This quote. We have it bad now, just imagine how it's going to be for our kids. Do people really want to bring kids into this world just to have them suffer?
@@yamchayaku maybe we should do something about it as a society and have a backbone against the people stealing and using our money incorrectly. America revolted for less than 1-3% tax against the british. But now we are all soyboys and with no backbone so i guess ur right we shouldnt have kids
You become a man and figure out ways to make more money. I make 6 figures at work but I also worked up to that position and when I come home I'm investing in stocks and crypto. I've made more in stocks and crypto than I did in the last two years working 50hrs a week
Yea, it’s what they never do. Like cutting down their own pay from the taxes they collect. Or not committing insider trading like they did during 2020 alongside their corporate donors. Scratch that, if they cared then they wouldn’t be politicians.
I would want kids, but I dont want to scrape by paycheck to paycheck, not living and barely surviving. I'd rather not make another human being suffer like this
Having a child is an optional grandmaster tier real life quest. The xp reward you get is based on how good a job you do raising the child. As stated, start saving as early as you can. I save for myself, but the very day my kids got their social security numbers I opened bank accounts for them and began investing monthly in low-cost global ETFs. I don't give a sht about my life in the future - I live a simple life. However, my kids should have the possibility to make choices in the future. I want to finish the grandmaster quest with a reward higher than my parents got from theirs - that's MY goal. People can choose not to have kids if they want. As I said, it's an optional quest.
Sounds like you're doing pretty good then :) Biggest issue for people like me is that all of my income goes to living and I've been losing all of my savings slowly because the cost of living is actually higher than my income. My biggest unnecessary expense recently was Wendy's a week or two ago. Love that people have money to save, but I'm sure people can relate to not even having money left to save. Ps, I don't even have debt, I have a college degree, and two raises at my job that aren't pitiful raises. Still no disposable income.
i'll look into global etf's. i usually buy properties from people in pre forclosure and rent it out. or i go to auctions but its a giant waste of time usually.
Thats good but more important than giving your kids money is teaching them how to have a good work ethic, how to keep their bills down so they don't have to make a ton to survive, how to pay bills first , THEN SAVE half, THEN they can spend the rest. Because its more important to teach your kids how to make, save, then spend money than just giving it to them because without that ability they will just waste it and get into big worthless debt.
I need to add that kids are an investment on top of being your kids. My parents work in health care, and the most miserable people are always those with no kids around them, because they drove them off or are distant, or have none to begin with. Pay now to avoid paying later.
@ethanchen4504 You don't need to add that. You are making a lot of assumptions about the source of other people's problems. Equating broken families to people who never had children is a logical fallacy.
@@Kefroth1 Sorry I should've added more context. This is the lesson my mom has taken from taking care of dying patients for roughly 20 years on the job. Her best friend visits hospice and such places and has been for at least 10 years. From them, their best advice is to HAVE kids no matter what. Take from that what you will because she said the amount of misery she's seen otherwise is too much. These patients visit the hospital weekly, and for many years until they don't(which is to say they die), so everyone knows each other and their families very well.
Across my age group, I've noticed parallels but the difference is that everyone is deciding not to have kids not just smart people. It's no longer possible to be a single mom of three, people are deciding to stop at 1 or 2 just in case something bad happens to their husband.
It's true though. If you are a middle class working family, you are pretty much penalized for having children as childcare costs on top of everything else are sky-high. Lower income families are incentivized to have children through benefits.
Are you saying the governmenty should do something? Im pretty sure it was people listening to the government that got us in this mess. Pop. shortage coming soon.
Also, even though average cost of a child is calculated 310k in this video, couples like this don't want to raise the child "average". Since they both are educated and have decent income they will want their child to wear higher quality clothes, eat healthier food, go to better schools etc. which will pull that 310k number way higher.
This. Some people are shocked that six figures income isn't enough for kids. It's absolutely true. Where I live, average home price is 600k. If you want a home in a good school district, that's $ 1M +. As someone who went to one of the best public schools in the nation, top 10 CS university in the nation, I'm not going to have mediocre kids. That means the cost for me to have kids, home ownership, good schools, and daycare so I don't get fired is going to be a household annual income of 400k. And no. I can't move, because my other option is San Francisco
@rainfang1992 in MA, it's 25k a year per kid. If you have two kids, you basically pay 50k a year for 5 years, or 250k in after tax money before your kids even enter kindergarten! It goes up every year, so over a 7 year stretch, it's more like 280k.
@@rainfang1992you can move, you choose not to. There’s no rule saying rainfang isn’t allowed to move to a cheaper state. Make the sacrifice. I left California and bought a home in NC and checked all the boxes you listed, while making less than 6 figures
If we go with the argument "some people shouldn't have children," then I don't think we should be surprised when people have the forethought to consider "maybe its not for me."
i think there has been a rather steep decrease in the quality of parenting. we know more than we ever did before about psychology and parenting and yet those skills are not being put to use, instead children are raised by the internet. delayed gratification is the key to success but now there are entire generations that won't understand that, because the only thing they are learning is instant gratification from scrolling tiktok/shorts all day by people who are specifically exploiting their demographic for money.
Both parents have to work now who raises them anyway, both parents, are stretched thin in the skills and lessons they impart schools and corporations have taken th role and they won't have mine
@@brandonprince4366 Raising a child is often too much for parents alone. You need a support structure of relatives and friends to pick up the slack and let the parents rest. It takes so much to do it right that its understandable people don't.
I'm a father of a 6 months old boy. It was all planned and we wanted it. We prepared everything and accepted the fact that we will be shorter on money and time. But man it's so not easy to handle. Our boy isn't even problematic (he sleeps bad though) but it's an everyday drill and sometimes I feel like we shouldn't do it (especially when Im at work). But then I come back home and see him smiling and making progress and I know it was the best decision of my life.
Hell yeah man, I feel that. Kids are awesome my son is 8YO and now we game together. Raid the bastions on Minecraft, play apex together. My 3 YO. "Sells food" to me. It's an amazing feeling. Makes me completely forget the struggles every time I see those smiles.
@@brednbudr2406dude I pay a mortgage every month in daycare, not “easy”. Then constant doctors visits when they are sick. Wrecked house. Have a 4 and 2 year old, so it’s a bit different. Brace yourself
It can be tough. I have a married couple who are good friends who couldn't have a kid without help. Took 2 rounds of In vitro to finally have a kid and he was an absolute nightmare of a baby. Barely slept. Cried constantly despite being perfectly healthy and tbh they were miserable for the first 4 years and it probably almost cost them their marriage. It doesn't always go well. Kids aren't for everyone and you don't know what you're going to get. Some people just need to get a cat or a dog instead of having kids lol. But I have the utmost respect for good parents. It's not easy to raise kids right.
I love whenever politicians freak out about the birth rate. Im not bringing a kid into a world thats this dirty and corrupt just so they can end up working for someone else making their family rich while everyone else suffers
It's not just a proplem for "the politicians" or "the market". It will soon going to be everyone's problem. If you want to get a decent pension for all those decades you've been working your butt off, guess what happens when this generation gets old and there are no new workers to replace them: no taxpayers to pay for your pension. So both us will be getting little to nothing AND the new generation will be overtaxed to pay for whatever scraps we will be getting.
for me its not just about the financial problem, it's more about realizing the huge challenge that represents to raise a child nowadays, my respect goes to all parents who manage to raise a "normal" kid in these crazy times
@@nathan113 That is basically going to be pretty much 99% of gen alpha, and addicted to TikTok which will make ADHD and other things skyrocket even more so
Living costs right now are actually just ridiculous. So many people under 35 are struggling even with rent let alone dreaming of affording a home some day. I'm not surprised at all less people are thinking about children.
I got a 2 year degree in something USEFUL. Got a job, have a stay at home wife with 2 kids and a car. Im living comfortably in s trailer just saving money.
@chops5084 gEt a DeGrEe iN sUMtHiNg uzseFuL. Probably the most hilariously, short sighted thing a 2 year degree got you - a small ass trailer and a low ceiling income
I have a 17days old baby, it's the hardest thing I've ever done. Pregnancy, giving birth (the pain is unimaginable until you go through it), the recovery, hormonal changes making you super sad for nothing, breastfeeding (it hurts), caring for a baby 24/7. Nobody should go through this without being super excited about it. I couldn't wait for a baby and still regularly break down and cry. It's not selfish, it's smart to know all the pain and sleepless nights won't be worth it to you and you will probably be a depressed or resentful angry parent.
