I agree! I bought an ESP with extra jumbo frets and I had no idea why I don't really like the guitar. I wasn't bonding with it. Ordered from ESP online. I picked up my Fender and was so happy. I feel like I'm fighting with the ESP. Gotta be those extra jumbo frets.
Yeah, the big frets definitely make it easier to bend notes but also easier to bend chords out of tune. The real trick to get a decent playing neck with small frets is to keep the lacquer off the finger board that used to bury the small frets. And, get stainless steel frets so they don't wear out very quickly. I wouldn't do it today if it weren't for those two options available. I think they play faster too on hammer-ons and pull-offs.
I had an Anderson with SS slightly larger than vintage frets it played and sounded amazing. But I totally agree about the extra Jumbo thing. I’ve tried a few really nice ESPs in GuitarCenter. Fighting them is an accurate description
I purchased a Kiesel semi-hollow 10" radius with SS frets, which are what I believe are a vintage or medium vintage size ( I really don't know the differences in fret sizes without looking it up...even then, it's confusing). I absolutely love them and wish they were on all my guitars.
It's difficult not to press hard sometimes depending on the chord shape. I've been wondering about the vintage frets for years and am so glad I gave them another try. Perfect for what I do.
I like feeling the fretboard when I play and the small frets make it easier to do that. It also makes the notes seem warmer and less metallic/tinny sounding. However I do find bigger bends easier especially in the higher register with medium jumbo frets. Also if your action is low bigger frets help prevent bends from fretting out, especially up high.
To me it depends on the guitar. I have jumbos on of my Fender style guitars and smaller low frets on my Les Paul. I've got 3 Musickraft neck and I love them! You can have SS frets though, I had them for a few weeks and could not put up with the sound of them.
I had jumbo frets on a replacement neck , you had to play it aggressively ala SRV , imo if you've got a lighter touch vintage style are better for you .
I recently picked up a vintera strat with the small vintage frets and 7.25" radius. Huh. Leo Fender had it right from the beginning. I honestly don't know why people are pushing for fatter frets and flatter boards. I don't get it. Is it just not having tried the alternative?
THANK YOU!! For this video! I have a Warmoth neck and got vintage frets with 7.25 radius and the internet has had me second guessing myself. Thank you for the peace of mind
Good decision. That is the classic Fender specs and Leo settled on them for a reason. The guitar sounds more in tune because it is. It is more comfortable too. I can't stand any radius above 9-1/2" which still feels flat to me. Enjoy.
Me too! And this is why I now play on my Squier Affinity with tiny frets having Texas Special pickups! My USA Pro1 Strat with Medium-Jumbo frets remains in its case.
I would like him tell more personal stories about Jimi, what his impression was like. I've seen pictures of Jimi with RM passing through Phoenix and I would like to know more about that tour. Also, what were Jimi's goals with music? What does he think of modern music and what made the music in the 60's so different before or since? Can we make music like that without drugs and rebellion? Could Jimi if he was alive today? P.S. I recently switched to vintage size and prefer it. I think it's a more organic feel and that effects the way you play. It's more authentic IMHO. P.P.S. Don't ever stop your videos. I love to hear your enthusiasm for Jimi and the blue guitar. Always picks me up.
Thanks Jimmy. Let's hope Roger will take the time to answer these. The small frets were a real eye opener for me. I could actually hear much more of a Hendixy sound coming from my guitar and I couldn't believe it. That was the main reason I bought the new neck and I'm so glad I did. I may get another neck for one of my vintage Strats instead of refretting them again. I think you will like Hey Baby from Maui. Jimi does some of the coolest stuff in those chords that you never think of and I am just in awe how he did it differently every time and I wonder if he knew what he was going to play or if it was strictly improv. Whichever, he was a genius. Can you imagine improvising like that and never making or rarely making a mistake? I heard him get off rhythm a little in the song be the band recovers so well.
Also I just ordered two more sets of the 9-40 from Strings by Mail. 40,30,22,15,12,9 GHS Nickel Rockers (pure nickel) and Boomers (nickel plated). They are both round core and seemed to be well made, about half the cost of Curt M. Just FYI.
@@JimmyDevere Thanks for the info. I hate to switch around a lot. My main goal is to find a set that has a wound D string that hold up to SS frets. The Mangans were the toughest so that would be my test on the GHS's. They sound great and they are on sale quite a bit.
Maybe what was Jimis actual amp settings (did he prefer a giant clean sound with the fuzz on %100 of the time backing off the volume on guitar for cleaner stuff) or was it really everything on 10?
Yes, and sometimes you would see Jimi run over to the amps and adjust them. You wonder what he was doing. I'm thinking is was mostly cranked on 10 because there are times when you can hear him kick in the fuzz but I bet he also had the fuzz on at times and controlled it with his volume. He did it all. There is no one thing you can pin down when it comes to Jimi.
@@millstap yes you are right brother , Monterey was a classic example of leaving the fuzz on and turning down guitar volume to clean up . And Woodstock looks like it was intermittently on and off. 👊
Its the modern style of music that brought up the jumbo frets. Ive mentioned it, for our older music these small ones are perfect. You are 100% right with what youve said in the beginning, with intonation etc. That is really a problem of the jumbos. But i want to see someone playing Megadeth Hangar 18 Solo on the small ones:-) The more it gets into shredding, super fast playing you "need" the higher ones because it requires less force. ANd here also the hand position changes for many player. We have the thumb over the neck but the moderner it gets, or also more classic like, they have the thumb on the middle of the neck. And if you play like that, the jumbos make it easier to play 180 bmp shredding solos. For everything Hendrix, Rock, Blues etc, yes the samller ones. But again, i dont like playing Metal on the vintage fret strat. Same as i dont like playing Hendrix on a modern Schecter with 24 Ferts and Jumbos. For each piece of music his instrument ^^ If one only plays vintage stuff jumbos make 0 sense, no. But i would say its also opposite. If someone wants to be a shredder and play Megadeth or Death, probably shouldnt get the small frets.
Exactly, since I'm focused so much on Hendrix's sound, I wanted to know what he was feeling and when I heard the extra Hendrix sound coming from those small frets, I was blown away. It definitely depends on your style but I would much rather have accurate intonation than anything. When you're a shredding, the intonation can be a little off and no one would notice on single notes. It's those chords that I love so much that are in tune now.
