Why The BIG Turbo? | 420kW K-Swapped FWD Time Attack Winner [TECH TOUR]

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This is what the fastest FWD Club Sprint class WTAC car uses to win.
Running 420kW at 20 PSI from 4500 RPM the Elusive Racing Brett Dickie driven DC2R Honda Integra is a FWD monster and the 2018 Club Sprint class winner. The old B series engine has been swapped in favour of a K series. Note we state in the video the car uses a K20 head, but this information was incorrect and Dave Flood from Elusive Racing has informed us the car does run a K24 head. The engine is well modified with Manley connecting rods, Supertech valvetrain components, ported heads and some aftermarket cams. A Borg Warner EFR 9180 takes care of the boost and a Skunk2 Racing inlet manifold helps ensure efficient air flow.
An Emtron KV8 ECU controls the package and 8 x Bosch 1650cc injectors are used to feed it E85 fuel. A MoTeC PDM and C125 dash logger/display round up the electronics package with a 5 speed (not the 4 reported in the video) PPG gearbox helping put the power to the ground.
Andre discusses why such a large turbo is used for this application along with the benefits of a split pulse exhaust manifold along with the benefits of the DBW throttle body underside mounting position on the inlet manifold.
Boost by gear and also wheel speed are also closely monitored to help maintain traction, and considering the result, it obviously was worth the attention.
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Опубликовано:

30 дек 2018

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Комментарии : 84

@hpa101 5 лет назад

Happy New Year team! There will be no shameless plug for our merch store today in this comment. I would normally drop this link in here: shop.hpacademy.com/ But I think today we'll give it a rest and I won't tell you to go get yourself a top quality HPA t-shirt from there at all :) - Taz.

@moelid 2 года назад

I love how descriptive this video is. Rather than the older saying. Running this and running that.

@kevinperryman6041 5 лет назад

Another awesome informative video, love to watch this channel , Happy and Prosperous new year to all at HP Academy!

@FrequencyOfThought 5 лет назад

Some people hate front wheel drive. I find it my passion.

@jayknight139 5 лет назад

Why do u like it better than awd?

@toyotaturbo504 5 лет назад

Fwd is best sir

@jayknight139 5 лет назад

@@toyotaturbo504 my concern is with high horse power applications because it seems like traction is a huge issue. It my dream to modify an oldschool honda but I'm worried that it will just spin the wheels like in the videos I see.

@FrequencyOfThought 5 лет назад

@@jayknight139 AS a technology stand point I don't. I didn't grow up with rear wheel drive cars or all wheel drive cars I grew up and wrenched on front wheel drive cars . You become kind of sentimental towards what most would call wrong wheel drive. When a Wrong wheel drive car beats a awd car or even a rear wheel drive v8 there is nothing that produces more laughter. If you're beating a v8 car rear wheel drive on the strip you know damn well he would never stand a chance in the top end they would get roasted... Why because traction. And weight distribution on launch always goes towards the rwd car.

@jayknight139 5 лет назад

@@FrequencyOfThought ok I see what u mean. There are advantages to each one but clearly there are very competitive fwd cars so maybe my concern is misplaced.

@nzpork1 5 лет назад

Very comprehensive video. Thanks once again.

@AlexButler10 5 лет назад

Awesome, just when I thought content was finished for the night 👌😊

@hpa101 5 лет назад

Glad we could catch you in time Alex! Enjoy and happy New Year to you from HPA :) - Taz.

@Thelirshin 5 лет назад

Love this channel guys please don't ever stop doing it

@hpa101 5 лет назад

Thanks Cesar! We're hoping to be able to do more rather than less this year ;) Enjoy :) - Taz.

@DimiGem 5 лет назад

Absolutely beautiful build❤️! Very smart and clean.

@FrequencyOfThought 5 лет назад

I like the valve covers breather lines -10 AN , they aint playing lol

@toyotaturbo504 5 лет назад

Amazing what a beast!! Happy new year sir have a good 1

@beany1987 5 лет назад

420kw or 563 bhp video title its 420hp to much bubbly at new year for hp academy i think lol

@TurboVisBits 5 лет назад

560hp is 420kw.