Next time, take the dilot'd shot. lol. My GF was on the fence and I just gave her the most serious and stern face I could, "Take the shot." Less than 3 hours later, 4 hands were inside of her stomach pulling my daughter out. I will never forget seeing that, turning to my gf and going, "You good babe?" (Hands feeling around INSIDE her flesh) "Yeah." 'ok.' xD The first year is pure survival. If you made it to nightfall- well done mama. It gets better in years 2-3. :D
The crux of this entire movement isn't that they don't want children, it's that the socio-economic climate of the western world has made the prospect of having children, owning a home, having a pension, affording retirement has become an impossibility. Homes cost nearly 10x what they did in my area than what my parents bought for. Groceries cost me at least twice what it did 5 years ago let alone 30 years ago and the list goes on. All while the median wage in 1985 was $55,000 and in 2023 it was $57,000 (both in today's dollars) - nearly 40 years of wage stagnation and the death of the single income family is the cause.
It's difficult and may be near impossible for some, and impossible for some. but it is not impossible for all working class people. My wife and I are blue collar, im a truck driver and she's a nurse. You can't get more working class than that. We have average salaries. We turned 30 a few months ago and bought our first home middle of last year. The money wasnt the deciding factor with us having our first kid, it was the schedule. My wife being a nurse is fortunate to be able to work on weekends only. If she didnt have that schedule, we couldnt have a kid due to daycare costs. With me working mon-thurs and her working fri-sun, one of us is always home with the kid. We have no true days off but it's worth it for us every day.
@andrew5689 right and you're still dual income to afford it where as 30 years ago that income as a truck driver afforded someone like my dad (who was a truck driver) to support a family of 4 on single income. Which would allow one parent to always be home, generally the mother. That is the part that makes it near impossible for most working class.
@@DarrenDurham i completely agree. Im not saying shit isn't hard. Its very hard. But i see this thread of, "the sky is falling, the world is about to end, nothing matters at all" and i just disagree. I understand the sentiment. It's nuanced. People get in very difficult lifestyles and its hard to pull yourself out of it but there still needs to be self motivation to pull yourself out of it otherwise everyone will stay where they are. Once everyone stays where they are, that's when the world come crumbling down. Once we say "shit is so fucked, why try harder than i need to?" That's when it's all over...i feel.
That's utterly untrue. It's a very common excuse of people "oh I don't have children because of the economy". Really? Then why did birth rates first fall under replacement level in the 70s and 80s? During the decades with the highest economic booms? Those trends have continued until today. Nothing changed. Economics not only do not explain people not having children. But in fact it correlates directly with lower birth rates. The richer a country becomes, the lower the birth rates. Now the question is: Does wealth do this or do people's values change due to the wealth? Well it's pretty clear. The only country that doesn't experience this even on a secular population is Israel. The only country with strong family and national values. When people become materialistic, no amount of wealth and money will make them have children. That's the reality of the situation. Another big reason is feminism. It is one of the key contributors of women's movement away from children. The sexual liberation and women's emancipation are what destroyed the role of the mother and the wife.
The thing about saying "Everyone should have a kid" is really messed up because a lot of people SHOULDN'T have kids but have them anyways, our drug addicts on the street who had parents who didn't want them. So yes if people don't want to have kids they shouldn't, they could always change their mind better and be a great parent for actually wanting the child
@@LordRykard9376alr bro, if that's what you say. There have been so many people who have come into this world with not great homes because it was an "accident" I don't care who you are people should only have kids if they; 1. Want Children, 2. Can raise children cause if you don't got either of those you have an abused child or an orphan
I also think the kid needs to have parents that WANT that kid. No child should be truly unwanted. I know myself, and I know that if I had a kid I would resent it for changing my life drastically. I would no longer have time for hobbies and things that bring me joy (art, reading, exploring nature), and I would ultimately hate the kid for taking all that away from me. And that would be very unfair to that kid to be born to a parent who thinks that way. That kid deserves to have parents that love them and WANT them, and I would not be able to give that.
thats completely bullshit. if you dont have kids, humanity will wipe out. only human cultures with a healthy 2-2,3 child policy will survive. and thats probably the bad cultures, like with no human right movements like 200-300 years ago.
The free handouts and forgiveness just perpetuates the problem. The fix is barring the insane interest rates and tuition the colleges charge. Look how much money Harvard has in endowments, colleges now are glorified hedgefunds.
7 месяцев назад
Yes it’s a problem in California because most people vote for democracy instead of republican. The first step act was heading in the right direction with trump.
inflation and education i cant say enough how much these impact people especially new couples price are increasing way too quick it is hard to see having a child would be fine
If you want children, have children. If you don't want children, don't have children. But whatever you do....don't accidentally have children. Be responsible!
@@Link-Bling Yeah, that's what I wonder about. Having another person and some pets might feel like a family, but when that person is gone that would change drastically. I mean it would either way but with no kids it must be worse. I hope they have siblings or very close friends and are close with their families.
Wanting them isn't enough. The child's needs should be the top priority, not how bad someone wants one. A lot of people aren't willing to educate themselves on childrearing or be disciplined enough to do it right.
Yeah, the cost of raising children has absolutely skyrocketed. I have 3 kids, I'm in my late 30s. Before we had kids, we had about year of income stashed away, investments and no debt. We were very well off and secure with no financial stress. Not only did we have to use most of that up, now we break even most months. Groceries, extra fuel, after school activities bills, school fees, child care, health insurance, utilities bills and on and on and on. Whatever your highest estimate of what it costs, double or triple that.
And yet there are other ppl in these comments arguing "children aren't that expensive" and I would like to know where they live, in my area the cheapest daycare is $1200 and I wouldn't leave my goldfish with that place, let a lone a human being! That place has had sooooo many cops show up I have no idea how they are still in service
@@Zexx4hey silly Billy, maybe instead of farming out the care of your child to some basketball American for $1200 a month you could have your wife stay home and look after them
Wait until the cost of age demographic in balance. When America has no replacement generations. What makes my GEN so stupid is by the time we retire there won't be a generations large enough to maintain tax revenues.
@@ee2610 If your family can afford that, great. The problem is, the child care costs are less than the loss of a second income, and most households can't afford that loss of income. Cost of living and other child related costs have only been going in one direction, up.
@@Zexx4 I want to say that they are people who are so tired and poor from having kids that they don't even realize it anymore and the pendulum went over the border and back again on the other side so now they are happy. Most of them think that others just aren't trying enough or that their solution and life applies to everyone. They think everyone has the same opportunities in life, everyone has the same willpower, everyone has the same desires, etc. And to note, I know that having children can bring great joy (I have nieces and nephews and love them to bits), but it does not mean that everyone feels the same way, and they don't get this. It's like religious people who can't fathom someone else not needing to believe in something in order to have meaning and live.
My biggest hurdle to having a child is the idea that my potential partner will come home one day and say “I’m not happy anymore” and then boom I’m a part time dad who only sees his kids on the weekends. I can handle losing my partner, but not my children.
Yeah many are clueless or just ignore what that drama does to kids through adulthood. Many kids(and fathers) nowadays are even finding out through paternity tests that mom has been lying.
When was society not terrible enough to justify having kids? People have been having kids in "terrible" times all throughout human history. I'd much prefer having kids now rather than a thousand years ago. Now my kid has a much higher chance of survival and they dont have to work on a farm by age 5.
People in my age group (late 20s) are stuck in a cycle of being unable to afford a house of their own, let alone a child, they have no relationship or social skills...Its like being stuck as a child forever.
Yes, I'd say the tech age did that to them. Everyone grew up being on the internet from a young age and having phones/ipads in their hands, so it's not healthy. I was the last bit of semi-healthy childhood as a millennial that didn't start using the internet until I was 12. Any sooner and it would've warped me more. I know it still changed any kid under 18 growing up and getting used to this new way to communicate and do things, all on a device. I'm very worried about our collective future now. We need laws everywhere making it so kids under 16 shouldn't be on any social media, it should be for adults only as it makes people depressed, even adults too, and it fucks up kids even worse, and then their internet usage should be limited to only researching things and maybe a couple of video games but only played less than 5 hours per week. And we all have to get politically active and fix our damn govt. Shrink it, cut the welfare and military spending, and create a more productive workforce again, brining jobs back to the US and deeply penalizing companies who outsource their labor overseas.
im 25 and even if i could afford my own house, I can confidently say that i would still not intentionally have kids. having kids and thinking you can raise them better than your parents did you is the most arrogant mistake you will ever make in your life. once you make that mistake you're not allowed to regret it either, you have no choice and end up gaslighting urself into thinking its what you wanted all along as a coping mechanism.
@@SaneMillennialsounds like a typical out of touch response. It's not the tech age, it's literally because the boomers did not have enough kids causing the next generation to be raised in suburbs with no other kids leading to social isolation. Technology is the only way the new generation can connect. It escalates per generation as they get smaller. Secondly the oldest two generations are hoarding wealth while also preventing the next generation from entering the market (nimbyism), they're literally cutting the rings off the ladder. Lastly the final issue is that GDP is decreasing thanks to them not reproducing and now saving soinstead of investing in their own kids and helping them build up they are importing the entire third world causing the cost of living to increase, lowering of wages, and abolishment of culture. All this does is delay the great population collapse that will change humanity for centuries.
