@Jar Head No baby, I got you AND him real mad. Mad at my Black Pride. You came to MY thread with the shits. Don't come here with the bullshit or you WILL get roasted. Just like the sun roasts you.
@Northern Wealth Anarchy Perimeter LOL I'm not mad at you, I pity you. I'm making fun of you. You're not man enough to make me mad. A person who can't even stand out in the sun for over 15 minutes can't talk sideways out their mouth to me.🤣🤣🤣🤣 go worry about skin cancer bitch, don't worry about me. LMAO
Communism doesn’t work. It’s not a pro human or pro rights system. A lot of blacks like the idea of communism bc it *PROMISES* black people what we love most...........free shit!
Abhishek Bhuyan so you’re a commie, I’m guessing. Where has communism worked? Do you know anything about Mao Zedong, Joe Stalin, VI Lenin, Kim Il Sung, Kim Jong Il, Ho Chi Minh, the Castros, Pol Pot and the khmer Rouge, the Bolshevik Revolution? Do you know anything? It’s all about domination, all about control. Literally murdering all political dissidents. Please explain to me why you think this is the answer. Go!
Abhishek Bhuyan that was one of the worst defenses of communism I’ve ever heard. You didn’t even answer the simple question I asked you bc you can’t lol 🤡 How about you go live in a communist country since you love it so much, I bet you won’t. You’re equating two things that have absolutely nothing to do with each other. You just wanna murder people who don’t agree with you politically which is not at all the same as the American Revolution and you know that but won’t admit it. But that’s why you people will never come to power in this country bc you’re all bark and no bite. You’re not going to kill anyone or actually physically do anything. You’re just a punk or what’s known as a useful idiot. So you even want to kill blacks who don’t support communism, based on their political ideology? I thought black lives matter? 🤔 do you see the hypocrisy there? I’m totally against communism but I don’t believe communist should be rounded up and executed for their beliefs, no matter how ridiculous. But I have something called *DECENCY* something you and those of your ilk lack. Retire!
Сергей Алексеев I take it you were searching the Bolshevik Revolution ? This was recommended to me after seeing what RU-vid would provide me , of course . It’s always so relevant to this . "We must realize that our party's most powerful weapon is racial tension. By propounding into the consciousness of the dark races that for centuries they have been oppressed by the whites, we can mold them to the program of the Communist Party. In America we will aim for subtle victory. While inflaming the negro minority against the Whites, we will endeavor to instill in the Whites a guilt complex for their exploitation of the negros. We will aid the negroes to rise in prominence in every walk of life, in the professions and in the world of sports and entertainment. With this prestige, the negro will be able to intermarry with the Whites and begin a process which will deliver America to our cause." - Israel Cohen, General Secretary of The World Zionist Organization, from his book "A Racial Program For The 20th Century" (1912), read into the Congressional Record by Congressman Thomas Abernathy, U.S. House of Representatives (Mississippi, 4th District), on June 7, 1957, Volume 103, pg. 8559, third paragraph (left column).
@@timberrr1126 Tim, communism fell with the Soviet Union in early 1990s. It was not a perfect political or economic system, but some of the ideas were good. Communism had to be demonized by the U.S. for various reasons, but Ms. Davis was just saying that some of its ideas were relevant to her given the history of racism, poverty, segregation, Jim Crow laws and ingrained white privilege in the U.S. at the time. By the way, I am a southern, black woman who loves Russia!
Blacks in Europe don’t carry the stigma of oppression that those in America have. So, Russia may be free of stigma too. In my opinion, people are naturally tribal. To be respected in America, Blacks should show interest in Africa., use some of their fashions. The colors are more harmonious to their skin color.
No, that's just a child's logic. Seriously, that's exactly how children think. Why don't you tell that to a LEGAL immigrant that lived through Communism? They're not white and they will rip you a new one for saying stupid shit like that.
I agree. By that logic, when Angela Davis praised the "glorious name" of Vladimir Lenin in the Soviet Union while accepting the Lenin Peace Prize and we know that Lenin was responsible for the "Red Scare" in which at least 100,000 people were murdered by the state, what "good" was it that those people knew that lead to their murder? Realize please that in this scenario, Lenin represented "the man." And if you think "the man" comes down hard on people in the USA, we can't hold a candle to people like Lenin, Stalin, Hitler, Mao, Kim Jong Il etc. Where is America's Stalin? Where is America's Hitler? We haven't had them. They come from authoritarian regimes like Nazi Germany and Soviet Russia. Slavery in the US was horrific but it pales in comparison to these regimes.
