I think it's really interesting that people in the fandom romanticize the siblings relationship when the whole point is to do the exact opposite of that. The weird incest stuff is supposed to make you feel gross about it, and I think they did a really good job if doing that. This is a horror game! I appreciate your commentary on it because you don't skip right to the weird parts and you talk about the stuff leading up to that point and the story, which I think is better than most :)
I completely agree, I don’t necessarily think the incest is something that the player is “supposed” to support - the game is crafted to make you want to see good for them, but also loathe them at the same time.
In this universe, there are few objective truths, and many ambiguous and subjective ones. By no means am I a supporter of nor an advocate for incest. I do not condone it under any circumstances, however, some others may have the complete opposite opinion to me regarding this. And, although the belief that “the majority’s opinion is more righteous” would lead many to the conclusion that the minority(in this case, advocates of incest)’s opinion is meaningless and powerless, this quoted belief is, at the end of the day, another subjective opinion. In conclusion, even when the right answer might seem obvious, one must always have the maturity to understand that, when the topic is objectively subjective, regardless of their personal opinion, there is no right answer.
This game really points out how some horrific crimes are socially acceptable but others aren’t. They murder and eat people in this game, but the part people complain about is a dream of the siblings sleeping together… yeah it’s nauseating, but not any worse than cannibalism.
it's like people making warcrimes jokes in rimworld then learn that theres a mod that adds extreme sexual content and they act like it's satans fucking bible lmao
I think its because crimes can kinda be more justified, like yah if you’re starving and there’s a dead body you might eat it, if someone is trying to kill you then you kill instead. But incest isn’t really a crime that can be justified, its just gross and pointless.
My favourite part about burial is andrew evolving, becoming less andy cause, let's be real even if he says it, he's still got no backbone Also, in the club, there's money. Share it, and you get Ashley calling andrew Daddy Talking to andrew after not cleaning the basement gives some interesting dialogue Also, those paintings get re named. If you didn't read em my favourite one of those is soulmates I forgot some stuff which is trivia but here we go In the cultist club, you can hide in the closet You can also tie the mom up first and get a line about ashley calling andrew weak again And if you interact with mom 3 times you get the "beloved don't test me" And in the dream sequence, after putting green plushy next to pink, it screams if you pick up green first And if you put pink in between the purple and yellow plushies, the flowers wilt And there's inventory flavour text for some items Bang bang, useless, and oh yeah, this exists I said all the stuff most people miss I think this is it or what I've found after playing this game through 5 times
Thanks for the tips that I missed😵💫, I didn’t know there was that much that I missed. I wanna see what it all has to offer now, especially since episode 3 is coming out soon!
There’s also one when Andrew and Ashley are trying to get into their parents house through the window, before you find the piece of wood to climb on. If you try the window twice, Andrew will say he’ll boost her up, and Ashly responds with “oh yeah, you’re just looking for a reason to touch my ass”, to which Andrew responds “like I’d need a reason”. They then have some dialogue where he says he’ll slap her, she responds with “on the face or my ass” and she gets disappointed when he responds with “that’s for you to find out” and she assumed he meant the face.
Not gonna lie, I wanna play this game and experience the story first hand. I also know that these siblings are horrible - I factually know that -, but I can't help but feel nothing but pitty for their existence.
I don’t think I’ve heard anyone talk about how the story could work in another medium, but it’s a valid criticism for better gameplay. I think a Netflix series would do the story justice for sure
i love this this explanation is simple and perfect!! i would recommend this to people who blindly hate on the game but i feel like even if i just told them to watch the summary parts id be hit with the "not watching allat" anyway i love this game so thank u for doing it justice!! they are so toxic and fucked up and it is so fun to watch
I think it’s always worth giving something a try. The game is good, I honestly like it, even tho I’m not necessarily there for the “interesting” aspects, I still respect it as part of the story.
