I mean ok but... what about a well tuned drum and a competent audio engineer? Even with triggers, if your FoH person doesn't know what they're doing.... it's gonna sound like butt anyway. I guess it gets you close right outta the gate. Kinda like using a fractal or something like that on guitars. Plus you gotta be able to play regardless. Either way, that swivel is fucking sweet 🤘
The drummers that hate triggers are people who have never tried them and don’t realize it amplifies how good or bad a drummer is with their foot technique lol
@@tjgadner8896 after you get to certain speeds, it's physically impossible to have much power and triggers are necessary to articulate what's being played
If you're confused what that is is basically a device let's put on the drum to make it electronic sounding to change the sound now it is like a hybrid kit
I have no issues with triggers. Other drums get triggered so what’s wrong with triggering your bass drum? Where the issue comes in is when people use heel toe or other techniques that let them play at insane speed, but at the sacrifice of EACH beater hit being the same strength. THEN they use triggers to cover up that mistake. Everyone knows this is why some guys hate triggers, I think this argument needs to be dropped and we all need to focus on getting along and being a united all embracing (newbies like me through to advanced guys) community.
Triggers change the way you sound. Not the way you play. Just like a guitar pedal changes the way a guitar sounds a drum trigger changes how a drum sounds.
Most triggers if not ALL triggers eliminate dynamics (force needed to produce a consistant tone, power) and can max out the curve with little to no effort needed in each individual stroke. You still need skill to play, triggers do NOT eliminate the need for skill, but does absolutely remove the need for full power or force behind strikes, making it much easier for achievements in speed and stamina.
I think triggers are pretty practical and cool but the drawbacks are that they sound bad at extreme speeds and they take away the dynamics and nuance a player can put into the kick drum (but you could probably edit some of that human-ness back in)
Yeah it's this. It kind of limits what you can do with the drum and 9/10 you're better off just playing it yourself to accomplish those dynamic things because it's less complicated. I get why a lot of live sound guys have become fans of triggers tho. They use them to set the gates on the mics, and it's the best way to do it since mic bleed can make it difficult to do the traditional way.
I used ChatGPT it just make a drum hit into a synthetic electronic drum sound (which is basically what is done when bands produce an album anyway) Seems drummers like to gripe about them but I think to most people that aren’t drum nerds wouldn’t even know the difference
Being able to play without triggers is great. But if you go record in a studio its the recommended practice for the best sound. If you are a solid drummer you can mix the natural drum sound with the samples. George Kollias triggers the kick but I believe he doesn't sample anything else.
@absentminded55 I'm not one of those guys that goes around saying triggering is cheating, but I do like the sound of the untriggered drums more, triggered just sounds too clicky. I mean, if Dave Lombardo can do it, and if you like that sound as much as I do, then when forming a band I'd look for someone who could do it like him, no?
Bc ppl love to argue over things they don't fully understand and especially over things they fear. Triggers have been around a long time. It just allows you to replace the kick drum sound with a new sound that plays instead of the actual kick drum when you hit it. That's it. The advantage is that, with a trigger, you can tweak the velocity curve so that you get more power than you could have playing the kick naturally. Again, if you are actually still hitting the kick drum naturally for every trigger hit, there is no problem with this. You * COULD • technically cheat a little with triggers if you.. say.... made a sample of two fast consecutive hits, so you'd only have play every other hit. ..but you'd still have to play in time, so... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Also a camera recording your feet would make it clear to everyone whether you were playing every hit or every other hit anyway, soooo..... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ALSO if you're playing in perfect time and it sounds good, who cares? It still takes talent and effort. It's just all the more impressive when someone can actually do it better/faster. But the bar for professional-level playing is still lower than most drummers would care to admit.
@enterthehacks the bar for professional drumming is in fact low, and in my view triggers make it lower. It's not a cheat code, sure, but it does give leeway for drummers to become lazy and connivant with their technique - playing super fast triggered and untriggered are 2 completely different levels of skill. Ask Dave Lombardo.
Bc they probably struggle and if they can call out a reason why the person more skilled than them is 'cheating' then it makes them feel better. I am only 10 months in to drumming so I am nowhere near skilled yet. Hopefully I will become as good as this.
Thats not the reason, because you can hit the bass drum hard without them but they are a tool for people who can play fast but not hit hard to still sound good playing fast.
I think people hating on triggers comes down to people being purists and people who like power playing. The faster you go, the less power you produce. Some think it’s cheating to go both fast, and sound powerful. Some of my favorite drummers are known for power, so I can see why some think triggers are cheating…in that sense. I personally like the fluctuations in power/tone a drummer produces. Sometimes triggers can make it sound too…drum machine-y to me. That being said, if the music itself is good, I don’t care
@@whoathatcombo obviously it removes all the nuance of playing the kick. Leaving the beater on the head. Pulling it back for the more open tone. Flutter tone, or flutter into hard hit with heel-toe. Obviously any good drummer wouldn't play with a trigger because it kills more of your range expression.