@@bentonja668 there we go again lmao. Capitalism killed more people then you can make up for communism, ok? So your argument back at you. What can you say in defense? People dying under capitalism is somehow better?
Most black women ARE strong because they have to be. For future reference its NOT a compliment....do some research I suggest starting with the dictionary.
Around 2017-2018 i was just watching an Netflix movie I think called “13TH” directed by “ Eva DuVernay “ about a week or two prior & the one segment of that movie that capture my soul was when I learned about Ms Davis & what’s She’ve accomplished as an black panther ..I remember working in the Esplanade Gardens in Harlem around 147th & Lenox. I was sitting at my post & I heard this soft familiar voice talking on the phone in the lobby .. now initially you don’t think that’s the person because wouldn’t think that person would be in that section of Harlem, or in that building at that time .. soo I was like “naaaaah can’t be “& kept writing in my book log ... then I said to myself “nah that voice is to familiar” .. I look to my left & it was her MS ANGELA DAVIS .. I had to acknowledge her .. I told that women it was an pleasure to actually meet her shook her hand & all .. i was 30 at that time I’m 32 now but I know some things on our black history .. & to actually meet her out of all the the famous ppl we see in New York .. she was the first person .. I’ve EVER APPROACHED!! On an groupie type level .. I will never forget that day ever .. I wish I had my phone to take an pic, but they don’t allow us to have phones .. this lady represented herself in court facing soooo many years .. walked in that courtroom & as an natural black strong queen & left out the same way .. AFRO & all✊🏿✊🏿 & she’s still as beautiful as she was then!!!.. MS. ANGELA DAVIS .. my name is Tabias barnes .. I still work in Harlem as in security but I will never forget you !!! Your soo iconic to the black community...❤️
I love this short interview, Angela Davis shows what we have in common, which is a desire to liberate the oppressed people of the world from the dictatorship of the bourgeoisie.
@@theplayerformerlyknownasmo3711 The bourgeoisie are people who own private property. I doubt some random RU-vid commenter is part of that small minority.
@@myrikke6391 u guys cant even handle 6 city blocks. Asking for handouts and getting your asses handed to you by the police and random citizens. You're all a joke.
@@theplayerformerlyknownasmo3711 Are you talking about CHAZ? CHAZ is some liberal bullshit, not a single fucking communist gives a shit about CHAZ lol. Second, Marxism is by far probably one of the most detailed and developed political ideologies ever. Try reading some Marxism before you shit on something you know nothing about. There are strict revolutionary methods derived from historical materialism, neither of which have anything to do with something like fucking CHAZ lol. Communists want to abolish taxes, and have earn the work they produce. This is what socialism is. No communist wants handouts, and especially not from the bourgeois state, you bad faith cunt.
"We must realize that our party's most powerful weapon is racial tension. By propounding into the consciousness of the dark races that for centuries they have been oppressed by the whites, we can mold them to the program of the Communist Party. In America we will aim for subtle victory. While inflaming the negro minority against the Whites, we will endeavor to instill in the Whites a guilt complex for their exploitation of the negros. We will aid the negroes to rise in prominence in every walk of life, in the professions and in the world of sports and entertainment. With this prestige, the negro will be able to intermarry with the Whites and begin a process which will deliver America to our cause." - Israel Cohen, General Secretary of The World Zionist Organization, from his book "A Racial Program For The 20th Century" (1912), read into the Congressional Record by Congressman Thomas Abernathy, U.S. House of Representatives (Mississippi, 4th District), on June 7, 1957, Volume 103, pg. 8559, third paragraph (left column).
It isn't so much that there isn't anything wrong with Communism, but rather that the struggle against it by the US and other Capitalist countries has always been a monetary struggle and a white supremacist rally. The US for instance, spends endless amounts of Capital to ensure the supremacy of Capitalism abroad which Capitalism by it's very design is tied to the exploitation of what is considered "Lesser" races by the Anglosphere. So if you wonder why the allure of Communism is gaining traction as well as Socialism specially by people of color, it's because these two systems are alternatives to the one that has oppressed them for generations.
