I forget where I heard that. Think it might have been Dr. Jordan Peterson, explaining that the lack or low empathy helped them to be better surgeons. Easily able to do what many of us couldn't.
I recently had a big abdominal surgery and right after I got out of surgery, my surgeon noticed my wound stretching and opening, and he had no qualms with using 12 metal staples while I was wide awake, no anesthesia to close it. The nurses were even cringing while I yelled with each stab of the staple gun. Yeah, surgeons are sociopathic 💯
This is incredible. Only the second time that I’ve seen a THERAPIST talk about NPD with compassion. The stigma is so pervasive that even though I think I have NPD, I still look at other people with NPD through that stigmatized lense. Thanks to both of you for the awesome work!! This is SO necessary!
Therapists need to buck up imho. It’s possible to validate the experiences of abuse survivors without throwing people with NPD under the bus. No wonder they don’t want to come for therapy if we are hateful towards them. I am so sorry that there is so little compassion from therapists for people with NPD - that’s on us, not on ppl with NPD.
Crying with pride 😌❤. We need so much more sensible, pragmatic and less polarised discussion around narcissism. It’s the middle ground I’ve been aching to see online.
I agree about the comment of viewing everybody as a narcssist or not. I was in that state for a while. I have high functioning autism, and while no one has called me a narcissist, people have constantly gaslighted me throughout my life and made me out to be the problem. She is right that not everyone that abuses have to be a narcssist. I was confused for a while wondering if I only attracted narcissists into my life, but I think most of them are entitled neurotypicals who think that if you don't act like them they have a right to bully and act condescending towards you. Autistics can be perceived as rude or arrogant and selfish because we are blunt, honest and pretty self focused. You can not blame anyone for how you perceive something, their personality, cognition, or for how it made you feel. You blame someone for their actions and intentions. Every human being is responsible for there own perceptions, feelings and actions. Self reflection is what humanity as a whole have to do.
Ugh right? Everyone can be shitty and unaware of their behaviors. and I feel it's damaging to assume all assholes are narcissists cause then you don't know how to actually deal with the "Normal" toxic people
Nattie, thankyou so much for this comment. I have found out late in life I am autistic and I can absolutely relate 100% to every word you have said in that comment. I feel so compelled to want to talk with you now hahahaha but I shouldn't because I am a devout muslim man and I shouldn't be freely intermingling with females. This is nothing to do with misogyny or anything. I can converse with you out of necessity and compulsion if you want to know about islaam or you are seeking advice from me sincerely or me from you where boundaries are kept to. It is to do with us respecting each other and each others' natural dispositions as males and females and respecting moral boundaries, maintaining dignity and modesty and shame and not opening doors to the shaytaan to start his whispering to the hearts. Islaam is the most misunderstood religion in the world by those who are not muslims, and even by most who identify as muslims these days too, sadly.. Anyway, I am at risk of monologuing here now because islaam is my main and biggest special interest. I just wanted to say as a fellow autist, I really strongly resonate with your comment and want to say thankyou..
I'm BPD/ASPD there was SO MUCH GOOD STUFF here that I completely identified with! Love love love this lady Jacob and you were excellent here! So proud to be affiliated with your channel! ☺☺😎😎💖💖
I really love the fact you made this interview with someone who believes in compassion for healing and recovering from narcissism. I always believed narcissism requires alot of grief and compassion to recover from it. Nice to it this from a therapist.
@@drruthannharpur If I can find the words, I will - maybe in bits and pieces. I felt like you got behind the wall. You gave so much hope, too. My heart is still touched. 😭😭😭
Yes, Jacob! All these NPD channels are using a laundry list of emotionally abusive behaviors and calling it "Narcissism," even though those behaviors are not in the diagnostic literature for NPD.