If nobody wouldn't mind a technical get crucial question : how should you adjust the nut height, bridge height, saddles height, pickups height, front body side (or scratchpad height), neck depth in the neck pocket of yours getting a neck with smaller/lower vintage size frets in relation to the new frets for maximum playability? Thank you folks :-)
The neck you have there is not 7.25". There is a huge difference in radius vs. fret size vs. playability. Pretty sure if it was 7.25" you would feel differently about small frets.
But it is a 7-1/4" radius, actually compound so it tapers to a 9-1/2" around the 12th fret. Still plays great, but yeah, bigger frets are definitely easier to bend. I think one of the issues with Fender guitars is the thick poly finish on the fingerboard which takes away a lot of height of those small frets and they feel even smaller. With no finish an no fret leveling, they are fine. Musikraft installs virgin frets and gets them level without having to take away any material. A great fret job.
The wear aspect of nickel is the elephant in this discourse; you went with stainless steel, which would be the gamechanger that makes the vintage spec viable.And that also explains the death of the type,- all I remember from my earliest days shopping for used guitars is how many I might have bought if the frets had any life left in them.People commonly sold guitars with worn out frets, and new players frequently managed to trash the frets before giving up.At their worst, nickel Wide/Tall still look better than vintage with decent wear. Besides, most guitarists that stick with playing are neurotic ,retentive personalities; the cool guys play bass or drums.A guitarist will stress or obsess over total nonsense, -and there's a thousand channels on line to proove it. It is definitely productive sometimes to reflect on why original designs or ideas were abandoned, because those old rationales might not any longer apply.
Yes, and the other factor that makes the vintage size fret viable today besides SS is the elimination of the heavy poly or Nitro finish Fender used to apply to the maple necks which covered probably at least 1/4 of the fret. I remember seeing those old frets that were worn down to the fret board and we were always fighting those little buggers. I'll have to admit since making this video, that I did spec a neck with medium frets and I do like the easier bending but still, the low frets keep you from pushing the notes out of tune if you are a heavy handed player. I assume the rosewood necks would have a slightly higher feel. The other great thing about Musikraft is they have an installation method that does not require the frets to be leveled so you don't lose any fret material. It's a great method for these little frets. I haven't had any issues with any of these Musikraft necks.
I think on bass I would also prefer the bigger frets. It's hard enough to play so the the small frets would make it harder I think. I like a variety. I have three with vintage Fender frets and one with mediums that is fun to play, and two with narrow and talls. The talls are harder to keep in tune because I chord with a heavy hand.
You're assumption of SRV was correct! I read a thing about Ceasars Diaz his tsch. He would put on Jumbo frets and then through tour he would shape and dress them. He would go through frets like butter not surprisingly. Apparently through Ceasars I think - Stevie preferred fret was "medium jumbo" whether it means those vintage ones or not.
Anything jumbo is way bigger than these small vintage frets. They are small. I'm getting ready to order the same neck except this time with a rosewood fingerboard. I don't know if it is the roasted maple, frets, or maple cap, or all together but this neck sounds better than my other necks and I have some vintage ones. I'm going to put the rosewood on my 1964. Too bad Stevie couldn't get stainless frets. That would have solved his problem but I bet he could have still worn them out, just not as quickly. The way Jimi played at times with his quick single string finger slide solos, you need the small frets so it doesn't feel like you're running down a railroad track.
Jumbo frets require a lighter touch. The lighter the touch, the less effort, which in turn allows for more precision and speed. Shredders use jumbo for a reason
Millstap! Sending love from Metairie. Played a strat with vintage sized frets (and a 7.25” radius)for the first time a couple weeks ago and couldn’t walk out of the store without it. There’s something there. Now all I need is a bassman…
I have an american original strat with the vintage tall frets, I don't like them at all- but that's because the gloss fretboard it's just the most sticky and unplayable thing that has happened in my collection. I will sand down the gloss to see if those tiny frets has any charm for my style.
Yes, I've come to realize the reason a lot of people never liked the small frets on a Fender was because of the thick finish would cover up some of the fret and make them feel even smaller than they are. I'm not sure there is a clean way to remove the finish on a Fender neck. If there is any other features you wish you had on that neck like a larger headstock, I would just buy another neck and install it. I know they are fairly expensive but that way you don't risk damaging the original neck and you can always put it back on if you ever want to sell it. The bare necks from Musikraft give you all of the fret and they don't need to take any material off to level them so they are virgin frets when you get them.
@millstap I've gotten into building pedals lately and would love to hear Roger's opinion on whether hfe values for fuzz transistors matter that much or is biasing them correctly the actual key to a good sounding fuzz pedal. Also this is a long shot but if Roger was ever involved with the actual set-up of Jimi's strats, did Jimi prefer floating or decked bridges and if floating how much gap between the bridge and body did they allow. Fender says 1/8" but I saw some pics of Jimi with way smaller gap between the body and the bridge. Thanks for doing this Stan and thanks to Roger as well, he's a living legend.
I'm a pedal builder and an electrical engineer.... I've been designing my own circuits for quite a while now and have even been blessed with the opportunity to make pedals for some very famous musicians..... if you are asking about fuzz face style circuit biasing, you want the first stage to have somewhere around -.6V and an HFE about half that of the second stage transistors HFE. You want the 2nd stage to bias at around -4.5v for that vintage FF sound. A lot of guys love to do the whole "dying battery" thing bc they say the fuzz sounds such better when it's not getting that full 9.2v from a fresh battery. JHS is even selling that dead battery simulator pedal for like $80 (it's just a potentiometer in a box, please don't waste the money) If you happen to like the dead battery fuzz face sound you can always add a pot to the -9v input to pin1 of a pot, then from pin 2&3 to ground. The FF really was an amazing circuit that is still made by just about everyone out there still today.
My hands have lost strength with age so you have to take that into consideration. I did just build a new Strat and decided to try medium frets and they didn’t help much but I did easily push notes out of tune. I had to adjust my touch to keep from pushing the notes sharp. They definitely take stronger hands like Jimi had. He obviously had no problems with them.