Because EVERY communist country ended up using "enemies of the collective good" as the excuse for MASS GENOCIDE! 40 MILLION in USSR between 1918 and 1959; between 30 and 60 MILLION in China during Chairman Mao's reign; Rwanda, Cambodia, Laos, Poland ALL picked out their "enemies" and SLAUGHTERED them for the good of the state.
@@unai49999 telling myself what? the truth? Pick up a book once in a while and LEARN it yourselves. Lenin, Mao both were Marxist communists who went through their countries, murdered MILLIONS each to keep the "oppressors must die" mantra going because that's all they had as a reason for their power. So they had to keep finding new oppressors that are still keeping "the proletariat" in such dire straights so then the next sub human targets were picked for genocide. Then after they murdered all the farmers who new how to actually work farms, no one was left who knew how to so millions died of famines following. In order for communism to be installed, the new govt must first come in with military might and remove all vestiges of the previous govt before they can hand over the commerce rights over to the people, right? Only that part never seems to happen because once these dictators got all the power of both the commerce and military then they'd just start eliminating all the anti government working/academic/professional class citizens saying that obviously it's too soon to turn everything over to the people because there's still too many resistance factions that still need dealt with. Sound familiar? At least in capitalism the power of the military and govt are separate from the commerce control. So when you insist on believing your own revisionist historical accounts don't get all bothered by facts and all because that just ruins your high of rage and hatred toward your perceived enemy. It's called DELUSIONAL reality syndrome because living in it keeps you victims instead of admitting your too scared to take responsibility for your own ignorance.
@@MegzeeR have you noticed that I didn't say comunists didn't massacre ppl??? I'm just pointing capitalist countries are same shit but different smelling.
I’m don’t identify as a communist politically and probably never will. Yet I understand why people do and why it is needed in this context. It’s cool to hear other POV on stuff.
Yeah embrace totalitarianism it will great, power to the people...For the first month then when all resources have run out we can all live on each other's faeces and then die of hunger and disease
There is a serious error in the subtitles at 0:17, when the interviewer asks her why is she a communist it says "economist", please correct that🙏 otherwise great content, amazing message, incredible charisma of that beutiful human being. Love❤
The way she speaks, the way shes so calm, the intellect, they she looks when shes paying attention, her eyes smh Lord this woman is one of the many definitions of BEAUTY! ❤❤ I ABSOLUTELY LOVE THIS WOMAN
It's interesting because as an anarchist who supports the Black Panthers this almost sums up my opinion of their marxist-leninist tendencies. I know what the ideology is of course, but I don't much care that I disagree with small pieces of their thought because what they do with that thought is impossible for me not to support.
I haven’t seen the full interview so I’m just wondering if she explained what communism is because i understand this clip was about why she is one. I’m wondering if TV would let someone openly talk about fundamental ideologies of communism on live TV back then?
No one would support communism if they knew what it actually is. Manning johnson tried to warn this woman and the rest of his people about communism. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-ruP-WVgfkMM.html
A communist society as defined by communists is a moneyless classless stateless society in which the workers own the means of production (the machinery used to produce items). Communists ask for a strong well fair state, the idea is to reach equity for individuals. The idea is that since people do not have to work in harsh conditions to survive, and since everyone has a good education, people will be able to peruse what ever jobs they want simply for the joy of doing it. People do not live under a constant threat of a boom bust cycle resorting in an economic Crises since items aren’t produced for profit, but rather the betterment of humanity.
@DoughnationCreative as opposed to being dependent on capital through your boss and wages? The establishment already exists, it takes from you and gives you less in return. An establishment that at least gives you a fair share in return sounds like an improvement
@@Vampirelov3r2000 I’ve seen a fair few of Black women who do wear their real natural hair, but don’t lie and say that Black women now don’t use, take care, or love their natural hair in current times; even in Africa this is becoming a huge problem for Black women, so this is definitely a global issue that needs to be squashed, and I do not blame Black women for giving into using straight haired wigs, because I do see the stigma of curlier hair on Black women being perpetuated time and time again. This has to be a global effort to uplift and praise Black women who use their natural hair instead of using fake inorganic and very unnatural wigs.
