While not considered to be good right now, a foot autarch leading a unit of storm guardians with banshee mask to blunt melee with sticky is actually kinda interesting. A wayleaper with gem is 150, an autarch with a unit of sg is 170. That 20 point difference is real, but think about it. Seems like it might have value. Whether you use foot autarch as warlord is definitely a decision point.
"Banshees are great vs high armor T4 max units" as someone, who plays 90% of times vs death guard and custodes, I'm not sure, i those kind of targets actually exist
My sad story with the skorps. Had 10 body unit in infiltrate against the thousand sons. My first turn and they charge in the sorserers behind ruins. - Overwatch with this dude. - How? I... I charged from another side of a ruin, he didn't see them. - He has pistol flamer. - Ou... More them half of the squad is dead before doing anything. + My avatar of khaine just got doom-bolted, breaked legs and dev. wounded to oblivion my 1 character and 1 unit of 5 spacemarines.
@@ProxyHammer1 check🔥 rules and you should know that the situation described here is illegal no pistol flamers are allowed in charge phase 🔥😱 Help you subscribers to not be cheated👍
The list you proposed folds to BA. They have access to fight on death (strat) and fast melee (jump packs everywhere) and fight first (judiciar) so no way you're trading well unless the BA guy gives you the game. Add on to that you're super vulnerable to the mortals from assault intercessors on jump packs, precision from sanguinor, and their entire army wounds you on twos in melee, you can just expect to lose. The list you propose folds to DG. They have access to huge number of flamers, fight first, either -save or -WS which guts your damage output or always forces a 5++ and wounds on 2+, free grenades, and so on. The list you propose folds to Sisters. They have access to huge numbers of flamers, fight on death, faster jump melee troops, and characters that can stand back up on dying so you always trade down. The list you propose folds to breacher spam, they are faster, sit in transports until they can murder you. The list you propose folds to GK, strikes and purgations will absolute tear you a new one and you have no counter to NDKs. The list you propose folds to Crons, enjoy trying to kill the monoliths in hypercypt or losing entire squads to c'tan powers. The list you propose loses to skysplinter assault as it's just a better version of your list. 3/10 I replied. Free max assassinate too while we're here.
This response seems a bit... much 😅. It's an army based on disposable units, to score and tie up enemy units. Similar to druhkari. It's perfectly playable and probably pretty dang fun. Players lose to players far more than lists though. I watched Brad Chester go 4-1 at a GT with all the phoenix lords attached to their aspects and 2 wraith lords in 10th. That was basically the entire list 😂. Now of course he's an incredible player but my point is, it's not all about the list. Almost everything you stated is about what's on the datasheet rather than how you play on the table, which I understand. I used to play/build lists like that. I chalked up my wins to skill and losses to list inefficiency and played a million different armies to find the perfect Stat check haha. Then I started playing an AWEFUL faction instead, just to get better, and the game turned into a whole new animal. Now I'm actually winning and having more than I ever did. I don't know what I'm trying to say anymore😅 but I've typed too much to not hit send . Anyway, trying new and outside the box lists is what makes us better and I think something like this is a great starting point.
@@kaneda58911 I think it's fair enough to state that player skill plays an important role but when discussing list power you should assume that both sides have the same level of skill. Especially when the video is claiming that this list is going to destroy the pariah nexus meta. I agree that it's similar to Skysplinter, which is why I said that Skysplinter does it (much) better in my original post. The difference is that skysplinter has access to disposable transports for protection and movement tricks, and it has good AT from dark lances and haywire to crack opposing transports. Lilith by herself is probably a better melee threat than any of the options in the video's list. I would be extremely happy if an msu eldar melee list exists as a tier 1.5 option like how it was in 9th, with phoenix lords, scorpions, banshees and spears. It was a good time. But this ain't it, this is just bad.
My main melee bane is sword brethren with the Lord Marshal and a castellan. 12 of those guys in a land raider is pain to deal with. They get 5fnp on the guys 6fnp on the land raider and a shit ton of flamers to overwatch
One thing that jumped out to me that wasnt covered in the video is some of the other strengths other melee armies have. Its not just that death company mulch elves in melee, or that world eaters can move quick, its that most of those "hardcore" melee armies have their own anti melee tech. Fight on death stratagems are brutal, which both gladius, sons of sanguinius and world eaters have. Even space wolves have that present on their Wulfen. Another is that death company dont even have to get in melee with most eldar models: since their unit ability is reroll hits without specifying phase, and the most common loadout being 10 powerfist + inferno pistol, the inferno pistols along should be able to cripple one of the fights first units even before it has a chance to get in.
