something I have noticed in the comments is that they focus on only perisex (non-intersex) people. before I transitioned, I dated an intersex guy. He had a penis AND breasts and produced more estrogen than a perisex man. is he suddenly not a man because he has 'female' characteristics. were we suddenly a lesbian couple? no, because he is a man, an intersex man. the fact that I, someone only attracted to men, was attracted to him, meant he was a man. same goes for trans guys. in addition, people are allowed to label themselves however the fuck they want to and you can't change that. gonna assume most of the people in the comments are straight, cisgender, and perisex because it is a pretty common idea in the queer community that labels are for you and not for others.
I don't really care what people call themselves. At the end of the day, even if a man is hung up on genitals, he is still in a gay relationship if he's with you or me out in public and treated as such by society. Sexual orientation is not a choice, but the label one uses is very much a choice and subject to change based on interpretation. I myself am asexual, and I've called myself gay, bi, and pan at different points of my life. (I mostly think about romance being with another man (or masc NBs), but I'm still open to being with some women I really connect with.)
As a cisgay guy who has dated trans men, you are absolutely correct. I will say that I have had any 'interesting' dogpiles from GCs after making this claim. TMAM, TWAW
it's so bizzare when this happens... there are CIS men who are very feminine, who are incredibly androgynous, who do drag, who wear stereotypically womens' clothing, and yet they are still CIS gay men. There are men who are attracted to very "feminine" guys, and there are men who are attracted to super ripped, ultra buff, Chris Hemsworth looking dudes... sexuality is a spectrum just like gender, so if someone identifies as gay, they are gay. you explained the sex dynamic perfectly... trans people have sex like any other human... there are also many stages of sugery that change the dynamics too. It's between the people in the relationship, and IDK why random people feel the need to interject their preferences into someone else's relationship.
Gays are born gay. It’s not something you “identify” into. You keep so desperately trying to make it a social/cultural identity when it’s not. You don’t “choose” to be gay and it’s not a lifestyle or some sort of cult lol Trans people being obsessed with gays and lesbians is so incredibly weird
@@kaymillerfromTX when was that said? @AddiRockART said word for word "there are CIS men who are very feminine" Cis = identifying as the sex/gender you were born. Also this "chick" is a man because that's how he identifies. Trans = identifying as the opposite gender you were born as. Assuming your also a man I just want to remind you that's how you identify. I get not liking female genital's but not all transmen have them. I also know damn well you wouldn't like some random person calling you a chick because you use this as a insult super fast. If you don't like transmen or find them attractive just leave them alone. Your making yourself mad for no reason. grow up.
You are confusing stereotypes about sexes aka "masculinity and femininity " with sex itself... What makes someone gay is that they are attracted to the same sex... thats it.. Transmen are not male they are female, they have female bodies. As such someone whos attracted to the male body is not going to be interested in them..
My literature teacher was very adamant that we never talk about "books" (only exception: the phone book), but always reference the "novel" or the "drama" or whatever type of literature we were currently reading. Not sure how that fits in lol. The whole focus on genitals (and other biology) seems so silly to me, cause like... a lot of people take their relationships quite slowly and won't see their partner naked for a long time. But they're already attracted to them based on personality, behaviour, outward appearance or whatever. Sure, they might still have a genital preference and then decide to quit dating someone if they find out they don't match their preference. But the same could happen because they find out the person smokes, or has a different religion, or is exclusively into one sex act, or doesn't want kids, or whatever other turnoffs people have. Also correct me if I'm wrong, but "gay" doesn't just refer to "homosexual" but also "homoromantic", doesn't it? So to an asexual homoromantic man it might be completely irrelevant what kind of genitals his partner has if he doesn't really care about interacting with them anyway. Dunno if it's actually used in gay male spaces, but "size queen" is a word that exists.
I actually had a "debate" in the comments section of one of your videos with a person with "gender critical" views who was adamant that I'm bisexual, not homosexual, because I'm attracted to trans men lol It was kind of frustrating but also kind of amusing, like, never before had I had to try to convince someone that I'm not bisexual lol usually, in the real world, it's the other way around, bi guys having to try to convince others that they're indeed bi, not gay.
