This brings up lots of questions, that I am not actually going to ask. I appreciate your honesty and wanting to do what is "right" for the customer. I am not sure I would have posted this video, but then again you have done just fine in life without my advice. I am not a licensed electrician just somebody interested in the trade who is trying to educate himself and learn how to do things safely and correctly. You are a role model. -Respectfully
You shouldn’t be allowed to be licensed if you are doing that kind of work instead of Making peoples home safer you’re making it unsafe By removing arc fault and GFCI breakers just saying but you do what you Gotta do I guess
Miguel why would they still allow them to sell them if they were unsafe? The older style breakers have worked for 30+ yrs. An the AFci or Gfci go out inless than a one year or two years.
@@unitedtradesmanacademy1894 I’m not talking about the breaker being unsafe you and they make the breakers because not everything needs to be GFCI or AFCI you don’t know if it’s a breaker issue or there’s an actual problem downstream they invented AFCI and GFCI for a reason to make peoples home safe
@@MiguelRamirez-ik7bs yeah a 4yr old house with electrical issues down stream, highly unlikely. Plus these breaker are only required when doing a new build or extending circuits. If you are doing a panel upgrade these breaker are not required. I do this every day an I know where the circuit is going.
@@unitedtradesmanacademy1894 Don’t listen to Miguel bro, because you can see he’s one of the jealous ones cause he don’t have a master license 🪪.. When you go to the panel n reset the breaker you can know right away if it’s dead short n it is not, So what you did is no problem.
@@unitedtradesmanacademy1894 For such anew home to have problems like these means that the most likely explanation is that the wiring installation has issues and the AFCI/GFCI breakers are exposing the poor work.
One reason I replace AFCis is for liability. If that house were to burn down, the insurance company would almost certainly deny the claim for the missing arc fault, even if it was unrelated to the fire, or at the very least go after the person who removed it. Not worth risking my career and livelihood. I do hate those breakers with a passion, and it is both a pain and expensive to have to do callbacks for them. However, I've learned there may be a good reason they trip, and one that could be expensive and time-consuming to fix, but may save the house from being damaged. At the very least, it's worth putting in a new AFCI and seeing if it trips. Should it immediately trip, I know there is a problem. If the customer isn't willing or able to have me troubleshoot it, I'd reinstall the original breaker, take a loss by just charging for the visit, and advise the customer to use someone else. Remember that doing things by code is your protection from liability. I don't care about a building inspector - what I care about and fear is the claims adjuster.
My thoughts exactly. My immediate thought was why he didn't troubleshoot the cause of the near instant trip. If it's something that keeps happening with different breakers, wouldn't that mean there's a problem along the circuit?
@@aurvaroy6670 Removing GFCI protection altogether from a circuit is against code. The video author mentioned that himself and he's right in that what he did violated code. So if the home has an issue with that circuit, something bad happens and its determined the lack of GFCI was the reason someone got hurt then the electrician here has provided video documentation that he removed the GFCI protection against local electrical codes. The liability will be his.
I thought I found A new young Electrician to watch, but you lost me on this video. What you did was so wrong and dangerous. You could have found the cause but instead you took the easy dangerous way out. I really hope you will improve your skills.
My thoughts exactly... What happens when that problem is actually caused by a loose wire or some random fasteners unknowingly installs through wiring. At the end of the day a service call is almost always cheaper and less stressful than a fire if it's properly executed.
I am confused. Why is the solution to a bad gfci breaker to install a standard breaker? Wasn’t the original breaker required and now the receptacle is no longer protected?
Man that is so wrong. You just perjured yourself by documenting that you installed an overcurrent protection breaker in place of AFCI/GFCI breaker which is against code. If a home burns because of you replacing with the wrong breaker type against code you are liable bro. There can be several reasons why an AFCI breaker will nuisance trip, only very rarely is it due to the breaker. There is either a problem with the install or there is a problem with an appliance on the circuit. The customer would not need to keep calling if you fixed the root cause of the issues here. Go to the electrical Code Coach channel on RU-vid and look for his video titled "AFCI Nuisance Tripping and Trouble Shooting". Learn from this dude. Clearly there is something wrong with the install if multiple breakers have this issue. Check for reversed polarity at the breaker or an outlet on the branch circuit, neutral sharing across circuits, neutrals going to the wrong breaker, or maybe grounds/neutrals are touching somewhere. Finally it could be an appliance, but that seems unlikely given the number of circuits impacted.
No hate man, just an apprentice wondering why you wouldn't even go check the microwave outlet? maybe something was touching now it's free to arc all it wants and won't trip the breaker.
