simply a classic American liquor ! To comply with Google Adsense policy this video is an independent non-profit review and is not selling or linking to a site that sells the product being reviewed.
So refreshing to hear someone talk about it who drank it, lol all the people I know who have a bottle wouldn't dare break the seal, haha what a shame...Ralfy is the king o spirits and above all knows they are to be enjoyed responsibly... :)
I never understood this. Something rare and exquisite is meant to be enjoyed, when it's gone, perhaps that is a bit depressing, but can anyone honestly say there life isn't better for having experienced it rather than held it in an indefinite "special occasion" reserve that may never come?
I had the opportunity to drink a glass of Pappy 23 at my uncle's house on Christmas eve a few years ago. He waited until everyone else left and it was only him, my dad and me. They poured me a glass with 1 large ice cube inside. They taught me the "Kentucky chew". To smell it first then take a drink and hold it on your tongue. It was the best whiskey I've ever had! My dad also had a few bottles of Old Rip Van Winkle 12 year at his house we drank a few times.
I had the opportunity to drink a glass of Pappy 23 at my uncle's house on Christmas eve a few years ago. He waited until everyone else left and it was only him, my dad and me. They poured me a glass with 1 large ice cube inside. They taught me the "Kentucky chew". To smell it first then take a drink and hold it on your tongue. It was the best whiskey I've ever had! My dad also had a few bottles of Old Rip Van Winkle 12 year at his house we drank a few times.
The last bottle of bourbon my grandpa ever had was a bottle of Pappy 20 I got for him on his 87th birthday. This was back when you could find it for just over 100 dollars a bottle.
I used to have the standard Pappy for $60 a bottle with no problems finding it on the shelf. This was 10-15 years ago, it was no more rare than any other high end bourbon. Now it’s some sort of legend. Well let me tell you, I wouldn’t have paid hundreds back then and I surely wouldn’t now. It’s not that much better.
One of the best reviews on PVW I have seen. I absolutely love this Bourbon, here in the States finding a bottle is next to impossible so when I did I was going to make sure it was enjoyed and didn't just sit in the cabinet. And boy what a joy it is to drink.
You're the best Ralfy. I haven't had a drink in 2 years but I still have to watch the reviews because it's always an education and your passion for the spirits comes through
thank you for clearing up cola cubes. you've used that descriptor before and I hadn't any clue what it was. and when you used it in this review I wanted to jump through the screen, shake you and yell "what the HELL is a cola cube?!?!" and then you told us. great stuff Ralfy. as usual. cheers!
Ralfy, you are truly an educator. Thank you for what you do. I am 21 years old, and because of people like yourself, I have more a healthy respect for alcohol than do most seasoned adults. With reviews like this, you make the experience of drinking safer, more interesting, more enjoyable, and cost effective (quality over quantity). Thanks again.
Great stuff Ralfy. Thanks. Ya know every time my Yorky (terrier) hears your voice she pops up on the sofa next to me and listens to ya as if she knows something good is gonna happen! It must be a UK thing! cheers
Certainly not a common man whisky at its price point and availability, but it is incredible. William Larue Weller and George T Stagg are two others that are sensational but priced at a very high level.
When I drank this bottle 7-8 years ago, I was surprised by the strong and delicious custard notes which , at the time, felt characterized this whiskey. I am surprised no mention was made of the custard or creamy characteristics which really separates this whiskey from other whiskeys I have tried.
Even Pappy 20 these years is starting to thin out, apparently Pappy 23 is still pure Stitzel-Weller Juice, so the stock is starting to thin out. Bourbon makers also have to char their oak barrels in order to be classified as bourbon, and they cannot be reused...they actually go over seas to a lot of Scottish distillers. The extreme heat really lets the spirit get into the barrel and the winters help pull it back out and get that flavor. I've also noticed they sit higher up in Rick houses than at Scottish or Irish distilleries.
As Ralfy says... Patience. We've all been there. It just takes time. I used to mix my whiskey with cola. Now, I can't imagine ruining it by mixing it with ANYTHING. In the early days I would put my Turkey 101 on ice and drink it that way. Now, I've found I prefer it right out of the bottle at room temperature. With the exception to a few very high proof whiskeys
I don't want this series to end, but I'm on pins & needles waiting for the Turkey 101 review. As far as Kentucky Straight goes ... Turkey 101 was my first love.
