£1800 vs £8000 Gravel Bike 

I think videos like these that are more for the normal, every day rider, is what's needed. MOST of us are just hobby riders and don't want or need to spend a fortune on a bike, but it is so hard to sort out what's important and what's not so important to spend extra money on for a everyday, all around bike.

Scott doesn't get the respect it deserves. They do make quality bikes and they do innovate whereas I feel a lot of the other brands play it safe and copy the trends. Besides, Scott bikes are SOOOOOOO beautiful looking

I really think a 1600 aluminum bike serves as a great bike, and you can destroy anyone with the appropriate fitness, and obnoxious kit. I just don't think the added money is worth it, I am even going back to aluminum on my mtb. Get out ride your bike and have fun.

It'd be great to see what upgrades you'd put on the budget bike to bring up the performance and see how close you can get it to the $3k bike feel

Like the format. Like that you both provide good reasons when providing opinions on the various aspects of the bike. I think adding a 3,000 pound version for comparison would be great! You both did a nice job.

You two are the best duo on youtube. You have take Jimmy to a loooong bike packing trip with you. That guy is a genuinely funny.

"You make friends with golfers so they don't hit you with golf balls" - Jimmy 2023

I think you could probably upgrade the cheap bike to make it feel significantly more comfortable, while still keeping the total price under £3000. Stuff like tubeless, better tyres, new saddle and handlebars could already make a massive difference and get it much closer to the feel of the expensive bike.

Nice to see you guys doing videos together again! keep 'em coming!!

Silca.. good choice. From what I can tell this is a serious company. Meaning they won't sell any kinda of crap just to make profit. Silca sincerely strives for quality in all the things they sell. Respect.

...+ it's good to see "Jimi-Arm-Thing" (@3:40) again...

thank you for the video Francis it's always great when Jimmy's on board

Great video Francis! I've been on and off watching your channel for a few years and I have to say they've been getting even more amazing every month. I'm now watching pretty much all of them these days. Definitely agree with some other comments here - great analysis, and it would be great to see a follow-up video throwing a mid-range bike in the mix.

Excellent format! And very believable discussion allowing greater insight into the 'value for cost' aspect.

Yes, thank you for mentioning Sora and Tiagra. It seems far too many people forget about how big these groupsets are and immediately jump to 105 and above. My first bike was a Sora (and Microshift) build and my commuter bike was Tiagra, both incredible pieces of kit for the money, and I’d bet a big part of Shimano’s sales. Look forward to some future videos on them…

My experience of the "cheap" vs expensive is quite a bit different so I suspect this is one of those situations where the results of other comparisons would vary a lot. I'm currently riding a 2013 Giant Defy 1. That's an aluminum frame with carbon fork and seat post. It originally came with a mix of 105 and unlabeled Shimano components. I've upgraded everything that wasn't to 105 and put much better wheels on. The best part was everything I added, with the exception of the wheels which I bought used, was second hand new...components people had bought for projects and never got to them...so effectively new but at very reasonably prices. This past fall I had an opportunity to spend a few hours riding a 2022 Defy 1 I was considering buying. (It had been a rental from a local shop and they clear out their rental fleet at the end of each season.) Full carbon and full (mechanical) Ultegra. The cost of the new bike would have been about 5 times what I paid for my older bike. The difference? The shifting on the new Ultegra was simply glorious...just incredibly smooth and quick. Everything else? Meh. Perhaps I just don't ride far enough or fast enough, or I am just not sophisticated enough to detect the differences, but there wasn't much in it. I dream about finding a bike that is as big a leap ahead as my Defy was from it's predecessor, but the upshot is I'm still riding my 2013 bike. I'd love a new one, and I'd love to have that Ultegra groupset, but for now I'll spend the money on trips with the old bike.

Brilliant. I normally bore of this type of chat about the ins and outs of which equipment is better than which. But you treated it fairly and meaningfully. I would welcome stuff like this. And you've got me inspired to design a bike for myself. I'll start with a good, light frame and equip it with mid-range components such as Tiagra which you mentioned. That could be the sweet spot. The biggest trick for me would be to find a suitably lightweight frameset and wheels on a low budget.

