4 Signs that your Saddle Discomfort has nothing to do with the saddle itself 

I have been searching for detail information on saddle and hand discomfort for some time. This is by far the best explanation I have seen! Excellent job! Your video is extremely helpful. I will continue to watch your other videos on this subject to help me determine how to resolve my issues. Thanks again.

Really well presented. Thank you for creating these!

The best bike fit videos on RU-vid.

Thanks for the tips. Today I adjusted my handlebars because I’ve been sliding down the seat and having serious butt pain. Raising the bars helped a lot. A simple idea that was worth a lot for me.

this was spot on. adjusted my sattle today and comfort was immediately noticeable. thanks!

Wonderful explanation and clarity much appreciated

Love your videos John, you make it sound so logical.

So everything! You need a bike fit!!! Joking, great channel! Very useful info!

I have had so many discussions with folks on this subject, finally I found someone who shares my thoughts on this😄, great video, thanks 👍🏻

this one really outlines my problems and give advice on how to solve them! was searching for this info for a long time and never found, but thanks to bikefit lessons now I know what's wrong with my toes.

Finally got into road cycling and been fighting to adjust. Went to flat pedals, tried rotating bars slightly, saddle positions/heights. After watching a few of your videos and some others I decided before buying a new saddle I needed to invest in a new stem. Stock my bike had a 140mm, so I dropped down to a 110. High speed seems unaffected, handling is much more stable when riding around at slower speeds as it's much more maneuverable.... BUT!!!!!! my butt... I'm now sitting back on the saddle more, like I should. So I think my saddle is fine. I was sliding off the front of it before, I'd get pain just forward of my sit bones where I'd normally get sore after long days on my mtb, pressure on my hands was killing me and I was blaming my gloves and bar tape, and my neck and shoulders would hurt so bad after rides 2 hours or more that I'd have to take almost a week off the road bike. Think I need a chiropractor to get my neck/shoulders corrected (after this covid blows over) but I can function now, and all because of a stem length change. Thanks for putting out such thorough and well thought out content.

Thank you.. one of the best videos. Please do more Bicycle riding tips videos.

At last! - my teenage daughter has been struggling with saddle discomfort for months and we've invested hundreds of $ on saddles. This video is the first I've seen that explains the issues - well done and Thank you for making this!

Very informative video. Confirmed some of my suspicions. On an unrelated note, I’m a Wilier bike owner and a newly converted bont wearer. Respect!

your videos are so helpful!!

You're just great, love your vids. Very informative.

Thank you. Good information especially regarding toe numbness and tingling. Any info regarding cramp in leg muscles would be spot on. Again Good video.

Thanks for your very helpful explanations

This is a good generalized video. That said its not necessarily useful for people like myself who need to ride in a more upright position because of age-related neck or upper back issues. Because I am more upright with an endurance geometry bike and raised handlebars, I finally discovered that tilting the seat back in the same direction as my body worked wonders. I discovered this after being through 2 different bike fits and swapping out several saddles. It wasn't the saddles, it was the saddle angle which had to be set about 5 degrees off of level. .

Another great video - lots of little bits of information that I have seen elsewhere all together in one place. I will be experimenting over the next few weeks, mainly with bar height and reach.

Yay im your 5500th sub, it was 5.4, subbed and then refreshed, 5.5. im surprised this channel is not bigger, such good content.

Boy, that really clears it up!?????

Excellent. Thank you!

Wow you are here for me I'm not sure how I found u but you are my answer to my problems of riding fantastic video, thank you my rides will be more enjoyable from here on out 🐸 Dean

Thank you so much for an amazing video!

Excellent video. Thank you.

great information!

MANNNN !!! Just discovered your channel VERY INFORMATIVE VIDEO !!! Great tips, advices for any level for a cyclist. KEEP ON THE VIDEOS :-) PS. Can you do a video about how to shift gears to make your ride for comfortable ( Steep hill, descending or flat road ) ??? THANKS !!!!

Thank you! You're the best!

Really appreciate your effort thanks bro

Wow!! It makes sense now! Your videos are so much helpful. I’ve suscribe thank you so much! I have a question where do you get your biking shorts from? Or what website you use to buy new biking shorts

Very good video !