I waited until my late 30's to have a kid, and its way more expensive then i thought. The diaper, food, toys etc, were all managable, but once daycare started, holllly shit. I had no idea daycare was so expensive. Currently paying 1400 for that, which is within a stones throw of my mortgage cost. fucking insanity
@@StuartBilo-sj6md i took care of my parents, grandparents, and my inlaws until they passed, so i guess i fall into this category. One of the many reasons i ended up having children late (wasnt financially ready).
@@CatalinaFOIAand the crazy thing is that the less costly places were only about $50 less and were not somewhere I wanted to leave my child. So it was 1350-1400 or nothing
Also, it takes a whole village to raise a child. I am a childless middle aged woman and had to take care of other people's children because they can't. A lot of people will find themselves in that position, rather it be through relatives, friends or in my case, neighbors. The people who breeds sometimes don't have enough IQ to understand boundaries and the child is innocent.
I think every woman is called into motherhood, and every man into fatherhood. That doesn’t mean every person will have kids, but every person needs some kind of motherhood or fatherhood to be fulfilled. Sounds like you raised kids that weren’t yours. That was your calling to motherhood. It’s very respectable and there’s nothing wrong with it. Most people will be called into having and raising their own kids. Our society has gotten screwed up to where we think fathers aren’t important. I see that as the number 1 issue in the country. We need more strong father. I couldn’t imagine not raising my kids. Teaching them to shoot, fish, drive, treat women with respect. That’s what’s missing in our country.
While it's pushing boundaries and completely insane if you are only neighbors or not even close friends with someone to ask them to take care of your children, I find it perfectly normal to participate in taking care of children from your own family and even to some degree their education and manners, as long as the kids are well mannered and you are not asked to do it too frequently
If you want kids, have kids. If you don’t want kids, don’t have kids. It really is simple. Edit: People are overthinking this too much. If you want kids, you should obviously be prepared financially and mentally. 🙄 Make smart decisions.
@@datboiashy2957 I know right!? People who are saying "it won't be ok" don't take into consideration some people who have kids and how many they are having...whether it's for religous reasons or otherwise. For example one of my sisters has 9 kids...the other sister has 5 kids just alone that's 14 people for the next generation...if people who are judging other's for NOT having kids are looking at this because of some "population quota" then rest assured we will be ok as a species. LOL The world has been through several mass human deaths (black plague, Spanish Flu, etc) and we have seem to bounce back...dare I say that some people think the world is too overpopulated (different discussion). All I'm saying is that for the folks who think that EVERYONE should have kids because it feels some type of "quota' relax...rest assured someone somewhere in the USA has filled your quota for you LOL
I think a lot of the point went over your head. The cost of living is making it unfeasible for people who actually want kids to have them responsibly. They feel pretty much forced to be DINKS. The people that don't want kids weren't going to have them regardless.
i don't want kids because i grew up watching my parents struggle with money. i am currently struggling with money, and i definitely forsee myself not being able to be the best mother i can be to a child with my income. why would i want to perpetuate the cycle? why should i force a child to suffer just because "having a child is the end goal?"
then try your best to make money, if you can't then no one will blame you, but people who have more than enough money to have children but refuse to are better of donating their money away at the very least, not waste it for overconsumption that feeds the very issue.
Definitely figure your shit out. Nothing worse than a provider than can't provide. But don't equate your current situation with never having kids. That should be the goal. There is nothing in this world that can equal the joy of a child. Fix your shit. Raise a family.
@@brednbudr2406 Having a child is only a joyful if you like kids or benefit from it in some way. A kid is a waste of time for most and a money burning machine. Most children cause unnecessary problems either with their behavior or disabilities, you can't fix everyone's behavior with good parenting. It's a financial risk with no return.
I have two kids. Theres very little support for parents in America. Its very hard. I don't regret it for a second, but that doesn't change the fact that it shouldn't be this hard.
I realy don't know how america got this "bestest and greatest" title. Besides all the current problems the european care system is solid. My wife got paid 65% of her previous income for a year for staying home, we got "free" healthcare (the cost is far less than in amerca) and daycare costs as much as you get paid for having a child. All in all you may pay a little extra bit nothing devastating.
@@dariusrosso3783 America never got the Title of "bestest and greatest". They are just feeling that way. That is why this country sucks ass at almost everything when there isn't money involved. It is the perfect dystopia and it is still getting worse.
The people calling them selfish confuse me why would you want someone to bring a kid into this world knowing their parents can’t or don’t want to take care of them that’s seems more selfish that just not having kids
You need to have kids so they can grow up and work their ass off for minimum wage and make money for the bossman while hating their life just like their old man... as another commented here "we're just the working cattle for cooperations"
@@Subsistence69yea forsure, theres enough people willing to make the sacrifice to keep future generations going, and even though the West is plummeting in Birth rates below replacement level India will always be there to repopulate the Western countries so we'll ultimately be fine. There's probably too many people on Earth anyways if we're being honest
The idea of self-care is important (put your own oxygen mask on before you try helping others), but it's one of those terms which has become diluted with overuse. A bit like "woke" which was meaningful 15+ years ago (being aware of the struggles others have that you may not) but is now a catch all term that could mean anything from "progressive" to "thing I don't like". Buzzwords and hashtags erode nuance
Kid sees parent or others struggle due to lack of money Kid grows up and makes decisions so they can not struggle and have money. *shocked Pikachu face*
Kid sees old parents die and kid ain't 20 yet. Kid decides kid will have his own kid in 20s. *Fails to get a proper job and woman until mid 30s.* Kid no longer wants a kid
That's why I’m not having kids if I was upper class maybe but it's irresponsible to have kids when you don't have the means to raise them or the suitable partner to do so.
That was what I did. Dad's business was destroyed by immigrants undercutting job bids. Parents divorced, Dad went away. Luckily my sibling and I were working. He in a cushy corporate job, me in a low paid but still sufficient blue collar trade (power plant/boiler technician) earning about 1/4 of what my younger brother makes. Both of us made up our minds to stay single & childless.
@@Often_Uneliable Your kids are better off alive and growing up poor than being condemned to never having been born. Andrew Carnegie, one of the richest men in history, was born dirt poor and said it was the greatest gift you can give a child.
Sure, but the people that just don't want children don't go out bragging about not having children or make it part of their personality. Then there's people like these who take on a "vegan" mindset about their life choices.
@frostmagemarii Yes! Like I dont want want kids. I realized at age 16 and just moved on with life. I mentor kids, do my hobbies, spent time with family, etc. I don't brag (nothing to brag about really). I really really don't understand the ones that make it into their personality. It just urkes me so much.....
not having kids is selfish to the government and not keeping the slave wage system going lol everyone just wants you to suffer like they do....that is the system. the rich find it extremely selfish....they won't have the future workers they need. Depriving them of cogs for the system luckly you have three...so they won't be too mad at you.
Thank you. I dont understand this mindset whatsoever. Its selfish because they had an accident and I take precautions to not put myself in that situation? Its mind boggling
@@Subsistence69It's selfish because children are the future of a country. By actively abstaining from having children you are not contributing to the future of the country. Whether you agree or disagree with this statement that is the logic at play
It's fascinating how people who have everything to be good parents (decent man and woman, enough income to deal with that) won't have kids these days because they actually thought about it a lot, but the most terrible people will have tons of them...today's kids are already a mess, I don't even want to know what kids will be like in 15 years.
@@retren5188 What?...Dude, that's not at all what I was saying and it's COMPLETELY wrong. There are tons and tons of excellent parents who are poor and raised wonderful people. When I mentioned horrible people in my original post it had nothing to do with how much money they have. It makes me so sad how some people (like you just did) would equate someone's net worth with their worth as a parent or a human being...what a fucked up thing to believe.
I dont understand when people say "oh you dont want kids your selfish" Then fo on to say the reason they have kids "whos going to care for you when your older?" Just seen as a means to an end
who guarantee that ur child will care for u ? how u know that ur child can outlive u ? some people that has kids want to drag down other ppl to share their mysery. and dilusional comfort seeing they smiled.
I can't think of a non selfish reason to HAVE kids. people give their reasons and it always starts with "I WANT" i want to raise them like xyz, I want to teach them my values, i want to see a little me grow up. it's always about the parents ego.
A woman I worked with said she isn’t having kids. I told her to reconsider because I was the same way and it changes you. You really should have kids. She got angry at me and made a snide remark. Fast forward two years later and she had her first. She tells me everyday how I was right. I’m not going to say it’s selfish, but I am going to tell people who are adamant about not having kids to reconsider. Unfortunately it’s something you don’t realize how great it is until you have them and then at that point, there’s no going back. There’s no trial period which is why the conversation is a hard one to have or why it sounds demeaning on both sides to argue the opposite. But it is definitely something that VASTLY changes your perspective on life. It is the closest thing to witnessing a miracle you’ll ever experience.