@beany1987 5 лет назад

TurboVisBits 560 or 563 does it matter point was the titles wrong

@hpa101 5 лет назад

haha good spotting! I have fixed that now and will get back to the bubbly :) - Taz.

@wrapzoo295 5 лет назад

The driver is gotta be the #2 most important thing not just having the power but being able to man handle those corners and putting it down to the track...but I didnt see any spinning, so I'm thoroughly impressed. Borg Warner is the best turbo in the world that also helps alot. I have owed many brands of turbo myself and let's just say a journal bearing china brand does not compare to a large BB Borg Warner with all that technology 20psi with stand alone ECU is probly insane. Omfg gear change egnition cut so no turbo lag jeez you guys though of everything.AMAZING. What's this cars quarter mile time around 10-11 seconds?

@jdcustomz 8 месяцев назад

Lol, GhostGun advert. Love it!. 3D print your 2nd Amendment Right. I had to let that commercial play out. Worth it!.

@Teglove 5 лет назад

Man does that look difficult, hes not even in boost half the time. I give them all the credit in the world. Amazing engine layout

@QuietMikeW 5 лет назад

I have a question about staged injection, when the first set of injectors is nearing their full duty and the computer switches to using both sets of injectors, does the first set of injectors maintain its full duty while the second set adds additional, or do they both go to splitting the load even duty for each- and does it matter?

@uncledave3584 5 лет назад

We run both sets 95% of the time in this setup

@aiGeis 5 лет назад

I wish I could ask this to Andre; although I've heard many others say that small turbos will supply too much low end torque thus giving wheelspin when exiting corners, I've heard a good counter argument being that small turbos offer more predictable throttle response whereas large turbos can act as a "light switch" overpowering the wheels by extremely sharp increases in torque. I'm not saying that is the case with the car here, as the 9180+twin scroll on a k24 undoubtedly gives good responsiveness. Another argument I've seen for smaller turbos is the more progressive change in torque puts less stress on axles, differentials, trannys, etc. thus giving longer longevity.

@toyotaturbo504 5 лет назад

I actually feel the laggier/higher rpm turbo is best to smaller ones that make bags of torque down low, as larger turbines like this one can b remapped very clean and smooth, almost like a supercharger type feel to it once past a boost thresholds

@hks071 5 лет назад

I switch from a bigger turbo to a smaller turbo on a fwd, i can tell you the smaller turbo gives more power down low, i broke my driveshafts after a week, wasnt even launching. Big turbo makes the lower end of the revv more manageable which i agree with.

@Westkhost 5 лет назад

I run a rather small Borg Warner EFR 6258 coupled to one of the smallest ecoboosts (1.6) in a Fusion (2nd Gen)/Mondeo(for those not in the states) and I can speak to the wheelspin. I constantly tried to modulate the throttle and would do what I could to throw out a ton of exhaust in 1st and 2nd, 90-100% wastegate duty cycle if I recall but it was the factory BW, which was absolutely a great product but ended up going with a 2 port WG actuator and that was the cockford ollie right there. Much more control and tuning became slightly less nightmarish. Full disclosure, I've tuned 3 cars, 2 still run, only 1 of the 2 is mine. I killed a legacy GT learning to tune but hey, gotta start somewhere.. unfortunately my start ended in saying farewell to what was easily my favorite car owned to date. Small turbos can deliver power if dialed in properly, the 6258 is happy to push 25 psi, it's the management of that pressure that is paramount in my opinion. You can have 30 psi off the bat but given the weight shift to the rear off the line, you know its simply not going to work, limit the boost through 1st and 2nd, maybe 3rd if it's a monster but not once have a needed to wrestle past that. Again, I'm not exactly breaking records nor am a pro by any means but people need to share knowledge because I stayed away from cars for the majority of my life due to the "oh you don't know what the flux capacitor is? Pshhh. Idiot" mentality. Now I know enough to go 88 mph to make the magic happen. Hahaha but you get the point be inclusive, share the wealth and bring the next generation up with us even if that's someone an awful lot closer to 30 than 20.. or 25 for that matter. Hope that helps. I'll just leave the soap box where I found it for someone else now.