My questions too. They are going to check to see if Roger will do even a third interview so we can get more questions in. Apparently, he still does stuff in the UK publicly but we never hear about it in the states. He is 76 years old now I think.
I definitely have a hard attack and grip but don’t rule them out if you haven’t tried them in a while. It’s the improvement in intonation and the extra room between the high frets that give them their advantage. Here they are in action on my 1964 Strat that I replaced the vintage neck with the Musikraft neck with vintage frets. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-MVM72L-xJ-c.html
I completely agree with you, sir! Its also a very astute and true observation that you need to go SS. The "zing and ping" effect is almost non-existent on smaller wire and people who say they can't understand why they aren't bonding with bigger frets: its simple! You are playing the crowns not the "guitar". And once they are gone.. so is all the feel and tone. Edit: Which you also covered!! Sorry jumped the gun heh.
It certainly wasn’t Stevie Ray who started jumbo frets in the 80’s. Larger frets were around long before that. Roy Buchanan’s album covers from the early 70’s showed jumbo frets on his Tele. I used to build guitars in the early 70’s and jumbo fret wire was a conscious decision for me, and a personal choice for many players I knew. I built guitars with jumbo frets, and refretted guitars with jumbo frets way back when. And none of these examples were ‘the first’, either. We’ll probably never know who was.
So you are saying that Fender Musical Instruments, from the early 1950's to 1983 with a few exceptions, got it wrong by using only small frets? That's all Eric Clapton and Jimi Hendrix ever played and their frets were even worse because they were buried in lacquer. Getting rid of the lacquer helps a lot.
@@millstap It’s not that they got it wrong, they made improvements over the years. Low frets are ok for people who play jazz, only play chords or have a light touch. But you definitely shouldn’t be coming into contact with the neck with your finger tip. The fret is what makes the note, all the wood is doing is holding it.
Medium jumbo are normal for me. I’ve no problem with jumbos either in fact I love the bends they allow. Vintage frets are not my personal favorite but I have guitars with both. The vintage tall is a bit better, but the difference is slight. I think the issue people have with vintage frets is they’re usually on 7.25 radius fingerboards where setup is more crucial to get the best out of it.
Yes, I just built another Partscaster and decided to try medium, .047" x .095", and they are nice but really didn't give my hand any relief on bends. I do like the vintage ones for when you are sliding up and down the neck violently (think Hendrix at Monterrey, Rock Me Baby). You should watch that again. Some of the most powerful guitar sounds I have ever heard. But, I did have problems bending notes out of tune with the medium frets and it took a little time to adjust my touch. That is another reason I like the vintage ones because you don't have to think about that much. My Narrow and Talls, .055" x .090", are way too easy to bend notes out of tune. I still have them on my vintage Strat. Instead of getting them refretted, I replaced the neck on one and will probably do the same for the other. The new necks from Musikraft are as good or better than the vintage ones.
Just for the record I prefer 7.25 radius and playing with 9’s or 10’s whenever I’m playing with a vintage guitar I personally have 4 variations of vintage a 56,57,61 all reissues and an Eric Johnson Stratocaster which is vintage with medium jumbo Frets and a 12” radius a Jeff Beck Stratocaster and an American Ultra Stratocaster compound radius 10” to 14” on that one 9.5 on the Beck Stratocaster each one is completely different than each other and I generally prefer 9’s and I don’t ever choke out on any of the vintage ones you just compensate your playing styles if you’re a 7.25 guy I prefer a 12” or whatever radius you have pick one and then you develop your own style that’s what all of the professional guitar players do they might pick up a Les paul or tele for a song here and there anytime I see a great guitar player live they’re usually their number one guitar and a couple exactly like the number one fret size and radius is just what you’re use to I play my 57 Stratocaster 98% of the time and all those other guitars are mostly just wall hangers! That’s my opinion I think that’s why all the greatest players are known for a particular kind of guitar! Jeff Beck was known for playing Stratocasters but he also had a HOF career playing a Les Paul and half way through the blow by blow album grabbed a Stratocaster threw away his pick starting playing with his fingers and the rest is history!
Great insights as always, millstap. I have a question for Roger but it is not really related to Jimi, but to the other one: Was he the inventor of the first distortion/fuzz pedal Jimmy Page used?
It probably does but I don't notice it. I still love the small frets and am glad I have a few guitars with them now. I think it is nice to have a variety. Stainless steel is a must for the small frets though unless you want to refret every six months at minimum.
@@millstap The only one I have with stainless steel frets is a 2000's Carvin. After 50 years playing nickel, it's going to take some getting used to, as they feel really different under the fingers. I'll have to check my late 90's strats to see if they have vintage frets. I was weaned on Gibson frets, low and wide "school bus" profile. I was always told as a kid that it's easier to play a Gibson after starting out on Fender, vs. the opposite.
can you refret a squier classic vibe that come with narrow tall frets with those small vintage frets ? i fear that the stock slots are too wide to accommodate the vintage frets
I understand. They are a little more difficult to bend but it is so nice to be able to slide up and down the neck without feeling the frets or the fret ends.
Gibson introduced jumbo frets in 59 on the Les Paul, and in the early 70's even had short jumbos known as the "fretless wonder". it wasn't till 1983 that medium jumbo frets became standard on Fender guitars.
lol, I bought one of those Fretless Wonders back in mid ‘70’s. That was before I knew that you needed frets to bend strings. That ended up being a real lemon of a guitar. I ended up trading it and $100 to to a friend for his 1963 Telecaster which I still have but don’t play because I’m purely a Strat guy now.
I think the trick with those small frets is to install new SS frets without any leveling whatsoever. That is how Musikraft does it. They have a perfect virgin crown. I’ve seen photos recently of vintage Strats and their frets are pretty flat on top. I couldn’t stand that either. You would be surprised how they feel when they have all of their original dimensions intact. And nickel wears out so quickly that SS is the only way to go if you install small vintage frets.
I have Vintage Tall frets on my Original 60's Strat and Tele. I had a 52 Reissue Tele with lower frets. To be honest I'm not a great player and to me it was harder for me to play. Am I correct in assuming you prefer the frets on the 52 Reissue Tele not the Vintage Tall frets on my Original 60's ?