I love how the game shows one side of how child abuse does, in fact, screw up the kids! Maybe if Mom and Dad weren't awful people and actually showed some love to Ashley, at least 20% of this could have been avoided, if not more.
@@apricotAfterglow Thinking people who have been abused and traumatized by being forced to go through something no person should ever have to live through are "better" and "more interesting" is a creepy af mindset to help. Get help.
Finally a reasonable video on it. It’s either people romanticizing the singular bad ending you should be avoiding…or people extremely angry cuz it has this as a bad ending when there’s a million other extremely bad things in the game
This game was sold to me as “the incest game” People really overreacted and lasered in on that one aspect huh? The incest is both completely optional and probably the tamest thing in this game. Good vid btw.
I actually really loved this game, and you did by far the best job I've seen covering it. It's meant to make you hate the Graves siblings and yet also be like look how broken house holds creat broken and really fucked up people. Honestly, I think Andrew is far more insidious than Ashley due to him being far better at masking and actually trying to be calculated in his evil deeds. Verses Ashley is impusive and really just thinks about what in the moment will keep her brother rapped around her finger. Little does she know he would be by her side even closer (far closer, eww) if she just didn't be so manipulative and was just honest and straightforward with him. Tbh as someone who comes from to very vile parents and has a brother as fucked up as me (we both have aspd [hes not diagnosed but everyone knows he will be at his next pysc eval when hes turns 18] {i havs aspd with narcissistic traits officially diagnosed}) so yeah hes referenced this game before and I have played it so i for sure definitely relate a bit to the Graves siblings and i assume if hes played it as well but i never wanna bring it up with him cause ewwww. But all in all, it's definitely my favorite indie horror game. Also, i relate to the characters for their emotions and personalities, not their experiences. I would much rather run a ponzie sceme them be a murderus cannibal lol :3
Andrew seems to mirror his father a lot with how his father takes a backseat to his wife, who isn't the greatest person. Hopefully we see a chance to save Andrew- as his ghost wasn't depicted as fully black yet. Perhaps he can be redeemed later down the line.
@@elgranpapyrus2161 Yes but the way he acts and the position he's in is very similar to his father. It looks like the women have some factor to them that puts them in charge of every situation and neither Andrew nor his father ars very keen on actually standing up for themselves.
This comment is long as hell, just to preface, BUT... The fact that this game got purely boiled down to "hahur incest game, this game endorses incest" when the psychology is actually so much more interesting than that is just really sad, especially because it's a pretty damn good game. Honestly, even the chain reaction of people condemning the game for having incest would be so ironically funny, if it didn't genuinely hurt the creator. The creator clearly expected people to understand that this game is being told from a biased, first person perspective, where both of the main characters are BAD people. They murder, they eat people, they make fucked up jokes, and clearly were born in a bad home, and we, the viewers, players, and readers, were supposed to understand that most, if not all of their actions, are condemned by the game. We only see such happy, goofy, or sympathetic sides of them, because this is from their perspective, and some of it is obvious coping mechanisms in certain situations -- it's literally shown and said in the game in different manners, plus, it's not a leap in logic. Other times it's just them... Being them. Even serial killers IRL still took breaks from murdering and being sick, fucked up people to read books and laugh at TV, or bond with family members and loved ones. The horror should partly come from the fact that they ARE so human, they ARE just like us in certain ways. They are sad monsters, who have to be stopped no matter what, but the game wants to twist our arm a little and show us first who they were as children, and how they became what they became. We can reject the idea that we would kill, and we can reject those that do, and that WHOLE emotional reaction is likely part of what the creator was aiming for in the portrayal of this game, and even if it wasn't the EXACT reaction they were going for, they clearly struck something great in the end. We are undoubtedly going to form a connection, and wish the best for Andy and LeyLey in some way since this is from their POV, and yet we will also hope/know they'll get what's coming to them while we watch their childish, but still undeniably evil actions, and that dynamic in a horror game is incredibly fun to see! But all because of one route, it is henceforth just the incest game... Nowhere does this