Why You Have A Skill Issue Helldivers 2 Experience Podcast 

On the TeamPlay topic, the 'meta' usage of Supply Pack comes into play as well, when you're told that the optimal Supply Pack usage is for self resourcing it change the way you look at it, the times I do resupply other teammates is when they outright state they need supplies through either mic or chat, any other situation I just self reload

9:35 and onward Pipz with a great point on playing a difficulty that’s comfortable rather than playing for ego. While I love to play helldive when I get a full squad of friends, I’ll regularly chill in 6 or 7 diff depending on how I’m feeling/if I’m tired. People need to learn when to sweat and when to chill. I really appreciate how Pipz put this without it sounding condescending or patronizing. Love these podcasts Thicc. Appreciate you for facilitating a comfortable environment to have a discussion.

I came from Darktide, and that game really encourages teamplay by being a linear gaming experience. When everyone focuses on the same objective, teamplay just naturally happens. Since helldivers is an "open world", I notice tons of people running off on their own, dying, and then rage quitting. If people would just use BASIC cooperation like tagging targets and sticking near their teammates, even helldive becomes laughably easy. When you have four people all throwing strats at a problem, there is NOTHING in the game that will survive it. I also notice tons of people just running primaries that do not compliment their support weapon. It pains me to see Helldivers running something like the quasar with the incediary breaker for example. With how many medium enemies spawn on the map now, you NEED something to deal with medium armor. If you have an anti-tank support weapon and bring something like the ibreaker, you will really struggle with hiveguards, brood commanders, bilespewers, and devastators. If you then do not bring strats which cover that weakness to medium armor, you WILL get overwhelmed eventually, especially if you are off on your own. Plan your loadouts well and stick to your team and a lot of these "skill issues" disappear.

I think a lot of people would complain a lot less if there was just more accurate and indepth weapon info in game, some sort of bestiary of enemies with some stats, and a training room. Just to summon up enemies to shoot em a bit, let em see what the weakpoints are.

Comment for the algo Like this comment if you think the regular diligence should get a silencer to make it stand out from the DCS

My one critique. A lot of the "skill issue" is requiring Warbonds to overcome. Just use incendiary breaker, use stun grenades, use grenade pistol. Those are premium paid weapons. Those 3 weapons are in separate $10 Warbonds

- Raingun should stun both chargers like before and stagger/interrupt Titans with +80% charge for example - we should be able to 1 shot any of the chargers/behemoths legs with Anti-tank. So the game could spawn more of them. It always feels more fun to kill high value targets than trash mob. These 2 changes would make playing vs bugs feels more interesting to play with different support weapons, rather then using only the Flame Thrower that kills any charger in 3s. The other options takes far too long to be interesting to use anymore.

Gonna make a wild guess that the "skill issue" is that most of the players got lives and livelyhoods outside of the game...

Gunship fabs are the best pro teamwork objective in the game. Trivialized by going “hey you shoot the gunship spawns while I plant a hellbomb,” absolute nightmare when your team fumbles it one at a time and death spirals w.o support weapons. Bug secondaries would be better for team work if you couldn’t just rocket them from across the map or drive by 500 them

I think that the real issue, is the removal of the fun part, for just difficulty without much meaning. Example, I was doing difficulty 7 and 8, on both Automatons and Terminids fronts, but since the latest balance patch, I feel like even difficulty 6 is annoying as hell with constant patrol and drop spawn… It's to a point where engaging enemies is such a bad thing to do, that we would have to constantly flee, if only other random players weren't generally quite the trigger happy … The game don't give us tools to solve this. Either give us: 1. Give us the means to do a full stealth play 2. Give us the means to eliminate all these patrols and drops 3. Give us mechanics which would allow us to remove/reduce patrols and drops. 0.5s to take down a hidden Automaton or Terminid isn't nearly enough to do that consistently. A few days ago, I had to do the whole mission (level 6) alone because my random teammates where dying in a loop of constant drop ships… And I couldn't make them move away, nor stop this hell for them. At the end, I couldn't extract and was kicked by the owner of the party because I failed to extract with the samples (the whole map was on me). Forgetting that I was the one to finish the whole damn mission all alone with one of them spawning a few minutes every so often, before dying again… 😒 I don't think that the issue is a skill one. Don't complain about the players when the game is constantly doing everything to make them play this way. Complain about the game teaching them wrong.

