I thought the same... Until I realised the prices are so high just for the plastic crack, that including the books as WELL is almost redundant, except when you consider some of my favourite games let you download the rules for free.
What I love about conquest is that the two player starter box is exactly that. You even get two rule books. They have not stopped trying to make the models better and better.
you'd be surprised what having two sides of a game to demo will do for a community. And with cheaper prices you can do it! Then when they are enjoying the game AND having fun, hit 'em with the cost difference. You'd be surprised how easy it is to get people interested. I've done this with Parabellum's Conquest at my FLGS, there is a community formed already in store and a wider community growing in my city! :-)
@@wurzella1 Aye but you need to have an opponent with their own team. It's not like a board game where they pick one of the Monopoly / HeroQuest pieces. Or even a skirmish game where they could play your spare team or proxy one to their liking with a few models. A wargame needs an opposing _army,_ hopefully one that has been thought-out by a dedicated player of another faction. Its a big barrier to entry.
@@darthkek1953 that's what I meant, buy a couple of teams so that there's models available for other people to try the game out. If the rules are fun & the teams not too expensive there's a decent chance you'll get some others buying in once they've played & enjoyed themselves. If we want people to open themselves up to more of the gaming world than just GW we need to be the change we want to see 🤣
you can play a complete game of Alpha Strike and Battletech with just the main box though? The alpha strike is literally 2 lances vs a star, classic full size engagement right there
I personally think Alpha strike is best played with even more mechs, and see the starter set as that. Either way, it is one of the cheapest wargames right now
I gave up 40K and W/H years ago and at a time when the game wasn't too bad either (5th ed 40K). I'm currently enjoying Bolt Action quite a lot (I love WW2 anyway). Bolt Action is easy and not too expensive, get a 2 player starter and then a starter army, that matches one in the 2 player starter and you've got a playable army with a few options on how to field it in a standard size game. You missed the Flames of War family of games and their offshoots. Flames of War is WW2 in 15mm and instead of a platoon size game, like Bolt Action, it's a company size game, where you can easily have 10-20 tanks, plus supporting units. The offshoots include Team Yankee, which is 80-90's era Flames of War, plus 'Nam and Fate of a Nations in the 60/70's. There's also the newer games Clash of Steel (Flames of War based rules, for just tanks and easier to play) and World of Tanks (more of a skirmish game). A lot of the models can be used across the systems which helps cut down the price of getting armies for the different versions of the games. You can easily buy a starter army and a few complimentary units to go with it and have a playable force for not a huge amount, relatively. Lastly for Rank and File games, thee's Hail Caesar from Warlord games. I've picked up a couple of thier starter armies (Roman and Greek) for under £60, so it's possible to get a lot of troops, for not much money. If you don't like how the game plays, there are many other 'ancients' rule sets that you could just buy a rulebook for and use the Hail Caesar models. There's also loads of companies, like Victrix who also do 28mm 'ancients' figures, so you can pick and choose your models, you're not limited to models by one company (like GW stuff)
Historicals (from Warlord and other manufacturers too) tend to be pretty affordable. Since the minis are not based on a particular IP you can choose between many manufacturers and they can easily be reused for a variety of rule sets. If there's a period that interests you, give it a go!
Another good cheap wargame on the skirmish side of things is fallout wasteland warfare all you need is the core box for a faction,the core game box( because costume dice and rules like legion) then they have a “free” army building if you’re ok with using a note pad
Great video, the gaming community needs more of this... the masses need to know 40k isn't the only option! You can't argue the quality of their minis which are sensational, but their extortionate prices, suspect business model and incompetent rules writing is too much for many savvy wargamers these days. Mantic I love. Their models are getting better which is great to see, but the rules are just spot on. Simply, easy to learn but tactically in-depth is what you get from Firefight, Kings of War and Deadzone.
While I love Age of Sigmar/Old World, mainly due to the friends who play them, I do have to say GW hasn't been my favorite for a long time. Also the pain of making these videos and now realizing I want to try everything I have mentioned still hurts my wallet
@@Wargamerofalltrades Old World is very nostalgic for me and so I'm trying to get back into it, I desperately want it to be good. Trying to navigate the rulebook though was a reminder of how, whilst being lightyears ahead of most with their models, GW are still very much trailing behind when it comes to actual rules writing. Still, it's mainly about who you play with rather than what you're playing, and the main issue with any of these other games you've talked about is finding anyone who is actually willing to give them a go.
