Something I found missing from the critique of the original sprite is how it was designed to be viewed. Unlike more modern pixel art, it was designed to be viewed sitting some distance away from a CRT TV, rather than sitting close to a high-resolution monitor. What may seem a bit odd now, could be required due to the medium of its time. Other than that though, great video.
Tbf, most pixel artists miss this because A) them and their audiences do not use a CRT B) Modern Pixel art software makes it hard to view pixel art with at the 1 scanline per pixel row ratio typical in the CRT era during the drawing process. C) 480p is your realistic minimum as that's as low as most CRT monitors go, but so much of the era was drawn at 240p, in fact pretty much all of it was until 3D gaming. D) even if they do use CRT as a reference, they will likely reference RGB/component which loses out on blending effects. There is an active effort to hide the widespread usage of composite video effects historically in the retro-gaming community because they all use expensive HD RETROVISION cables and have an attachment to the maker, even though composite looks better for many games due to such effects. It's funny because we all love pixel art, but I'd say the vast majority of pixel artists are disconnected from it's origins, many may have never seen a CRT before, some might even not realize there's a difference between CRT and flat screens other than resolution.
Though I probably should have paid service to this point in the video, I did take a peek at the original sprite on a CRT recording of the game and I think in this case all of the criticisms still stand. Note, if you were a handheld gamer you've been seeing pixel art on LCD since 1989, including this sprite on the GB:C remake Super Mario Bros Deluxe in 1999, 25 years ago, without CRT artifacting.
@@AdamCYounis I certainly agree that most people are more familiar with crisp pixel art presented by LCD screens. I was mostly explaining that the odd way the fact looks could be to capture specific elements on lower-resolution CRTs, rather than simply odd design decisions. I don't happen to have an old 80's CRT I can test it out on though, so cannot say for sure. It is just something people don't generally bring up when criticizing older pixel art, so I wanted to mention it.
The sprite was also limited, like the skirt is symmetrical because half of it is flipped, to save 2 tiles. That is probably why toad is looking directly at the camera. Bowser and Mario were higher priority sprites that peach and toad. But peach's sprites have never been that good, even the one in super Mario world feels odd
@@rex_melynas and the original sprite uses 2 different palettes, since NES sprites could only use 3 colors (4 without transparency) That's why there's no white in the upper section (using black instead), a restriction that most reinterpretations ignored
Mostly pixel artist won't take into consideration that Super Mario uses 8KB for all the sprites, and the bottom of the Peach's dress is mirrored to save memory. It would be interesting if the people "teleport" themselves to NES age and think as game developers, to understand why this initial Peach's design could be the better solution for the NES limitations.
While true, a few of those reinterpretations do actually seem to keep the mirroring in mind while still making significant improvements. Which isn't to say the original is bad for what it was. Of course an artist with the benefit of hindsight and no time constraints could do better. Whereas given just how little screen time she get, the original just couldn't be such a singular focused priority when they were also having to draw everysingle other sprite in the game as well.
@@EmeralBookwiseObviously if the original developers cared this much about the art direction, they would have tried to bring it to all sprites, not just Peach. Later NES games like SMB2 USA and SMB3 have much better art styles than early NES games with more utilitarian design like SMB1, though they also had more experienced developers and more advanced cartridge technology so it's hard to say how much of that is art direction
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@@TheRenegade...Dokidoki Panic is also already a lot better.
People who say that you don't teach anything don't understand what you teach. It's a common mistake to confuse specific skills or tools with the principles that need to be implemented with their help. The latter is much more difficult and requires a certain level of thinking. You need to understand the essence of an abstract thing in order to successfully apply it specifically. The funniest thing is that thanks to you, I learned several functional things in step-by-step guides on isometry or shaders in Unity. So these people are doubly wrong. Thanks for your videos, good luck with the game. You are one of those who inspired me to solo development in my free time.
