Three friends named Phil delve into places and ideas that interest them. These include motorcycles, music, films, and history, as well as quirky locations and tall tales.
Welcome to the world of 6MilPhil, Philthy Phil, and Wobbly Phil!
The 2007 point when SORNs decrease, that could be the older Triumphs either being resurrected, becasue maybe people have been inspired by Henry Coles TV show . Okay Henry's TV show has been from about 2011 . The downward bit of the SORN graph does start from about then ! Of course, maybe the old machines are just being scrapped, an extension of that theory is possibly 2 or more old Triumphs are being merged into being one old resurrected Triumph , that is road taxed .
I'm still wanting a Spagthorp and now a family crest thing with a chicken head as an emblem. Definitely a must have. I'll bet that horder Leno has 3 of each in a fallout shelter somewhere.
NO. This is observable by anyone who lived through both eras. Prices are falling because owners are old and dying. There is nil young market because that was never cultivated by anyone who mattered. NVT died long before most new riders were born and they grew up with tough, rugged, RELIABLE (without excuses made) alternatives. Visit a vintage Britbike rally in the US. Fifty is exceptionally young for an enthusiast. Why would a young person who is not an utterly determined hardcore mechanic want one when nearly everything else is functionally superior and (this matters) well supported by independent shops? I'm the last British bike mech in my area and I'm 65 and retired. Old British motorcycles killed the British motorcycle industry when they were new, and almost no modern buyers will tolerate the constant fettling us classic enthusiasts enjoy. There are so many vintage British machines coming out of the US because when they were new bitterly disappointed owners discovered (remember bike media before the internet was dominated by commercial media whose revenue depended on motorcycle company ad revenue) reality was far different than magazine propaganda. Their bikes went into barns and garages then they bought Japanese, German and US machines so they could spend more time riding and less money at the shop. If you are a mechanic they're not bad to keep running but if you are not one stay away unless you have plenty of spare money AND (the hard part) access to a genuinely competent shop. Vintage British machines were never reliable by US standards. That's not an insult but motorcycle owners (usually those who are not mechanics) have their rose-tinted spectacles riveted on. Vintage Britbikes are really 1930s designs and unit crankcases (TriBSAetc) don't change that. Only one motorbike firm which barely survived similar mistakes was able to maintain continuity and that was Harley-Davidson. A key reason is they were built far more ruggedly than their British competition and (this is key) thanks to the roller bearing crankshaft can be overhauled to "zero time" in the field with few specialty tools. OTOH grinding vintage crankshafts is specialty work. I've two Tridents ('69 and a '72 Miles Engineering framed cafe project), two Commandos ('69 and '73) and more but I would never commend them to a mechanical novice. True collectors will find them and enjoy not overpaying. OTOH the new market is mostly people who find the classic design naturally appealing (perception thus industrial design has rules!) and want RELIABLE steeds. Many know little about the old bikes and that's for the best since modern machines are vastly more practical as transportation.
I agree with all of that, and if you dig back into my previous videos you’ll see I’ve previously argued that it’s the age of enthusiasts these days that is the prime driver of the current price decline in the British classics market. My first ‘bike’ was an NVT moped, which was abysmal, so I’m fully aware of the foibles of the 1970s Brit era, you definitely have to go into ownership with your eyes open and in the full knowledge that you’ll be spending large amounts on getting things fixed!
If you are already a very good mechanic you'll be fine. If you aren't and must pay someone any of the old UK lumps will be an adventure as the old mechanics are dying off and the owner community are mostly ancient like myself. Read exhaustively and join the TR3OC.
I used to belong to the TR3OC but tbh I didn’t get much out of it, probably because there wasn’t anything going on near where I am. I do have a very good friend called Phil (of course!) who has owned his Trident for close on 50 years and has kept it mechanically and cosmetically in practically brand new condition all that time, and I get most of my tips and hints from him. Thanks for the comment. 😊
The Astralite wheels were quite innovative. I used to make motorcycle luggage racks ("Custom Carriers") in a kind of similar fashion & yes, I did make one for a Hesketh - anodised black to match the wheels.