I have been lucky with a really open minded local gaming group and friend circle, and most of the games are cheap enough that buying two factions doesn't break the bank, But I do get it, it is harder to convince most people to try these smaller games
Flames of War is great too. Many starter sets routinely on sale for 50$ on Amazon/eBay… can pick up two of those for a large force or buy an army in a box for 100.
Just as another system set of rules, I would look at Xenos Rampant. It doesn't have its own minis line, but is a system for smaller battles from Osprey. I mostly just use my old 40k and Warzone forces in it.
For the cheapest wargame in the world, look at anything historical in 20mm or 1/72 scale. You can get HO scale model railroad buildings cheap for terrain. Also you can get the figures and vehicles depending on the era for less than $20 each in most cases. For under $60 you can have everything you need for a good historical wargame in whatever era you really like. Many older rulesets are also available online for free.
OPR is my system of choice but i wanted to see cheap places for plastic miniatures sonce resign ones are less durable, your vides is just what i needed!
I used to play gamesworkshop LotR. It was expensive back in the day, and its even more insane now. Started with Legion and never looked back. Super good community!
Look at Infinity the Game by Corvus Belli. 15 models + terrain = around 350; however, for around the same price of a Space Marine army you can have an entire faction line of miniatures at around 12~15 USD per model not counting TAGs which you usually only use 1 of in a skirmish.
Price of books and necessary accesories are important as well. Take bolt action as an example - there you need order dice, armies of book and the core rulebook as well 😊
I'm currently looking at a WWII French Colonial platoon with options (AT gun, 60mm mortar 2 HMG), all in metal - $143 USD It would be a bit lower without the Senegalese head swaps for the support weapons. Bolt Action is a great WWII game as well but the real advantage is that you can re-use your figures and vehicles with other rules sets. No one owns the IP for a Panther and your Shermans are never going to be retconned out of your list. I prefer Chain of Command rules wise but there are many more out there and for many different periods. Now a caveat, if you get into 28mm Napoleonic mass battles - your wallet will take a big hit and you probably won't ever finish painting all your figures. ;)
Yep, I really like all the options for the scale, you don't need to buy from Warlord. However I haven't found a game in that scale I enjoy more then Bolt Action
I remember when my 1500 point chaos army (IIRC it was 4 squads of marines in rhinos, 2 vindicators, a chaos lord and sorceror, and a defiler) during 5th edition cost me like £300, prices are insane now.
Was surprised you didn't put in OPR, considering you can buy an entire army for 70-100, both printed or STLs if you have your own printer. That's all the units for the complete armies. And then it gets even cheaper if you do have your own printer and you sign up for their $10 Patreon as they give you a discount.
@@Wargamerofalltrades yea they print through MMFs printing company called Only-Games, if you're apart of the Patreon you can get an additional 5%-10%, now granted the Patreon is another monthly fee which can be a turn off, but the idea is 1. You get all the rules for free ( advanced rules) and through drivethrurpgs as well ( they'll always be updated if you have the apps on PC/Phones) 2. You get a massive discount for the STLs or up to 10% for the physical miniatures. Cost wise you're looking at $99 ( before discounts) for an Army ranging in size from 29-39 models. Individual units can range from $6-$97( yes $97 for a single unit-But this guy is huge!) It's completely understandable why OPR in general has been slept on, honestly I didn't think much of it back in 2015, but it has truly grown into something so amazing. Not to mention, if you do have a printer the starter set to play the game is free. You get two armies, the rules needed and that's it. If not you can cheaply build an army out, cheaper than most games. Amazing video either man! Keep it up man
Good summary, same journey but different timeline. GW 40K minis now relegated to OPR armines - Mantic Deadzone and Firefight are so much cheaper and easier to play and without the toxic GW community idiots. Can also use Mantic mini in OPR so win, win, and again win. 3D printed armies from OPR are very good also.
Though. I havent looked at the game in ages because i could never find anyone who was interested enough to get into it, seems like the places to buy this are extremely limited. Not even amazon offers minis anymore.
