1591: The Book of Abraham Translation Evidence w/ The Backyard Professor

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Kerry Shirts (aka The Backyard Professor) was a former LDS apologist who defended the Church and its truth claims. He was one of the founders of FAIR (Formerly FairMormon) and served as the director of research for FAIR. He joins us for one of the most epic episodes of all time where we will explore Joseph Smith's Book of Abraham translation claims. With stunning imagery and explanations, The Backyard Professor will explore the fascinating evidence scholars have found that confidently uncovers Joseph Smith's translation method of the Egyptian Papyri.
(This episode is video-only, due to the visual media used in the presentation)
Show Notes:
Kerry Shirts/Backyard Professor RU-vid/Podcast: backyardprofessor.org/
Mormon Discussions: mormondiscussions.org/
Robert Ritner series on MS: mormonstories.org/podcast/rob...
Brent Metcalfe MS interview: mormonstories.org/podcast/bre...
Dan Vogel MS interview(s) about Book of Abraham: mormonstories.org/podcast/jos...
RFM MS episode on Book of Abraham: mormonstories.org/podcast/fro...
Joseph Smith Papers - Book of Abraham: www.josephsmithpapers.org/sit...
Mormon Stories Essay on Book of Abraham:
mormonstories.org/truth-claim...
MormonThink Essay on Book of Abraham:
www.mormonthink.com/book-of-ab...
CES Letter - Book of Abraham
read.cesletter.org/boa/
Bill Reel
Radio Free Mormon: radiofreemormon.org/
RFM’s interview with Backyard Professor:
bit.ly/3yvrcPb
LDS Church’s Gospel Topics Essay on the Book of Abraham
bit.ly/3l9cbKZ
Robert Ritner’s Response to LDS Church’s BOA Gospel Topics Essay
bit.ly/3wjysea
Robert Ritner’s book on Book of Abraham:
www.amazon.com/Joseph-Smith-E...
Stephen Smoot’s review of Dan Vogel book on Book of Abraham
journal.interpreterfoundation...
Dan Vogel’s RU-vid Channel: / @danvogel6802
Backyard Professor: backyardprofessor.org/
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*MSP Blog: www.mormonstories.org/episodes/
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Contact Us!
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Timecodes:
00:00:00 Introduction of Gerardo and Kerry
00:22:30 Kerry thanks wife and several friends
00:27:50 Beginning of episode. BOA
00:33:30 The BOA Artifacts - An overview
00:35:00 Book of Abraham & Book of Mormon title pages can not be ancient translated texts
00:44:30 Book of Breathings
00:47:52 Book of Abraham papyrus dating puts it not in alignment with Joseph’s story
00:52:00 2 missing columns can’t hold the book of Abraham
00:59:00 The Fragment of the Book of the Dead
01:02:00 There are zero biblical topics written on the Papyrus.
01:07:20 Joseph know that noone at the time could read the Egyptian papyrus
01:10:33 Timeline of Joseph Smith and the papyrus
01:15:50 Joseph Smith History entries about the artifacts
01:20:00 Bound Grammar and Alphabet
01:29:00 Joseph Smith and the mummies
01:32:00 Joseph Smith’s claim to early church members of translation abilities
01:34:00 Damaging the catalyst theory
01:35:00 Undermining the whole restauration
01:44:00 Astronomy in the alphabet
01:57:50 Lucy said Joseph could read the egyptian papyrus’ missing parts by putting his head in a hat and he could see what they said (Lucy Mack Smith - 10/3/1846)
02:01:30 Grammar
02:04:00 Words per plate
02:15:00 Breaking down each character
02:28:14 Translate it with the papyrus, stones, and hat now…prophets of today
02:27:15 Joseph Smith writes “Translation of Abraham”
02:38:00 Why was Joseph Smith creating alphabets if he wasn’t translating?
02:52:10 Rotating characters and reusing them in translation
02:56:00 Joseph made the dark figure a slave in the papyrus
03:06:20 Disagree and still be friends
03:17:00 Ignoring the dictation evidence
03:20:20 Smooth skips chapter 2 & 3 in his book review
03:28:28 debunk 1 not all 7 witnesses
03:39:15 Smoot on revelation…or his other apologists view on revelation
#LDS #Mormon #PostMormon #ExMormon #MormonStories #Religion #Education

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23 июл 2024

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Комментарии : 106

@jameswalberg3265 2 года назад

Kerry brings a smile to your face. He is overflowing with wisdom and kindness. A highly anticipated interview/podcast that does not disappoint. Kerry is the most sincere likeable former apologist. From the BYP's firesides, I know how much work went into this. I appreciate the tremendous amount of the work that went into clarifying this strange chapter in LDS history. Kerry's enthusiasm is infectious. Keeping him on track is a full time job. Some university should give him an honorary PhD.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

That is very kind to say, thank yo so much.

