Your First Engine Job - Checking Cylinder Bores For Roundness And Taper Using An Old Piston Ring 

If you want to really learn the tricks to building a great engine, listen to Uncle Tony. Its the same as learning to become a great chef by listening to a 5 yr. old describe his happy meal.

While running the piston ring down the bore checking for roundness you can check the ring gap at each stage to see if there's any taper.

Your videos are a godsend. I have an old Ford 144 inline six I got for free off craigslist. Just having fun tinkering with it and learning to rebuild an engine. Not something I want to take to a machine shop and drop a grand on getting blueprinted. After getting the pistons unstuck finally I was faced with the question of: "should i get this bored?" People on an internet forum were telling me I need to (and I might), but I was thinking "I wonder what Uncle Tony says about this" and you had a perfect video for it.

Important last sentence from Tony gave us all a clue, "Now i can confidently get standard bore piston rings" The take away is: Don't order anything or open a catalogue until the block and the rotating assembly is inspected!

If you have an engine you just want to get back together like this I suggest finding a hone with the fixed adjustment rather than spring loaded. You can do a much better job of honing and correcting the bore in the process. Having honed hundreds of blocks there is pretty well always a few thousandths taper and a fixed stone lets you get that out whick makes the rings and pistons much happier and it will last a lot longer.

I always hung out with the old guys when building engines… now I’m the old Guy! Id study manuals to learn, now it’s to remember😂

While you're checking for light gaps in the cylinder. Go ahead and check the gap with a feeler gauge at the same time. Save a step. Otherwise, perfect explanation. Easy to follow and very good information

This is exactly the type of information a beginner needs.

Just 2 items I hope you will cover in a future installment : How to feel the feeler gauge so you know you have the right one because it is easy to go a couple thousands once way or the other between loose and too tight. Second would be which stones to use because there are different grits and that will be based on the type of rings used. Great series! I wish I had a teacher 20+ years ago that taught me this stuff!

I remember when you hit 100k subs loving watching you grow. "If you throw it up in the air and it comes back down it's too heavy" UT

Have learned more from this series than I did in 2 years junior college automotive technology.

I agree with you Tony great job explaining the generations of engines. Not to blow my own horn, just an old guy who wants to help here, early first Generation engines did have the owners working on them. Some poured their own bearings in the rods or crankshaft s of these engines, but short of that several farmers who didn’t have access to even a small furnace to melt Bering material, mostly lead I believe, and the metals used in the process would simply use a strap of leather that was soaked in oil. Crazy right? But at the time people worked with what they had, and the got the idea of using leather as a bearing came from it’s used on wagon wheels. Wagon owners repaired their own wheels when they had to, making the rungs to hole the rim in place by carving what ever wood they could find and placing leather straps covered in grease to lubricate the wheels and allow them to turn on the wooden axles without destroying them. Definitely a primitive version of shade tree mechanics. Fascinating on the intermediate engines, you are spot on! This is where I got my start eons ago. I even met Don Garlits on this journey. Keep in mind that almost all the improvements in the middle era came about through racing in all its forms. The technology of modern engines were driven in part by racing, but can be directly linked to water cooled Fighter engines from WWII. Why it took so long? The muscle cars were so successful in those intermediate years that the technology wasn’t need to build faster an faster cars or better engines. That’s what drives us old guys to want to keep the dream alive and pass everything down to the next generation! But after the muscle car era all but died it was unfortunately driven by forces out of our control. In fact I don’t believe we would be seeing much of that would have taken place if it weren’t for, customer demand for performance and the way the EPA destroyed the potential of the late intermediate engines. Instead of improving and researching better designs the EPA required a host of stop gap parts be installed on engines. they lowered compression to the point that most had issues with afterun,( commonly refers to as dieseling), decreased performance along with what seemed like miles of vacuum lines that all but buried the engine they were put in .That all but killed the DIY market which drives aftermarket parts today. To make power required auto manufacturers to invest in development of better technologies, but they failed to do so, at least for those cars made in America. The foreign car manufacturers ran circles around our four cylinder economy cars. We caught up and leaped ahead, but it took time. Keep in mind that our economy went through a major recession, and wages shrank uncontrollably when inflation is considered, for decades. But, due to demand and a somewhat improved economy we are back on track.

Hi uncle Tony . I have to keep commenting on this series of videos. These are great for real world engine building. This is what most guys and gals are doing in there garage and driveways. I commented before I wish I had these back in the fabulous 80's when I was doing this outside in a driveway.

I'm loving this playlist. About to start an engine rebuild this year.

