@@hammerhiem75 You have your numbers reversed. It is NOT affecting 0.001% of players. I have yet to have a week in the past few months where we get knocked out of current position by a last min Trunda team.
@@snypergotya Says the guy named snypergotya . In regard to the 0.001%, how do you count as more than 1 player? Out of hundreds of thousands... which would actually make it more like 0.00001%.
I mean if some people start quitting it will effect their bottom dollar. I can’t complain though because I have a trunda yumeko team and so does everyone else in my clan as I’m in a top 10 clan in the whole game. My trunda key does 80 billion too my teamates keys do 200 billion. I’m a baby Trunda key. I did spend a pretty penny to get my team I think I spent like 10000 dollars on voids I don’t think Trunda is necessarily broken it’s the double Yumeko reset that breaks it.
I think Hydra clash system is just fundamentally flawed. It needs a complete rework from the ground up if they want it to be a system that people enjoy and feel rewarded for
How about a point system instead of basing it only on damage? Hit the minimum on Normal you get 1 point, Hit the max on Nightmare you get 10 points. Then it graduates between those. So like if you got the minimum on Nightmare you get 5 points .
In our clan and also in the previous one we always was arguing about Hydra. People are frustrated from randomness, matchmaking system and time consumption. System is not good but also the boss is not designed well. The boss is toxic and Trunda is only a cherry on top. It actually does not matter how much dmg my teams score because based on my dmg I got stronger opponents next time.
@@hal2735 that would take care of every reset champ, so people would just build for that instead actually fighting the hydra so i'm not sure that would help much but adding a mechanic like hydra getting an instant turn when there's a reset, and decapitated heads getting 2 instant turns could theoretically work
They just need to reward clans for participating in Hydra Clash. Most people don't care if they get 1st or 3rd, they just want protection and ss accessories. Give people who hit 650M 1 or 2 pieces regardless of placement. Simple! rewards people for attempting a key and doesn't hurt the competition aspect.
And primal shards... Like this is the worst rewards for items... Might as well charge for a monthly sub at this point. Or make gold 6 now since mythic teams are coming and and effing people up
I disagree, you gotta work for that chest cuz it feels good when you finally get it. Expecting it just because would ruin that. Reeks of participation trophy.
@@davidrichardson956 Yo but for many acounts its hard work to hit 15m dmg on normal and you need a many key champions and overall decent speed to do that. Give those people something if they do way more than the 6.6m.
@davidrichardson956 it's a video game, you do get rewards for participating, dude go play an actual sport if you want to complain that you aren't being as rewarded for opening up your wallet
how about making trunda's a2 skill both immune to cooldown reductions AND immune to cooldown increases from lockout champs on the enemy team... so trunda would be getting a very limited nerf as well as a small buff at the same time
The gap between the top clans and the rest will only get bigger when a lot of people struggle to kill Amnius which gives one of the best PVE sets and higher-level accounts are killing him every rotation. Another thing is that they have to watch new champs design more carefully otherwise they will face the same issue over and over again - cheesing hydra damage to billions. This is hardly possible even with a big QA team so it is better to just tune the rewards to all clans.
Thanks for talking about this issue and bringing it to the top. With the upcoming hydra clashes something has to be done about those Teams, otherwise ppl will lose interest in hydra for the simple fact that they cant compete. My teams combined to around 11B total dmg on Hydra, and yet im blown out by asingle Yumeko/trunda comp. And im running champs like Acrizia and Archer. I hope there will be a change otherwise its a grim future for Hydra and everyone who wanna play. Btw Saph, current non Trunda WR on Nightmare is 5.1B. Gharol, Toshiro, Krisk, Lydia, Firrol and Mikage. (pre Slayer nerf)
I would buff Serpent’s Will buff by adding a Revive on Death effect with MAX turn meter. This will essentially force the heads to take turns while avoiding disrupting normal teams.
Edited this in... I seem to have double posted instead of overwriting this post. The other one is laid out better. As this already has some thumbs up I'm leaving it here but please read my other post as I slightly altered it, and added/made bullet points at the same time. One way to reduce the overall score without the fix is simply to make hydra teams like LA gold where you cannot have dupes in the same team. This would remove the double Yumiko problem as Paylarium will not "fix" either Trunda, or Yumiko. It won't solve the problem entirely ofc, but the overall score will be significantly lower. Add your idea (@Saph) of a 1 turn damage immunity for respawning heads, and it will bring this number down even further too. If you really want to cap the scores, then only have original champs for all 3 keys counting towards hydra clash points, so if you run a second Trunda, and/or Yumiko in another team, those points won't count towards the hydra clash, only the first key submitted with these champs will. This would ensure a fair playing field for all, and possibly bring equalization to this absurdly broken team comp. I know people will say that this isn't fair as they may have double Acrizia, or using a Shamael/Uugo in all 3 teams, but this will make it unique and allow for more variety/theory crafting in hydra too. Swings and roundabouts I'm afraid. If you want a chance at winning the clash, then you also have to sacrifice something in return, or wail on and hope Paylarium change it. Good luck with that I say, unless an all out strike takes place to twist their arm nothing will change #notplayinghydraclash lol However, to go along with that there must be two things added to the rewards system... 1. All 5 clans get a participation reward chest as mentioned. 2. Right now you must reach 35+mil to get a reward box if you place in the top 3. All members of a clan that reaches any weekly reward box 6.66+mil in normal, should also get the reward box for their contribution in helping the clan place in the top three. This is a clan wide contest, so no one who helps the clan reach a placement by participating should be left out. I do say however that achieving the lowest personal box in any difficulty is the only proviso to getting the award.