I think the stronger boosters are in general, the more group play is encouraged.

The issue with Charger Behemoths on day one, was the fact that they were spawning like crazy. They mentioned they wanted a more varied loadout, with fewer heavies, and the spawn rate for heavies was the same, with 4 out of 5 being Charger Behemoths.

Didn’t know the enemy had vats

There was a time I played on lvl 5 bugs S&D, and we couldn't get to the nests because we were getting pushed back. Once one of us pointed out we were going the wrong way, we looped around and barely made OBJ. On the way to extract 1 BT spawned and killed my friend with our only AT. Once he came back, all I heard was him say "THERE'S 4 AND A MASSIVE SWARM". One of us died to call extract, I was hiding behind a small rock and was watching the timer. Once I saw it hit 5 sec, I bolted and only stimmed through them. My friend put it best. "It was like trying to push to the front of the line on Black Friday."

Love the podcast guys. Great insights as always. My comment is for the stagger portion of the discussion and I would like to add that stagger against the bots feels amazing. The very first time I switched from scorcher to Jar and I could make devistators flinch it allowed me to play more aggressive and it felt awesome. I play lots of weapons against the bots for fun but I love being able to bring crowd control and hard cc to the battlefield as a tool. It can be invaluable.

Is there a list to sign up for these podcasts Thicc?

The actual problem is lack of telegraphing. The problem with charger behemoths is that one-shotting a charger in the head with an EAT was a fun gameplay loop. Adding a charger that that doesn’t work on kills that fun gameplay loop. What adds to that problem is that Behemoths are not easy to distinguish from normal chargers. Sure, pro players can do it, and observant people will probably figure it out, but casuals or someone like me who mostly plays bots and drops into a dark bug mission are not going to know if the EAT to the head will work. And if we don’t know if it will work. There is no info in game so anyone who is not looking for how-tos outside of the game is at a severe disadvantage. Fixing the fun could be as simple as making the Behemoths look different enough to tell them apart at a glance. Though sprinkling the behemoths among normal chargers could be fun for some difficulties. There is a really simple fix for this. Have both chargers and behemoth

Today’s gamer has been spoon fed by triple A games for far too long. Those games that require no skill to shoot a weapon that gave huge hit boxes that made you feel like you were an elite gamer. You didn’t necessarily need to shoot the head spot on as each shot towards the neck or shoulder will be counted as a headshot. Those games just ruined your gaming experience while not offering any sort of tactical skill or strategies involved. No brainstorming, none of that. Everyone blames the weapon while not blaming themselves. You can literally not die if you know the bugs and bots mechanics and kept your situational awareness on 100%.

On a separate note for the Charger Behemoths, the axe thrower REALLY struggles to kill those guys and it makes me so sad cause I really do love the gun.

23:00 That video you should have been from Cassius (I might have written it wrong).

a lot of times i go on solo trips even when playing with others because i rock the scout armor and try to play stealthy. the danger doesn’t come from enemies, but other players giving away my position and getting drops called in. sometimes it’s way easier to do an objective like a generator solo. it’s the easiest way for me to carry randoms in higher difficulty.

Would love to see you guys make a segment on your ideal loadouts and armor for all 4 players on various mission types for both bots and bugs. Everyone talks about individual loadouts, but I haven't seen anything for an entire fire team.

Also there is definitely a tip that states that if you shoot at bots their aim worsens. They may have removed it post recent patch, but it did exist and I’ve seen it many times. It has nvr been true as far as I can tell, unless you’re using the punisher plasma 😂 or a cannon that staggers them.

Idea for team reloading: let the player with the weapon have a couple of rounds in their inventory so the reloader leaving doesn’t stop them from being able to do any thing.

I do agree so much that lvl 9 difficulty needs to be so hard you fail missions. It is not hard enough. It should NOT be possible to solo helldive difficulty - Or at least nearly impossible. I want to feel like, “how the hell am I going to survive this shit!?” I hope they get there one day.

I love the Arc with both Bots and Bugs. Yes, this includes helldive difficulty too. Was way better when it staggered hulks but not broken. If you didn't have consistent hits on the hulk you would get lit up. So you were REALLY vulnerable to flank attacks. I don't run it solo much, though. It struggles a bit when we have Randos on the team, but with a well-jelled team, it puts in work. I run it with InBreaker on bugs and punisher plamsa on bots. Have the grenade pistol as secondary and impact grenade. The arc just requires playing the game differently, paying attention to the battlefield positions of your enemies and allies, and prioritizing targets.