You can buy 2 full factions in 3 or even 4 games for the price of a single 40k army, enough to start your own gaming club even if nobody local currently plays the systems. Add in some smaller skirmish games and you could have a thriving weekly community rather then trying to find an opponent with the spare 4 hours that matches your spare 4 hours for a single game of 40k every now and then.
@@Wargamerofalltrades That's my eventual plan, I'm working 2 jobs at the moment so very little time for gaming. I'm playing 5 parsecs from home solo with 15mm models. Rules, close to 20 gangs between 8 & 15 models each, a bunch of scenery and all for less than £150. When I have more time I've got enough stuff for half a dozen skirmish games going at a time!
While I prefer Legion as a game, it feels more like a skirmish game when compared to 40k in scale. Personally, my favorite game is X-Wing which is easily the cheapest game I know of. $80 and your practically at a full size list for some factions. But the game is sadly pretty much dead now.
@Wargamerofalltrades To be fair, I can't speak for 40k in its current 10th edition fully. I played back in 6th and 7th edition. Back then the price ran me away and I dropped it. Ive played roughly 7 different miniature games throughout those years though. Some I've only dabbled in and other I got into. Legion is easily one of my favorite ground based miniature games. While I do love SW, the rule set is solid and feels a lot more modern than 40k. It's highlight feature for me is the token activation system which makes the game feel very fluid. With that said, 800pts of Legion still feels smaller to me than 800pts of 40k. A skirmish game of 40k feels much closer to 800pts of Legion to me than a 2000pt game of 40k. With that said, I think the skirmish scale plays a LOT better as a game. The smaller scale makes the units matter a lot more and you can remove redundant troops. In Legion, you can bring a single anti-vehicle Squadron onto the table and be fine for most match-ups. In 40k, I was brining a lot more than that simple because the enemy just had a lot more tanks. Not to mention you can lose those squads before they even fire. Granted, that wasn't as common a complaint back in 6th edition as it appears to be now.
While I do want to try Kings Of War, Old World hits a very specific itch, a nostalgia and fun itch. I do agree it's not the best rules system, but I want to run my Tomb Kings. I still plan on getting into Kings of War, or at least trying it once, but it will be with a different army.
@Wargamerofalltrades You can just use the unit footprints first to see if you like the rules. You can use cut outs for that instead of having to spend a lot of cash.
You left out One Page Rules. They offer an alternative to WH40K and AoS, and they have now their own minitures. You can either buy stl-s for 3d printing, or you can buy the printed minis as well. Of course it is cheaper then GW. Also the basic rules are free, and since I bought the "full" game system I can say they are just additional rules, and not necessary for an enjoyable game.
You forgot about Malifaux, where you can get a playable crew for $80 (including a purchase of a deck) and about $120 to $180 if you buy a complete keyword which will give your list a ton of variety
Cheapest wargaming is my own, when. The 3d printer goes "Brrrrrrr" Screw GW thinking they own the wargaming space and can charge those prices, ill just print your stuff instead then!
7:10 Play Kings of War and you want to throw your GW stuff into the bin. That game is so good that even Warhammer 40k and Warhammer fantasy in their prime editions (3rd/4th for 40k and 6th for fantasy) are absolute garbage compared to it.
Glad to see Mantic getting a bit of appreciation. Their Starter Boxes are superb value. But where Mantic really excel is the gameplay. KoW and Firefight are great games. But if you want to dip your toe in the Warpath universe I would highly recommend a Deadzone Starter Box. There are two on offer for 3rd edition - the only difference being the starter factions each contains. Coming from the world of GW I think it will melt your brain what you get for your money. And how much fun the game is.
Another thing to note about the Battletech choice is that by buying both of the starter boxes, you now have two formats to play with. To put it in perspective, that's like being able to buy into both AoS AND Warcry; two distinct gameplay formats in the same setting for an immense fraction of the cost that you could even splurge on a half dozen Clan force packs and still not exceed the cost that GW demands of you to be able to play. Heck, for the same price as that start collecting/combat patrol combo, you could buy Alpha Stike, A Game of Armored Combat, the Clan Invasion expansion, and both Comstar force packs. That's a full Binary (10 clan mechs), a full Company (12 Inner Sphere mechs + auxiliaries), and a pair of Level IIs (12 Inner Sphere mechs). That's three fully functional "armies" to play with in Alpha Strike and definitely more mechs you could ever need in Classic BT. All fully cross compatible and interchangeable to boot.