_It tells me when the use of double champs..._ _The players aren't being resourceful,_ _I did alot of damage from what I had,_ _...Without having double champs but gear dependant !!!_ [[ ADDED NOTE: LIVE ARENA PVP HAS DOUBLE CHAMP RESTRICTIONS ]]
I am not sure who said it but someone had the idea of giving points not for the damage but for the ranking you score. The one with the most points gets a score of X, secondplace gets Y and so on. It would fix the issue that one team can't dominate all teams of another clan. But it would make it less rewarding for the clans where only a few try hard. So it's also not perfect. I would still prefer a balance of champs who are breaking the game.
In all fairness I did give a friendly warning in your livestream that I have a 100+ bil key. Not sure if you remember. I said if you weren't planning on taking 2nd place, you would be 4th. The reason also that I only did one key was to give u a good video to show to Plarium, I was thinking "1 key vs Clan Hydra Clash." Something along those lines for the video title. No hate, like your videos.
I have exactly this team with double yumekos + trunda. Before that I had with corpulent cadavar. A few thoughts about the current hydra clash content: On the one hand we could all get annoyed with teams with cadavar and now with trunda and on the other hand we forget what is the coolest thing about this game. When I started playing Raid a few years ago what attracted me to this game the most was the possibility to achieve certain results/goals by different spobes. It was up to me as a player whether I made good results or not. If I wasn't able to grasp the game, didn't know what items to keep and what items to upgrade then I would never be able to achieve good results. Anyone who has ever had the opportunity to try to create a team with corpulent must have known that the team was incredibly difficult to create. The main problem here was the equipment, which really at that time had to be incredibly selective. This high scores was intended mainly for end game players. You had to earn it decently. Literally after the cry of very many players this team was nerfed. Now we have another team with a trunda that requires much, much less to create than with a corpulent and the same thing happens - we have the cry again. So maybe it is worth considering, why destroy such compositions that came straight out of the game mechanics ( shield with corpulent ) and accept one just because it is a legendary character ( Trunda ). If more teams of this type appear then the competition will automatically improve. Soon there will be new characters, new mechanics, new teams, and some players will probably figure out how to combine them to achieve better results. As a reminder, the highest score achieved by a corpulent team on nightmare is 43B, while trundle teams have already reached 83B. Corpulent teams should not be nerfed if they don't want to do anything about the broken trundle. There is no consistency in these actions. Creating a limit for Acrizia, Gnut and other Max HP heroes who can be more effective on Hydra when the broken trunda is active. This is really bad. They are making fun of us. Hydra may be a big problem, but I see a bigger one in the long run. In the last few years we could see many exclusive heroes that are no longer available to get. For example - game changer ninja, xena, all 5 monster hunter world champions (Archer) It's so crazy, so broken. You can think of yumekos, trunda and other heroes, but you will be able to get them in the future, but the champions I mentioned earlier, unfortunately you can't get anymore. In the future perspective, this can definitely reduce the number of players. At the moment, I know many people who are more pissed off because of that. At the end I want to remind you that all teams with yumekos trunda + yumekos corpulent requires amazing gear which you can only make yourself when you have consumed enough time for this game. It's not that you will achieve amazing results just because you have these characters. Let's stop crying and also accept the fact that it takes a lot of patience, time and dedication to raid the right gear to achieve something in MMO games.
Nah fam, the real problem is Hydra's mechanics; they need a solid rework. Most people say "a lot less RNG" and I could agree, but that's also what sort of makes Hydra, Hydra. I think what really needs to happen is; once you decap one head; all other heads gain a damage protect buff, and a reduced speed debuff, and have their turn meters dropped to 0. This way, your choice in head decap can (and will) matter; as you can prevent certain things and manipulate the heads a bit more, while not being able to go "kill all heads, keep all heads dead with damage multipliers". Also, this isn't a unique setup as Saph mentions; there are a few ways to build this team; and some have even put forward some crazy setups with Rathalos taking the place of Trunda, obviously not as effectively, but still doing significant amounts of damage. That said; nerfing Champions is never going to feel good, for anybody; the time and effort most players have to put into building a team like this, only to have it nerfed on a random thursday and unusable afterwards is just silly and disproportionate. Now, if players could just build champions faster, like making Mino mastery farming less of a headache than it is, potion keeps, etc. maybe even throwing out some more gear every once in a while... (Dragon/FK/Spider/ 25 should drop more epics than blues imho). Cursed City is an area of the game that just feels, weird. It's meant for the more established accounts that have rosters to utilize the rotations. Imagine you have 2 Undead champs built (1 for IG, and another for say Arena), and 2 Knights Rev (a boss killer and a debuffer), and 0 Sacred Order just because you pulled loads of "bad" champs and never built them; you have 0 nukers for a stage that would use those 3 factions. So you go as far as you can, but sometimes you can slip your way through the whole city, just to get roflstomped by a boss you don't have a champion to nuke for you. It's silly because it's very much intended for well established accounts; but you can move around (at least normal mode) fairly easily for the first few stages, but after that it's a crap shoot; did you get any good FK hard champions in the faction for that boss level? If not, GL with that shield.
I'm glad that in my hydra clash, the teams are only hitting between 1.2 and 1.9B points. There's a few people with a trunda, but they hit 200-300m, which isn't that crazy.
its not the champs that are unbalanced in hydra. its the matchup balance, it is broken at every lvl. it should be based on clan power, but it isnt. 400m pp should not be matched with 200m pp clans, don't care if someone has Trunda.
10:18 my biggest (original) gripe with Hydra & 'Serpents will' is that Head of Decay spawning into a game after a destroyed head resets can ruin a run simply because he comes into the match without a cooldown on his cleanse. Same with Head of Mischief if you're not running a mischief tank...You can target and burn down these heads individually, but spawning back in with all their skills off cooldown and racing against a single turn meter bar to prevent a run being ruined...completely...is obnoxious. To progress, you build control teams. To win Hydra clash, you build nuker teams...Personally, Turvold and Hexes was a great burn it down build for hydra before pulling a Trunda...So single target smackdown seemed legit, but every point of extra damage on a Trunda will always outscale anything else available right now. All I got to add.
