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#53 The Many Watch Scams 

WatchArtSci
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With watches being a valuable and portable commodity, there are no surprises that different types of crooks would used them in everything from money laundering to fraudulent acquisition. This videos views a few examples that you need to watch out for when purchasing a watch--especially in overseas transactions. WatchArtSci covers the general topics of high horology watches, watch movements, purchasing watches, judging the value of a watch and its movements and understanding the history of different watches and watch brands that collectors cherish.

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20 окт 2024

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Комментарии : 83   
@altonriggs2352
@altonriggs2352 5 лет назад
Just found your channel...subbed..really enjoy.
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 5 лет назад
Welcome Alton! Join us today for a live stream at 8:30pm GMT. Kindest regards, Bill
@juniorjohnson5961
@juniorjohnson5961 3 года назад
Catching up on your old videos how long have you been doing these ? Good Job 👍
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 3 года назад
I've been doing these videos since March 2016. Glad you like them, Bill
@styx4947
@styx4947 3 года назад
The chrono 24 thing is when dealers list all these great watches at good prices just to get you to enquire, ie, get you into the store, so to speak and try to sell you something else
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 3 года назад
Of course they want to attract you to their products, and I've made some great deals on Chrono24 and eBay ... just have to be careful, Timothy. Take care and be safe, Bill😷
@ivanmejia6843
@ivanmejia6843 5 лет назад
Recently found your channel and love it. Ignore those that say you take too long to get to the point. Creative minds tend to branch out in different directions in their thought process.
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 5 лет назад
Hey Ivan, thanks man! Yes some want everything in a tweet.. no depth; no insights...cheers Bill 🤫
@styx4947
@styx4947 3 года назад
How was that first issue a "bait and switch". The guy got his deposit back and obviously the guy didnt buy the watch at the higher price.
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 3 года назад
Timothy, it was an attempted bait & switch...how's that? Take care and be safe, Bill😷
@styx4947
@styx4947 3 года назад
Cash and carry. Period. For private sales.
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 3 года назад
Timothy, so much of the interaction these days is on the Internet. Safe way is something like Chrono24 where the payment is kept in escrow until the deal is done and the watch is checked by the buyer. Take care and be safe, Bill😷
@kenhofelich
@kenhofelich 3 года назад
I've purchased some vintage watches on ebay 75% were miss represented i'm out of that deal
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 3 года назад
Yes, buying pre-owned from eBay requires both luck and knowledge. However, now eBay requires all watches to go to an evaluation prior to going to the buyer. I've had good luck with eBay, but it's been more a matter of luck than knowledge! Take care, Bill
@بوحسنالنقي
@بوحسنالنقي 6 лет назад
You are a gift to any watch lover. I almost feel like its robbery watching your videos. All the best to you! 🌹
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 6 лет назад
Hey و حسن النقي thanks man! It's very enriching to hear that you find them useful. Kindest regards, Bill
@cedarcanoe
@cedarcanoe 7 лет назад
As soon as money is involved, people will start to show you worst properties. Thanks for reminding us to be careful when buying watches. Personally I try to buy from fellow members of a local forum or small fb-group. Thanks for the video.
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Hey Erik, unfortunately you're right. Buying on relationships rather than "advertisement" is the the way to go, but even friendships have been destroyed by friends involved in money matters. I've done repeat business with dealers who've given me a good & honest deal, but if I feel I've been burned. That's it--I never do business with them again. It takes time and experience. Recently, I got a great deal from an AD; so you never know who it's going to be. Hey, if you know any specific bad deals or dealers, let me know. Cheers, Bill
@weerobot
@weerobot 6 лет назад
Meet strange guys about a watch....Yeaa right AD for me...
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 6 лет назад
Hey wee robot! That's certainly a choice. I don't think I'd meet a guy in a hotel under those circumstances either... Cheers, Bill
@pennfootball71
@pennfootball71 7 лет назад
That Zenith can't come to the USA the Cohiba logo is part of the Cuban Trade embargo and is not their different international logo.
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Ok, Thanks Don. How about Canada?
@pennfootball71
@pennfootball71 7 лет назад
Not sure Canada is a small watch market. I don't know.
@michaelrankins581
@michaelrankins581 7 лет назад
It can't come to Canada either because you aren't allowed to cross promotion with smoking items
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Michael, that is a very interesting point! Thanks. Bill
@thehealer74
@thehealer74 7 лет назад
Hello professor 👨‍🏫, just love ❤️ the art work👌🏻
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Jaber!! It's all inspired by your examples! It's a lot more fun and interesting than just the watches. You are my Watch - Art mentor! Kindest regards, Bill
@thehealer74
@thehealer74 7 лет назад
I am really humbled by your kind words. Let me tell you, I watched your video on a 85" tv and could not find a blemish 👌🏻 harmony at its best🙏🏻✨
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
What I'm working on for tomorrow's (Sunday) collection review is a series of Jaber-inspired category headers (e.g. Divers, Chronographs, etc.) It's a lot of fun for me as well! Everyone at the NYC FPJ Boutique love your images with the FP Journe watches. Looking at me on an 85" inch screen must have terrified your cat! Cheers, Bill
@thehealer74
@thehealer74 7 лет назад
WatchArtSci As usual you looked SUPER CHIC😎
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
C'est moi!