Hi Ralfy. When you spoke (a while ago) of altering your marking system nobody has mentioned adding a decimal. That can easily differentiate the subtleties of a spirit where either an 88.1 would be "quite different" than an 88.7 (or latteraly an 8.1 as opposed to an 8.7) That decimal can really isolate the correct intent of the mark (Stars?? nahhh, too tight a system.) anyway something to think about Ralfy ...We did & that's why we wrote you on this fine post-Summers day. Cheers
Actually, American white oak is not the requirement for Bourbon. It DOES have to be new charred oak barrels but they can be French oak barrels if the distiller wants to.
Here's an analogy Ralfy...sounds like our friend John Glasser is the Pappy of Scotland. Using ONLY the best wood that can be found here on Gods Green Earth. ahhhh wood. gotta love it. cheers
This is a great, insightful review. Ralfy has gotten rather cranky recently and rightfully so, but I feel better after this review instead of saying all that is wrong with things.
I'd agree, and while there are some truly excellent American whiskies, I do think the main current US advantage is being able to play the wood/NAS game more cheaply and at least as well, if not better, than the Scotch industry, much of which was encouraged to go in that direction by the success of Bruichladdich. I think Glaser has done some very good things, but is also close to showing the limits of improvement through casking; whether it ever returns or not, the rest is aging.
On a related note, Diageo is apparently reopening Stitzel-Weller in the near future. Except the new distillery will probably be making rye bourbon for Bulleit which is currently being supplied by Four Roses. Like Brora, S-W Distillery was essentially mothballed hence why it doesn't need much to restart (like new equipment).
In fact, a significant amount of American bourbon is not distilled by the company that bottles/markets it. It's an interesting phenomenon. This is what makes a real craft distillery like Stranahan or Balcones so important.
Ralfy, I found your site quite by accident when my son told me they weren't making Green label anymore! The best JW ever! Anyway, I have watched about a half dozen of your videos and I must say that Cmdr. Scott would be proud of you! All kidding aside, you know your stuff and I can see I will become a regular viewer. Good health, long life and happiness! Cheers from NY, USA, Rich
+ralfystuff ralfy, which Johnnie walker green is the one they discontinued? I think it may still be in some stores where I live and I would like to pick it up. Thanks!
I heard an interview with one of the Van Winkles and the only PVW with S-W juice, now, is the 23 yo, and even that is coming to an end in the next year or two. That being said, I think Buffalo Trace has done a tremendous job in producing PVW. I was lucky enough to get a bottle of the 15 yo, a few years back. I'm pretty sure is Buffalo Trace distillate, and it is outstanding. The only thing they didn't do well is plan for how popular this would become.
I remember seeing this for $90 around 2009 for so. It was too rich for my blood. Wish I would've bought it but fuck all the high priced, hard to find, rare, sought after liquid that isn't worth nearly what people are willing to pay for it.
I am in the USA , and I can't get Pappy. Johnnie Blue is pretty smooth though. Probably not as good as Pappy but Blanton's is very enjoyable. Fairly rare where I am , but obtainable and delicious in my opinion.
Some have claimed that the method used to process the wheat in the Stitzel-Weller distillery is different from that used in the new Bernheim/Heaven Hill distillery and that this change will affect the quality of the resulting bourbon.
Regarding Jefferson Presidential Select, I know the person who blended casks for one of the batches. It is most certainly not Stitzel Weller. Sorry to disappoint. SW casks is what the bottle says. I do love the 17 so I am not saying its a bad whisky. But I don't know that it's better than the old Weller Centennial 10 which is long gone except for a few dusty bottles in forgotten liquor stores.
I didn't know about a different wheat preparation. Of course, depending on the release date of the reviewed bottle of this PVW15, it's already not 100% SW whiskey and quite possibly a lot less. Each release of 15 that I've tasted has been just a bit different. But all good. Harlan's team do a fine job.
Hello again mate. we just spoke to JohnG from CBW and he's so graciously imparted an appx. wood:spirit ratio to achieve maximum flavor.If anyone needs further direction contact the Maltbar if you wish to repair the declining "classless malts" line that I can see from the negative comments are alive and dying an ugly death. w/American know-how. along w/capacity proportions I have interpolated the necesssry variables to rescue this declining SMS dilemma. Its all about the wood(as if we didnt know)
I believe the requirement, for bourbon, is only the initial aging of new make. Once it has been aged, sufficiently, in new oak, I believe you can do whatever you want with additional "finishes".