game say it supports any of the things therein, and it's apparently a known thing for the creator to have darker undertones to their h o r r o r games, so having siblings that act sus, and can be walked down a path to actual OBVIOUS incest, shouldn't be something that spurred people into such hysteria that they scared the creator into hiding. People are so used to tamer horror these days, that seeing something that should objectively disgust them, makes them think it's a cancellable offense. I KNOW incest should not be normalized as a thing outside of maybe the fringes of horror, but this game is definitely NOT trying to do that, I mean, just look at it: Andrew and Ashley are cannibalistic murderers who work with a demon. They killed their parents... I think it's been GREATLY hinted at that their ending is NOT going to be a happy one. If that's not enough to tell people that they shouldn't like these characters as PEOPLE because of their ACTIONS, and should, with common sense, not like incest as well because THESE fucked up people do it then dude I have lost hope. Don't even get me started on the difference between liking characters because of how well they're written, liking characters because they're hot/designed well, and liking characters as people, because the internet has supremely failed as a whole in understanding that concept, and it is just SO so sad. ((Also, I have to say, the fact that some people think this game romanticizes incest is just so... EUGH. Because the game has portrayed these people as nothing but fucked up, and the entire relationship between them as toxic, unhealthy, and immoral. They're probably gonna die in the end, or something else awful, there is NO way this is a romanticized relationship between them, it's going to end TERRIBLY, just as it's GOING terribly. Plus the idea initially makes Andrew uncomfortable as well when Ashley says "never say never"...)) I seriously enjoy this game as a psychological look into fucked up people in a fucked up situation in a world different from our own, and I'm STILL seriously looking forward to the third and final chapter! Hearing how the rest of the internet treated the game though makes me desperately wish the clock could be turned back so it never truly hit the public consciousness, and the creator themselves could still happily be working on the game to completion without the backlash and controversy. Sigh... This review was a breath of fresh air with how funny it was, understanding the people who were watching it, and the reason for its viewers being there. But especially relieving was the objective stance you took on the whole thing, while still keeping it pretty damn funny and informative. Great video man, keep it up!
For something I love this game and a channel who made videos on it. He’s going through a hard time right now but I love this vid and subbed to the channel. I see you going far in the future dude. (The channel that I mentioned before was beyond the arcade)
Great video! Some new analysis i havent heard before. And funny too! Reckon maybe slow down a bit at some points of the video for pacing purposes. But really good!
Bro i need you to make more video's like this, excluding the Type of imoral conten because i was CONVINCED I stumbled across a 100k RU-vidr and then see the video only has 47k viewsand you onlg have 1.53k subscribers (side note RU-vid crashed and i had to spend an hour finding your video again) i wish to see more videos and you gain many subscribers
This game is quite interesting to say the least. you did a great explanation on the game mate but I do wonder tho what will become of the siblings in the later chapters 😉🎇
This video was really good! I’d never heard of this game before, and tbh I’ll probably never play it because sibling stuff grosses me way the hell out. Some very fascinating ideas though.
i love this game and i'm not apologizing for it. but seriously, crying over a brief in cest scene that...didn't actually happen? is my generation really so soft to the point where they can't handle something like this, or are they just discovering internet 'corn' tags for the first time? i'd say both.
a lot of younger people are busy trying to appear like good, upstanding and moral people online so much so that they lose the ability to read blatant condemnation for a subject and instead call it "romanticizing." I'm a substitute teacher and one school used to assign a series of books to senior lit students to choose from, Flowers in the Attic was one of them up until two years ago because of that attitude. It's meant to horrify, but a lot of the kids just saw it as "normalizing" incest. edit: I should say that you can absolutely tell they're just repeating what they hear on social media, I'd cut them some slack, they'll grow to think for themselves with age. It's just a normal kid thing to copy what they hear. They're terrified of being seen as a bad person because now that comes with eternal internet damnation callout posts. When I was a kid and you did something stupid maybe ten people found out through the rumor mill, it's not like that anymore.