0:32 Dinks are not a new trend or type of household. I personally first heard of it in the 90s cartoon Doug with his neighbors were Mr. and Mrs. Dink who have no children and made it a point to show off the expensive stuff they would buy by not having kids.
Not a new trend; but the new trend is being overly proud and smug about it at every turn, and derisively calling people "breeders" when they see someone with a child.
@@frostmagemarii Might be personal bias kicking in, but I see way more overly proud parents IRL: showing off pictures of their kid like she's a sports car or something. I've never heard someone derisively use the term _"breeder"_ outside of goofy social media accounts or fringe internet forums.
Since when was not having a kid selfish? Who is it hurting to not have a kid? To say it’s selfish to not subject yourself to an extremely stressful lifestyle with a massive financial burden is CRAZY
I honestly think it’s more selfish to have kids at the moment. The price of everything keeps going up but the wages don’t, owning a home will only be a dream for lots of people, global warming is only getting worse and not much is/can be done about it and everyone seems to want to start a war now. I don’t think the future looks good and It’s not an environment I want to raise a child in
I don't know what country you live in, but many countries have declining birth rates. That means that their total population numbers are dropping. It also means that in the immediate future, there are going to be way too many pensioners and not nearly enough tax payers to pay for all these pensions. So the active workforce will be overtaxed and the pensioners will not be getting the pensions they've been working for all these years. It also means that the country in question will have a much smaller work force. In general, it's not good news for any country's citizens to have a declining birth rate. I understand that the economic situation is not good and many people simply cannot afford to have kinds, but using terms like "child free" and turning not having children into an "empowering ideology" is not only selfish, it's downright corroding the foundations of society: a country cannot keep existing without new births.
@@nikolaosboukouvalas449 I mean, imagine a world where we are forced by law to have children. Gotta strike a balance. People who don’t want kids shouldn’t be shamed into not having one. Personally, I’d rather focus on myself and build wealth that worry about finding a mate, which has become increasingly difficult btw. It’s so easy for a woman to just up and leave and take your house, your money and your kid with them. I’ll stick to being childless and single for now. Call that selfish all you want but I’m looking out for myself. I don’t owe it to society to struggle financially so the country can flourish in the future
@@PhotonBread I never said that we should force people to have children. I agree that is a terrible idea. And like I said I can understand and respect your choice. But generally speaking it IS undeniable that for a human society to fanction and continue to survive there needs to be new blood coming in. But to accomplish that we cannot "force" people through legal threats or societal pressure. We need laws and cultural changes that will make both men and women less afraid of getting married (not losing half your stuff in divorce, not being afraid of being abused) and financial reforms that will make starting families and having children financially viable. BUT cultural movements like the "child-free" people (not people like you, but rather people who call children "crotch-goblins" and promote not having children as a form of noble revolution) or incels of both genders that rouse hatred and suspicion between men and women do NOT help.
@@MrXaphus sure, but this is literally the first generation in American history when a generation is worse off than their parents in terms of prospects for the future.
Of course, the key to happiness is marrying someone you don't like, get kids you don't want, wage slave away as your partner is dissatisfied and cheats, and eventually live in a pod.
Fucking inflation man. In the 90s early 2000s my single parent mother with 40k salary could own a house on her own Now I make almost the same amount but can barely afford a single bed apartment. You need need to have double the amount to afford a house by yourself or dual income to equal that. If you want kids you need almost triple it. You need a CEOs salary to own a home for your family. I fully support eat the rich, literally holding back everyone.
From 2019 to now, my salary increased like 25% yet food, rent and everything else tripled in cost. In fact, I left a 1 bed room apartment to live with 3 more people in a shared household
I dont think it’s primarily about the money. People have had kids under _any_ financial conditions, from obscenely rich to dreadfully poor, for the longest time. Nowadays it’s more like people don’t want to spend their _time_ on kids and make all the sacrifices needed. Another factor is the crazy explosion of divorces that started in the 90’s. These days a lot of adults come from a broken family which, although they typically won’t admit it, is a traumatic experience. And they wouldn’t want to risk their own kids going through the same thing, so they don’t have any. The concept of a nuclear, traditional family has lost a lot of its appeal. But unlike many, I think it’s a good thing : having a family is now a choice, only people truly motivated by parenthood will have kids. That means quality over quantity. And I’m not worried about economic collapse, individual productivity will keep increasing with automation and AI. And even if the world GDP were to reduce it would only threaten the wealth of the super-rich.
Your ignoring the fact that when gdp drops our system is built to bail out wealthy business owners and leverage all of that on inflation and the dollar. There are plenty of people who want to or should have children but if the system persists this way it's only going to get harder for the average family. The current system is designed to pull the strings and artificially make people feel like children are unaffordable or actively make them work harder and have a dual income to afford the "luxury"
One things is, before when people faced hardship they still had a positive outlook to the future and also kids could help you living on a farm. These days the opportunity of making a career in a company is gone too, people wouldn`t be so worrier about money NOW if they saw a path of working hard and getting better pay into the future.
You can be optimistic about people now having a choice in having kids but it doesn’t take away the fact that people who have no business having kids just pop them out, I just hope the kids that come from parents who make bad decisions learn and do better.
Funny enough when I was in my teens, I mention I have no interest in getting married and having kids, and my parent and grandparents said that once I get older I'll have have a different opinion... well I am now in my early 30's and I still have no interest in getting married or having kids.
@@sora5982 it's not all women, but you'd be plain ignorant to ignore how some modern are acting these days. Women stalking men at "Lowe's" to find husbands because it's "too hard out here." Tiktok clips alone will show you.
I'm 44 now (female) and me and my husband always knew we didn't want kids. The amount of times I was told in the past I would change my mind when I was older, is just insane. Guess what; I STILL don't want any kids and I'm happy with the decision I made.
Crimes high, wages are down, costs are up. It makes people reluctant to have families. The governments solution to import even more people though, just makes the problem worse. Costs for housing go up and wages stay low due to more competition.
@@sean6793 Well on one side here, we have somebody giving reasoning and an opinion. On the other hand we have an emoji-using guy who contributed absolutely nothing substantive and made the most painfully obvious observation that anyone could ever make. Lay off the CNN and Cardi B.
@@mommasbigboy8656 Not to mention crimes and drugs that are imported this way. Plus the libs calling for defunding police, late term abortion and all that other fun stuff that screams decadence.
Problem is most people who are poor and grew up in unstable families will get multiple kids, while the people who were more suited to get kids choose not to.
@m0utruche I think the pointing at idiocracy and complaining is part of the problem. Like, clearly, poor people are raising children. Are they perfect? No, but many of them do awesome things as adults despite, or perhaps, because they had less as a child. Our society values its empires of dirt over community, and that is reflected down to the individual level of people not wanting kids. Fine. Build your empire of dirt. Grow old, become irrelevant and old and rich... but when you die that money doesn't go with you. And, when you're old, the choices you took will remain with you.
Regardless the reason why you don't want kids it's ultimately a selfish mentality. I don't have kids and I'm 35, I'm mature enough to admit it's been for selfish reasons
@@lanceneol865 Heh you think you "maybe sort of want kids" and then you see the first sonogram, and you start feeling like you're going to pass out from joy.
Combined me and my wife makes 84k after taxes. However, we live in LA due to our jobs. Shits expensive. We cannot afford childcare. We cannot afford daycare or a fulltime nanny for the childs early years. Our parents are there sure, but only in my mother is, and even then she still has a responsibility to her job and to my sister. With the prices of baby things inside stores are going up, we could literally break bank.
@@MochaBiscuitCafe Also, I want to mention, I wasn't trying to mock you or something. I was just shocked on change of perspective when a household with 100k pretax (approx) is struggling not just able to afford kids, but can be even priced out of state.
I don’t get it, why would you live in LA with that trash pay? Move to Phoenix, the job market is great here and 84k is nothing; I worked for Costco before I made a step up and made 70k there alone…. The job market cannot keep you in LA because you can make that same money literally everywhere else in the country so why screw yourself in an unlivable economy for your income bracket?
PS: this wasn't necessarily singling out "bad" parents - but more so to point out that taking care of a child involves a lot more than having a sunny disposition. You've got to be able to support the child emotionally, physically, financially. I heard this said YEARS ago in a long-form interview the Archive of American Television did with Judge Judy. Don't give me the whole "any parent is better than no parent" BS. Tell that to the children of Josef Fritzl or the kids in the Turpin case. Being a parent is more than "in name only". I see similar within the adoption of animals from shelters. People think having whatever animal is smooth sailing - but there's vet bills, learning the ins-and-outs of the animal in question, unforeseen stuff - and so - some people feel overwhelmed and end up returning the animal to the shelter, or give it away to someone else - or dump it somewhere. You can't find much of a trace of me online - but there's countless comments I've left on RU-vid videos of animals - because I love animals. I wouldn't dare to bring an animal into my life, though - because I know I can't provide all the things I'd want it to experience during its' time on this Earth. Never go to bed hungry, endless amounts of cuddles/affection/attention, probably a second or even third friend to keep 'em company. If you question whether you can be there for another living creature - then it's best to not take on the responsibility for said creature. Just my POV. Making a kid is EZ. Taking care of it is *potentially* nightmare-difficulty level shit. Here's what to consider: imagine being FORCED to play on nightmare-difficulty. Nope. You cannot play the game on a lesser level of difficulty. Yeah, that's a good way of thinking about it.
