This is the fourth instalment of my "Why do people HATE" series, where I'll tackle the notorious 3rd Hokage and answer the question of why he's hated within the fanbase
I think Hiruzen suffers from the same problem as Rose Quartz. At their introduction they seem like a well-meaning if flawed individual that touched many lives but, as the series goes on, it's revealed they are responsible for everything that went wrong to some degree. In Part one Naruto is just some unlucky kid that fell through the cracks of the system, but then it turns out Hiruzen knew about him from the beginning. The Uchiha massacre, at first, looks like a random tragedy like Zabuza's massacre of the Mist academy. Some kid just snapped and started killing with no provocation. Then we get the story of the village founding. The whole point of the academy and village was to keep children off the battlefield. Itachi only acted the way he did because he was a child soldier, Obito was a child soldier, Kakashi was a child soldier.
Yeah Hiruzens biggest fumble was allowing Danzo too much power. Danzo leaked that Naruto was the Jinchuriki, he stole Shisuis eye thus leading to the massacre, he helped Orochimaru get test subjects.
@@patrickloureiro351 I mean, I know that was the point but after the first couple of reveals it gets old. She's dead stop beating that dead horse and move on to someone else. It ruined my enjoyment of the show.
@@teezy786 Mild correction: The massacre was coming regardless of Shisui's eye. That just stopped him from resolving it non-violently. At most, it gave the Uchiha more reason to do the coup.
They have the yamanaka clan who can read minds. They could have read minds of Uchiha's Jonin and Chunin to prooves that they weren't responsable for the Kyuubi incidents.
I know it’s lame but a think they have some rules against And also, I’m not sure inoichi would be able to read fugaku’s mind on distance Would have to be something like with the pain bodies, with touching and etc
@@igortristao3102 they will certainly accepts to get their minds be read if it could dismiss them for the crime they didn't commit but were punish for.
He even was a pushover when Nejis dad was murdered because The Cloud were trying to murder Hinata and take her eyes out after they signed a peace agreement
Another example of the 3rds incompetence. He also let stone walk after the 3rd ninja war, despite Konoha's losses and that konoha was close to victory. This move was so unpopular that the 3rd had to step down as hokage.
Bro hiruzen didn't want to start another, since they were still weak from the nine tails attack , it wasn't even hiruzen that made that decision it was the hyuga clan that made it not hiruzen, hiruzen was just a mediator
@@JuubiTazI am 100% sure hiruzen wanted to stop more ppl from dying, hiruzen knew it was risky decision, hiruzen even willingly took all the blame for the qat
Something to highlight the thirds incompetence is the fact that as hokage naruto chose to take in an orphan who had a target on his back and made him a part of a family he never had, he did for kawaki what hiruzen should hv done for him
that's true, even though he had a bigger obligation to take in Naruto, than Naruto did to Kawaki, cuz hiruzen was the Hokage & Naruto's parents gave their lives to protect the village
In defense of the third, if Naruto’s parents were common knowledge then it likely would’ve made it easier for enemy villages to figure out who the nine tails ginjuraki was. This is also true if Naruto knew that the nine tails was inside of him. And if Naruto knew who his parents were then he probably would’ve never shut up about it lol. Remember that his mom was kidnapped by an enemy village because she had the nine tails inside of her.
@@durrangodsgrief6503 just because the villagers know doesn’t mean that outside villages know. In fact, the third forbid anyone from talking about it. And this was apparently so effective that Naruto, never heard about it until he was 12.
i believe by that point in the story where Kushina was kidnapped, she was not Kurama's jinchuriki as of yet. She was kidnapped because she was an Uzumaki, and those people wanted to know Uzumaki secrets from her.