@Chalgal29 2 года назад

Back in probably 2003 or 2004, in the early days of organized exmormon activities in Utah Valley, I attended a screening of a documentary, at a theater at UVU, about the Book of Abraham (I cannot remember the name of it or who put it out), but I do remember this guy who was out in the foyer after the showing who was passing out the "real" information about the BoA (i.e., apologetics) and was talking to people. He was real nice and the guy I was with wanted to talk to him and hear what he had to say, but I remembered his name, it was Kerry Shirts. OMG, imagine my surprise to find this podcast. I had NO idea that he'd come over to the dark side. And he still seems so nice. Wow. Just wow! No one would have predicted this that day at UVU.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Wow! I actually think I sort of remember that event! Thanks for commenting and bringing it back to memory.

@chubbuck35 2 года назад

Gerardo did a wonderful job at getting a very high resolution image of the papyri that allowed him to zoom in and show off the characters. I’m blown away.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

I have had soooooo much enjoyment in meeting, getting to know Gerardo, and working with him, and his using his incredible skills to bring this whole presentation to a much stronger and higher level/graphics. When I grow up I wanna be as skillful as he is!

@cindihunter9119 2 года назад

Gerardo is an intelligent gem! ♥️👏

@kaylorshumaker2235 2 года назад

sandra tanner and john larsen have always been my favorite guests but this guy is definitely joining the list! great episode, y’all!

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Thank you. I promise I will try my best to never disappoint. Come join me Sunday at 6 p.m. over at Mormon Discussion Inc. (Hope it's o.k. to ad that here John! No offense intended whatsoever my dear friend.)

@Rcplanecrasher 2 года назад

Hey Gerardo and Backyard Professor , Elder Igloo here. Thanks for using a lot of my graphics. Loved that you kept Yoda in there 😂 Hope it helped!

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

THANK YOU! I so appreciate your efforts as well and you are a HUGE part of this. It is always helpful showing visuals with this subject! Look forward to more exciting adventures with you and many others

@Moksha-Raver 2 года назад

Proved Yoda in graphics true it did.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

@@Moksha-Raver When Yoda speaks listen the prophets do...

@iamjustsaying1 2 года назад

Gerardo's slides really helped me understand and solidify some of the confusion that has remained, despite my serious study of BofA. And, I can see now that the apologists are the ones who are muddying the water, purposefully, to keep us confused.

@chubbuck35 2 года назад

This is absolutely incredible. You have demonstrated all the key points in a succinct way. Thank you Gerardo and Backyard Professor and thank you John for hosting. This is what we call smoking gun evidence of fraud. SMOKING GUN EVIDENCE.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

I appreciate you letting us know this as that was absolutely the entire intent of this. It is the intent of my 15+ video series on the Mormon Discussion Inc site "Backyard Professor - Getting Clear on the Joseph Smith Papyri."

@thelastgoonie6555 2 года назад

Thanks BYP and Gerardo! Would love to hear a discussion on the canonization of the Book of Abraham as scripture since that came decades later.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

We can make that happen!

@cindihunter9119 2 года назад

Mormon Stories! You are shining! Love this podcast! I adore the care, thought provoking, and intelligence that is present here! ♥️

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Thank you Cindi. We put an enormous amount of time and effort into making sure the information here is accurate and easy to understand. We appreciate the kind sentiments! More to come!

@jacobopstad5483 2 года назад

The Book of Abraham always caught my interest when I was a TBM. Finding out it was a fraud was the beginning of the end of my testimony.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Yes this is the stickler of them all I will admit.

@jeannycastro2379 2 года назад

The Mormon scholars saying that there is another piece of parchment/papyrus that we are missing and that is why we don’t have the correct translation sounds like Joseph smith coming up with another set of plates all together when his translation of the first 116 pages was at risk.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

An excellent observation!

@caseyjude5472 2 года назад

Kerry reminds me of the fact that the church really & truly is losing their best & brightest members. Kerry is so wonderful!