A very good friend of mine, based in Johannesburg, but now, sadly, deceased, owned the only Hesketh on the African continent. What happened to it after he died, I have no idea.
There is a Hesketh Owners Club, maybe they help trace where it went if you’re interested. Amazing to think it was the only one on the entire African continent! Thanks for the comment. 😊 heskethownersclub.org.uk/contacts/
@@3Phils He actually acquired his Hesketh, from Britain, through the club, which he had joined. He was a brilliant engineer and had a large collection of very desirable bikes, many of which he had restored. I think it's possible that the whole collection was sold to a Joburg-based billionaire. Unfortunately, I have lost contact with my friend's family, added to which I live at the other end of the country, in Cape Town. Thanks very much for your response and for the link to the club.
Such a great video with a sad ending. I'm of similar vintage. Started on an FS1E, then a RD250LC (yes that's the bike that altered the 250 on L's law!) It's now we realise that we've had many more riding years than we've got left. Best get out there and make the most of it.
Fat old geezer here. I've been riding motorcycles since 1979. I tried it all: Hondas, Kawasakis, an almost brand new BMW K100, a newish RD350, a Suzuki 850 etc etc. But I tend more and more to lean towards the classic bikes, I have 1957 Bonneville in my garage right now. And no, it cannot brake, it has awful lights, it is powerful enough, but only just, and it does break down now and again - not as much as I feared though. And every time I go for a ride, I think to myself: "Is it gonna bring me home again too?" BUT, when you get the ignition timing just right and the carbs set up properly and it does run the best it can, and you learn how to change gears properly and how to brake a mile before you want to stop, i.e. learn all of its little quirks and tempeaments, it's just so REWARDING in a way, that no new bike I've tried can compete with. This sense of being good and clever when a ride goes smooth is just so fulfilling, I can't explain it another way.
@carlnapp4412 I often think there’s a bit of a connection between old motorcycles and steam trains! Maybe we’ll see a steam loco in next week’s video?!
Nice memories of a time that was so easy and delightful. I'm not only referring to the girls, the motorcycles were in a class of there own as well than! I bought my first real motorcycle in '73, a DKW VS 200, which was quickly followed by a Horex Regina 350, and I still own her today. Thanks a million for having reminded me! By the way, 1:57 I'm afraid we didn't work on our beloved bikes wearing gloves of any kind. The hittings are getting closer. May God rest his soul! Cheers!
Brilliant motorcycle I sadly sold mine in the spring after many years…smooth and nice riding machines and reliable !! Sold as just too large for me now …don’t elect the rubbish about gearbox it’s similar to a BMW of the era…just take it gently
That’s more than once, now, that I’ve heard from folk who’ve owned them saying the stuff about the gearbox is rubbish. I’m beginning to think it’s a myth that been perpetuated from one dodgy test ride all those years ago! Anyway, it’s great to hear from owners and thanks for the comment. 😊
Mick Broom was R&D man and test rider for Hesketh. Broom Devolopment Engineering owned the Hesketh name, made and repaired bikes and operated out of the old stables at Easton Neston for years. I recall Mick telling me that he rode a V1000 around MIRA at about 140mph. The reason the production bikes didn't do this speed was due to a new European noise limit imposed before it was in production. The Hesketh was too noisy, so they had to set about strangling it. IIRC Meriden Triumphs were also too noisy, but they were already in production so they were exempt. The Hesketh had to comply and was 'detuned' to meet the new noise regulations. There is also the rumour that Hesketh were 'inspired' by Japanese shaft drives, some say the bike was going to be a shaftie until BMW sued Yamaha for infringement of patent, so it quickly became a chain drive. Regardless of what the bumf the commentator is reading says, Hesketh V1000's were fitted with Dell Orto carbs, not AMAL. I was told that Hesketh wanted the bike to be All English, but the suppliers would only supply in large quantities, so Brembo brakes, Honda clocks, Marzocchi forks and rear shocks were fitted because they could buy these in smaller quantities. People have queued up to tell me what a pile of poo my Hesketh is. "How long did you have yours? is my usual question. The usual answer is: "I've never owned one, nor have I ever ridden one, but everyone knows....." It's always interesting that people can be so against a bike that they have never ridden simply by reading something about it in a magazine, or 'My mate Dave told me and he should know....' What the V1000 is good at is touring. 70mph @3,500rpm and she'll do that all day without any problems whatsoever. I did it with fully loaded Krauser panniers, a top rack with tent, camping gear and my wife on the pillion. Rider and pillion were both very comfortable. Mine has been over the continent a few times quite happily and very comfortably. Someone will soon be along to tell me that I am wrong (that usually happens) but it does seem that buying a Hesketh meant you might get a good one or a not so good one. Mine is a good one since the gearbox is just fine, it has never leaked oil nor had any of the problems that other bikes have had. Magazines in those days praised bikes made by companies that spent a lot on advertising with Lord EMAP, double praise so if it was faster than last years model (and don't mention the rubber frame and ornamental brakes), and decried everything else. This is all in my cynical opinion of course, but I have at least I own one, have ridden miles on it and my opinion is based on empirical knowledge, which trumps everything else.