@@NoldoWalker yeah but even so. Doesn't make any sense to me. He's clearly top notch, as for the ways he does things, everybody's different and chooses a way to do things. Idk it's weird
To understand the original sprite, you have to look at it in context - right beside Mario. It's stylistically consistent. Her head is just as ridiculously oversized and out-of-proportion as Mario's head, and that's both intentional... and it works. It's a goofy looking kid's cartoon character, just like Mario. Imagine redesigning Marge to look less ridiculous (the Simpsons characters are all pretty bizarre looking, after all), and then imagine putting that redesigned (and, if following the same trend, ultra-feminine) Marge next to the original Homer. It would look absurd. Redesigning any character is a fun and beneficial exercise and I'm not knocking it - but to view any of those sprites as better than the original is to miss the most valuable lesson that the original sprite could teach us.
That's a fair perspective but I don't know that I would consider the Mario and Peach sprites particularly well matched if those hadn't been the sprites we'd been looking at for the last 40 years. It's hard to say, given so much history and culture is bound up there. I will say, I think peach's official design has undergone more drastic changes than Mario's, which would suggest his was more iconic to begin with.
I think even as a beginner, I definitely enjoy working with smaller sprites because it can feel less overwhelming with a smaller canvas and definitely serves as a good warmup. That’s not to say it holds little challenge.
Yeah small pixel art makes it a lot easy to make something that is at least passable. But trying to make something really good can actually be harder than traditional art.
I also think that small-ish canvases (64x64 or smaller depending on personal preference) are better for learning pixel art for two big reasons: Doing a lot of small pieces gives you more opportunities to make mistakes, learn from them, and move on than spending forever on a big piece. And every pixel is a decision you need to make, so a canvas with fewer pixels has a smaller number of much higher impact decisions, so you’ll find yourself with more opportunities to learn and problem solve
It's her key feature. We could say peach shaped bangs too. In their defense, its so hard to convey details in such small canvas, they had to compromise.
@@charlesabju907 Yeah but they just made a redhead Rosalina in like most of these!!! There's so many peek-a-bangs that it makes me angry and wanting to sit them down with my NES and SMB2 cart and make them play the entire game as Peach. THERE WAS A WAY. THIS WAS NOT IT.
@@charlesabju907 you're not wrong about the difficulty in that original look, but I think I see it decently enough. Her current self is such a departure from the original still so it's fine lol. I was just being goofy.
I agree: Justin_Cyr's version does look great. However: it also changes the look from princess Peach to something more akin to an ancient "Greek goddess". The crown looks more like a hair circlet. The gown looks more like a toga. And the cleavage...well...
Honestly though I think without that creative divergence the trend might not have taken off to begin with. I think me describing it as "fixing" in the thumbnail doesn't do the trend justice.
@@AdamCYounis "without that creative divergence the trend might not have taken off to begin with" --- Very well possible. It's just - if I would have been shown Justin_Cyr's design, WITHOUT being made aware, that it's supposed to show princess Peach...I would not have "recognized" her. Just to reiterate this: I'm NOT criticizing the design as such. I think *the design is great!* It's just not very "princess Peach"-ey.
@@o.b.7217to be fair, I only know the peach sprite from the nes is supposed to be peach because I have prior knowledge of it. I bet the modern audience that is used to the modern, standardized version of peach wouldn't be able to make that connection at all either lol
@@orions2908 OG Princess Toadstool in the OG mind is usually her SMB2 sprites for a reason. (Mostly, because her dress is pink as she gets a dedicated palette, instead of using Fire Mario's palette) And most people I know recognized Peach despite the hair color restriction, partly because what you call the "modern standardized" peach? That was her original design. She had blond hair and a pink dress ALL THE WAY BACK in the SMB1 manual, even in Japanese. The only versions of Peach that weren't blond were the extremely color-limited NES games (it was fixed in the All Stars versions of those games) and the SMB US comics and Super Mario Super Show, which were based on the red/brown-haired sprite. (AFAIK, the modern audience still recognizes Peach's redheaded version just fine, mostly because there's consistence... and only so many princesses and the other one (Daisy) has a yellow dress, not white/pink.) I was a tiny tot when I played Mario Bros and couldn't read english, but lucky enough in french "princess" just gets an added e, so I knew that the story had to do with a princess. Wasn't hard for even a 7 years old to deduce, ah, this is the princess the weird hat guys were talking about! I just figured that she was wearing a wedding gown and Bowser dyed her hair to match him, in my 7 years old brain.
