Another great video. There are a lot of RU-vidr’s doing these firearm videos that don’t have a clue what there doing . It’s refreshing to watch somebody that does. Thank you :)
Well, commenting 2 years after the fact, I do have a few observations... #1, your presentation over the last two years has truly improved: GREAT JOB! #2, you might have mentioned what your handloads consisted of: they did aptly demonstrate that longer barrels typically provide higher velocities. #3 , your results confirmed the fact that this is truly excellent 10mm ammunition, probably more than adequate for everything up to actual "ursine defense" situations, where a 200gr hardcast flat-nosed projectile might be preferable...? #4, your overall analysis was 100% RIGHT ON! Well, except perhaps for the unusual situation you have (apparently?) experienced with your 4.5" Elite: mine is one of my most favored firearms, dead accurate & dead reliable as well... Thanks for this great review! P.S. I recently obtained a score of these Winchester BJHPs to reload as they will probably become my preferred SD loading, and this very positive review was a major factor: what more could anyone really want ammo-wise?
Very good test. I like the format of using two different guns for each factory load. Thank you for doing these tests. I'm a recent subscriber, and I'm looking forward to the rest of this series and beyond.👍👍
Energy dump was pretty impressive. I'm sure a torso would behave differently but it would be very close to a thru and thru. Two holes are always better than one.
2 holes better than one for hunting but NOT for defense. You are responsible for every round you fire including if it kills or maims someone behind the violent attacker. Over penetration is dangerous and irresponsible.
I spread the 10mm gospel whenever possible, I’ve got a few converts already. The more people you get to try it the more will buy it, the more people that buy it the more the price will drop per round. While I enjoy other pistol calibers, 9 and 10 are what I shoot the most and carry. Love these test videos, I know performance may vary over the years, but generally these chrono tests have yet to steer me wrong.
Great content TTO. I'm anxious to see the Hornady XTP performance as that's what I have carried in my Delta Gold Cup for close to 30 years now. Lucky Gunner gel test shows all 5 rounds stopping at 16.9". That is very consistent. I look forward to more episodes. Keep is up buddy. Love your channel and thanks.
I wonder what barrel length Winchester used to obtain the advertised 1,240 fps. Theoretically, the 1,213 fps could be within the SD… I saw the results of a thug take three 180gr. Ranger-Ts to the chest from a G22 Gen3. He was about 6’4” and over 300 lbs. charging an Officer with a huge knife. He met his maker before he hit the deck!
Thanks for doing this series with the different ammo, it's an interesting one to follow. I have a request, I'd like to see you add to your ammo comparison series. How much muzzle flash does each ammo produce comparatively? This information would be very useful to have when selecting self defense ammo for use in low light or near complete darkness.
Love your new range set-up......very professional looking. Your 10's are exactly what I have, only I have the 5.25 also. I only carry Win 175 Silvertips. Hopefully,you can find these as well for this test series. Great vid and info as always.... thanks
I think I will be able to find those. I might have seen them here and there in other calibers. And thanks! Had to give it a little bit of an update. I'm pretty happy with my pair. I don't really see me needing anything else. As far as 10. But I'm sure somebody will come out with something cool. And I kind of want to get another one of the 3.8" and 8" XD m's to put a Red Dot on just to play around with it at classes and such. But I don't know if I can justify that in reality. I won't carry a red dotfor self defense at the moment.👊🦃👍
@@theturkeysopinion there's a 8" XDM?? My original plan was to get another 5.25" bbl for the 3.8 and have the end of the bbl NOT in the slide magna-ported for recoil control
In 10mm I carry both a Glock M29 or a Springfield Armory TRP 1911 Government. So, Steel and polymer. Full size and compact. It’s my go-to standard for traveling through the Appalachian Mountains. Them woods is full of Bears, drug smugglers, serial killers and some really weird stuff. None of that matters. Whatever the mission, I’m pretty confident that if I do my job, the 10mm will “git ‘er done.” What I carry on any given day is usually driven by weather, temperature and clothing. Carry mode is usually a shoulder holster. I ALWAYS have at least two spare magazines. Minimum. I also keep a couple of boxes of ammo in my vehicles on a permanent basis. Trouble in those mountains means help is a long time coming. I never use the interstate. I’m retired. I love mountain roads. I’m a former Infantry Captain and an NRA Instructor for over 35 years.
I love the 10mm auto cartridge. I own only one 10mm handgun a Glock 20sf . I reload my own 10mm ammo with ZERO projectiles 180 grains hollow points with 10 grains of Blue Dot powder. Wish I should have purchased a Smith & Wesson model 610 revolver in 10mm when I had the chance. Can't get them anymore in Canada . I would jump at the chance to get one because one could shoot 40 s&w as well with the 610 revolver. Long live the 10mm my favorite handgun cartridge.