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Oh you are very kind Casey. Thank you. More to come!

@Mon-Alisa 2 года назад

3:04:30 The only other theory you can go with is the catalyst theory *with the clarification* that God let Joseph *_think_* he was translating the hieroglyphs when he was really just _getting revelation_ that had _nothing to do_ with the hieroglyphs at all. This theory would imply that God is sometimes extra specific with Joseph (like much of the D&C revelations), but other times very unclear, even though God himself should’ve known that letting Joseph think he was translating Egyptian would ultimately look really bad for the whole foundation of the church when we would eventually find out the correct translation was nowhere close to what Joseph came up with.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Excellent point Alisa. We will dismantle the catalyst theory tomorrow night as well on my live session at Mormon Discussion Inc at 6 p.m. Mountain time.

@zmb5126 2 года назад

loved this! graphics are amazing. When the spiritual/mental pressure of believing finally became too much for me, i had the thought- there was a line in the round facsimile that said "if the world can translate these characters, let it be so." and so i thought, well egyptology has come a long way, i wonder if anyone has translated the book of abraham facsimilles? As soon as I saw that Joesph had completely made up all the names, the language etc, that was it for me. That led me to the CES letter, and to that layer of apologetics where you realize there is no factual foundation for the church's narrative. Kerry's line "why doesnt Russell M Nellson use the seer stone to translalte the book of joseph? If you think about it, that is a really profound question. There should be nothing in theory that differentiates Nelson from Joseph, regarding abilities to translate. Or ALL THE MODERN DAY PROPHETS. Any one of them should have been able to use the "catalyst method" just as easily to give the world a book of scripture that apparently was on the roster before Joseph died. Would we not benefit from that if it was so readily available? just a few hours with his face in the hat, and Nelson could benefit the world with new scripture, new words from the mouth of God... makes you think!

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

We had such a ball producing this together. Thank you for watching and sharing your thoughts

@hattswank5313 2 года назад

Better yet, why haven’t the prophets used their seer stones to do reverse translations of the Book of Mormon into all the languages that have needed to be accommodated for missionary work over the years?

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

@@hattswank5313 A just POWERFUL question

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

@@randyjordan5521 LOL! Only you Randy....

@jayanderson147 2 года назад

Mr. Shirts should be a college professor. He would make lectures sooo much more interesting. 10/10 for the content, 10/10 for the fantastic mustache.

@davidnielsen68 2 года назад

I love the BYP. He knows his stuff. Great addition to your library.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

That is very kind, thanks man!

@leeevanmorgan 2 года назад

Loved this episode! Thank you all. Kerry, not sure if you remember, but you spoke at my mission farewell. I have always appreciated your willingness to do that. Hope you are well.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Oh that is too intriguing to leave me hanging! Where and when?

@leeevanmorgan 2 года назад

@@TheBackyardProfessor We worked together at Olson Construction in 85. My farewell was in Rigby, November 85.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

@@leeevanmorgan OMG! I *DO* remember you! A blast from the past!!! Man what a very pleasant surprise!!! We gotta stay in touch man. This is soooooooo cool!

@perrykim5 2 года назад

Watched this whole episode, just wanted to say how valuable it will be, also love Dan Vogels Book of Abraham Apologetics! It’s the best !!

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Can't disagree with that Peter! Vogel is one of my heroes! Thanks for watching

@valeriegriner5644 Год назад

Sandra Tanner is my favorite! She is sooo knowledgable about EVERYTHING Mormon!

@thomasfischer9259 Месяц назад

20k views ... this should have 200k. This was one the best videos I have seen on the subject.

@Moksha-Raver 2 года назад

From the portion beginning with Princess Katumin and King Onitas, it is apparent that Joseph did not understand the Before Christ numbering system for years. Earth years go from about 4.5 billion BC to 1 AD. Somebody should have revealed that to Joseph.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Yes... even if in a tree instead of a stone or something - GRIN! The Green Man! One of my favorite mythology characters!

@Moksha-Raver 2 года назад

@@TheBackyardProfessor Yeah! Imagine having Princess Katumin being born before her father. That would be a true BoA miracle.

@jesse1008 2 года назад

Kerry you have been such a delight !! I enjoyed this so much. Would love to hear more from you 👍🏼

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

I will do more, thank you for the kind words.

@shannahdawn4724 2 года назад

How I LOVE Crazy Professors!! Speaking (the often painful), truth and making it somehow unavoidably delightful. Bloody Brilliant!!