Great video, instructive while still being laid back and fun. I've been doing pixel art for a year or so and am basically teaching myself from the ground up, so learning about these foundational art concepts is really helpful.
Wow your princess Peach versions were very beautiful, both of them. Though Peach has a very characteristic "peach" shaped bangs on her forehead, in the afterdark version the idea is there but it was totally missing from the first one.
Thumbs up for the after-dark one. I like how you make anything wholesome, even showing a bit of ankle. Love your stuff, bro, you always inspire me to write!
The way you explain and your process of drawing pixel art is so different from how I look at things! I should try this sort of style some time, I tend to really struggle with anything other than very basic organic or mechanical shapes
@@AdamCYounis More than you might think. It has layers, and primarily scanlines render nothing like pixels. For example: pixels on CRT aren't square (there is no pixels, they're just a part of the video signal that defines scanlines) so peach was thinner on console. Between pixels, the colors would blend together based on their difference (more contrast = less blending) because of composite video signals. Insert intense debate here about if this is what the developers intended, or if the developers actually wanted you to use s-video which is sharper with no blending but instead the console makers saved a buck shipping composite cables. Regardless, many many games used blending effects more or less intentionally. Finally, there's size, distance, and resolution. The max vertical resolution you'd use for pixel art on CRT is 240p. The average screen by the 2000s would've been between 24 to 32 inches in 4:3, and viewed from about 6 feet~ away. So for reference on my 32 inch CRT, adult Mario in Super Mario World would be about the size of my thumb if I pressed it on the screen. CRT TV's had a softer image than CRT monitors, so anything you draw you have to keep in mind it will look softer on the TV and viewed from further away. CRT's also could hit pure black like oleds and have perfect horizontal motion clarity (meaning you worried much less back then about things in movement being harder to see) Despite all of this, the real limitations for pixel artists was console hardware. Palette restrictions and lack of ROM space are 99% the look of the NES. If you try a 320x240 palette you'll have access to the same screen resolution as artists of the time, and there's a ton you can do with that space, especially since you can change it up to 60 times a second
BTW, it's not just the screen, but the video cable connecting the c9nnsole to the TV as well. The NES had both an RF port and an RCA, with the latter giving sharper image quality than the former.
@@LostInNumbers Having played it both by screwing in the coax every time I wanted to play and having to memorize red-white-yellow because I had the misfortune of my dad having a TV that didn't color its ports, just writing "video" and "audio L" and "audio R", I can definitely say that it didn't really make much of a difference on the NES. The SNES, yes, but NES looked just as sharp to me on both. Maybe on higher end CRTs instead of cheap TVs?
Ahoj, jsem z Česka a amatérsky se věnuji pixel atru. Ráda se dívám na tvá videa. Prosím více tutoriálů ;) Ráda bych vytvořila nějakou malou hru, ale třeba animace mi dělají pořád problém... Máš příjemný projev a vysvětlení jsou srozumitelná. Pokračuj v dobré práci :) Hi, I'm from the Czech Republic and I'm an amateur pixel artist. I love watching your videos. Please more tutorials ;) I'd like to create a small game, but animations are still a problem for me... You have a pleasant speech and the explanations are understandable. Keep up the good work :)
And apparently art trends like this last about a week. I want to know all these others that happen. The only large scale ones I know are Bowsette and the Anhka dance.
the main one I know of is the subreddit r/pixelart. it has 2.3 million members (tho it’s pretty old so i think most users are inactive), and I’ve seen quite a few peach redesigns (filter for top of this month!).