I'm starting to think in your case, if the fingerboard is finished in the typical fairly thick Fender glossy finish, then that covers some of the fret and makes them feel even smaller. With the Musikraft unfinished (oil or very light lacquer) fingerboards, you get all of the fret to work with and I'll agree, even then they are harder to play but the chords are better in tune because you can't push the notes out of tune with finger pressure and sliding up and down the neck quickly is a dream. There are some trade-offs. Now, with my arthritic hands, I am playing my medium frets a little more even though the intonation is a little off with finger pressure. It seems like the vintage frets, for me, are easier to play on a maple neck than a rosewood neck. It's nice to have a variety.
No way in fact if I could I would put Dunlop 6000 but no luthiers carry them so I will teach myself how to refret. If I could I would be bass frets just plays better. Leo wasn’t being a genius electric guitar didn’t exist so his baseline was an acoustic guitar.
The point I was trying to make was that I stranded on an island guitar is my American Vintage II 57 Stratocaster with vintage frets and I actually had a 1957 Stratocaster that I sold because I needed the money at the time but it was very close to the American Vintage II Stratocasters especially the 57 but I loved the small vintage frets and there’s a way to get around choking out you have to play that guitar enough to know how navigate sometimes instead of trying to push up the string if you’re trying bend up the g string try pulling it down instead of pushing it up but again that’s from knowing the guitars limitations and adjusting your style a bit you most definitely can choke on the neck with smaller frets unless you make adjustments either the string you’re playing with or the height of your strings or the gauge of your strings is easier to choke if you’re playing on 10’s 11’s and low action but if you raise the action a little bit you may not have any problem’s Matthew Scott of RU-vid fame likes his action high because he doesn’t have to adjust his playing style I suspect he’s using heavier gauge strings I know he’s a huge Stevie Ray and Hendrix guy!
I haven't had the choking problem in many, many years. Looking back, I think some of the issues were just bad fret jobs. These frets are put into the neck so precisely, there are no problems on big bends. I am still glad I got the compound radius as insurance. I can hardly feel, if at all, the transition from the 7-1/4 to 9-1/2 radius. I keep my action fairly high at 5/64" at the 17th fret but I don't see how anyone bends strings with a low action. Right now, I've been playing the Partscaster I just built and it has medium frets on it with the same compound radius. I'll admit it is a little easier to bend on but I still like the feel of the smaller frets even though they tax my hands a little more.
Hey Stan, do you remember your process applying the decal on your musikraft headstock, I'm about to do a decal on a very similar Musikraft, any tips? Thanks a bunch
I used this video, ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-xDQIEwyt-M8.htmlsi=L09D7u9gypOKq4AF. Where did you get your decal? I'm about to do another one myself. I did put about 5 coats of lacquer on top to seal the edges. I didn't want to spray the whole headstock so I taped off around the edge of the decal which was a pain but it worked. Also, first I sprayed a few coats on the headstock where the decal was going to go because it had nothing but an oil finish and they said the stickers stick better to lacquer. I wasn't sure what would happen if I did it on top of an oil finish. It would have probably worked seeing that I put the lacquer on afterwards.
Yes indeed I've had those frets on all my Strats all along...and yes my guitar tech has always said "you sure you don't want to go to a larger fret...almost all the guy's are doin it" ...and I always say nope...lets stay with the original ones. IN FACT....I've been considering going to the smaller frets that Gibson Les Pauls had on their FRETLESS wonder's for my Les Pauls ...Yes I (like our host) grab and fret the neck with gusto and I dislike BIG frets...as I will fret so hard that it will bend the note out of pitch.... I now need to convince my guitar tech to install stainless steel...so i'm not spending a fortune needing "refrets" all the time...but even if i do it is a small price to pay for the ease and comfort of the original sized frets......I'll ALWAYS USE THEM
Tim, my first real guitar was a Black Beauty Fretless Wonder. I could not play that thing when it came to bending. They basically had shaved the frets down to where there was barely anything left. I think the vintage Fender frets are the best. Are you playing with someone now since you have a guitar tech? Is he a well known tech? I couldn't believe how much those small frets improved the intonation. I guess the crown is so small and exactly centered in the slot, the intonation is way more accurate. Those larger frets always have somewhat of a flat area even when new and, if nickel, flatten out pretty quickly. I've been wanting to try the old frets for years and am so happy I finally did it. The stainless steel frets will save your guitar. I wonder how many refrets a neck can actually take before the slots wear out. I'm starting to think that some of the nice tone from this new neck is the fact that it is the first fret job and the fret tines are really biting into the wood and there is no glue involved. I think that glue might have a detrimental effect on the fret attack. I've heard some luthiers say hide glue sounds better and everyone is using Super Glue nowadays. I was going to put the vintage frets back on my vintage Strats but now, I think I might just get two more necks for them and go with the large CBS reverse headstock. It makes the bass notes sound so good. It will look strange on a 1964 and 1966 Strat, but who cares if it sounds great. That roasted maple may also be contributing to the nice bass response I am getting now.
Are you talking about what on Fender necks are called “ narrow tall”? I put a Fender’51 U shape neck on my Tele. It’s got the narrow tall frets, and I like them a lot. Only thing I can compare to are the jumbos on my 95 American standard Strat. I might get a musikraft neck with the vintage frets someday, but I’m digging the Tele in the meantime. Thanks
No, the narrow talls are the same as 6105's and are on all of my guitars. They are too tall and too wide, .090" x .055". The vintage frets are 6230's, .078" x .043". The vintage frets will put your guitar back into perfect intonation and now that they are stainless (7230), they will last. I will change all of my guitars back to vintage frets but slowly. I need to get at least one done because I guarantee I will wear out the SS frets too. I'm thinking of just getting another Musikraft neck for one of my vintage Strats and retiring the vintage neck. The next person can live with the 6105's or refret it to whatever they prefer. That maple cap neck sounds amazing. I can't believe how much cooler and clearer the bass strings sound without going out of tune when you hit them hard. www.fender.com/articles/gear/different-fret-sizes-explained
Given the choice now, would you go back to a full 7 1/4" radius... or stick with the compound radius you selected in terms of ease of bending? FYI, I will definitely be going with the vintage SS frets as you have suggested!
