Well was it Jean Grey or madelene Pryor all along? The goblin queen herself was here in place of Jean Subscribe and like! #jeangrey #xmen #xmentheanimatedseries #cyclops #xmen97 #goblinqueen #xmen97 #reveal
😯 first link below where your publishing it, I can’t wait to read that! Second, I could see events happening differently, I don’t think Nathan would have been born. Yet again who knows. Episode 5 could be different, cyclops not getting mad at the news reporter and all that I guess
@@natovision1 Tell you what, I’ll give you a small spoiler The clone’s name is Scout Summers, and his relationship with the original Scott Summers is much better than Jean and Madelyn’s The rest, you’ll have to learn it once the fic is out ;)
I LOVE THE NAME! I thought that said Scout and Scott were in a relationship 👀 maybe? Just a thought. If you want to send updates and stuff I have a discord server for marvel and x men things also twitter: @NathanCollect and my discord is also Natovision1 Btw, thanks for that sneak peek!
@@natovision1 Thanks! And no, by relationship I don’t mean *that* kind of relationship I mean that there isn’t that much animosity between the two, and their bond is that of brothers, almost twins
To be fair, Scott just found out that his wife is the clone of the woman he actually thought was his wife. He needed time to process that he just wasn’t going to get.
I feel so bad for Madelyne, no matter is she clone or not, Scott should atleast stand up for her as for mother of his child, that the only certain thing at this point.
You know if you think about it, most of majority of X-Men has clones too. Jean has a clone (Madalyne Pryor) Wolverine has a clone (X-23) Emma Frost have clones (Stepford Cuckoos) Magneto has a clone (Joseph) Cable has a clone (Stryfe) Mister Sinister has many clones (Dr. Stasis, etc.) Hell, even Apocalypse has a clone! (Evan Sabahnur)
I mean, to Scott's credit, he didn't say he would leave her or anything, just they needed to know who the original was. But this would be so hard to unpack in therapy "Sooooo....the woman you love wasn't really the woman you love but she thought she was. Meanwhile the actual woman returns with her mind all messed with. Meanwhile the clone is going through an existential crisis and feelings of betrayal. I'm going to be seeing you all in my office for decades, aren't I?"
@@DesignIncase well then we come to the question of consciousness. From an outside perspective yes they are the exact same. But if I poke one and the other doesn't feel it then internally they are different one is just a very good imitation. For an outsider there's no difference from the inside there's a major difference. If my loved ones carried on without me with a perfect copy who thought it was me and they said "same difference right?" I'd be pissed because no it isn't the same. Everything they did I didn't experience. It then feels you don't care about me as a person, you're happy with someone/something that can imitate me. It isn't me as a person but what I represent in your life you care about which is very existential and troubling. I don't believe in a soul, I believe in consciousness. If a perfect replica and me don't experience things at the same time we aren't the same, we're separate beings
I love Beast more than any other X-Men, but it was so goofy how he was more excited to explain what he discovered than realizing that Jean's entire world was crumbling apart. He just says, "You're fake, you're not the real Jean." "But, but I have all the memories of my life how can this be-" "Well, I don't know but you're definitely the fake Jean."
True but there is also the fact that he doesn't _love_ the clone Jean but the real one. It's a very awkward situation for all those involved with Scott having to deal with the fact he had a son with a clone of the woman he loves.
@@javiervasquez625 Also there’s a possibility that Jean might not even love Scott at all, because it was all Mr.Sinister’s orchestration due to his obsession in creating a powerful mutant, the point why he created a clone at the first place to get the job done. I’d like to point out in the og series that Scott and Jean have been monitored by Essex after they got to the x mansion, just right after prof x first recruited them.
@@javiervasquez625 Not to mention the fact that we don't know when the switch happened. Scott might have only known her for a year or two and, well, the fact that he was basically tricked to be unfaithful is something that will screw with everyone.
