Excellent job addressing this serious issue brothers!!...This is a very disturbing movement which seems to be highjacking much of the global huge charismatic movement.(at least many of MAGA theme megachurches or sign&wonders/wordfaith decree megachurches!) It really does seem to stem from of a continuum of the teaching from William Marion Branham... to Paul Cain..to Bob Jones..to Keneth Copeland.... and now, by those like Kat Kerr, Robin Bullock,Johnny Enlow and others who are highly promoted by "Elijah Streams"! These new "super-spiritual" modern apostles/prophets often give their newly downloaded extra-biblical revelations!...And when you boil it down, their message seems to be rooted in, or stemming from that doctrine by Branham of "manifest sons of God"/vis a vis "Dominionism"/preterist"Kingdom Now", or pre-Tribulation "Kingdom Now ", woohoo glory days of signs& wonders !They incessantly prophesy that "the reformed Ecclesia led by new prophets and apostles will eventually take over the 7 mountains of the world system ,for many many years, perhaps many generations, in order to bring in the billion soul harvest,..(Many add :" all following the upcoming Red Sea victory of the return of Trump, our gold-standard "Retribution" to lead our Christanized New America! In my view, all this is toxic to the max! For it (1)foster pride of life, (2) encourages leaning on a charisma-laden human leader ,"trusting in princes,or leaning on the arm of flesh"!) (3) fosters materialism and (4) fosters unteachableness, and(5) an unwillingness to bear the cross, facing hardships of these last days! Again brothers,thanks for addressing the dangers of this convoluted teaching that can easily engender sophistry and cult like control.God help us get back to the Cross!

NAR by definition, the “vision” of “the apostle at the top”. Got it. What im hearing is that youve (RR) been defending the very thing (NAR) that we’ve seen from Bethel (Bill Johnson) and IHOPKC (Mike Bickle) and somehow try to distance yourself from ideas that people youve held up to all believers as genuine Christians. gentleman, your own credibility is on the line here. You want to describe the danger of NAR to the church all while having people pay for your RR conferences so they too can be trained/ coached into prophecying. Listen. Coached prophecy or tongues or apostolic gifting IS NEITHER THING. God in the person & work of the Holy Spirit decides who gets what gift & when. NO TRAINING NEEDED. “by their fruit you will know them” NOT by their claims of fruit. just because your leader is not a freemason / satanic infiltrator doesnt mean your leaders arent NAR.

Insightful discussion. I have a theory that much of the problem comes down to an unhealthy combination of ministers who are "confidence men" and needy believers who feel inadequate in their relationship with God, and are drawn to someone who exudes a sense that he's in on the secret to a victorious walk with God, or knows the secret pipeline to intimacy with God, or the keys to hearing from the Holy Spirit, healing, miracles, etc. By "confidence men," I don't mean that such ministers are necessarily deliberate deceivers (although some are), but that they exude confidence... talk of hearing from God as though it is an everyday, clear experience, tell of experiences with healings and miracles, or describe having a deep sense of intimacy with God. Some may have actually had such experiences and share about them out of a sincere desire to encourage and instruct people, but when they share several amazing spiritual experiences that they have experienced over maybe decades, one after the other in a matter of minutes during a meeting, it can foster an illusion that they walk on a special, higher plane with God that believers suffering from a sense of inadequacy will be drawn in by, hoping that if they would "hook their wagon to his star" that they too will experience that "higher plane" of walking with God.

Romans 5:12-21 NKJV - 12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned- 13 (For until the law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law. 14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those who had not sinned according to the likeness of the transgression of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come. 15 But the free gift is not like the offense. For if by the one man’s offense many died, much more the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abounded to many. 16 And the gift is not like that which came through the one who sinned. For the judgment which came from one offense resulted in condemnation, but the free gift which came from many offenses resulted in justification. 17 For if by the one man’s offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.) 18 Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life. 19 For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous. 20 Moreover the law entered that the offense might abound. But where sin abounded, grace abounded much more, 21 so that as sin reigned in death, even so grace might reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

OK, you guys definitely need to do a show about pastors failing and stepping down such as Tony Evans, Robert Morris, maybe you are already preparing it I don’t know but it’s viral everywhere and I was hoping you do a segment on this please thank you

So he was “fired from a church he calls NAR” so he is but hurt 😢 about that. So he has a negative bias

You are just talking about how Jesus established his church, Jesus established the 5 fold ministry. We see Apostles like Bill Johnson and Heidi Baker, we see Prophets like John Paul Jackson and Hayley Braun, we see Evangelists like Reinhard Bonnke and Billy Gram, and pastors who Sheppard local congregations, and teachers like Chuck Missler who focus on teach bible and theology. NAR just recognize all the 5 ministry gift offices.