People have to be willing to listen and open to learn though. When I first came here, I was baffled by the idea that a main marker of NPD is personal pain. Is there deep pain w/ the disorder? This is never discussed on those "I'm an endless victim of narc abuse" channels. Even though I'd been devastated by a 10 year relationship w/ someone likely on the NPD spectrum, I instinctively recoiled at being called a victim. Even the self aware narcissist channels like Mental Healness and Raw Motivations go too far w/ this, and maybe unknowingly fall into pandering to this camp. I can say this hear, but I did not like Dr. Ramani's style at all from the getgo. She comes off as bitter and unprofessional and I didn't get the hero worship of her. Now that I've been on Heal NPD and Dr. Ruth Ann's channels, I can see that Ramani has a pretty distorted and one sided view of narcissists and doesn't portray them much as people. She comes off as a bitter victim herself and it's unprofessional seeming to me.
@@saintejeannedarc9460I feel the same way about this channel. I think there is a lot of pandering and placating to people who have NPD & asks victims of abuse to have more empathy for people who have abused them than they will get from both the world or their abusers. It gaslights victims. Look at the “was this just hurtful or was it abusive?” - someone being chronically hurtful towards you is abuse, period. This encourages emotional thinking & encourages victims & survivors to question if “it’s really that bad? I should feel pity for this person.” No. Empaths, victims, and survivors also have maladaptive attachment styles and mental health issues. We have to take accountability for the fact we have allowed people like this to use & abuse us while making excuses for their abuse. Some of the channels you are saying are unprofessional and bitter actually gave me the strength to stop making excuses for my abusers & finally walk away for good. Some ppl with NPD can change. Others are highly abusive & won’t stop abusing you until you completely walk away. Some of us have been stalked, physically abused, emotion abused, used, & tossed to the side repeatedly by multiple ppl with this disorder. I’ve considered unaliving myself multiple times due to this type of abuse. The most empowering thing I ever did was to accept: 1) my abusers will not change. 2) they do not have to capacity to empathize or love me. 3) they objectify me & look at me as a utility in their lives. 4) they abuse me to make themselves feel better and 5) accepting that they live in a delusional world that I share with them based on faulty emotional thinking vs logic. That actually helped me as a survivor. This content feels gaslighty and encourages ppl to feel bad for the people who abuse them.
Covert vulnerable narcissists emotional abuse you by silent treatment, stonewalling and gaslighting. Let that sink in. Thanks for sharing. Keep working on yourself so things don’t get bad. My ex things are getting really bad. It’s super sad.
This was really enlightening! You really helped clarify how learning to be compassionate to the parts of yourself that are responsible for your modes is really important for making lasting changes, as well as how that can allow you to then integrate those behaviors into how to cope healthily in daily life. Thank you both for the video!
Thank you for your videos. My abusive ex had a lot of NPD symptoms (no formal diagnosis, so not sure if that's what he has)... I asked him so many times why he acted the way that he did, but he never had the self-awareness to answer me. Listening to you explain your thought process has felt like, maybe, I'm finally getting those questions answered. And that has brought me so much closure. Thank you
HAHA right?? It's also great cause like, who's gonna come here and say we're full of shit when we got a self aware narcissist and a therapist speaking truth? (Also if you want I can ask her if she'd like to do a vid with you, as I mentioned she's a fan)
This interview has been a ground breaking watch for me, along with so many of your videos. I was the scapegoat child and I’m used to getting inundated with fear reinforcing narratives about NPD which is really helpful in developing defensiveness, more fear, and self righteousness, but not so helpful in explaining the NPD lens and motivations. Many other sources written by narcissists generalize their comorbidities which further adds to the confusion. I think I can finally begin to understand in large part thanks to this channel, and nothing else has been so healing. I can’t thank you enough nameless.
Hey man I really appreciate your channel. This has been very enlightening and useful in understanding the psyche behind these coping mechanisms. I hope you continue bringing awareness and you learn to practice self love. Thank you again.
As someone who is pretty screwed up by my father who was not what most people feel abusive and then married one Narcissistic Abuse has a very specific flavor and is the only thing that I struggled with and has almost killed me. It's because we stay locked in far past when when a healthy person would leave. The empathy is our defense so we can understand and predict you. It's stressful and comes at a cost. We stay in till we break. We aren't healthy either.
This video with BOTH of you was so informative. I am married to a covert narcissist for 30 years and I only found information about Covert narcissim about 7 years ago. Receiving information was so helpful for me. This video was so accurate.