@FukU2222 5 лет назад

EFR 9174 + 13b = good tiemz

@hendrahendra 5 лет назад

Waiting for that hur durrr comment 'ITs a FwD dOeSnT nEeD a ReAr WiNg.'

@TimZ007 5 лет назад

Driving starts at <a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="551">9:11</a>

@Pastechi 5 лет назад

not that much of a fan of fwd but that build is beautifull

@MrFlashRoc 5 лет назад

Is there a traction control strategy on this car ? Seems like it's backing off power to limit wheel spin. Mega car tho! Would love to see it in action.

@luisrod106 5 лет назад

MrFlashRoc curious as well

@uncledave3584 5 лет назад

Yes Traction Control is very much used we had 0 testing time before the event and its still in the early stages of development,EMtron works very closely with our team and we will be testing the car again before it runs at SA Time Attack in Feb.

@MrFlashRoc 5 лет назад

Uncle Dave thanks for that.

@alfboxwm 5 лет назад

Hello. CR 9.<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="1">0:1</a> isn't too low for E85 @20 PSI? WMI isn't used?

@toyotaturbo504 5 лет назад

No problems with that, im gnna b running E85 on 8:01 engine

@alfboxwm 5 лет назад

@@toyotaturbo504 which kind of toyota you building? I'm just trying to understand which CR is best for my 3S-GTE engine tunning on pump gas @ 30psi boost. Want to try something like 9.0:1. Just wondering why so custom engine has only 9.0 CR. Why not more with E85 and big turbo? BTW at the end of the video mentioned that car is only 2 days after built. What is the target boost? Thanks,

@toyotaturbo504 5 лет назад

@@alfboxwm im using toyota starlet Ep91 shell @ moment, utilising the engine & transmissiom from a glanza! 4efte 1332cc cylinder!! Running a dogbox, Garret 3071 turbo!! Fully built engine, wossner pistons & scat conrods, also fitted billet main caps this year, along with coil on plug Well lower compression usually means u can feed in more boost, even tho fuels like E85 will help again , u do see ppl running more compression on engines with E85, but a lower choice wont make any less power i dont think

@alfboxwm 5 лет назад

@@toyotaturbo504 Very cool. Interesting project. Quite a big turbo for this engine. I know some people that built some custom 4efte & 5efte's in lightweight 4wd bodies like tercel, old corolla (total weight about 800kg) but with lot smaller turbos. Thanks for your reply :) Could you please provide a link to your project? Interesting to read.

@toyotaturbo504 5 лет назад

@@alfboxwm hi sir no online build thread of my car or setup sorry, if add me on FB or wherever i can send many pictures and information with it as it progressed.

@GetUpFalcon 5 лет назад

4 speed H-pattern? How interesting. So much torque I guess.

@luisrod106 5 лет назад

GetUpFalcon that’s cause it has a 5th gear cuff

@hpa101 5 лет назад

We were given the wrong information there sorry, it is a 5 speed gearbox not 4 speed - Taz.

@TheBigRed. 2 года назад

I thought he was running the k24 head as well a complete k24???

@hpa101 2 года назад

Could well be now, this was the information we had for this build at the time of filming though, noting the release date - Taz

@sexyfacenation 5 лет назад

<a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="450">7:30</a> you said steady state. But I know you know I know you meant solid state. If it was me I would never make a mistak

@hpa101 5 лет назад

Yes this is a slip of the tongue Andre struggles with as he says steady state numerous times a week during live lessons so his brain just defaults to it. He 100% means solid state :) - Taz.

@BeamRider100 5 лет назад

He said that in another video. I'll give him 99 out of 100 for presentation skills.

