Thanks for the dive into it. #1 thing for me on a new unit is number of bluetooth - I can live with the current video. Will be outfitting a new workout area later this year and ideally I just have a box like this rather than a linked computer of some type - I like simplicity.
You said it best at the beginning and I agree completely: I use AppleTV for Zwift over the PC because it ALWAYS works. I never have problems with virtual bike apps on AppleTV compared to my laptop.
Thanks for this! After experiencing a big bug on my old Apple TV with Zwift yesterday (would NOT start), I will wait till Zwift fixes this and improves on the items you've pointed out! Going to move old Apple TV to guest room afterwards and update to this model in my pain cave.
Indeed, looks like that bug was a wonky one. In case you didn't see the threads on the Zwift forums, in short, disable the Dolby audio support and you'll be good to go.
As always a great review and content. I have the old version and trying to move around Zwift to select worlds, routes and so on is a game of chance with the current remote!
A bit of a warning: Zwift hasn't supported directional navigation for years now. The Apple TV could already work with 3rd party remotes and Xbox controllers but Zwift still wouldn't let you use directional arrows. It works flawlessly with Apple's apps (they're pushing it as a gaming system after all) and literally every other third party app but Zwift have been dragging their heels for years now.
I've been waiting for a better Apple TV4k for a while now but it appears the new one is only marginally better, I don't think the new CPU has enough extra to give the better experience we all want in Zwift. If you look at it in PC terms you need almost twice the horsepower to go up a level in graphics. I almost rushed out to get the new one, glad they sold out so fast now! Thanks
According to last Zwift version Apple TV 1.13.2 (1.0.71228) (June 2 2021) : "Added support for high resolution graphics on Apple TV (2021 version)" : new test to come ?
The iPhone remote app has had an option to enable the precise direction controls for.. a long time. But Zwift has never implemented comparability. Here’s hoping.. I hate navigating controls in selecting training programs with the swipe remote sooo much..
To be honest Zwift on (my) PC's just work too. I had not any major issues since... 2015 I think. And it became even better when Windows 10 figured out Bluetooth native support. I get the charm of super small, cheap and quite portable device which ATV is. I just prefer my Zwift to be much more smooth and pretty ;)
Yeah, I really wish I could say the same, but it's impressive how many bugs float across the PC/Mac variants. Heck, my Windows box (which is only a year old) refuses to pair BT in Zwift for some unknown reason. I could spend hours/days troubleshooting why, but I've given up on it. I just stick an ANT+ adapter in it.
@@Dcrainmaker The M1 MBP has been flawless connecting to Zwift’s either via BT or ANT+. I mostly use ANT+ since I give the more solid connection to TrainerRoad via Bluetooth.
@@Dcrainmaker As of BT there is some quite common problem with Visual C++ on some W10 machines. Installing this usually solves it: www.techpowerup.com/download/visual-c-redistributable-runtime-package-all-in-one/
Any news on this or are the graphics still not as good as the original 4K version . Hard to find any updated videos on the graphics and how they compare
I loved your hint at lots of new sports tech in the next 7-12 days!!! 12 days puts us at June 2, 🤔 I think some FCC applications expiry on the 2nd as well!! Also saw you logging some k’s last night!!
Yeah, I think if we fast forward even just a few weeks, many of these initial concerns will be sorted out in Zwift updates. Ultimately, I wouldn't go out and buy an old one for really any reason. I'd either wait a few weeks, or buy the new one and presume the minor quirks will get sorted.
Hi DC Rainmaker, is the screen/image quality better now for the new 4K '21 Apple TV compared to the old one? That would give me a excuse for buying a new one!