In case my comment didn't get seen last hydra video - serpent's will should reduce damage to (1). Excluding damage dependent debuffs is too limiting. I also want to point out that during the togron fiasco, I noticed in my clan the motivation to push damage beyond reward thresholds was crushed - what difference does it make if I do 40m or 200m on nightmare - the 10b points my clanmate did is going to carry me. My final thought is that Plarium is de-motivated to introduce "participation rewards" for hydra. Binary prize structure (get something or get nothing) pushes the absolute min/max strategy that causes kraken spending - don't hold your breath for 4th and 5th place prizes.
My problem with blocking the dmg while Surpent Will it"s on is that you have 1500 turns to deal some dmg and this way you would lose hundreds of turns dealing 0 dmg. If the hydra head gets block dmg at 50%hp while under SurpentsWill buff that would be much better.
More user friendly idea for Serpents Will would be to also give reborn heads protected unkillable buffs for 2 turns. That would force Trunda teams to deal with the heads' mechanics too without having much impact on the regular players.
I have been playing since the Sir nic fusion, spend couple of ten thousands on shard packs and still no trunda. Got 3 nia's, 2 emics so I could make this team work if only...
It is not only the Trunda Issue for the Top Clans but also the Trogon/Yannicka problem for low to midlevel Clans. In our Clash one player made 25,79 billion Clahspoints with Trogon, Yannicka, 2xAniri, Trunda and Shamal. All of the other Players of all Clans in our Clashgroup combined (226 Keys in Total) made around 14,3 Billion points. One player made nearly twice than everyone else combined
Do really enjoy you two talking about subjects, very similar mindsets but always looking at different perspectives. Would like a good HH team conversation around big topics or a few smaller ones.
You are right, Trunda Clash is out of control I hope Plarium will find something to fix it and also find a way to reduce the time we spend playing our 3 keys Hydra is a very nice and complex game mode but it just takes toooooo much time
The no dmg idea is really a bad one imo. It is gonna really lower the dmg of teams that are not hitting high numbers. It will make the 30 million dmg requirement harder to achieve, it will make it harder to one key for people still just fighting for that, and it will not fix the Trunda issue at all. It will just lower the Trunda numbers but Trunda will still put out insane dmg comparatively.
@@boZo420_how about if they just made it so the new heads couldn’t take more than 10% in one hit ? Sort of like the enemy max hp caps for bosses, but instead it applies to all incoming dmg
@@lambsauce8545 that’s a better idea for sure, however, if they were to do that it still would not address the Trunda issue. She has 2 multi hits in her kit and I am not sure how her a2 is coded it may also be a multi hit when the dmg is applied to the bosses. I think this is way better of an idea that would not screw up lower level player however it does not address the real problem which is the Trunda teams.
The 35M minimum needs to be changed. I'm in a small clan and my clan mates with newer accounts push to help us win and they get nothing because they fall short of the minimum...
My account is 4 years old & I struggle to make 35 million, so dropping the cap really needs to be there for newer players. It should not be points minimum, just 1st 2nd 3rd.
Maybe if they cap dmg just like at arena that even if u hit 300k and the target has 60k the final dmg chart ssay that u did 60k , even on nm hydra heads have only 3m hp avaregy, even if u build trundra to do 35m for each head cap it to the max hp the head has , and the decapitated head as well can only take 3m and any surpassing dmg do not count until it respal, that way those absurd dmg charts will be "nerf" without touch at trunda or any other bronken comp , like yanica and others
My #1 issue with them touching the trunda team is that they will certainly ruin it completely. They are incapable of balancing anything. They will delete the team from existence by hard nerfing her just like cadaver. Its 10x worse now that they gave everyone the green light to build and invest in the team. If they put a 20mil dmg cap on the secondary hit or something, fine. But you know its going to be something like 200k. Honestly Yannica teams are becoming a bigger problem for lower mid level clans than trunda at this point. Going to need trunda teams just to compete with yannica. Its easier to do billions with yannica than a budget trunda team thats missing shu zen and yumeko.
Very good Collab. We are in the lower tiers of Hydra Clash but even at our level its just 1-2 clan members hitting 1-2 billion that wins every hydra clash. My clan usually aims for 3rd to try and snag a chest. The biggest issues for our clan is we forgo killing NM because we can't get the higher points like we can from hitting normal and hard with our better teams. The accessories are flat out better than the Hydra rewards for NM so we skip NM to hit lower levels. It's not alot of fun to sit for 1 hour plus running a manual hydra key. I would much rather grab top chest and stop my run. The obvious solutions is to reward everyone in the hydra clash with accessories. This would take so much pressure of clan members and allow for people to do more normal damage amounts. I also think a damage cap on normal and hard should be done. I don't think you should be able to hit for more than the bosses full health on either difficulty. If they really wanted to push the players they would do that to all levels Normal to NM, this would make Clans chose to use all 3 keys on NM and forgo rewards or split keys and get more rewards.
Hi guys i do agree with everything you are saying. But tbh Trunda is the only decent hydra champion i have. I dont have any Yumekos etc i do have an emic i do have a Painkeeper. But i still dont have the gear to make it work. If Trunda got nerfed then the people who only have her and rely on her just to even get the lower chests would be punished. What are your thoughts? should lower accounts be punished for just having one good hydra damage champion even though they aren't able to do crazy hydra clash damage.
Plarium nerfd enemy max HP to 10% because it was doing too much damage. Now what trunda is doing is much worse. At least buff enemy max HP again to make it more competitive again with teams like this. Most people can build enemy max HP with even epics. I think enemy max HP nerf is now outdated since a lot of non-max hp damage dealers can outperform enemy max HP.