I would have done that if the new breaker I put in didnt stay in the on position. The microwave is built into a cabinet an is not easily accessible without removing wood trim pieces.
You had not checked the circuit for earth leakage or the equipment, there could be still an earth leakage in the system. But not sufficient to operate the circuit breaker. As you would call it GFI in the USA, we in the UK call it RCD (residual current circuit breaker) which detects any leakage current to earth.
Thank you for sharing this! So I 'm an electrical contractor too. I agree with you. But what are the legal ramifications, as you replace it with a regular, are we then violating the NEC? So if the house had burned down and the Home Owners Ins company coming to sue me, because I did this, would I be held liable? Did you also know there seems to be "class action lawsuits" against the mfgrs as the AFCI's have issues. It seems common sense that a lot of the circuits should not have AFCI protection, cause it is gonna be nothing but another false trip. I'm hoping to find out how to "Legally" protect myself. It is so frustrating. I also resolve sometimes by putting a regular breaker in, then installing a "AFCI/GFI" kinda outlet, and wiring it as a "feed thru" so it still has protection, but then if there is a fault, it can be isolated easier I guess. God bless you! You take care! AL from CT
But how sure are we that it is a "false trip"? Could it be a real arc fault condition like a squirrel gnawing through a wire or a wire got nicked somehow? I have seen this happen and it is a fire hazard.
I hate AFCI breakers with a passion. So expensive, and trip so easily. A third of the outlets in my brand new house can’t even take a vacuum powering on. Absolute crap devices.
Vacuums are a common reason for nuisance tripping. The motor maybe worn/dirty and be arcing internally. The breakers are telling you a story. That story is get a new vacuum, its unsafe.
@@JeanPierreWhite EVERY vacuum trips it. And one of those vaccums was brand new. Other things trip the breaker too. Heck, I could get one breaker to trip just because of RF interference. (Look it up, it's a thing.) The breaker is telling me a story alright... it needs to be replaced because it's faulty outside it's manufactured tollerences. But now I'm $170 in having bought two new breakers that finally work without tripping. My statement stands. They stink.
@@ryankramer I like the Peterson Electric channel here on RU-vid. They have good AFCI nuisance tripping videos. I like their approach. One statement the tech made was we are paid to find out what's wrong not switch equipment. It took the guy a while but eventually he discovered that at a 4 gang lighting box inside the house there were two home runs and the prior electrician had tied all the neutrals together instead of separating by circuit creating a backfeed issue. This caused the afci breaker to trip. When he switched breakers between circuits the issue went away, so yes some breakers are more sensitive than others, some breakers will expose a wiring fault some won't. They do need to be more consistent but often it's not a faulty breaker. It takes skill to find root cause. They have another video where the home owner had tripping issues with a vacuum and they found what the root cause was a porch light on that circuit. Vacuums will expose faults on circuits protected by afci breakers. In another video they were critical of Eaton BR AFCI breakers saying they had a high failure rate, more so than other types/brands.
A breaker doing its job!! I would delete this video from RU-vid........ I'm well aware of the frustrations of the arc faults in our industry not a fan here..(and I've seen well educated men like Mike Holt get hot under the collar talking about them) But the GFCI you definitely need to address, never eliminate!
Sorry, but this is just so wrong in so many ways. How is the customer going to feel when the house burns down and they have no insurance because of the work they hired you to do.
@@zornob1439 he literally said it himself that he was breaking codes - i dont understand how this guy still has his license, but hey im from eu and dont know how things work in the us
It’s frustrating why the breaker goes out so often it’s a problem that needs the manufacturer to correct. one thing you could recommend and still be code compliant if it’s device specific circuit would be to install a GFCI/AFCI receptacle especially the Leviton smartrip pro which are very reliable. The problem is the arc like signal lots of devices create that on inrush and settling current levels as it operates. That being said even my Leviton receptacle trips for my microwave circuit once every 6-months but given it’s infrequency I can live with that - it’s a simple reset.
This is an excellent suggestion. He needs to go back to that house and put AFCI/GFCI outlets in as you detailed. I've seen others recommend the Leviton units.
Absolutely love your videos, these are perfect for what actually happens out in the field. These videos are really going to help the people that are new to the trade!
Question: Is it GFCI and AFCI breakers in general that are causing the issues or are there particular brands of GFCI and AFCI breakers that are the problem? Thanks for sharing your knowledge. Much appreciated.
@@unitedtradesmanacademy1894 All it would take is for someone to alert a codes inspector in your city to what you did and then you will find out what. I don't know what what is, but I know it's not good.