Everyone is talking about how it was designed and meant to be from a distance on a CRT. But so far I've seen no one talk about the actual limitations the NES had, and also the super Mario bros game in general. The designers clawed and fought to get as much as they could out of the limited space of the cartridge and NES sprites are typically subdivided into smaller sprites to work with. They have a pallet of 4 colors, two of them being white and black. And overall this was one of the first famicom games. The designers had very little room to work with, they were trailblazers and just starting out on the platform and were still figuring stuff out. There is a massive improvement between super Mario bros and super Mario bros 2/ super Mario USA, they ended up learning more and getting better for their platform and its limitations.
To add to your point on how fewer pixels are harder: notice that the artists that used more pixels limited themselves in another way, by keeping the same number of colors, so they challenged themselves anyway.
I suspect that a small part of why NES peach looks a little awkward and stiff is because her lower dress is (internally in the NES) actually one 8x8 tile flipped horizontally! Her arms, hair, and hands can't go any lower than where they are. The head is still a little funny looking, but clearly intentional and the style of the time for Nintendo. Do you think the mouth is meant to be lips or a big smile?
I swear, this all sounds like a class I had at Columbia college chicago! My professor went over all this stuff! Great video learned a lot about pixel art
I always found it cool watching what people prioritize in such a small palette size (though this still applies in larger ones) ...that being said, i sure do suck at choosing 😭
also, i feel like some of the choices available to express said details is even smaller when using outlines because you're using more space. kinda a nuisance for me
2:46 small canvases literally can’t hold most fine detail, unless it’s something super important, and contrasting. Like one of the glowing elemental sigils the genshin characters all have. Still depends on the ‘angle’ they’re facing too
I enjoyed all the renditions of Peach and how 5 pixels could turn her from an aloof, snooty princess into an innocent lamb lol. The interpretations of Peach's personality were pretty interesting in the larger sprite sheet!
I'm learning to make a game right now, i cant wait to finished up the basic coding so i can try my hand at pixel art, I want to try this at some point . [ Mon 12:49am 9/23/2024 ]
Are there people who think it isn't? Make a masterpiece! You're resources are unlimited! Make a masterpiece! Here's 3 broken crayons and an inch of paper. . .
Pixel art today isn't the same thing as then. The artists literally drew it on a CRT to view on a CRT. They look nothing like this really. It's weird how modern people think clear pixels is the retro style, but we didn't see it like that and the artists were using CRT tricks (and would be horrified to see how their work is viewed now). That being said... the sprite is still pretty bad even on a CRT!
Mario Bros 3 was a real showcase of what the NES could do, you can hardly blame the Peach art for being how it is as one of the first titles on NES, though it was laughable compared to what was already in arcades.
I am a beginner of pixela art.It’s true that low pixel art is harder because you cannot define details easily. I started working on 16x16 pixel art last month, and I need to control every small cluster precisely, or it will look weird. Especially since I am working on a tilemap. I made almost 20 samples to decide which one to use.
i feel like terderrer and justin_cyr's designs are probably the most attention grabbing to me personally, but that may just be cuz they enphacise the chest more than the others lol
Turns out the original Princess Peach design in-game there is far more in line with where a whole lot of particular people see things these days. Personally, I prefer most of the redesigns that are, shall we say, more traditional representations of a princess named Peach. :-o
Dude, that thumbnail of the original Princess Peach sprite next to your “after dark” redesign with the text “We can *fix* her!”…it has some connotations that I’m going to be nice and assume you didn’t intend, but it’s kinda ewww.
Hi m8, I love your graphics they are just so nice. I'm in the middle of creating a pixel platformer, The problem is it's so big, there are thousands of screens! Incorporating different genres like sci fi, horror and Egypt etc. there is even an 80s theme in there with Manic miner screens, Chuckie egg and other(too young? look on RU-vid lol)I think I've made it to big and will take me another couple of years to finish. Unless you want to help design a few screens for me? 😊
I know this is just a pixel art channel, but id like to at least draw your attention to some pungent undertones of misogyny and even colorism (6:48 specifically here). Who are you, or anyone but the artist, to say that the original sprite was intended to be more conforming with euro-centric beauty ideals. And to say it looks less "feminine" is just Ugh. Again, im sure you didnt mean it, because maybe you haven't been exposed to the topic much before. TLDR Plenty of women have features like the ones in the original art, and im sure that it would hurt to see so many people "fix" the art by simply "feminising" those features.