But death to current net worth, that ignores the incentive kids cause of working harder and the fact that on average people that had kids are more than twice as rich than those that don't by mean average at 55 and older. A DINK can save, the hardest part is doing it longer term. Parents have to think long term.
-> have a lot of money -> get depressed at 50 cause no kids and probably wife left you long time ago -> be depressed and die 30 years earlier -> money useless -> much wow
Too many aspects of society are broken. Healthcare, housing, food, time are rare commodities. I dont blame them. But at same time i have 3 kids and my parents would babysit during the day a few times a week to help. If you dont have available family care its incredibly hard.
I think a lot of people hope that having kids will bring you happiness later in life. I'm a parent and I've never actually thought that way... How fucking crazy selfish is it to think that your children have to look after you and give you grandchildren to makes you happy. Just nuts to me honestly...
How did you even arrive at thinking that way? Did you get to a place in your life where your parents asked a lot from you and you felt that it was selfish?
Generally these people have no skills that are of value to others. Such is life.. Finances are a measure of what society owes you, if you are of no value to others you get little value back Pretty straightforward
Yes, and they can struggle alone, not drag down a young, impressionable person who didn't ask to be put into that situation. I'm not sure which side you are arguing for, if any. Please elaborate.
And even though I will 100% take care of my parents, it should not be an obligation to do so. A child had no say in their parents' decision for them to be born. In the video they mention how (in the US) medical bankruptcy is common occurrence and elderly parents increase this financial burden on people who potentially wanted to save that money to responsibly raise their own children.
Disagree. Plenty of poor children still live happy and fulfilling lives. And especially in societies with free education (most of Europe for example) have very good odds of becoming financially stable as adults. Whats selfish is contributing to the population shrinkage crisis on our doorstep that will cause the greatest economic disaster in history.
I had kids at 24 and I am 38 now, when I had kids it made me do better for them and myself, Before that I didnt care how things played out. Being a parent is definitely not for everyone, just do what makes you happy.
Thing is that women surveyed later in life found ~80% of them either wanted to have kids and couldn't for various reasons, or didnt want them initially and now regret it.
@@DG-kr8pt As a woman, 80% of women definitely do not want to have kids. Surveys usually tell you what the person running it want them to, i'm sure you can find one where only 20% of women wanted to. I'd say it's around 50-50 of women in their late 20's . If anything from my social circle maybe 40-60. Even most of the 'yes's' are actually not sures or yes under the right conditions. There are so many girls that find the whole idea of having kids awful.
I never wanted a kid. We ended up having one by chance. It's the best thing that's ever happened to me. Honestly didn't think my life would be so full of love that it actually gave it meaning.
Yes they don't understand parents have Dual income, and increased drive. I work 50 hours a week comfortably because of my motivation. Just took 5 kids to Monster Jam last night, it was awesome not a "financial challenge."
My wife and I just didn’t want kids because we wanted our lives to be fun. Ask a married couple if their lives are fun. They’ll use words like fulfilled, but fun isn’t one of them.
Agree with you but then ask them 20 years later and see which one says its fun to be old and have no kids and who is more happy to have nephews ans family meetings and gatherings
Something that amazes me is how often people had kids due to pressure from outside sources - society, family, friends, chasing meaning, religion, culture, trying to save marriage, and the list goes on and on. I wonder how many folks truly had kid(s) because themself and their partner truly decided together to have kid(s)?
I'm about to have a kid even though I absolutely do not want one. My partner, whom I love very much, decided she wants a kid. I want her to be happy, but in order to do that for her I need to sacrifice my life.
@@chazhansen2479 Right, which is why ultimately you don't want to create an economy where prices keep jacking upwards and wages stay stagnant. The government needs to intervene at some point because success within the system (kids, house, car, etc.) is becoming more and more unrealistic.
@@chazhansen2479 It is not going to destroy our economy to have less people. The fewer people the more for everyone else. You are thinking in reverse here.
I was DINK for 10 years. But my wife said she wanted a kid or else she'd leave. We had a kid. She left anyways. I went from living life, back down to alone supporting my own home, 50/50 with a kid. Going to child events only, no time to do anything. Very little to game, very little money left to do what I want. Kids, or even a kid, is a risk. A Huge One. You want to assume your marriage will last forever. Holding on to a person you love. But that love shifted from me, to our kid only. Everything could be much much worse. I am thankful it isn't worse. But I had to sell my quads, camper, gaming collection to have enough to support my own 2 bedroom home while paying her child support/alimony. Even while 50/50. If I didn't have my child half the time. I would starve or be homeless. Cause and Effect.
The biggest impact with kids is definitely free time. That said, you can absolutely continue your hobbies with kids, you can get home from work and be "handy" like this guy said, involving my kids when i work in my shop is one of the things i enjoy most, its so rewarding seeing them struggle with a screw, and then shout for joy when they finally get it screwed in. I can work on my own projects while they are with me, kids like to do things, they dont want to just sit and do nothing with you.
As a kid, I didn't want to do it, but I was sent to help my grandfather take a bucket of bent nails, and straighten them with a hammer. I smacked my thumbs a few times. But I know how to swing a hammer. I see guys on job sites who can't swing a hammer properly. Kids need to be taught skills. Same as everybody. And they are going to get hurt. Teach them good safety and technique.
As someone who also has a partner and also doesn't want kids, the finances are a big part of it but ultimately irrelevant to this main point: It's no one else's business on whether couples have kids or not. It is our choice regardless if we're financially stable or not. If my partner and I want to live our lives child free, then that is our right.
Lol go right ahead bro do you. The only people that are fighting you on it are the people who worked so hard to make sure the bloodline lived on in you. If you want to let them down, by all means. Your competition certainly endorses that decision. More resources for my kids
the sad reality is that people who want to be child free put more thought into their decision than those who want children. people want kids but never actually learn how to be a good parent. its a self-perpetuating cycle that only gets worse.
I could afford to have a child (I'm European), but I just never wanted one and never will. It's not about the money for me. My boyfriend is on the same page. I see nothing wrong with that. People are different and have different goals and needs. And I think it's no one's business how I live my life.
I like kids and they normally seem to adore me, but I have no desire to be a parent. There are several reasons, but the core one is that the idea of someone being COMPLETELY reliant on me for their...well, *everything* , scares me. I am barely able to take care of myself (not for financial reasons, just in general). I've got no business trying to raise a kid.
I'm not sure if it's funny or sad that the same people who are at least partially responsible for high medical costs, lack of support for new mothers, higher maternal mortality rates, etc are the usually same people saying that not enough children are being born.
Exact opposite. It's people like this that think a mother is "selfish" for bringing a child into the world, and want to withhold that. Who benefits from couples NOT having kids? From couples working more and producing product mindlessly till they die. Think.
@brednbudr2406 Nah, those decrepit politicians want people to have children, so they can keep the miserable cycle of exorbitant student loans and healthcare insurance keep going.
Living in my 30's with no kids and still not a lot of money to go by unfortunately. But then again I'm not in America so yeah, money doesn't come by easy where I live.
For those mentioning "who will take care of you when you're old?!" I want to share some thoughts. Having worked in the Elder Care field, in the US, unfortunately the vast majority, 90% +, of those in old age/Memory Care/ and Independent living communities have children. The reality I learned working in that field is that having children is almost meaningless when it comes to elder care. In most cases even if the children want to help they don't have the means or time to take care of their parent(s) due to their own burdens. The most helpful avenues I found for elder care and life in retirement are; 1. Have substantial savings to cover issues and emergencies. (Easier said than done) 2. Be aware of government assistance programs ahead of time. 3. Makes sure your healthcare, either public or private, can cover your needs. (Easier said than done) The easiest and most straight forward people to work with were nearly always single and childless, but they were rare in my experience. The most difficult situations were always those related to the residents with children. The amount of "Why don't my kids call/visit." were far more common to hear than the opposite.
That is actually a VERY good point. the people who preach about "whos gonna take care of you when your old???" most likely don't give 2 shits about their parents. and moved out when they were 20
I’ve also worked in long term care and I’ve seen numerous situations where the children fight over their inheritance. These situations are always ugly and always end with a deceased parent and siblings who resent each other.