3:02 is where she actually answers the question. There is a lot of run-around talking up until this point. IMO she provides an admirable answer, but essentially just says she wants the best for those who have been oppressed and all those thereafter. No real discussion of the political or economic rationale
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||a it doesn’t work there’s to much power in the government we need to minimize government involvent to basic services like schools, roads and national defense and let a competitive marketplace give people the best quality and cheapest products and services they can get which will not work in communism
@@lIlIlIlIlIIIlIllIIllIII I detest the state, capitalists and wage slavery. I wish to see either state socialism in my lifetime or a global communist society (stateless, classless, moneyless) in my descendants lifetimes. Capitalism is unsustainable and inefficient deliberately for the sake of the owning class. Nobody on earth has to be homeless or starving. This scarcity is deliberately manufactured and is literally killing our ecosystem. We need to have an economic system in which the workers who produce the value in the economy own the means of their own production. Rather than individuals or corporations who have enough sway to buy elections. I want freedom. Positive freedom to achieve one's goals. Material freedom. Real freedom. I cannot be free in a cinder of a world made only for the ultra-wealthy. Oh and also in the US our Neoliberal Capitalism is built off of the backs of black, brown and indigenous people. It harms everyone in different ways. But it's important to recognize one's own unique privilege. I am a white man. Even though I am privileged there is a reason I fight for this beyond ideological. It simply is the only way for our species to survive in both a material sense and a spiritual one. How's that?
What is it with people in this comment section thinking they can meaningfully talk about a topic they, literally, know nothing about besides some catchphrases?
hi smarty thanks to this f.. capitalism you have the technology to send me the message. You have all the conveniences of life and all of this is because of capitalism, freemarket economy. If you don't like it you can always move to Cuba.
@@marktwine9126 Absolutely pathetic. This is the best the capitalists have to muster? Capitalism did not invent the technology we have, workers did. Infact, the internet your using right now was invented thanks to the US government and not the "freemarket" (and you being the smarty pants you are, know that when government does things its socialism). People in the US can't even move to Cuba (which is not socialist, in reality) because the US has put Cuba under a murderous embargo 62 years. And no it wasn't because "anything is okay when its against communists, communists are subhuman scum", it was (according to the US State Department) done to "while as adroit and inconspicuous as possible, makes the greatest inroads in denying money and supplies to Cuba, to decrease monetary and real wages, to bring about hunger, desperation and overthrow of government." If you don't believe you can google the quote, and you can google anything else to check if it's true here.
I want to be a Communist since it's a beautiful ideology. It's just hard when every Communist country (I know about) ended up corrupt and oppressive af. So despite my hatred for capitalism and the many downfalls it brings. I would prefer it over communism bc it's the lesser of two evils as far as I can tell. Atleast in practice
I honestly cant tell if you are trolling or not but either way you've made more sense than any of the nuts praising it in your skeptical take on it alone. That's sad.
there have actually been many successful communist revolutions that were very peaceful and it doesnt take much research to find them. but i would implore you to ask this question: how many people have died from the unjust wars in the name of preserving capitalism in america? the iraq war is a war over oil, the vietnam war was unjust and caused the deaths of many young people, i would argue even the civil war was fought over the indsutry of selling people considering capitalism and racism are very much intertwined. communism seeks equal rights. the problem with stalin was totalitarianism. the problem with mao was totalitarianism. communism seeks to equalize not terrorize. look into anarchism and youll see what i mean.
@@TheJumboBurrito Like who? You are comparing the war machine to capitalism itself and that isnt accurate. Capitalism and racism have nothing to do with each other. Everytime communism is enacted it breeds some for of violence.
@@TheJumboBurrito War, no matter how 'justified', blows goats. The US is still villified by entering WW2 too early, too late, or wrongly all together. But the Nazi Holocaust consisted of some people putting other people into ovens. The horror of even imagining such evil precludes me from answering the usual journalism stuff... who, what, when, why...etc. That all happened under a policy of appeasement. I've also walked part of the Bataan Death March in the Philippines - and met survivors. Horrific. And very little 'blacks/whites' involved.
Wtf kinda comment is this? Why is it insane because you expect a black women with an Afro to speak like a mentally deficient window licker? Or because she said she’s a communist?