Just found your channel and love it! Timing is everything as they say, I'm currently rebuilding a '55 Plymouth 230c.i. flathead 6 engine, and your tutorial on checking bore roundness and taper is wonderful! I do have measuring tools I picked up over the years but what you showed is simple and definite. I will be looking at your other series on rebuilding the 4.0l for more tips and tricks, thank you so much for doing this!!! You're helping all of us "garage" mechanics keep our old iron alive!

Thank you for your expertise. I was gonna throw my pistons in my sbc 355, until this video. The bores were very smooth. Will run new cast iron rings and hone with a 220 grit. Thank you for setting me straight.

I would have never thought of this in a million years.

Good video. I noticed someone in the comments has issues.

You sir are a go to encyclopedia of knowledge, thanks for sharing your experience.

Thank you for sharing your knowledge with those of us looking to get into this. Disregard the "gatekeepers" and trolls. Unfortunately, they seem to occupy most of our hobbies like reloading, amateur radio, motorcycles and automotive repair. Their goal is to dissuade others entry into the activity while at the same time, bitch about the lack of interest into said activity. God bless!

Never seen it done without a tool. Awesome

While I have the snap gauges and micrometers to take precision bore measurements, I usually take rough measurements (like Tony just did) first just to give myself a heads up on the condition of the bore. They're usually pretty close to the precision measurements anyway. I also combine the 2 methods that Tony used with the light and feeler gauge into 1 operation. I'm guessing that he does too and only did them separately for the sake of clarity in the video for first timers...which isn't a bad thing.

I wanna say the old model T engines had shims under the main caps and when the lead babit bearings would wear out you'd remove a shim to make it fit again and once you ran out of shims you'd pour new babit and start over

So glad I found your channel so much information I needed to know. Very appreciated

I’m rebuilding my 4.0 that was a 4.7 stroker for about 80k miles before the mains went out since I built it in 2008-2009. I sent the block and crank to Carolina crankshaft and had them fix my main journals and set my clearances right. I am going to start putting back together as soon as my tax return hits my account. It’s a beast engine! That’s for sure!!

Ring trick is a great idea.. subscribed bud! Ty for these videos.

Another great lesson. Grazie zio Tony.

Quite right so bloody well right

I rebuilt the 318 in my durango two years ago. I have about 15k on it now and a road trip. The ridge in the cylinders was so slight I could barely feel it. Called my local machine shop and he told me he wouldn't touch it unless he bored it 30 over and assembled the short block himself. Also wanted 5k and at least 6 months to do it. Needless to say I didn't do that. gave the cylinders a quick hone and send it. So far the thing is great.

Thank you Uncle Tony great work. Don't let the turkeys get you down.

Thanks brother your my teacher have a good day 😊 Manny

🏆 top man ! All done using a feeler gauge, quick easy & inexpensive, excellent Mr Tony 👍

I rebuilt my 302 with nothing but a claw hammer, 😅 runs great!!

Thanks for the trick, it helped me know what condition my bores were in before sending it to a shop. 🙏

Very good................to the point.

Thank God for this video

OUR HARDWORKING MASTER IS AT WORK AGAIN,CONGRATULATIONS TONY MASTER

@20:20 "Gasoline is my go to...," was there ever any doubt? UTG giving theatrics to the comments is hilarious. 🤣 🌋

Great video.. Very informative. I'm rebuilding an 87 BMW m20, cast iron block. Will probably send it to the Machine shop, but I'm going to check it out based on the video before I do. Thanks much.

Thanks Tony!

Great series!!! Look forward to it every day……. Thank you Tony!!! 👍🚗

I’m building mine ! And this is helping a lot thank you 🙏 💯

I have pulled away some good information for my Harley

I remember you doing that outdoors with a guy who knew nothing and another with a gun on him lol. Winning team. I felt for you

Regarding checking bore taper and out of roundness if the ring gap differs by 3 thou of an inch you have 1 thou taper/ovality.

I remember a story of you blowing up the laundry room?? Hahaha how did that go again lmbo . Good stuff buddy. I do the same stuff never had a problem. Well not yet? And yes I’ve poured Babbitt barring’s before. Lol old technology gotta love it .

What a fantastic video!

Hey man just wanted to say that your videos are very helpful for the guy at home. Don’t listen to the machine shop guys that think their process is the only right way to build an engine. I’m a young kid and I’m porting the cylinder heads on my dads 318 and doing some cleanup or “blueprinting”. We need more mopar videos like yours. It seems every RU-vid channel has worked on or talked about Chevy 350 small blocks.

Thank you for the video Tony, very informative. You are a great resource of knowledge.

