Why don't your products feature a subwoofer output? 

Good point!

THX is not a format.

@@playedforfun Yes thanks, that's correct. THX is just a set of specifications. Typo on my part. I meant to say DTS. Edited my response.

So what do you do if you have such a dedicated sub-woofer output? are you supposed to use a rca y adapter? as far as I can tell most subwoofers I've looked at had two standard red and white rca plugs.

Most subs has two rca connector, the pre-out on the pre-amplifier goes into the sub, and all is set. If you don't have a pre-out from an integrated amp, then it becomes more tricky to solve. I have a sub connected to the pre-out on my integrated amplifier. It works nicely. Yes, I also have speaker cable inputs on them, but then I will have to buy a new amplifier for that. I can't see why I should bother about that.

@LD Blake Pre out is always after volume control. It is not a pre out if it has full line level all the time.

@LD Blake It will not optimal to power both the sub and the main speakers with the same output. Of course it works, but it is sub-optimal. But most subs are active, so there is usually no need to give them power from an power amplifier.

@@oysteinsoreide4323 A simple Y adapter will serve to feed the line input on a sub. Some preamps have two pairs of outputs, which would eliminate the need for Y adapters.

@LD Blake Pre out will always be after volume control. If is full line level it's often called rec out.

Oh hell, I wished I could visit Colorado last time I visited US....

All I want is one of those THC crossovers.

@@juliaset751 Every crossover has a little bit of THC in it.

So, how would someone connect a powered sub with no sub outputs and with a recent sub that does not have line-level inputs? I don't think this was answered by the video at all.

@@trog69 He's published a couple videos on how to connect a subwoofer, today's design. The way they work is they connect to the outputs of the power amp and have a low pass filter in the subs circuits. Effectively the main ( L & R ) speakers are still running full range in the way Paul describes how to set this up. Important point PS Audio is NOT a Home Theater products supplier as that is an entirely different design process. In Home Theater you put the LFE stuff, the first two octaves, in the sub(s) subtracting it from the other channels. In today's world the way to do that is with DSP processors. You want to do that if your want to have LOUD explosions and not blow up your main speakers. DSP has been around for decades. When you buy the DSP chip you are paying for the licenses like Dolby and THX.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_signal_processor

A Survey of Mainstream DSP Processors: www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1275387

@@wilcalint Well the Dolby and DTS licenses are optional on some custom DSP products. But most generic DSP's lack built in Dolby and DTS processing. And DSP's are used far beyond audio systems. Many modern pieces of test equipment as well as other industrial electronics is DSP based. None of the DSP chips in that EE Times article have DD or DTS built in but I know at least Analog Devices does make a licensed DD product.

Curt Chase, I did this converter box also to a flat screen. The lady didn't want to deal with more than one Dish remote.

Our 43 inch Westinghouse has a variable RCA outputs. It's been an awesome TV.

I asked Paul if he would give me the hi res file, he said he nuked it. haha

That is the better 💡😊

It is fine to do that and yes, the Stellar outputs are the same for both RCA and XLR.

PS Audio Thank you; I’ve passed that answer onto someone who had a similar question about the Stellar/DAC on another posting.

The older surround sounds had a crossover for the sub and the little cube speakers were crossed higher. Seems like Bose was the first I remember of that type in '96 or so. I didn't like that set up in the first ten seconds that I heard it at a store.

Boy, speaking of THX, I developed friendship with the guy that ran the local Radio Shack back in the 90's. My wife and I went to his home and he had A THX certified system, full blown with "Butt kicker" servo mounted to the 2 viewing chairs. Saw Titanic. Or should I say felt, heard and seen Titantic?

If you're not "decoding" anything the sub does not have it's own LFE channel defined by the medium. Only the crossover. The LFE input at the sub is typically NOT crossed over in the sub. So if you can set the crossover frequency in the reciever to optimize your setup in two ch mode you should be fine.

Craig Flowers. The whole discussion basically puts anything less than Paul's new design,... a compromise. This thing popped my bubble months ago when Paul did a video on it. "How to hook up subs" I believe. His point is that the main amp (his) has tonal qualities that should be passed on to the sub. So I suppose if you don't have hi level input on an active sub, then you need to get one that does or maybe a hi to low level converter then into your active sub with phase and volume control.

endrizo look up my subwoofer klispch rw-12d I have all 3 inputs Lfe-line in L-R rca-and high input speaker wire inputs - it was 800 bucks but sounds great !

Interesting product idea! A 2.1 channel analog preamp with a built in adjustable low pass filter for strict high end stereo use? PS Audio probably has the right market in hand to sell it to. I would skip the Dirac as that would require DSP processing plus licensing and you can already get HT products with that.