Two formats of play and multiple scales to play in, that's where the real value comes from Battletech. That lance of minis you get to play 4 Mechs can be turned into a company because 1 Mech represents 4-6 units in Battleforce. Thus the 4 minis now are 16 units on the field or even more if you go into Strategic Battleforce rules. All the while, the stats from Battleforce are just the ones from Alpha Strike. All from the rules of one book, boom you are off and ready to play entire literal armies now.
I can answer that, when I checked the website for this video all I saw was the start here patreon with STLs, so I did not know they sold pre-printed minis.
Might I recommend Gaslands, the game itself consists solely of a $30 book and either raiding your kids hot wheels collection or running to the dollar store and picking out a handful there. All told you can have a competitive team for less thank $5 plus any time and effort you put into painting / weathering the cars to look more Mad Max-ish.
ASOIAF (game of thrones) is also quite cheap with very streamlined rules. A faction starter box is about 100€ which gives you ~ 30 points (standard competition list is 40pts). Each starter comes with the rule book, faction specific dices, standard terrain, movement trays, cards, …
Lets not forget the army building app that you can keep track of your collection, lists, and updates to have the up to date stats on units and game modes
@@Wargamerofalltrades It is excellent - alternating activation system + rank and flank makes maneuvering key + non-combat tactics board and tactics cards add a ton of strategic depth. Check out Hits and Crits, Yecats, or my own channel for ASOIAF miniatures content.
@@Wargamerofalltrades it plays quite nicely. Compared to 40k/AOS, I feel it’s way simpler while adding back some complexity that « makes sense ». For example, units are on standard tray (4x3 for infantry, 2x2 for cavalry) so they are easy to move and line of sight is dead simple (there are sight markers on the tray). But you have bonus when charging/shooting the side/back. And you have two movement type (one short which allow to turn before moving and one long that make you got straight). So positioning is extra important, and flanking someone is very rewarding. Unit characteristics are also based on the number of remaining ranks (not the exact number of remaining minis). When you still have three ranks you hit with X dice, two ranks Y dice, … This seems simple, but it gives the designer a way to give some flavor to some unit without relying on custom rules. For example, most units becomes less powerful as they loose rank. But some elite ones will stay as strong. Some can even become stronger (like barbarians be coming crazy when they loose friends).
Battletech may be a scrimmage game, but it has deep rules for Combined Arms if you want it. It also has an unofficial Tabletop Simulator (megamek) that could do all the math for you.
the Best wargame in my humble opinion, not only cost wise, but also as an introductory system for beginners, is SAGA, with victrix models. Armies tend to be 40 models per side and there are several "universe books" depending on your taste, be it fantasy or historical. If you want Vikings? Victrix sells a bundle of 60 models for 46 USD, Greeks? 48 models for 44 USD, Romans? 60 models for 36 USD!!! if you want to turn it into a fantasy army, just add a monster or something unique to it. I bought a plastic Dinosaur toy and painted it up for the fantasy side.
Mantic Games has nice Models yep, i have some, Kings of War is a typical Rank and Flank wargame that is pretty cheap compared to Others cuz you dont use individual Models in Regiments, that gives you the Options to use less Minis in a Regiment and build Diorama bases, Mantic Games also allows third Party Minis in Tournaments, what i Like about Kings of War is that i can Play an Undead Army With a Necromancer General as a good Guy 😋 If i want. It also have different Starter Boxes.
I am glad to see Kings of War and Firefight making the list. They are both really great games. For Kings of War, the multi basing and model agnostic really allows freedom in your army to get the look you want. Firefight however is my new love. I have picked up a box for each faction which still costs less than my Tau army I had for 40k. The older models are not that great but the new ones have come a long way and are really affordable. Another thing to mention about Mantic is the Mantic Vault. Every month they release more STL files you can get and print for their games. Mantic Armada (think GW Man O War) is pretty fun and most the ships are available in the vault. The vault also contains quite a few upgrade components for models so you don't have to shell out $$ to get resin upgrade kits. You can now just print your own. This along with the companion app they have for their games makes list building easy as well as looking up rules during a game.
I am happy you enjoyed it! I like putting the spotlight on lesser known games, and it looks like this time RU-vid decided to show it to so many more people then normal, so I am pretty happy with the reach it has gotten!