Checking the bore with the ring was absolutely genius.

Re the existing crosshatch when tearing an engine down... If you know the engine was done right previously (competant mechanic or untouched since factory assembly) then wear patterns would show any deviations. And you should put a good crosshatch down even if the previous crosshatch is still visible, since the crosshatch acts as the teeth on a file to wear down any high spots on the ring. You match the coarseness of the finish to the hardness of the ring so that the "file teeth" become dull just when the ring seats for a good seal. Any remaining crosshatch will help hold a bit of oil for lubrication. My two cents.

In a machinist term I would take dykem blue and cover the area that was going to be inspected use the ring and scrape down the surface, and anywhere we didn't scrape you know that would be a low spot. I would say you'd have to have more than a thousandth of an inch to see light testing both ways to make sure

Ouch. I’ve used a ridge cutter to get pistons out. Planned to bore it anyway. Good to know about using it as a reference. Many thanks

Glad I watched this video haha pulled my 360 FE heads off and it doesn't look too bad besides the ridge at the top on almost every cylinder haha its pretty bad. Not sure if I should buy remanufactured heads or fix mine

Never Change Tony ur the best👍👍

Bringing back memories overhauling used engines on the low dime ! Use to buy rotted muscle rusty cars , mopars for 800-1200 dollars etc performance them ,invest elbow grease and only minimal money for the fix upgrades ,Sheet metal and BONDO , lacquer spray paints ! cam and lifters , double roller timming chain, valve springs, gaskets ,bearing , rings , valve seals, oil pump and gunk and paint ! JC Whitney mail catalogue for the cheapy cheap performance parts ! Swap meets for headers , aluminum manifolds , higher stall converter , overhaul a used Holley too ! same for the rest of the car , brake pads , change the oils , swap out in 8 3/4 rear a used posi with taller gears , man those cone posi's really sucked , they wore out fast and it didn't lock up then ! had to pay the extra for the clutched ones ! , when money was no object add the 125 HP NOS BAby ! oh almost forgot the secret air induction system ! that chrome praying mantis head air cleaner without the foam insert filter removed ! keep bugs and rocks out ! and the chrome barefoot gas pedal ! must have cool factor and a sport steering wheel ! used cragers and fattest rubber with the money left ! The most important for Last ! Must have cassette deck with a booster graphic eq amp and coax 6x9 speakers , cruse and race time baby !

Oh thank you tony I learn something

curious as whats the mileage on this 4.0 block?

Good video tony!

Before doing an operation on the engine, he educates 5 mins about the nature of the process.Great teacher and i am going to slowly build my 2.0 lt Rav 4 diesel engine with those teachings without rushing and asking some help from a reputable machine shop if the block needs to be barred or squared etc etc.But i have one question I wonder a lot , for exemple when the bore is machined the milling machine has a fixed true square reference, i mean the bore afterwords is true and correct.My question is wouldn't it be better to attach the honing aparat to a drill press or a more true turning spindled machine instead of a drill that we hold in our hand ? Isn't it going to disturb the trueness of the bore ? Or the cutting rate of the stones are not considerably high so it doesn't matter ?

SPOT ON TONY I USED A RIDGE REAMER FOR YEARS AND USED TO THINK ABOUT TAKEN OFF THE RIDGE AND MADE ME WONDER IF I WAS DOING MORE DAMAGE THEN GOOD MOST OF MY REBUILDS I OVERSIZED IT VALVE JOB DID SOME QUICK REBUILDS RINGS AN BEARING TO GET IT DOWN THE ROAD. BUT WHAT YOU SAID THAT MAKES TOTAL SENSE WHEN YOU HONE IT USE THE THREE STONES INSTEAD OF THE BEADS GODSPEED

Thanks!

When UT says something is ancient. It's ANCIENT. 😆🤠

People like this are dying breed. I was about to test my cylinder boar similar to what he did, but the light is genius

Great video. Thanks.

How about a 2.4 dohc Chrysler motor from mid 90s is it in the same engine group as the jeep engine? It's a cast iron block w aluminum head. Great videos!

Watch a lot of your videos, big Tinkering shade tree type....but have a situation and looking for experienced opinion. my own truck dreaded 5.4 3 valve engine. rocker gave, dropped a valve, broke a rod...ok, But the broken rod at very low rpm gouged the cylinder wall. don't have time to send it in to be machined, remand out of budget today, can a guy weld a bead or even JB weld, then hone it? new piston, rod, bearing, junk yard head, new timing set....just to get her up and running good enough until afford new engine? your opinion helps and your videos are appreciated!