Honestly,it's refreshing hearing someone analyze this game's plot without going, "Incest? Cringe + kys!" Feels like people complain about horror being the same cookie-cutter slop, while at the same time discrediting anything that even considers bringing up real taboo subject matters.
I agree, because inc*st is a problem when it comes to this game, but when it comes to Game of Thrones, it's okay, it's art it's just a part of the story
It feels like a lot of people now just don't know what psychological horror is as a genre. It's gonna be wild when the Silent Hill 2 remake comes out and people find out what actually happens in that.
Fun fact. Ashley never calls Andrew "brother". The only exeption happens during the....... "Close bonding" route. Do with that information what you will.😑
Honestly, of all the videos examining Andy and Leyley yours is one of the better ones for not just going "eww incest lol" which is all most do it seems. You take the time to actually pay attention to the story which is a breath of fresh air.
I wanna watch this whole thing but I'm worried I'm gonna get hit with the "Ashley is the only toxic one and Andrew is the innocent victim" argument 😮💨
Just a random thing I noticed that I thought might be worth mentioning: The mom has yellow eyes, the dad and Ashley both have purpley-pink eyes... but Andrew has GREEN eyes. At first, I didn't think anything of it because the Nina girl's eyes were crossed out (so you can't see them) and everyone else that isn't Andrew or Ashley had yellow eyes... until you see the dad has the same color eyes as Ashley. I'm only mentioning this because the mom seems like the type of person to cheat on the dad but make him raise Andrew with her like he was his or to tell the dad (who couldn't even be bothered to get Andrew's name right) not to tell Andrew that he wasn't his dad ---- or some scenario like that. I'm saying all this to say that I wouldn't be surprised if it comes out in the future that Ashley and Andrew are "only half-siblings, you guys! So, see, it's not as gross as you thought!" or something like that.
She has green eyes, their just lime green. It’s less noticeable with Ashely but her eyes are lighter than her dad’s darker pink. Basically Andrew has a darker shade of green than his moms eyes and Ashely has a lighter shade of Pink than her fathers eyes.
The psychology of the siblings is so interesting in this game. But the entire internet overhated it for all the wrong reasons. The "incest" scene was a vision only and the siblings only really ever hugged each other.
Yeah, it kind of got portrayed as being a definitive route in the game, but it’s optional, and you don’t have to go down the incest route if you don’t want to. People didn’t really see it through. A lot of people I know are more interested in how toxic the siblings are, and enjoy seeing the codependence and drama.
i found out about the game when manly covered the first chapter when it was just out, and fell in love almost instantly waiting for the second chapter proved to be rewarding, and seeing the storm stirring up about the game was pretty hilarious, but for many its just the alabama game, while the writing for these characters, the general style, vibe, and everything, just the engaging experience they manage to craft in rpg maker is just chef's kiss, this game is much more than what the public overhates it for cant wait what the devs gonna cook up after parents soup, so far everything's been delish
the sister character is a tsundere girl whose obsessed with her brother and doesnt allow him to have relationships with other women and he very clearly reciprocates that obsession by reacting angrily whenever she jokes about having sex with other men, over half of their interactions are coded as flirtatious and the entire plot and core of the game hinges on their (heavily implied to be) incestuous obsession with each other. people are allowed to like the game but why pretend it doesnt romanticize/revolve around incest when it very obviously does lmao
@dieman4746 imo it all depends how you see it. Ashley was pretty much abandoned by her parents and they left her to Andrew to take care of. Ashley's classmates also isolated her and she had no friends. In my opinion they're both mentally ill and cannot tell that something is odd with their relationship. If you pay attention close enough you can tell that Andrew is the one who mainly acts "incestuous" meanwhile Ashley's letting him in fear of losing him. It's just my opinion tho.