Good points but the thing is on the terrain layouts good positioning behind ruin walls means you will never be shot at by those pistols in the first few turns. Fight on death is tough but they can only use it once per phase and it only procs on a 4+. Wulfen can be an issue because they always get fights on death but even so they are more susceptible to shooting. In addition to melee the army I posted had falcons which mulch wulfen. 10 Powerfist inferno pistol is powerful but it’s a 280pt unit so the key there is to soften them up with fights first then when they inevitably destroy the banshees (Yvraine’s Troupe will body them pretty much so that’s not an issue.) then be ready to mop them up with shooting/grenades/Tank Shock.
While you did mention in your previous vids, that you like clickbaity titles it kinda skews the whole context for the video in my opinion. Aeldari units are competent at best in melee, but the melee focused armies will shit on this competent melee 10 out of 10 times. We are not looking at things in a vacuum, the elves do not win games in the fight phase, but in the movement phase, but I am sure you know this. You used the death company as an example for "good melee in BA" which is not at all their best melee beatstick - it is the sanguinary guard with dante, and I am sorry, but aeldari melee cannot compete on any footing with that unit. It is a pricy melee deathstar, but if you compare it against yvraine with the visarch with their clown court the sanguinary guard will demolish them every time. You won't get the drop on them, since they are deep strike, and aeldari have no 12" denial, and even with fights first from the visarch, they are -1 to hit and -1 to wound, and they can pop armour of contempt to save on 2+ from the clown clapback. And if you would like to make the argument that the 5 chances of devastating wounds from yvraine will make a huge difference, the sanguinary guard can tack on a priest for a sweet 5+++ like she provides for the clowns. It is good that you mentioned they charge-fights first interaction, a lot of folks have no idea how to correctly play it.
Correct positioning in combination with fights first is key to making this army work. I’m not at all advocating for a straight up slog either, Dante and his unit probably could take on Yvraine’s Quins but Dante with 10 Sanguinary Guard and a Apothecary (priest) Is 520pts… Yvraine, visarch, and Quins are much less and honestly can still do very good damage into them with both the visarch and yvraine. If I were playing into that I would simply have a unit of Quins in a Falcon with TM ready to pop out, Grenade, and tank shock what remained after combat. 520 points gone…poof! But ya 1v1 a 520 point unit should pretty much always defeat one that costs less. At the end of the day all the armor in the world won’t save them against mortals. Truth be told as well, I’ve never really considered Sanguinary guard to be that great due to their high cost and lack of invuls
@@ProxyHammer1 without the priest they still beat yvraine and clown court, and they are roughly the same points with the aeldari being slightly cheaper. 395 vs 430. We can make up scenarios where the setup is incomparably worse for the monkies, but the fact is, their melee and their winrate are both better than the aeldari. (only checking for the BA specific detachment with slightly above 50% on BA vs 46% :( ) Sanguinary Guard may look a bit glass cannon-y, but for the past few weeks I saw my buddy dominate everything that came to his way in two separate events. Granted, they usually died in two turns, but they always beat at least 1.5 times their price in points. I am not trying to say that they are the be-all-end all BA unit, but as a melee beatstick, they are extremely efficient with deep strike and the BA stratagems. Also the dense tournament and pariah nexus terrains help them big time. Don't get me wrong, I think Yvraine with the clowns is an excellent piece, and with the visarch and the free/1CP heroic intervention they are a nasty surprise into anything, but I still think the old man dante + guard combo is better, even if we discard the sheets and the abilities because they are a lot easier to use and require less setup.
@@CommanderDerpington Ya after researching the combo a bit more i have to agree in a straight up brawl they win hands down but tbh i think they would beat down pretty much any other meta melee unit in the game as well.
Hello, this question may be off-topic in the video, but I need help with understanding. The Autarch has an ability like "Superlative Strategist" which says: (Once per turn, you can target this model’s unit with a Stratagem even if you have already used that Stratagem on a different unit this phase.) But the latest rule change says: *срс: Parts of a rule that allow a player to use a Stratagem even if they have already targeted another unit with that Stratagem in the same phase can only be used if the name of the Stratagem is specified in that rule.* So this means that the Autarch’s ability simply doesn’t work? Thanks for the answer.
Shining spears although wide based are still our most powerful single turn unit breaker they can punch up with lance and pre shooting. With the lovely 14 inch move charges really aren't that hard to whip.
@@ProxyHammer1 yeah, I never take any suggestions at face value but I sure like listening to what everyone comes up with. Other Human brains are my favorite resource. Thank you for the constant content bro.