It’s fantastic to hear from someone who owns a Hesketh, thank you for commenting. The magazine article probably got a few things wrong, so it’s great that you’ve chimed in and corrected them. The interview with Lord H was done in 1980, before the bike was produced in any significant numbers, so no doubt a few things changed. I’ve always thought they looked amazing and might even have been tempted to buy one if I’d had the money! You must draw a few crowds on your tours!
I only remember there being claims that the engine cases had a porosity problem. Not sure if it was actually true. It's also a hard leap to attract motorcycle riders to spend big when the history of the company is both short and based on lucky success in formula one cars.
I loved that swooping 4 into 1! Sad to hear they’re difficult to find these days. Admittedly I had a slightly less baffled silencer - what a howl! Thanks for the comment. 😊
I know, I know! It’s been remarked upon before, but I could only have five options because that’s the max RU-vid allows in a poll. As I’ve hardly ever seen a 900SS in real life, let alone ridden one, I stuck to machines I knew at least something, anything, about! I think they’re great looking bikes and perhaps I’ll have to do a ‘Here’s one I know nothing about’ video to make up for the omission. Thanks for the comment. 😊
On the irreverence of Bike Magazine which was also my favourite at the time… Anyone remember the infamous “Honda Goldwank” road test that lost them Honda’s advertising for..I dunno…a while!
I have a white/yellow T160 that brings a smile to my face every time I ride. Tickle the carbs before starting (press and hold the ticker on each carb until fuel emerges from around the tickler) and it should start on the button every time.
I do like the yellow and whites! But if only it were the case that tickling the carbs had been the answer for my T160 when I first bought it. Nowadays, though, following a complete refurb of the carbs and paying assiduous attention to the type of fuel I use, it does start on the button, after a thorough tickling of course! Thanks for the comment. 😊
@@3Phils I also got rid of the wasted spark Boyer Branson EI (the 4 volt coils being very susceptible to any drop in voltage) and put in a TriSpark. This system is full 12v and fires the cylinders individually. It also fits completely inside the timing cover with no “black box” under the seat. The bike will now hold steady idle at 750 rpm.
Yes, I’ve heard that the Boyer isn’t perfect, but then I’ve also heard of Tri-Sparks failing. One Trident specialist I spoke to said he’d had to return 25% of them and he now refuses to fit them. I’ll stick with the Boyer, I think, as sorting the fuelling side has improved the bike dramatically. It probably needs the carbs balancing again, though - I’m keeping an eye on the centre plug, the middle cylinder seems to be running a bit rich. Oh well, it’s all part of the joy of owning one of these magnificent machines!
I saw a trick the other day for balancing the carbs and that was to shine a torch through each carb in turn and adjust the slide to the point where the light disappears. Good luck and happy riding.