Right?? It's sooo distant from the real world. No one in my real life has ever questioned my bf's sexuality because... He's so clearly gay 😅. As you said, when he was figuring things out in high school and first thought he might be bisexual he got the opposite comments - people saying he would eventually come out as gay (... Which he did lol). Only on the trans critical corners of the Internet is the assumption weirdly the other way - that these gay men are secretly bi.
@@arthur_rockwellI noticed that usually the people who publicly identify as bi tend to be confused gay people and actual bi people are closeted most of the time. It's funny how that works. Bisexual people are real but if someone openly identifies as bisexual then there's a high chance that they're probably gay. It's so paradoxical lol. I'm not saying that everyone who identifies as bi is actually gay but this is a pattern that I've noticed with a lot of people. I also thought I was bi for a while before realizing that I'm gay. It's like the further you're away from heterosexuality the harder it becomes for you to come to terms with it. I hate heteronormativity with passion. The universal assumption that everyone is attracted to the opposite sex until proven otherwise 🙄
And when your "boyfriend" is pregnant with your child? You're going to think, Oh well, that's what happens when gay guys forget birth control? You do realise that being a man or a woman isn't a look, that it isn't just appearance?
I actually think there’s a lot of nuance in this. Like, it really is “sex”-ual orientation not gender orientation. Because a gay man (probably) isn’t going to be attracted to a trans man who is pre-everything and still presenting as “female”. That person may be a man, but that doesn’t matter to a gay man’s orientation because what the gay man is attracted to is the appearance of maleness (i.e sex), not the gender of manhood in a vacuum. So I think that crucial bit is that while we like to say sex is about biology, it’s really not (at least entirely). Sex (as relevant to people’s actual lives) is really a social category. In this social sense, it’s not just about genitals or gametes, it’s about the overall appearance and expression that signifies the sort of human who would have those genitals or gametes (even if a given individual doesn’t). So when it comes to orientation labels, homosexual and heterosexual mean attraction to the same or opposite social sex respectively. And bisexual is not attraction to two or more genders, it’s attraction to both of the social sex categories.
I agree with you! I’d honestly be confused if a gay man DID find me attractive before any of my transition steps. After I’d been on T for a year or two though - long enough to have facial scruff, deep voice, male musculature/vascularity, and just generally look like a man - gay men became my biggest partner/dating pool. I’ve had no surgeries, so I understand and respect that gay men who really value an actual 🍆 aren’t going to be into me (actually, my own preference is very much that, as I don’t like toys). Ime there are two distinct types of attraction amongst gay men* I’ve met: those who are predominantly attracted to overall masculinity/secondary male sex characteristics (voice, hair, body shape, scent, etc), and those predominantly attracted to male primary sex characteristics (🍆🍒 lol). I’ve had zero trouble appealing to the former despite still having my original primary sex characteristics, and I’ve had zero LUCK (or desire to) appealing to the latter 😁 (* I don’t think this divide is specific to gay men, and probably applies to everyone. I identify as bi, and am slightly more attracted to men’s primary sex characteristics than secondary, while it’s the other way around for women - I’m attracted to their curves, softer skin, voices, etc, but not all that into actual V’s.
@@DannyD-lr5yg Yep. In fact, the most notorious example we see of the divide you're talking about is actually with straight men, since we all know about the huge cohort that are attracted mostly to female secondary sex characteristics and either don't care much about genitals, or are easily able to overlook non-standard ones, while there's still the larger(?) set of straight men that really do need those primary sex traits (although the popularity of trans women as a category on straight porn sites suggests that the former cohort might actually be much larger than we tend to think; maybe even the majority). And for those men, I think it makes more sense to say that they're attracted to the female social sex rather than the gender of woman, because like if a socially female person they were attracted to came out as non-binary, we wouldn't expect them to start identifying as bi or pan; they'd still just be straight!