Can't thank you both enough for this video. I found it highly informative and insightful. Especially as I'm currently deeply concerned about my behavioural treats in my current and past relationships and the work I'm willing to put in to improve them. There are things that i need to get to the bottom of and this video has inspired and given me confidence to do so. Again thank you both.
Great video. I've been personally interested in schema therapy for my BPD. Also dig the Plato allegory and it reminds me of a Hozier song where he refers to it, and now that I read the lyrics again the whole song kind of reminds me of narcissism and the inability to really connect.
@@Thenamelessnarcissist nice. I still love him haha. My fav is prob "It Will Come Back" particularly this version ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-GgWOJIC6Kp8.html
I'm a B clusterfuck (they all sound relatable to me, oops) with a boyfriend of 5 years and our coping mechanisms are at war with each other, in increasingly hurtful ways. These are really useful videos, thank you and your guests for making them.
Iiiii absolutely love this lady and your dynamic. Really gave me a lot of stuff to think about, and I'll probably rewatch the entire thing at some point haha
It’s difficult expecting a narcissist to take responsibility, it is very difficult for them because it brings on a lot of shame. When they feel shame it is very deep and I truly believe it hurts and embarrasses them. It’s the very core of the narcissist that needs to be addressed ie shame and inner turmoil , before addressing taking responsibility and accountability. This is only my opinion but as a woman who was raised by narcs/BPD/ASD and having been in a long term relationship with 1 diagnosed NPD comorbid BPD I now have the clarity of thought and insight to know that a lot of the harm they caused me ( and to others) wasn’t intentional. It’s the only way to move on from a narcissist, you have to make peace with the past in a way. I went 5 years no contact and now I’m one of his confidants and we are NOT in a relationship. He is actually very ill with NPD/BPD. It is ruining his life. He has been regularly seeing a psychiatrist for fifteen years but it just simply is not working.
Does a narc 'step up's very often? I've been drowning in narcissists ALL my life and have never seen a HINT of change toward taking accountability and TELLING THE TRUTH in any one of these creeps.
I agree . I think this lady is playing into the narcisist's ego by excusing their behaviour. The best thing you can do with a narcisist is get as far away as possible. I've tried everything I could with my mother neglecting my own needs in order to help her 'cope' but she just took and took and I almost ended up loosing my life at which point I cut her off and I have been trying to overcome the countless traumas she caused ever since . In some cases there's just no solution
Thanks for this educating video, I didn't know the terms "hoovering" and "discard" etc are not clinical terms used to describe the behaviour of narcissists. I had NO IDEA what a narcissist is until very late in life, I just thought it is an adjective to describe somebody who is absurdly grandiose. I only started to see all the online content about "narcissistic abuse recovery" etc because of my life circumstances and things somebody close to me was persisting in which were incredibly painful for me. I did a lot of research and determined most of them are pathological liars and destroyed abuse victims (or at least claiming to be). Most of those claiming to be abuse victims actually all came across as very nasty abusers themselves because the way they seem to describe NPD is in such a way that anybody could potentially be patterned up as a narcissist very easily by anybody and plus to them the terms "narcissist" and "abuser" and the terms "narcissism" and "abuse" seems to be the same. I noticed they ALL encourage women to start accusing their husband of being a narcissist based on many very normal behaviours in most people and some of these people really stretch the boundaries too. It seems to me they are evil people who operate a weird divorce/remarry cult where they monetize causing divorce and then running the broken divorced women they manufactured through their disgusting dating apps and their "counsellors" they all work with closely. Many of them, I noticed, also follow a lot of weird pages that say they take payments for "divorce magic, love magic, adultery magic, marriage magic" etc. They are all using psycholinguistics to varying degrees to warp their listener's minds with the justification "It is okay to harm and abuse a narcissist because they are evil and they deserve it even you are the one harming them before they start really harming you; it is inevitable they will harm you and discard you, you should harm them and discard them first" (what Mona Alyedreessy told her followers via a live feed on her IG page themuslimnarcissist, among other evil things she manipulated her followers into doing and saying to their spouses... EVIL things)! They expertly pose to unsuspecting people as if they help victims of abuse but really it is a cover for manipulating women, breaking them down, encouraging them to draw reactive abuse from their spouses and justify it.. it's okay if you doubt what I am saying about her even after investigating her content. Then I can send you a screen recording of her teaching abuse techniques to her listeners proudly and justifying it all and encouraging self diagnosis of NPD and abuse of the spouse and stealing from the spouse by distorting islaam to justify it etc. and in that screen recording she refers to herself as a "supernova empath"; she has a post on her page describing the SHAYTAAN as a "supernova empath" and says it is a "special type of narcissist who has the ability to use their narcissist traits to abuse and punish other narcissists for what they do to their victims"... she is wild!! She causes lots of abuse in marriages and divorces an she peddles the women through a dating app she works with called "MuzChat" and through "therapists" she works with who also seem to have some weird divorce cult type agenda...