They make a lot sense if your TV doesn’t have a good OS (a lot of older TVs for example and probably a lot of new ones). Everything can be controlled via the remote included and they integrate extremely well with other Apple devices. e.g. swipe down from the top right on an iPhone and there is an Apple TV remote and screen mirroring options
@@trannel73 Haha... Literally, one of my two iPad's is from 2014. Seriously. The other one is from 2016...I bought it when Zwift announced iPad support: www.dcrainmaker.com/2016/08/zwift-ios-app-version.html
Just messing with you 😅🙈 sorry. Currently in full Apple silicon M1 hype and traded in my old iPad Air 2 from 2014 (maybe you have this one as well). Will be a blast to feel the speed for RU-vid convenience when purchasing the new iPad Pro 12.9” 🏎 watching Tour de France on the terrace let’s goooooo! 🤩
@@trannel73 Hahaha...yeah, I have an M1 Mac Mini at the office (you can just barely see it in this video below some monitors) that I use for a few random tasks. And I've had my finger on the buy button a few times for one of the new M1 iMac's to use at home for quicker rendering when I need to get something out (like last night...and two nights prior). But now the timelines here are 6 weeks for that, so I'll wait to see what happens at WWDC.
Based on the fact that other training apps can only support 2 sensors in addition to the remote, the limit is in tvOS. I have read (unfortunately, I can’t find the link) that the limit is artificial and the hardware can support the same number of connections as iOS devices.
Wonder if they stalled the release of the fabled, perhaps vapourware, ATV UI update pending release of the new hardware. I’ve got the 4K 2017 and with better BT support and maybe a gfx uplift in terms of quality and speed, I’d be tempted but not right now.
They said back a few mins ago (CEO, Eric Min), that basically they stopped that because they realized they had some more substantial backend type issues that they needed to sort through first, before changing the UI. In other words, their underwear had holes in it, and it was in more dire shape than a pair of new heals.
Great video, Ray! I have one question that hasn't been covered so far by anybody: At home not only me but also my wife and my daughters would like to use zwift. Since they do not want to have road bikes and I am taller than they are, there is currently no way... Could anybody recommend a "stationary" bike for zwift that solves this problem?
That's a tough one. The best of the bunch these days is the Wahoo KICKR Bike, but that costs $3,500! Eeks! You've then got the Stages SB20, Tacx NEO Bike, and Wattbike ATOM that are all solid options but at a lesser price point.
I have a stages sb20. Highly adjustable. Takes only a couple minutes to adjust seat x axis , seat y axis, handle bar x axis and handle bar y axis. Handle bar pitch and seat pitch requires an Allen wrench though. Although I don’t adjust those once fixed. Wife uses it for her peloton classss and I use zwift. Happy to spend the 3k it cost and would do it again
This is an issue I face as well. I have Kickr Snap but I rarely use it because it's not practical for our home gym, as my gf also likes to ride on Zwift. A bit spendy at 900, but we have a Concept 2 ERG bike that connects without wires and is quickly adjustable. It's been rock solid with zwift and we love it. Low tech for the most part, but I love that part since too much tech makes for a headache (we learned this the hard way with our Bowflex treadmill that has to perform an update once a week and takes 20 minutes). Anyway, we have over 6k miles on the thing in a little over a year and are considering a second one for our cottage.
A12 has known capabilities, one can look at A12 (or later) iPhones or iPads. Even a 2020 iPad Pro I have with much more powerful processor did not get assigned any profile other than basic.
True, but as others have pointed out, it's actually a bit more complex than just the A10/A12/etc chip (such as being permanently connected to power, giving it more power), which is one of the things Apple tried (mostly successfully) to illustrate in their keynote.
I’ve always just mirrored my iPhone on ATV. It is the best of both worlds. Easy light weight setup and I can have more than 2 Bluetooth connections and navigation is on the phone. I think Zwift’s companionship app is useless. No reason to upgrade the ATV.
Hey can you help please? Do I mirror zwift from my phone with airplay onto my 4K TV or unpack the new Apple TV 4K TV and operate zwift directly through that? 🙏
No doubt the new 2021 ATV will align with Zwift and other apps. No doubt. If you’re looking for a new ATV definitely buy the new one. Even for just having the new remote. The 4 buttons will end up working with Zwift, those up/down/left/right will make navigating a blessing. I was a huge fan of using my ATV 4K as my pain cave setup. I’ve transitioned to an M1 MBP only because I’m running Zwift and TrainerRoad at the same time. It’s been flawless after getting the Bluetooth and ANT+ all dialed, and graphics on my 4K tv is better. It’s not a simple setup like the ATV, and much more costly, but the specific setup I was looking for is working great.