Enjoyed the format 👍 First video I’ve seen your mate on, he’s good. You both work well together

Thanks for this video. So informative! Took a lot of information to take into consideration for the Gravel I want to buy this year.

I got the 2021 scott speedster with a Tiagra group set. The have made it more gravel-ish in over two years, terms of tire clearance, geometry (and handlebar). My version is pretty aggressive and „raw“, for a gravel bike but Scott offers very good performance for the money

GRX groupsets - totally agree. Great around performance. I mean I love my Di2 on my road bike but I never feel like anything isn't working absolutely bang on the money when I'm out on the gravel / winter bike (£1800 orbea Terra) - pound for pound its an absolute belter.

Enjoyed this format and the interactions between you…it was super…

The last few minutes with the wrap up. Gold content imo

great video & like the format. Well put together. running self built mason bokeh, ekar (group set). it was the only components i could source during lockdowns.

Amazing review video - comparison works well as a format. Great to see Jimmie back in the show -

You and Jimmy together is just the best 👌 great video as always 👌🤙🤙

I liked this format and that 8 grand Scott looks so good. I’m new to gravel bikes mine is a cervelo aspero rx600. Great vid👍

Love this new format. Please keep ‘em coming! Oh, and I second that the Silca Nastro Cuscino is lovely! I run them on all my bikes. The thickest ones. In black. The white one yellowed out in a day 💀

Excellent video Francis! Have been scouring YT for in-depth info on the Scott Speedster Gravel range especially for geometry comparisons but this by far is the most info I’ve got on the bike. May I suggest the following upgrades to bring down the weight substantially? 1. Parcours wheelset - For my riding, I would choose the 1,400gm Ronde with the Hutchinson Overide 38mm tyres (tubeless, of course!) to save a bit more weight while retaining functionality. Standard X25 wheels are approx. 2100gm. 2. Carbon seatpost - More comfort, slight weight saving. 3. Carbon handlebar/handlebar-stem combination - Again, more comfort, slight weight saving. 4. Selle Italia saddle - Definitely one of the best around, I personally use the Selle Italia SLR Boost Endurance, the one you use is lighter still. 5. If you had to go all the way and really make it a focused build for a particular type of riding then a single Rotor crank. Even without number 5, I reckon that this could be a shade under 10kg but with a vastly more comfortable ride quality. Looking forward to a future build and as always, amazing content man!

I have a marin gestalt gravel bike with 2x9 sora groupset and i absolutely love it! It gets the job done both on and off road so I would definitely agree that the cheaper groupsets are overlooked

Nice video guys ! I run a Giant ALX mtb with shimano and a carbon cinelli Zydeco gravel bike with campagnolo groupset . Both completely different in terms of riding . Gravel bike doubles up as a road bike and mtb great for real off road 👍

Enjoyed the new format, thanks

I'm a London Cycle Courier and I use a Tiagra groupset (disc) with a Fyxation Quiver frame, which is a gravel design if you're not familiar with it. Tiagra is decent but you have to keep an eye on the calibration and the chainwheel selection mechanism broke internally but tbf that was probably after around 18,000 miles heavy use although it shouldn't really happen. After a bit of haggling with a side-order of charm I got this replaced on warranty. It happened to the gear selector too but my mechanic fixed it himself with a bit of ingenuity. I'm probably not a good example as I do incredibly high mileages each week compared to commuters and weekend mamil's. But when someone who reckoned he knew a thing or two said to me "Tiagra is sh*t", I just replied he had no idea and was mistaken. I got a discount (Courier perk!) on the groupset but in my world it was still quite a lorra money! Love the channel 👍😁.

Fun to see Jimmy in your recent videos!

