I think it's a cool alternative for those who use a desk. These types of desk mounts are a simple DYI and for those that are not mechanically or carpentry inclined or don't have the time. I think it's a good thing. In my life experiences a $600 to $900 cockpit from a Sim IM company. Easily acquired for $60. Building it yourself with all the bells and whistles. Really liked your tutorial. It does give many others more options. I don't have any love for Logitech. I started with the rudder system and I couldn't find a cheaper one so I ended up going to the ace VPC anti-torque which is way up on the top shelf. Hey, different strokes different folks. Keep them coming 👊😎
looking at my first stick, mainly for war thunder sim. thanks for the review! better beginner stick than the NXT EVO? theyre so close in price, not too sure if the extra $15 gets me more with the WKB
@@littletweeter1327 if you are in the US you get free shipping on WW but not VKB, which makes the difference 60. If the difference is 15 after shipping, it's mostly a toss up. I liked the grip and button layout better on the Ursa, in like the feel of the hats and a couple other minor things on the GNX more
@@FalconsLedge what would you suggest for that price point? I really need a lot of buttons and a throttle for something like Star Citizen or Elite. I was looking at the cheaper thrustmaster but there's just like no buttons on that thing
@@captainfach two Winwing Ursa minors, nothing beats them in that price range, and you will not find more buttons for the money either. I have a review for them on my channel
Excellent, really enjoying this series. As a person with experience with a bunch of sticks and bases, in your opinion, what's the ultimate dual stick space setup for something like star citizen? Would it be VKB Gunfighter IV bases with SCG grips, or something from Virpil?
@@eric90000 for dual stick any high end gimbal would be great. The real choice comes down to grips. Now, Virpil is coming out with new grips that could change this dynamic, but the consultation alpha had ergonomic issues when used as a side stick in my opinion. Its shape is based on a center stick (F18), so it's shape is far from ideal, it's face is centered (obviously for aesthetics) which is also not ideal for side stick use. Imo the SCG is well designed for side stick, especially if you have smaller hands. If you have larger hands, the MCG-U/MCG Pro left is a good solution as is the T50 grips from Virpil. I'm only seeing the right hand version of the new FLNKR grip, so that wouldn't be an option.
@@FalconsLedge thanks! Yeah, I watched your video where you discuss the Constellation Alpha grip ergonomics concerns, and I have also seen info about the hats not being gated which isn't ideal. Those new Aeromax grips from Virpil do look interesting... Hopefully they'll send you some so you can do a review 😂
@@eric90000 from what I understand the new grips from Virpil (FLNKR, Aeromax) still are ungated. Maybe their design is improved or different switches? One can hope. Also the Aeromax still seems very girthy, but the face didn't look centered so perhaps there will be some improvement.
I have one after T.Flight HOTAS 4. And it feels much better than what I had before. The amount of buttons, switches, hats available is huge. My main complains are: 1. The throttle has to be connected directly to the PC USB port, otherwise it has ghost inputs. I tried several USB hubs with a power supply and still it happened. 2. Rotating knobs on the throttle handle are "flickering". If I try to use them for e.g. zoom in DCS, then I find myself with epileptic change of zoom (one step range, but it is still annoying) and a need to either zoom in or zoom out a bit to make it stable.
@@LiveseyMD yeah well you went from a t.flight. for what you paid, those issues are absolutely unacceptable. When the X56 came out it had no competition at this price point. That is no longer the case. Logitech doesn't give a flying crap about combat Sims. The product today is the same as it was 10 years ago. It's shameful.
@@FalconsLedge Well it works for now and at the moment I am not at the upgrade point. Probably when it fails I'll invest money into something much more reliable.
@@user-hw5we9rj6b no, the dad part is that I paid money to be horribly disappointed by this pile of garbage. There are considerably better sticks for your money. Logitech sells absolute trash.
Thanks for this very informative video, I will be buying this stick! I was just wondering if you could speak a bit about the haptic feedback. Did it work well? Did it correspond well to actions from the game? Thanks!
Someone that doesn't have access to that 767a grease, with Teflon tape be sufficient. Or Vaseline simple Vaseline. I've seen you can use Teflon but they did not specify Teflon tape. Or is there a special Teflon grease? The reason why I asked it will be specifically for helos or Hilo is my natural habitat in life and in DCs. Of course we're flying the DCS Apache and Huey's of such not the actual US army due to primary logistics. There are some bugs in there. Also, as far as the mods on DCS. Hopefully they'll get that worked out. I pull a 180 in the Apache and it wants to freaking drop to the ground even with full collective. I'm using the same demonstration and I do have the dampeners now. I just want to know if it'd be proficient to use Teflon tape. Just wrap it once and slide it back in. Or simple thin Vaseline cuz I don't have that type of Grease. What are your thoughts?