The biggest tragedy in this story is how Andrew and Ashleys’ relationship is forever changed and doomed. Andrew would’ve likely been content to carry on being a brother first and foremost, his bond with Ashley had already extended beyond the normal for siblings due to his role of caregiver. But Ashley was conditioned to expect rejection, conditioned to believe that she was unlovable by everyone in her life that wasn’t Andrew and so the instant him being taken away was threatened she massively over reacted seeking to control him in whatever way possible to insure he couldn’t leave her. Their once wholesome relationship became an unsustainable cycle of emotional manipulation and abuse all because deep down inside Ashley is still the same little girl whose terrified of being alone without her brother. And it truly is unsustainable, decay and burial are the two extreme end points of the abuse levied against Andrew, either he finally has enough and retaliates, or he becomes so accustomed that Ashley’s tricks stop working on him, either way Ashley looses the control she’s desperately tried to keep over Andrew all these years.
very glad this popped up in my recs, amazing video. love the way you explained everything and embodied andrew and ashley - i'd heard the murmurings about this games and that one, er, bit you can do, but there is so much more to this game. awesome work my guy
i feel like horror/comedy is such a hard thing to write. if you arent careful the nature of humor can sometimes make it seem as though youre advocating for something you arent. especially in a story that gets as dark as this one does. idk what the creator behind this story is really like, so everything im about to say could be wrong (take with a grain of salt), but ive always felt that they use the humor portion of this story to great effect and is integral to the experience. the casual nature of the story and the dry humor seasoned with describing such horrible things makes the whole thing just so much more appalling. ive noticed that people hate this game and the developer for the incestuous themes of this story, but ive always found it odd that they never consider that the existence of that plot device doesnt seem to present as a positive. its MEANT to be disturbing, and the humourous, almost flirtatious aspect of the writing is MEANT to apall you. i could be wrong, but i really dont think this is a case of "the writer's barely disguised fetish." at the end of the day this IS a horror story. unfortunately though, the writer being a degenerate for the mere existence of incestuous themes within the story is a conclusion a lot of people jump to because it makes for great drama. its also kind of funny in a dark way that in a game where you watch broken people murder others, summon demons to sell souls, and cannibalize the bodies... its not any of those things that have people freaking out. oh no. its the weird incest stuff lol. obviously the creator must be into that, and by that same logic must also be a serial-murdering cultist cannibal. the discussion the characters have towards the end of... THAT route, seems to imply that the creator even anticipated the backlash lmao no, i dont think this story is promoting any of that just because those themes exist within it. they, and the humor alongside them, are present to carry the story beyond a line most other horror stories are too afraid to cross. true depravity is a terrifying thing, and i think the creator knows that.
@@KAPSENSI thanks man. ive had time to roll it around in my head ever since twitter had its big freakout lol. thanks for covering it in the way that you did. its nice to see the game get talked about in a way that isnt as persecutory
This game is one of the few modern entries in the Grimdark subgenre, which denotes that there is no hope to be found in either its narrative or in the characters' mindsets. With how more and more people are demanding that dark fiction be censored or "fixed" for the pleasure of people who don't like it in the first place, Nemlei's commitment to not only make this game in the first place but also see the fruits of her labor as a solo-dev be rewarded with over 1 million dollars in revenue just warms my heart. I view that the Graves siblings were incestuous from the start, long before the Questionable Burial Route's dream-sex scene. The way Ashley had browbeaten him into virtual isolation and his knowing deep down that Ashley may truly be the only one who can still accept him for who he is after the Nina incident, those feelings allow him to get far touchier with her than when he was with Julia, with his asking for Julia to tie her hair up (like Ashley always does) implying a degree of sexual attraction even back then. He only ever chose Ashley and couldn't force himself to care about anyone else to the point that he wasn't really bothered when Julia left thanks to his sister's harassment. That bothered him. His feelings of incest are purely sexual. Meanwhile, Ashley's emotional reliance on Andrew in turn has such a stranglehold on her inability to make meaningful connections with anyone else that her feelings are warped closer to the possessiveness of a mentally ill girlfriend than a sibling. She's had empathy issues from birth and can't get along with anyone who isn't Andrew, so she lashes out extra hard to make sure that only Andrew is in her life no matter what. Her feelings are incest are purely romantic. I mean, the fact that you have the option to go down an incest subroute in the first place makes it pretty easy to guess why most players chose it, these two are going to Hell no matter how you slice it lmao
😮💨you described exactly why I like the game perfectly. This subgenre of horror doesn’t have many like it at the moment, so it’s refreshing to have something so “in your face” for a change of pace.