Somehow, Temari got out unscathed. But sadly, virtually no other female character is good. Tsunade KINDA goes from trash to decent, but is still the weakest Hokage, and arguably the weakest Kage at the time... so like, still shafted. Not to mention characters like Tenten, Sakura, and imo Hinata who was at least handled sloppily. And then from what I saw in Boruto (which was only like 30 episodes or something) she basically became just a one-dimensional gag character of "OOH, she's scary when angry!" Although, I mean, look how much Naruto and Sasuke got shafted then. And is Sakura really happy being alone like 360 days of the year? Even for the people who hate her... did she deserve that? Hell, Karin said Naruto had the warmest Chakra she had ever seen. She probably should've fallen for him, too. Yet she wanted Sasuke, with the coldest and darkest because she's got Stockholm Syndrome as bad as Harley Quinn did when she was with Joker... so let her be alone all the time. Christ, imagine a kid with Sharingan, Adamantine Chains, the Uzumaki's pool of Chakra and Sealing Techniques, and I think they even have the best regen short of the Senju? Sarada would be unstoppable. Sakura deserved better. Like, anyone else. Of course, Shikamaru & Temari are the OTP... but like, idk, Lee? Gaara? He's edgy, too. Kiba is basically discount Naruto so I guess why downgrade? And I think she hates bugs so no Shino... honestly, she probably should've got with Naruto... but Hinata also deserved better. So I don't hate her winning at the end of the day... I just hate that he didn't realize she EXISTED as a woman until she was like, "I love you, Naruto!" and DIED. Before that, she was just someone else from Konoha for him to protect. And then they get married. Garbage. The Last movie should've been tweaked to come BEFORE the wedding so they effectively had at least ONE date, and bonded some, THEN got married. (My) Problem solved. But since Hinata had no build-up and Sakura had ALL the build-up, I'm #TeamSakura as things stand. And I'm not sorry for that. Shonen authors really need to learn how to make decent female characters. It's a shame we got like 1/10 Temaris.
the Cloud got caught with their pants down trying to kidnap Hinata yet they got the audacity to ask for compensations! On top of that, he pandered to them.
You're ignoring the fact that they had just struck a ceasefire. Hiruzen was trying to prevent another war. I'm not saying he was a perfect ruler, but he had the most trouble to deal with, as he ruled for many decades, refined the Academy system, led the village in many wars (including the 2nd and 3rd great wars), and made it prosper somehow. In comparison, Minato ruled for around a year, and then Hiruzen had to come back from retirement and take charge again. Hashirama founded the village but ruled for a brief time as well, as he died before or during the First Great Ninja War, where Tobirama also died. Hiruzen has been the Hokage for like 90% of the Leaf's history.
@@giannixx he could have still given them the middle finger, the cloud was in no position to ask anything, it's like a money launderer asking for the money he stole.
@@arinzechukwuonyekwuluje2218 the hyuga are his people THEY SHOULD NOT HAVE TO OFFER THEIR LIVES FOR AN EVENT MADE BY THE ENEMY, he should have told the cloud to kick rocks
I think that's implicit. The Cloud saw no problem in kidnapping children from other villages though. Nor did the Sand mind using a child as an experiment to see whether it could control Shukaku before becoming too dangerous to the point it would have to be assassinated. The Mist didn't mind making their Academy students murder each other in order to graduate, or ordering their ninja to betray and kill their comrades so they won't get captured by the enemy. I don't think you can single out the Leaf while the real problem is the shinobi system itself, as Minato, Nagato, and Madara were able to understand and demonstrate. And we see in the Land of Waves Arc that every experienced Shinobi probably has at least a superficial understanding of the problem (Haku and Zabuza understand that to be a shinobi is to be a dehumanized tool for one's village or employer, and Kakashi says to Naruto that the same is true in the Leaf), they just don't know the solution.
@@aliastheabnormal I knew his name and that he was the third’s dad. I was more asking about what stuff he did, and how the memories of the village were wiped. Was it in a light novel?
@@JuubiTaz Sadly Tobirama had a choice in the matter. Danzo was an envious coward. The elders are psychopaths complicit in war crimes. And he himself was going to get jumped by Jinchuriki. Hiruzen was a proper choice by comparison.
Because Hiruzen has too many skeletons in the secret closet. Mainly because he was designed to be the final boss in the early stages. But after that got scrapped there were too many tragedies in Konoha and surprisingly all in the third Hokagai’s era. There’s some thing I didn’t see much people talk about is what happened to all the Uchiha property ? Sasuke didn’t get shit , seeing how strong Itachi is genius aside he was far better trained then Sasuke . What happened to all the Uchiha’s resources ? Why is The scarf that Naruto‘s mother made for Naruto is in the Hiruzen clan’s Storage? Naruto‘s father is the fourth Hokagei and his mother is the last surviving princess of a small country , where is all that property and money? And most importantly in the fourth grade ninja war why are there thousands of Hiruzen ninjas ?
Sacrificing Hizashi Hyuga to appease the Fourth Raikage after the Cloud Village's attempt to kidnap Hinata, showing weakness and causing needless tragedy.
