From what I'm learning, The surface area of the bullet has a lot to do with it also. Measure the circumstances of 9mm and 10mm. Plus the length. Sure it weighs more, but the larger diameter needs and expends more energy as passes through the target. If it were flesh the 10mm tears and damages more than a 9mm. The weight of the bullet has some but not all to do with it. Most people get hung up on the bullet weight. The heavy 10mm only went though one or two boards more. But that is out of ten. 10% more. Not 10% more dead. Simple physics.
I like caliber also and maybe if ther was more availability of good loads other than underwood and double tap it would be my main caliber instead of 9mm. Otherwise I got a glock 17 and glock 22 with glock 31 barrel because as you know most .40 and most 357sig can be converted easily and cost ain't issue just availability of good loads
I like that you used a "real" 10mm load for this test. A lot of people compare these cartridges against the 10mm with the "standard" off the shelf loads such as Remington - watered down 10mm... The 10mm in 200grn is where it truly starts to shine. Hard to beat a 200-230grn 10mm hardcast load.
5.7 has metal slide wrapped with polymer. If you fire the elite ammo T6 (similar to the underwood ammo you used) it would probably have done a few more boards. It slices through level IIIa body armor like butter.
I am a .357 SIG fan and I am not surprised it won, but I think the 9mm part of the test had a couple of X factors that the other rounds didn't have. For one thing, I think you should have used standard pressure 9mm. Also doing 9mm +P would be ok as long as the standard pressure 9mm was represented. For another thing, most guns you used were the full-sized Glocks, but you used a Glock 19 for 9mm. A Glock 17 would have been more fair. Thanks for the test. Enjoyed the Count's cameo appearance.
I remember seeing a test like this on magnums. They couldn't get over the 357 mag 158 and how many boards it went through. The 460 mag was truly impressive. Awesome test brother man.
@@SINESTERSERPENTSIXXX There is a video of this underwood ammo with an average on velocity of 1550fps being 124gr projectile, and the highest bullet went at 1589fps, but, with the 124gr instead of 115gr should help in penetration.
Right. See my comment above - "I like the .357 Sig round, too. However, my Glock G31 .357 Sig Gen 4 was a nightmare. Way too snappy and nasty, and hard to keep on target, so I sold it. My full-size Sig Sauer P320 .357 Sig is a much better gun for this round."
This was a very informative test and I liked the fact that you didn't make it into a 45-minute video! Short and sweet. I love the .357Sig for several reasons: 1. It is FAST and has a flat trajectory compared to many other rounds. 2. The combination of power and blast is an advantage in a gunfight. People don't just fall down like the movies unless you get a headshot. Since most fights are at 21 feet or less, there is a psychological effect of the muzzle blast in deterring your attacker. 3. I've had 0 misfeeds in my Sig P226. The bottle shape always feeds well. My EDC is between my Sig P226 and my Kimber combat. I'm 6'5" and 210 and in the 4 cases where I've needed to draw a weapon, I faced multiple attackers. In every case, the fight ended before it started because I carry a full-size pistol. I do not carry a pocket pistol for the very reason that I don't wish to actually shoot anyone, but if I'm faced with having to do so, I need enough power to end the fight against several men at one time. We get caught up in ballistics and such, but I submit that we need to consider the dynamics of a gunfight and the threats we actually face. Can a 9mm +P do the job, yes, can I carry a few more rounds of it? yes. Can I fire a .357Sig or my .45 and have most people running away screaming like little girls, yes. Can I put down most adversaries with 1 shot with these calibers, yes.
To each their own. I found the muzzle blast from the only .357 SIG I've handled (a P229 Pro) to be more than I prefer. I'm sure there is some psychological deterrent effect in some individuals, but it's not something I personally feel comfortable banking on. I went with 9x19 in my own carry gun (Walther PPQ M2) as I saw sufficient evidence that a properly-engineered JHP in 9mm can do anything I would need to ask of it for defensive use while also allowing for a higher capacity (options are a nice thing to have) along with less recoil and muzzle blast so I can be more confident in my shot placement in follow-up shots. The lack of expense is great too -- it allows me to practice more and develop the mechanical skills that are of arguably greater benefit than caliber alone (within reason). All that said, I am an advocate of people carrying whatever they're comfortable with. 9x19mm fit my criteria, but I can still acknowledge that other cartridges absolutely have their own advantages that everyone has to analyze for themselves.