@ianyonethere Ah, I use a Colortune, a nifty, see-through spark plug you insert in place of your regular plug, which allows you to adjust the mixture up or down until you get a nice, blue colour. Of course, you can’t use it on the centre cylinder without taking the tank off, but you can adjust the middle carb to around the same as the outer two to give an approximate result. Right, the sun’s out here, time for a wobble out! Happy riding! 😊🏍️
Many years ago I was at Gus Kuhn Motorcycles and there was a silver Hesketh V1000 in the showroom, I was highly tempted to purchase it as the price was good and the bike looked fantastic but eventually reason overcame emotion and I bought a 750 Commando instead which I never regretted for an instant as that Commando was an utterly brilliant machine!. However, I still find myself thinking about that Hesketh to this day and wondering if it would have worked out..
Having also owned a 750 Commando, I agree they’re brilliant bikes. Even so, it took a while before my Commando was set up right and I imagine fettling a decades-old Hesketh would be even more problematic. I mean, to start with, where would you even get the parts from? So imho you made the right choice! Thanks for the comment. 😊
I think we must've been in Gus Kuhn's about the same time. I remember a red one which was too expensive for me. I bought a BMW R650 with the toaster fuel tank. Just thought as I type Lord Hesketh was from Towcester in nothants which is pronounced Toaster.🤗
In 1980 I went to Australia for 25yrs, & within a yr & a half I had bought a 1982 Laverda Jota, lovely machine, came back here ( Wales) in 2005, & a couple of years ago I bought a Harley-Davidson Fatboy lo Special, the ' flying brick ' as I call it, always used to buy Bike magazine, they had great road tests , all the best 👍
Gosh, you had a Jota? I’m jealous! Always wanted to get my hands on one of those! I’m busy re-reading these rediscovered Bike mags, there’s some good stuff in them. Thanks for the comment. 😊
Bike wasn't a "Lad's mag". It was extremely well written and took no prisoners. They published a letter from a remedial teacher who said his pupils wanted to read it but it had far too many long words and long sentences. They published articles by LJK Setright. The Hesketh was all wrong from the start. Hesketh had no conception of the problems of volume production, especially the need for quality without a team of mechanics on standby. He also had no conception of the difference between racing where noise and vibration were tolerable to long as you got over the finish line first, and production bikes which by then had been civilised by Honda. But worst of all he didn't understand big V twins. The whole point of them in those days was high torque at low revs, the ability to lumber along carrying two overweight Americans. Even the Vincent was low speed power by modern standards. The Hesketh engine was high revving with high vibration and torque in the wrong place. Americans wouldn't buy it and nor would UK admirers of US bikes. By the time Hesketh realised he might need some UK designers, all the wrong decisions had already been made. Compare with Ducati who made a V twin by doubling up on the cylinders of their existing design and just kept developing from there (with a switch from bevels admittedly, and eventually de-emphasising desmo gear as valve springs and materials got better.) Design a one off from scratch with no time pressures using existing parts - Allen Millyard. Try and design a low volume design from scratch - go bust.
Sorry, my bad, I must have been distracted by all the busty ladies advertising bikes and gear, and the ads for tabs on every other page. LJK Setright was a genius, and I looked forward to his column every month! Thanks for the comment. 😊
Crikey what a bill! I had a ride on one of these and recall being really impressed by the handling, it just felt so stable and planted. Plenty of power too, and no overpowering vibrations like a lot of British bikes. It's really a pity that the British bike industry left their innovation too late, if this'd come along 10 years before it did then it might be a different story now. But there was no way this could compete with the Japanese 4 cylinder bikes.
Yes, the bill was rather eye-watering! It’s actually a great bike, though. They began developing it in the 60s but took too long to get it to market, and when they eventually did Honda had already beaten them with 33% more cylinders, electric starter, etc, etc. What a shame. If you can get your hands on a sorted example, they’re terrific fun in an old-fashioned kind of way!
Howdy from Texas! Just finished watching this video and still learning more and more about my new FTR RSD. Glad to be part of the club! I already received the bike from its break-in maintenance and other than a few times where the bike dies after a few seconds at cold starts, no issues with it so far. This only came about the first two hundred miles though. I am absolutely in LOVE with it!