This review kinda shocked me, I'm currently on a Thrustmaster TM16000 with throttle and quite like it but its getting worn out. I'm gonna wait and save up for Virpil HOSAS instead and just extend there, should have enough life in the HOTAS not to worry about it. Since I'm an EE guy that likes his buttons, some points you meantioned are a big nono for me
@@FalconsLedge I heard as much sofar, and I have a feeling the 1000€ spend might be worth it considering it is not... that much more than other manufactureres for what you get.
Re greased clutches: Apples to oranges, maybe, but as I keep telling folks: I've experienced my GF Mk III with its clutches in three states: 1. Out of the box with bad or "spoiled" factory-grease on there 2. Completely de-greased after cleaning, so with no grease whatsoever. 3. Re-greased with fresh stuff after cleaning The only state in which the stick performed as I would've expected was 3. With spoiled grease on there, the stick was un-usable because it was ridiculously sticky and would not give me the level of precision you'd even get from, say, a MS SW FF2. De-greased was better but still would get imprecise with any sort of clutch applied. Only once I put fresh grease on there did the stick start to justify its price-tag. Note: I'm talking about damping grease, in this case the Nyogel 767A-equivalent I raided from my VKB Gladiator's built-in "spare grease stash". So, yeah... I would *definitely* recommend at least giving greased clutches a go - not sure if the VPC gimbals come with pre-applied damping grease, but this stuff really is a game-changer if you want to run any sort of harder dampening on your axes. Re the VPC-gimbals: Man, these things look positively gigantic compared to my VKB. I sure hope you'll be able to get your hands on a GF-gimbal for a head-to-head (-to-head)-comparison. One thing I'm really envious about the VPCs is the fact that you can adjust pre-tension and clutches on the fly. Setting the clutches on the VKB-gimbal is a bit of an operation and involves quite a lot of disassembly/re-assembly if I want to do it right.
The new gunfighter IV fixes that issue. you do have to take the dust cover off, but you can mount the stick without it, set it up as you want, then put the dust cover back on without completely unmounting the stick.
@@1SaG I've had experience with the gunfighter, I had one for two years. I've experienced them in basically all forms. I now have experience with all of the high end gimbals except the AVA. I would love to test the Gunfighter 4, but affording one is a bit of a challenge at the moment, maybe in the future.
@@MCP2002 I had no issues with the GF3. But a properly tuned CM3, considerably better. The MCGU grip is definitely better than the constellation though.
@FalconsLedge Agree to disagree on the CM3 (though I do enjoy mine). I've had a CM3 for a while and am pretty well-versed in tuning it. It never felt as precise. Definitely agree on the MCGu, it's amazing. :)
@@FalconsLedge Thanks for the reply, btw my critiques are towards the company obviously, not you :) for example they keep listing the z-axis module on their site for years so customer will buy the orion2 with the idea that it will come out, what a crappy move of them, don't you think?
@@FalconsLedge I believe too that pedals are better but that's not why I'm crapping on them, first of all what are they redesigning for 2-3 years now? it's not rocket science :D and secondly if you don't have it then unlisted from your store, it is misleading the customers and make them buy the combo package with the hope that soon they can buy z-axis module which is false
I think I'll get the vkb ones even though more expensive for a couple of reasons, I think quality wise the gimbal is better and second winwing as a company is a little iffy om certain things and dishonest and that matters
If I were to split up the components and say which are better for each it would be as follows: VKB: gimbal, hats, software, serviceability, customer service, sensors Winwing: value, price, ergonomics, quick customization, button count
@@fabioccio8863 id buy Winwing, the new cheap throttle from Virpil before The WH. I'd buy the VKB STECS before the WH. In terms of value proposition, it goes WW>VPC Cadet > VKB > VPC CM3 > WH
It isn't easy to get it perfectly dialed in. If you really really want fssb, imo you are better off going with dedicated fssb. Check out Tianhang, he makes great stuff for not to much money.
im kind of torn. I have an x52 pro and I bought an original run x55 (I pre-ordered which obviously I regret). I love the x55 but it failed catastrophically. I bought the tools and wire to re-wire it, but every time I take it apart I decide im in too deep and close it back up lol. I was considering getting an x56 since it's gone through at least 2 revisions (x56 is a revision on x55, and then logitech made further adjustments to wiring and also supposedly replaced electronics). my x55 stick still works fine and I personal haven't had any of the common issues people have with them, and I use it with the x52 pro throttle since my dual throttle has like a dozen broken wires internally.
Dont sell yourself short! These are not good devices. Keep using your throttle and buy a Winwing Ursa Minor for a stick. You will be in a different world of improvement over anything Logitech produces. There is a reason why Logitechs ecosystem is dead. It's outdated, horrifically bad quality, and they absolutely don't care about combat Sims they are just leaching off old IP for a free bucks.