This podcast is great dude! It’s fun to see an intelligent discussion about the game instead of just angry Reddit people (cough cough “Ohdough” cough cough)

I hope they make helldive harder soon. Good points all round.

Team reloads shouldn't require the second person to have the backpack. More people would be the loader if it didn't require them to spend the whole match as a pack mule. It may be effective but after the first time its really just a novelty.

Once i did level 7 solo it's chill then when i go level 4 it's chaos😂 At the end of the day it's just a game, something to play to unwind after work

Can I listen to this on a podcast app? I can’t seem to find it on Spotify or Apple.

Can someone post the link to Clay’s feedback doc?

Ultimate teamwork. Person with the big support weapon wearing the personal shield, person with the ammo backpack doing reloads, third person with supply backpack, possible fourth for active chaff clear.

For samples I've seen 2 and 3 on level 6 on different drops, and on 7 I've seen 3 and 4 total. It can be either I guess.

Hey, great podcast guys. On the pummeler nerf: For me it just feels immersion breaking when a single smg-caliber bullet can stun a medium-sized enemy. I get that it is a sci-fi setting and almost anything could be described with two words - "future technology" but from a game design standpoint it's just mechanically inconsistent. If a Liberator Concussive with bigger rifle caliber bullet that has more of this stun thingy cannot do the same better why would Pummeler can? And on the team-reload thing: They could do that if you mark the enemy while team reloading, shot's gonna deal more damage to that enemy. Like you are highlighting a weak point for a shooter.

I haven't been playing the game for super long - i'm level 28 right now lol. I honestly do things I feel comfortable with, right now I do a rank until I die once or twice a mission then I look to jump the rank up. Then I get my ass dominated until I learn the new enemy types and how to kill them. Either way the game is still fun as hell to play for me, just gotta find your play style and build from there.

It's good to see content creators not giving to the trend to make the game in high difficulty a walk in the park. High difficulty missions should be hard. So they mean something

I did use the arc thrower when it staggered the hulks. It was great chaining the arc and staggering all the bots. Just stopping them from shooting me was well worth it for utility, even withcthe damage being little.

Thank you for setting this up guys. I've followed you all individually and didn't realize you all worked together on this stuff lol Keep it up! Great work

I think AH and the fans need to make concessions on both parts to make the game the best it can be. AH has their vision for the game; which is good, look how fun the gameplay loop is. But, the players have invested WAY more time into the game and know how the game FEELS. There should be an honest discourse between the two groups to maximize.

No, they need to split and run. You are not supposed to hold down the automaton base after the objective is complete. You are supposed to move on. If you get bogged down you need to work on your timing so the bigger bases that needs more time to bomb or do an objective on doesn't drop more automatons on an already harder base because if you got the drop on the easy spot you are already gone

I would not mind the less stratagem or scatter if it was tied to an objective. Take out a jammer get your stratagem back.

Sorry, but Thiccs' perspective of difficulty isn't the majority view of the playerbase. He is in the camp of pro players with perfect game knowledge, hundreds and hundreds of hours of playtime. I think many players dont like the extreme ragdoll chaos where bugs constantly surrounds and the armored enemies have inlogical weakspots and stalkers oneshot from behind. Many people want more of a power fantasy and less forced meta loadouts. He is ofc entitled to his opinion, but its not the opinion of many players. Neither opinion is wrong per se, but I find his lack of understanding for people experience annoying. Many of us cant play the game like its a job and dont have pro gamer friends to play with. Hearing him laughing and saying "helldive is easy" is infuriating. There are thousands of people on Reddit who finds the game to be difficult in a bad way even below helldive, and before you say anything realise this: if the gamers dedicated enough to use reddit thinks this, imagine what the majority of players think (most gamers dont touch gaming media). I want helldive difficulty to extremely hard and possibly even harder than it currently is. The problem currently is that patrols and reinforcements even at 5-7 can be extreme and relentless. Personally, i want to be able to breath between fights and not having to flee every objective. Before the spawn and patrols were changed I played mostly at 7, but at times on 4 to relax. I think this podcast needs someone who isn't deep into the "the game is so easy"-camp.