How can you say the previous remote functions perfectly ! Zwift needs to work on the interface for Apple TV on the very known issue of erratic selection with the remote. Looks like the new remote isn't better at all.
I'm not sure where I said the previous remote works perfectly. I simply said that the mini-swipe section within the new remote works within Zwift to the same level the previous remote did. But I've never said the previous remote is great, in fact, I literally made an entire video about how bad it is within Zwift (and in general).
@@Dcrainmaker You mention that Apple TV works great with Zwift. However, the remote navigation is part of the experience - very annoying. We would have hoped that the new remote would improved a lot the experience - which isn't the case, unfortunately. Whether it is the Zwift interface or the remote itself, maybe both are problematic ?
Am i the only one with lag and bad picture quality on the new ATV? The first version worked very well. But the version is not doing to good? Any ideas?
My 2016 Alienware alpha is just becoming painful to run Zwift on, I really don’t want to spend 1000s on something that’s only used for Zwift so thanks for this vid ray. Zwift does look poor after playing glorious ray traced Ratchet and clank on the ps5 tho lol
Hey Ray, been looking to see if you have anything for the new 2023 Apple TV version. Can’t find anything for Zwift. Want to get Apple TV (my first) next month but want to know more about it or if better to get this 2021 or 2022. Any updates?
Any updates on whether things are already as high end as they'll get on the 2021 4K AppleTV? Wondering if Zwift can squeeze any more out of it in terms of graphic profile
I use my old PC (Skylake, 2015?) with ANT+ receptor and it just works fine. Screen is my old 52" TV in HDTV. Better details than ATV. Going to stick with that.
2 is usually enough. And if you need more because your setup is particular, you can add them using the Companion app as a bridge. Most people have their smart trainer and HRM on the two channels. The trainer provide control, cadence and power on one channel. HRM use the other.
@@Dcrainmaker agreed. I’m an early adopter for most things but these days the initial firmware and software support is half baked on release so it’s ok to chill for a bit
The reason I came in with the negative here is because you’re talking about a negative. The negative is that they haven’t updated for the new unit yet. You could have cut to yes buy the new one today and wait for update.
There’s a very simple rule in tech: Never buy tech based on promises or un-implemented features. And when it comes to Zwift specifically, that rule is even more important.
thanks for the vid. I gather that it is NOT worth upgrading from older ATV 4K. But, if NOT currently a ATV owner, is it practical to purchase 2021 ATV 4K and patiently wait for Zwift to support new hardware spec? OR, is it more sensible to buy 2017 4K model at a bargain price? Thanks.
Bought one separately for my 2017 due to family members really struggling with the old one. Works as expected, auto pairs straight from the box. I have the case Ray recommends for the old one and actually quite like it still, but family much happier with the new one!
Regarding the number of concurrent BT connections, I don’t think it’s a hardware issue as I was just able to connect three Bluetooth game controllers and a Bluetooth keyboard to my previous Gen Apple TV 4K. So my guess is it’s a Zwift issue unless Apple only allows multiple connections for certain types of hardware. For instance, it won’t let me connect 2 Bluetooth keyboards at the same time. When attempting to connect a 2nd Bluetooth controller while I already had one connected along with some Bluetooth headphones I got a popup message that said “Only one game controller can be used with Bluetooth audio. To connect this game controller, change your audio output to HDMI”.
Yeah, historically it’s always been an Apple limitation that impacted all apps. Keep in mind that technically BT smart could be separate from legacy BT, or, Apple just randomly got around to allowing more connections - which would be huge.
@@Dcrainmaker According to this support article from Apple (support.apple.com/en-us/HT205302) you can connect up to 4 MFi Bluetooth controllers which should allow for local multiplayer gaming. Hopefully this means Zwift can support additional Bluetooth sensors without resorting to the Companion app.