I know you're not asking anyone but Ralphy, but check out: -Old Forester Birthday Bourbon ('97 was delightful, but hear the newer releases are good as well) -Russell's Reserve Single Barrel 10yo -WL Weller (made by Buffallo Trace - check out BT website for more) -Corsair Small Batch Triple Smoke (best of 2012 Whiskey Advocate)
I'm just glad to actually get a taste of S-W bourbon when I got my hands on Jefferson's Presidential Reserve 18. However the somewhat excessive woodiness tells me one thing: the Van Winkles kept the best casks because it seems the Van Winkle 20 doesn't have that aspect.
HAd my chance to snap a bottle of this last year in Edinburgh. Decided not to pull the trigger due to the 30% price increase on all of the pappy line up. Looking back now I wish I'd have manned up and bought it because I hate to think of the price this year! If you liked this one Ralfy, you ought to try the mighty George T Stagg, it's a less refined beast but it's one of the most complex and interesting bourbons out there. Grab it if you get the chance. Cheers mate!
Currently have 1 of these baby's in my collection! Bought one 7 years ago and I didn't know what I had but thank goodness I've been lucky enough to happen upon one at a bottle shop in East Windsor, CT
America also has the difference (I'm not sure it's an advantage in all cases" of a warmer, more extreme climate. The higher temps and wider temperature swings means more interaction between wood and whiskey, causing differences (acceleration) in how aging plays out.
I don't have personal info about the different wheat preparation processes at S-W and Buffalo Trace, but my impression from the description I read was that the S-W method produced a relatively coarse grain of varying sizes, while the modern BT process results in a fine powder. Don't know if all that's true or how it will affect the final whiskey. Just passing along what appeared to be credible information.
Within the last year, I read an interview with the people currently in charge of Pappy releases (I think it was an issue of "Whisky Advocate") who said that ALL Pappy releases younger than when the S-W distillery closed in 1991 are ALL Heaven Hill spirit. So if you want any S-W spirit today, that leaves the 23-year Pappy or later.
After not caring much for Bernheim and the taste of wheat, it turns out you are indeed a wheat fan, Ralfy. Pappy is a wheated bourbon, in which wheat replaces the typical rye component. It's generally believed that the wheat in Pappy provides its special characteristics. Also important was the way the wheat was prepared in the old Stitzel-Weller distillery. The current Buffalo Trace wheat preparation is different, and future Pappys are not expected to reach similar heights because of it.
I'm quite aware of the proliferation of NDPs in the bourbon trade. It's quite well-known among bourbon drinkers (as evidenced by the fact that I know it). I've had both Balcones' and Stranahan's products, and am familiar with quite a few other craft distillers. Their stuff is just peachy with me. I'm also aware that Jefferson's is sourced, but they claim it's actually S-W juice, not just "casks," whatever that might mean.
Agreed! However If John can do it in Scotland(with quality and success) then there is no reason Diageo (spelling ?!) or the other culprits can't match the commitment by keeping the consumers interest just in front of the bottom line...where quality goes, $£€ will follow... in which Mr Glasser has harnessed by virtue of his varied award winning spirits. But yes America has it all over Scotland, dollar for quality infused dollar! cheers
I've been told that at least one store has a lottery system that allows chosen customers to purchase a bottle. The amount of bottles put out every year is simply not enough to satisfy everyone.
Personal preference here, (and I know I'm not ralfy) but I would say not justified. There are MANY bourbons that can be had for a far lower price, and easier to come by that will satisfy your taste buds. Elmer T. Lee, as you mentioned as well as Blanton's, Michter's, Bernheim (wheat whiskey, not bourbon), Makers Mark, Angel's Envy, Elijah Craig 12, Jack Daniels Single Barrel ... just to name a few
Buffalo Trace releases bottles of this every year but the only way mere mortal can buy it is if it sold in a lottery with only a 100% markup. Otherwise it's sold on the secondary market at 2000% markup. You missed out one of the most important features of Pappy and that is the mash bill. This is the sine qua non of WHEATED BOURBONS that use wheat as the secondary component after corn. All bourbon must have at least 50% corn and traditionally the secondary grain is rye with some malted barley for fermentation enzymes. Wheated bourbons replace the rye with wheat. This makes them softer and also lets them peak at longer maturation. Cheers!
Well at least you're at a Festival, so you have a good reason. But, I believe that the respect many have for you and the resulting celebrity you have in the spirits world would take care of any expenses to get you to Kentucky someday soon.