If you are attracted to someone you are going to generally want to pleasure and be pleasured by that person regardless of what equipment they might or might not have. If you like each other you can make it work regardless of the tools each of you has at their disposal. While there are certainly people that might be afraid of interacting with a penis or vagina and be grossed out by the anatomy itself or have trauma, you can usually get over it if you focus on the person overall beyond just their genitals and focus on the pleasure of the experience of being societal judgment and making sure everything is clean to overcome any fears of hygiene or whatever it might be.
@@plastictouch6796 I kinda disagree. For example, I could never be with someone longterm who didn’t have a penis (women, trans men, trans women who’ve had bottom surgery, etc), or wasn’t interested or able to use it (trans women who haven’t had any surgery and thus still have penises, but who either don’t like to use them or whose hormone regimens affect their ability to get an erection, both of which are incredibly common; also, cis men who don’t enjoy using their penises or have very low sex drives, as well as trans men who’ve had bottom surgery that isn’t identical in form and function to a natal penis). It isn’t because of biases, or trauma, or an aversion to vaginas (after all, I myself have one). It also doesn’t diminish or trivialize my attraction to people, nor does it mean I’m reducing people to their genitals. It’s purely because I really enjoy penises, and because PIV sex is the number one way I feel deeply connected to a partner on a physical, emotional, and romantic. It’s okay to have preferences, and it’s ok to know yourself well.
you using the definition of a book to illustrate the transformation of sexuality descriptors was such a good example that i’ll be using in conversations with argumentative people at parties ;)
You guys need to understand that if your Bisexual you like both MEN and WOMEN... And if your Gay you like MEN. Now if your CISGENDER you identify as the sex/gender you were born as, born male identifies as male. If you are TRANSGENDER you identify as the gender you WERENT born as, born female, identifies as male. NO questions or bigotry this is how it is whether you like it or not. This should be enough for people to understand but if your bisexual you like both girls and boys, and if your gay you like strictly men. Ok now if a transman is a man, and you like him, your still gay. Your not all of a sudden bisexual because you don't like girls. I get not liking specific genitalia, so don't be sexually active with a pre-op trans person, and being fine with all doesn't make you automatically bisexual. For example, I'm fine with everyone genitals but I'm strictly a gay man, I'm only romantically and sexually attracted to men, trans or cis. Because they're men.
I wish @WednesdayEvans would just own his bisexuality. This rhetoric that gay men can be sexually attracted to the opposite sex is harmful. I honestly thought we progressed from gay conversion, yet here we have members of our own community trying to push it.
It's always great to hear about trans gay topics 💖 there is so little representation. That's why I didn't realize I was trans until I saw Gottmik on Drag Race 🤦♂️you're doing the Lord's work
To naively paint being gay as a “social label” when many have been (and continue to be in some countries now) “unalived” for who they are is so tone deaf and proof you will never understand what men deal with.
These people have to call everything a "social construct" to rationalise their delusions... Their rationale is "transmen are men therefore gay men must be attracted to them"
do you think trans men don't *also* get killed for who they are? also, if somebody sees a gay couple out in public and decides to murder them, they're not gonna ask "do you have a vagina" to each of them to figure out if it's actually heterosexual and therefore 'okay'.
My partner is a cis man and is 100% gay. I'm a transman. He sees me as a gay man and to him. He is disgusted by how cis gay men are so phallocentric and closed off to wanting to date a transman just because they were born with a different anatomy.
What no sense logic is that Gay man are not into different anatomy. There are no hormones or plastic surgery that can make not anything but phallocentric. If they are with a transman, they obviously are not gay.
It’s weird how that whole “it’s a spectrum” thing is tossed out to insist these men MUST be gay men. Let gay men be gay men. Let those in between be who they are. What happened to acceptance?
You do realize they’re just called gays (homosexual males) and the “umbrella term” is just used by toxic tumblr girls. You make it sound like it’s a social/cultural identity. Youre born gay. We’re not redefining it simply to fit someone’s fetish of gays.