Isn't there a certain amount of fluidity to church structure within certain boundaries? Some structure is in conflict or harmony with culture.

Some good stuff. I like sticking with biblical language. Everything in the Word is still for today but can be stretched beyond the Word.

In a lot of churches the senior pastor seems to be the CEO

Great job breaking this down with scripture! Lots of sacred cows that need to be exposed.

Another common attack...you're just a heresy hunter

The book, THE MANIFESTED SONS of GOD, is really telling. All except one case of manifestation in the New Testament, it is God that is manifested, rather than us, though they teach the manifestation of us. We become the Head, rather than growing into the Head (Christ, the Head of the Church). We eventually run world, rather than Jesus through His Body. It is based upon ego, pride, envy, idolatry and receiving a great ministry if you serve the apostles and follow the prophets' prophesies. I was in it for decades and personally knew many of the players. We got to see NAR in all their manifested glory at the Bentley ordination in Lakeland. They sent their best. They couldn't have been more wrong!!! Few repented. Most of these went back to their old ways. Manifested Sons of God or Dominionism eventually ends up in Universalism, called Total Reconciliation, or Finished Work, where even demons and the Devil gets saved.

Was at Miller’s church in Denver, and I can say that I witnessed a miracle! They had Chick-fil-a on Sunday!! But for real, he preached on deliverance and how to tear down strongholds which is how we wage war as Christians. We may have a spirit that we’ve had for so long it can be hard to tell between us and the spirit.

Michael Roundtrees volume is always much lower than Josh's and Millers too. Its really awkward to have to switch the volume up or down and its been that way a lot for a long time.

Thank you for raising the issue of novelty. Charismatics/Pentecostals love drama and new exciting things as a group, which is one main reason we tend to be prone to embrace all kinds of bizarre stuff. So you mean God deprived Christians of this amazing secret for two millenia and decided to reveal it to this guy/woman? Nah. Give me that old time religion is right.