IMO it could almost be considered gothic horror, the family felt like something William Faulkner would have written. Genuinely wish more games tried stories like this.
I think there's something else to Ashley's feelings, as I don't think she has romantic attraction to Andrew at all. I think she is so terrified that Andrew will leave her that she would do legitimately anything to keep him in her life.
Why was this actually such a good analysis of the game 😭 Also I'm not brave enough to actually buy and play through the 3rd chapter so I wonder if you will cover that
Loved the analysis , I really like how you don't take it overly seriously to the point that it's pretentious but in the same time you don't just sarcastically diss it as a nother "ooohhhh incest game" , rather you find a right balance for us to get invested and enjoy the breakdown and analysis. Btw I instantly recogni the into music being from Milk outside a bag of milk , would you by any chance do analysis on that game ? I really love it and think it deserves a lot more attention. P.S excuse my poor English as I come from Eastern Europe.
Funny enough, if you’re looking for a milk inside a bag of milk analysis, stayed tuned for the next upload then 🤫. I also appreciate your comment it means so much to heart that
I was expecting the "close bonding" to be a lot worse, people really be fixating on the tamest part of the satanist cannibal murderous siblings huh? also on a sidenote, i dont even think that Andrew and Ashley are blood related, the mother has yellow eyes and the father pink ones, so i think the only legitimate child is Ley, thanks for the summary dude!
Even if they weren't Andrew is essentially her brother, they've been raised together their whole lives, even worse so Andrew essentially raised her because that job was forced on to him by his mother
woah what the hell i thought this video had way more views than it does, what do you mean its only at like 700... this is super engaging and the quality is outstanding!!! im excited to see what else you cover in the future friend! :-]
This game is so good and i enjoy its story a lot but jfc the incest 😭 like i understand why the burial route exists and everything,,, but i kinda wish it didnt happen,, other than the implication of them hooking up i do really love this game… sucks that its “problematic” tho or whagevr
Yeah I completely get it. There definitely was probably a way to convey toxic family behavior without having to add incest into the mix, but I wouldn’t have even heard about the game without all that drama so I’m kinda glad it happened 🤷♀️.
3 months bro, shit made me realize how much effort higher quality videos take and I now respect all video essay creators for their work. It also made me wish to create more.
I really have to praise this game on how it makes me have headaches whenever I have to watch those two conversate, it goes to show how bothering it has to be to be close to people who are like that (very mentally unwell). It's a pretty weird but interesting game at the same time for sure.
please make more videos omg i loved this video and i came back to check for more and was so sad! I love the pacing + analysis and would def watch more!!
My one friend does character drawings in this style (intentionally mimicking it) so when i saw the thumbnail i was like "oh ill learn more before i commish my friend for art" and now i know more..... perhaps i wont buy that specific art......... but god i love unapologically dark media. What an interesting game.
I did not expect the mom to be the funniest character to me. Idk why but i found her dry frustration and her being a terrible mom in general to be hilarious.
Thank you so much I’m gonna sob. This is one of my very favorite games and finally someone’s reviewing it who has both played it, and doesn’t call it the “Twitter incest game”