Great video given exposure to other war games but I think Battletech should have been #1. You can get away with just buying the Alpha Strike box and the kicker, you don’t have to assemble anything!
I was in my FLGS yesterday. I got into Star Wars Legion last year. I keep looking at 40K, it’s just insane. I don’t see how they can justify this other than just greed.
To each there own, AOS 3rd edition has been surprisingly fun to play, and 4.0 looks to be a breathe of fresh air. I also love Old World so I can finally find people to play against my Tomb Kings. Games Workshop is a terrible company, and I won't argue that, but I do feel like AOS is the most solid game they offer right now. It is slightly cheaper as well in most cases due to lower model count armies, especially with 10th edition 40k. That being said it is still stupid expensive
@@Wargamerofalltrades “They” in this context is Games Workshop and their greediness :) Definitely not throwing shade at players! I’d play AoS if it wasn’t for my Legion pile of shame :)
Star Wars Legion is cheap and the nice thing is I won't half my expensive models removed before I get a turn. The Ganeswork option that can be considered is GMs Battle for Middle Earth.
@@telleryoutube4458 Point being? That Starter set gets you a fully playable army, not 75 points but 50 IIRC. That would be equivilant of getting a roughly 1250 point 40k army, and that will cost you a LOT more than 200 USD.
just got into battletech a few weeks ago with the GOAC and Alpha strike box sets so far great rules the last time I played was the late 80's rules have barely changed over the years but the mech's are now plastic and look like the illustrations from back then hope to try new game in a few weeks with friends there all painted and ready to go :)
@@Wargamerofalltrades I think this is a bad idea as all these games exist in the same eco system. Some skirmish games are more expensive than tradition wargames but they emphasize on the experience over tons of model, which is the base reason we play the games.
Agreed. Infinity is far and away the most underrated wargame… which is hilarious because the community and company make it seem like the most happenin game always!
Star wars legion used to be so cheap. In 2020, expansions at my flgs were $20, characters were 12, and big vehicles were $47. Core sets were $80 and occasionally had sales for $68. Asoiaf is amazing because there is ZERO assembly required and you can get an army with everything you need for $100. Also mesbg CAN be amazingly cheap for being a GW game
standard battletech is a true war game. having combined arms consisting of infantry all the way to space war ships and everything you can imagine in between. as far as army size, you can have a squad of basic soldiers (7 troops) to company's (minimum 12 units) to battalions (minimum 36 units) to Regiments, Divisions, Corp or Army. the scaling is up to the players - and not based on points, but organizational title. as far as cost and value, 'a game of armored combat' is $60usc and gets you effectively playing for as long as you want. since the game is miniatures agnostic, you never really need to buy anything more.
Show some pictures of the armies, would improve te video. For many of these like mantic you are just yapping with a picture of a helmet next to it and it means nothing to the viewer.
Get a nice miniature agnostic rulebook (I recommend Lion/Dragon/Xenos Rampant, around $25.00), and some 1/72 scale miniatures and models. Italeri has some wonderful infantry minis that go for around $15.00 for a box of 40!
I still think classic battletech beats legion, not only because you can buy a box of 4 mechs for a lance, but you can use anything as a mech, unlike with gw where you have to use the models they sell you.
40k would be fine if they didn't keep removing minis and changing unit composition and forcing you to be on a constant race of spending money to have a fieldable legal army.
Another Warlord game, that probably qualifies as skirmish, Blood Red Skies is one of my favorite wargames that is dead simple to learn. It's WWII airplanes that you can get into with a single squadron box of planes for $25-$40. That includes almost everything you need to play, minus dice and the rulebook.
Just jumped into Flames of War. 15mm WW2. Got a full 100 point army for just touching 100 GBP. Be careful with SW Legion - it quickly becomes a money sinkhole.
It’s funny I kind of fell into Battletech and Bolt Action, partly thanks to GW. I bought some Star Wars Legion models for the simple fact that they were so cheap and I could get some of my favorite characters. Thanks to some sales on Amazon I now have plenty of models and I’ll be getting into that game as well. Great video and appreciate all the research.