One thing we have to remember is that is that the Hokage is effectively a Military Dictatorship and that means that the leader has to be portrayed as strong and capable, and sadly by allowing Danzo to walk all over him in his decisions that means that Hiruzen was seen as incompetent to all the readers considering that the position of Shadow Hokage is mostly used by him and really no one else in Konoha makes us wonder if he was ever suited for the role.
Hiruzen was the light while Danzo was the darkness. Hiruzen couldn't bring himself to kill his precious student. Hiruzen didn't neglect Naruto, he took good care of him until his death, he put Naruto into a normal house and if he took him in, the villagers will lose respect for him. Hiruzen was the sole opposition towards the Uchiha Clan's mistreatment but Danzo and the two elders weren't having it, however the hardliners in the Uchiha Clan made everything worse at the cost of even dragging their innocent clansmen into Danzo's trap.
The guy from the ramen shop took care of Naruto way more than Hiruzen ever did, despite HIRUZEN promising Minato. And then Iruka basically became Naruto's dad. Hiruzen DID NOT take care of Naruto. He's trash. He was neglectful af. I know there's usually a difference between neglectful and abusive, but at some point, you can be neglectful enough it's abusice, imo. And Hiruzen was. Everyone hated Naruto and treated him like crap AND he failed the Genin exam like 3 times? Why? Because he had the Nine-Tails inside of him and couldn't control his chakra enough to do a simple clone and transformation Jutsu. Yet he INVENTED Sexy Jutsu (which honestly IS a transformation so idk why that didn't count) and MASTERED Multi-Shadow Clone Jutsu, an A-Rank Forbidden Jutsu, OVERNIGHT. He's a goddamn prodigy but NOBODY helped him not recognized his talent. Hiruzen didn't even explain to anyone at the Academy WHY Naruto struggled. Also, he didn't explain to ANYONE why they shouldn't HATE Naruto. It wasn't HIS choice to have half the Nine-Tails sealed in him. Honestly, it makes sense why GAARA was treated like that. His father was abusive and thought love and kindness would be a weakness and WANTED his son to be treated like just a tool. But why tf did Hiruzen who PROMISED TO LOOK AFTER NARUTO, effectively let him be treated the same as Gaara? Nah, Hiruzen deserves ZERO respect. He's trash. Idc if he was arguably the strongest Hokage according to some statements (he wasn't) or anything like that. Idc if he tried to do some good with the Uchiha or something, so did others. And he just didn't want them to be a threat to the village. God, freaking TOBIRAMA probably would've taken better care of Naruto, especially if he promised Minato he would. Mostly just to keep his word, because he's probably the type to see a Jinchuuriki as a tool... but still.
Hiruzen is the prime example of when compassion and complacency override duty and responsibility. This is what Hashirama and Naruto could've been if they didn't have their sidemen question them and come up with alternative ideas.
When Hiruzen became Hokage, rumors began to circulate about his father's atrocities during the Warring States Era, including the deletion of his own pregnant daughter. Of course, this negatively impacted Hiruzen's reputation, and he sought a way to clear his father's name. He eventually found a shinobi in the Land of Lightening who could alter memories. Hiruzen learned his technique and used that jutsu to make the Hidden Leaf forget about his father's past and see him as a hero. He could have used that jutsu to make people forget that Naruto was the Nine-Tail's jinchuriki.
Is that from a novel or something because wtf? If that's true than there really is no excuse for Hiruzen. He essentially has Doctor Strange magic if that Jutsu is canon
@@FrostyPeace10 Sorry. But all @dygoknight has said about Hikaku Uchiha or Sasuke Sarutobi was a made up story by himself. @dygoknight is still the best Naruto's content RU-vid Channel in the whole world.
@4:30 i think that's more of a demonstration of how good a guy Iruka is, pulling a total 180 and basically raising Naruto himself after that point, while Hiruzen still sat back behind his Crystal Ball. The "Good Man" doing nothing. The previous generation failed Naruto and to a lesser extend his peers, so hard. Iruka, Kakashi, Kurenai, Guy and Asuma are absolute G.O.A.Ts, Hiruzen and the Ninja council are failures
Yes i didn't realize before both sasuke and nagato hated the hidden leaf village for killing thier familys the more i known about the how and croupt and evil the hidden leaf village the more i am convinced that they deserved to destroyed no wonder many characters in naruto hate the hidden leaf village
The real problem is just the whole narrative in general. The author keeps on changing and adding stories as the show goes on. Hiruzen was the strongest Hokage ever, until he's not. He was the genius, until the author decided that the 2nd Hokage was smarter. Danzo wasn't even existed until Kishimoto wants to introduce a new villain for Sasuke because Itachi is suddenly became a good guy all along ever since he won so many popularity votings.