Hard to say if you aren’t just a really good gunfighter, if it really went down that way. I mean, there’s like NO data concerning the psychological implications of your weapon’s features, but the old addage that “grandpappy didn’t have his old shotgun loaded for the reason that the mere sound of his bolt opening and closing would send an attacker running for the hills” is extremely hard to believe, even by anecdotal standards, so why would a big ol’ muzzle flash and bang be any different?
Great job , it's refreshing someone did a real-world test and did not use the weaker of the 357 Sig ammo.Thats the same first 2 rounds I carry daily in my Glock 33😁
Excellent no BS video and really informative. Love how your info was straight to the point and quick to the results without endless boring commentary. Kind of surprised at the 10mm penetration results, I thought for sure it would penetrate deeper than that but still, great demo. Subscribed.
Thanks for getting a .357 Sig! Underwood Ammo has a 65 grain Xtreme Defender in 357 Sig. I shot it through my 16" carbine and clocked it around 2650 feet per second.
Although expensive, 357 sig is my favorite! I stocked up as much as possible (with FMJ and HP) during the beginning of the "panic buy" period of 2020-2021
Man, you are a prize in a sea of You Tube crap. Clear, well set up testing, intelligent - and testing the things we care about. Thank you times 10, my friend.
That is my EDC caliber. 357 Sig with screaming Underwood 115gr and 125gr Noslers are my first choice. They are super hot fast rounds, but compared to FMJ or the Bonded Speers, the Nosler is likely to protect you in a fire fight with a violent criminal, while doing away with dreaded over penetration. Loved the video....357 SIG AND UNDERWOOD AMMO ARE ROCKING ON!
Nice video... Something most forget when it comes to the diameter of the bullet... Bigger diameter takes more to push through. In this case with a 10mm it makes a bigger hole and dumps more energy.
Nice work I'm glad you're using ammo loaded to to its full potential for the 10mm - Underwood makes a big difference. I put a 9x25 Dillon barrel in my g29 from lone wolf. Underwood loads a 90grn extreme penetrator rated @ 2000 fps. I would love for you to test this caliber in your g20 . I live in northern California and don't have the facilities available to me. ( don't pity me LMAO) I love the cartridge the barrels are about 125. I bet you would have a blast. Thanks
That Sig hits hard, I knew from the beginning that it would be the winner. For some reason the necked down 40 casing makes that 367 sing. I wonder how a 357 Sig compares to the 357 magnum revolver in the pine boards. I'm betting the revolver will only marginally beat it but again depends on the load. Underwood seems to make the most powerful rounds.
And that american eagle training ammo is the most underloaded out of all the 5.7 rounds! Yet it kept right up with the best of the best rounds/manufactures from the other calibers, truly an amazing cartridge.
Good one. I didn't think the 357sig would even be close to the 10mm. The holes in vs holes out through the boards is what I was looking at. I've been a fan of the 10mm since I was younger. I still carry the 10mm. Good deal. Thank you.
Just bought a Glock 40 MOS in 10mm and Underwood 180 grain bonded hp rounds and 140 grain extreme penetrators. Underwood makes so many different 10mm loads. It's awesome. Looking to buy a .357 Sig next. Great video!
Good video, Scott! Thanks! Practical set-up, clear speaking, and enjoyable friendliness. Keep up the good work, and best wishes to you and your family.
Proving again the great balance of power vs caliber with the .357. Also too, being reminded to think what's behind the target, especially if you miss). One bullet, one lawyer. Nice demonstration.
Just by swapping out the 357sig barrel for a .40S&W you can shot .40 S&W caliber in your glock. I like the idea of shooting 3 different calibers out if 1 pistol.
Not what I would have predicted. Expected the 10 mm and that FN 5.7 to blast through more boards. I am a 9 mil fan for several reasons like recoil and quicker on target follow ups. It seemed to hold its own in this type test. Appreciate your work and the pine boards test shows interesting results every time. Thanks for the share!
