Allison 10L vs Ford 10R 

I think they finally accepted that they don't need to overbuild for more power given how all their diesels spend the majority of their lives in their underpowered detuned mode due to some emissions compliance BS being out of spec. Why build for 500 Hp and 700 Ft/Lbs of torque when you know damn well the things going live their lives self-detuned to less than half that.

They built it to be worked on. Ford built it to last the lifetime of the truck.. listen to the last sentence of the video. Said its going to be "another 68 we need to get readyfor that workload" chevy builds them to break.. when they break ppl just buy another chevy like the next ones going to be different.. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. -Albert Einstein

@@tpss3834 Too often corporate has no clue what the customer base wants. Years ago I worked as a service tech at a welding supply chain store and my whole department got shut down. Our national region had like 6 or 7 service points in it and they condensed it down to one, which pushed service and repair turnaround time from a few days on average to a few weeks. The actual explanation was that the execs thought that if they stopped servicing/made it really difficult with the older equipment, that would push the customers to buy new stuff whenever things broke down.

@tcmtech7515 justifying buying a new gmc/chevy/cadillac every few years doesnt help.. theres a reason ford is the #1 in sales. Not in profit. But in sales. Chevy actually made more in sales while selling almost 100,000 less trucks. Price gouged as well as needing repairs more often..

​@@tpss3834actually gm is number 1 in truck sales.

Even the old ford torque shift was better than the Allisons

​@Silent but Deadly ford definitely knows how to make a strong transmission, there's a reason you can buy a brand new siverado with a transmission made by Ford.

​@@Prestiged_peck Thats is not an accurate statement. The Hydra-Matic 10LXX transmission family was developed in collaboration with the Ford Motor Company and is produced at the GM Powertrain facility in Romulus, Michigan. Ford took lead on engineering the 10 speed rear drive transmission while GM lead the enginerring on the 9 speed transaxle trasmission Ford and GM collaborated on. Ford and GM collaborated on transmissions 10 years ago as well.

@Jeramy Bennett then explain why I've seen transmissions in siverados with the Ford logo stamped on the side of the casing??? Typically ford only puts their logo on things they manufacture or assemble, or on parts that go to their cars.

@@Prestiged_peck You've seen 10 speed Ford transmissions in Silverado's? That means Camaro's have them as well since they got the 10 speed before the Silverado and GM is lying about manufacturing their 10 speed transmission in Michigan?

Yes . Allison even says they don't build a 10 speed for pickup trucks, just the 6 speed, which is the Allison 1000.

@@MrStaybrownTrue. But GM still labels them Allison to trick customers into thinking they’re getting a bulletproof tranny. One of many reasons not to trust GM.

No, no, the GM literature says it's an "Allison Branded", not built, because it's a GM transmission taken through Allison certification for life cycle duty. Meanwhile, while this teardown is great, it doesn't cover the material science part of the internals. A gear might look "beefy," but it might not be as strong, depending on the makeup of the metals used.

@@mbukukanyau Would you trust GM to keep the standards of Allison or take their usual cheap short cuts to save money. I know what I’d bet on.

@reneeandchrisforever You know GM has a better quality record over the last 10 years than Toyota, according to JD Powers? Plus, I doubt Allison will just let their brand be trashed. I am not tribal, I own Ford, Chevrolet, and Toyota products. One has to use a product as designed and intended by the manufacturer.

WOW I have had duramex last 500k miles I haul in the oilfield all the time im on my 2nd LML right now 394k with no major issues, way more curvy roads and steep hill stop and go over here never had trans issues I did change the fuel system on my first LML at 260k with zero issues a2ter that sold it with 506k miles on the clock. the current truck(16)is not deleted stock front end components also but the 2013 was deleted at 110k miles did front end work anftter an accident in ice

@@jeremybroderick9465 they're talking about brand new trucks, older duramaxes, especially the pre-DEF models, were king of the hill by far.

Exactly the opposite in the NW. We run a fleet of transit vehicles that put 300+ miles a day on. 20 2010 G3500 with 6.6L Duramax and 24 E450 2018 6.8L gas and 15 2019 F450 6.7L Diesel. No joke not one major failure with GM and all but 3 of the Fords have had either transmission failure, headgasket failure, overheating issues, or injection pump failure. Even the brakes last twice as long in our chevys. Same exact maintenance program.

Where trucks are actually worked

Your very lucky the GMs don't hold up as well usually I'm a logger in western Montana and F series is the truck of choice period out here

Ford finally has a new CDF from that won't slip the bushing any more

Absolutely truth. 💯 Only Ford trucks for my company & myself. Transit 250 vans also!

It's clearly an inferior transmission now 😭

Yes, not nearly as robustly built as 10R in Fords F150/F250. I've also read Ford strengthened it's 10R further in '22+ trucks/vans. Nice. Have '24 F150 Tremor on order now.

