Why Mary’s Assumption Is Indefensible 

I converted to the Catholic faith when I was 27 years old (1991). Within 7 seven years, my husband, sister, and best friend joined me. At the age of 52, I was convicted by a Providential discovery of Dr. Greggory Allison’s book, Roman Catholicism: An Evangelical Assessment. I am grateful for the Catholic Church and how it taught me to love Scripture and doctrinal truth. I have an MA in pastoral theology from a Jesuit university. Ironically, my critical thinking skills have led me out of the Catholic Church for two primary reasons: 1. I started to struggle with the RCC’s claims about itself as the one true church (for a number of reasons) and 2. Even though I sincerely love Mary and accept some of the RCC teachings, I just can’t accept that those teachings are elevated to the level of infallible dogma. This places Marian dogma at the same level in the hierarchy of Truth as the resurrection. I simply could not bind my conscience to that. I’ve been writing a bit about my journey in Substack. I’ll post the link, if anybody is interested (it’s free-just a hobby).

Mary's assumption is better seen as what it is called. An assumption.

I am an ex Catholic from from Mumbai, India. After first reading the Bible some 40, 50 years back, as a Catholic I used to struggle with some of the bizarre dogmas and teachings of the RCC and used to think that how can such intelligent and learned prople in the RCC could make such errors leading to weird teachings and idolatrous practices. I finally found a Bible based local church of which there are many in Mumbai and other cities in India. Your videos have been very helpful to see that in reality Protestism is much more apostolic and fundamentslist than what it is made out to be. God bless you and your family.

Thank you pastor As a struggling Catholic Your debate with trent horn is how i discovered your channel As i look more and more into scripture and your works i know where my anxiety and confusion is coming from May God bless your channel abundantly.

Babe look, new Gavin Ortlund video dropped !!🔥🔥🔥

Baptist here to learn a bit more about church history and find out if much of it is even important to know or not.

As a faithful and devout Catholic, thank you Gavin for your thoughtfulness, for your charity and the good spirit you bring to apologetics. This is so needed on both sides. Still disagree, but this is the way to do it!

I think this is one of those rare subjects of RC v protestant disagreement where the argument is decisively won.

Thank you for so clearly and succinctly explaining everything! I am an evangelical protestant, and agree, but I love that I now have the clear words to better explain to others.

I've been looking into Catholicism and find this dogma a real sticking point. Thank you for the work you put into this video. Please know that I appreciate your kindness; you honor Jesus in the way you've handled yourself in every video I've watched thus far.

I love all of Dr. Ortlund’s metaphors and analogies. They’re always so creative. He’ll be going in depth on a theological topic and then just be like “ok so imagine California splits into 3 states”

Presbyterian here, I have to thank you so much for your content, Gavin. I've been ingesting such a huge amount of theology content lately and also trying to see the Catholic side of apologetics (since I have a considerable amount of Catholic family members and friends) Your gentle approach and respect of historicity is refreshing to see rather than the flat out demonization of the other side (which happens from immaturity on both Cath and Prot sides) There's a part of me that reeaallly wishes I could become Catholic to join my family members who are and release that tension, but it's dogmas like this that unfortunately keep me from taking that route. Regardless of the differences though I take comfort that our needs for salvation are met in our mutual love for, faith in, and reliance on, Christ Jesus. God bless you and thank you for your content!

Made it to the end. As a Protestant, I actually have zero qualms with the possibility of Mary being assumed bodily. How could any of us truly know?? The way I see it, it's the Lord's business. My problem is, like you said in your conclusion, that the Catholic Church makes this an essential, mandatory doctrine you must assent to or else be anathematized. That is just a step too far for me---saying you are quite literally ACCURSED if you dont assent to this non-biblical doctrine that has no historical evidence. If the RCC or even individual Christians want to accept it as a pious belief, totally fine. But the overreach of authority is just crazy to me.

Watched to the end!😊

This was 50 minutes longer than my video, and also WAY better. Super informative, especially with all the references to the Holy Fathers. Thank you, Gavin.