The problem is the game does not prepare you to for the higher levels. The jump from 3 to 4 is huge. Meduim does not get you ready for chargers or hulks in the natural game. The missions where you fight them on meduim they don't really engage the player they are way easier then fighting them on 4 and higher. You go from 2 secondary objectives to 6 on medium. In the bot side you know have jammers and heavy bases.

Arc Thrower w/ shield backpack used to be a great build on bots, so long as you had at least one person with AC or anti-tank to complement you.

I think people soloing are just playing on another level than their friends. They are probably trying to do all the optionals and want extra samples

I feel Like if a Heavy devestator or mg raider can cc-lock u from the First Shot and have u in a endless Ragdolling combo we should at least be able to stun then with First pummeler Shot for Balance reasons. That would make it bit more even, but rather fix it so Laser Fire Doesnt ragdoll u as much as it does now or Not at all would be Great.. Also Like Ur suggestions on flinching and stagger with armor, just Like to add to that maybe make Heavy armor baseline for standing back up After ragdoll and make them get up faster as u Go loser in armor Rating

We got buffed with the enemies, getting buffed

I stopped using the arc thrower when Shreakers showed up. Since i didn't know how to kill them, and lighting wasn't it Now i don't always play with poeple, so its hard to control the chargers, i never think to use it The arc blitzer is a fun weapon, however

Pummeled used to stun Hulks if you can do it from the heatsink

Nerfing stuns and crowd control is anti-coop design. They need to be less afraid of certain tactics being powerful- Dark Souls has weapons that can be used to cheese enemies and many players take pride in not using them. But the Remove buff mentality is what drove a lot of people away from the game. You can add new enemies or something at higher levels to counter some strategies but changing how the game itself works by destroying functional weapons just creates confusion and takes fun away from players that have already been using weapons. This much tweaking is representative of an early access game, not a properly released game. The weapons should have been decently balanced at launch and major mechanics at least plotted out if not fully implemented. Edit: they can flinch us but we cannot flinch them is a very good way of phrasing it. For bots, flinching and the suppression system made teamwork possible back when weapons sucked because I could create an opening for pinned down allies. Now it feels like the options are “get headshot”, or “ragdoll until death”. I’ve lost that sense of tactical movement that made bots so much fun. Theres no point to using micro terrain as cover anymore because it does not work. As for bugs, simply being able to slow them down would feel so freaking good. That would give allies time to shoot the enemies mobbing the player or just open up new strategies… imagine if crippling bile titans so they could not outrun allies was a viable option. Perhaps they could add effects to primary weapons to make them feel like more than backup weapons.

They nerfed Slugger the day after I bought it. I was pisssssed.

Wait how can you tell if it's a gunship or scout strider map??

23:05 G1beon Games I think.

Having team realidad medal rewards would be good. They are not mandatory and low commitment. Have it be 80 medals haha

Still waiting for the Thicc and OhDough collab, yall the 2 best hd2 content creators on RU-vid rn 🙏

So I play on challenging primary for a relaxed fun experience and I thought people were being winey when they were saying the difficulty was too hard. And either the devs stealth adjusted this or I adjusted my playstyle enough but difficulty was ramped up with this patch. I went from being able to solo challenging to having difficulty with Randoms. Idk if it was an increase to enemy in patrols or in spawning but suddenly I was having to bug out instead of fighting on challenging. I'm not a pro but I can usually hold my own if I'm paying attention to mission and load out.

This is so good and so amazing. If I catch you live I'm going to toss some cash yourway

Kinda sad elding got a new dlc and apparently alot of bosses are stronger than malania yeah nah im good

Literally the only issue I have with the game is Eradicate missions. They're way too small and not fun at all.

OhDough needs to see this

16:00 - Sorry, but this whole argument about using the right tool is broken when you bring the usage of stun grenade or pummeler in this argument… They aren't available from day one AND this highly depend of which warbond was unlocked by the player. I believe that the only warbond which should be considered as standard equipment should be the first one. Anything else shouldn't be considered as available to accomplish a mission, limiting greatly the options available to players.