Velho é uma situação complexa. Tipo pode fazer anos ou no máximo um ano q ele está dormindo com uma mulher que pode ser ou não aquela com quem ele se casou. Sem falar que elas além de iguais na aparência ao que tudo indica pensam e agem de maneira semelhante. Quem não ficaria confuso nessa situação, tipo ele traiu a esposa ou não ? ele viveu sempre com a clone ou não ? É muito confuso.
@@javiervasquez625but they also stated in the show that they don't know what point sinister swapped them out since they both have the same memories. They don't know if it was the original jean or Madeline who was possessed by the Phoenix for example. So a lot of the things they've been through that strengthened their bond may not have even been with the original Jean.
Storm would have been the one but she wasn't there. Then the rest of them had bad story with experiments, Morp was experiment on by Sinister, Wolverine and Gambit are too emotional constipated to actually try, Hank is Hank, jubilee is too young to care? And Rogue is not really there to care, she's worried about other things. Magneto doesn't care and Scott is conflicted since everything he believed in was a lie.
@@donatellohamato748 Yeah although it makes you wonder who Scott Summers truly loves Jean Grey or Madelyne Pryor? I also agree with you that Storm should have been the one to say something and stand by Madelyne.
Scott Summers given such a huge weight on his shoulders at such a young age, all he wants is a family but people in power always just take it away from him😢
@@1978fergood it’s more about the rest of the team finding out and not Maddy herself, lol. Proper process is for beast to talk to maddy first before he announces it to the rest of her family (in this case, the x-men) and let maddy decide how to break the news to them. Maddy finding out that no one was there to back her up after Beast’s announcement could have been totally avoided
In the previous episode he doesn't just bluntly tell Storm her powerloss is permanent, he hesitates a little before delivering terrible news. Here he's like a robot who doesn't even seem to understand why she's not accepting what he's saying immediately, like her issue is with the science of it :) Admit it folks, bad writing.
I mean imagine being Scott and you sleeping with who you thought was your wife who you met as teens and see her die come back only to find out she is a clone
I really don’t like how they started treating her different the moment they realized who the clone was, but I also like it because it shows how the x men can treat people differently the moment they realize there identity, but also why didn’t beast first ask the group if you would like to know who is the clone and who isn’t or would they rather not ruin their perfect relationship with both the girls
I'd have thought that Storm would probably have thought Madelyne was the clone too, but pondering it over I do think Storm might have been on Maddy's side regarding Maddy having real memories that the other Jean lacked regardless of the ages of their bodies.
Meanwhile, in DC's Young Justice: "Oh, so we have two clones of Red Arrow and the OG is now a one-armed vigilante? SWEET! We got a set of three awesome brothers!"
@@Pelican07.23... Why? It deviates from the whole 'They're an evil clone, we must kill them!' Trope, which I must admit, I do like the deviation. Could've done it here in 97, although those who read the comics knew the clone Jean would become Goblin Queen... No relation to the Green Goblin.
To be fair the situation here is way more complicated than with the Roys. With the Roys they lived very distinctive lives from each other with different personalities as a result making differentiating them simpler. Here Beast had to use carbon dating to even tell the difference and add onto a psychic bond and shared memories Jean and Madelyne have which understandably causes a serious existential crisis.
@@jeffcarroll1990shockWell imagine an alternate reality where Madelyne here actually was the real Jean Grey. What else could you say or do to rebut Beast’s hard science? I can understand her frustration.
@@kingstarscream320 I understand the frustration. Discovering that the clone's frontal lobe was unable to pass a simple logical conundrum must have been really frustrating for Dr. Nathaniel Essex.