Bought a box of these in 9 mm and they were dirty too . Glad to see it wasn’t just mine. Damn both our luck! Looked identical as far as old dirty ammo and I ordered mine from a major retailer that I use often, and never had dirty ammo from any brand before.
Great test. 10 mm just awesome. Finally took that pistol out hunting the 3.8 Elite took my first three Hogs with 10 mm using Fort Scott munition tumble rounds. It was lights out for them. Hits at 20 to 40 yards. Just wipe them out. Look forward to seeing the other ammunition. Definitely a step in the right direction. Looking good my man.
That sounds like a lot of fun! I suppose that would be a great round for hogs. I'm not sure if I've seen it in 10 mm around me. But I'll keep an eye out for sure.👊🦃👍
@@theturkeysopinion I would be interested in a chronograph reading it says 2,000 feet per second to solid copper projectile. I think it's only like 120 grain weight. Figured out the problem with the firearm was it the firearm it was the magazines. Kind of sounds like the new prodigy problem
Looking forward to more of this series. I have the HST, Fort Scott, Hornady Critical Duty and several variations of Underwood. And 1 box of Double Tap. Impressed with the performance of the Winchester, but not the lack of QC.
Señor, I buy factory blemished ammo and bullets all the time. It generally knocks at least 30% off the cost and it doesn't have any effect on the copper/lead or the powder. I bought Underwood ammo out of 460 Rowland and 45LC blemished ammo yesterday. The recipient won't know I got it 50% off. That T-shirt; my brother wasted years of his life playing Zelda. I GOTS TA GET HIM THAT GARMENT!!! Nice review. Oh, Underwood has 150gr and 180gr 10mm 30 & 40% off on their website. Free shipping over $200. Great stuff! I buy both 200 rounds at a pop
Great content as always! Your channel is THE BEST source of 10mm information… your 10mm content got me to subscribe way back on your first (M&P) videos (because I had one as well).🙄 Keep up the good work!
Love the Flag hanging at the range!! Great accuracy. Like the shorter barrel performance. Have the HST 200gr, Extreme Hunter 150gr & Underwood Flat Nose 200gr mixed in my mags!
In my experience with Winchester ammo, you have to take out each round and inspect it. It is not uncommon to find some kind of debris in the hollow point cavity... not sure what it is, like some kind of tumbling media (certainly not styrofoam from the packaging). This has happened to me across several boxes of their premium defensive ammo, life Defender and Ranger-T. A small pick will easily remove it, but just like the dirty rounds shown in this video, I think it is just indicative of the quality control during manufacturing
Finally made it through the video after sharing and taking screenshots and such. Great presentation! I wanted to like the XDm Elite. I drove 250 miles to get one. I didn't like the way the 3.8 crowded my hand, and the larger one wasn't significantly less small that my G40 MOS to matter to me. I ended up with a new M&P 2.0 4" model. God, what a perfect fit for my hand. Now, 3 months later, I have a trigger, a guide rod & magazine springs into it trying to get the damned thing to work as well as my Gen4 G40 MOS. Very disappointed.
As for your first test your results are similar to the velocity I get. Rule of thumb is 50 feet per second per inch of barrel. This video is an excellent example to judge ammo by. Good hob.
I have owned a few 10mm the one I kept is the 4.5 inch barrel over the 3.8. Not sure why but I like the performance of the 4.5. Both are great pistols. When I go to the mountains I carry my revolver. Just my preference.
FYI: I recently received a couple boxes of 10mm 180gr Winchester Defender from Target Sports USA. The boxes and the rounds are in pristine condition; no dirt, no blemishes, no discoloration.
Would definitely love to see you go through the boxes you have on the tables, especially the three boxes of hornady, I have a mag loaded with each as well as the fort Scott TUI
Hmmm. I have one of them close to me but I always fail to get out there when they have deals. The guy behind the counter can kind of be a jerk. But boy when they have a deal they really do.👊🦃👍
@@theturkeysopinion 5 mags and a bag for like 567.00 I think. It was online. I just ordered a 44 Henry brass Big Boy 250 less than anywhere else. Took 4 days Shipped same day.
I have a Glock 20 with a 5" threaded KKM barrel & a Springfield Ronin Elite 1911 in 10 mm. Both shoot well. I'd shoot them more but with the ammo prices being high I mainly shoot my 9 mm guns. Like your videos.
Enjoyed video, companies seem to be stepping up with hotter loads. Bow hunting elk in Colo by myself? Carry the 3.8 with Underwood 200 hard cast mixed with Underwood 200g xtp. Mostly hardcast. Feel safe.