I see no issue with acceptance in Arthur's video or the statement "Men who label themselves as gay, and are attracted to trans men, should still be considered gay". What is an issue with acceptance is if someone is externally *relabeling* someone as bisexual, and therefore not accepting the identity that person chose for themself. And most importantly, people who consider gay men attracted to trans men to be de facto bisexual, simply don't fully accept trans men as men. And I totally can understand why Arthur finds that worth addressing. That doesn't mean there aren't any bisexual men who are into both cis men and trans men or anybody else in the spectrum, but that is not the point of the video, if I understood correctly.
If you listened to the video you would've heard the issue at hand is "gay men are being told they are bisexual, because they're fucking trans men too." So if that's the issue : gay men being gay and randos telling them they're not gay, why are you here decrying "gay men just can't be gay anymore"? Topic of the video: gay men who fuck men are still gay Most cis gay men: I'm gay and I fuck men (including trans men) You: "WhY cAnT aNyOnE bE GaY AnYmOrE" Clown
The same people who screamed about orientation and identity being different now want to contradict themselves lmao. At the end of the day what does it matter if people don’t believe you? Call it whatever you want. We just don’t buy it.
So for people who where born with XX chromosomes and a penis are they male or female? Because based on chromosome sex they aren't. There are also people born XY with vaginas. Some of those are trans men. So would they still be male?
You do know that words don't have concrete meaning because they are something that humans invented right and lanaguge changes over time? Are you one of those conservatives that was upset when scientists claimed that pluto isn't a planet?
A book is something humans invented, so the concept of a book can be changed. The reason the imagined re definition of homosexuality/gay as same gender attraction isn't the same is that being gay is a sexual orientation
Is that not a social invention though? Did we not star the gay vs straight labels as a way to put people in certain boxes for various reasons? Either to find common interests, or to avoid unwanted interests, and so on. So it's not so crazy to redefine this as it gets discussed more openly. Also Gay means happy too, at some point its just words that end up being used for too many different reasons, good and bad.
Then in that case gay men & lesbians don't exist, if their existence relies on a social construct. This is why the gender movemt is so dangerous for same sex attraction and eh the LGB should separate ftom the TQ+
Spouse is straight het/cis- I came out as NB and he's no longer attracted to me. It's heartbreaking, but I weirdly find that gender affirming. I do think there's something to be said for genital preferences- but I think there's definitely way more to relationships vs hookups. idk Idk if my comment adds anything to the convo- but wanted to give you engagement/boost points to your channel.
@@PatricenotPatrick it is. As a gay man myself, I've frequently found trans men attractive. I've also found femme gay men attractive, masculine men attractive, etc. I've never found a butch lesbian, cis woman, or a gender affirming trans woman attractive.
@JAR-jy9fg I'm not bi, at least in the operative term. I'm gay. You line up 100 guys of different shapes and sizes and ill probably reject maybe 20 off hand, make do with 50, and try to date/marry the remainder. You line up 100 women porn stars, naked, and begging me to sleep with them and there's probably at MOST 5 that i'd be slightly interested. With trans guys, especially passing trans guys, i see them as a guy and if they match the features of the type of guy im typically attracted to, I'd be attracted to them.
I keep getting scared of things like dating simply because I'm a trans man (pre T, pre surgeries etc - I'm scared of both). I constantly feel scared of making other men uncomfortable because I lack certain parts that they have. For a while, I was hesitant to even call myself gay because I didn't feel I "deserved" to call myself that due to my lack of typycally male parts. I'm still struggling to let myself see sexuality as the spectrum that it is because I was always taught about it in a very rigid way and I was taught that sex was extremely important to a relationship, something I personally avoid and I was scared of making people uncomfortable with because, again, I lack the parts that most expect from a man. Now that I'm older though, I'm slowly learning that my boundaries are just as important as my (non-existent) partner's and that sexuality and relationships are more than just about sex etc. this video has helped ease my worries a lot more as well. Thank you and I hope you have a nice day :)
"For a while, I was hesitant to even call myself gay because I didn't feel I "deserved" to call myself that due to my lack of typycally male parts." Bro I feel this sm, even tho i'm on T and pass most of the time and so ;(
You missed the point entirely. I'm gay and I'm only attracted to masculine traits associated with men regardless of whether or not you're trans. A bisexual person is attracted to two or more genders.