I think this one is great for VR use! Big knops and I believe a good feelable orientation cause of the different shapes of buttons and dials you can find orientation! I will try this one out
If I were in this budget range, I would go for the Ursa. This is not a knock on VKB. Great company, great community, and great products. But bang for your buck, the Ursa is top dog right now.
thank you for the nice documented review. Always ni e to have real argument and comparison. Is there any dream fonction that you would love to have on the alpha?
Lower right button on the face changed to a hat, face moved towards the center by a bit to center hats on extended thumb. Grip narrowed a bit, more to the thickness range as the F16 grip. hats changed to 5 way gated hats. Those changes would make it the best grip on the market.
I don't disagree, literally everything went wrong while making this, from losing my first two full videos, to audio problems, to time issues, and it goes on and on. I'm just glad it got out
My exp with VKB today "I guess the proper name for the switch in question is a "Trigger switch" yes? now all I need is how to replace the switch i can find nothing on youtue on our VKB's forum. I'm not too pleased on how VKB expects me to change the trigger without instructions is that too much to expect??? how about you take all my VKB products in trade for a WINWING or VPRILE ...,.. ARE YOU GOING TO STAND BEHIND YOUR youtube WHAT!... AT 74 I THINK I CAN HANDLE REMOVING A BUNCH OF SCREWS IF THAT WHAT YOU WANT ME TO DO PROBABLY CROSS-THREAD THEM AND RUIN THE THROTTLE" coulden type I so pissed VKB wrong choice
All due respect, but all of the major brands are going to do the same things, they're going to send parts and try to help you fix it yourself. Its just too expensive to have you ship it to china and back. I'm sure if you get on VKB's discord people there would be able to help you change it.
Internals are quite different on the grip. Layout is similar, but only because it's kindof obvious how you would lay it out. Both companies are based out of China, and in China this is quite common, I doubt anything will come from it. Would I have preferred something more unique? Yes. But I'm quite happy people have a super value option.
Depends really. If you are on a constrained budget, it's a no brainer. If you already know you want to continue into the VKB ecosystem, or if some of the cons are deal breakers, then go for the NXT
@@FalconsLedge Indeed, my plan is to buy STECS (love the customizable setup) or CM3 (love the looks) + Gladiator NXT or Ursa Minor... But I am leaning towards VKB combo (STECS + G NXT). Ergonomics is the king.
Hi Bjorn, You've won our 3k subs giveaway of an F-4 Phantom from HeatBlur for DCS. Please contact me via my business email listed in my "about" section of my channel and I'll get you hooked up. If you already have the F-4 feel free to pass it on if you like.
@@henkolsonpietersen2242 I own VKB, but looking at the internals it's undeniable what they did lol. You can plug their stick into the Gladiator base and it works. People don't care about that stuff though, then wonder why all that's left is cheap knock off stuff. It would have been nice to see them not use a 1:1 stolen design, but WinWing must be hurting financially and needed to stop the damage VKB was doing to their inferior designs. All I am trying to say here is that when your competitor is winning, just steal their work and profit. You could apply the same thing to shopping. Can't afford something? Organize a flash mob and take it! It's 2024.
@@oni-one574 Yeah, and then everyone loses. When VKB is unviable due to their designs being stolen, and WinWing is unable to design a proper budget option, who will be doing it then? Intellectual property is there for a reason. Can't afford something? Go and get a job, it's 2024.
@@oni-one574 Yeah, and then everyone loses. When VKB is unviable due to their designs being stolen, and WinWing is unable to design a proper budget option, who will do it? Intellectual property is there for a reason. Can't afford something? Go and get a job, it's 2024. You're not entitled to luxury...
@@Spelljammer1 right now I have only this loaner and the MSR, but I haven't been playing a lot of SC. Been playing mostly DCS when I get a chance to fly.
Looking to upgrade to these from the t16000m where they "snap" back its main location. Watching these just glide on the axis was a concerning thing. Hope im not sounding dumb lol
After 600+ hours in DCS, about 100 in FS20 and recently dabbled into Star Citizen I'm looking to upgrade from my 3 year old T16k. I guess this would be better, but not considered a big upgrade?
@@FalconsLedge Good to know! I was looking at the VKB Gladiator but this appears to be a competitor for a good price. Do you have any top recommendations for stick+throttle for a maximum of 3-500 euros?
@@TheTomster94 few options: 1. A second Ursa with Omni adapter with the z spring out, acts as a throttle. I'm not sure if you mean 3-500 total for both or what. If I was buying a hotas for that much I'd buy the Winwing Orion 2 hotas.
@@FalconsLedge I was indeed thinking about a total budget for both the Throttle and the Stick. Looked at the VKB Gunfighter at first but it is just too expensive. Winwing looks like a decent middle ground!