LD Blake Yes! I have in fact had a hearing test. Anything below 35 HZ or so comes through as flutter. I've run my senhieser HD380's through a sing along generator and heard all the way down to 25 Hz, although amplified. It's there, and a good sub will bring that out. Even way back when I was a teenager, and they offered free hearing tests to every one at our school, I heard a much wider range of frequencies than most people can. And that, in and of itself, explains why people invest god money in the shit Bose sells! If you can't hear the difference, I'm sorry. But there are those of us who can and those of us who have trained our ears to hear the subtle differences in frequency response, detail of a given driver and much more that could just be lost on the average guy with a loud ass subwoofer in their car rattling the spot welds apart. So yes, I've tested my ears and had them tested. Have you?

TJ, I looked up your 2 channel pioneer. if your "subwoofer out" goes to your subwoofer LPF you may have the pioneer crossing over and the sub doing the same. Phase is the situation that you most likely have going bad. Getting subs to be in phase with mains is the biggest challenge. If a company had a ready to go package, then chances of a good turn out would be easier to achieve. Paul doesn't respond to questions here consistently. I would have to look up your sub to go further. Happy New. Year either way.!

Brian David Loveless Thanks a lot, I appreciate it , I been running my main sun out out from pioneer into the sub Left channel sounds alright on movies but not music then I hooked up the line out from back of pioneer into klispch Left and right input Ohh my constant signal no volume ad just right now going to use a Y splitter from pioneer amp sub-output to see how it sounds - then I have the option of speaker B outputs from the amp to subwoofer the klispch subwoofer has digital controls on top of it I can control phase from 0-180 then the LFE from 40Hz to 120hz then it has eq mode also which is music-depth-flat thanks again it's a Klispch RW-D10 not D12

Tj, did you see how Paul knows hooking up a sub is tricky business? that's why he's building his own speakers with subs included. It takes so much to get it right. The adding a subwoofer to a speaker is going to prove in time to be a compromise. This is what's wrong with 2 channel audio. We all know that a sub always sounds good on a movie. And then we want that great sound to work in a 2.1 Don't get frustrated just because they sell stuff, doesn't mean that it is or can be perfect. How many times do you see a sub sitting next to a high-end speaker system? its because the sub and the main woofer overlap in frequencys. Its at this point when things go bad. time delay in different amps for one. They must be matched in so many ways. I'm just trying to say that you get it as good as you can and then live with it. Your pioneer has other Features that are more important than a sub. You know that all amps "sound" different from each other.

That's why Paul recommended Rel subs. they are fed the same signal as the mains( hi-level) "to get the same characteristics as the main amp"- Paul Mcgowan

See my reply to LD Blake in this thread.

LD Blake you are correct. Thanks for pointing that out.

Hook it to twice the I'm out power and see what you get. Its just a Pyle.

More power can only be had with more voltage ( ohms law) . More transistors may get you cooler operation by sharing the total load that will not get you more power output.

To get more power you have to draw it from the amplifier's power supply. The reason high powered amplifiers have multiple p-channel and n-channel devices in the output stage is to handle the current that a higher power amplifier requires. In short the power supply of the amplifier determines the possible power output.

I actually did this years ago. I paralled 2 Stk's 0049...didn't seem any different, It was a short test and I realized it was silly to try this. Thankfully nothing cooked.

Ok! Thank you

you want more power? Multi amp it !! Now heres the rule.. say; two 100 watts stereo amps (50wpc) Bi-amped is the power of one 400 watt amp. (200wpc) That's from Southern California 38 years ago.

I think Paul was selling the Rel sub when he said that.

Random Tube Klispch RW -d12 had all 3 inputs

I thought the same thing. Don't I use that output to hook up my sub??

That's the question of today. Pretty sure it's not crossed at any point so its like a y connector from line out.

The Sprout does not have any DSP processors in it. See my post above.

@George Blisson Paul uses IcePower Class D amplifiers. He's even mentioned this in some of his videos. Not a bad choice if not the best choice cost return benefit: icepower.dk/ I believer that the Sprout is a nicely packaged ICEedge Class D amp.

The DAC is new to this Sprout and better then first Sprout and it has bass boost defeat unlike first one.

transkryption mine is more like a Tweeter

@@jimolson9671 I think it should be called a yapper!

@@transkryption is that a sub-type of tweeter?

Yes and for some strange reason they spend an inordinate amount of time staring out the window.

ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-_xn1Uyuoakw.html

Alrighty then!

That was months ago that was said.

@@SJMessinwithBoats1 Speakers---done right---typically take 1-2 years from inception to production, and oftentimes even longer, as sometimes manufacturing can introduce unforseen defects in parts or assembly, or even something as simple as cabinet finish. I'm in the biz, and know.

@@MrSatyre1 My idea is mostly too unrealistic, so probably take longer . But I do have a general formula. Willing to blab to anyone that wants to hear about it.

@@SJMessinwithBoats1 Actually years ago they showed them even...but I think you missed my point.