Loved it, thanks

great informative video. i didn't know a saddle too low could cause all these issues. i thought a low saddle just made the pedal stroke inefficient. didn't think it could cause these issues. i might have to raise my saddle

Great video, thanks

I have trouble with sore bum/hips and knees - and i tried 3 saddles. Yhis was a great video for me (ill be making adjustments)

thanks found out my reach is too long. need a shorter stem. thanks

Very informative. Thank you.

I check all these things as soon as I get new bike never had a problem 👍

Is that a Claris set.?I tend to lower my nose so I as to avoid sitting on my perinium.thus the forwrd slide.I tweak this by adjusting my saddle frwrf/aft position

My saddle tilt before is 0 degrees.. Made me had to stretched my arms to reach the hood.. I’ve changed my saddle tilt nose down little bit, and its made me comfort riding the bike and get easily on aero position..

I want to say that point 4 about foot problems is spot on. I've been plagued by foot numbness for a long time. I ended up solving it because I loaned my bike to a buddy's brother for one ride when he came in from out of town. We adjusted the saddle to fit him (raised it) and when he brought it back, I attempted to get it back to my normal setting. I ended up missing by about 2mm. It was a bit higher and BAM, foot trouble over! It made it possible to enjoy riding again. So my advice is tweak by 1 to 2mm until it goes away. This works.

Hi! Thanks so much for the great videos! they have helped a lot as I have only been riding for 4 months and loving it! 'm 6'3ft and 250 lbs at 15% bf. (just to give an idea of build to frame question) - My sit bone width is 138cm - I am told this is very wide for a guy. People have recommended at least 10cm of clearance on either side of each sit bone for saddle sizing. however, Previously the most I could find would achieve 5.5mm on each side with a 149 gm saddle. I have now found a 155 from seller royal. I'm hoping this will help solve the problems I'm having of pain and saddle sores. The saddles I have run just don't feel like I have enough area to plat my si bones, I often feel like I need to move and reposition. DO you think that 10cm each side is a reasonable clearance as a starting point for a better bike fit? thanks again!!

Thanks! you're great.

Hi, how often do we have to cahnge the saddle in a route bike? thank you from Houston, TX

I changed my saddle and my pelvis pain went away also my arm numness went as well I did have to adjust my handlebars to bring them closer to me good tips

Hello! Great video, very helpful ! I have a question regarding saddle tilt. Can a saddle nose tilted too much down cause lower back pain? I have done this to relief discomfort on the pelvis, which it did. But created sore lower back on the 3 rides i tried this set up. Thanks!

Great....im sure i wont overthink any of this advice in investigating my hand numbness and saddle discomfort.

I am building a Trek Boone cx bike after I sold my Emonda due to a broken C5&6 vertebrae fracture. on my current Crockett build I get a little numbness in the hands on the thumb side. 54 cm frame with a 100 mm 10 upward degree bend. the shifters are flat as is the saddle. I reckon I need a shorter stem on the Boone to relieve this pressure.

Awesome information!!!

explained well

Is there a optimal range of position the hip should be behind the feet? I've read that the GT in line with the seat tube is a good way of setting seat setback. Could you do a video of this topic perhaps? Pretty please

I do disagree with some things he says, but in general, he's right on the money. Lots of incorrect bike fit info on the internet. One important factor that's not mentioned (crank length) get this wrong for your limb lengths & hip mobility & no saddle or position can be made to fit you comfortably ... start with shoes / pedals / cleat position, then work on saddle height / position / Tilt ... 40 yrs & many thousands of miles of racing / setting up my bikes & other riders.

You covered my pain symptoms in #4, BUT I was having the symptoms described BEFORE I got on a bike for the first time in about 32 years. That was 2 weeks ago. Doctors are not listening to me, can't explain why I no longer depend on cane to walk/have decreased pan in hip. Can anyone suggest a video that might explain?

I feel very comfortable on the saddle but recently having issues with shoulders. Don't know if increasing reach will solve it since I'm always riding on the very top of the hoods

I need to buy my first Chamois because I went cycling and my bum was destroyed for 3 days. Any advice on which Chamois has the most cushion/protection?

With a specialized toupe saddle how do you make it level? Where do you put your level to check?