I don't think a list like this survives contact with Tyranids. Especially not with double Mawloc vanguard which is gaining popularity since the dataslate. Too many small units with low wound counts that quickly lose effectiveness to distributed mortal wounds. Invasion Fleet dakkafexes are also a serious threat, and they can wipe any individual infantry unit in this list in overwatch from 24" away.
hello proxy! Nice list but how was it in secondary schools without hawks without spiders without vyper something fast that can reach a quadrant or the rival zone in one movement. A unit of troops with the troope master coming out of a falcon killed an avatar in an assault, between tank shock bright lance grenades and pulse laser fusion pistol and dev wounds it was incredible. The queens unit with vizar and yvraine is incredible if you control the center with them and you can heroically intervene to any unit behind that is weak, it is amazing. You can also control an objective behind cover and leaving some queens on the objective, you kill a few of them, you remove them from behind the cover and then you resurrect them haha. For cost price, a unit of scorpions with karandras on a falcon is much more powerful than one of troopes with troope master counting grenades, guns, etc.? I understand that it is a thematic list but I believe that the strength of our army is based on having fearsome units in combat supported by units that can protect them from a distance by shooting.
Honestly I think this list can be fine tuned for competitive play for sure this was my first iteration and it’s a thematic list. I think you could definitely keep the melee elements while also bringing in hawks and spiders
Jain zar aint worth it. Tried her so many times. She failed vs orc boyz, greater daemons, terminators, rubric marines, plaguebearers and plaguemarines, vanguard vets, rhino, she failed vs everything. Killed nothing, died misserably.
Pick your targets more carefully, i have her and a unit Banshees rip right through Necron Warriors, marines...and Orc boyz. Still not as impressiv as what Lelith can do btw.
@@ProxyHammer1 They were in the way, so i choose the option to go through them and get the more juicy units behind them. Sadly those other units fell to other stuff in the next round leaving Jain Zarr to just sit there with the ladies. Probably talking about some lady stuff.
@@ProxyHammer1 when you soliture hits on 4+... And all these termies. Death guard is beatable, but saw painful. I like a shooty wraith knight in them, especially with tank shock change. Or court with cabalites. But a day, when my avatar and soliture ran into death guard was a day of pain(
@@ProxyHammer1 it says: "if a model has a rule etc." And the Archon has the rule only when he's the Warlord. When he isn't he has not the old rule and so there is no rule to change into the new one.
@@lorenzosgarallino Idk what to tell you that’s how it’s being run in competitive play 🫤 truthfully I agree that it’s broken but how I described it I’d how it’s being ruled officially for now
@@ProxyHammer1 not every locations run like that, only in those where people cannot read english ;p joking, np, I hope they issue a faq to clarify it :) cheers. nice video. I play Space Wolves but you seriously made me think in playing some melee eldar. The new striking skorpions minis are so good.
pure cope, theres no viable eldar melee builds that are competitive. you arent out-trading space wolves, custodes, orks etc. this channel is getting very bad with the nonesense
@@ProxyHammer1 i have and they are sorely lacking. can you describe to me a unit with a set of buffs/strats that can reliably kill 6 thunderwolf cavalry or 6 meganobs? 30 wraithblades with guide do 18 wounds to TWC = 9 failed saves = 4 dead. thats a 500 point units vs a 200 point unit that, by the way, you will never get the charge on.
@@TheLoneRanger-by2jp MEQ stands for Marine Equivalent. T4 2 wound bodies with a 3+Sv. Mega nobz and TWC are TEQ or Terminator Equivalents and I wasn't saying that any eldar melee unit by themselves can take down a max unit of either. However, Yvraine and the visarch with quins can probably (actually most definitely) kill most of TWC or Mega Nobz on charge once you factor in the shooting.
@@ProxyHammer1 i know what meq is i just dont care, those arent what we have problems dealing with. again, you are picking a unit that is quite a bit more expensive and my math says 10 harlequins do 6 unsaved wounds to any t4-8 4++ body. thats pathetic
I usually play VS Dark Angels, inner circle detachment (btw that detachment is OP) and my buddy managed to have ALL army, except 1 phobos and 1 repulsor, with 4+ inv... Also he has Lionel.... And i struggle to do anything 😢
@@ProxyHammer1 Dev Wounds are great, but they are not the Panacea for everything. Dark Angels get that 1/battle 4+ FNP against Mortal Wounds for a phase, which dev wounds now are. Dev Wounds will of course still help but they get a lot harder to apply because you have to space out putting Dev Wounds into each unit over several phases and the first Eldar unit to make them activate their FNP will whiff and generally get clapped in return. The Lion even just gives a straight up 4+ FNP against Mortal Wounds to anything in 6" and Azrael gives an additional activation on the 4+ FNP ability. Next to Custodes Dark Angels are probably the army that is most resistant to Dev Wounds.