Most kids don't care about their parents and barely talk to them. Dying alone and relying on everyone else because you chose not to have kids is an entirely different topic
I think it's just funny how up in arms people get on either side of this debate. If you don't want a kid, there's nothing wrong with that. It could be for money reasons or just something as simple as you not wanting all that responsibility. Taking care of a kid is hard and expensive. Sometimes it's okay to say you're not responsible enough for a child, more people should admit that. It's not a knock at you or something, life is kind of scary right now. If you want to have kids, there's nothing wrong with that either. It can be very fulfilling and rewarding to have children grow up and become adults. We do need people to have kids to keep going as a species sure, but way too many people just see having kids as a necessity more than a bonus to your life. Life was more normal for them back in the day, so why wouldn't you want kids now when it was fine for them? Looking at comments on this video kind of just confirms why so many people are choosing not to have kids in general, they keep getting pressured to have kids when they're not ready or capable, and so many of them have grown up in struggling households and don't want to see that happen to their kids. It's not rocket science. Maybe folks need to look at WHY people aren't having kids as much and not just the fact they aren't, and maybe folks on the other side need to stop trying so hard to belittle and forcefully convince people into having kids. For a bunch of people who preach responsibility, I would think preaching accountability is just as important. No one wants kids right now because the economy is just volatile and scary, who in their right mind wants to bring a kid into that kind of situation?
@@LordRykard9376 It means that you are thinking with your upper brain, not lower brain. Instincts tell you to reproduce, but your rational mind reminds you, that your life will become much harder, if you do.
"No one wants kids right now because the economy is just volatile and scary, who in their right mind wants to bring a kid into that kind of situation?" Being poor or the financial instability in a country should not scare you from having kids. It should not disallow you from having the right to have children. Its if you have the neccessary attributes in raising a healthy Kid in a poor household that is important. There are plenty of dedicated and ressourceful poor children being happy that they were brought into existence and their parents actively giving their best. Heck, they might even carry the country back as they recognize first hand root causes etc.
My parents wanted kids but didn't want to be parents. I think more and more people nowadays actually realize when they don't want to be parents and then choose to not have the kids they want as a result, and that is good. That is only a tiny factor though.
Got 2 kids, theyre dope. Dont care bout money. I have a very rewarding life. My kids are like real life points of interest, the ultimate quest. Its almost like i cracked the code in my gameplay loop and unlocked some secret DLC. 10/10 would definitely play again.
@@hellokaumea8315 exactly but some of these folks be lying 😂. That's like me saying I'm a doctor and I copy and paste some text from Wikipedia to make it sound like I'm wise in that field 😂.
Watching this makes me really happy I live in Finland. Our daycare costs like 300$/child if you're in the highest earning bracket, and it decreases for each child you have. You also get 100$ per child until they turn 18 so basically child care is 200$/month. People who don't want children should not have children, it shouldn't be financially impossible for thos who want though.
Asmon is absolutely correct when he says that people expect others to have the same values as them. A lot of people don't like it when others feel differently about something, even if the other person's choices don't directly affect them. Seeing people with kids get offended by the fact that some other people don't want kids is always odd and quite funny to see.
@Jonnyicey If enough people stopped having them, then yeah, sure. But that fact doesn't really change what I said. The idea of trying to grill someone and rile them up just because they don't want kids is moronic to me.
i'd feel guilty about having a kid because that means passing down my hereditary curse of mental and health problems i'm also capable of admitting that i'm just not responsible enough to take care of a kid
the biggest cause of mental health issues in today society is unproductivity. Back in the day people had to time to have mental health problems. I can see it myself, the more time I spend being unproductive, the more down I feel
@@bcav712 really isn't. Most people are just comfortable and don't want to change things up, so they stay at their dead end job and whine about it on the internet. Or they apply to dozens of jobs way put of their skill field and write a woe is me blog post
@@gargleff2691But why would you strive for a better job for the sake of having a kid? I mean you should probably get a job that does a little better than “barely puts food on the table”, however people have no obligation of working their asses off to further the survival of human race. In the past kids were a financial asset. Now they are a burden, hence people don’t get kids.
@@gargleff2691 There's a lot more people in this world than there are "better jobs", and everyone trying harder will only de-value those jobs. The problem of most people can't afford to have kids won't be fixed by people trying harder.
"If you want to find a bunch of men who dont have kids, just go online" Bro, has he played Classic WoW? Thats literally 80% 35 year old dudes who have to go afk in the middle of a boss because "their child woke up". I dont even know what that means. Do they have to be with their children every second they are awake or something?
Lol, I played classic WoW when my kid was newborn. Was a pain in the butt because I couldn't even run an instance (I wouldn't sign up for an instance or raid that I knew there was a good chance I would have to suddenly leave during). If he woke up (which could happen randomly), I would basically just walk away from the keyboard and deal with whatever the situation was, often returning to my corpse. When you have little kids (like
We already do things that either contribute to society or make us existentially fulfilled and children would only stand in the way of that. Just because people don't have kids doesn't mean they live hedonistic, meaningless lives. We help our community, we volunteer, get into civic engagement, make art etc etc. Many ways to live a rich deep lives outside of being a parent.
@@Gumbatron01It's great that you find joy and meaning in kids - honestly. But get rid of the perception that your kids will take care of you when you're old. It's not going to happen.
@@Gumbatron01 Most people are barely scraping by. Tell me, when your kid is an adult do you seriously think that they’ll have the money or time to also support you? Because at the rate we’re going the economy isn’t getting any better. There is no problem with having kids, but bringing one into the world at every disadvantage possible, poor, no opportunities, no college fund, no good food to eat, and barely having time to spend with their parents cause they’re constantly working is what is truly selfish. Having kids is a choice you can’t take back, not having kids is a choice you can’t take back, either way these are life altering decisions, many people regret becoming parents, the same way some wish they had, in one case both suffer, in the other 2 do. Hedonism is the argument everyone points to, but these peoples life styles are the opposite of hedonism? Where is the reckless pursuit of pleasure above all else? Safely putting away money and saving for their future? Spending money on mentally stimulating hobbies? They are literally not indulging in a single one of the seven sins. I wonder if you think nuns are also hedonists. Also do you not think friends are not also people, your spouse? In the end it’s just another person. Do you think people who can’t have kids are hedonists? Especially if they don’t adopt after?
who the duck actually said its selfish to not want to have kids? would you rather a kid exist in an environment where theyre not wanted? cause thats what happens when people who dont want kids have kids.
In Germany, for people with an income below 30,000/60,000 euros (single/married), a supplement of 1,000 euros a month for each child per household is absolutely normal. If more is earned each year, it would still have to be between 250 and 350 euros per child.
We have tax breaks for having kids here in the US. Because we are so insanely overtaxed, you can get thousands of your money back for having kids. Though you do only get that once a year during tax season.
@@dragonninja3655 "Because we are so insanely overtaxed" are you tho? isnt US citisens one of the least taxed in the world? one of the reasons your medical system is so shit?
We live in a time where you NEED 2 incomes from most careers to live a middle class lifestyle. At the same time Child Care is more expensive now than ever before. This creates the scenario where both parents are working and 75% of the 2nd income is going towards Child Care just so that someone else can raise your kids and you can try to scrape by on the remaining 25%. The days of raising a middle class family of 4 on a single income is gone. You have to REALLY want to raise a family and be willing to sacrifice substantially to do so.
I think it's a lot more feasible to have one parent stay home with the kids than people realize. Because daycare is so expensive (probably 75% or more, as you said), but by the time you factor in gas to get there, maintenance on two vehicles, so on and so forth....it's probably a loss. So you're literally better off staying home. Not to mention- you could easily find a neighbor kid to watch before and after school for a reasonable amount and you'd be much further ahead.
@@ivankrushensky The problem is generally people having new born babies are younger couples. Those first 4-5 years before they can go to public school requires someone watching them 24/7. This is also the time where the only person working is also young and not well established in their career, likely earning close to entry level wages in their field trying to not only pay for record high Rent/Home prices, but also sky high food and baby supplies to provide for not just themselves but their spouse and child. This IS doable, I know people who live on a single blue-collar income. The point is it requires VASTLY more sacrifices than it did in the past. You cannot expect a middle class, white picket fence, American Dream family where the dad works and the mom stays home and raises the 2 or 3 kids. It's not that it's impossible - it's that young people (on the whole) just don't see the benefit for the sacrifice required to start a family in your early/mid 20's. That's also why so many people are just starting to have kids in their 30's AFTER they've spent 10-15 years working their way up in their career just to be able to afford to start a family.