Precursory research of the original series suggests that the most ‘optimal’ time that Sinister could’ve made the switch was back when he kidnapped Jean to give to Apocalypse for his endgame plan with all the world’s best psychics. Makes sense since there was a chance that Jean could’ve died and Sinister wanted her and Scott’s kid. So giving Apocalypse the clone that became Madeline makes sense, both to satisfy apocalypse and put her in a potential position to be rescued by the X-Men should Apocalypse’ plan failed. With all that was going on, they wouldn’t think to look for clones. Either it succeeded and Sinister could still salvage Scott, or it failed and the X-Men either rescue Madeline, or Madeline still dies and Sinister still has the original to work with, either Sinister wins This does mean, however, that Scott is married to the original Jean since that was just after their wedding…or would that mean he’s married to both of them? Clones are confusing
To be fair, i am with Madelyne on this one. She was no less Jean Grey than the body on the bed. She fought by their sides... And they just kicked her away like a trash, because she was "not a real Jean". And Cyclops was a special type of douchebag in this whole episode. She just birthed his kid... I can understand confusion, but she just gave birth to their CHILD... I felt really sorry for Madelyne the whole episode.
I'm Team Madelyne 100%. I think that Madelyne is the Jean that contains the mind of the Real Jean Grey but in a cloned body, where as the the other Jean is Jean's Phoenix side which is why Jean's memories are distorted and she feels like they're being remembered from the wrong perspective. I especially found it shocking that Jean yelled at Scott for sharing time psychically with Maddy. Scott and Maddy had to give up their baby, it's natural that they'd support each other but Jean (who just smooched Logan) had no empathy for them. I can empathize with Scott even in the moment in this clip though cause this is an impossibly bizarre situation and wanting to do more tests to figure out what was going on, but none of Maddy's friends were being considerate in this moment when she was feeling like a copy that had less worth. Especially Beast who was like, "You're just a fake Jean Grey, Miss Clone." Beast is my favorite character, but they wrote him to be unkind here.
@@Anonomius0 LoL, what kind of BS is that? She was literally genetically same and her memories were also from the "OG" Jean. She literally is JEAN. The only difference is their experiences since they "diverged". But up until that point, "Madelyne" was, literally, part of Jean. Sure, u may now present some theological remarks about souls and i do not know what else, but that does not change the fact, that everything, beginning with DNA and ending with most of their memories are same. +Main point of my comment was, that everyone kicked Madelyne away like she was a trash. Cyclops, whose child she just birthed, acted everything was Madelyne's fault. She didn't asked to be created. She didn't ask for "real" Jean(as u put it) to be imprisoned by Sinister. Hell, she fought with these guys and would've given her life for her teammates. But most of her comrades, especially Cyclops, didn't stop for even a moment to consider that, did they? Madelyne was a victim just like Jean. Yet Jean got support and Madelyne got suspicion and blame. Doesn't seem fair to me. And the fact that "real Jean" is, as of now, attempting to play both Cyclops and Wolverine, i have to say, i prefer Madelyne. She seems to be loyal, unlike the "real" one.
Guys she was a sleeper agent and when she got questioned she got way too defensive and aggro then walked away rather than stay and be rational being that beast is one the smartest people on the planet and even if someone did tamper with his findings he’d definitely figure it out and talk it out like adults
Beast: Science is turth Jean: Science is lie!! LIES I TELL YOU Freaks out and storms away Beast: It's not me Jean! IT'S SCIENCE!! SCIENCE I TELL YOU!!! OH SCIENCE WHAT HAVE YOU DONE?!
Dude. This minute and a half is better than all the live action movies. Oh yeah. Now that’s the kind of melodrama that put Marvel on the map in the first place.
The clone twist always fucking sucks dude😂 It's such a petty thing to do for the original and the clone usually. Like in Young Justice with Roy Harper(Red Arrow) Or adventure time, with Finn and Fern It always just seems to fuckover either the clone or the original or both
In the comics it was more that they wanted the original class to return, so they had Iceman, Beast, Angel and Cyclops but Marvel Girl was dead and some ditor had a rule that you couldn't bring Jean back without giving a way to excuse the Dark Phoenix
Yes, because she is mental. She literally showed aggression (even in this scene) that the ORIGINAL Jean Grey would have never demonstrated. That's why the writing is sooo good in this clip. No matter how hard something gets, Jean Grey has never had the sass this clone has. Secondly, she is manipulated by Sinister. The reality of it is, she needed to be cutoff.
