Paused on the flop: what interesting analysis and conversation. I appreciate the uncertainty. Almost certainly it’s a mixed raise and call spot. But love all the thoughts. Edit at the end: love this call and caller. Made mistakes, had some good thinking too. Critiqued himself a lot, wanted Bart’s thoughts. Felt like he actually learned. I liked listening to his thinking both wrong and right. Great call.
@5:50 After the flop check raise "I feel like I'm going to get continues from a wide variety of hands" @7:51 "So now, once I get continues on the flop, I can probably shrink his range down a good bit" 😉
I've gone through the same mental gymnastics playing against V's I know very well. It's a lot of leveling, with "he might do this, or he could do that", where this and that are total opposites.
Nice video. The caller should keep in mind that the villain can be more capable of bluffing river than population, and still not bluff at a high enough frequency.
Nevermind the bad river bet sizing. H showed mega strength on flop and turn -- enough to fold out anything less than the nut flush draw and flopped sets -- and still got called twice from patient V in position. No way V is continuing the turn with AcKx. V got there by river and isn't worried about even the weakest boat. I believe the KK claim. Good fold on river.
H seriously pushed this hand too hard with low end draw to straight or flush. Too many cards that can come that make him lay down. And it’s heads up, so when his check raise didn’t work, he was in a very bad spot all around.
@@MrJambereeAm I missing something here? He got the lead on the turn and made the villain call a full pot sized bet on the turn for 5-1 odds 9 outer. His only mistake imo is betting the river
I think it is much closer on the river. I expect KK to 3bet flop majority of the time since you want to get money in now vs very strong made hands like sets and good draws. 98s is folding turn for this sizing i would think and also is just 1 combo. Leaves 1 combo of 99, K9s, and 3 combos of 88. I actually like the block bet to induce or get called by Ak with ace of club, but think it's a call on the river especially given history with villain. Now if villain jams a better flush (since we dont have boats with this turn size), that would be pretty sick.
Indeed. Why would anyone want to regularly be in these situations, as the caller says he is- just with this opponent alone. Then he got cute with him and it ended as expected. Bad game selection, bad opponent selection, nonsense play of the hand.
Hero played this hand like an idiot. V just played his hand in a straight-forward way. Hero over-thought it, got too aggro with a sub-par hand, and paid the price.
Kings makes perfect sense... which if he bluffed and wanted to lie, thats the hand to pick... but, tend to think theres a 90% chance he's telling the truth at least.
This is often just silly poker story stuff. I have seen soooooo many players lie about their hand afterward that I wouldn’t even bother to ask. Nothing good comes from asking what he had. It’s all nonsense
I had Kk no reason to lie I am confident that I am balanced enough in this spot with value Jams full houses and quads and ace high flush just call with smaller flushes and jam aces and ace king with 1 club as a bluff so no reason for me to lie I feel that I am balanced the way I played the hand which is why I didn’t 3 bet the flop since I would not have done that with aces or ak
@@joshsheppard21assuming this really was you… KK certainly seems credible including flatting KK on the flop. Do you have any 3 bets on the flop at all?
@@MrJamberee I've caught myself lying about hands to people who weren't even in the game at the time, just so I didn't have to admit how badly I played my hand.
Bart you’re missing a 3rd reason (and imo the best reason in this case) to lead with a blocker bet. If your opponent has a better hand than you, but not so strong of a hand that they can raise a bet with. But by checking, the opponent would bet more. So you’re minimizing your loss in the hand. And I think a lot of villains’s range falls into this category. We’re talking all larger flushes, even the nut flush, and possibly even baby boats like 77 or 79. Those hands facing a $600 river bet are not going to want to raise there, especially with a possible straight flush as well. If you check your hand, these hands will feel comfortable to bet anywhere from half to 2/3 pot. So the blocker bet minimizes how much it’s going to cost you to see the river. You also will get crying calls from black aces, or AK with A clubs.
Heros River bet size is just not an option You have to have a plan, and calling off and folding both are kind of mistakes So it’s a bet without a plan when you get raised
I don't usually max buy, which I'm aware almost all pros would not recommend. It just makes your decisions so much easier not being super deep. Yeah I don't cash in as much when I flop a set etc, but it's just so easy to realize my equity where I play, I'm rarely confused by peoples play.