@kimgoeckeritz6320 2 года назад

I am really enjoying this guys energy! Such a fun guy!

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Thank you Kim. Lots more to come!

@hattswank5313 2 года назад

1. The church loves to tout the brief time JS needed to produce the 500+ page BOM. But he needed a ton of time to produce the much shorter BOA. Further, why is there no grammar/alphabet for the plates? 2. Where was the Urim and Thummim for the BOA? Why would it not be used for this? Based on the BOM story, JS should have been able to produce the BOA and the Book of Joseph in a matter of days.

@phyllisw. 2 года назад

May 10th, 2022! Date posted is missing now! Thankyou for posting!

@MegaJohn144 2 года назад

John said: "Removing the literality undermines the entire restoration." When you really think about what is said about the restoration, Joseph Smith didn't actually restore all that much. To Kerry's point: If you speak about taking him literally, and defending him instead of defending the modern church, then take a look at what the revelations actually say and what he actually taught. We have a record of the restoration of the Aaronic Priesthood, but I am wondering if it was the understanding of the Aaronic Priesthood that was restored, not the actual Priesthood, itself. I don't know if the actual Priesthood itself was ever lost. The accounts of the "restoration" of the Melchizedek Priesthood are sketchy and inconsistent. Joseph and Oliver never talked about the vision in the Kirtland temple. Elijah never gave them any keys. Joseph Smith always spoke of the coming of Elijah as a future event. Several sections of the D&C speak of the "restoration" and the "dispensation of the fulness of times" as future events (e.g. Section 77, 128). And the D&C always speaks of Joseph Smith and his associates as laying the *foundation* for the restoration, not the full-blown restoration itself. As far as I am concerned, he was not the righteous person the church claims he to be, and he admitted that he was not very righteous. I think he lied about a lot of stuff, but he also gave us some great understandings, which I, at least, cannot deny. I am struggling to reconcile the two in my own mind. His name is held for both good and evil in my own mind, and I am trying to save the baby while chucking out the bath water. I don't worship the man. I don't worship the church. At least Joseph Smith had some redeeming characteristics. The corporate church has none, while embracing Joseph's lies and neglecting his truths.

@mormonstories 2 года назад

What has he given humanity of real value @John Crane?

@MegaJohn144 2 года назад

@@mormonstories You may argue with these and say these are ideas he picked up from other sources. I agree. But he brought them together and presented them in a form that the average person could understand. Unfortunately, the corporate church does not wholeheartedly support any of these ideas. Relentless desire to seek the truth wherever you find it and question authority, especially religious authority. That man may commune with God. That God operates on natural principles of cause and effect, not by magic. A better understanding of the nature of Priesthood

@rwsd1025 2 года назад

Where can I find where it says the BOM was translated from only 14 plates?

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

It is in Dan VOgel's Documents of Early Mormonism, the 5 volume set. Gerardo looked it up online, I am not sure how he did it. I shall have to look myself

@leonardojerkovic3618 Год назад

What about Book of Joseph? Did anyone translate it?

@lashram32 2 года назад

So Awesome! Thank you.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Thanks. Striving for clarity helps get it to awesome doesn't it!

@lashram32 2 года назад

@@TheBackyardProfessor yes sir it does

@robcox81 6 месяцев назад

I can’t tell if this guy is a genius or insane but perhaps he’s both? Lol Great work guys.

@ZCMIShopper 6 месяцев назад

The Backyard Prof is a little of both but shouldn't be driving or using machinery while doing podcasts. lol I love his Zany style! I love how Geraldo is his designated driver while JD keeps the traffic moving. lol These guys are Awesome!

@kentthalman4459 Год назад

Disappointed that Kerry hasn't come on Mormon Stories to give us his story.

@mormonstories Год назад

I’d love that!!!

@CarolinaKley Год назад

I want this guy as my college professor

@MrBilgey 2 года назад

In facsimile No.1 in Smith's so called Book of Abraham 'The angel of the Lord' ( figure 1 ) hovering over the 'body of Abraham'. I have seen the same 'angel of the Lord' hovering over the lifeless penis of a pharaoh in the temple at Dendera.

@mormonstories 2 года назад

Exactly!!!

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Yes, I have seen lots of lion couches with various types of representations, making each one actually unique from all the others. For years I was side railed by Nibley saying and showing Joseph Smith's Fac. 1 is absolutely unique. Now I realize that is true of every single one of them since they actually were written by individuals for individuals. Yes there is an overall pattern, but each one is totally unique of itself.