Wow I just noticed you’re almost at 35k followers. I’ve been here since before 10k, glad to see the channel grow :)

Excellent video, Gavin! Thank you for your thoughtful, well-researched work on this topic, as well as the many other topics you cover on this channel. Keep up the good work and may God bless you with wisdom and discernment!

Made it to the end (as I've done with all your videos Gavin] which required absolutely no effort on my part. I cannot tell you how much your channel has, and continues to, enrich my Christian journey. Thank you and God bless from the north of England.

as a Protestant I have no issue with Mary being bodily assumed or remained a virgin forever but the fact that it is a dogma and that I have to believe it lest I be thrown into hell fire is a serious roadblock for me. How and why is belief in Mary’s bodily assumption essential to the faith, did Mary die for me or did Christ ?

Praise be to God for how charitable you are in your apologetics Gavin.

Made it to the end Gavin. I appreciate the conciseness by which you present these videos. I found it interesting that you mentioned the Francis Schaeffer quote. From the content I have seen from you this seems to fit your approach very well. Just as we are to present the Gospel as an extension of truth rooted in love rather than an attack, you also always present your content in a way that is truthful and loving. You always give me such a strong impression that the joy of the Lord in within you. I pray He continues to use you, God bless.

As an ex-Catholic, this was by far one of the most damning piece of evidence that led me out of the Church back in the day. I could not understand how can Catholics insist on a dogma this abstract and unimportant and bind all Christains to it under a curse. For me it was a living proof that Catholic Magisterium is not infallible, but rather, it produces doctrine that seems compelling at the time. I still think Catholics can be saved, because the proper gospel teaching is out there among their countless encyclicas on secondary issues - but remaining in a Church this self-centered was simply out of the question for me. I can't be homest with myself and remain Catholic, when the dogma clearly states that I am under the curse myself for not finding the evidence behind Mary's Assumption coherent.

Thanks for this, Gavin. Appreciated not only the conclusions you’ve drawn, but the posture in which you approach the topic.

Made it to the end! Thanks for an insightful look at this issue!

Watched to the end and as always amazing video. God bless.

I’m glad I watched this video. My heart is secure insofar as I decided to not cross the Tiber.

I enjoy your respectful back and forths with Trent.

Keep speaking the truth in love! It shall set anyone free willing to humble and accept what is true

Just want to say thank you for what you are doing. I have always kinda struggled with understand the balance in truth and grace and the nuance of how to talk about your faith and evangelize, and defend it. I was either feeling guilty that wasnt doing enough or that i was being to "mean" but when i did decide to discuss my faith. After I found you it really helped me understand how to rigorously defend in an irenic way. Very cool what tou are doing, and its inspired me to do something similar. God bless. P.S just finished your book "theological retrieval for evangelicals" one of my favorite books I have read. 👍

I get excited for every post!

Watched to the end! Great vid, Gavin :D

Terrific video. Very persuasive and very well articulated argument. Thank you Gavin!

Hi Gavin, You misrepresented (I’m not saying intentionally) the Eastern, Orthodox Church’s view by not mentioning that it’s universally held that the Holy Mother of God died prior to her body’s Assumption into Heaven. This is why the Feast is called the “Dormition” for us. I may have misunderstood or misheard what you said, so correct me if I’m wrong. Still, I think it’s worth mentioning that the absence of relics isn’t something to hand wave away as you do, considering how undeniably keen the early Christians were to preserve the remains of Saints who didn’t even have direct relations with Christ. It’s not only easy to imagine, but, arguably, unthinkable and untenable to imagine otherwise, that such Christians would not guard the remains of the very Mother of God herself to the point of risking their own lives for it. That there is no textual or oral tradition whatsoever of her remains constitutes, for someone who is already a believer in Christ, possibly even sufficient evidence for the claim. That’s especially the case in light of the fact that the Incarnation is precisely about the cleansing of Human nature from corruption. To deny the bodily Assumption of the Mother of God says something about God, that He would not honor His own mother, whose flesh He chose from before the foundation of the world to be the flesh He would assume for the salvation of humanity, with the absolutely minor favor, from the point of view of His omnipotence, of preserving it from corruption. These two things, the absence of relics and the greater coherence with the logic of Christianity, I think, are very compelling when seen in light of each other.