@@mikemccarthy6851 Interesting. All of those accessory types shown are legacy (full) Bluetooth, as opposed to Bluetooth Smart (Low Energy). From a practical standpoint, there's no reason why there would be a limitation on BLE but not full BT. But of course, practically doesn't just mean a random software limitation because Apple didn't see a use-case (which, is what I suspect we're running up against).
@@mikemccarthy6851 "The page you're looking for can't be found." - is there something missing in the page address? (ETA: Figured it out - you configured the parenthesis at the end as part of the URL! ) - should be support.apple.com/en-us/HT205302
Normally yes, it will. Regardless of the output resolution, the 4K versions just render better games than the non-4K version. This has been the case for the last four years. However, at 720p output, you might not really notice some of that.
The 'shadow problem' on the ATV 4K has been solved (for quite a while now). I think the graphics are really good for such a 'cheap' device but I can't compare with the older versions of ATV.
I am kinda late to ZWIFT and Apple TV meaning today I'm getting 2021 Apple TV 4K 64GB - Black (2nd generation) , so as of May 1st 2023 will it pick up 4 sensors ?
Ray, Thanks for this and apologies if my question has come up recently. Just bought the new remote presuming that they would have the directional pad functionality figured out by now, but no. So, right, this remote is worse than the old one for Zwift. Do you have any insight into when they will do the necessary programming? I am driven mad by the inability to maneuver around with either remote.
My Question is the following: 1. Can we expect anything to change after Zwift has assessed the device? As DCR pointed out, right now Apple TV 2021 is even worse than its predecessor 2. What about 4K support (not profiles), if Apple TV 2021 is connected to a 4K TV will it output 4K resolution?
1) I suspect we'll see the buttons on the remote get fixed super quick, and then I suspect we'll see them tweak the profile slightly pretty quickly - hopefully to get the shadows back. 2) Zwift has never supported 4K on any Apple TV units, but, you can still output in 4K, the game just isn't rendered in 4K. For example, I was outputting in 4K/30-SDR, but the game is only rendered in 1080p. I haven't heard any plans to change that.
In this case it was the Rode Wireless Go 2, with a separate Lav mic. There's something up with the Lav mic connection though causing a slight pop every once in a while. I've gotta troubleshoot it.
If you are one of those weird people who do not own a smartphone and want to get into Zwifting what is the easiest way to do that? I will buy a Wahoo Kickr. I don't mind spending money.
The new Apple TV is just disappointing in terms of processor. The old 4K got the then iPad Pros cpu a10x. now it’s just a a12 which performs worse in some benchmarks compared to the a10x. Compared to the current iPhone cpu models it’s a joke, not even mentioning the m1 chip. I was so looking forward to replacing my desktop for Zwift…guess it won’t happen :)
I can save you 9 minutes: Zwift does not have a profile yet for the 2021 Apple TV - so we don't yet know if it's actually better or not. Stay tuned a month or two to find out.
@@Dcrainmaker It looks garbage compared to a PC for a little bit more; even with the current graphics card issues... (£70 PC; i3 haswell, 8gb ram, ssd ebay) plus graphics card 1050ti (or 1030 untill they get cheaper again.)
@@Dcrainmaker Plenty of us are and perhaps more should for VFM rather than accepting a closed ecosystem to spoon feed them a potato branded 4k that is far from that!
@@robiedoo00 Sure, but that's not the point. I can build a system too - but you can't do it for $179 from new parts and have it work perfectly just about every time. The 1050ti is 2x that alone, even a 1030 is $100 by itself. Let alone all the other parts you've gotta buy. C'mon, I literally built datacenters for two decades - I'm very well aware of what you can and can't build.
Apple TV with M1 chip? Hold your horses, Ray 😅 this thing renders 4K footage in second, and would bump up the Apple TV price by 100-200$ I believe. So maybe the A12 might be good for our wallets 🙂
Except some of us would gladly pay that extra $100-200 for an M1 AppleTV. I, for one, plan on skipping this new ATV and getting an M1 Mac Mini instead.