You didn’t answer the question you put in the title, you didn’t actually find why it was tripping. You just swapped it for a circuit breaker and said cya later.
@@unitedtradesmanacademy1894 No you didn't determine the breaker was bad. You replaced it with a braeker that does not have AFCI/GFCI protection. The fault could be in the homes wiring.
Man them thangs are nothing but a scam . In school they always told me low key companies paid good money to make them make it code so people would pay so much money for them. They are a pain and trip all the time . SMH
They trip because there is a fault on the circuit or with the appliance. I've heard estimates that as high as 50% of electrical circuits in the US have ground faults. We are an accident waiting to happen. Glad codes are finally addressing the shock and fire risks in residential homes.
Why the breaker keeps tripping??? Either a breaker fault, or a fault on the circuit. By removing the arc protection you're ignoring the problem. And you've documented it!
The gfci is there to protect the homeowner, they're paying more money for those breakers yes, but those breakers offer more value to the home owner. If one keeps a home from burning down what is the value of them then?
Southwest Missouri here, I have been considering putting those breakers in my panel. I have square d homeline, are some brands more prone to go bad than others. Thank you in advance
Those arch fault breakers are so touchy code is all political... you want to make money change an industry standard. Plus they were designed for extension cords such as an AC unit plugged in across a bed room causing a 🔥 somewhere in the extension cord regular breaks cant shut off because the unrated extension cord has a constant load on it and fails. Just don't use those cords for a permanent solution.
Is that e Eaton afci breaker? Those always go bad. They had issues internally few years back from what i hear and experience. Just replace it with a newer one. Today that issue is resolved so im told.
Hey bro, I got two minor questions. 1) you don’t offer warranty for your job or work? 2) how do you work with glove on? For me i try several times but I got to physically touch and feel what I am doing
Here is some information why a microwave can cause nuisance tripping with an AFCI breaker. "Yes, an underloaded microwave can trip an AFCI breaker. AFCI breakers are designed to detect and protect against arcing faults, which are a type of electrical fault that can occur when there is a spark or electrical discharge between two conductors. Microwaves work by generating microwaves, which are a type of electromagnetic radiation. These microwaves are used to heat food by causing the water molecules in the food to vibrate. When the microwave is empty or underloaded, the microwaves can bounce around the cavity of the microwave and cause arcing. The AFCI breaker can detect the arcing and trip the circuit breaker to prevent a fire. This is a safety feature, but it can be inconvenient if it trips the breaker frequently. To avoid tripping the AFCI breaker, it is best to avoid running the microwave empty or underloaded. If you need to heat a small amount of food, you can add a mug of water to the microwave to absorb the microwaves. Here are some tips to avoid tripping your AFCI breaker when using a microwave: Avoid running the microwave empty. Avoid heating small amounts of food without adding a cup of water. Keep the microwave cavity clean and free of food particles. Do not use the microwave to heat metal objects or liquids in metal containers. If your microwave is old or damaged, it may be more likely to trip the AFCI breaker. Consider replacing it. If your microwave is tripping the AFCI breaker frequently, you should call a qualified electrician to troubleshoot the problem."
I'm an electrician and I agree with your methods, you have to do this, because of these shitty gfci/afci dual breakers, that cause nuisance trips, and cost a fortune to replace, and still doesn't solve the problem, the older houses all have standard breakers, and didn't cause problems, to hell with the code, I'll do the same and change the breaker to a standard one, problem solved
I am also and electrician, and I also come across this problem. The FIRST question to ask is WHY is the breaker tripping? Not just run right to a faulty breaker or "they always " go bad. I hate these things, and admit almost 50/50 itsa bad breaker, however, as my master told me once: "The dildo of consequences rarely arrives lubricated." No disrespect intended, just believe we HAVE to take the time to actually diagnose the problem.
Late to the party, but my dishwasher and microwave in my new house both trip them. I am thinking the electrical 'arc' of the motors could be causing the problem. Thinking of using just a ground fault on these circuits. Against code, but better than dealing with wife. Don't forget that code also allowed aluminum wire and other crap for a time. Perhaps in time either the code or the products will get the memo. With the high level of manufacturer-regulatory capture in just about every area of government (FDA, CDC, et al), you can bet it is also in code compliance as well. The new appliances work like crap anyway, partly due to EPA regulations, so when they outlaw them you won't miss them as much. I am old and have never know anyone who had a fire from a microwave or dishwasher circuit. I am sure that there were some but they were very rare. Bedroom is a different story. A required sensor for natural gas might be a better direction to go in as those explosions are spectacular.