I was driven to serious suicidal thoughts because of somebody I loved more than anybody in my life turning on me, self diagnosing me (I am actually autistic) and screaming in my face "Narc" over and over again... she followed Mona Alyedreessy... she is the most evil woman I have ever witnessed in my life; the most evil person full stop! She indoctrinates and manipulates women and if you witnessed the levels of disgusting manipulation in her live feeds then you would both be truly sickened, I know you would after hearing this podcast talk.. thankyou both by the way!
@@religiohominilupus5259 It kicked off to an immediate great start and again it has formed my opinions even more on this entire NPD and abuse as a whole.
How is a narcissist not a bad person? When they hurt others in order to feel better about themselves, when they cheat and gaslight and manipulate, are they conscious that they are causing damage ? How is that not being a bad person? It's the definition of a bad person
i dont know why my heart is hurting listening to this. i know i feel seen. like somebody could care about helping me. maybe i should try schema therapy.
Because it's a mental and personality disorder. They don't know how to be in healthy relationships, because they aren't healthy themselves, so relationships often go very toxic. They don't mean to do this, and this can spiral into more shame. They avoid shame at all costs, so lather rinse repeat.
There is healthy narcissism, but if they deem into the DMS-5 “aka” as antisocial personality disorder that’s where the problems become a disaster. You may want to research that information. I researched covert vulnerable narcissists for 2 years prior to running into this.
I don't believe so. Schema is an integration of a persons different parts, inituion, like IFP Internal Parts Therapy but wayyyy better. As far as I know, Sam Vaknin implemented "Cold Therapy" as a way of retruamatize and then show the patient "survived" the harsh treatment. If that's true, I kind of had that unintended terrible experience in my couples counseling (not Dr. Ruth) LOL. Seriously, it set me back a while, but Dr. Ruth sounds amazing.
@@NoContext83 I am not at all a fan of the empath crap either and what Jacob doesn't say in the title is I also work with "narcissists" too and am very hopeful that people can change and grow - watch or don't watch the video (I really don't mind either way about that) but please do know that not every therapist thinks "narcissists" are beyond hope. My view is quite the opposite 🙏
@@drruthannharpur thankx. I watch all of jacobs videos. They are insightful...I don't trust Lee and Ben are truthful beyond facts...Jacob is who he is, it's always real. I don't think I'm fixable, but I've learned how to be aware of the shitty person who lives inside me and like to try to control everything. I have npd w bpd and psycopathy, I've also been married for 15yrs, and going strong, to an undiagnosed covert. I feel like our relationship is very loving and very symbiotic. We also have 4 children, none of whom shoe narc traits as of yet, three are teenagers.
If all narcissists aren’t abusive then how do you explain the fact that they are dismissive and avoidant with their partners feelings is emotional abuse. Emotional abuse is clearly defined whether or not the partner is doing this intentionally or not. Continuously rejecting, ignoring and showing no emotional empathy during and outside of sex is emotional abuse.
You are litteraly God. Maybe you condition is more advanced than the normal person Forget all this 3D reality stuff Where did life come from Answer Its always been here Wow I see you as the perfect candidate for mystery school Your right Everyone else is litteraly pathetic U need to level up If we are ment to speak again We will