I almost went full 7-1/4" on the #5 neck that is ready but hasn't shipped yet. I've had no problems with the compound as far as fretting out goes so I didn't want to chance it. I stuck with the 7-1/4 to 9-1/2. There is hardly a difference though. I'm real excited to see how I like the new 10/56 V neck profile. I went with medium frets this time just to compare. SS is the only way to go with the small frets. I know for a fact I would have had to get them refretted in less than six months. I got SS mediums too. Musikrafts mediums are not as high as 6105's even though some say they are .090" x .055" high the same as mediums but the Musikraft 6105 and 7105 (SS) are .095" x .047". Wider and lower. They should be nice.
bigger frets also will kinda make your scale length feel smaller it brings them in closer to play but yeah i would want one guitar with the big fret and strings thtey also would have to be super high action to match srv
The small frets sound so much better as far as chord intonation goes. I'm getting ready to order my third neck with vintage size SS frets on it. I will convert all of my Strats to them. I have one more vintage Strat to convert. The new Musikraft necks are actually better than the vintage necks I have so it is better to get a new neck than to have the old one refretted.
I'm doing it again and I stuck with the semi-rolled. I didn't think it was worth another $40 for heavy. I'm fine with the semi. I'm getting the same neck except with a rosewood fretboard, dark Indian rosewood, for my 1964 Strat. I also went straight 7-1/4" radius instead of the compound just to keep it more vintage correct although I am getting the reverse large CBS headstock. The new neck will be $585 because of the uncharge for the darker rosewood.
I use the Hendrix 10-38 gauge, Nickel plated of Pure nickel round core Curt Mangan strings. My action is always exactly 5/64" above the 17th fret. I found that is the sweet spot for me. It's interesting how much saddle height affects string tension when bending strings too.
@@MrPDTaylor Medium. It depends on your neck radius. Fender recommends 5/64" on a 7-1/4" radius and 4/64" on 10" and above radius. They really are the best when it comes to recommendations. They know their Strats.
I have slightly larger than standard size frets I like to compound my radius via the fret so it needs a tiny bit more meat but aside from that they are smallish
Yes, I went compound too, 7-1/4-9-1/2". I'm getting ready to order another one of these necks except in rosewood for my 1964 Strat. They sound so good that I think it will improve the sound of vintage guitar. I would rather do that than refret my 1964 neck now. I think the slots get worn out and the frets don't bite very well after a while. I think that affects the sustain some. I may eventually refret the 1964 neck with SS frets, but for now, it's just $250 more to get a new neck plus it will be the large CBS reverse headstock which I love. I will have to buy another set of left handed Kluson tuners though. Maybe I try to find some of the late 60's F logo tuners. Probably hard to find in left handed.
Hi Stan! Interesting video as usual. I do have a strat with vintage specs and I really like it but I find vibratos on top of bends are a bit tricky to get right. It's a laqcuered maple neck and I find I work too hard during the bend so maybe I have to work on my touch sensitivity a little bit. My fingers tend to dig into the fretboard. What do you think, I'd really appreciate any form of advice! Take care Btw I'd never have thought you'd go with stainless frets haha
Dear Sir, first you should measure your frets with a good pair of digital calipers, particularly their height. There is no extra meat at all on those small frets for leveling or the slightest wear. That is exactly why I went with stainless. I would never have done them in nickel. Even then, I look at mine everyday to see if I can see any wear. I play hard. I found these even smaller "vintage" frets on Fender's website, www.fender.com/en-US/parts/fret-wire/vintage-style-guitar-frets-24/0992014000.html, which could be what they installed on your guitar. If yours are only .39" high, I would consider a refret in these 7230 frets. Since mine are new and did not need any leveling, they are high enough to where bending is easy but I too have to work at it a little bit in certain areas. I was very sure I did not want a heavy poly finish on the fingerboard and I like the bare wood feel of the roasted maple fingerboard. It is not as sticky as poly can be. But, to keep from refinishing your fingerboard, check the fret dimensions and then consider the 7230's if you find yours lower than .43." Also check your neck relief. If you like a flat neck, then that makes it way more difficult to grab the string on bends. I would consider going with the Fender specs of .012" relief on 7-1/4" radius and .010" on 9-1/2" radius. I keep all of mine at .012" but this neck in particular was at .011" without ever having to touch the truss rod so I just left it alone. It is very stable. I hope the helps.
@@N0thingIsTrue I just checked my fret heights to see and they were pretty inconsistent, from .37" to .44." That might be an indication of how hard they pressed each fret it. I'm not sure. It might be my skill with the caliper. It wasn't as easy as I remember. You have to have the caliper perfectly perpendicular to the fret board to get an accurate measurement. I used the center caliper stem which is for depth. It might be more accurate to measure the fret board next to the fret and then the top of the fret and subtract the two but that would be easiest with the strings off and I'm getting ready to play. So if yours are in that range, try the increased relief if it is flat and I use 5/64" string height at the 17th fret. That seems to be my sweet spot. The biggest advantage of those small frets is the improved intonation. I always wondered how Jimi kept his C and F chords at the nut in tune because mine never sounded right until I got this neck.
@millstap I just checked mine too and they seem to be all around the 1mm mark which equates to just over .039 in freedom units. You think I should maybe go for a refret? I would probably go for something like the jescar fw55090 nickel silver. Going for nickel vintage size wire wouldn't really be feasible since I'd probably wear them out really quick again. I love this guitar's tone and don't really want to risk it with stainless frets.
@@N0thingIsTrue Those should be good. If you love the guitar's tone, I would leave it alone unless they are flattened out. I have the 55090's on all of my other Strats and they are just too high, IMO, and can easily be pushed out of tune. But, I've had them on for years and like the way they bend but my Hendrix experiment of vintage frets proved to me that some of Jimi's tone is in the vintage frets. The SS doesn't bother me as tone goes at all. I like them. They have a nice attack and sustain. My other guitars are in EVO Gold wire. I only have one in nickel now. I just bought another neck for my 1964 Strat and will put it on so it has the vintage frets too. That new neck is sounding better than my vintage necks. It could be the roasted maple is helping too. We will finalize the experiment with the next neck on a vintage Strat with rosewood veneer instead of maple. What was your neck relief? That makes a big difference in the ease of bending.