@douglaswilliams774
@douglaswilliams774 5 лет назад
The Chinese are getting too good. Noob , AR, etc are “ super clones” . They cost from £400 - 800. They can seriously fool the untrained. I just wonder.....they are this good now.....what will they be like in 5 years time ?
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 5 лет назад
Hey Doug, the super clones are so good an AD may have trouble, and there may be some in the mix that no one realizes are there. Yikes...Bill
@amintaslneto
@amintaslneto 7 лет назад
Great discussion topic Bill. I keep believing that you need to buy the seller first and then the watch. You should do more videos like this with other types of scam other viewers may share. It's may be a very useful service for all. Cheers
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Hi Amintas, yeah, I'd like that -- I think the purpose of this channel isn't to listen to me pontificate, but rather to get as many collectors as possible talking about things that are important to us all. I have yet to have had a deal that was concluded overseas. I'd rather dump a deal (even a great one) than to toss money into a hole in the ground. So, let's hear of any you might have for optimizing not getting burned. Kindest regards, Bill
@5RustyBin
@5RustyBin 7 лет назад
most helpful vide Bill. Looking forward to the state of the collection update Bill. I'm down to 12 now. Getting there :) Target 10.... I really want an el primero but the price is prohibitive for me tbh. Contemplating a different brand with an el primero in it - but tbh I really like the slighty overlapping subdials that the zenith movement causes - and if I'm honest I will hold out for an actual Zenith.
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Hi Rusty, interesting point you make: get the movement and not the brand. It's better to get the movement first and then worry about the brand later. Both my Harry Winston and Vacheron Constantin Overseas have Girard-Perregaux based movements. VC worked over the GP to the extent that it fixed some teething problems GP was having with it, and in the Harry Winston, the GP 3106 operates the bi-retrograde module that Jean-Marc Wiederrecht created for the watch. In the case of Zenith, though, I think you're right in getting an actual Zenith.Take care, Bill
@paulbrady8107
@paulbrady8107 7 лет назад
I now have squeaky underpants after this episode sir.can be very risky especially if like me and not to smart computer wise.i think if these scammed and conman put their craftyness and street smarts to use in a legal enterprise they would probably be a success instead of putting it to nefarious scams .looking forward to Sunday. 👍
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Hey Squeaky Pants! The reason that we're such good targets is that we love watches so much. Doesn't take much of a evil genius to get us--just add some slimeball and stir. I have computer smarts out the Ying Yang, and I'm as likely to get burned as anyone else. Take care, Bill.
@jpdavis6042
@jpdavis6042 7 лет назад
One problem perhaps in the higher end watch world, is that affluent buyer's in the 15k plus range as an arbitrary figure, have no street sense. On the domestic end, as to transactions, some jurisdictions could be reluctant to prosecute and may view the transaction as a civil matter. There's a country song with the lyric "you don't go writing bad checks down in Mississippi" ....great vid, Bill
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Hi JP, I think you can find suckers at all levels. The $15k + watch appeals to a person who who's probably a business person or professional. Some are pretty crafty wheeler dealers themselves. I don't think there's much of an appeal if you get burned buying overseas. Never wire money unless you're holding the watch you want to buy--overseas or not. Most countries, including the US, are way behind the curve on doing anything about Internet crime. We're in the Wild West!! Keep your head down and your powder dry! Cheers, Bill
@jpdavis6042
@jpdavis6042 7 лет назад
Interesting point as to affluent crafty business people in their own sphere, but get out of their element in an expensive hobby.
@dallaswoods9537
@dallaswoods9537 7 лет назад
Great topic Bill. Fake watches are going to be a problem for the used market. Buyers are going to demand evidence and a written statement that the watches are authentic and what the seller says they are. As they should anyway if they are reputable. Of course this only works in the US because of our legal system. Anything overseas all bets are off. Facebook is littered with ads for Rolex watches at 90% off, or $150. Well a little bit of math skills should tell anyone this is BS. 90% off a new $8000 Rolex Sub would mean they should at least want $800. Not that anyone in their right mind would think you could get it for $800. Maybe some people do, or maybe they do not care and want a fake. I have never bought a watch off eBay. I may for something inexpensive, but I don't have the nerve to put real money out. My collection is small. My Rolex and Tudor were both from the AD. I may have paid more, but if they are not authentic then the AD will have a serious problem, that will cost far more than my watches. These fakes are becoming very good, gotta be careful.
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Hi Dallas. One of the reasons that I hesitate to buy a Rolex is because of all of the fakes out there, and I'm not a Rolex smart guy. It is one of the most discussed watches on the Internet, and yet all of those discussion do as much to help the forgers as the buyers (or potential buyers.) I'd probably pick a place like Jomashop if I got one hoping they'd have adequately checked for authenticity. Anyway, we have a topic that will not soon exhaust itself. Cheers, Bill
@dallaswoods9537
@dallaswoods9537 7 лет назад
Very true Bill. There is a real risk in buying one blind. It is probably the most faked watch in the world.