This might be it. All of a sudden, after 1 year of riding, I’ve been having terrible perineal pressure after 35 miles. I am pretty sure I need to set my saddle level and raise it a bit

I don't slip forward in the saddle, but I find myself wanting to shift myself further back than the saddle goes. Does it need to be higher, or do I need an offset seat post? My frame is larger than the experts have recommended for me, so my reach is not too short. Surprisingly, that sliver of a road bike seat is less painful than my bigger mountain bike seat.

I recently found your channel and it's given me a new appreciation for the science of bike fitting. Sadly I was given a poor fit when I started cycling a couple of years ago and developed significant back issues as a result (overly tight QL muscle on one side, neck & mid-back strains). For now I've given up cycling but if I can fully recover I'll definitely be more informed for the next time I get a fit done.

Thank you. It was very informative. After I saw this video some week ago. I dropped my saddle about a cm and moved also aft too by a cm, got more comfortable, then I dropped it another 4 mm and I got faster and I can now ride while holding from hoods too.. And also I can ride hands off from handlebar now.. Don't get tired so much after long ride also. Most comfortable I feel now when I'm on drops. I still feel like I need to push my own rear end back to the rear end of saddle time to time.. Seems I'm sliding forward.. But I'm sure I will figure out what causes it by my own.. someday. Currently I did not have saddle discomfort, but I always felt that the reach is too far.. It was confusing, because when I bought the bike. I bought one size smaller than sizechart recommended. But I made a lot of research to figure out how long top-tube and/or reach would fit me. I believe I got correct size. But one thing that bugged me, did not make any sense, but was still throwing some doubts to me. Was that some websites said that wen between 2 sizes: measure ape-index. And if it's positive: take the bigger frame. I do have positive ape index, but I did not follow that advice, because it did not make sense. The bigger frame would have also longer head tube - higher stack. Initially I had set saddle according of equations and heels on pedal method and so on.. Also had measured knee and whatever angles.. But I don't have indoor trainer, so I just dropped chain. Sat on bike while leaning against wall.. aligned my rear part on saddle to a position where I usually sit on while riding and filmed from side.. with as long lens as I could use in my small space, then measured the angles with protractor against computer screen... Seems I could not do it well like that, since it was not good. I remember I lowered it last autumn about a cm or even 1.5. too. That time I moved it partially because of saddle discomfort.. Felt like pinching pain under perineum.. like someone pulling from hairs there, or something similar pinching. Thought that it's the fault of bike pants. But by fluke I discovered it was because of too high saddle.. I think all saddles are designed to be horizontal. If I set nose even little downwards I may get numbness.. Even though It does not look like I'm sliding too much forward that way. When I was kid I liked to tilt nose upward. I guess, I was just stupid.. or maybe I was a sado masochist. It was definitely not too comfortable to ride like that, but I still set it that way. I always had it also so high as possible, and also moved it as far aft too I think, because I thought that this way I can use more muscles more efficiently. Also calf muscles and hand muscles. But I don't say that I did wrong. It was still worth of trying.. It has been interesting path to travel. To experience and learn different things. But it's also interesting to learn from others, even if they are smarter than I am. It's still pleasant to get know more. ;D This was one of the best video tutorial about bikefiting that I have seen. Now I just have to figure out what is the things that you kept to yourself and did not mention here. And then I will be as smart as you are and even surpass you in my big greatness. :P

i just got my fixed gear bike and the bikeshop set the saddle height lower as I requested. However my hands hurts so bad when I ride, it seems all my weight are going into my hands. Since hands are also handles balancing and steering it hurts even riding 15-30mins. I set the saddle all the way down and now I ride more comfortably. Since I ride fixed gear my legs are doing all the work in pedals then backpedaling however it's now easier and I enjoy riding my bike.

I bought a used bike a couple weeks ago. I was finding that my hands were going numb and I was constantly sliding forward, plus my feet were feeling sloppy on the pedals. No spd pedals yet, just regular. So I slid my seat foward and also raised it an inch. My hands no longer go numb, my feet no longer wander on my pedals, BUT I am still having to constantly slide my butt back. So should I be raising my handlebars instead of moving my seat forward and up? I have been riding 25 miles 3 times a week. At about mile 14 (1 hour) I have to get off my bike, and take a couple minute break because my butt hurts so bad. I am early 60s and have had both hips replaced. I am probably 50 pounds UNDERTALL. Thanks for your help.

Does this explain why I get cramp in both legs?

Good video thanks.. But you need a wireless mic, man!