That could mean at that time during hiruzens prime since that statement would only refer to base hashirama that hiruzen surpassed and not sage mode hashirama since no one except madara knew of its existence thus making the statement more plausible.
@@KristopherDorsey-rq8ek I'm not talking about powerscalling. I'm talking about how it was canonically stated that Hiruzen is THE strongest of them all, said by Iruka on the early chapter of the series. But later on, the first hokage is labeled as the god of shinobi, which nullifies Iruka's statement. It's an inconsistency of the narrative.
Love the series but Hiruzen gets the short end of the stick because Kishimoto invented Danzo, who becomes the "fall guy" for Itachi's actions during the massacre. Kishi also has Danzo involved with the eventual creation of Pain. Danzo and elders suspected the Uchiha for the Kyubi attack and relegated them to the edge of the village which in turn pissed them off. Danzo was just a fall guy but because Hiruzen is the Hokage at the time, Hiruzen gets shafted as well...
Psalm 37 verse 7 Be still before the LORD and wait patiently for him; do not fret when people succeed in their ways, when they carry out their wicked schemes.
Social workers took custody of me when I was 11. I too was alienated from my peers, I had different nationality and didn’t knew the language at the time. At same time I started watching Naruto, his life was very similar to mine. I could connect with his loneliness. He was my role model and thought me to never give up and that hard work will pay off. If you take anything from Naruto and change it, Naruto would be a different person. Just like me. The hard childhood makes easier adult hood, at least that was the case with me. I overcame my bitterness and loathing for the unfair world. I grew past my past, I can see now why adults did what they did to me when I was a kid. Would I do what they did to me to another child? Ofc no, I forgave my parents and heard their excuses and why they did what they did. Sorry for rambling, back to Naruto. Let’s be real if Naruto knew who he’s dad was, he would become cocky, just like Boruto was. You saying that village would respect Naruto for his father legacy? He would have as many enemies as his daddy also in that case. If hiruzen adopted Naruto, not only he would show favouritism towards this one orphan, it would change Naruto’s point of view on life. He would learn that it’s his birth right that matters not the deeds you do in your life. Also he wouldn’t be so passionate and emphatic towards other people. Hiruzen reminds me of my step father. Kinda rough but he handled things with his best abilities. And he really loved me, and cared about me. He was teaching me to be a man and rely on my own strength, believe in myself. I’m child of a 90s and we never thought back then that hiruzen is a bad human being, on a contrary it was an opposite. He was rough but fair granddad. And he was a human before ninja. He knew that he needs Danzo, he couldn’t kill orochimaru because he was his favourite pupil, and he cared for him. I think Naruto would become like orochimaru if hiruzen played favourites again. But my point is: when did everything became abuse? To me it’s a personal growth and maturity to survive in this world. Look at Naruto verse, there is wars, death and orphans. Corrupt countries and leaders that doing their shady shit, trying to win the arms race. And then there is hiruzen, one of the oldest kage, nominated twice by the people. Who was ready to sacrifice himself before village, couldn’t kill his dear student, was familiar with all the villagers and their children. Everyone sounds so hurt, while they are living in a comfort era, many haven’t experienced the same life as me and Naruto, but still bitching about this granddad. It’s called growth and maturity. World isn’t sunshine and rainbows god damn, it’s a cruel place. If Naruto had these privileges he would become ignorant soy boy. Hiruzen did an excellent job in raising Naruto.
1. To be fair, Hiruzen did help Naruto plenty. When you compare the latter's life to the other orphans in the show, he had a much stronger support network around him and that's largely due to Hiruzen. Credit where it's due. 2. I disagree with this interpretation of Hiruzen as "naive yet kind-hearted old man manipulated by the evil Danzo" considering it's stated that he's the one who ultimately ordered the massacre, not Danzo.
@@JuubiTaz There's no evidence that Danzo ordered it. In fact Hiruzen admits he gave the order when asked by Sasuke (who'd seen the flashback from Itachi at this point so he would've known had Danzo done it behind Hiruzen's back).
The misconception that Danzo gave the order without Hiruzen's knowledge stems from anime filler and novels of questionable canonicity. In any case, manga version holds priority.