I hate pixel art but it's so cool that so many people can do so different art and different styles with same colors and same size with so much change in art style
Where is that remotely implied? All artforms and levels will have their own unique challenges. What IS being implied here is that minimalistic 8bit/16bit can oftentimes be more limiting in expression. There is no cutting down any art style, and if you're reading that statement, it says more about your own self image and confidence in yourself. I'm sorry if you don't feel like you're an artist, I think you shouldn't feed your self doubt so much
less than a minute into the video i was inspired to pick up pixel art again after a couple years and make my own version of peach... finished it, resumed the video, and a couple minutes later i realize i actually did mine at HALF the resolution of the original. guess i took the lesson to heart lmao. great video, thanks for the inspiration! :)
What I think is getting lost in this discussion is that the NES was still very early in the history of color pixel art, the original SMB was one of the first games on a completely brand-new platform bashed out in a year by a bunch of programmers, not artists. Shiggy and company didn't really have any existing gorgeous 32x32 pixel artwork to draw upon for inspiration either, unlike the VERY obviously Shovel Knight, Shantae, and Cave Story inspired redesigns shown here. It's the same reason Toad is flipping the bird rather than waving or cheering as intended, they didn't have the experience and retrospect we have the benefit of.
Something I also find missing in the discussion here is how much room there is for interpretation with original sprite, while being unmistakably a princess with a puffy dress and long hair. To me that speaks to the fact that the sprite is doing it's job well, not against it. I would be extremely surprised if anyone actually did see that sprite in game and imagined the character to look like the "literal Interpretation" you showed. Regarding the CRT discussion 10:58 would probably be a very good example of looking better on a CRT, because all that detail blending together and making the simpler parts like the sword and face pop just a little bit more. And to be clear, I do like a lot of what's being said here, but I feel these are 3 different approaches and putting them against each other without context doesn't do any of them justice.
Any minecraft builder understand these points so, so well. The higher resolution of a larger build is just so much simpler to get right because the defects are A: less noticeable or B: easier to spot because so many blocks are out of place.
I was a professional pixel artist when I was a teenager and in my early 20’s. Got to work on licensed gba, nds, and cell phone game titles. It’s so fun trying to cram detail in 16x16 or 32x32 pixels.
Unfortunately most of these designs would have to be changed. On a 8x8 grid on the NES, you have max 3 colors. The top of her sprite uses black, orange and red, and the bottom uses white, orange and red. You'd have to consider this when making true NES pixel art
One thing I don't think was mentioned (unless I just missed it!) is that, artistic differences aside, most of the redesigned sprites (including justin_cyr's) aren't possible with the NES constraints as I understand them. It could only have 3 colours in each 8x8 sprite, and the redesigned version uses 4 - sorry, can't have the white in the eyes & crown, or the black on the belt. Someone else also noted that the original sprite uses 7 memory slots, while the redesign needs 8 and would also need more for leg animation (did you notice that the dress and hair/upper face can be reused, and it's just the middle sprites with the mouth and arm that would need to change?). I'd also note that while it undeniably has more appeal, justin_cyr's redesign really doesn't fit with the style of the game or early 80s sprites in general... But both technical points are kind of nitpicky, and the general art advice is great. :)
Pixel art has always interested me. But, that said: It always baffles me when people are selectively lazy. Which, is A LOT more common in the... "less wholesome" part of pixelart. But: I'm sure you've all seen a variant of this. Like, they have tons of models with like, accurate mouth movement to talking, blinking and a whole other lot of impressive feats. And then just... There's like ONE select area where they just... put *zero* effort. And I never got that. They just choose to be utterly worthless at one specific area.
This is totally unrelated but no one seems to have a video or even an article about different perspectives in 2d pixel art games, I've been trying to see what are my options and what are the cons and benefits for, for example, NOT creating a game in topdown, sidescroller, or (I forget what the other one is called) view. Are there other angles you can make a pixel art game in? If anyone has answers I would like to know🙏