It was hard for me to nail down her definition of it. Did she mean in her mind, Communism was a simply revolution against the oppressed, not so much an economic hierarchy of goods and leadership?
Communists use idealistic “useful idiots” and “revolutionaries” to destabilize a nation. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Zi4mrAAErv0.html Then later they are executed.
@@clairofan01 it’s about the message not the messenger. Even if Yuri is a charlatan as you claim, what he says about leftie communists is very true. Most of the lefties in the west are brainwashed. When you hear of people that have actually lived and escaped communism, that exposes everything you need to know about that oppressive and evil ideology
@@pygmalion8952 China isn't capitalist and the main issue the USSR had was being undermined by revisionists and liberals from within, not with the system they had set into motion during the Lenin and Stalin eras. China allows sphere of capitalist production in specific areas for consumer goods. Healthcare, weapons/defense, banking, education, energy, the entire tech sector is 100% nationalized. There is a contingent of Western leftists that want to denigrate China because it doesn't superficially match up to the socialist fantasyland in their heads, meanwhile China has almost completely eliminated poverty in a huge country in record time. Call it whatever you want, but it isn't capitalist and even if it isn't the society you personally want to live in, it is 100% functional.
@@pygmalion8952 When the state is a worker's state, the people do control the means of production which is why China's system produces results for its people, rather than funneling all the gains to the top. You are drawing a line between the people and the state that is un-Marxist and shouldn't exist in a socialist society. There is a reason why right wing ideologues always want everything decentralized and left to be run itself without government oversight: it sounds nice but is really a trap for letting concentrations of wealth dominate people. China's working conditions have improved a lot by the way.
@@pygmalion8952 Yes, one of us has read Marx, whose original contribution per Marx was the concept of the dictatorship of the proletariat and the other is just spouting nonsense.
@@442277100 www.aljazeera.com/focus/2009/10/200910793416112389.html This is communism. Fencing and locking your citizens in to stop them leaving and shooting them if they try. Grow up boy and study history instead of wading in that north African river.
@@PenzancePete Lmao, that isn't true at all. A fascist state with no democracy is _inherently_ not a communist state. They might call themselves communist to make them sound more friendly in the same way that North Korea claims to be the Democratic People's Republic of Korea while not actually being democratic, but that doesn't make them communist. A communist society is in its essence a classless, stateless society in which all of the wealth and means of production are redistributed according to the people's need. Socialism is an umbrella term for many different ideologies that want to turn society into a communist one, but the means in doing this vary wildly. There is for example Marxism-Leninism which advocates for the use of a vanguard party that is controlled by the workers of the state, while Anarcho-communism wants to achieve communism through the abolition of the state, wage labour and private property. East Germany had a dictatorship that was not classless and there was no redistribution either which makes them not communist. It 'Democracy is indispensable to socialism' after all.
“There’s a certain woman here named Angela Davis. I don’t know if you are familiar with her in this country, but in our country, literally, for an entire year, we heard of nothing at all except Angela Davis. There was only Angela Davis in the whole world and she was suffering. We had our ears stuffed with Angela Davis. Little children in school were told to sign petitions in defense of Angela Davis. Little boys and girls, eight and nine years old, were asked to do this. She was set free, as you know. Although she didn’t have too difficult a time in this country’s jails, she came to recuperate in Soviet resorts. Some Soviet dissidents-but more important, a group of Czech dissidents-addressed an appeal to her: `Comrade Davis, you were in prison. You know how unpleasant it is to sit in prison, especially when you consider yourself innocent. You have such great authority now. Could you help our Czech prisoners? Could you stand up for those people in Czechoslovakia who are being persecuted by the state?’ Angela Davis answered: `They deserve what they get. Let them remain in prison.’ That is the face of Communism. That is the heart of Communism for you.”
And people only seem to be saying in the comments is how beautiful she is how and we'll spoken she is...I'm like hellooo?!?!?! Do you not see what she stands for?!?!?!?
@@mohammedsaleem4918 I put this comment on the most viewed Angela Davies videos to make people aware. Most people don't realize how extreme these people are.... I've not had one notification yet where someone read this and agreed that her viewpoint is correct....They always say she didn't say this etc....errrrr google?....which means even her supporters don't actually agree with her when they really understand what she really thinks. As soon as the authoritarian left are exposed it always crumbles
@@ricksmith3634 let's pray it crumbles because there's a new radical left in the limelight now and it's called the World Economic Forum and people really do need to look into it and start taking it seriously
Marx predicted those regimes. They are what he called "crude communism," where people try to move to a communist regime without first passing through capitalism and ridding themselves of thinking in terms of property.