@GravityBoy72 2 года назад

It's amazing that people still believe in the Mormon religion with all the information out there.

@frankvelazqiez2961 2 года назад

This guy is awesome.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

Thank you, that is very kind.

@randinboise 2 года назад

Closed Captioning please!

@MegaJohn144 2 года назад

Well-presented and easy to understand. "All of Mormonism can be understood through polygamy." Lindsay Hansen Park. This probably applies to the church from Brigham Young going forward. "All of Mormonism can be understood through treasure digging." John Dehlin. This was probably true while Joseph Smith was alive. There really are two different churches. The only connection is Brigham Young using Joseph Smith as a platform to stand on.

@mormonstories 2 года назад

I would say that the treasure digging persists to today.

@StephRivera 2 года назад

Joseph Smith was all about polygamy. But you're right Brigham Young changed a lot of the vibe of the church.

@MegaJohn144 2 года назад

@@mormonstories How so?

@MegaJohn144 2 года назад

@@StephRivera Polygamy became public under Brigham Young. He added 26 sections to the D&C in support of polygamy in 1876, which removed the old Section 101 on marriage being between one man and one woman. If the church really believed in monogamy, they would have brought this section back instead of writing the Proclamation on the Family. The church denies the Adam-God theory was ever taught, but there is abundant proof that that Brigham Young taught the doctrine and excommunicated people who didn't believe in it. Adam-God is a natural extension to polygamy.

@StephRivera 2 года назад

@@MegaJohn144 what I'm saying is that if you understand Mormonism better when you understand polygamy you have to start with Joseph smith. Brigham Young is not the one who came up with the idea.

@deskjockie4948 Год назад

As to priesthood lineage, Joseph Smith claimed to be a literal descendant of Joseph of Egypt, yet Joseph of Egypt married an Egyptian woman who was the daughter of an Egyptian priest. Their children, Ephraim and Manesseh, and their descendents, were therefore unworthy to hold the Melchidek priesthood. (See Abraham 1:20-22 and 1:26-27)

@sdfotodude Год назад

When the Fonzie of Mormonism finally jumps the shark.

@mimsredjelly 10 месяцев назад

It's not how many angels can fit on the head of a pin, it's how much information can an angel fit on 14 gold plates!

@roberthasse7862 2 года назад

Dear Mr. Dehlin: Quick comment (and not meant to be obnoxious). You frequently misuse the expression--as I did for years--"begs the question." You use it to mean "brings the question up for consideration." But that's actually incorrect. In fact, begging the question means presuming the conclusion that you are in fact trying to demonstrate. The easy example is that I know the Bible is the literal word of God because it says so in the Bible . . . which is the word of God.

@mormonstories 2 года назад

So true. But can the phrase have two meanings?!?!

@GravityBoy72 2 года назад

@@mormonstories Yes it can. The common usage is your usage.

@JakobMusick 2 года назад

27 minutes to even began?? Wow that must be a record.

@richardholmes5676 Год назад

Paul Gregersen debunked the Egyptologists.

@Toppo2099 2 года назад

John... You don't have to yell when you speak buddy. Chill, lol.

@mormonstories 2 года назад

Sorry.

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

@@daveyjones9930 I actually didn't hear him yelling, though I am half deaf myself - GRIN!

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

@@daveyjones9930 Yeah I don't mean to yell, I just get excited is all - GRIN!

@Bold11x Год назад

Reading the comments apparently there is a portion of people who can take in information when the person giving it talks in an obnoxious tone. Seems like great info but cannot get past the lingo and tone

@patricisbinder4880 2 года назад

No women!

@klelligans 2 года назад

wat

@thelastgoonie6555 2 года назад

You're here able to comment. Do you have anything meaningful/pertinent to contribute to the conversation? We're all ears...take it away.

@klelligans 2 года назад

I’ve never gotten misogynistic vibes from John or Gerardo in anything I’ve ever watched. If you think they intentionally had no women on an episode… where is that coming from? And if every piece of media you consume has to have a woman in it, just for the sake of diversity, do you realize how negative that can be?

@TheBackyardProfessor 2 года назад

@@jcrook5904 Wow. That's a bolt out of the blue. Me a misogynist?! Um, somehow I think you have your wires crossed.

@klelligans 2 года назад

Sorry BYP