Hello from the UK! I love the FTR too! I’m very impressed, especially as it’s the first time in almost 50 years of motorcycling that I’ve owned a bike from the good ol’ US of A. My first V twin too. As I say in the video, it’s not quite perfect with its fuel mapping but that does seem to improve the more miles you put on it, as the engine loosens up. It handles great, it’s quick, it’s built properly and it’s nimble round the twisties! Thanks for the comment. 😊
Yes, I should have made it clearer that it was the first gen Hinckley Bonnie. I’d probably still find the uprated 80hp a little placid on a modern bike, though. I’m more of a 100+hp kind of guy when it comes to modern machines. But that’s just my personal preference and I know plenty of folk who love their Bonnies. Thanks for the comment. 😊
Your narrative style is very amusing. Owning a classic requires either being rich like Jay Leno, or having a workshop full of whitworth spanners and sprocket pullers and feeling happy to spend several evenings a week messing about with it. The fixing is part of the joy for many owners. If you need to pay someone else to do it then it's going to be pricy and probably frustrating.
Thank you for the kind comment. 😊 I often wish I’d developed the necessary mechanical skills but having been an urban dweller for the past 40 years, living in flats in Victorian conversions without garages or sheds, I’ve never had a proper space with heat and light to work on anything (until recently, that is - and I now have several sets of Whitworths!). So I’ve had to go down the Jay Leno route, without the benefit of Jay Leno’s millions, which probably explains why I’ve never been able to afford a property with a garage or shed with heat and light, because of all the dosh that’s gone on paying others to tend to the motorbikes! 🤣
@@3Phils It's good that you've finally got yourself a workshop. Some say that the skills for working on bikes are quickly learned - I think it depends a lot on the person because it requires a knack for visualizing how things fit together in 3D and an eye for when things aren't right. On older things there are often corroded and seized parts as well as decades of previous botched attempts at repair. It's probably best to start by doing routine maintenance on a bike that's already in reasonably good shape. That can already save you a lot of money.
Yes, it’s a big step forward having my own space with light and power. Until my early 20s I lived with my parents, kept my bikes in their garage, and tinkered away to my heart’s content, although I never acquired the skill levels required to, say, rebuild an engine. But now everything is coming together in the new place, and there’s nothing more satisfying than being able to tinker with the Trident when it’s reluctant to start. I just wish the UK summer would start!
I was a bike test rider back in the early 80s. Worked for MC Enthusiast magazine among others. I came accross one of these awful bikes when they were road testing a couple of pre production bikes. Oil leakage and blown fuses were the least of the problems with them. Sounded like a bag of nails on tick over. The riders weren't that impressed with the handling either. People bought shares, Lord H
I remember around 1983, Steve Rhodes Motorcycles in Bradford broke up a brand new Hesketh V1000 for parts, Rhodes himself said that he could make more money selling it as parts than he could selling it as a complete motorcycle. After it was stripped I remember seeing the Hesketh's beautiful nickel plated frame on the floor of Rhodes parts department.
" The Forgotten Classic" You're making me feel old. I remember the Hesketh when it was new. Not to ride, just wondered/lusted at in the mags as a spotty yoof. I bought Bike for the same reasons as you (first stop always Ogri). Best wishes from... Another forgotten British classic
As they say, nostalgia ain’t what it used to be! Paul Sample also did the illustrations for the Tom Sharpe paperbacks, which is what drew me to reading them. Then in a very roundabout way I ended up with a father-in-law who was chums with Tom Sharpe. And it all started with Ogri! 🤣 You can still buy Ogri T-shirts apparently. Hmmm, my birthday’s coming up… 🤔 All the best and thanks for the comment. 😊
I did enjoy reading Wilt. Loved Ogri and the Ogri themed pubs at the IOM TT in the early 80's. Drooled over the Hesketh at the bike show on a plinth covered in the Union Jack. And I loved riding my new US spec T140 Bonneville. Great times.