I’m currently on the fence with fret size, but I’m definitely warming up to smaller frets (again). I recently picked up a late 80’s E-series fender Japan Strat with the original small frets, and I kinda like them. For me, I like the feeling of sliding up the neck and not crashing into high frets. In fact, after getting used to these old, somewhat worn in frets, I actually find myself occasionally thinking these old frets are too high! Never would have guessed that. I’m also playing lighter. I think that’s really important for playing small frets. Just lightening up my touch has, by itself, improved my crappy playing.
It was a real revelation for me. Like you said, sliding up and down quickly without running over a bunch of railroad ties is almost enough in itself to the get them. The SS is what did it for me. I would have already worn these small frets down if they were nickel. I can't recommend getting SS enough. I play hard hours per day and I am really hard on frets. But, my touch has not lightened up much. If you're a Hendrix fan, it's almost mandatory. I love them. The improved intonation on chords was what I loved more than anything. Now I know how Hendrix stayed in such great tune. I was "bigger is better" for probably 30 years thanks to the jumbo craze. I'll never go back.
How do the 6230s compare the "Narrow Tall" on modern Squires? I've got a bunch of jumbo and medium jumbo guitars, and I'm curious about the small vintage. I picked up a cheap squire just because I liked the neck better than the Strats with jumbos.
The 6230's are quite a bit smaller than the Narrow Tall. I think the narrow tall is 090" x .055" while the 6230's are .078" x .043". I just got a new Musikraft neck for my Partscaster and wanted to try their medium 6105 (7105 in SS which I got) and Muskrat's dimensions are smaller than the usual 6105's so they do vary a little. I would not have gotten the 6105's if they were the same as Narrow Tall because they are too tall. But Musikraft's 6105's are .095' x .047" which is much better for me. They are nice too. Some places show that 6105's have the same .090" x .055" as Narrow Talls.
Being learning Wind Cries Mary on a Telecaster thinline with Jumbo / 6100 frets that sounds fine . Do you know the specs of the 60's Fender frets ? Thanks , interesting information .
Vintage Fender frets are .039" tall and .084 wide. If it sounds good with 6100's, then leave it. It was more of a "What did Hendrix play" experiment but I ended up liking them because they are faster and sliding up and down the neck is fast and smooth.
They are cool for sure. But, after helping another player that was having problems bending on his guitar, I realized the Fender factory setup specs are even more critical on these vintage Strat specs.
I once had a short chat with RM, about 15yrs back I had 1 of his Voodoo Vibes (recently bought) & was experiencing an issue which was I was picking up Radio (fishing sea weather forecast) through my amp when using the Voodoo Vibe.. So my call goes..(ME) Hi could I speak with someone for advice on my Voodoo vibe I'm having a technical issue? (RM) Yes this is Roger what's the fault your experiencing? (ME) whenever the Voodoo vibe is in the signal chain, it doesn't need to be switched on, it's causing my rig to pick up a particular Radio station sea weather forecast.. (RM) OK so you're using "Planet Waves" guitar cables? (ME) eh? Erm yeah er yes I am! (RM) don't use them! (ME) (BTW my minds just blown or farted) I'm wondering wtf, then he (RM) said Don't use them, stop using them & that'll solve the problem.. I thanked him & the call ended.. I'd just spent £70 on 2 new leads around the same time I bought the Voodoo vibe, & sure enough he was 100% spot on, I stopped using the PW's & everything was fine.. I know he was jimmis Guru & obviously a wizard with FX & for a moment I thought I was under surveillance lol but he musta known about this PW cable issue effecting the VV before I called him.. was Brill knowing I'd spoken to the man who helped Hendrix sculpture his tone/sound, even if the conversation lasted seconds rather than minutes..
That is a cool story. Roger is a smart guy for sure. It’s funny that it’s almost a one man show. I know he also hand delivers all of his effects to Guitar Village. I’ve got a slight connection where I may get a chance to speak to Billy Cox in the near future but we’ll just have to wait and see. He lives in Nashville and became friends with Jimi way back in 1961 when Jimi was only 19. They met in the Army. I’m sure he’s got a ton of information about Jimi. Billy’s 82 now but still active musically.
For Rodger Mayer: Question#1 Dear Sir: I would like to know a little about the discussions you must have had with Jimmi as to the difference in sound and performance when Dallas Arbiter went from using the germanium ie NKT275 to the silicon ie BC108 transistors in their Fuzz Faces...Jimmi undoubtedly heard/noticed the difference and I've often wondered if he asked you for a solution or just accepted the change and you heard no more of it. Was this an issue? Question#2 Rodger I know you were working with several other guitarists at the time..Jimmy Page, Jeff Beck and others...How were your experiences different from one guitarist to the next? Can you share on the differences between the guitarists you have worked with? Question#3 I've always been curious as to how Jimmi got around the issue that happens when you go from Wah into Fuzz Face...Did you put a small buffer into the Wahs (like they do nowadays) to solve the impedance/high pitch squealing problem? Some people say he went from fuzz face into Wah...but this produces a different sound to the Wah and not what I hear when one goes WAH into Fuzz? PS Thank you for all of your creations and innovations throughout the years....as I have purchased quite a few
Tim, thanks for the questions. Everyone has been curious about the wah/fuzz reaction for years. I always run my fuzz first for that very reason. It still sounds good so I am wondering why Jimi would ever want to go the other way. I had read that he told someone, maybe Roger, that he wanted to "wah the fuzz" instead of the other way around. Jimi must have had his reasons. That would be another question. I'm really surprised Roger has not written a book about his whole experience in the 60's. It would be fun to co-write one with him. Thomas is going to ask Roger for a third interview since there are so many questions. Hopefully Roger agrees.
I always assumed it was the 80's shredders who made the jumbo frets popular? The fast runs they would do made it easier I thought? All my 4 guitars have jumbo frets but that become I've always been following George Lynch and the 2 custom shop modesl of his guitar I have has those frets. So my 2 other guitars have jumbos as well. It's what I've always had. Now you got me wondering what the vintage ones feel like? God knows I can't play like George Lynch.