Pine is soft as hell so a jacketed round going through a series of spaced boards is basically just calmly slowing down through each board and smacking the last board as hard as a thrown rock.
one other thought, the issue with penetration on the 10mm is the frontal area. It might go faster and have more momentum, but its going to penetrate less because its a full 10mm, not smaller. Difference between a dive and a belly flop. I'll bet if you had a similar weight Extreme Defender or Extreme Penetrator, it would penetrate more than the FMJ 10mm due to the cross shaped meplat vs the "hammer face"
When you used the different weight projectiles for the 10MM, it got me thinking about another Underwood 10MM load that would be interesting to try. The Underwood 100gr extreme defender at 1825 fps. Man that is hauling butt. You probably stuck with fmj loads for the sake of the test, which makes sense. Love the videos.
I stand by .357 sig and I wish it was a more popular round as it deserves to be. I’m actually surprised the 5.7 didn’t do better it being such a fast and small round
The 357 sig in my opinion is the best over all pistol round. It has speed, flat trajectory, and is very accurate, I wonder why more shooters don't use it? Great video, keep up the good work.
Nice job. I especially like your re-usable pine-board test setup. In the end I'm still reminded of that old saying: any round that can produce an exit wound is too powerful.
Good vid! I was surprised by the 5.7x28 (went a couple boards farther than I thought it would) and the 10mm (thought it would make it through another 4-5 boards).
The .357 Sig is making a comeback as of 2022. It's expensive but it has "Iron-man" magic to it. I have a 2001 Sig Sauer P229 chambered in .40cal. The handgun has the capability to have its barrel exchanged with the .357 Sig barrel. The mags are interchangeable with the .40 cal. So if you own a Sig. P229, you essentially own two handguns, one a .40cal and the other, a .357 cal. Hickok45 was able to change the barrels between the two in less than 45 seconds. That means any of us can do the same within at least 5 minutes. I'm lucky enough to own a P229 Sig Sauer built-in 2001. At that time, they knew about the conversion capability to change the barrel to a .357. That's why they built the upper with very strong stainless steel. I recently purchased a .357 barrel replacement. I can't wait until it arrives from Sig Sauer in the mail so that I can make the barrel change and take my licensed handgun to an approved outside range license by the State of Texas. I love using licensed handguns at licensed locations that are governed by State and Federal Law. How's that for covering my butt for a licensed observation?
I still take the 5-7 out of these rounds Everytime. More ammo per mag, easy to control recoil, exerts energy into a target quickly and is (in my experience) more accurate than the others in this comparison.
James Alvarez it's hard to have a good representation on the 5.7 due to the main fmj is actually a tmj and is highly underpowered for a 5.7 load. The problem is finding a fmj that shows the full potential of the round
@@bdawg5415 , I never looked at it that way but, well said. This is why I love channels like this that are unbiased towards any one particular round and are completely honest when doing videos like this one.
This is a bad representation of the 5.7 rd. The picture shows the version of the round that is designed to not over penetrate, and there are rounds that will penetrate ballistic helmets, but the one he actually used is the cheapest and weakest of them all. It's range ammo. Not for carry.
I would say doing only one board less then the best with what others in this thread are calling range ammo is pretty impressive in my book. Then again I have for a while had an interest in the round just can't justify spending the money to by a gun made for it (1.4k for the hand gun or 1.5k for the rifle)
I am the rare liberal gunner and I've had to kind of teach myself everything about guns and my second amendment rights as I didn't have a strong family tradition of gun ownership, hunting, etc. I have to say that your videos are fantastic. There's not a lot of B.S. in there, just straight facts. Also the way you described .357 Sig really helped me understand that cartridge way better than anything I've heard before. Thank you so much for producing all this great content. I hope you're getting adequately compensated for all your hard work!
I love the 10mm I just fired my buddies S&W 1076 . 8 out of 10 rounds at 50yrds. On a 6 inch plate😀😎 Sweet pistol. Hey if you still have that dumpster, some 5.7 maybe. Good stuff my all American friend.