Please get ohDough on the next podcast. You guys are doing awesome keep it up 👍🏻

Oh look its ThiccSkillissues man live with another stream! :D

Let’s get ohdough on here

Yes I have a SKILL ISSUE and I admit it

I missed the freaking stream with clay! I hate myself

Prettymuch anyone can beat helldive in teamplay unless your in a team that works against itself or is composed of videogame journalist. Id argue solo helldive is easier than playing with the average team as the main thing that kills me is friendly fire followed by automaton rockets. My main issue with the difficulties is that you pretty much HAVE to play helldive to get a enemy density that feels good. Seriusly i never really get the feeling that i have to use a strategem in level 7 on bugs and the only offensive strategems i use against bots are stuff to deal with tanks and structures even on lvl 9.

People are bad at the game because they dont stay together and communicate

Ngl the lag kinda messed up this one for me 🥺😢

behemoths aren’t that bad just a little tankier if it was the same as a normal charger it would be boring they don’t take much to take out the hunters and stalkers however can rot in hell 😂

Pve games shouldn't have head shots on players and I'm fairly sure they don't generally

Run n gun bois

The phrase "skill issue" is so cringe now. It's the battle cry of insecure low test beta males to refute any criticism/feedback about the game.

Flamethrower + blitzer + 500kg meta

So you want the enemies to not be rewarded by shooting you in the head but you want to be rewarded for shooting your enemies in the head?… 🤔

Tbh when i first started out i had more trouble against the bugs rather than the bots. I now prefer playing against the bots and dont really like playing the bugs as much

Yeah, one charger isn't a threat if you know how to kill it (some players don't, especially the Behemoths that you can't headshot). But right now on 6+ there is never just one charger (not sure about lower difficulties). Two chargers can be a threat if they are synced up weird so they're constantly blocking each other (or not giving you time to reload). Any number of chargers + Hunters = Just the worst experience. The Hunters will stagger or acid you at some point or prevent you from going for the Charger kill. You can't afford to stop moving but you need to stop moving to reload most of the anti-charger weapons. This is why the Flamethrower is so good right now. Kills chargers, keeps you mobile, handles everything except Bile Titans on the bug front fairly well. Pair with something to handle stalkers like the Arc Blitzer and you're golden.

For team reloading I bet if a poll was done most if not the majority would say they don't do it due to the backpack needing to be on them and that's the primary reason... SO changing so this isn't a requirement and the current version stays HOWEVER a second version is added where a reloader can use the other persons backpack yet this reload is 50% slower than the full team reload so it's still a shit ton faster than solo reloading yet they can avoid the annoying swapping. So one mission type they could add to go with what tends to happen a lot with good players 2 stacks doing the mission... have an objective that requires everyone to press a button within a few seconds of each other however space it close enough so 2 people can do both ends of the presses in case of lacking players. One team goes to raid a SAM sight while the other team goes to lock in the radar station for said SAM sight. 4 buttons total, 2 objective areas with both buttons on each being spaced about 10 meters apart with enough buffer to sprint (with heavy armor) to get the second press in time if need be.

game is and has always been since day 1 very very very inconsistent... this is the only consistent part of this game... I almost exclusively play helldive(9), for basically 2 reasons: 1, is the most fun, 2, in general, comparatively better lobbies.. and no helldive is not difficult, it can be tho, occasionally when game gets too inconsistent or if you have very bad players... but also, I do not think we need a super challenging difficulty, w/out rewards most players would not engage w/ that, so what's the point? the only thing it would accomplish is segregate the player base (even more) and make room for very few folks to "flex" and maybe some content creators "content"... that "can't stand up bug" has been in the game since forever, the difference now is the AI is more aggressive and some enemies hitboxes seem a bit different now... been saying this for literally since launch week, them devs treat this game like a PvP game, obliviously when it comes to balancing, but no so obvious, some mechanics design... head shots on players in this game make literally no sense, EVEN IF they think one shot mechanics should be in the game, it just makes for a more complex gameplay to program/code for literally no benefits... you can make friend, I've been making new ones to this day... and this game is more fun w/ co-op, regardless of being friends or randos, but also I would be very weary on how to "incentivize" co-op... a perfect example low incentive is the team-reload mechanic, is very restrictive gameplay wise and offer low benefits comparatively... but also forcing players to cooperate would feel bad if not worse... there are ways to incentivize w/out forcing, but I'm not sure arrowhead "gets" how (since is not in the game) even if they wanted to do it... players should feel a tangible benefit when cooperating, but do not feel penalized when not... much like communication works right now, for folks actually communicating in any shape or form there are tangible benefits, but also the game is completely playable w/out communicating at all... (just to be clear, I rather folks communicate like I do myself, but also believe forcing that in any way would exclude a lot of people, and we need more people not less)