I like Chevy /GMC ..but i buy Ford trucks. All they need is good basic maintenance. Never let me dwn.

Fords have just as many if not more problems. Ford still uses the CP4 fuel pump that has a 9% failure rate. Plus Ford transmissions have their own set of problems that aren't addressed here. I have a Duramax for towing but I'm a Toyota guy at heart. Just bought the duramax because it seemed like the best out of the big 3. Seems like the Ford and chevy have about the same rate of failure on trannys but chevy has a far superior fuel system and less Def/dpf problems. Ford has a better frame and axles but not enough to compensate for the fuel system. I had a 2015 f350 powerstroke that I sold at 235,000 miles and now have a 2020 duramax with 80,000 miles. Both trucks have treated me great.

My problems started at 38k…. Then it shit the bed

My duramax tows 14k pounds most of its life and its at 80k with no problems.

Either way the data shows Fords 10R is more robustly built. Not that Chevy/GMCs isnt good ..but i'm towing/hauling & using my expensive 4wd daily. Why would i buy anything other than an F150/F250?

​@@Davido50cp4

Yes, absolutely. There's good reason near 75% of large & small companies buy Ford trucks/Transit vans. I personally have owned 3-4 F150s/F250s. Always served me very well. Good basic maintenance all they required. 💯

Bell housing and crankshaft adapter and an aftermarket transmission controller will put that behind anything you want.

@@tcmtech7515 Awesome. Looks like I need to talk to my transmission builder. ;-)

​@Bwanar1 transmission controllers ain't available but if you can find a way to make a stock 6.7 ECU run a 7.3 properly, then have at it! I'd rather put it behind a 460 or a cummins myself.

@@Prestiged_peck They have been around for years now. Powertrain Control Solutions PCS is what I was using 20 years ago and they already had plug-and-play units for everything that was off the shelf plus their units could be customized to run special stuff as well. Odds are they have something that works with 10-speed units all ready to go.

@@tcmtech751520 years ago a 6 speed was space age

That's what I'm finding to, I found 3 people complain their trans went out after digging through different duramax forums, which the causes were a faulty part from manufacture from the get go which made theirs go out around 1k miles, but yet ford's 10r a bunch of different forum pages come up with tons of people complaining how theirs have gone out after 5k miles and up. But yes exactly what's the mileage on these 10 speed Allison's going out? We're they behind stock or modified duramax's, ect. My 21 duramax dually almost has 40k miles on it and almost half are from towing heavy and the trans has been flawless and haven't had a single hiccup out of it yet.

@@dustintilton7920 My experience also. It does not surprise me that there was no response to my questions. Facts and data are all we have vs some guy in a shop somewhere with an opinion.

i wonder if your seeing more complaints for the 10R because theres a lot more of them than the 10L on the road. the failure rate may be the same percentage wize.

Ford trucks tend to be more common in fleet duty, where the same truck will see 30 different drivers in 5 years, they get beat to snot and stressed about 5 miles beyond their limits and the guys running them ignore the problems and flashing maintenance lights until the problem actively stops them from doing their job, and then they complain that their engine shouldn't need regular oil changes to run when they just ran through 4 oil change intervals without touching the drain plug or the filter. If you want to break something, hire it out to a west Texas oilfield fleet, they'll break it 16 ways to Sunday and then drink a beer atop the remains at 5 o'clock on friday

They also collaborated on the HD version. Dude, look at the video and tell me those weren’t designed from the same basic design

I cant speak entirely from experience but my 10R80 has a 8 inch cooler on it. Probably 12 on the 140s. Not sure if the chevy's come with coolers stock as well

@anthonys3906 gm must have better cooling system. I asked why ford transmission runs hotter?

@@gmfan6029idk. What I see on my 10R80 on average is 145-175 in the winter and 198 absolute max in 100F summer. New England for environment. 2018 F150 5.0 3.31 in 2WD empty highway driving on an overdue ULV fluid swap. 198F is what I see most southern dudes running. 210-215 is when people say to start watching what you tow and how you’re driving it

Cooling thermostat built into valve body?

Either way they are entirely different transmissions. The Ford 10R appears beefier & more robustly built. I've owned Ford & Chevy trucks. Both served me well. If i was large or small company using my trucks.. or vans daily for business it would only be Ford vehicles. Data shows Ford trucks /vans purchased 3>1 vs other brands by companies/rental /fleet buyers etc.

Anodizing is insanely thin and only affects 10 to 25 microns deep into the metal. That's half the width of a human hair. If they were really worried about surface hardness, they could have simply chosen a different aluminum alloy or heat treatment process.

It's transmissions 2022 and older. The CDF drum was redesigned 2023 and no longer has any problems

@@100pyatt is this for both manufacturers?