Paul supported other company's speakers to demonstrate quality in loudspeakers and subs that can take advantage of his line of electronics. Psaudio hasn't sold any speakers yet. And Psaudio still sells electronics that go with other's products. Speakers and Subs. ("showed them".. showed what exactly?)

Doesn't the sprout go full range out and let the active sub do the crossover point and phase?

My thoughts too. I asked about this on a previous video and got no reply. Doesn’t mention on the PS audio website if the Sprout has a full range output or a cross over point .

email him or Scott direct. Mainly, Scott is the guy. scott@Psaudio.com

Adding subs to a well designed speaker is like putting big wheels and tires on a pickup truck and expecting it to be a win-win situation.

@@SJMessinwithBoats1 You must have the only speaker that is well designed then. Just out of curiosity, how is this well designed speaker able to find the power to drive at very low frequencies? Just curious...

I'm a DIY. It takes being a some luck to match up the mains driver and a sub driver. Here's the thing, when speakers are designed, they never intended to have an add on. Paul is building a speaker with the sub integrated with the "mid bass coupler". I say, that if a person was to add a subwoofer, than the mains box should be optimized for a higher freq than an optimized box for the lowest possible freq. I hope that came out right.

That's Paul's point about his line of speakers. ground up design. "Nobody else is doing it, it needs to be done"- Paul Mcgowan

@@SJMessinwithBoats1 I also am a DIY'er. I built a pair of 6Pi Cornerhorns, they are 3dB down at about 25Hz. By any standard, this is one of the rare designs that "does not require a sub." Indeed, it does not require stereo flanking subs, but it benefits hugely from a single sub low passed at 80Hz. there are other speakers that also reach down into subwoofer territory, but all of them that I know of will benefit from an additional sub. The main reason for this is that a sub uses a driver specially designed for being a sub, and it requires a great deal of power to drive it. If that driver is also powered from speaker level outputs from and main amplifier, you will have real issues when the driver is damped. The difference is in SQ is huge. A good woofer will provide a great deal of detail, but visceral resonances come from subwoofer drivers.

That way you're not blending the subwoofer's sound with the speakers. You need the subwoofer in line with the speakers to accomplish this, otherwise your output is coming from 2 separate outputs. There is a big difference in the sound.

I think you're confusing S/PDIF with a mono RCA. S/PDIF is digital. Not analog. Paul's equipment, at least his amps, and preamps are all analog. There's no digital connections in any of them, Sprout might be an obvious exception here (I think it has an on board DAC?), but the Sprout is a completely different thing then all the rest of the equipment he's ever built anyway. I've never seen a sub with a S/PDIF input BTW, ever. Always analog RCA, speaker level inputs, or LFE. To use S/PDIF now you would have to add a DAC to the sub. This would only add costs, and hurt the performance.

You're answering your own question. You do not want to mix digital and analog outputs to your speaker set.

The big selling point for me is the DAC in the Sprout, Paul told me it is better than last Sprout. Just a little longer before I get to ream the Sprout out. (constant burn in)

@Dennis D. West Subwoofers have almost no timbre, if they are producing the same frequency range with the same distortion, group delay, transient response, etc., they all sound the same, you can mix and max subs with speakers to your hearts content.

Did you see Paul's? It works for the wife and grandkids.

I think what you're trying to say is, combining a home theatre and 2 channel setup = junk. If you like watching movies, having a separate home theatre setup is mandatory.

@@thegeb75 No, it is not mandatory. However, if you like weird atmospheric sounds and sounds behind you and you don't care about sound quality, it is of course. I enjoyed that for about 5 minutes, but after that it just sounded silly to me. I love movies and I love listening to them through my two channel system. Of course home theater is great for the average consumer who does not know any better, but I am not the average consumer. I have been an audio enthusiast for a long time and a home theater system that would make the grade for me as far as sound quality is concerned would cost far more than i am willing to pay. I have an excellent 2 channel system and it is great for movies too. The idea that an HT system is somehow mandatory for movies is an idea perpetuated by salesmen of all the crappy processors, amplifiers and speakers you need to complete your "mandatory" 9.2 or whatever system. You can buy as many speakers, amps and processors as you like, but it is still going to sound like garbage compared to a proper 2 channels system unless you pay something far north of $100.000. To me 99% of home theater systems are junk. I do however see the average consumer's point of view and if they think sounds coming from behind their head are fun and they like cluttering their living space with cables and crappy speakers, then all the best to them.

@@petermartin9494 Can't stop laughing! Just... Wow.

@@petermartin9494 I can see your point, although you seem to have very high standards. Do I need whizzing bullets, flying spaceships and cars racing around the city to be high fidelity? Perhaps those kind of movies aren't your thing. Fair enough. HT for me is like thrill rides. Sure they're not like flying an F-22 or base jumping off K2, but those rides are sure dang fun! At the end of the day, listening is about enjoyment. 2 channel, 11.2 channel, or 100+ channel, whatever the system, if the listener's having fun, that's all that matters.