So... what determines the other four clans that you go up against in Hydra Clash? Is it just a better way to rank the clans that go up against each other that is needed (better matchmaking)? The idea of running Hydra clash by rotating the champions that can be used (a la "Cursed City") that is separate from the Hydra Boss rotation might be a good twist for Plarium to implement as well!
Make Hydra clash gives rewards based on total score for the guild period. If you best the score you get top chest, which gives accessories, then additional rewards for placing 1st, 2nd 3rd. (Ie books, soul stones)
An even simpler solution would be to simply cap damage on any hit on a hydra at some max % of HP...above top non-Trunda teams today...and below Trunda (and let's not forget Yannica) levels of damage. Problem solved, with room to tune cap as powercreep undoubtedly marches forward.
I'm literally not incentivized to participate in Hydra Clash until my account can do 35m on full-auto (bc that's how I run it, and that's how I will always run it). What is the reasoning behind that insane minimum for the weakest rewards? Is it to prevent casuals from participating?
Wait until wixwell enter hydra field. Ive seen combo with yannica. Whats then? Nerf wixwell? Nerf yannica? Nerf taunt? Where will it end? The moment everyone will have same champs? True problem is in hydra mechanic, in pvp. Not in champs
I mean for Hydra the problem isn't necessarily the mechanics it's that damage has gotten to such an absurd level it completely skips the mechanics, Yannica wixwell is definitely a problem as well. One of their suggestions of basically making a freshly spawned head immune to dmg would address a lot but not all of the problems.
@@dukekessler6292 so if hydras are missing something after heads are returning - its mechanics issue. And about enormous damage. Now is problem, when there was just og CB, high damage were praised by everyone. I'm afraid, that beacause of constant demand from ccs for nerfing champs we will get into slippery slope of destroying all fun comps, everyone will be allowed to deal same damage, and unless you spent ungodly amount of money, you will have just set of boring champs with ability to barely beat top content. Problem is with content, not with champs
They'll nerf ("fix"😆) Wixwell + Yanica because everyone has access to them, they only nerf the comps everyone can attain somewhat easily, then come up with some bs why
@@miked8497 absurd damage is the problem when you make a competitive game mode around it where rewards are dependent on having specific champions. As another person said no one cared about absurd CB dmg (or was jealous as you put it), it didn't negatively affect the reward system. As Saph said you can make a largely scuffed team that ignores all mechanics and put up bonkers numbers in comparison to a perfectly tuned team that counters all mechanics. The second is harder to do than the first while the first is rewarded more. This is backwards and pointing out that absurdity isn't jealousy.
@@agsk6295 when it was released that protection they had was plenty. The bloated damage however has overcome it. So mechanics wise I guess the issue is it hasn't kept up with modern tactics and builds.
As a person who is running those teams you are looking at 1:30 to 2h+ on successful run. When you get bad luck the 8bil that I do could take a nice 8h+. To be honest if there is a solution where I dont have to spent those 8 hours in a repetitive, but high level of attention useless task I will be super happy. At this point I am rooting for Trunda to be nerfed so I dont have to do those tedious runs, but I have to as the competition is running them.
The problem is the game mode, not the champions. If they nerf this team, someone will think of a new op team ( like the yanica & wixwell team) so will everyone start crying about that team too. Then how about the next op team after that, and the cycle goes on & on.
From my experience, and it would appear to be the same with the clans we compete against, about a third to a half of keys are not used in typical clash events. People are just not interested in it. Mainly because (A) for most people it doesn't matter what score they get, the clan score will be carried by the top half dozen, and they might get nothing anyway, and (B) a key can take up to 45 minutes to run, even on auto.
Nerfing any champ would be a major problem for plarium. The fantasy world they created and the money people have spent or will spend is why they can not nerf any Champs. Now "fixing" hydra mechanics should be a huge part of their main focus. The insane amount of rng in hydra is what frustrates alot of people.
The idea I had on Hydra Clash was instead of counting total damage, earning above x amount of damage will reward x amount of points per player. You then tally those points collectively. Basing it on damage is.....yeah. When the game is this broken, not a good idea.
solve the problem by damage cannot exceed the max hp cap of 10% like it is with many other bosses. if they dont wanna change the damage atleast give every clan rewards. skip the quartz and the myth book. put a void shard and a leggo book for 4th and a ancient + epic book for 5th. also change the 35m chest to 1.67m which means the lowest chest on normal so lower levels can get gear aswel.
They will not change Yumiko, nor Trunda as it will cost them too much money in fewer shards being bought, and Whale/Kraken backlash... Possible solutions to hydra clash below. 1. Make hydra teams like LA gold, no dupes in a team. This will kill the double Yumiko issue stone dead. It will not completely destroy the team but it will significantly reduce the overall score. 2. Add @Saphirra's immunity idea to respawning head for 1 turn. This will bring the overall score for all teams down, but will have a proportionally higher reduction, for higher damage teams. 3. Make hydra clash only count 18 unique champs towards points. 3 teams, 18 unique champs will score in all 3 keys. 3 keys, 2 separate teams have a dupe champ, second key = zero points towards hydra clash. 1st key submitted with a unique champ will count, 2nd dupe champ team does not. I know people will say but I use a Shamael, or Uugo in 2/3 teams. You still can, you just won't get any points for using the second/third one in another team/key. I have a possible solution to the problem this creates below. 4. Have a separate key system for hydra clash with a checkbox. You have 3 personal keys, and 3 HC keys. You actually play your regular key and tick the checkbox if you want this run to be counted towards your HC. If you do then it eats both keys. If not, then it will subtract just your regular key and still leave 3 in HC. Free regroup still works as normal. Once you have completed your 3 regular keys any HC keys can then be used to complete the HC runs and this way, you can use dupe Uugo's and Shamael's in your normal hydra keys and then go on to create those other unique teams to score in HC. The leaderboard will show a green tick next to the team that scores in HC. 5. All 5 teams get a participation reward, even if 4th and 5th place have a reduced odds chance to receive the highest reward from the box, or even remove the chance to obtain the mythical books altogether. 6. As it currently stands. Only those who have placed in top 3 AND reach 35mil will get a reward. This is a whole clan participation event and those who have contributed to the whole clan placing in the top 3 but scored less than 35mil will not get a box. This must end immediately, and be linked to the base personal box instead imo. If you reach any base box as a personal reward, then you should also get a clan reward box too period! Even if the 6.66mil (normal) to 35mil box doesn't have mythical tomes or gear in them, they should absolutely get something and I'm not talking about 50k silver either, but a shot at what's in the 35+mil box minus the top mythical tombs and perhaps only half the primal shards.