I think everyone should give them a try again. Once you play them and hear the great intonation plus the feel, you probably won't go back. It does depend on your style but I would take having chords in tune any day over whatever advantage the jumbos are supposed to have.
Very nice insight there my friend. My current favourite fret size is 47 tall and 104 wide. A very nice compromise, not too far from vintage and great for both lead and rhythm. That what I have (stainless steel) in my Musikraft roasted maple neck. By the way, I never knew that it was hard to get hold of Roger Mayer. I remember having a problem with my Roger Mayer Red Lion wah and I gave him a ring. Roger himself answered the phone and we had a nice chat about it. Very cool piece of gear (if you can find one).
Apparently he lives close to the Guitar Village and he hand delivers his effects. He is 76 years old now I think. If, I were you, I would still get a guitar with the smaller frets, .078 x .043" because the width makes a difference.
We've lived with 80s-90s shred-metal neck profiles and frets for too long. They're unplayable. When Fender brought out the 'deep C' necks with vintage frets, some semblance of normalcy returned.
I think SRV may have caused the phenomenon when forums said he was using bass frets. I am playing my new Partscaster a lot because it sounds so good and I decided to try medium frets because they had slightly smaller dimensions than my Narrow and Tall frets. .047” X .095 vs .055” X .090” respectively. I still have trouble getting perfect intonation by pushing a little too hard which is just habit for me. The vintage frets stay in tune. The good thing is I can swap necks now if I want because I have two almost identical necks (except the neck profile) and I can put the vintage frets on my Partscaster. That is the beauty of Fender guitars.
Anyone with a modicum of technical prowess can play a flat neck with chords. If you played a classical guitar you'd weep. Flat necks are the best for doing full bar chords with as little pressure as possible on your thumb
I recently got a 2012 57 avri and was really worried about the vintage small frets but wanted to try. 2 months later n damn I wish my other strats had em aswell
Join the vintage fret club. Aren’t they great? I don’t know why we got away from them. I just bought another Musikraft neck with vintage frets to put on my vintage 1964 Strat. I also got the large CBS reverse headstock. Should sound great.
By the way, I put my second neck on my 1964 Strat yesterday and it improved the sound of a vintage Strat. I couldn't be happier. I will never use big frets again.
On many modern guitars they put on the big frets 0.55 high x0.11 wide. I don’t like them for couple of reasons: 1. More metal, more metallic sound 2. Too wide, not handy in the higher regions for 25.5 guitars and shorter. Also more intonation problems when frets wear out. 3. Too high for smooth pulloffs and chords sound out of tune because pressing too hard. 4. If the frets are higher the neck will automatically feel thicker. On a six strinf doesn’t have to be an issue but on a 7-string every tiny inch matters. High frets do have a function in the highest frets for bending. But you can put on smaller/lower frets and scallop the fretboard in the high region. Who started the whole jumbo fret madness I seriously dont know. I think people just assume they prefer big but if they would be more critical and observative the majority of players would choose medium or even smaller size frets. The next time I do a refretting I choose medium. Smaller and less high than the jumbo’s I have now. However, I did a fret leveling and lowered my current jumbo frets. The guitar plays more comfortable now and everything sounds better.
I'm so glad I went back to the original frets. I had wondered about them for years and finally made the jump back. When listening to Hendrix, I could hear the perfect intonation of his open C and F chords and wonder why I could not get that perfect intonation on my guitars. The frets made all the difference. Their crown has to be very tight so that the string stays in the dead center of the fret. Right off the bat, the bigger fret, once it starts to flatten out a little, will push the string contact point closer to the bridge (away from the nut) and cause those fretted notes to be a little sharper than the open strings. All of that went away with the small frets. Stainless steel was the key for me because I would have flattened out the small nickel frets within a month or two and already would be hearing the intonation discrepancies. Light touch is a good thing although I am not the best at doing it. I play hard, but I did notice that trills and pull-offs were faster and easier and I also love that I can slide my finger up and down the neck without feeling like I'm running over railroad ties.
@@millstap yes, railroad ties, yes. Even on classical guitars they don’t have jumbo frets and classical guitar players have a light touch. So I think it is just a marketing thing that what manufacturers think guitarists want on their guitars. They will keep providing as long as it brings in the cash. Same as black toothpaste I guess. Before it was just a small number and now everybody is making black toothpaste. Not that black toothpaste is better but because people have the fantast it is better. Many times people are not aware of what is going on.
I would say it is even more critical in a Tele. Those frets are perfect for that spanky sound of the Tele. Jumbo frets just seem wrong on a Tele. I have a Tele and I will definitely put them on when I get a chance.
@@millstap Thanks for taking the time to respond. Just discovered your channel, you really know your stuff! I have a classical and flamenco, German and Spanish made, with thin, round-topped frets. Great action. Makes sense to have that on the Tele. Now that you called attention to it, looks weird to see these bulky, flattened out frets…
Millstap! I love your channel and I don't even play anything. I have a 20 year old stepson who plays guitar. On Jimi's 80th birthday, can you tell me what to tell him why Jimi is the greatest and most important guitar player of all time? Thank you!
Hey Kurt. It was really his spirit and soul. He was blessed beyond any guitarist that has ever existed, IMO. He didn't just play guitar, he owned the whole concept of the fretboard. He invented so many different ways to play it. He had a sound in his head that he had to get out and he used the electric guitar to do it. Part of his energy was the shear volume he played at. Nobody had done that until him. It is a subjective matter. The younger kids would rather watch the shredders of today which is okay but not anything like what Jimi was doing. He was on a cosmic level. He could play as fast as anyone but he also played slow ballads like no one else. He did it all and sang the whole time he was playing some of the most complicated passages on guitar. Simply amazing!
@@KurtAspaas Kurt and Laura, thank you so much for the very thoughtful gift. I love everything. That was soooo nice of you. Now you've got me curious, how were you able to find me? I can't even find myself, lol. My son is already asking for a shirt and that was very thoughtful that you sent both sizes. Happy New Year and also have a very prosperous 2023 and beyond.
PS , Question for Roger " The Valve " I'd like to know if it's true that he actually bypassed Jimi's tone controls on his guitars , because I read that in a book as a direct quote from Roger 👍 it would really really open a whole can of tone worms lol .