on the whole teamplay things mics aren't standard on pc but on ps5 they are so toxicity is more prevlant just because mics are open more often (ps5 isn't inherently more toxic) , alot of people have been burned or ripped apart for no reason by another person for death spiraling or under-performing or doing weird sht and so they just give up on the whole teamplay thing. it boils down to not wanting to bother or be bothered when they play solo which kinda just ruins the game, it turns it into a depressing version of odst where you got left behind completely. pirate software has a good short about dawngate's voting system where for essentially being nice you get double the xp for that game. granted it's not perfect but something like a few extra super credits or medal never hurts especially after a good game. the problem is just it takes awhile, those people weren't burned in one night and they aren't going come back overnight amd there are any number of reasons people want to play solo. These episodes are great btw even if it feels like alot is left unsaid. it's sad alot of interactions in his game are just another issue in a mountain of issues and i don't think this game will move as quickly as people would like with the same quality they expect but one can hope for the best.

Game has been on a downward trend since the first patch. First build of the game was perfect aside from long call in times and certain strategems and weapons underperforming. All they had to do was buff some items. Instead, they broke almost everything and have been scrambling to fix their initial mistakes every patch since, compounding most issues.

The biggest broken mechanic in this game imo is that the war bonds wind up being a lvl progression in terms of weapon acquisition and then we have a dev team that wants to make all weapons equal. You can’t when weapons are tied to a lvl progression. The result is always that the two things just won’t mix. There will always be weapons that are weaker and meant for lower difficulties while others are designed fend to be stronger. You’re going to break late gameplay or overpower beginner play. You can’t tie weapons to a progression system and then nerf powerful weapons. A different system may work better. I don’t know what that may be.

1:04:23 What about extreme cold? Its the only good one because its the only positive one

I wish that devastators and hulk head hitboxes were bigger cuz I’ve had too many times where I swear I was shooting the head like my crosshair was on their head but it didn’t count

Thiccfila by the way some of the small robots actually have homing missiles. If you see their scope turn green they have locked on you

I play on higher difficulty to get more xp, thereby increasing planetary conquest points.

“The game is too easy” *complains about all the stuff in the game that makes it harder*

You gotta let the guest talk. Why ask a question and just interrupt

Spear good against gunships. Insta oneshot

Try mines, and your skill issues will disappear.

I think the proper response to those saying they want the difficulty to be raised on the highest level is: "How are you wanting the difficulty to be raised?" To me, that is a much more interesting conversation versus if it should be raised. Increase patrol rates? Make patrols bigger? Reduce stratagem count (nope... people didn't like that)? More bigs? More chaff? Less time? Enemies have better accuracy? Enemies hit your weak spots more often? I wouldn't mind it being more difficult, as long as the difficulty comes from complexity versus more numbers. To me, the fun of Helldivers derives from problem solving. Give me cross map objectives that require entering in a code from one side into a terminal on the other with a timer until the code resets. Stuff like that. In what way would you like the difficulty increased?

Another small thing that not everyone does and it's also not super visual but just cover your team members, especially while they reload. I often take patriot exo and just gatling around my teammates to keep chaff of their ankles. Another thing that exos make you a dedicated team tank, and with recent patch destroyed mech doesn't kill the driver if you dive straight after ejecting. So just shoot around your teammates. Stick together and shot together. Another thing is from RTS games - focus fire. If two people shoot at 1 enemy, that enemy will die faster than if you both shoot at different enemies, and even tho swarm kill time remains the same, the faster you can kill EACH enemy, the easier the entire encounter gets. Two bots at 50% is still 2 bots shooting at you. 1 bot at 100% is 1 entire bot less.

I will say the game already does support teamplay in a way where if you play alone or without a good group you can't choose what boosters to bring together. But I will also say teamplay is just as important to solo play. Both options should be there but teamplay is definitely good and should be a better way to play harder difficulties. I think a great way to do this is to make a gun that requires two people to shoot. For example, one person aims and the other fires the gun as like a very effective weapon against bugs or bots. Also maybe they could add combos for stratagems and if four people do certain combos it will proc effects that hinder the enemy. For example, they could use some things from Earth Defense Force where one guy drives one guy shoots.

the devs dont playtest their game. they have no idea of the Hunter mayhem, the fps drops on certain planets and the broken enemy mechanics.