Watched to the end! Your videos are fascinating and I applaud your approach.

Watched til the end 😊. Just wanted to say, I am incredibly grateful for your channel. It's been a blessing as I found myself (a protestant) falling down a church history rabbit trail, and seriously considered pursuing EO. You've revealed much, and I'm thankful.

Made it to the end. Great work dude

Nailed it, Gavin! Great critique.

Watched to the end. Great video as always!😃

Thank you for your videos, Gavin. Truth Unites has been a great resource for me. Genuinely helpful.

thank you for your content, youtube needs more kind protestant apologists like you

Thank you Gavin for the way that you presented the information in regards to this subject. My wife and I have been investigating since the spring of 2023 the early to medieval Catholic beliefs and practices. I have learned and seen that there is a deep richness in the liturgical practices of the early church, as well as great devotional thought found in the church fathers. One area that has bothered me is this topic. Again, thank you for the way you presented the material and thank you for your ministry brother.

You ATEEEE! Great work!

Thank's for all your work and gentle tone in these discussions. A very important channel.

Thank you for all you do! I’m a Protestant that struggles with my Protestantism sometimes because our modern church in the US can sometimes seem too trendy and lacking in reverence. Your exposition on scripture has helped ground me in the Faith in Protestantism in a way that I thought traditional Catholicism or Orthodoxy would. P. S. I made it to the end of the video.

I only discovered you recently by way of Jordan Cooper. Glad i subscribed, because this video was very informative on something I just perceived as typical, Catholic baloney that was added later.

As a Lutheran I’m rather indifferent to the assumption of Mary… I personally feel it is adiaphora … many of the reformers seem to be in favour but at the same time not thinking it should be a doctrine

"may Christ be honored in the way we search for truth on this topic" 💯

RC here. Watched to the end. I personally believe in the Assumption/Dormition, but I admit the doctrinal foundations for it are weak. My belief is that it should be considered a wide-spread, venerable opinion, but surely not one that results in "utterly losing the faith" if a Christian doubts or even denies it. I also agree with you in the final analysis that the Magisterium is the only source of doctrine which really comes to matter in RCism. We are finding that sword to cut both ways, when it is used to find novel reasons to justify dubious moral practices, let's just say.

I watched it until the end. As a portuguese, I deal with extreme Mariolgy daily because of Fátima, and the next accrecion that is surging: the co-redeption of Mary. This has given my good tools to engage with it, speacily regarding the lady in the book of Apocalipse. Thank you so much Gavin. 😁

Been waiting patiently for this. Let me watch now. God bless you and your ministry, sir❤🙏 Pheeeww!!! I just finished the video! This was expository!🙏

This was good! Made it to the end!

Ya know this makes me kinda sad. It’s not the idea of the blessed Mother being assumed that bothers me. It’s the binding infallible declaration behind it that separates me from communing with wonderful Roman Catholic Christians. We will all commune together one day when what fallible men have ruined will be restored by Jesus Christ. Thanks for your work Dr. Ortlund

I made it to the end! Huzzah! That’s easy to do though, as I always find Dr. Ortlund’s videos very interesting. I am a former Roman Catholic of 30 years. I knew that the assumption was a required belief, but didn’t know the history surrounding it. This was true about most of my catechism - knowing the beliefs but not the history of why. When I attended initiation classes for a friend, this issue of the assumption was discussed and the teachers’ arguments were very simple: Mary’s body was nowhere to be found and “early” accounts say she was assumed, thus we believe she was assumed. I was astonished by the lackluster argument and dove into the Marian Dogmas. After months of research into Mary and other topics (mainly the pope), I decided being a Protestant was the best thing for me. I will be confirmed in the LCMS this fall. God bless you, Dr. Ortlund!

Watched to the end. Well done.

Excellent video. I never heard of this concept until today.

Great video Gavin.