@@Zach-rw6jf I have no idea how old you are, but I grew up in the 80's and 90's. So not that long ago. I think your idea of "blue collar job and white picket fence" is actually just a myth. What people tend to forget is- not that far back many of us didn't have cable bills, computers or cell phones. No one had internet, streaming services, cell phone, gaming service bills...because they didn't exist yet (or only the "rich" people had them). We drank water out of the garden hose, no "bottled water". Coffee was made in a pot at home for only a few cents, or you could get a refillable cup and for 25 cents fill it at the gas station. Generally 1 television in the home. If there were 2, it was a piece of junk from the 70s that we had our Nintendo or Atari connected to. Most homes had one bathroom- if they had two it was because Dad put a shower in the basement (a curtain and shower head) to rinse off with as he came in from cutting grass. We cleaned our own homes, no maid service. Actually had to hand wash dishes. Families may have two vehicles- but they were never leased. The "new" one meant you were the third owner and the other vehicle was some piece of garbage- rusted so bad you could see through the sides, that Dad would drive to work. My Mother's home didn't have A/C, my Father's did. We didn't each get our own bedroom- we shared bedrooms (this was in both my Mother's and Father's). Rarely did we "eat out", 99.9% of the time we ate what was cooked at home. I had a "blue collar" family. I could keep going on....but the point is, times were much different not all that long ago. The reason it was more "affordable" is because the standard of living was completely different. Everyone wants nice, new and fancy now- Starbucks, two leased vehicles, piles of useless college debt (I have nothing against college, I went to college- but when I say useless I mean degrees which are actually useless and are not marketable), renting or buying homes that are clearly out of your price range, multiple "nickel-and-dime" monthly payments that you don't actually need.
@@ivankrushensky Perspective is key. Your observation and perspective IS VALID, but not for our current times. What small homes are being built? None. Decades of price and corporate driven inflation makes even the rust buckets expensive to get, the price of goods has gone up and it costs money to save money. Decades ago you didn't have in certain places DEADLY heat waves or cold fronts every other year. If you did, the house likely would survive it, whereas now even in California or Texas you might have a BLACKOUT because decades of deregulation has allowed profiteering on vital infrastructure. You didn't have food deserts back then, Walmart and corporate America has pushed healthy options out of reach for a lot of communities. Even if you cook for yourself " I remember ramen, beans, pasta, and other responsible recipes during my time as a student around 2008 onward" prices have skyrocketed within the last decade. No car companies are making cheap cars, even if they do you need good credit to save there . . . being poor with no or even medium credit itself is expensive. You cannot function without technology today, even getting jobs requires it in all but the smallest communities. Even the lowest quality of life "a ghetto" requires capital. Decades since you remember living, there has been NO minimum wage increase, wages have been FLATLINED since until covid . . . which forced the hand of the market to pay more. In your perspective, you lived through a life that was modest and sensible. Life is tough, people have to persevere. I also used to flip burgers for 15 an hour as a student, with what is now no college debt and I am now working abroad in a highly paid skilled job. The current reality for average Americans is so far removed from your experiences, it might as well be a fiction novela, because that reality doesnt exist anymore. If you want to live the lifestyle as you described, you have to move to some random town and get lucky with a remote job so you can live as a pauper to be paid as if you were a king "many small towns during the beginning of AirBnB had catastrophic growth in real-estate due to just that, so too late for that one." Hopes and dreams don't change what is happening now.
We almost didn’t have kids but I am so glad we decided to. We started with 1 and loved being parents so much that now we are about to have our fourth. If we didn’t wait until our 30s to start, when our house was paid down and our retirements were funded, we probably would have had more than 4. We constantly talked about how close we were to not having kids and how empty our lives truly were then and how it would have been. I know this is different for everyone but kids were the right choice for us. Budget wise, we have barely spent anything, technically saved money because the price of diapers and the clothes/shoes we buy and some sports activities is so so so much less than what we were spending on going out to festivals and breweries. I breastfed, we took hammy downs (only good ones though), repurposed a beautiful crib/dresser/changing table. I also don’t buy a ton of clothes because I do laundry twice a week. Everything worked out great since we were already good with money (no debt but a mortgage).
On the food part, we have a big garden and my husband has always hunted for our meat, so we never bought much from the store even before kids. We do live in town since we could not afford land here in the Bay Area, so it would help to have a bigger backyard, but we make do with what we have.
You don’t know how to save and finance then. Have a wife and 2 kids and I make around 60k and still have a PS5 and all kinds of nice things. Just got a 65” TV. People who say this just spend their money on stupid shit and can’t save. I have zero debt and two cars too so I would suggest you get someone to help you finance.
@@CharleyScene69ifyYou clearly have not dated modern women. I don't know any single women that aren't $20,000-$40,000 in credit card debt or family debt from living outside of their means, forget their student loans. They live the highlife and think it's normal for men to be making 6 figures. @spacecowboy373 @CharleyScene69ify The two of you sound like you are projecting. I don't date these women, I know them and I know they live beyond their means because come end of the month when rent is due they are asking everyone for money. @CharleyScene69ify Just because you found a unicorn doesn't mean all women are like your 1 unicorn.
Same. I have avoidance "issues" (I personally am not affected by my avoidance, but my family is) and can't even stay in a relationship because I eventually get bored or annoyed and want to be by myself. I think all my relationships were with great people and some could have lasted. I've always been the problem and don't think I'd be a good father because all the evidence would point to me getting tired of my children and wanting to avoid them. And it's not like I can try and see if I like parenthood. I believe people when they say children will change your life for the better, I do. But I know me, and you can't go back from that. I blame my parents for that. My parents shouldn't have had kids under the circumstances they did. I was raised in an abusive and neglectful environment of fear, and my whole family is fragmented and riddled with addiction issues because the tree is foul from the top down. I'm not going to perpetuate some cycle for the sake of some social construct (names), or because I want someone to care for me when I'm about to shit the bed; or to feel that I'm *that* much closer to immortality because I "live on" through my children, at the expense of little humans who never consented to be raised by parents that shouldn't be parents. Call me selfish-hell, my dad would call it hedonism-I think it's being responsible and honest with myself.
The fact that you recognize or are critical of how responsible you are tells me you'd probably do alright. It's those that have no self-awareness of their flaws that are often times the most horrible of parents.
I have similar issues, but whenever I am with my niece I am in protective mode and feel pretty comfortable and confident. But having your own child might be different because there is also your partner…
People should build a steady life before even attempting having children. Taking a child into an unstable household is literally bad for everyone involved...
A quote from a vídeo that i saw. "When its a good time to have kids?" "With You are asking that question then You aren't ready". Another one "When its a good time to have kids?" "When You aren't surviving with your salary".
Thing is, the people that aren't waiting for this "steady life" are going to inherit the world. South American's & African's are having babies at record numbers while S. Korea, Japan, Europe & NA are dying off.
@@samfire3067 fyi, money has little to do with this. It's the power of choice (women's rights) and narcissism (more concerned with wealth than family). The poorest nations have the highest birth rates. The most wealthy have the lowest. It isn't money.
@@jonathanstone4878 oor... mayby.. crazy take here..... Its a variety of reasons depending on your own beliefs and the enviroment you live in? myabe,... For some it is a financial reason in... places where one can afford to take it as a financial reason because the people have the freedom to do so. while in other countrys maybe like the ones you mentioned... finances isnt a factor due to various reasons of thier own from as otaku said no hope of the future and maybe even some religious views if im not mistakedn rlegiously is one not obligated to bring in a new generation? So.... Its almost as if there is more than one determining factor based on region custom rligion belief morals and so on that play thier role to shape peoples choices.... crazy right. I know not comforting to label it under one certain motive or reasoning.
@@leggotheeggodemon1323 The only factor that counts is this; the culture with the kids will live on and eventually overrun/dominate the culture with no children. The people having babies are the poor, the religious & and free-range peoples. Those not having babies are typically liberal, LBTQ, wealthy, highly educated & feminists. Look up the stats. It's the same in EVERY wealthy nation. It began in the 60's in the US. Go look at the social movements of the 60's and 70's. Divorce spiking around that time too.
Not only Japan, even in Europe we have that problem. It is a general problem that too many don't want kids anymore. And it's often about money, about the bad future for kids etc. And it's in many countries the same. But the worst thing is, who have mainly kids? It reminds me at the movie Idiocracy. Edit: Ok, next time I finish the video first. :D
But... world population has been skyrocketing in recent decades, why is it bad to slow down a bit? Resources are limited and people are already too selfish to share.