I like the format, I have a similar tier bike as the low end one and it has gotten me through several thousand miles of fun and wind over the last few years. Biggest difference for me over my old bike was the hydraulic brakes and it actually fitting sorta right

Great vid. I have a 2021 Cube Nuroad EX gravel bike that was about £1700 when I brought it.. I immediately ditched the home branded wheels and brought (eventually 3 pairs!) new hoops with the main ones being DT Swiss GR1600s and some Mavic all road pros while of course making them tubeless. Bar tape, saddle and chain were also swapped out to parts I trust and like.. It rides like a far more expensive bike now despite only changing the points of which I touch on the bike and where it touches the road. The 3 sets of wheels have varying Shwalbe G-one tires varying from Allroads to ultra bites to use depending on weather/terrain I am riding on... One thing I also did was change the standard Shimano brake pads to ceramic pro ones made by Disco brakes. A mega cheep upgrade that improves the performance massively. Final note.. As an ex MTB racer and someone who has toyed with road bikes for 35 years I LOVE gravel bikes and in fact find it faster on bumpy towpaths and mild single track to my mountain bikes.

Totally agree on your comments about modern Tiagra. It may be 10 speed, but works just as nice as 105 or Ultegra. A new bike buyer than can test ride different options will see for themselves.

Love this new video format! Keep it up lads, I want to see this £3k build gravel beast killer bike. Keep these 1vs1 bike comparison bike reviews coming ❤

First, I wanna say I really enjoyed this video. Watched it a few times. Honest and fair assessment of both bikes. The few points you highlighted, saddle, bar, and tyre set up, are all things rider specific, as we know, we all usually swap them out straight away. Tubeless set up would have been good for the test tbh. I'd love the £1800 Scott, for my needs, perfect, unfortunately I'm jobless atm, but in time, I hope to buy a gravel bike. Great content mate, as usual. Thank you 👍

Great vid Francis. Interesting and well put together. I ride an Orro Terra C gravel bike with a 2x 105 groupset. I've spent most of my time riding with road guys but I'm doing my first gravel event this year and I can't wait to see how I get on.

I was riding a circa 2006 road bike until about a year ago, thinking "I don't need a new road bike, there just isn't that much difference". The bike fits me well and doesn't seem to hold me back on group rides. But, with that bike now well past 15 years old and on its 2nd, 3rd or 4th iteration of components, I finally broke down and purchased a new road bike with all the new goodies, wide / carbon rims and wide tires, disc brakes, Di2. I went on to get a 3D printed saddle, new stem and bars (to fit my body better) and swapped out the 52-36 chainrings for a 50-34 combo (quite hilly where I live). Making all of these changes had me questioning if I would have been better off just buying a frame and building it up exactly how I wanted, and if I were to do it again, I probably would go that route. Anyhow, with the bike completely dialed in and $10K US into my investment, I NEVER ride the old bike any more. The new bike is just about perfect. OK, did I need to spend as much as I did? Probably not, but I don't care, I love the new bike, fits me like a glove and it's flexible enough to do both road and gravel. I have ridden crap bikes for long periods of time in the past, and there is nothing wrong with that. You get out there, do your reps, get fit, have fun. With that said, the experience of riding my new roadie has provided some new perspective.

Loved this format

More of this please!!!!!

Interesting one, law of diminishing returns really. Would like to see that 3k GBP bike compared to the 8k GBP one. I personally think the 3k bike will be best bang for your buck 👍

I got Addict Gravel 30, which is the fourth in line, with GRX800/GRX600, plus Zipp303s. That is just below 3000 pounds bike. I would say up to this level, the difference in performance is huge, but from 30 (with carbon wheels) to Tuned, it must be pretty close.

I ride a Cannondale SuperSix with 105, and having never owned anything better than my dad's 40-odd year old Raleigh Record Ace, it absolutely blew my mind. The shifting is almost instant, the brakes are strong as I'd ever need, it works well enough that having never ridden anything Ultegra or Dura-ace or whatever, I'm genuinely not sure what (if any) noticeable difference there would be.

Great video! I like the idea of a diy frame build. I built a road bike up and been playing with different parts to make it feel right. Giant TCR frame, Sensah Empire Pro 11spd groupset, seems to have made a well rounded combo for cheap.

Im glad you have done this comparison. I've got the Speedster Gravel 20. It's pretty much the same as the 30 and has an 11 speed groupset. I've swapped out the saddle and handlebars and bought a carbon wheelset. I've saved over 1kg, which is great.