I read Proverbs every day and I have seen scriptures that people don’t hardly ever talk about about the power of the tongue let alone James chapter 3! What I’m saying is that with the power of our mouth with the words that come off of our tongue, I have seen both my wife and I speak to two LGBTQ owned businesses to close up. One was a former beautiful church turned into an LGBTQ entertainment center. And the other a sub shop owned by the same “married” homosexual couple. I even got into it on Facebook with the one “guy.” Years later from what I found out in the news, one of them broke his leg pretty bad in their goodbye/ thank you news article. But anyways, we attacked those two buildings (businesses) and started commanding it to shut down, get out of our neighborhood! binding those homosexual spirits, lust, pride 🌈, perversion, unclean, paedophilia, etc. etc As Jesus cursed the fig tree that it would bear no fruit so we prayed that these businesses would bear no fruit, and we cursed them to shut down and that no profit would be made and that they will have to leave and they will shut down in JESUS’NAME!!!!!!!!! We even wrote to the Mayor of our town and told him we don’t need this but he disagreed we need as many businesses as possible so it’s all about the money even though he says he’s a Christian and goes to church down the street. I put in my scathing warning email to him “read Romans chapter 1 and read the story about Sodom and Gomorrah.” Within a short period of time of a few years the church one shut down, then finally after 4 years the sub shop closed down. These two married homosexuals who lived in a whole different town, never came around again. 🙌🏽 We also had a big strip club around the corner, called “Pure Platinum.” Even my uncles would go there when they were younger in the 1970s. We cursed that thing we commanded it to shut down and I would walk by laying hands on the building, speaking in other tongues, binding every spirit from A-Z, commanding this perverted business to close up. After X number of years, it eventually shut down and it’s still shut down for about eight years now. Three doors down from there there was a new age/occult place “Aroma Bubbles” Same thing just commanded those new age, spirits, witchcraft, etc., etc. to be bound. I commanded that place to shut down to go out of business. After years it finally did…but moved far away to another poor location. It ain’t going to last. It got beat up so bad. We had a house that was being rented two doors down from us with young kids living in it. We called it “the crack house” and so we did warfare. We used the power of our tongue to get rid of this problem. Within an X number of years that house was razed to the ground and it’s been that way for an about eight years. Empty lot. Zerooooo lumber remaining! On the same street as the strip bar used to be as well as the new age occult store there is a service/business? run by the United Church of this town called “The Embrace Centre” which is ALL about the LGBTQ agenda. It does nothing. It just sits there as a cancerous sore in our town with its flags and promotions!! I’ve prayed and commanded and cursed that place for years and years to shut down to close up, but it has such a stronghold. No go. The same with the Freemasonry hall just a four minute walk from there. No go. Its roots are deep. Those spirits don’t wanna budge from there. Very very strong. My last story is a long one, but to make it short, there was a nondenominational charismatic church with all of the flaky, seeing angels, prosperity gospel, all fluff, and positive preaching by the pastor whom we’ve known since the day he got saved 30+ years ago. It was a pure nepotistic family run church. It was very concerning because we also had a few relatives cousins and their kids and people we knew were attending there. My wife and I have been veterans and have gone through the church splits, scandals, con-artists thing a few times. We knew the inevitable was going to happen. And it did. So I commanded this cult to shut down to close up and started cursing this thing at the roots that it would not bear anymore bad fruit that the truth will come out, and these false shepherds, these liars will be exposed. I even made a Facebook page calling its church name with the word cult at the end of it with a question mark.❓ wanting to make the member think “ am I in a cult?” The pastor would even laugh and tell his congregation that they are being called a cult. I remember clear as day that one of my family member’s husband and I had a meeting as he was in charge of the children’s ministry that we met at a Tim Hortons donut shop and we talked …and I looked him straight in the eye, and I said to him with righteous authority and anger at the devil “this cult is going to shut down in the name of Jesus. Mark my words.” I did videos, exposing the pastors, false teachings wrong doctrines kooky flaky messages. Not even singing Christmas carols during Christmas. Very weak. The head Pastor got so mad he even went to my workplace (post office) to try to get me off his mail route for me to stop delivering mail to him! (I didn’t even know where he lived when I chose this route. It was just God.) I would be pleasant to them in the driveway if their car lights were on or some other unpleasantry I would notify them about. After some time people started coming out and we banded together together, and we would pray, one couple in particular whose daughter (and husband and 3 kids) were terrified of leaving, fearing that she would be cursed if she did as the Pastor said so leaving his umbrella of protection. Another couple we became very strong friends with whose daughter and son were still stuck in there, but our friends got out when they were being coerced to give more money. I mean, lots of money. Eventually their kids were out when the cult shut down. So after years of doing spiritual warfare, commanding that cult to shut down to be exposed, binding every spirit that we have come to knowledge through our experiences, eventually it did close down, and the head Pastor took all the money left Canada and went to North Carolina I believe he and his family. His one daughter (who was a pastor there) was not in agreement with him. She was rebellious, but she was also into Yoga/New Age (which I exposed) and sleeping with a suicidal church member. Even the head Pastor eventually had an affair with one of the younger girls near the end. Because his wife had an eating disorder, very skinny through a lot of fasting and probably bingeing. They called themselves “Apostles.” The wife was the “prophetess.” Imagine going to church that one Sunday morning, and the doors are locked!? A couple (who is our friends today) who went there, said she so wanted to be on the praise and worship team that she said she was finally accepted (as a black woman) to go on stage, but when she went to the doors, they were closed. Needless to say, there are a lot of people that are NOW spiritual zombies, broken, disillusioned, backslidden, hurt, confused and bitter. But I say all of this to the glory of God 🙋🏻‍♂️🙌🏽♥️that through the power of our tongue 👅with our words 🗣️💥💥💥when it lines up with God’s will, when you know that you know that you know, when God leads you to do it just as Paul WAS LED BY GOD to curse Elymas the sorcerer and he was bumping into trees before he knew it! 🤕 Great message and program guys keep it up. God bless you. P.S. I totally forgot that there’s two places here in my town of Fort Erie, which one of them is where we get the name of our town from the War of 1812 where they say the fort itself (being our main tourist attraction) is haunted by dead soldiers and some other people that were there. And they actually have haunted ghost tours there! 🤦🏻‍♂️ We also had a kids TV show program studio van come from Toronto to shoot their show here at our “doll museum” (dolls can be very demonic objects) just around the corner from us where the whole town believes that it is famously haunted. It is now out of business just sitting there for years. Nice building. It was used in the past to smuggle black slaves who were running for their lives from the US under the Niagara river into Canada into this building. But I think some of them died in there from what I recall.

I was hoping you guys would bring up Dominionist doctrine, Seven Mountain type stuff.

Hymns written in, say, the 1700s were new when they were written and probably emotionally expressive at that time. The issue is disengaging the mind and relying purely on the emotion. One thing charismatics do is mistake talent and gifted performances with "anointing." By the way, FTR, I am not and will never be a cessationist. Cessationism has no support in Scripture and requires reading one's interpretation into the Bible.

This was great!! I loved it! Very helpful!!!