I have a bunch of the win defender 10mm all are clean nickel cases 1200-1220 fps from my 4.6 M&p and 1250-1260 from my 5.5 inch RIA tac ultra double stack 10mm
Good Mornin! I do plan on testing that in the future with many of these rounds. However the clothing absolutly wrecks the gel. 🫤 it goes from about 10 remelts to about 2 really quick😬 Gotta use prtty used up blocks for that. 100 bones a piece😭 👊👍🦃
@@theturkeysopinion PS- This is actually a great carry round - great performance without being as crazy with the muzzle blast and recoil as the Underwoods. I lost part of my hearing in the Army and don't want to lose the rest if I ever had to fire a full power 10mm round inside a house or a vehicle! lol. Thanks again for testing it
@@JohnB-dr8sk 10% clear ballistics , 20" Shooters Block. And I hear you on the ears! I can remember a handful of shots that I really regret.... And my ears remind me of it every night when they ring. 👍👊🦃
There will be much difference if you shoot Underwood hardcast bullet 200 grains. Longer barrel provides much higher velocity and penetration. This hunters choose 6 inches barrel and heavy hardcast bullet. 9mm and 45 acp for self defense.
In an actual usage scenario, one could expect about ~8.75 inches of penetration in living tissue from the Winchester Defender (roughly half the distance performed in gel).
Am I imagining things, or did the Winchester ammo not get chronographed??? Your video came up because I did a search for the Winchester ammo, looking for chronograph results!
Need heavy clothing test! That’s how you truly find out how it will perform in real world situations. I don’t want different ammo for different weather!
Hey Tom just finished 500 rounds through the M&P 2.0 10mm. 400 of which were 180 grain 1200 FPS. 100 rounds 180 grain 1300 fps only hiccups I had was with in the first 100 rounds. I'm starting to think that you got a dud. Only mod I've done is a 20 lb recoil spring from Wolf and a Hollow sun Red Dot. Also I can only load 10 Rounds into my magazines because in New Jersey I'm not allowed to 15 Also just a heads up I don't know why I did not get notification you just pop drop this video
Nice report! Good idea to put that Spring in there for sure. If anything else it'll be good because that 10mm ammo will eventually start fatiguing the recoil spring anyway. I definitely had a dud. That thing was...ughh. I would like to revisit it one day. And I've noticed that a lot of my notifications are late also. Like days late. I'll get a notification for a video I watched 3 days ago. Thanks again bro!👊🦃👍
Which animal would you suggest for EDC? Not necessarily Woods Carrie but just for every day Carrie? I’ve been looking a lot of that under word extreme defender stuff but as much as it penetrates with the foot pounds of energy and muzzle velocity, I do worry about over penetration. Would you suggest a hollow point? And if so, which one?
Gold Dot is my personal favorite. Loaded by Underwood especially. I usually put extreme defenders or penetrators as the last couple of rounds in my magazine just in case things get to that level. That Winchester defender though is some pretty nasty stuff also.🦃👍👊
Very hard choice. The sig is a handful but boy do you get the extra power. I think I would probably run the winchesters for the top half of the magazine and then the six at the bottom half for when things got crazy. 👍👊🦃
TTO, would you take the 10mm Winchester Defender 180gr over the Hornady 180gr XTP (1275 fps) or Underwood 180gr XTP (1300 fps)? I showed the velocity to help identify the intended round.
Hmmm. Thats a hard one. I might if it passes a few more mags of reliability testing. I still have hornady and underwood xtps loaded at the tops of some mags. The .45 defenders are in my nighthawk. So hard to choose a forever round...i like so many👍👊🦃
@@theturkeysopinion I don't usually believe what I read on product info, but this is from Winchester (it also applies to the XTPs mentioned above): "Consider Winchester's vaunted Defender 10mm round, that features a 180-grain bonded hollow point bullet leaving the muzzle at 1240 feet-per-second (FPS), resulting in 614 ft. -lbs. of muzzle energy. This makes the 10mm round more powerful than a 357 Magnum, and has nearly double the energy of a 9mm Luger."
That's crazy I just bought a box of 124 grain HST and it's not the old box it's brand new box of hsts and they are also dirty spotting on them really strange never seen hsts like this
Lol, @ Thomas Cozart @John W is right Ultimately I just couldn't stand the fact that it shot a little bit high. I didn't even test it very far. My 3.8 was so incredibly accurate that once I shot an inch high I kinda just lost all interest. It was like a 6 o'clock hold. I have no idea why and I just didn't want to figure it out. I'm so happy with my 3.8 that I didn't need it. If I want capacity I can just put the extra long (15 rnd ) magazine in it. I'm pretty sure my might have been a fluke I can't imagine they purposely leave the factory like that. When I was able to trade it at a store for a Glock I wanted i just did it. Good luck with yours! Let us know how it does👊🦃👍
Unless we’re discussing the use of a Ransom Rest, accuracy discussion of these two guns is irrelevant. Lacking that consistency and repeatability we’re looking at shooter experience and competence. Which is NOT to denigrate either! Far better to compare barrel lengths in terms of performance.