I suppose the counter to this line of thinking is you should study your late street deep play. You’re doing smart short term thinking by identifying a leak (I’m assuming you have data behind this decision and not just feels) and self-exploiting to minimize it. However, the obvious response to that is if you improve your play in the situations you’re avoiding you will drastically improve your success. So it’s a good short term idea and one you should try to move away from in the medium term.
Writing this just after preflop action. I just can't see how raising this hand in middle position could possibly be a positive EV play. The button or even cutoff fine, but not here. Am I incorrect?
I think with the large turn sizing you are almost setting yourself up to get bluffed on that board pairing river. If I was getting sticky on turn with AK and you block bet the river I’m really gonna consider turning my hand into a bluff especially if I hold the ace of clubs. Once again the power of position is reiterated on this hand.
the call on the turn by villain was better flush, straight, or set....if he's ripping ak with the ace of clubs or aces with the ace of clubs don't play with him anymore.
I don't like hero's flop x/r, when V has the nut advantage on this board. I don't even like an x/r on the turn, when V has more nut-flushes in his range. With these stack sizes, and this hand, we can just check-call flop, check-call turn, and plan to check-fold river on any spade or board-pairing card. Our hand isn't anywhere near strong enough to take hero's line here.
To me check raising vs 1 opponent is better than vs multiple opponents because in my mind the odds of someone having a higher flush draw go up with more people in the hand. Someone please argue this
Let's keep in mind we get no reveal on this. This after the fact story, especially between regular "leveling war" rivals, who are portrayed by caller as pretty Laggy, is completely unreliable. I also don't think it mattered what villain had, there's no way this guy just calls river. Did not really like any of hero's choices. Bart did a great job of pointing out how hero's "outs" are going to be suspect when they hit.
The V in this hand has apparently joined the comments to say he did indeed have KK. I really hate hero's line here. V has a nut advantage on every street. Hero's hand isn't anywhere near strong enough to be played this way. I'd check-call flop, check-call turn, and look to check-call river on any brick, but check-fold on any board-pair or 4th spade.
@@EllieBanks333 I don't always believe what opponents tell me when I don't see for myself, but if I know the opponent reasonably well, and if they maintain their story after the session, I tend to believe them. As a side-note, I wonder more about opponents' answers to those hypothetical "If I jam turn, are you calling" type questions. Whereas I don't think there's much EV in maintaining a lie about our holdings in a particular hand from a prior session, I think there probably is some EV in letting opponents think we'd snap off a bet or insta-fold, just to keep opponents from feeling overly confident about putting us in tough spots the next time we face them.
Another reason to wait til the turn to check raise is to stay balanced. You should check raise a certain percentage but not a lot because you don’t want villains to figure you only reraise made flushes when you check raise the flop. So if you just check they will punish you for showing weakness
Its the wrong way to think. Its like, I met this nice girl, we went on date, she made me buy her a car, and now she left me, how can I sell the car and still make profit? The proper way to think about this is, how do I play flop and turn to arrive on the river and NOT be polarized to only flushes as valuehands? What can I do differently on prior streets to avoid this exact situation instead of how do I get myself out of the mess I already created?
@@chrisko6439 thats what you find out when you try to sell it. Aka when you play your hand as face up as possible by blockbetting river. In both scenarios, you won't find value...
Block betting isn't to induce a raise. That's literally the exact opposite of why we block bet. We block bet in situations where our hand is >50% against our opponent's range, our opponent is likely to check back with hands we beat, but those hands might call a small value-bet, and we don't want to face a larger bet from our opponents when we just check. If we want to induce a bluff, we should just check, not bet. Bet size isn't a consideration when we check. We want to induce a bluff when a value-bet isn't likely to be called, but our opponent might bet if we check to them, especially on boards where all the most likely draws bricked out, making it more likely our opponent will bluff with their missed draws.
Bart I think a block bet is fine on the river, although I'm likely checking all my flushes personally. As I'm sure you know block betting benefits those middling hands that don't want to face a big river bet) So IMO flushes, especially 6 high, are middling hands by the river and benefit from the small sizing (still check a lot), while full houses can go big to likely get called by flushes
A block bet is supposed to be used in a circumstance where your opponent can only call or raise but never fold. In this circumstance villain can only jam or fold, there is no calling range on this texture the way the hand played out. So in effect hero basically just bluffed with a flush because he did not want his opponent see a showdown. He bet with the intended purpose of folding which is ridiculous