There was absolutely nothing Classic about the Hesketh,...if you stand it next to a Ducati 900SS or a Moto Guzzi 850 leMan that were manufactured in the same period...
Interesting. Perhaps, like the Royal Enfield I owned a few years ago, they look good in the photos but don’t bear closer inspection? Thanks for the comment. 😊
I’ve thought about it. Trouble is, music does help smooth over some of the audio edits, but I’ve also found it can sound more prominent depending on which device - desktop, laptop, TV, phone, earbuds, headphones - you’re watching with. I also think RU-vid does a bit of audio compressing when it processes the videos after loading up, which means the mix never sounds the same as when it leaves me. I get your point, though, as nothing irritates me more than when TV bike and car shows play music over the sound of an engine and you can’t hear the ruddy engine! Thanks for the comment. 😊
@@3Phils Thanks for replying, you've clearly thought a lot about this. It's not the background music as such, but just the level, where it's impossible to concentrate on what you're saying because the music is intruding. BTW the content is really interesting. I read a review of the Hesketh at the time and can still remember "500 pounds of rolling thunder cleft the air at 100mph". Ever since then I've had a desire to ride one, although I suspect the reality would be underwhelming.
No worries, I’m open to comments about the technical, video side of things as well as comments about the subject matter. I do a number of tests on different devices before I publish each video and mixed the music very low on this video, to the point where I could barely hear it on my iPhone. I do this on the RU-vid platform in case there’s some kind of processing at RU-vid that perhaps compresses the audio once the video has been loaded up. It would be interesting to know what kind of device you’re watching on - phone, laptop, tablet, or TV? I’m relatively new to this RU-vid mullarkey, and despite having been a broadcast TV producer, director and editor for more years than I care to mention I’m still finding my way around the YT technosphere, so I hope you’ll bear with me. Many of my earlier videos had less music and they weren’t as popular, so without valuable viewer input like this I’m operating in a bit of a vacuum with only stats to go on. This week I’ll be trialling a new audio set-up which I’m hoping will be an improvement. All the best. PS: Just had a comment from a test rider who found the Hesketh slightly less impressive than the hype. Interesting!
@@3Phils I'm viewing on a PC with a pair of small bookshelf speakers on the desk. For me the music is intrusively loud on this one, it seems almost as loud as your voice. Of course opinions vary on background music, but overall it's probably more about the content than anything else. There are very successful channels where the graphics and sound are pretty basic but they do tell a well-researched and interesting story.
Thanks for getting back to me on that. I’ll test the video through bookshelf speakers, which I don’t ordinarily do, and see what happens. I really appreciate you taking the time to provide feedback on this, thanks again. 🙏
Not sure if my memory is playing up but wasn't Cosworth involved in the engine design? I seem to recall that Hesketh Engineering was refurbishing DFV engines.
It was Weslake, in fact. I think Cosworth got involved in Norton. Lord H says they got Weslake to help manufacture the engine to his team’s designs. Thanks for the comment. 😊
If my memory..... The engine was based on the concept of sawing off a couple of cylinders from the Cosworth V8. In the upper 6th we were praying for the British comeback. - Norton`s rotary - Silks`s two stroke - never quite happened in the way that we were hoping. We went Italian. Hesketh always seemed to be the product of an unsuitable heritage.
@@tagomago2178 You may be thinking of the Norton Cosworth there. Norman White, who appears in some of my other videos and who was Chief Engineer at the Norton Works Team in the 1970s, mentions just that - basically two cylinders sawn off the Cosworth V8! But some unkind souls thought at the time that the Hesketh engine was two 500cc Weslake speedway engines bolted together. I never went Italian myself, apart from Lambrettas, but you've reminded me of the Norton Rotary and, more especially, the Silk. Hmm, I feel another video coming on! Thanks for the comment. 😊
10 outta 10, was too easy… Owning a Norton Commando 850, a BSA B44, a Triumph mongrel (1971 650 engine in a ridgid 1951 frame as a bobber) & a lifelong interest in motorcycles since I was about 10 (in 1973) helps as well.