(I watched to the end. Heart me!) As a protestant, what gets me about the Assumption is that it is a dogma in the Roman Catholic Church, which means that if you willfully reject it, then God will damn you (see the papal statements starting at 7:11). At most the importance of the Assumption could be an edifying thing ("Hey, did you know that Mary got assumed just like Enoch and Elijah? That must mean that her example of piety and faith is a good one to follow!"). There is nothing central or essential to Christianity in this doctrine. Denying it is not like denying the deity of Christ or His Resurrection so why should denying it carry such severe eternal consequences? Making this doctrine a dogma is an unnecessary and harsh imposition on the consciences of believers.

As a former RCC convert who returned to Protestantism, I concur with your comments on this. I listened to all of it. Cheers!

I made it to the end, watched it while I did some sewing. Thanks for the video~

None of the bishops at the council of Nicaea believed dogmatically what the RCC teaches today.

I watched to the End. Gavin thank you so so much for doing this, and exampling to us how to fight for the unity of the Church while valuing Truth and gentleness. Absolutely love your channel, and it has equipped, encouraged, and corrected me so much. Keep up the good work!!

I'm a methodist and grew up in a Catholic school for 12 years. I had to argue and defend my beliefs, every morning during prayer I'd say the Lord's prayer but I'd keep mum during the hail Mary part. This issue has been on my heart since a young age and I'm grateful for Gavin who is able to articulate our position so well and lovingly.

Made it to the end. I love your work. May God bless you and keep you!

@Truth unites watched till the end and Catholic. Thanks

Hi Gavin, I’m a Catholic covert. I really appreciate your gentleness and kindness when approaching these engagements on Catholic doctrine. I thoroughly enjoyed listening to you and I really admire the research and time that you put into your videos. It means a lot to me that you can be civilized in these debates and challenges without the anti-Catholic rhetoric. May God bless you Gavin

Great video!

I watched to the end. A lover of history and theology: they matter! Looking forward to watching and learning from more of your great content.

Thank you Gavin for all that you do. As a protestant, you have helped me tremendously. I would love to see a video on the perpetual virginity of Mary. Thank you again. Your videos encourage me greatly.

Excellent as usual

Watched to the end, another great video!! Thanks for the education!

Gavin, thanks for your input on this topic. I am a seminary student at Talbot with a love of church history. I recently became interested in Protestant/Catholic dialogues, and you’ve provided insight as well as great reference material. Thank you!

I listened to Trent’s response for this so I’ll listen to yours. It can be frustrating for all of us when our beliefs our challenged but it’s necessary. Iron sharpens iron

Great vid!

Excellent overview! I could have listened to far more.

awesome video gavin

As always… solid stuff, Gavin! Keep up the good work. You’re in our prayers.

I really don’t understand why people believe Mary had no sin and is raised to heaven. Why have Jesus Christ then? Why did he die for our sins? I can’t understand why this dogma even exist, for what purpose?

There’s a great deal of truth, goodness, and beauty in Catholicism, but Rome’s doubling down on this isn’t it. Thank you so much for your work on this.

Thank you Gavin IN THE NAME OF JESUS for this VERY IMPORTANT vudeo..... You ARE very well detailed....simple to comprehend....based un scriptural & historical proof..... Dont give up.....brother....many will HATE you ....this is normal....but the true body of Christ will love you & encourage you ....we are in a spiritual war..... God bless you Gavin ❤