Yes it's just a nameplate now, GM owned Allison from 1928 and made the big mistake of selling it off in 2007. They should have kept it and told Ford and Dodge to build your own. Allison is owned by the Carlyle Group so now they are just Allison branded transmissions.

That GM transmission identifies as an Allison !! 🤣🤣🤣🤣

What’s weird is Ford has had the most issues the past 4 years. Their Super Duty 10 speeds are having a lot of issues. Very strange…

I’d like to see you rebuild the automatic trans out of a late-model Focus or Fiesta. Bet I’ll be waiting a while. Oh, your a rail frother too? No shock there.

@@brandon18054 I grew up with the train tracks right behind my house ( ILLINOIS CENTRAL/ ILLINOIS CENTRAL GULF) and I didn't do trains rebuilds because I had a guy who guaranteed his work for 3 years

How much did that run you and was it under warranty?

I need to do the same thing

That’s such a loaded question. It’s all on how it’s used. A 16 year old kid with a bone stock super duty will smoke one before a 65 year old man does pulling his 13k pound camper to Florida. You can’t give an honest answer on that because the variables differ so vastly from case to case. Not to mention maintenance habits even being taken into consideration.

@@ChaseLandMgmt exactly it comes down to how it treated and how well its maintained.

anything is possible just depends on how deep your wallet is. Cheaper to just rebuild it heavier

Well, from the factory at least 1200 ft lbs!

The part of the transmission name which this video omits - the numbers after the "R" or "L" - indicate the capacity. At Ford the digits after the R multiplied by 10 is the maximum input to the transmission after the torque converter in newton-metres; a 10R140 rated for 1400 Nm (about 1000 lb-ft; Ford says 935 lb-ft in specs). At GM the numbers might not directly indicate torque capacity, but higher number mean higher capacity.

@@dundonrl Not even close. Try roughly the 1400 Nm suggested by the name. The earlier 6R140 has about the same torque capacity (as indicated by the "140"), and is rated by Ford at 935 lb-ft input.

@@brianb-p6586 So, the 2023 6.7 Power Stroke is only rated 1200 ft lbs of torque on paper? (it's rated by Ford for 500 hp and 1200 ft lbs/1627 nm torque). Either they are going to be eating A LOT of these 10R140's because the engine makes too much power, or it's rated to handle that power day in, day out for years!

​@@dundonrlthe 10R140 is rated for 1400 Lb-Ft ✅

I believe the F550 10spd is designated the 10R140.

My son is a service tech large rental co they ordered 5 new DMAX 5500. Ford's having to many issues.

A 2015 chevy would have a 6 speed Allison still I'm pretty sure, the 10 speeds didn't start coming in until '17+ with the lighter stuff, and at least for ford they didn't release the 10r140 until 2019.

@@Prestiged_peck Yeah...that's not what I was asking. I was asking Randy's Transmission. I wasn't looking for anything specific, just if they thought the Allison could last a few seasons under that kind of use.

Yes they certainly proved their "top dog" status with the 6.0, 6.4 and the 6.7 with the excellent CP4.2.

**diesel transmissions**

They give you a dog to keep you company waiting for tow truck

Lol fix or repair daily

Had a shift problem with my Ford, 28000 miles, dealer did Fords dance and it didn’t fix the problem, dealer kept pressing for a new transmission, Ford pretty much stop responding, left us hanging. Drove Fords for 35 years, but not any longer. They don’t want to stand behind their stuff.

He's referring to the 68RFE in the Ram's that have a lot of internet armchair mechanic assumptions.

The Explorer never moved passed the old 6spd until 2020 when they installed the 10spd. And Ford killed just about all of their FWD cars, so there was no need for the 9spd trans. Furthermore, the both GM and Ford have their own variants of the 10spd transmission.

@@hellkitty1014 The 8 speed was used for the Edge. My bad

No, it is not. Allison says, "Do not bring it to them. Instead, take it to a GM dealer."

It was designed by GM with oversight by Allison. Allison will not work on this 10 speed because it is not a Allison 1000.

@MrStaybrown The 10L1000 is an Allison designed transmission. GM struck a deal with Allison where GM will produce the 10L1000 for the 2500 trucks in house and Allison will produce the exact same transmission for the 4500/5500/6500 trucks in their facilities.

They worked together on the light duty 10 speeds.

They may have and Allison did not build it.

Ya it says GM made millions and Ford made thousands. Simple economics and says nothing about the quality.

The only true Allison's are the Allison 1000's. 5 and 6 speed.

@@MrStaybrown Yes you are correct I forgot about the 5 speed🤦🏿‍♂️

@@David-yy7lb the modern GM 10 speed only identifies as an Allison. 🤣

Myself as well. Also why owner of company i'm w/ won't consider *any* other trucks or vans unless they're Fords. Makes sense!