Sons of God can also refer to the watchers and and angels. Heavy shepherdin can also be a phenomenon in some NAR churches

My understanding is that the NAR movement believes that we are in a second Apostolic age. These new Apostles are equal with the original Apostles. The mission is to take control of the earthly kingdoms and to bring heaven to earth to bring about a massive end time harvest so that Christ can return to rule and reign. And I'm sure that there is more. I take issue with the idea that there would be New Apostles because the cornerstone and foundation has already been built. The church has already been established. The Cornerstone is Christ, the original Prophets and Apostles are the foundation and we the believers are the building stones that make up the Temple of God. We shouldn't be trying to change that. It is an entirely new teaching that is nowhere in scripture. I find that problematic. The gifts are to be used to build up the church so that we can go out and make disciples by rescuing people from the darkness. Not to take over the kingdoms of this world. Jesus said "My Kingdom is NOT of this world.". He will return and establish it on earth and at that time rule and reign over it.

As far as emotions go, they are part of who we are, and stifling them down is not going to work well. On the other hand, churches of almost every stripe will try to enhance emotions. Closing prayers being a nearly universal point of it. I don't mean to pick on Todd White, but he's a prominent example with "Can I get some keys?" That slow, meandering, emotional tune over the closing of a sermon or prayer is emotionally manipulative. All that said, I will self-identify as a practical cessationist, but the hymns in particular definitely stir emotions in worship when I reflect on what He did for me (but I grew up Presbyterian, so I didn't/don't raise hands).

Lets do Remnant Conference here in Curitiba, Brazil!

NAR is essentially a pejorative used by cessationists with what seems to me a very broad brush. They mean pretty much all full gospel / Pentecostal / Charismatic churches. I’ve heard em deny that, then take another stroke with the brush. I think it does apply to some churches, but similar to most denominational churches, there are LOTS of degrees. I was recently a member of a church that was about as NAR as NAR could be. Not my cup of tea. Everybody in the place was either an apostle or prophet, or both. Which was weird because they were constantly going thru deliverance… Here’s the deal. I’ve been in Charismatic churches of various flavors for 50 years now. And I have a few criticisms. But one thing gets overlooked or ignored. In spite of the fact that it often attracts and gives a platform for the … shall we say the more dramatic personality types… I’ve met many many people who were extremely serious and passionate about God. To hear the critics, you wouldn’t know that. So much vitriol and questioning of other’s faith and character. I don’t question the faith or sincerity of a Reformed Presbyterian or Baptist. I might disagree on a few things. Doesn’t mean I call them heretics and claim they’re going to hell because they don’t believe in the practice of the gifts or whether or not the office of the apostle is still in operation today. Do you believe we are fallen creatures in a fallen world and we need a savior? That only thru the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross that we attain redemption? Good I’ll guarantee you that 99.9% of those whacky Charismatics in the Assembly of God, Church of God, … Bethel etc believe that too.

39:40 "i have all the truth i need in scripture"...yet Jesus is Truth. Scripture was given to give us Jesus, not to give us "all the truth that we need" (john 5:39) everyone falls into the ditch on one side of the road (there is no new truth) or the other (the cults of "new revelation") God isn't in either ditch

everyone thinks their own church is special and right. otherwise they wouldn't be going there

Hey guys. It sounds like you are throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Since NAR has Apostle in the name, Miller equates them with narcissism, and Roundtree goes straight to Jim Jones ! What about Jesus !?! What did Jesus say ? Jesus told them, "... Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. 16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. 17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; 18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover. 19 So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God. 20 And they went forth, and preached every where, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen." Do you see the part about how this was when Jesus was received up into Heaven ? Well what does Ephesians 4 say ? Paul writes, "8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men." What Ascension ? It is the same one that is described in Mark 16 ! It is THAT Ascension, the same one that is described here ! "9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. 10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; 11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven?" What Gifts did Jesus bestow at His Ascension ? "11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers ..." Guys did Jesus clumsily sling out those Ascention Gifts to make narcissists, and to only facilitate Jim Jones types ? Was it to make us spit and wash our mouth out with soap when the name Peter Wagner goes accross our lips ? What was the intention Jesus had when He GAVE those 5 Ascension Gifts ? The scripture says, "12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: 14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; 15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ ..." Who is to be perfected ? The NAR leader ? NO !!! The SAINTS ! For what purpose ? '12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ..." The Ascension Gifts were given by Jesus Himself ! They were and are for a specific purpose, and needed more today then EVER before. You guys LOVE exhaulting PASTORS, because you are one, but expect us to spit in Jesus' eye if we realize Apostles are in that same list because the Pastors on Remnant Radio slander the Apostles ! Y'all have become Justin Peters. I have an idea. Why dont y'all let JESUS be the head of the Church and stop trying to usurpe Him because you think you have a better idea than Jesus could possibly come up with. Jesus Himself left Apostles, Prophets, Evangelists, Pastors, and Teachers. He didn't leave them for the guys on Remnant Radio to "gatekeep" those Gifts and throw them out the window because somebody calling themselves "Apostle" misused the term for something Jesus meant as a New Testament function for a specific purpose and not just a Pharisaical title.