@@doctorgreene4429 It's a starting place, open for discussion and further ideas to mitigate these things. Add a suggestion to the problem, if you have one. All suggestions will help shape the final solution. If Paylarium won't fix Trunda/Yumiko, then we, the community, have to try to give them a way out. Just saying it won't work without applying anything else will keep the status quo which everyone, except those running those teams perhaps, agree must change. Do you have any ideas?
@@doctorgreene4429 I'm glad you are happy with the state of the game. It's a game at the end of the day. I'm a low spender Daily gem pack, mini mix when on sale, and I am casual when it comes to hydra. I'm more interested in balance in the game, so everyone from f2p to kraken can have fun. I'm don't care about PvP that much either, but when something is obviously broken, then it should be fixed for the good of the game, the community at large, but most of all for your own enjoyment. People who do care, are hurting because the top section, Whales/Krakens, have a dominance due to a single team and they already have all the advantages of their spending power already. If that team was easily accessible, Cadaver/Madman and was left untouched, I'd not care to speak up. However, they were nerfed and Trunda/Yumiko was left untouched. This is a blatent FU to those from f2p to mid spender, while at the same time giving a big thumbs up to the Whale/Kraken. That's why it must be fixed, or undo the changes to Cadaver/Madman and let every level of player do what they can with the resources available to them. Cadaver/Madman will never compete with Trunda teams, so why not allow it through? The obvious answer is money, and that galls me. A business should make money and Whales allow for f2p players in the game. That is a balance, and so I accept that with good grace. I know I'll do better than most f2p even though all I buy is monthly gem pack and mini mix but that's still an advantage as I can farm more equipment and progress faster. A new Whale starting tomorrow will surpass me in a few weeks and I simply don't care about that, but when a champ/team comp does 1000% more damage than any other team comp, then it's broken and must be fixed imo and I do care about that.
@@doctorgreene4429 You may well be happy with the state of the game but you are commenting in a video about how unhappy many in the community, especially the two making the video are. If they are moved to make a video about it calling upon Paylarium to change it as the Trunda, double Yumiko team is so obviously broken then why are you watching it tbf. Your only contribution is to say it won't work, and you basically don't care. This is a discussion to try to find solutions to what is a problem for a great many people. I really don't care personally about HC, but that does not mean that I should not care about something that has completely smashed the whole point of the content and for those participating in it. A very few people in the entire player base can make this team and 1 person can obliterate a complete clan. That is not a competition, that's slaughter. If I was not to care about something so obviously wrong because this particular thing doesn't affect me personally, and it really doesn't, then what if this was to happen in an area of the game that does matter to me. How can I then wail and moan and ask for help to change it from those I walked away from when they needed me previously and I wasn't there for them? This is a solo game for the most part, but this game also has a strong community. Communities help one and other at times of need even if there is no benefit to you at that time. It will hopefully be paid back if, and/or when you need them to have your back at a future time. Try to contribute towards it with ideas of your own, I'm not claiming that I've fixed it. I'm saying it's a possible solution to mitgate some of the worst elements of it. trying to bring it closer to a manageable place for those who really want to participate/engage with it. If you don't care, then don't bother writing anything at all. Jog on, and look the other way if you will, but for many, they are feeling very salty about this and rightly so, as it's not consistent. Cadaver/Madman, two champs easily available to the whole player base were nerfed because they were "doing something not intended for the content" and so is Trunda and she has been left untouched. The former team could not touch a Trunda team but still it was nerfed and not easy to make either. The only conclusion that can be made from this, is that it's about money for Paylarium and the fear of losing the Krakens if they touch her and Yumiko, but they don't fear if even a few thousand low spenders quit because some of these big spenders dwarf the entirety of all those who spend by the same factor as Trunda's scores over every other team. This is simply about balance, this team and those two champs are broken in this content, to the point that a large portion of the community don't want to engage with it any more, and that is simply not good for balance, or the structure of the game, nor for the community as a whole. It does affect us all whether you believe it or not, whether you care, or not, because we all have to share this space from f2p like yourself to the Kraken collecting everything, and everyone in between. Pay to play like myself, or pay to win like the Whale/Kraken, I don't care, and for f2p players like yourself, you need the Whales and the Krakens to spend big to allow you the opportunity to play, and that's good too, but any game is always going to be slanted towards the Whales/Krakens anyway just by the nature of it's structure, they don't need any other advantages over everyone else too with broken champs/teams that only they for the most part, will ever be able to do.
tbh, I've been too focus on putting big numbers thinking I cant do Brutal Nightmare... I can do 400m on Normal, 300m on Hard, around 100-150m on Brutal, still haven't done Nightmare, but I think I can 1 key it... problem is I can't provide as much points for my clan for hydra clash if I do brutal and nightmare, just to see a trunda team outdamage all of team even if I only attack both normal and hard
I agree with @jaxan; i feel like right now Plarium isnt affected by this, i think this will make people want to pull shards more to get those champs, and as long as thats happening its good for Plariums bottom line. Once that stops then i could see them doing something about it
I would really like it if they started adding all the accessories for the six-piece kits such as merciless Supersonic and Slayer gear. Why don't they do that? I think it's BS that I have to buy a forge pass just to get a couple of accessories
My guild are so far below this being a problem for us but it's obviously an issue for the end game clans and players which is where the money comes from. They'll work something out, just not quite what anyone wanted as usual.