On the day the leaf and the cloud signed a treaty, the cloud attempted to kidnapp Hinata, providing it was just a ruse. It's one thing to forgive such a blatant violation, but to make your own village appease the offender is just so stupid. All for a treaty that meant nothing.
I think the simplest answer is: "Don't worry, Minato. I'll watch over your son." Then he doesn't. Edit: also, Bee isn’t really discriminated against? So Naruto may not have been.
They're hating because they think he abandoned Naruto but gave Sasuke better accomodations...Like Naruto can't be messy and Sasuke can't be organized.....am talking about when they showed Naruto's and Sasuke's rooms respectfully
He literally let the kid live alone his whole life; and gave him scraps to feed off of. It’s almost like Naruto would have starved without the ramen guy.
Your saying its bad that he didn't want to reveal the past to Naruto knowing how tragic it really was? Im sorry but this is thr dumbest thing ive ever heard in a minute. Telling that to a kid is hard you know hiruzen didn't want to reveal it him for obvious reasons that your choosing to ignore. And as for the villagers it makes sense i dont think being the hokage son would make the villagers treat Naruto any better considering how he still has the thing that destroyed the village inside him? And some people would probably hate Minato for not killing it and sealing it in a child basically thinking it can run rampage around at any moment. There is a lot more to it that people clearly blatantly ignore.
@@mrmist3763 no hiruzen is the hokage and he didn't do his job well. So by allowing orochimaru and danzo to do whatever they want he indirectly made konoha a hell for naruto and the uchiha. Also he himself admitted that he was a weak and incapable hokage
Hiruzen needs danzo, he is real world CIA. This is how countries operate in our world. He protected Naruto and didn’t play any favourites with orphans, didn’t tell his nuclear weapon that his dad is 4th and that his clan was erased because they were dangerous. Orochimaru were his pupil, hiruzen acted upon he’s feelings towards his favourite pupil, I think that’s why he didn’t play favourites with Naruto. In the end he redeemed himself, orochimaru even helped with war. If you look at the mist for example, they pitted genins against each other fight to death. The series have wars, orphan’s and corruption. Compared to other villages he is not a bad kage.
I would be finenif the 3rd was supposed to be an incompetent leader. After all, he was chosen on a whim. But the show kept gaslighting you into believing he was a great leader by having Naurto downplay his mistreatment, the Hyugas having no beef, and other ninjas glazing him for his intellect. He is a good ninja, but a bad Hokage. Similar to how Robert Baratheon from GOT was a good commander but a shit king.
One of the reasons why I stand by my belief Kishimoto is just an atrocious writer. Retconning Danzo into the series just made Hiruzen look entirely incompetent and corrupt allowing that shady rat to commit treasonous acts like murdering a soldier of the village in Shusui. Sad part is, that it didn't have to happen. The series DON'T need forced plot-twists and complex narratives to be well written. Ranma 1/2 comes to mind. Telling a simple gag story of a handsome boy cursed to turn into a beautiful young girl when splashed with cold water, its simplicity allows it to be much more consistent than Naruto. Despite being comical in nature, I still find the characters way more relatable & human than Naruto's with their pretentious, overly dramatic sappy backstories. Backstories are just a clutch for weak authors that can't develop their characters in the present. I'm not a big fan of Rumiko Takahashi, but I'll always credit her for staying within her limitations and not trying her stories like Inuyasha up with forced plot-twists & "morally ambiguous, grey characters."
@@JuubiTaz kishimoto made lot contradictions in naruto like the village is one big happy family but hidden leaf village treat each like trash like what the did to naruto and kakashi father and guy father who was mock by other and the Uchiha being hated by the village and force to live in outskirts the hidden leaf village being one being happy family is bullshit another is how the series talk about love and peace but trians child in art of killing and war and being tools for the village like how children in hidden misst village are forced to kill each other to survive the is pretty fuck up another example is hard work beats talent but by the end naruto is the child of destiny naruto as a story has many retcons and inconsistents that is the problem
@JuubiTaz The writing was horrific. On paper, it sounds like a good idea, but in reality, it's atrocious and is utterly nonsensical. The village has never been a democracy, its always been a dictatorship. The final decision always rests with the Hokage, so having characters "overrule" Hiruzen makes him look spineless and incompetent. Then there's the fact Danzo never existed in part one and had no actual interaction with Hiruzen in the present. He was simply retconned into the series to pardon Hiruzen of any blame, making Hiruzen look straight up incompetent instead of morally ambiguous.