@IAT1964
@IAT1964 7 лет назад
Dallas Woods The only watch I would buy on ebay is a vostok......
@davidobrien9362
@davidobrien9362 2 года назад
What a shame you didnt name the people,company,story is true right?,name them so to make others aware.
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 2 года назад
David, that's your job! Try naming a name before a legal conviction and see what happens. Take care, Bill
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Mr Bass had a comment to the effect, "You're just fronting for AX." I don't know who AX is; so help me out here Mr. Bass, and tell me what you meant. By the way, no need to post in all caps. Kindest regards, Bill (Somehow the original comment and my response were deleted. Sorry about that.)
@RockandrollNegro
@RockandrollNegro 6 лет назад
AX= Ali Express. IE, the haven for Chinese counterfeits
@5RustyBin
@5RustyBin 7 лет назад
My rulesnever part with your watch till you have cleared funds in your account.buy the seller and his / her reputation - normally a zero feedback or poor feedback is for a reason (although yes everyone has to start somewhere).some will disagree with this as they aren't really vital, but personally I will never buy a watch without box and papers and preferably a purchase receipt.Watches are pricey objects and where there's profit there are scam artists. Go in with a very healthy level of cynicism and you should be fine.ebay gets a lot of haters but their buyer protection is very very good - I got scammed once and had all my money back within a week - with no hassle at all.never send without proof of delivery or tracking if you are a seller.never pay with western union.
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Thanks for those insights, man. I don't have much experience in selling watches since I've only "sold" mine in a single trade-in. So getting advice from an experienced trader is most helpful. I like the system that Chrono24 has where all money and watch exchanges are through Chrono24. They take the money and watch transaction and control it until finalized. There's a 3% charge, but split between buyer and seller, it's only 1.5% each -- shouldn't be a deal-breaker, but some buyers/seller are dumb enough to think that extra charge should be one-sided. Let me add one more thing: If the seller's / buyer's "socks squeak" -- step away from the deal; no matter how much you want to buy/sell the watch. If you get an intuitive doubt that something's wrong, trust your instincts. Kindest regards, Bill
@muratargentium1256
@muratargentium1256 7 лет назад
What's with the selective color? Are you trying to show us your cravatte? ;)
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Hi Murat, I just fool around with different colors, but you're are right; pretty cool tie. Cheers, Bill
@martyzielinski2469
@martyzielinski2469 6 лет назад
Eighteen minutes to say what can be stated in two minutes. God, how I hate that!
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 6 лет назад
Hey Marty, sorry about that. There are so many different frauds that my brain broke for a while... take care, Bill
@Order-in-Chaos
@Order-in-Chaos 6 лет назад
Sorry but that was a loooooooong rant. You could've squeezed that down to 6 minutes easily. I had to check this video but it was a bad check ;)
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 6 лет назад
Sorry about that OC ... while I was making it, new scams and variations on scams keep going through my mind ... my bad. Kindest regards, Bill
@Order-in-Chaos
@Order-in-Chaos 6 лет назад
I'm just teasing you Bill no big deal lots of good info you got there. You're a good man. Cheers.
@Daveyboyz1978
@Daveyboyz1978 7 лет назад
Its dog eat dog out there... be careful caveat emptor
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Be a hungry dog Daveyboyz!
@kellyrobinson550
@kellyrobinson550 6 лет назад
Daveyboyz Buyer beware 😱
@peternicol3513
@peternicol3513 6 лет назад
Very informative, but you take too long to get to the point.
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 6 лет назад
Thanks P, and you're right ... over-thinking everything. Working on that. Cheers, Bill
@sniffy6999999
@sniffy6999999 6 лет назад
For gods sake stop waffling,get to the point please.........
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 6 лет назад
Ok, ok...waffle, waffle, Cheers, Bill
@peternicol3513
@peternicol3513 6 лет назад
I agree with you; all these "Watch Critics" waffle on and on and take too long to get to the point.
@kxish
@kxish 7 лет назад
painful to watch and listen. too much rambling.
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
Hey KCPIO, sorry about that. That topic sometimes gets me babbling there's so much corruption and bad behavior. My bad, and I'll try not to let it happen again. Kindest regards, Bill
@bigchiponmyshoulder7573
@bigchiponmyshoulder7573 7 лет назад
Not being malicious to Bill who appears to be a lovely chap. But, I agree with you entirely. Too much bumbling and rambling does make these vid's difficult to watch and stick with. A real shame because the topics are very interesting and educational. Bill - stick to the point. Keep them concise and to the point. Less is more (more or less!).
@watchartsci
@watchartsci 7 лет назад
I've been working on the rambling...my head keeps broadcasting, "Ohhhh this would be interesting...and what about this?" Check out focus in later videos. If it's not working still; just shoot me... cheers, Bill
@bigchiponmyshoulder7573
@bigchiponmyshoulder7573 7 лет назад
Practice makes perfect my friend. For someone who can respond positively to some constructive criticism it should come together nicely. ATB, BCOMS
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