HC needs to have damage caps. We've had a few things "nerfed"(with more coming) for a mode that many people are never going to play or would even have a chance in. With minimums to even get into HC, to win rewards, or even place given the compition, not everyone is playing it presuming they even care to. Most of the "nerfs" affect every level of a Champion's play and not just the most extreme it can be taken to. Edit: They make too much money off people chasing Yumeko to change her.
I like the effort thinking of the no damage idea but it just penalizes anyone with lots of speed, it will be really troll especially noticeable on normal when you waste 100s of turns while waiting for heads to be able to take damage again. I ultimately think the easiest solution is just give 4th and 5th place basically the same rewards as 3rd or 1 chest lower and people will not care as much. I don't have trunda but i think it sets a bad precedent for ultra late nerfs (after plarium cashed out) such as this when it has been know for so long. Since hydra clash and the nerf to corpulent think about how many progressive events people dumped shards into just to build this team just to have it nerfed after plarium said they wont nerf it.
In Hydra, a team should be ineligible to qualify for a chest unless at least a certain percentage of their roster scores at least a certain percentage of their point total... So, like 25% of their clan roster (minimum 3 players) scored at least 5% of the total Hydra Clash points, each.... or something like that. So when you have someone dropping 1 key to score 55Billion damage, the other 25% of the clan, at least 7 more players, better score like 5 Billion each, or they are disqualified. This would stop those clans with 12 members, and only one member that does Hydra, but scores a bajillion points. Or the clans that have 15 members that do a total of 100million points, then that one plyer at the end that comes in and does 600 million to rocket past the other teams. My clan isn't end game at all, and we all work at it, and have been turning out a 450million total in Hydra Clash in the last couple months or so.... and it's really fucking discouraging when at the end of the week, a clan 3 levels below yours, and with only 12 members, shoot past your clan and bumps you out of 3rd place with 2 keys. 11 of the members aren't even really playing... and yet the clan gets the prize.... so in effect 1 person gets the prize. That needs to stop. Hydra Clash is a COLLECTIVE effort, and the prizes should only go towards an ACTUAL collective effort.
They should give rewards to anyone who contributes to it if clan gets in top 3. So many ppl say way should I try when I get no rewards. They say I can’t enough to even get a chest. But they try and try. It’s ok for big accounts or powerful players. But if u are just scalping by they feel let down. We are only low lvl clan but do get in top 3 here and there but only a few of us receive a rewards. My wife for example has giving up since it takes time and she doesn’t rewards for her few runs of 1/2 at most 5/6 million.
VictorTES told Plarium Clash wasn't going to work before they released it.. And calling for nerfs has only hurt the Mode. Personally I'd like to see your highest 1 key contribute to the Clash score. This wouldn't "fix" anything, but would save time at least. I think Skratch would like to see the turn limited halved, which would help too.
I can't believe HH has done this to us! Thanks for the video, I notice a lot of people have been burning out lately and you guys make a lot of great points. Something def needs to change
It is so much fun to develop Hydra Teams and see them improve from month to month. Without Trunda, Yumeko, Yannika balance - it is unrewarding and will stop being fun - as you no one will really compete. So no one does care "what is the highest-non-Trunda" dmg, it does not affect the clash result - getting to the top chests is a matter of 40 minutes to end game accounts, so without having a trunda, the gamemode is boring. A single champion in a Gotcha - there is not a single reason to keep it like it is. They could add other champions with crit the crit 2nd hit. They could add more reset the reset skill -- it is not happening, so in the silence it is already acknoledged that this is not correct. Fixing will become a problem - so many whales, krakens etc. have invested a lot in 3x Trunda +4 at 6 star awakening accompanied by 6 yumekos and all the rest. If you know fix this team - a lot of your paying community will quit. So keeping the problem open for long, and guarding it with fake arguments created a - nearly - impossible to fix scenario. They did the same with Taras and Marichka - Solution: Mysticals & Narses I feel like their only way out is a constant power creep to the other team to get into a competing level. So just "fix" 5-6 other already existing non-Void (as Trunda) dds, to have similar mechanik as Trunda - give them a 2nd Hit multiply all crit multipliers. At least everyone can compete than on his rooster. All other problem would still exists - the non-mechanik teams, the resetting yumekos and so on, but this could be tweaked or adjusted without completly facing the lock in trunda situation...
Nerfs should happen as often as buffs. Raid just need to get on board and just do a refund system from materials and ascension like most games do now days.
I think as you mentioned something with the scoring should be done so they stil get more points for 60 bil vs 2 bil but its not 30x the points so their team still gives more points but not so many they single handedly decide the win. Now obviously if the whole clan did it they'd win if your whole clan isnt but at that point they are doing the most and should win and regardless there will always be a best team or at least a best core part of team.
"anyone who played for 3 years has a reasonable chance of having Trunda" cries in 5 years and no Trunda 🥲 I don't like the thought of nerfing Trunda (aka fixing her) but I really like the idea of having a respawned head being immune to damage while they have the serpent will buff. I also think no cd reducing skill should be able to have it's cooldown decreased. If they make it so Yumeko can't have her reset abilities' cooldown being reduced those teams will also get harder to build and lower in damage. There's alot Plarium could do to help clear up this mess called hydra clash, I just hope they do it right.