They have so many questions now, they are trying to set up a third interview. I hope he does it. Apparently he hand delivers his effects to the Guitar Village store so he lives in that area. It's a cool store in an old building that was built in 1466 and Clapton shows up occasionally because he lives in that area.
@@millstap I've just checked their site , they sell great vintage guitars for very favourable prices . A 77 Les Paul for £3000 , why would you buy a new one 👌
Watch Parts 1 & 2 of the Roger Mayer interview. He mentions that he did that mod on the guitars he was going to break up or burn so that hitting the control wouldn't do anything while he was throwing the guitar around. He bypassed the switch and the volume control too.
Well, I certainly would stay away from a heavy poly or lacquer finish on the maple fretboard. The roasted maple on my neck is very slick. They just put a hand rubbed oil finish which is really great. There is no friction except maybe a little when your hands start sweating.
I forgot to mention, the original frets had been dressed 4 or 5 times. It was closet candy until I sent it to master luthier Mark Erlewine in Austin TX to re-fret. Pricey but worth it.
What is the issue? I really don't know of any that are reasonable. That is why I learned to do everything because I couldn't find one I could trust. There is Hogy Notzel in Baton Rouge but he will be expensive. It's probably something simple. What are the symptoms?
@@millstap It probably is something simple like a faulty tube… I’m just not too knowledgeable about this things. There’s a rattling/vibration sound coming out of the amp while playing lower pitches. It’s more apparent at higher volumes. I also feel that the amp sounds more compressed than I’d expect as it starts to break up/get higher into the gain stage. Sound like anything in particular? Thanks for your help!
@@mattdonner9415 Matt, sorry I didn't respond earlier. I probably won't be able to help a lot. Since it is a printed circuit board, those are difficult to work on without the proper tools. I'm headed out for the night but I can give you some troubleshooting tips to try later that might fix it. First, you should buy a complete new set of tubes. You will eventually need them and that way you can at least eliminate a bad tube.
John Mayer went with smaller frets and 7.25" radius on his Silver Sky. He might know a thing or two! Stevie used super super jumbo's because he had to. They made his favorite necks last longer. That guy wringed the hell out of a guitar neck every time he picked one up. I agree, if there was stainless frets in the 80's he probably would have used a standard guitar sized fret for the time. Smaller frets are easier to play fast on. Just look at Les Paul and his fretless wonder Customs. The Fender Vintera 50's Strat and Tele necks are a good buy too. 7.25" radius, vintage frets and all maple. $360 on Reverb and they ship immediately.
That sounds like a real deal on the Vintera. I can't wait to get these big frets off of all of my guitars but that will cost a pretty penny since the only one I trust in my area is expensive. I will just play this one until I wear out the SS frets. Hopefully that takes a while. That is good to know that John Mayer picked the same specs. Those small frets are just killer. I'm sure the maple cap is contributing a little. The neck is awesome. I thought I might refret my other guitars the same but then I had this thought, what if my old vintage fingerboard fret slots are just too worn out and they have to glue each fret in? I'm thinking that might take out some of the ring and sustain. I think this being a new neck with the first fret install is giving the best frequency response through the tight fret/wood contact. Now, I'm thinking I will leave the vintage Strat necks alone and just replace them with Musikraft necks. I bet that 1964 would sound amazing with this neck on it. I could also go rosewood. I might be able to get my Tele refretted but it has also been refretted quite a few times. I'm just thinking over time you lose something with a loose fret slot. What are your thoughts?
@@millstap I remember the surgery the Tele had to go through over the truss rod. I wouldn’t tell anyone to go messing with the frets on that neck. Get a new neck or two with different specs(headstock size, slab or veneer etc) and don’t risk damaging your vintage guitars. When it comes to glue vs no glue, I don’t think it gives or takes away from anything tonally. I use thinned wood glue when I do refrets as an insurance thing.
@@matthewf1979 Well, I have read that hide glue does sound better so I would think the glue does make a difference. The Tele has been refretted many times. It has the bigger frets on it now. The thin frets would turn it back into a smoking 1964 Tele. But, the Musikraft necks are so good, I may just put them on all of my guitars eventually. That roasted maple is pretty cool. I didn't think I would like it but the sonic character is like I've never heard on my guitars.
@@millstap I guess I can’t tell you not to refret everything. I immediately install super jumbo’s in every guitar I get. Maybe glue can matter with certain fret size and fingerboard material. I couldn’t tell you if it was the glue or the new frets. I specced out a new neck from Musikraft for one of my Strats. They are a great deal for what you get and they’re extremely high quality. Get a new rosewood fingerboard neck for your vintage Strats. The worst that could come of that is a new partscaster!
@@matthewf1979 I was shocked at the quality. Much better than most Fender necks. Yeah, rosewood would be appropriate for my 1964. The reverse CBS headstock might look strange but I don’t care. They sound and play better.
Questions for Roger: Were there additional buffer stages used in tandem with the Fuzz Face? If so, were they before or after the Fuzz? Did they use any tricks to get the fuzz and wah to work together and reduce squealing? How much of a factor were the long coiled cables in getting the signature warm yet glassy top end that Jimi had?
You're so right Brother. I played a real Vintage 1955 strat a couple weeks ago and absolutely loved it of course. $35,000. Anyways, the vintage frets (they had been replaced but same fret size) and beefy neck profile 0.89 to 1." At 12th fret soft V shape with extremely worn rounded Fretboard edges. I loved that neck. I was surprised I actually liked the small frets better than my guitars with 6105's.
It takes a little while to get used to the smaller frets but they are so great and clean sounding. I have no issues playing all the huge bends on Hendrix songs and a lot of his stuff is actually easier on the small frets. Thank goodness I got stainless steel because they would be worn out already. That's the only drawback but SS is the remedy.
Hi. Since you’re talking about intonation,I am wondering if a 6 string fanned fret bass will keep in tune in every position,contrary to a regular fretboard where notes are not in tune every where. Thank you
Sorry I took so long. I have seen some strange fret configurations over the years to compensate for the inherent flaws of the tempered scale. I would have to do more research on the fanned frets. I would hope that it makes it at least easier to play but you don't see many (I've never seen anyone) play that type of bass.