There is a fix for the spongey Sram brakes. I battled with them for two years. My LBS spoke with Sram and worked out a fix that finally made them crisp braking. They were thrilled to figure out the fix. I was glad to finally have brakes that worked.

Very entertaining video! Keep up the great work! Regarding your question at the end, I have a Canyon Grail AL 6 from last year, so the same entry level group set, quite comparable in about any aspect actually, but a bit cheaper. Basically the cheapest gravel bike they offer. I am pleased with the performance as one who just wants to use the bike the be fit, not racing or anything.

concerning how much I like this format: A little more random rambling and your back on track. 🍻

Fun and informative? Yeah, why not 👍 thanks guys - please do more

I own a Genesis CDA 20, aluminum frame, steel fork, swapped up the wheels for a DT Swiss Gr 1800 Spline pair, Conti Terra Trail 40 mm tubeless tires and Shimano Sora 2x9 with mechanical disc brakes. I’ve had it for 3 years now and taking into consideration that i was a total beginner cyclist when i bought it and that i am an okay cyclist now, i’d really like upgrading to a higher end bike. Never the less, my Genesis has been miss handled, beaten to the dirt, the gravel and untamed roads and i’ve gotta say i have rarely felt limitations. I ride with other people and my cheap bike doesn’t stop me from winning sprints and hills against dentists who own a 3000-4000€ worth gravel bike 😁 mine was worth 800€ when i bought it.

The Eagle AXS casettes are like $500, the XPLR are like $225. You save a few grams. You can change the 'sponginess' of SRAM brake distance with a set screw (depends on the line where the screw is), but my brakes are as snappy as your GRX in the video. It is really quick to do, you can pratically do it while riding. This is generally in the instructions that people throw away because they think they know better.

I absolutely hammered a a new Tiagra groupset on an old Scott Roadster (2007 frame I think?) that I rebuilt in 2019. I took that bike everywhere road, knarly gravel, bike packing, well over 2000miles and it never failed me (other than pads, chain, cassette / consumables etc.). It's so overlooked.

Content of this sort is exactly what folks need to see. While I drool over so many of the incredible bikes I've seen on Francis' and Jimmy's respective channels, they are simply outside of my financial reality. Added is the physical reality of weighing 98 kilos; I have to be far more circumspect about rider weight allowances and braking power. Finding the sweet spot between performance, durability, and price is incredibly confusing in the current market.

Loved the video and should definitely be a short series. Creating a 3k bike to simulate the feel of a 8k would be interesting to see

I currently ride a 2021 scott grave speedster with a ultegra swap and gator skin tires. Personally i think this is the perfect set up of road/light gravel riding. I am able to keep up just fine with my carbon road buddies and gravel junkies. Also great for long endurance rides!

I really enjoyed it, certainly a format that you could develop. Demystify groupsets, upgrades that are worth doing and their impact etc would work well.

Very Good!! I back in the 70s I would buy a custom frame and average group set and I really liked the ride. I find it difficult to find a deal on a good frame that could be built up like the old days. The frame cost is close to a bike cost yet the choices for biking are so complex. I look for parts and try putting various combinations together. I agree with your saddle,bar and tires. The best point you made I think is the cost of ridding with expensive part for all parts just need to be replaced and repaired. I do my own work but still very expensive for tools and parts.

8:05 We won't TRY to hit you with golf balls. LOL.

Thanks Francis and Jimmy....

Happy to see Jimmy again!

A very solid and fare comparison!

Very interesting video, love the format. I bought an aluminium canyon roadlite 7 with Ultegra last year. Tubeless, flat bars and 9 kilos it's one of the best bikes I have ever owned. It cost €1400.

Love the post swear bleep - that's proper funny! Great vid as ever!

A lump of chromoly steel gravel Vitus bike bought for £1k from wiggle in 2017, then gradually upgraded to grx800, with tubeless 650B wheels, 2.0" tubeless tyres, zero carbon parts and it weighs the same 11kg, WTF Scott???

great video,like the format

Got the Speedster Gravel 20 with Syncross Capital x40 carbon wheels setup tubeless. I found that to be the perfect sweetspot between price and performance. Even lower speced road and gravel bikes these days are SO good!