+Andrew Caron What does the VSS have to do with any of those rounds lol? The VSS is 9x39, 9x21 Gyruza is a Russian specialty round that's armor piercing, but 9x21 IMI which is what most people mean by 9x21 is the exact same dimensions and practically the exact same in every way and it's a little closer to 9x19 +P or at least it has that potential. And .38 Super, it's pretty much when loaded properly already at 9x19 +P levels so it's going to perform the same.
+WRXXXual I expect 9x25 Dillon in a 90gr loading would make it to about 14 or 15 depending on the barrel length. With a 6 inch a 90gr is rated at 2,000 fps, from a Glock 29 I've seen it chronographed around 1,600+ fps, and in a Glock 20 with a stock barrel around 1,800 fps. Going with a heavier 125gr, in a Glock 29 it performs close to .357 Sig in the G31 and in a G20 with a stock barrel it's going nearly 1,700 fps. So, at it's worst it'll likely perform the same as the .357 Sig, at best it will push through a few more boards, and on average it might do 11 boards.
My uncle, who passed away now. Did 30 years in the infantry, compared to my 12 years. Used both the M1911 and the M9. I'll never forget his opinion on the two. "You shoot a man with a 9mm he might get back up, shoot him with a .45 and he won't."
Thank you for doing a test like this with FMJs and similar barrel lengths. I watch countless people do these tests with hollow points in one caliber then FMJs in another caliber and two inch barrels vs five inch barrels.
Yep 👍.357 Sig All Day! And you shot it out of a shorter 4” barrel with the best results! Underwood 125 Gr Speer Gold Dot Hollow Points the Only rounds you will ever need! Yeah but the .357 Sig is too expensive. Maybe you are just cheap right? How much is your life worth? .357 SIG “Priceless”
Very interesting. I ‘Wood’ point out (former cabinet maker) that the density varies widely within the same board even if they’re all ripped from the same plank. You’d need to repeat this experiment numerous times to come up with ‘average’ penetration for each caliber. Not complaining however. Thanks
Makes sense that the smaller diameter yet faster .357Sig went deeper than the 10mm. However where 10mm dominates for maybe a bear or hog skull, is in energy DUUUMP. There’s more mass and weight behind 180 or even 200gr 10mm. It tends to smash or crush better with its wound channel because it’s a “bigger hammer.” It would have been awesome to see a 200gr HARDCAST LEAD bullet do it’s magic through those boards.
I have 357 sig. S&W used $400 I bought before the pandemic. on the Handel was a small bold spot. I fixed it with a sharp age of nife :) The front sight has broken in half moon :) I fixed it with little paint. I love it.❤❤❤
Well done! Very informative and well produced video. No meaningless, time sucking fluff, just good content provided at a quick pace. Keep up the good work. I'm now a subscriber.
9mm wins with most forces etc due to 'enough' stopping power & less 'pass thru penetration' / collateral damage. Thanks for a great presentation mister 😎
And that american eagle training ammo is the most underloaded out of all the 5.7 rounds! Yet it kept right up with the best of the best rounds/manufactures from the other calibers, truly an amazing cartridge. Should see what a 5.7 can do at 1500 fps, 1900 fps, and 2000+ fps. It's literally a pocket rifle.
It's a PDW cartridge designed to defeat NIJ III body armor. The 5.7mm AP rounds can actually punch through NIJ IV if you get close enough, which is more than most intermediate cartridge AP can claim.
@@NickFrom1228 Paul Harrell did a true comparison video a few weeks ago. Well worth a watch. The 5.7 with actual quality ammo did well! Though he kept the hot stuff out of the iiiA body armor pen test. Which I'm glad because it would of went through. (keeps the politicians from justifying the ban of it)
*Note:* Repost for general readers: Here is the rub. Most, if not all of these pistol/revolver bullet test *are not important.* The reason is *ALL handgun bullets are weak.* Weak in stopping power & weak is killing power. So don't put too much time & effort in thinking - "Oh, I should carry this or that caliber." Put your time & effort in going to the range, gun school, getting drills done, etc. so you can hit your target in the deadly triangle. If you want stopping power & a real effective weapon get a shotgun or rifle. If you want or need a handgun to be powerful pick any mainline caliber from .380 to 45ACP & shoot accurately in the right spots. Just saying the truth of the matter with all due respect to Kentucky Ballistics.