Ridge reamers, if any ridge is present ,gets used before the pistons come out if you expect any reuse of the pistons and bores. Otherwise you can break the upper ring lands and the ring . You can't determine if the new rings on the used piston will interfere with remnants of the old ridge if you don't cut far enough down the bore, but you don't want to bore all the way to China. Depending on the ridge reamer design some square up off the top of the piston and are impossible to use otherwise. I have used them all and I hate them all for quite a few reasons. I like using a rigid hone to finish to finish bores as opposed to the spring loaded ones or the dingle ball units . I have used inside micrometers for 50 years on engines as well as industrial machining as the they are inexpensive and can be used for far more then a cylinder bore. A dial bore gage is nice and would be called for in a production machine shop. I like using Kerosene with a little 30 wt engine oil for honing. Less flammable and I don't get painful dermatitis from gasoline that way.

Uncle Tony is the Eli Whitney of internal combustion engine. “It anit got no gas in it.”😂😂😂

Would these tips also work for outboards?

i love your videos

Great info, thank you

Great vidja 🤙🏼

Emissions Tony Emissions To last the warranty

Looking for info on inspecting and reuse of pistons. Do you cover that in one of you videos? Great info on cylinder taper.

I love the trick with the piston ring, I can't afford to buy a bore measuring set and micrometers to see if my blocks need honing. I'm trying to save money on my old L134 Go Devil Jeep blocks and T-214 Dodge straight six blocks. If I can use simple cheap techniques like this to save money then I'm all for it. If the cylinder taper in minimal that cast rings will take up the difference without problems, then the money I can save from the machines charging $150-$200 an hour to tell me that already, could be spent on parts. Why spend almost $1000AUD on tools when doing this simple trick with the rings will tell me the same thing and if it is out of round you won't need to measure it because you'll just bkre it out to the next piston size right??

What about retrofitting low tension rings on old engines?

I saw a guy on instagram that said if you mount an inline 6 engine on engine stand from the bell housing due the length and weight it can cause significant damage to the block and bores. He was actually talking about a BMW 1988 inline six cast iron block. Just asking you as I see you mounted engines from bell housing. Do you think it can cause any damage to inline6 engines? Thank you

Tony so you are showing that the bores are "round " with this check taper would require a bore gage please correct me if im wrong.

I Have a 4 leg hone. Can't find stones. Any ideas?

Down to earth guy I'm tuned in all of my junk should be running by summer 😂😂😂 keep it coming I'm 👀👀

What's the max taper that you would use before it needed boring?

I think the intermediate engines and vehicles were the best. Maybe not for power and efficiency, but that was that sweet spot where they were very reliable and simple. You know a little more advanced than carburation but not too much. You know you know like right after the throttle body craze and before the GDI craze right now sweet spot where everything was import injection naturally aspirated decent size engine you know and and it was less technology but there was enough technology where the thing started everywhere and drove everywhere just fine. You know the regular guy could get in it and drive it and it didn't break either that often it just needed maintenance. You know maybe a little more maintenance than the newer vehicles, but honestly the newer vehicles are higher maintenance in my opinion than they never been. They just don't want you doing any of the maintenance you understand... Late models are high maintenance of valley girls

That is awesome

Measuring your ring gap at each step of the round test would let you know if there's any taper.

Great video, thanks man

what was the price of a new crate 265 v-8 in 1956?

Yes but about ring wave?

I use murphy's oil soap and water

Chopping a Tree down... Yeah we get it, You have Money, Used a Laser Guided Performance Excalibur edition Chainsaw... We used a Axe 🪓, cause all we had was an Axe 🪓... Tree came down, became Fire wood... We are UTG... Survival Engine tear down basic.. @∅

Very interesting Very!!

Not a rant, perhaps a screed.

Wait! What? Tony actually owns a flash light?!? Lol just busting your gonads UT….

High maintenance valley girls with tight tolerances.... Gold digging ways lol.... Oh the boys are going dirt biking no you're staying home and fixing your truck... Or bringing it to the dealership and then maybe you can strap your bike to the roof of your Mazda 3 loaner

Has anyone used lard, when honing cylinders?

Another thing I don't like about modern engines. All these numbers they give you are a peak numbers that you're not even really ever going to see if you're just a regular person driving normally..... Secondly, yeah the older engines had weren't rated at the peak but also they hit torque at lower rpm

UTG, do you have a channel name for "Andy"? I just added him to my list of guys in this crazy thing we do...Fix cars! DK, Omaha!

This guy and his "biulds" 😂. I'll do it the way I do it.

I would think kerosene would be a safer choice.

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