@@clearstar8354 They could've helped her with Sinister. Also, wouldn't *you* be angry if you were accused of being a clone, even though you've been friends with the people who are accusing you for years? Also shows, how narrow-minded they are.
Not scientifically. Gamma rays are very destructive to genetic material. Also, while you can have a genetic marker in hemoglobin , you can't have hemoglobin in a genetic marker.
@@CelticVictory Gamma energy in the marvel universe is different to how it works in real life, one of its main 'heroes' turns into a raging beast due to gamma radiation, instead of dying from cancer.
But in a alternate universe trying to destroy reality when another clone of Peter Parker was made to replace him and got a carnage symbiote attached to him to go crazy
The craziest Morph transformation in X-Men '97 is whenever he turns into Illyana Rasputin AKA Magik. In the 90s cartoon Illyana is only 12, she's much younger than Jubilee and we only see her as Colossus' little sister. I don't think the 90s cartoon ever showed Illyana's mutant powers. When Morph turns into Magik in episode 3, Morph's version of her has all her powers and looks like a grown woman.
I mean, I don’t think it’s clear if he gave up on her. She was the clone, so not backing her up on not being the clone made sense. The whole thing is a mess lmao. I don’t think Scott did anything wrong under the circumstances
I mean... The conversation is about whether or not she's a clone, not if she's the mother of his child. He doesn't back her up because he also suspects she's a clone. But in spite of that, he's not being hostile to her or denying her access to her child. I don't know what happens later on, but I don't see how he's doing anything wrong here.
Ok and even after she goes coocoo, he goes after her and their son. She tries to kill him and even after that, they fight Sinister together. His reaction, was completely understandable. Who wouldn't be confused after finding out what he did....
Crazy that Storm missed all this drama. By the time she's back with the team, she probably wouldn't realize that the real Jean is back if someone doesn't inform her.
This reminds me again why I never like the Madelyn Pyror character and storyline in the comics. It was unnecessary to introduce her in the series. Was fine with regular Jean Grey in the series. By the way in the comics Cable considers Jean Grey more his mother than the clone.
The storyline was convoluted. She didn't even think she was Jean and then you have Scott abandoning both her and his son. Comics wise, these only reason for Cables preference is because Jean got to raise him. Madelyn did not.
The perfect time for the switch is beyond good and evil part 1, Jean was last in X-Men TAS getting thrown through the portal, every scene afterwards is Madelyne and after she was saved she went back to the mansion and started wearing her hair down, even right before this scene when she searches Jean’s mind she sees all memories from the animated series which stops at the wedding in the same episode she was thrown through the portal. Which explains why Jean is alive after Season 1 of ‘97 while Madelyne isn’t. The phoenix force is only connected to Jean because only Jean was possessed by the Phoenix.
Personally, I would try to ensure the clone wife that I love her because of her and not because of implanted memories (due to my personal belief that differences in the interpretation of memories ultimately make up what the person is on a spiritual and metaphysical level) and then urge her to run some tests due to her nature of a clone. That could have some real consequences on my child's health due to cloning not always being stable. I would then apologize to the original because abandoning the clone would be morally wrong. Hopefully, the original and I could stay friends. I don't want a "Bladerunner" to lead to a family court case. If the clone was "programmed" to love me then I would try to be only strictly friends with both of them due to the violation of free will on the poor clone's part and the absolute mess of a situation I would be in with the original. Pursuing any romance with any of them would be a recipe for disaster.
I kind of hate how cyclops handle this, i mean he should have stayed with the clone, she is the mother of his child and he SHOULD LOVE HER! i know that she is not the "original" but it was not her fault even if she is a clone its still her... i would feel bad for the original and if i was in cyclpops shoes i would probably tell the original that i still love her but i also love the "clone" and sadly she is the one that he married.
The complicated part is that he didn't know she was a clone, he thought she had always been Jean. She had Jean's memories, but she's not the same person. Anyways, they handled him WAY better than the comics. He walked out on Maddie and Nathan as soon as he heard jean was alive. I don't recall if he was even there for Nathan's birth.