It has already worked just not superficially. For thousands of years humans used to cooperate and our leaders would make sure everyone was well fed and healthy. But then capitalism was invented
People are known by how they present themselves. God presents Himself as good, because He hates evil, and injustice. We need to love Jesus Christ, He is the essence of good in this world, and everything good comes from God. Everything bad comes from Satan, but people are drawn to naturalistic mindsets which cause spiritual decay.
ok let me give you some examples. look up east and west germany its the perfect example literally one side of the country was basically capitalist and the other side was communist...
Read the Communist Manifesto by Marx and Engels, and The State and Revolution by Lenin; those are pretty good to start and understand the basics, you can easily get the PDFs.
@@DO-fo5pm Well the original phrase "better red than dead" was coined as an anti-nuclear war slogan, so I presume you are advocating to starting a nuclear holocaust? I mean, no one outside of your edgy circle of 12 year old friends will take you seriously, but if you really want to die I'm sure you can find much easier ways than waiting for a nuclear war.
Some people are more successful than others. Some people make better choices through life. People get lucky. Life is random. Some lions get more kills than others. Some cubs dont make it lion hood. This is NATURE. This is NOT because of systematic oppression. Creatures DO NOT ALL HAVE THE SAME OUTCOMES.
I thought it was so rich and telling when Angela Davis found out that one of her ancestors came to America on the Mayflower. She thought that her history started with slavery here but it did not, it started with an ancestor that was part of the founding wave of immigrants to the Americas. I hope she is able to learn from that fact in her later years of life.
@@bruhidk3069 not 100 million it was exaggerated by the west with rumors and lies its more around 60 million .. still a lot though but it was run by genocidal dictators like Stalin
I’m sure Angela, who has dedicated her entire life to the liberation of black people, knows what her people need to be free. As she says, racism will never cease to exists as long as capitalism exists.
The problem with communism is technology will eventually take over the worker because demand will always increase. However, capitalism seeks to marginalize the worker by placing as little value on his labor as possible in order to maximize profits. Communism leads to stagnation, but Capitalism leads to abandonment and economic disillusionment. Neither system answers the fundamental question of human dignity.
Innovation is ongoing. Change is inevitable because of demands of the markets. You start with a tiller then you move to a plow then a tractor in each case the worker must adapt or be replace. Communism removes that incentive so markets are loss to other countries that keep innovating
@@loon0493 @@loon0493 capitalism doesn't produce new things for the sake of innovation, only for the sake of material gain. you get tons of shitty useless inventions that are solely made for profit, and it something useful is produced the prices are rocketed for profit, look at medication, even in case of corona virus now in communism people aren't scared of mechanization of the work place. if they're replaced by machines they won't be fired like in capitalism. they will be given shorter working hours and will have more free time to peruse their passions etc
The Soviets loved that black folk from the US so much that invited the to stay at the illustrious Gulag Archipelago where they could work to their hearts content. Many were denied entrance back to the US. Many were tried as traitors to the Marxist revolution and were given the gift of bullet to the head. Lovett Fort-Whiteman was sentenced to 5 years of hard labor for being critical of Communist authors and for being a "Trotskyist". Leon Trotsky was who Lenin had hand picked to be his successor, but Stalin had his eyes on the position. Trotsky was eventually huted down and killed. Fort-Whiteman was beaten regularly she he wasn't able to meet his work quotas. Kind of like slaves in the US under the Democrats. Fort-Whiteman's teeth were knocked out and he died of "heart failure"
Obviously she has no idea what a communist really is !the speaker asked her why are you a communist and she could not give a vivid answer on what or why she was a communist or what communism stands for as a whole !!
@@MC-ns8gb I can understand speaking in parables or even disguising what she wanted to say , but her answer was shaky her voice was cracking she kept saying uhhh . Those are all indicator of her not being sure of her answer & not knowing what she should really reply without sounding like she has no idea what she's talking about . I heard nothing of what communism meant to her or her people !