(This is bait just fyi, now I'll wait for the angry replies like baaaah here's a good drummer using a trigger he's way better than you. yes. now go cry about it)
@@davidramirezrodriguez3373 they make your hits consistent. So if you have inconsistent hits, they will still sound the same. It does cover up poor habits.
@@scotto132 thats quantized trigger, not trigger. trigger just takes the hit and places a sample there. Quantized trigger takes a hit and places a sample in the closest grid spot where a hit could go.
As a hobbyist metal producer myself, I kind of thought the same thing at first, spending all my effort trying to get the sub bass hit of the kick drum dialed in stronger but neglecting the click/attack. It's actually quite important to have have a good amount of high frenquencies from the kick coming through the mid range speakers to accentuate the electric guitars and other elements to achieve that full bodied modern metal tone. Once I started dialing in more kick attack, my mixes started sounds much more clear and full with the tone I was looking for. It is suprising how much better even the guitars sounds with good kick attack to compliment them. It was an effect I wasn't expecting. The kick still has lots of low end thump, but now much more high frequencies when listening to the kick in solo that I wouldn't thought to add.
Depends very much on the size of the bass drum. Jazz drummers are looking for a melodic tone from a 18” or even 16”. You can get a funky punch from a 20”, or a melodic tone. 22”s and 24”s are much more throaty and boomy, but depending on muffling and mic’ing, you can get the top end attack and some lovely bottom end sub. Ultimately the first rule of bass drums is there ain’t no rules.
@@ianmatthews9763 well. I'm strongly into rock and metal stuff. Hearing clicking when it's supposed to be the kick makes me cringing. I mean, it's so awful and awkward to have ultrasounds instead of a nice "boom". The Wall, by Pink Floyd, has, to me, a beautiful kick sound. Darkthrone too.
@@dodenmanniskan8846 Onemof my personal favourite recorded bass drums sounds is Joe Morello’s on Dave Brubeck’s Take Five. Deep and warm. Utterly marvellous!
@@ianmatthews9763 will check out. I remember, a video interview of Darkthrone's drummer, it's very interesting to listen and understanding, he's straightforward when it comes to goodness
Did people where offended by Alex Van Halen or Bill Bruford using Simmons electronic drum pad on an acoustic electronic hybrid configuration ? Of course not , even ZZtop Franck Beard or Rammstein drummer use that stuff on there regular acoustic kit to sound bigger than life and simplified the job of the P.A mixing guy , you know sometimes get the mic sounding right on a huge area can be problematic and need a lot of processing device to sound similar, that kick sound for example need a plastic or wooden beater and a lot of noise gate and compressor to get it right !
They're necessary for certain music styles or certain applications. But I much prefer an acoustic bass drum sound. That triggered sound he's using sounds like a practice pad.
You’re sick both on the kicks and in these comments. 😂 Who have you watched play drums the most? I’m always trying to gather more drummers to watch and learn from. My mom says hi.
Are there a good setup for bass drum triggers with a Roland Drum trigger module? I think you get it more clean but the only thing I notice is that you are limited to the module sounds. And what about playing live, then you hear both right? I get more n more interested in this topic :-D more than rudiments ^^
The real problem is when they increase the speed beyond 220 bpm! Without triggers the drummer should train and practice a lot to be able to have a coherent and forceful sound as well as clear! There are many drummers who have been practicing for 10 or 20 years to do that! but ! With the arrival of triggers, today's drummers don't hit the bass drum hard and just hit it super soft and let the trigger do the rest! Whether current drummers will worry about maintaining forcefulness and speed with or without triggers is another story.
I think hearing the real drum set is a good thing though instead of just using triggers for samples. Cuz I think a band has to have its own sound by the drum kit. That's why I kind of hate music right now because they're everyone's using the same drum samples
I use triggers and a mesh head too but don’t act like it’s not 1000% easier. 220bpm on a mesh head all day but the second I touch a regular head I get gassed the fuck out.
Yeah because he definitely can't play as fast he can with triggers or anything. Dude is literally playing the same speed and showing how much better triggers sound. You need a reason to dismiss their skill so you don't feel bad about your own lack of skill.
@@redfin382 doesn't matter how fast you can play. Matters if you sound good. If you need triggers to sound good then good for you. Just feel you should push to sound good without all the bullshit. It's like a singer using auto tune. Are you really a singer?
Cause most triggers sound like ass, plus lazy people not wanting to properly tune their bass drum, a properly tuned kit will always Sound better, that's just how it is
Because people don't understand what they are, they think it's drumagog or something, it just makes your kit sound better, not your playing lol. If you suck, triggers could make you sound worse😅😅