I've had so many discussions with Catholics and regardless of what scripture you share, any position you take, they are unable to separate themselves from the lens of catholicism! The role of Mary is quite clear in scripture. She, like John the Baptist are prophecy fulfilled! Neither play an active role in our salvation. They point to the wedding as one reason why they pray to her. To gain stuff, I guess but does the Holy Spirit intercede for prayers to Mary, or only those to God? With millions of catholics praying to her every minute of the day how is able to enjoy heaven, hear every whisper, run to Jesus and have Him give her the stuff that she was asked for? The woman shouted, "Blessed is the woman who birthed you and breasts that nursed you", Jesus didn't tell her He agreed but instead took everyone's eyes off of Mary and placed them solely on God. He replied, "Rather blessed are those who hear the Word of God and obey"! In Matthew 12 when Jesus was told that His mother and brothers were outside He pointed to the believers in front of Him and said, "Here is My mother and brothers"! But He didn't stop there. He added, "Anyone who does the will of God is My brother, My sister, My mother"! He doesn't place Mary in a special category but lists her with the common believer who does the will of God. From the creation of the first Christian Church in Acts thru the book of Revelation Mary is not taught, preached, written about, or even mentioned! No Apostle, no writer of any book mentions her. The Apostle John, caretaker of Mary after the cross, never once mentioned her by name. Never told us that she was special, deserving of our praise and adoration. The Apostle Paul, writer of half of the New Testament never once mentioned her! The Apostle Peter, the Catholic rock, never mentioned her, not a single Hail Mary! Revelation 12, the woman who is pregnant is pregnant and in heaven over 2000 years before Jesus was born. In verse 9 Satan is cast out of heaven. So the timeline contradicts Luke's account of when Mary became pregnant. In verse 14, the woman was given giant eagle wings to fly like a superhero. There is no mention of Mary having wings in scripture. Then in verse 17, I think, I don't have my Bible handy, but it says something to the effect that Satan went after her other children who kept the commandments of God and the testimony of Jesus contradicts John 7:5 where we are told His brothers didn't believe in Him. Mary, like John the Baptist are prophecy fulfilled. Neither have an active role in our salvation. To take our eyes off of God and to give to Mary is a dangerous thing to do!

Absolutely love the video!! Definitely watched to the end brother! Unity at the loss of Truth is no true unity. I think I read that somewhere… haha! Please keep up your wonderful effort in the spirit of engagement in the Revealed Truth of Scripture alone for faith and practice. 🙏🏼♥️ Thank You and Gods richest Blessings ✝️

I watched the video to the end!! this is such an important and well-thought out message, you helped me in my faith journey tremendously. Keep up the good work!

As a Catholic, the assumption of Mary is the hardest dogma to defend. I sometimes wonder why the catholic church dogmatized it in the 20th century. By this time why bother with it. Since the Catholic Church has approved some marian aparitions, I wonder if one of those private revelations had something to do with it. I also wonder what is your stance with those alleged Mary aparition like Fatima or garanbandal. Do you think it was a show? or devil the deceiving people?.

Amazing, and irenic overview. I was raised Catholic, became Evangelical (not protesting) through study, not anger, and all have lots of Roman Catholic friends. This shows it can be accomplished, discourse in truth and love. Well done, sir.

Watched to the end. ❤ Compelling video

Watched till the end. Quite enlightening

Watched to the end 😀 excellent arguments 👌🏻

You are hands down the most outspoken "preacher" I've seen on this topic. Thank you!!!

Catholics will criticize sola scriptura, because they think that it allows that any man may just come up with his own meaning of scripture, but when a bunch of catholics believe in something for long enough, this believe will become doctrine, because "it couldn't be that the Holy spirit would allow that the church would believe in something false", so it must be true and if you oppose this truth, you'll incur the wrath of God. What? How is this better than sola scriptura? And then they'll use scripture in the most laughable way and they'll pick and choose from the fathers to support their inventions while accusing others of doing just this: misinterpreting and picking and choosing.

Excellent dive into this topic.

A magnificent and irenic presentation. Very helpful!

Excellent video-made it through!

This is great Gavin! Keep up the good work

Of course I made it till the end!! It was such an interesting video, thanks Gavin! And thank you for your heart of humility that you approach these topics with!

I watched to the end. Very helpful

Watched to the end of the video. Thank you Gavin for all you do.

made it to the end. thank you for all that you do! i appreciate all of your disclaimers & the way you always aim to speak the truth in love.

I always make it to the end. I love your content

Why is Mary's assumption necessary? What can Jesus being truly human not accomplish on behalf of all those who trust in him that we need Mary to do for us in heaven? Is it not ironic that we need a Mary who is human but not God compared to a Jesus alone who is human still as we speak and God who not only created us but knows deeply our hearts of evil and frailty of the flesh? How can Mary be more compassionate than Jesus who is God and shares in the same attribute of the Father who is merciful. At what point does anyone who believe in this Mary dogma not realise it's incoherence?

Thank you for this video. I hope you will be putting your book in audible!