It seems like you are saying NAR believes charismatic stuff but takes it too far? I am not hearing a clear distinction. There has been some sort of apostolic succession, but they don’t have the kind of authority that The Twelve had?

I have seen too many people hurt in NAR churches due to the lack of wisdom, tendency to control and flat out misunderstanding that gifts are gifts and not positions.

Bible Project greatly unpacks "manifest sons" it is COMPLETELY different then how it's normally applied

WARNING ‼️ This guy is a false teacher! Diga Hernandez is a Benny Hinn disciple. Benny Hinn’s nephew Costi Hinn is warning others about this false teacher’s ministry.

Bill Johnson absolutely believes in the doctrine of the Manifest Sons of God.

Good job guys for explaining the NAR and opening our eyes spot on! We need more of this. Thank you

Listening to charismatic’s talking about NAR is terrible. You guys need to bring on a non-charismatic that isn’t looking to diminish this topic. It’s a serious issue that should be treated as such.

LOL

Why do you insist on feeding the NAR myth It just feeds the self righteousness of those looking for a label to slander those they don't agree with, or more accurately don't like Though there may be good reason to call some actual practices and to a lesser degree beliefs, cultish NAR is a construct of these people Having been on the fringes of cults most of my walk with the Lord I could name a number of Calvinist groups that behave and believe like cults But I won't

Emotion is great, but I think it's a problem when the fervor of one's emotional experience is the primary barometer of authentic faith. Building emotional experiences becomes valued over building orthodox doctrine

Does ANYONE actually admit that they're NAR?

What about the cult like tendencies of the AOG and all Pentecostal churches as described in the book of Galatians

To be honest, even tho Bethel says they arent NAR it sounds like they are.

Cults deny the deity of Jesus and are driven around a certain personality as a singular authority. That's it. NAR is cultic from the standpoint that everything depends on one man who replaced Christ as head. Megachurch/CEO + WoF/Latter Rain = NAR

maranatha

Stop deceiving people saith the Lord! 🕺🏼

The beginning did not in fact get edited out Josh😂

When we're out preaching the word of God we end up taking on what the people were trying to bring to the Lord their culture their ideas. That's nonsense

Again Mike Winger I don't know if he's purposely doing this. Or it's because he's not a spirit filled believer he's not baptizing the Holy Spirit. And does not understand the gifts of the spirit and how they work. He's claiming that charismatics and people like Bethel Church are taking things from new age and applying them in Christianity. That is absolutely backwards. 50 years ago they complain that you should meditate on the word of God but yet the Bible tells us to meditate on it they said you don't meditate on because that's like being in TM . Mike doesn't understand that we get wisdom the word of wisdom from the Holy Spirit we can get a word of knowledge from the Holy Spirit we can get a prophecy from the Holy Spirit. We can't conjure up these things on our own we can't decide that we want to pray for somebody to be healed and they'll be healed. Also I want to note that Bill Johnson in his book when heaven invades earth talks about how we as Christians are change the atmosphere around us. There is that NAR Buzz word. What does actually means is that we are light and salt to the world salt and light changes things. Bill Johnson relates to story where a festival came to town and there was an astrologer who set up a tent. Bill said oh no not my town. And he went and stood behind the tent and prayed rebuking the spirit of divination. Say no get out. Get out of my town. Does this sound like a guy who's going to take from new age? guys like Mike Winger who early in his experience of charismatic gifts he faked being slain in the spirit. So now he goes around pointing out when I would think are some abuses and there are people out there faking the effect that the Holy Spirit can have a person. Winger has also gone so far as to edit a person's quote to make it sound like they believe in new age when they were actually saying the new age is trying to move into the church and replace the gifts of the spirit. You to Rod Saunders RU-vid channel called Jew and Greek . where he does a piece exposing Mike Winger. So are you going to trust a liar

It’s biblical, simply

Miller hair is epic

Regarding "touch not God's anointed", 2 Corinthians 1:21-22 says all believers are anointed... "Now it is God who makes both us and you stand firm in Christ. He anointed us, set his seal of ownership on us, and put his Spirit in our hearts as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come."