At the end of the day it comes down to bullet fps and shot placement. Which is why I dont bother with .45 or .40, I daily carry 5.7x28 and I love the .357 sig. In my humble opinion, the ladder of the rounds I mentioned truly bridges the gap between a rifle and pistol with the performance to prove it. But no matter what you shoot, it doen't matter how good of a bullet/gun you have if you cannot hit the target multiple times while enduring physical and mental stress.
*Geronimo Vita* I agree. On that huge gap between handgun stopping/killing power vs the rifle's/shotgun's. There is no bridge big enough or long enough to make any difference. Hence, these tests are amusing *but pointless in truth.* A handgun in the home, on the street, or in war can not come close to the pure performance/effectiveness of the rifle or shotgun. Many experts say, *"The purpose of a handgun is for fighting yourself to your long gun".* Stay frosty.
The same can be said about a rifle in .22 caliber traveling at high velocity compared to another rifle firing 20mm. The distance between the two is vast, yet both can achieve a similar result against a human target. It comes down to, what is its intended purpose and practicality .
We are getting off topic just a little. Putting it back together: - the point is common handgun bullets for CCW, Law Enforcement, military use, & home defense, *all of them are weak* in stopping power/killing power. - this means the ballistic test, the penetration test, any test on handgun bullets is a waste of time (i.e. they have already been factory tested). - so accuracy & shot placement are the *power* of the hand gun - hitting in the "deadly triangle". - real life shopping power comes from the rifle & the shotgun. These dominate a fight when used. - the gap between weak handgun bullets and powerful rifle/shotgun bullets is extremely wide. - do not trust in ANY common handgun bullet to stop or kill. Shoot handgun bullets in the right place and more than once if possible. The intended purpose of a handgun is self-defence a knife is way better in destructive capability & close quarter battle. The handgun's main advantage is not stopping power or killing power it is in *distance/reach.* I.e. distance = safety. Take care.
accuracy is huge yes but if your bullet can't get to the target then what good is the caliber. 357 sig shoots very flat and is extremely reliable feeding due to its bottle neck design it also has a host of other pro's. granted the ammo is a lil more expensive the "SOME" other rounds ..BUT...i feel my life is worth the extra expensive for the performance the 357 sig offers.
I can save you the time. The .357 Magnum with 158, 180, or 200 grain FMJ or hard cast slugs would easily win. This is because those weights have higher sectional density than any round tested here.
Agreed, however it would be the end all to see extreme penetrators in sig and the mag. I have no doubt the mag starts passing the sig after 125gr.. but by how much.
@@dude55ist even at 125 gr the Magnum is already past the SIG. For example, look at the Speer Gold Dot loads. The velocity for their 125 gr Mag load is 100 fps faster than the 125 gr SIG. In this test with similar sectional density, nonexpanding projectiles of similar profile, more velocity equals more energy equals more penetration.
It's very dependent on who's loading the round. Some cheaper sign ammo is around 1250-1350. I shoot prvi partisan stuff and it's listing 1550 which is pretty good
I don't understand the surprise I thought the .357 sig was designed and engineered with penetration in mind. The more boards it will go through means it is less effective as a handgun round unless you can see through walls to know what you are shooting at. You want rapid expansion and the round to dump the energy off fast to inflict maximum damage in a short distance. The bigger the slug diameter to begin with the better off. If you want to get in the real world with handguns talk hollow points and what distance they retain terminal velocity. .357 Sig full metal jacket when you need to kill the intruder hiding behind your neighbor's fridge!
From the future, 2023, watchin the calm version of Kentucky Dude.....amazin, sometimes, how gettin shot, or most any major trauma, can change your whole attitude on life. In his case he bounced back great. Thankfully.
Bought an M&P 40 Shield and found a company making extended and ported barrels in .357SIG for it. Converted it immediately. Don't regret it one bit....until I need to buy more ammo.