All good points. UCI now allows higher variance in saddle angle. Pros are now, per a recent GCN video, 'slamming' their saddle. My concern, people will want to emulate this. Perhaps it would be a good future video topic, especially as issues like poor bike handling, hand/wrist problems start to show-up in the pro peloton.

I think I may need to tip my seat forward I’ll try that first. Thanks

Thank you from Pakistan

i found my sadlle must be upwards , after this change my pelvis is very stable and i got power in my legs too .....but i need it very forward to handlebars so i need seatpost with offset toward to front wheeel .....

excellent

That's my issue! I just bought a Trek FX and am sliding forward. The bars are too far and Im getting saddle sore.

What was that explosion??

Thanks for the video. My problem with the saddle is a little strange. I keep bouncing on it. I ride a diverge expert carbon size 54 and I keep bouncing of the saddle when I'm trying to accelerate. However when I ride my brothers bike which is a a diverge Base carbon size 54 I don't have that problem. Both the bikes have the same Geometry but different group sets. Different tires. What could the problem be?

I didn't know it was this complex

"Fit issues!" How do you fix these issues? "By fixing the fit of the bike!" Ohhhhkay then.

thanks this was really helpful. I recently started to notice I was slipping forward and having hand issues. Regarding saddle & handlebar/stem height and or length, how do you know what to change? I had a bike fitting when I bought my bike so I am confident about my saddle height. I am a tall guy and not extremely flexible. How do I know when to use spacers in the stem or change the reach? Is there a measurement similar to calculating saddle height?

Hi John, thanks for the informative video. I hope my bike fit is correct as I have just spent a great deal of our UK pounds in a hand made bespoke bike following a 2.5 hour Retul bike fit. The saddle is a Fizik Antares & I am OK for about 2 hours. After that much pain & discomfort ensue. Recently rode a charity sportive, over 6 hrs., nearly cried with pain! I am an old boy of 74 & only started serious riding two years ago. I went through 6 saddles on my Hybrid, finally settling on the US, Selle Anatomica. what is your opinion of that design? I may have to change to another SA, even if heavier for my lightweight, however worried that the drop bar cycle will not be the same as the flat bar Hybrid. Advice please.

how too remedy three issues would make a nice addition to this video

how can you test on yourself. If my seat hight is too low i will have problem because then I can lift my leg over to get off. also i am 68 and having problem with the seat pushing to much in to wrong area. and making it sore. I was looking at getting a wider seat but dont know if i should try to reposition the seat

Thanks for the video. My sitting bones always hurt after every ride, 2-3 hours ride, sometimes 4. But I don't have any issues with the four signs you mention, like arms hurting or knees hurting. Does this mean it's a saddle issue? Thanks.

5:35 nearly crapped my pants

Great info. From another source I've just been advised to raise my saddle 1cm and bring my cleats 5mm nearer my heel. Right now I'm experiencing some 'saddle' issues so hopefully these things will fix it.

I am a fairly novice rider who is trying to train up to ride to work. The saddle that came with my bike really jarred the base of my spine after rides of 10+ miles. But I had no other problems with fit. And so 3 weeks ago I had a new saddle put on, but did not ride until I started vacation this week. With the new saddle my hands are numb and I keep slipping forward. Aldi I keep falling off when I try and get off the bike. According to the 109% seat fit guideline, the seat is ~1.5 inches too high. Does this sound reasonable? ,

#5: I would also recommend, a lot of seat problems are caused due to a fungus like that of athletes foot. Using a good anti fungal cream every couple days will stop that. Also keeping a 5 gallon bucket near the shower to rinse the shorts off at least every two rides will reduce the fungal build ups and allowing the water to sit for a day before rinsing your shorts will reduce the fabric damage of your shorts due to the chlorine in the water. #6. Fit of the shoe. Getting your foot positioned on the pedal has less to do with the length of your foot as it does to the arch position of the foot. Take for example: Your foot has a length of a size 45. So you buy a 45 and it feels tight and you find you get numb toes and your body just isn't comfortable on the bike because you look down and the ball of your foot is way behind the center of the axle of the peddle. You go in to a local SHOE STORE and ask them to measure the arch of your foot. The sales person should automatically know that you are being very specific as to the fit for your foot. They will probably pay more attention to you. So, let's say you have a 45 (10) measure length and you're arch is a 48 (13). All that means is you're like most men (women are usually the same (7 and 7) which means you have shorter toes in relation to the arch of your foot Get a shoe for a 48. It will make it wider in the front and from my experience, most to not all, come in only a C width. This will open the front up stopping the numb toes and it will the ball of you foot is exactly over the center of the axle of the pedal. Note: The number on the box of the shoes DOES NOT TELL YOU THE LENGTH. It tells you where the arch position is built IN to the shoe. Thus the ball of your foot will be over the axle of the pedal correctly. Do not listen to anyone telling you that a shoe needs to be tight or it will stretch and get better. The shoe should feel good enough for you to wear everywhere (except if you have road shoes where the cleats impede the gate).