Fantastic video. So informative. Relatable!! 👌👌

Good stuff gents - 100% need a mid-range 3k bike comparison review

Dogland at the willows @ Newburn & Ryton ! 😅. Good comparitive Scott, gravel bike test there gents, nice to see jimmi back on the FC channel 👏

Great video. My road bike is Orbea Avant Sora with ultegra rim brakes. Love it and it's all the bike I need. Apart from the gravel bike I just bought. Vitus substance ,2x grx . Which was only £1000.

Good work guys and yes really enjoyed that.

Canyon sells their bikes with everything you need for tubeless. Rim tape already on, comes with a tubeless valve, etc. Good to go!

Nice to see Ryton Willows and Station Bank featured.

I’ve got the speedster gravel 30 so was great to see the comparison. The tyres supplied with it are not tubeless compatible though. My main reason for going for the speedster over the addict was versatility. I use the bike on occasion to take my daughter on so the ally frame means I can safely ride with a child seat. I then also have a second wheel set, Zipp 303’s for when I’m doing big rides to save some weight and add style points 👍

Really dreamed of getting a Scott Addict Gravel for a long time. It's just not readily available where I.'m from sadly plus the sizing is just too large. But really great to see these bikes in action. Currently running a Ceepo Rindo as my main bike and love it. Keep at it mates. Cheers! Ride safe.

Great vid! I'd be curious to see if carbon seatpost, handlebars and wheels would change the way this 1 800 bike feels. Is it worth to buy carbon parts for an alloy bike? And compare it to good set of tubeless tyres - which is better investment? And what happens, if you combine carbon parts and good tyres?

Absolutely keen on seeing a Tiagra/Sora/equivalent Sram groupset test!

I have a speedster gravel 30 with 2x11 GRX and love it. Changed the saddle but otherwise kept stock. My mate has a mid range carbon gravel bike, cracked seat stays after a few months and has to wait 6 months for his replacement frame. IMO alloy is the way to go for off-road

Awesome video. I got and canyon grail earlier this year and went for an Aluminium frame to keep the price down but managed to get an electronic SRAM rival etap group set and wow, it’s such a good setup, would love to see a video with a £3k setup like you mentioned. Cheers 🤙🏼

I actually own an EQ version of Speedster Gravel from last year. With fenders and all, it is even heavier. However, it was a very conscious decision, and with a few likewise planned upgrades (including going tubeless with the biggest tires the frame would swallow) it is a bike that can be nicked and banged, takes on a beating and keeps on coming. Removable rear rack, frame bag, bento box, and it is a hell of a commuter that you won't be too scared to lock to a post somewhere in the town. What you've said about the groupsets, I can only agree with. The 4700 series Tiagra that came on mine is such a satisfactory ride! Threw on a bigger cassette in the back to get at least a bit of "minus" gearing, found a deal on hydraulic brakes with levers, and the damn thing just sails through anything for 3000km already. City, Gravel, light singletrack, snow and sleet in the winter, ridiculous cobblestone descents... You CAN be satisfied with a cheaper bike.

I think the difference maker is the carbon and more specifically the carbon layup on more expensive frames. can make different parts of the frame stiffer or more supple to absorb some vibration and flex where they need to. and they can be so light too.

The black tape looks much better than the white tape! Never get the cheap one! If you do, you’ll eventually buy the expensive one anyway. I ride a Sage Titanium Barlow frame with GRX 800 mechanical shift (11 speed) one by, a Chris King bottom bracket (T47) and head set. The wheels are Roval Terra C with Panaracer Gravel King SS @35mm. I ride less on gravel than pavement. They’re quite fast on the road and hard pack conditions but not so good for mud. If it’s muddy I stay home which is more of a option in Southern California than the UK except when you were here!😂 We’re having the coldest and wettest winter we’ve had in quite a few years. My bars are Roval Terra and probably have the shortest reach and drop of any carbon bar and are very comfortable. The stem and seat post are Thomson Elite. Very strong! This build is a bit over $6000.