I think so, sure. I bought some 6 mm armies off of Etsy to play one page rules, it worked really well rules wise. But the miniatures had some issues. So many feet broke off while trying to clip the supports. At that size you can easily hide it in grass, but after that experience I decided to not really do 6 mm anymore. Not with infantry anyway.
One thing about Warmachine is of course also that in many ways price comparisons are difficult. First, if you want to play tournament games, you usually get to bring two lists, each led by a different warcasters and choose which to play after looking at your opponent's lists. This means that a "true" tournament army can bigger than you'd think - although you can easily build two 75pts lists from the core box plus the expansion. You can probably build two lists from the core box + a cadre box, or an expansion box, a cadre box and an additional, separately bought warjack or warbeast if there isn't one in cadre box. However, the game is also very modular. You keep swapping out warjacks, warcasters, units and solos when building different lists. So Warmachine more encourages you to buy a toolbox for building army lists than a single army. Even more so, with the core warjacks/warbeasts being modular - a core box typically has two warjacks/warbeasts, each with 4 different interchangeable right/left arms and heads each.
I haven't jumped on MKIV yet, but the lists look easy to manipulate a bit out of box as they include different arms AND the magnets to make switches work with models already designed for the magnets! I played up to 2nd edition and it was a fun game! Not sure about the changes to MKIV, but if it wasn't for the cost I'd have done it already...maybe I should go proxy some old models and give it a go....
Warmachine is a great game! You get a lot of variability with the starter and expansion. Each army is led by a leader "think your king in chess but as powerful as the queen" you get two of these with that set up. You also get two warjacks. Each has magnetic arms and heads so you can change what weapons they have to fulfill different roles. So you can adjust and change your army list without buying more things, but then that option is there as well
I'd like to mention Turnip28 which can be very cheap as it is very kitbash friendly and while there are official models (finura miniature sells printed minis and the game's creator has STLs available) you can just buy a box of Napoleonic infantry and a box of medieval minis from Perry Miniatures plus some green stuff and have enough to make models for two players... or use whatever you've got on hand really.
This why I started buying Legion instead of Warhammer, I love Warhammer, but I builded an army with what a combat patrol cost (was on sale on may the 4th, but still)
The dropzone commander star is pretty cool and can be found cheap. Two armies, paper battlemat and cardboard terrain. But 10mm minis, so lot for those who dont want to change scale, love the game though.
Mantic is, like all British minis companies, made up of former GW employees at every level. Their main rules designer is Alessio Cavatore, who was a main designer for Warhammer, Warhammer 40k, Blood Bowl, Mordheim, Bolt Action, and Lord of the Rings.
Warmachine was a lot bigger 10 years ago. It's on the smaller side of Army combat, mainly because the main units are not the blocks of troops, but the magical mecha the game is named after. Fun game and game setting though.
Any of the rampant games there miniatures agnostic which means just find cheap miniatures OPR for the same reason oathmark also miniatures agnostic and they dedicated miniatures are well priced
Conquest is a different scale. It's not a perfect comparison due to this. Unfortunately, I don't think the larger model size does anything for the game beyond inflating the prices.
A Song of Ice and Fire should be metioned(CMON sells Starter for 100€ including Usable Terrain and House coloured Dices) in one Box you habe prebuilt models, Rules, Cards and all stuff ro get started. And do not to forget the Price Tag on the GW Rules(if competetive)
You should at least say that this video is for Miniature Wargames. There are lots of free or cheap wargames out there, in any kind you could want. Basic Armys, Fantasy, SciFi, and just weird, .
The best use of your gaming dollars and attention are games you can get to the table or otherwise enjoy. The worst use of limited gaming dollars and time is a game you don't enjoy or enjoy playing because of the rules, lore, or other players in your area
I can attest to bolt action. I did a near full competitive sized game. We learned and played a game and finished it in under 2 hours. So much better than 40ks 4-5 hour games when trying to learn their rules
@@Wargamerofalltrades and that’s the thing. I dreaded 40k turns where I couldn’t do anything. The dice bag activation system just blew my mind with the difference in interactive play. On top of that they’re awesome with their customer service. Helped and knew their info about their products unlike GW customer service. Warlord even sent a sprue of 5 free infantry with their bases and upgrades with my most recent order. The reason this was impressive was I only ordered 2 howitzers and some dice. But they payed enough attention to send me the correct French faction infantry sprue as a free bonus. They earned my support that day.