It's funny, we have pvw in bars here. Kentucky really does spoil you for bourbons. I think it's necessary to distinguish when the bottle was produced. It was a very different spirit it of Weller
There's some rumors that Bernheim wheated bourbon is being blended with the Stitzel Weller bourbon to make Pappy Van Winkle (probably the 15 and 20). Since the Bernheim Distillery was made by United Distillers as the successor to S-W, the two bourbons should be very close in character.
Wish you had a chance to try the bourbon from the distillery I work at. We use non-GMO organic corn and grain. Cooked, distilled, aged, and bottled all on sight deep in the heart of Texas. If you ever get the chance in the future, watch out for Garrison Brothers Texas Straight Bourbon!
I'd agree that the American casking and wood sourcing is very likely superior, but I still think quality is mostly about the time IN that wood (Pappy a 20 and ETL a 14 by urban legend). If wood contact proportion could replace, rather than enhance, age maturation (and certainly it's been tried), we'd be swimming in 90+ whisk(e)y, and it's just not the case. But if you're going to drink young/NAS 80-something stuff anyway, buy American if it's cheaper .
Allocation in MN has gone from cases and lotteries at special events just to buy it, to a few random bottles to now nothing. The managers at the liquor stores simply laugh at you the moment begin to utter the name. Thought I'd have some luck with Stagg Jr but not a chance in h-e-double-hockey-sticks.
Took me a couple of days to get through the alcohol; no water, just drank it neat. I can't comment on Knob Creek but I found Maker's Mark to be very uninspiring; what little flavor it has is vague (to me) at best. I suspect the Wild Turkey 101 will give you a bit more flavor. Try Buffalo Trace.
Lotteries for Pappy are actually common here in the US, if it's available at all. Worse, I suspect most bottles are bought up by the store employees without ever getting to customers. As a US citizen, I consider Pappy bourbon to be something that exists in another dimension, something I'll never experience. Anyway, given the prices I've heard ($250-400+), it seems like a "Guaranteed to Disappoint" bottle, Ralfy review notwithstanding.
I am watching this review as I want to wait to open the bottle of this I have in the bar. Humble brag I know, but so glad I sat on it.... The eagle rare 17yo my wife used for BBQ sauce, however, hurt....
+Bob Papadopoulos I think I'd cringe more at using coke instead of ginger ale more so than using Pappy. Though I personally stick to polluting lower tier bourbons like Virginia Gentleman or whatever the well/rail bourbon is.
This stuff is excellent but nearly impossible to acquire and very expensive. Goes for ridiculous markup prices on secondary markets.good review but very unlike many people would actually be able to ever acquire a bottle
One last thing that just hit me - AIUI, bourbon is not legally bourbon if it's aged in a refill cask. (Please correct me if I'm wrong.) So, if what you're saying is true, the people at McLain & Kyne (owners of Jefferson's) should be in considerable trouble with the FTC and TTB - both for false advertising and mislabeling their whiskey.
WOW a great wheat heavy mash bill that ages perfectly in one cask. Wheat bourbons do age better on the long term than rye forward ones. I don't know if I would agree with all of your tasting notes, you are getting too many flavors. I wouldn't say you are not tasting these but maybe some are imagined. This is a very complex whiskey. The stock is from the old Weller reserve and is no longer available.
That wild turkey 101 on the shelf is suuuch a better value. I’ll never taste pappy because it’s outta my price range but I’m fine with that. Its $25 😐 4:50 my man said “warm, earth” as if we know what he’s talking about. Not room temperature earth? 😂
Although im not a big bourbon drinker, or rum as I just find them too sweet (most of them) I do love the names of bourbons. Pappy Van Winkle? That's just spectacular....Unfortunately here in Canada bourbon is about as popular as cricket. Only bourbons we really get are the mass produced garbage.
+TheJusnic82 -- I don't know where you live in Canada, but in the Vancouver area we have access to some of the better bourbon brands. It isn't just the cheap stuff here. Still, the bourbon selection available in BC should be a lot bigger than it is.
+TheJusnic82 oh bourbon is getting bigger here all the time .in fact ontario has allocated lotteries for buffalo trace antique collection and a current lottery for pappy .but our selection sucks partly because of the demand .in fact larceny bourbon from heaven hill is only avail. in 14 states
I just looked at the current going rate for this bottle and I truly hope you didn't pay that much! And if you did, I hope that it brought you immense happiness!! Holy sticker shock, Batman!
Ralfy, thank you for this great review. But I must ask you, is the $200.00 USD price justified considering Elmer T Lee can be had for only $30.00? Cheers from across the pond, SamC