No trunda being so op is stupid. Them saying it's a hard team to build but no that's not really it unless you have trunda you can't do the team. You can have all the other champs in these teams but no other champ can fill trundas role. That is stupid
This is more a Whale/Kraken problem, the only people with Empowered, Awakened Trunda, AND all the other champs. Of normal player base odds of having it all are so small, even after years and years of playing. How many Clans are even pulling those kinds of numbers? Top 100? of many thousands of clans. Easy solution is rewards for all levels.
I've been playing for 3 or 4 years and same. No trunda..I've pulled lots o times when she was boosted, even now with the increasing chance boost and she keeps evading me
Change hydra clash to ranking system. Person that does the most damage gets a set amout of points for their team, 2nd place earns a few less points, and so on.
I think they need to lower some of the damage requirements for lower-end clans and split Hydra Clash into leagues like they do with Arena (silver, gold plat etc). Let the krakens battle it out in Plat while the rest of the normal people play in silver/gold. There would be clans that could try and abuse that system by limiting the damage they're doing, but that's already sort of happening. No perfect solution unfortunately. And if they nerf Trunda, these clans/players will switch to Yannicka shield comps (before Yannicka gets nerfed). Idk man, I hope they do something since it's pretty demoralizing seeing one player wreck your entire clan and you go "Well, I guess I'll just get my top chest for the week and move on." That happened to my clan but it was sort of a nice break from trying to push the max damage and just running keys on auto for 30 minutes total vs 2-3 hours of manual play
At this point I would rather see them adjust the Hydra mechanics vs nerfing champs. Seems like that would be an easier approach, and they could fix more than just the Trunda teams. At this point, I think they should just remove all the bonus damage you get from attacking decapitated heads. The majority of people have massively surpassed the one key damage, and alot of that has to do with the bonus damage granted from hitting decapitated heads. I don't know how far this goes to fixing the Trunda comps. She will still do high damage, but it should tone that down when you remove the bonus damage on decapitated heads. Another items they will need to address is the shield teams with Yannica. I know they are working on the one bug issue with the champ that was spreading an growing shields, but what about the recent team Boozor put out with Wixwell and Yannica. I think the best way to approach this is with shield limits in Hydra. Don't nerf champs just add in rules to the Hydra game mode itself. The biggest thing they can do right away is to adjust the Hydra Clash rewards system. People are putting in tons of time to get nothing. All 5 positions should get rewards.
So I went back and watched HH Trunda run in Hydra. So the first hit of that A2 did 1.6mil damage to a decapitated head so the other decapitated head should take 60% of that damage, so about 975k, but not it took 24.3mil, that's about 1500% more damage, it's broken. Plus Yumeko's CD skill is reduce skills by 3 turns on a 5 turn cooldown, how the hell does she reset herself what happened to the other 2 turns? That is broken as well. Make these champs do what their skills say they are supposed to do. In theory eventually everyone will get one or more of these comps and start going "oh another Hydra fusion champ" not needed, skip. But in reality by the time that happens Hydra as a game mode will be more of an afterthought than CB. As far as "Trunda not being useful if nerf'd" well some of us end game players are still stuck with Trunda as our best arena nuker.
Personally, there are so many issues with Hydra I do not know if I particularly care about Trunda. Add rewards to 4th and 5th, this is Plarium...it will be rare 5* gear and trash. Fix the champs to mechanics and its even more time. I have Trunda, I have Yumeko, White Dryad Nia, Emic...I can do billions on normal or hard. I can do 3-400 mil on NM and Brutal. I cannot always commit the time. Hell I rarely feel like even doing it when you can go 30 minutes and wipe out of nowhere for some BS RNG. I used to love this content, at this point I am over it.
It got to the point where I started inviting krakens to my clan and we eventually got one. He’s done like 6 billion each week 🤣🤣🤣. So glad he has joined us. Right now I’m doing 250M -330 M. Slowly building a new team
Biggest issue of all content not only hydra is that they add it, maybe make some day 1 patches because of poor testing and then forget just force us to do it but not interesting in any tweaks or bigger changes like they just go forward and assume everything they did is the best implementation possible. Patches are only answer to community rage there is no improvements in advance only money grab or few years to late updates to tavern for example.
Our clan just ran into a 5 star Togron and 5 star Yannica on brutal for 11 billion. They alone beat the bottom 4 teams. PL needs to fix something in hydra clash.
I don't agree that hydra is a clan killer there are plenty of clans that don't push the clash so you can join one of those so please can you explain to me what is going on here? what is the issue why do you keep moaning about Trunda we know all about her every man and his dog knows about her Plarium are not going as far as I can see going Nerf her I love you Saph l love your content but l just don't agree that this is an issue that is affecting the "community" that is a misleading concept there is an issue with a relatively small group of player's and and it seems some CC's anyway l am gonna stop moaning myself now.
I think just make it to where every clan that participates, gets some kind of reward. You "nerf" Trunda, and theres always going to be a "New OP" Team.
Nerfing the champions is the worst way to address this. Fix the game modes. The game mode leads to the problem. Address the scoring structure. Decouple the actual points scored from clash scoring system and use a ranking score to put the points towards clash. Nerfing the champions is such a bad take when champions get used elsewhere and how overbearing other game modes can be when you may only have certain options. Fix the problems in the game not cause problems elsewhere for players.
You are saying fix the problems in the game.. well Trunda is source of the problem in hydra clash. You want to change the whole game mode instead of changing the source of the problem? That wouldn't make sense. Trunda can remain the best hydra champ, just not 50x better than the next best.
