3 Battery Range and Temp Testing in the Forests of Endor || Sur Ron X 

Same

All on belts

Thanks for letting us know. Forrest fires had that whole side of the tillamook Forrest closed last time we went :( will check it out next time!

430 phase amps. It will effect range a bit running it higher, also builds more heat.

Watched till the end and got most of the answers to these questions. I like how the batteries seem to fit much better then the lite speed versions. Are you using 18650 cells or 21650/21700 cells? I'm really debating buying a battery for mines I wanted to build one at first but it truely is a art form that is hard to master building these batteries in a high quality way that fits inside the tiny area they give you on these bikes. I wish the battery area was more like the stealth bombers but that would definitely mess with the looks of the frame too.

Yes weight plays a huge roll not to mention people seem to mix up the difference between battery current and motor current. If I’m running 12kW and someone else is running 5kW, we still have the same amount of motor current at low RPM which generates the same amount of heat. More power only leads to more motor current above a certain RPM. Anecdotally, we actually noticed in our testing around a 10Deg/6 Tooth decrease in temperature as we increased the sprocket with equal weight riders. There are also many other customers of ours who’ve noticed a large reduction in motor temp with higher tooth sprockets. Likely more relevant to those doing lots of climbs…

Partly true, the motor current is not the same at the same rpm at different power levels. Power is the Produkt of Torque and rpm, if you accelerate at the same rpm, the torque/motorcurrent will be higher compared 5 to 12kW. But rpm limits the motor current, that is true. The lower the rpm, the higher the max. capable current. If you can say your testing is accurate with 10deg/6tooth then the motors efficiency curve is worse than i thought at higher current. Why are you building a 60V battery? 72V or even 84V with higher gear reduction would be way more efficient.

This is true it doesn’t stay the same but it peaks the same at the controller limit under initial acceleration but obviously that’s pretty short lived. I guess the point was that motor temp depends on i^2*R which has a much greater effect from the high phase current at Low RPM compared to the more similar phase current as PWM levels out and motor current starts to approach DC current. Regarding the battery, 72V is the nominal limit of our controllers so 84 is off the table. 60V was what we chose for a couple reasons. The first being the cell layout worked better for a higher Wh battery when running 16S vs 20s. I think it was something like 300Wh difference in the same size battery so not that significant. And of course that was trying to not over complicate the stripping layout. You could do it in the same layout and get fancy with how you connect everything but that increases complexity. The other reasons are mainly due to liability. 72V allows you to spin the motor to the point of failure (with some FW) quite easily where a 60V even with a good amount of FW will stay under that limit. We also aren’t interested in selling batteries that allow our customers to hit 80+ on what is basically a MTB. Even the 60+ you can hit on a 60V is excessive. Also, a 64T is the biggest sprocket you can reasonably source/fit on these bikes which we already run with a 60V. That setup seems to keep the motor at a really efficient RPM range. Realistically the difference between 10kW at 60V vs 72V is ~25A at full load. Definitely makes a difference as far as heat from current goes but nothing crazy.

Yes, thats why the 200lbs rider reached the cut of temp that easy with 4,8kW. Does the phase current reach the limit already at 4,8kW??? How much is it? Thats what i thought, technically it would be more efficient. But regarding to the problems a 72V setup causes its better to chose 60V. The surron just isnt made for tall heavy riders who want to climb some hills ^^. Or at least the motor. Maybe you will build a new motor with a 120V System oneday haha. That would solve every problem. The Alta for example has a smaller motor than the surron just because they are running 20k rpm.

Yeah I believe it can hit that limit all be it very briefly. We definitely have some interest in a ‘high voltage’ setup like the Alta but things seemingly get tricky to source once you go higher voltage. We are part of our schools formula team so we will be building a 400V battery here soon! Will be curious if the benefits of higher voltage.

We used a Tubliss 2.0 system in the rear. Highly recommend. You can look in the description for part links

@@emotobros is there anyway to speak to you? I have an issue and really would like to get info on trying to fix this issue. It is really frustrating and with what I see on your channel there has to be a solution.

Cool enough to touch it. Usually only gets hot on super steep hill climbs with limited air flow. When we are cruising a lot the heatsink does its job well.

The sur ron is more of a motorcycle than an electric bicycle. We only ride on trails where gas bikes are allowed. In oregon they are designated as OHV areas

@Cisco I’ve heard 60v with 4000bac can still reach speeds of 60mph… any idea how long those speeds can be sustained without overheating? Is that 10 miles? A couple miles or just a few hundred feet? I also don’t necessarily want the extra speed however I would like a little more power as I’m debating getting a bigger sprocket. B

$2 from Home Depot 😁

Check the description

@@emotobros okay thank you, great videos hard to find good videos of surrons off roading

Yes, but you can’t reach the same Wh on a 72 volt so we are prioritizing the 60V

With some field weakening it’s a bit over 50Mph

All 60V

@@emotobros So you could run those batteries on stock X controllers? What would the max power output be then?

@@Xanathar77 if you are running stock controller it will pull stock power

0%. That’s all we run.

Got it. Noticed my 72v lightspeed tuned asi bac 8000 was set at 14kw with 45 percent FW. Is there a big difference if I put it to 0 percent? Thanks

Not necessarily. You just lose torque on the top end equal to the percentage you have it set to for the purpose of a higher top speed.

They have metal plating under the rubber but are not sealed in a metal case for serviceability and so that you can replace the rubber easily if it ever gets damaged. There have also been cases where a fully metal case when punctured/dented will then puncture a cell and cause a fire where fiberglass will absorb and splinter. That’s why our metal plating is top/bottom/front/back but not sides. Also for fitment reasons.

Everyone rode the bike they own. Grants bike was only a couple weeks old and he hadn’t had time to source all the new parts/bypass battery. We were expecting the bigger power levels to generate more heat but that didn’t happen. Everyone was on 430 phase amps

@@emotobros OK. Thanks for the clarity. I imagine Grant was at around 200 PA's since that's stock. We all know weight plays a huge factor on range. My wife (125lbs) has the twice the range I do at 190lbs. That's why I was asking.

Grant was at 430PA just like all of us were! Weight certainly plays a roll.

@@emotobros holy crap. You guys are able to pull 430 PA’s from a stock controller?

Grant doesn’t have the stock controller. He has the BAC but was just running stock power since he was using a stock battery.

Yep, through EggRider. That functionality was added in an EggRider update and if your value isn’t changing you’ll need to download our app and hit save to flash to get the latest updates 🤘🏽

$1800-$2200 depending on options.

All 60V for this test.

I don’t think that would do much to help. The main issue is lack of air flow and the conduction through the motor is pretty poor so you end up with a huge gradient from the shaft to the casing.

We sold ours and strictly ride these but for very long rides/the track nothing beats gas.

You can use the chapters to find what you want to watch. The testing videos take time