Well if I have to chose between buying a new saddle or adopting a grandpa position on the bike I'll go for the new saddle. Sure, saddle discomfort can be solved by changing the fit. But lets face it, if you have a race bike you want to go fast. Which means you want to have a somewhat aero position, and then you will have to have a long + low reach and a bit of a forward angle on the saddle. A saddle with a grippy surface will stop you sliding about, a saddle with a hole in the nose will reduce numbness and perineum pressure, a proper positioning of the bars and grips will eliminate hand numbness, and training core strength will also help a lot for all of these.

What size and degree stem do you have on the bike please?

This problem is single handedly ruining my TT training. Ive had a bike fit and the fitter has placed me pretty high up at the font end to relieve pressure on my undercarriage. Ive even resolved a degree of leg imbalance due to a twisted pelvis ( through physio)... but I cant shake off this damn saddle discomfort. The weird thing is outside on the TT bike it's not too bad, only on the turbo does it really get me - but 99% of my training is indoors on Trainerroad :( Its also hampering my ability to get more aero on the bike which is the whole point of TTs!

Since I bought a single speed / fixed bike, almost 1,5 months i was adjusting my position up to mms

Heres my situation. Every time i get back into cycling i get pain in saddle area of my body. This goes away after a short period of time however it is painful making me to stop often. Almost like building a callous. Had major spine surgery from racing motorcycles many decades ago. Besides love to ride I'm also building my strength. It's a slow process as i bought a week ago Specialized Sirrus Pro Elite Carbon Fiber bike and simply love it. Any suggestions or advice appreciated. Well Made Presentation 🚲👍

How to adjust Saddle Height for MTB?

Which shoes are those?

Hi John just came back into watching this after few weeks started cycling, and I just noticed that in 6:57 your plumb line looks like drop behind the pedal centre as advised by many bike fit videos and it kinda confuse me on what should I achieve first, correct plumb line, perfect reach or saddle comfort? Because now since I follow bike fit tips, I have three problem, hand numb issue, sore butt, and numb right toe. Before I try to find saddle comfort first by putting the saddle centre right on top of the seat post, what I believe made the force pointed not at the sitting bone, but it looks like my plumb line dropped behind the advised one. But it's comfortable. Thank you for your advise. Pardon my english.

I got a question for you. I ride a Trek Domane 4.3 with a Brooks aged B17 saddle. After a few miles my shorts chamois shifts to the right, making me sit on the seam. I have tries different brands of shorts and went to bibs but they all do the same. It must be the way my positioning is set up but I cannot figure it out.Thanks for any help.

you explain various possible causes but no tips on how to setup the bike properly?

En español por fase ve que son buenas las instrucciones para mejor comodidad en bici sufro de dolores en la nuca cuando subo a mi bici

Whats weird for me is that my saddle trouble(discomfort in groin area) began when or after I put my bike(2015 cannondale synapse ultegra) on a trainer(tacx neo 2t)...I'm gonna get a bike fit first and see where that takes me...

Very interesting... I never actually had a bike fit as I bought my bicycle second hand but I am pretty sure the frame size is correct for me. I have noticed i am sliding forward on my saddle and I have shortened my stem as well as have it at a 6deg rise. but I am still having point of contact issues. I was looking at getting another saddle but now I am unsure as what to do. some days I go out and feel fine some days not so much....confused.

Very interesting but could do with diagram pictures too

I guess the choice is being super comfortable on the bike or being aero. Getting more puts one in awkward positions. I work on training my body to be able to adjust to aero position

Would have appreciated more info on achieving correct saddle and hand bar position . I know full well something is wrong. Naming it doesn't help me at all.