@@david86418 She wasnt considered a problem until Clash was put in place. Same with a multitude of other champions. So are you gonna fix what wasnt broken, or fix what was added that created all these different problems. No one cared that yumeko could be reset until clash was added no one cared about cadaver until clash was added, no one cared about anything that wasnt a pvp champion until clash was added. So instead of fixing the game mode that made everything become a problem we are gonna nerf champions that werent a problem? That makes sense right? Dont fix what created the problems... Nerf the champions that may be some players best options in other areas of the game. Lets use common sense you dont fix something that wasnt a problem until something else was added. You fix what caused things to become a problem in the first place. Its just such a backwards mentality and such a reactionary response to look at the champions before what was added creating the problem in the first place.
@@ItsDaveMan795 Trunda skill says will do secondary damage equal to 60% of the initial, but that is not what it does. Seems pretty evident. Before clash, that issue didn't impact other people, that's why it was ignored. Now it impact the whole game mode which comprises other people and because of that has become a serious issue to solve. But anyways if it makes you sleep better at night, they can add a line that all secondary damage based on initial damage cannot crit a second time in hydra, just like they have aoe damage reduction etc. I would be perfectly ok with that.
@@david86418 Trundas A2 works as its written just because Plarium doesnt write out the multipliers and explain dmg calculation in the skill doesnt mean its incorrect. It takes 60% of the dmg then that 60% gets run through the multipliers against the other heads, but shes not the only one whos skill does this. Hers crits where others say it cant. Again the champion isnt the problem its a piss poor game mode design. And changing champions doesnt fix that. Changing champions doesnt mean that 2/5 of the player base that get screwed weekly will stop getting screwed. Fix the game mode, and allow all players to get rewards while decoupling scores to create the clash scores. Just changing trunda wont mean anyone is going to get a fair deal. Whales are still gonna whale. The people crying are still gonna lose, and what benfit came from it. A few ruined champions a pissed of player base from every angle. Champ nerf crowds still losing 4th and 5th still get nothing. Whales are still putting your score in the dirt. Nothing gained from nerfing champions. Everything to be gained from fixing the game mode. Easy choice for me.
Personally, i dont even get why they hesitate/refuse to nerf Trumeko. Maybe they have better numbers on this, but essentially there's no point in even releasing new hydra focused dmg champs, as they have next to zero hydra clash relevance.
If i can be honest I don't think trunda can solely be blamed for this issue, try running a trunda without a reset champion and you will see you don't get anywhere near that number.
Maybe introduce champion bans for hydra clash. Im 50/50 on this, because some people might have 1-2 good hydra champions that carry their team and if they get banned they cant get as much damage.
Put a cap on how many points a single player can contribute, it would solve several issues, keeping 1 person from winning it, reduce time requirements and allow winning to be determined by the weaker players.
2:43 the point about a player (ShortonSkilz) putting up 10 billion and still their clan gets overtaken... Well..... that player and the rest of the players in that clan has a choice to make: keep running with a few players who put up 10 billion each, and keep losing because you match against other clans that are stronger, or......... Play strategically. Tank. Get into a matchmaking cycle where you're only fighting teams that score 20 billion, not 60-80 billion. Try to compete there. Stop trying for only highest scores. The rewards are the same for finishing Top 3. Why try to finish Top 3 against other 60-80 billion clans? Work on your matchmaking by managing your scores, and play more strategically.
Trunda does not need to be nerfed and Hydra mechanics do not need to be changed. I do not have Trunda, or Yumeko, and can only do 1b in clash myself, but I don't have any issues with the whales doing billions of damage on any difficulties of Hydra. Hydra Clash matches clans up according to their average Clash damage over the last 3-4 weeks, but there are some clans that basically fix the matchmaking to get weaker opponents, just like in CvC. Hydra is already annoying to deal with in the first place because of all the random garbage occurs in the first place and how long runs take to get high damage. Plarium doesn't need to do ANYTHING to make Hydra more difficult in the slightest. Hydra Clash however could use some major changes to the rewards and structure. I think a turn limit of 500 or something like that could be good for Clash, but doesn't penalize teams that need more turns to get damage for the top chest. Mainly they need to add some kind of reward for 4th and 5th place and lower the damage thresholds to receive the Hydra Clash chests.
The point cap HH said makes so much sense. This way you would also have to coordinate more with your clan mates. Sure there might be clans that only recruit a certain team type. But you can add a smaller multiplier to the points for using champions that are not in top damage teams that shows up when you select the team (which allows the score to over the cap). This way people will have to actually work to get the top three spots. And not use the same champions.
I‘ve got a 6 star crushing rent Trunda, I’ve got multiple copies of all the reset champs besides yumeko, I’m in a true top Clan but I still refuse to use this because it’s not fun at all I really enjoy pushing dmg in Hydra, last week I got my first billion+ team on brutal (without bug abuses) so capping the dmg would really hurt my fun. It’s just kinda sad that my theorycrafting and testing is worthless if there are these trunda teams doing absurd dmg. They should just fix trunda and probably yumeko cause this kills the game mode.
Why no make either the cloak of ages' second hit deal 45% instead of 60%. or balance crushing rend. CR is extremely unbalanced. I don't think a ascended 4* should be useless but 6* is god tier for any blessing.
Majority of players don’t care about hydra clash, they just want to push and get max chests and if we get some bonus primal quartz and protection banners then it’s a bonus
Cadaver nerf screwed over people who could only use it on normal to get a decent score. Trunda nerf would do the same thing. The problem is at the higher end where ppl have the 6* awakening and crazy gear. Those of us with decent gear and low awakening would be knocked back out of the game mode again
They should nerf/fix any campion they think needs it, BUT players get the option to get back books, chickens and 800 gems, so that if they think the post nerf champ isn't worth it they at least have the resources they spent on the champ returned to them. Also they need to massively increase the amount of buffs given to champs if they increase the amount of nerfs.
If it "clan v clan" based game than this should mean - Than more peoples are cooperating than stronger they are, so even 2 players together should be always be more than 1. It comes as result as making score cap lets say 500k, and may be add extra 1k per decapitated head.