@t1bud42 5 лет назад

Does he have a TelePrompTer? The way he talks so fast in every video is actually amazing.

@christianraschella3069 5 лет назад

*mistake

@howardroark3895 5 лет назад

could anyone point me to a video or thread about the reason for a k20 head on k24?

@howardroark3895 5 лет назад

@Sean Price thanks for that info, does having a k20 head allow you to use any k24 block and achieve higher red line?

@hpa101 5 лет назад

Hey there Howard, we had the wrong information here and this car runs a K24 head and block sorry. The K20 head swap is popular though - Taz.

@turnip5465 4 года назад

K20 have better higher flowing castings that have more meat to port out, not to mention that some K24s come without vtec or with a wonky head such as the K24z7 with the integrated exhaust manifold.

@ramonji15 5 лет назад

Lizard at <a href="#" class="seekto" data-time="594">9:54</a>.

@sexyfacenation 5 лет назад

No co drivers allowed. This is cheating!

@toyotaturbo504 5 лет назад

Fuk he probs didnt even know that wee beast had crawled in

@kbnguy 5 лет назад

That's not a lizard... He dropped a bottle cap and it's rolling around since

@gordowg1wg145 5 лет назад

Happy New Year from the winterless north to the summerless south ;-) There is a new Binky episode out, BTW - ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-z0pNV_FPH10.html

@kemalkeza6795 5 лет назад

what happened to the Civic dammit

@DeathOrGloryRacingBC 5 лет назад

Wouldn't it be more sensible to just short shift whenever you expect low traction? (hairpins, low speed corners where you're getting on the throttle early) That way you still have the option of having a more responsive turbo by staying in the lower gear or short shifting when you're traction limited. You could run boost by gear too and just limit the lower gears that are traction limited - which is probably until you get out of 4th with a FWD haha. I don't like designing a 'mechanical limiter' to suit driving styles, especially one that likely doesn't improve the potential lap time of the car itself (though it may make it easier to run a fast lap for the owner). With electronic boost control methods at least you can change it at any time. Besides, it looks like he's still struggling to put the power down with this setup. FWD is a tough nut to crack, but I don't think this is the best solution to find grip with higher power. I'm intrigued though since the 'threshold theory' could apply to awd setup. I short shifted in my STi when I was learning awd on track because it's a bitch to get in boost while 'locking in' to a big throttle induced understeer moment. Yes, over ambitious at times... all I wanted was a little oversteer! Like Andre mentioned a simple lift doesn't necessarily drop the power down a whole lot immediately. I could go WOT in 3rd with full traction instead of part throttle in 2nd. One benefit to short shifting this way is you end up on the throttle for a longer amount of time since you can get on it earlier without compromising traction and potentially might need one less gear change on the straightaway since you're already in a higher gear. It can be more consistent too which is helpful for road racing or trying to keep your tires around a little longer ;)

@jayknight139 5 лет назад

I feel like they could have done better with the cooling system but maybe it was a weight issue.

@wackomanx 5 лет назад

That turbocharger was chose to keep wheelspin down? 560 HP+ from 4500 RPM sounds like more that enough HP to spin the tires. At the end, that bad boy is fighting wheel spin in 3rd and 4th gear. I think the real hero here is the traction control keeping it from lighting up the tires. I've always loved FWD time attack. I bet the arm pump get's serious in a FWD.

@ngt84 5 лет назад

8x1650cc for 600hp ? Overkill

@anonchannel1058 5 лет назад

Would be running race fuel if not e85 so needs alot more volume than 98RON. The 1650s were likely chosen because it keeps them at a lower duty cycle and they have a good spray pattern. They also don't flow 1650 unless you run them at over 3 bar of fuel pressure, so that makes these more like 1400 If you think about it that way it makes alot more sense, your car's producing 83hp per litre of fuel, this car produces 50hp per litre of fuel, add 30% for e85, maybe even more for race fuel and you get what would be 68hp per litre if running 98. Combine that with the advantages of running a modern injector and running a lower duty cycle, it works out nicely.