I was speaking to my colleague who is from Indonesia. I live in Australia. To get a box of chocolate and flowers for valentines day costs $1 there. In Australia for about the same thing is $200 dollars. People in poor countries don't have much money, but their money goes a lot further.
maybe not that extreme of 1 dollar (unless we are talking about shady chocolate shit), around $10-$15 is probably a very normal price. your point still stand though against $200 dollar. what kind of chocolate and flower though priced about 200? nb: I live in Indo
I have lived in third world countries and two first world. People in the west look at third world as poor, meanwhile the “poor” dude owns his own home, can afford five kids and a car with the mother staying at home. I wonder who is really rich
Im 29 and my fiance is 28. Both of our families are very poor. Out of both our families I am the only one that went to college, and im graduating this December but need to go to grad school in order to progress at my career. Hell, im the only member of my immediate family to have never gone to jail. I’m a therapist for children, and work with them all day. My fiancé’s biological mom walked out on their family when she was 12, and her dad worked shifts that were over 24hrs long. My fiance was 12 years old taking care of her little brothers. Cooking, cleaning, getting ready for school, and taking care of her dad after he had a major surgery. She had to be in a mom role when she wasn’t even a teenager. She doesn’t want to keep doing that her whole life. I also work with kids, and know myself well enough that im going to get burnt out if i come home to more. I need a break. Combined we make less than 100k a year currently and we do not have the money or energy to raise a child. We’ve talked about adopting because we both know what its like to have a rough childhood home life and will maybe want to help a kid in need of a loving family, but first we need to be able to take care of ourselves. But that feels impossible in today’s economy. We want to own a house, have 2 cars (we share mine and its a hunk of junk) and i want to finish my masters degree so i can more than double my income. But even after all that, we feel tired after work as is. Sometimes my fiancé works weekends or nights. The economy needs to figure itself out for middle class Americans before we can have a child and not feel like we’re doing them a disservice by bringing them into a world that will treat them even worse than ours treated us. The only reason we’re considering adopting is because we feel like its the right thing to do if we have the means to help a child that needs to be loved and needs a family. We like the idea of having kids but we dont like how hard it makes life when people are paid do poorly compared to the price of everything and the cost of living.
100k a year, I would be earning nearly 10 times more than low class in France , that's freaking crazy that at that amount it's impossible to raise a child in the US Wish you a good life to you and your fiancé, may you succeed in your effort
@@Le_Souf it truly is. the average cost of a modest, suburban, three-bedroom home in the US right now is around $250k! you might be able to get that three-bedroom home for $100k in a rural area, tho. still, things are too damn expensive!
@@thispersonrighthere9024 In France it's around the same price, I would say in my town it's around 250k to 350k+, if we talk about owning. Nowadays, most people rent in France because it's too expensive. I would say tho, having a kids is much less cheaper because there's is many help from the government. Like, school is free and you can even have a degree for free in France and you could even get paid for it (if we view grant as a payment and you just go to public school until you get to university). Healthcare is much cheaper, going to the doc is around 25 euros and 2/3 of that is being taken in charge by the healthcare system. There's things like logement social where you can have a rent in towns like Lille for 350 or less, with 2 bedroom, a living room, a bathroom, a dedicated room for the WC, a kitchen etc. Even with all that, I still don't know if I want kids, because if you don't rely on the system and earn more than 1k7 a month you have little to no help and life can be costly af when it's the case. As a frame of reference, if you are being paid 24k a year after taxes (2k a month) in France, you are in very good spot, most ppl are being paid 17k a year(1k4 a month). Still, I do think we have a life much easier around here, you have my total respect Americans for succeeding even tho life is hell of more costly around you.
@@Le_Souf I live in Latvia. Me and my boyfriend have about average wages, we don't own any property, but I feel like we could afford a child without too much trouble. Healthcare and social support must be a big factor compared to the US. Hospital delivery is cheep, medical needs for kids under 18 are mostly covered through healthcare, schools and kindergartens range between free and affordable (unless it's fancy private), good public transport so you don't necessarily need a car in the city. We also don't have study debt, because one of us finished on scholarship, the other could pay it off within like 5 years. Even then most people stop at one or two kids here. The situation in the US seems absurd.
I like how idiots say it's selfish to not want kids. Like obviously bruh, im not gonna raise another human if im unable to take care of it. Selfish towards your kid. What kid? A hypothetical child that doesnt even exist
Selfish because it means you have to share and your life won't revolve around you anymore. Same reason why someone who refuses to share is selfish despite never actually being in the position where he is able to share because he avoids it altogether.
@@TehFlushMaybe, but kuds also increase resouce consumption and carbon footprint. Kids take time from you spending time with friends and other family. Kids contribute to overpopulation.
@@evilparadigm no such thing as overpopulation. Carbon footprint is negligeable in first world countries relative to developing countries. If you don't want kids, that's fine, but silly to frame it like that. The best thing my kids can do for me is to have a ton more kids. My tribe will grow.
@@TehFlush I don't care that you don't care about carbon footprint. To clarify I'm talking mostly about the literal tons of disposable diapers and food packaging. You are factually wrong about overpopulation. Every animal on this planet has a maximum carrying capacity. The maximum is debatable, but the existence of a limit is not.
@@evilparadigm bro we have enough space to fit the entire world in like two states of the country. Again, don't have kids, not my problem. Your line ends with you as does your way of thinking. I already have kids, plan to have more, and will tell my kids to have even more than I did since I'll be financially able to subsidize them doing so.
I'll be honest, as the oldest girl of five other siblings I had to raise all of my four brothers and one sister like if they where my kids. even though my parents provided the money I had to feed them, clean them, change their diapers, picked them up from school, help them with homework, make sure nothing happens to them to the point where people around me thought I was a single mom and while I love them I hated being called that. When I moved out with my bf (I talked to him a lot about this just in case he really wanted kids in the future.) I finally had the freedom to not have to do that and it made me not want kids at all. I don't hate them but I dont want to make one. So when certain family members tell me when am I having kids I just tell them it's cause of money but when they tell me that oh money isn't a problem since they did while they were broke, I just tell them that I already raise 5 why the hell would I want to raise more.
I think you have to think about raising kids is also like an investment, you prepare them for adulthood, and they'll find a job and make money for you. You still have to love them tho cuz it's your kid
@@houbertcanitio2199That's pretty narcissistic to think your kids will make money for you. Kids should NOT AT ALL be giving their own parents money at any point in their lives. As a parent, you are responsible financially for raising your own kids, and you accept that your kids owe you nothing back.
@@duckshepherd How is that narcissistic? It's called gratitude. If I a parent give birth to you, I did it for a purpose and it's to further my bloodline and to enrich the family. Having your Kids work and give money to me is ultimately their responsibility because I have just sacrificed decades and decades taking care of them, How is not fair when they could give me money with their work or the fact that they inherit my stuff when I die anyway. This is where you are wrong, you think your kids are nothing more than freeloaders while I think my kids as a pragmatic way to survive and contribute to society. What's the purpose of me giving my share when I don't earn anything in the end. So yes I expect my kids to earn me money just as I broke my back nurturing them into adulthood.
@@houbertcanitio2199 I'm not talking about freeloading, I mean, it's expected your kids do chores and stuff as part of being a part of the family. My concern is with the mindset that you have kids expecting direct financial gain from them at some point specifically. It's debatable once they turn 18 as to whether they need to start paying rent if they're still living with you at that point. But if they're out on their own as full grown adults, they don't owe you money for any reason. A friend of ours was raised by parents who kept track of all financial expenses (childcare, medical bills, food, school events, etc.) they made on her until she was 18. Then they literally gave her a bill when she was adult telling her that she had to pay them back. She didn't know any better, and actually did pay them back in an agreed upon payment plan with interest. They literally made money off their kid like she was a loan - that is one of the more messed up things I've heard - it's sad that there are parents out there who think like that.
@@duckshepherd First of all, chores and stuff is just one piece in the puzzle, its not comparable to the amount of money we spent on their food, education, healthcare, childsupport, rent, tax. Second of all its completely normal to expect somethimg from their children. At least they should recognize that without us how will their lives will turn out, one day they'll have to know that its their time to contribute. Third of all, even when they are older and they don't feel owed to use or they are in a greater distance, I would still expect them to bring gifts or money at some point. You might think I'm insane for thinking about that but thats simply how society work. How could a society functions when parents have fostered this idea of being egotistical and self centered around the fact that they don't a owe goddamm things to their parents. How could parents expect their lives to be better when they are old when their sons and daughter don't care about them. How would the sons and daughter of my children help them in their dire need. Basically, its better to teach them they should be grateful to their parents and they should owed to their parents with either love, gifts or just money. Also, I'm not a control freak and I think its just wrong to give them a list of debt with interests. I think kids shoud only pay when they could and only when they could. Its better that way then us having to force them a list of debt which they couldn't pay in a lifetime.
Brainwashing that begins from the moment they were born. They were told that having children is the right thing to do so they respond negatively to people who don’t want to.
Who gets upset at that? I think it's reasonable considering the cost of living. However, the population will collapse if things keep up so we have a sort of obligation to fight for fixing the situation. Once its less of a financial burden to have a kid, more people will be open to the idea.
No one is upset. Just disappointed. Disappointed at what this generation has come to. You like many others are the contributing factors that will lead to demographic and societal collapse.
People need to mind their own… I have one kid and don’t plan for another…I get crap constantly for not wanting another kid and it’s pretty annoying. I think it’s great when people are happy with multiple kids and I think it’s great when people are happy without
@@USS_Sentinel i have 7 brothers/sisters and i had an amazing childhood playing ball/mario kart/smash ,helping eachother, it was great. Even now we all go on vacations abroad together and it's pretty great.
@@Triforcebro Yeah, I was the kid alone in his room reading or building with LEGO. I don't do much (physical) reading anymore, but I still have my passion for LEGO.