I definitely like the idea and format of this video. I do think the "budget versus expensive" comparison is a bit saturated. As others said, you bringing real..."from a rider" view of the differences like you did is a nice differentiator, and, I think extending to building up and riding that middle-ground bike would be cool. Whatever you do, if you keep your personal enthusiasm, and keep including your stellar mates, it'll come out well.

Your remark about replacement costs is very important on a mtb/cross/gravel bike. I remember how fast the components on my cross bike would deteriorate in one winter season. Just a few races. So glad I was running cheap 9-speed stuff. It lasts longer and is much cheaper to replace.. On one course, many expensive bikes where shedding their deraillers in the mud. My trusty Deore derailler was fine. Well, gravel is not mud or cross..

Fantastic Episode - Hands Down, Excellent Just seeing Jimmy's face was worthy of an $8,000 price tag Now here in Colorado, it was literally impossible to purchase a Scoot Bike. Scott doesn't wholesale from the UK and you MUST go through a bike shop. That Totally Blows!! Because of you FC and your videos, I tried in 2021 and half of 2022 to locate a Scott Addict 20 or 30 Gravel. Forget It So I purchased the RIBBLE SL Gravel. I am only bring this up because the tires and rims were tubeless ready but shipped with a tube. I did pay the bike shop $28 US dollars per wheel to switch over. I am very pleased with the ride and the "standard" parts are top shelf. Again, my point is that this episode kicks A$$ and is very entertaining. Well Done Boys, Cheers

Thank you

Thanks for such an informative video, I'm not a Gravel rider but you've definitely hit the right notes with the comparison between these 2 levels of kit. Would be great to see you do the same for road bikes!

I have a earlier Gravel bike that came with Sora, I’ve over the last 5 years upgraded the groupset to get hydraulic braking, and last year new wheels to go tubeless both where dramatic upgrades. The gearing is barely noticeable, slightly better range with Tiagra cassette 34 vs 32/11 both shifted well.

Great video guys! 2 years ago, I brought a vitus gravel bike, spec’ed with sram apex. Love the bike, except the brakes. I've always riden Shimano, never had an issue, but these sram apex brakes never feel quite right. Even after multiple bleeds, switching to uberbikes pad, etc, etc.

Water Lane in Ryton, that’s my mates house on the top of the bank. Just a mile away from me. Nice seeing you ride along the Keelman’s & round the Willows.

I have a Sram Force Mullet on my gravel bike love it.

Just been able to get hold of GRX 815 - the Di2 2X group set that has been unobtainable due to supply chain issues for a couple of years. Now thinking about a frameset to put it all on. I currently ride a 2020 Specialized Diverge Sport but I've ridden it on a fair few long multi day bikepacking rides now so I'm thinking of going for either a new DIverge frameset or a Trek Checkpoint SL frameset. My Roval Terra C wheel set will migrate over too and I'll get the Pro DIscover bar and stem to run the wires and hoses internally. My old Diverge Sport will then transition to a road bike...

It isn't mud... it is forestry gravel! 😛

Nice video, tkx!

I like Jimmy's "if you can ride the more expensive one, do it!" I've gotten so used to my road bike being under 7kg that I've had to rethink other bikes & what's acceptable to me. I'm also getting older and I don't have the same power & time to ride as I did.

Parcours tubeless wheels, same tyres as the addict tuned, a carbon bar & seatpost, a saddle of your choice, and you're not far off that £3k bike. That's where the sweetspot is - perhaps add a GRX 11 speed mech to go 1x with an 11-42 10 speed cassette to make it as close to the carbon bike. Pull ratios for 11 speed mech and 10 speed levers were the same for my Tiagra 4700 shifters and R7000 derailleur

On my cheap carbon winter bike I found it a really harsh ride and was upset with myself for not spending a bit more for a quality frame. Then I tried the VCLS seatpost from my summer canyon on it and transformed the ride completely. Now I WANT to ride it rather than feel like I have to when it’s wet. It also has a Frankenstein group set with SRAM force levers and brakes, Rival mech & cassette, GRX chainset with 105 left side power meter, Ultegra pedals & KMC chain. Works just as well as when it had a full Force groupset!