How Scott handled this was much better than in the comics, where he outright leaves Madelyn and his son to be with Jean when she comes back from the dead.
LOL, no. He only "loved" the clone, because he thought it was Jean. The entirety of their relationship was sustained by him thinking that was Jean Grey all along. He never loved Madelyn, he loves Jean Grey, and only had a child with Madelyn because he thought he was having a child with Jean Grey. Why would he "stay" with the impersonator he never intended to be with in the first place? 💀. Is not his fault either. If anything, Jean is the one who should be the angriest here, she was the one who had her identity stolen by a random clone.
@@serenitysubs933 no but none of them are part of the team at this point in time. Spoilers: Bishop took Nathan into the future and doesnt have enough energy in his time band to come back right now. Ororo lost her abilities and left. And now madie is gone
Denied all she wants, but reality, she is clone. But my concern clone has a short lifespan, so it is possible that the clone dont have much to live....
@paulkellerman2603 I don't know how long she has left to live....but given date available on clones. It's said clone have short lifespan, and problems with immune system. Yeah clone Jean will face heavy consequences.
When exactly did Jean get switched? Although I get the whole thing about wanting to know the truth thing I still kind of feel bad about how easily they switched up on the clone. Has she actually been fighting alongside them for as long as she thinks or only a limited amount?
Honestly we don't know. You'd think it would be as simple as "The last thing you remember and that's where the switch happened". What I took from Jean and Madelyn's exchange is Jean has memories she shouldn't have so there is this overlap that makes determining a timeline difficult without Sinister straight up telling them when a switch happened.
Ok ok enough! She’s a clone. (Jean Grey) Spidey’ a Clone. Thor had a clone. Thor: I believe it was a “Cyborg Clone.” WHATEVER! And to top it all off Sinister has a gaggle of clones. IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO HAS A CLONE!? Deadpool: I guess I shouldn’t bring up the fact that a fan girl got pieces of me throughout my misadventures across the country bringing to life a Frankenstein clone version of me…
My theory is shortly after Xavier left to go to Shi'ar space Sinister used some secret phrase to Moroh to get him to unknowingly help Sinister abduct Jean and used her powers or Madelyn to alter the memory of everyone on earth to think Xavier died so that there would be no one to interfere in his plan to get Nathan summers
Doesn't seem like manipulation to me, at least at first. Poor woman was just told she isn't real and instead of trying to help her make sense of reality the father of her child immediately drops her in favor of his "original" wife, that would be terrifying for anyone. She's desperate not to be a fake.
@@hiddentiger73 Yeah. It shows how well trained and deep in belief that Madelyne was that she was actually Jean, just as Mr. Sinister had hoped for to be able to infiltrate the X-Men like that. It's just NUTS.
@@thunderbear9418 because she has all of jean’s memories plus her time with Logan where he shared how much she means to him which brought her to tears.
@@MrGabeanator Well Scott and Madelyn Pyror did get together and eventually have Nathan even though Scott didn’t know Madelyn was a clone of Jean yet one thing is still missing like why bother cloning Jean when Sinister could have waited for Scott and Jean to have kids of their own unless Madelyn is even stronger than Jean Grey depending? Also I wonder if Cable knew when his mother was switched out with Jean.
Who knows, maybe what happened to Magneto and Gambit(or at least we think so) really happened to their decoy family? 😂 You know, the way to keep people in suspense 🤣
People are agreeing either when Sinister abducted both Scott and Jean during their honeymoon or when Apocalypse was kidnapping telepaths for some bigger scheme on Season 4.
I actually think it was much more recent like just after xavier left to go to the shi'ar empire he activated somekind of brainwashing in Morph to get him to get Jean alone and Sinister kidnapped her and replaced her with madelyn and afterwords used Jean or Madelyn to alter the memories of evetyone on earth to believe that Xavier was killed @@uncannydcmarvelous5732
I mean I imagine scott's more or less the same, but that depends _entirely_ on when the swap happened. if it happened on like... the day _of_ their wedding? definitely questioning. if it happened like... before the first date? Clone woif all da way