@@judahmac1799 how is that any different than being a bisexual (attracted to both sexes) man who prefers men and masculinity? Like a bicurious gay man, if you will.
So many profiles on grindr are fake and people playing a game;you don't really know who you are communicating with, so very naive to cite messages on Grindr as evidence.
I am a gay man and I am attracted to cis and trans men. What you said makes no sense. It's like saying a gay man would want to date a trans woman just because she might have a penis. That doesn't happen. I don't care what genitals the men im attracted to have. Im attracted to the fact that they are men and present like men.
Also do you know of the history of people gay people who were forced to be in straight marriages and had children. Do they suddenly stop being gay because that happened?
@@kaymillerfromTXMy dude what are you talking about? Gay men who were forced to be in straight marriages and have children are still gay. While you are out here saying that men are gay because they have some fear of vaginas or something. Not only isnt that not true but you're the one being transphobic. You also have de-valued the gayness of gay men who also are attracted to Trans men because you yourself don't like Trans men. Definitions aren't based off of people you personally want to fuck.
@@kaymillerfromTXyou're out here acting like contemporary gays are forcing you to date trans men, meanwhile no trans man would want to date you. Problem solved.
The gay men who are dating trans men could technically be gay, but they wouldn’t be gold star gay if they were in the first place. Since we like the same parts, not someone who has different parts.
Are you... The last gay standing who uses those "gold star" terminology or are you a bot... Bc no one says that. And the origins and usage of this terminology is fundamentally misogynistic, so I mean you're wrong on a lot of levels..
@@ShouPow I personally don't care when people use terms like misogyny or the like. I means nothing to me. I'm basically just stating facts of one's experiences. Preferences are discriminatory by it's very nature. A true gay man has absolutely no interest in the opposite sex. If you find that you like men and women to some degree, then you are probably bisexual and their is nothing wrong with that. I proudly use the term gold star or anything related to it. People all over the world are pressure to enter into relationships that don't match their true orientation. As a result they end up hurting the people that they are suppose to love, given enough time.
@@peraman2022 okay thank you for your honesty and directness. That's unfortunate to hear you basically shut off, conversationally, when people bring up heavy, pervasive, quotidian topics like misogyny. I'm confused what you mean by "true" gay man. Like by whose standards? Bc I know we all have wayyy different standards.. so that feels a little moot to base your whole thing on some hypothetical concept of "the true gay man" when the gay experience is really based on personal and interpersonal relationships, not others' conception of us. So, at best, it's kinda sad you take pride in being a gold star gay, just like it was sad when I took pride in having girlfriends & eating pussy before I came out.
Technically isn’t it. Trans men are not less than. Men are men trans men are men. If a man likes another guy that’s gay. Golden little stars don’t matter same with the labels are bodies. Sexuality is a spectrum it doesn’t matter if someone is gay, bi, pan, straight etc they can like what they like. As long as they aren’t harming anything.
Someone liking quote on quote “parts” doesn’t determine someone’s sexuality. Physical attraction isn’t make it as a whole. People can also people can be spiritually, emotionally, mentally, and so much more finding attractive about someone
Yes. It confuses me. For 1 Trans Men are biological females and unless they have had phalloplasty they still have a vagina... So how would a man attracted to men (homosexual) be attracted to a person who looks like a man from the waist up but downstairs has a vagina?? Please explain to me... 🤷🏼♀️
Some people don't have genital preferences, which would be a huge reason in not wanting to date a transgender person. That doesn't automatically make them bisexual though. You're only bisexual if you like both women and men, and like me there are gay men who don't care about if a man has penis or vagina. But I'm not and probably never will be attracted to a woman. There are also gay men who aren't very interested in sex, so they would date anyone they're attracted too regardless if that person is trans or not because sex doesn't matter as much you know? anyways I hope this makes sense :)
@@WednesdayEvans everyone has genital preferences.. and a person is either a BOY or a GIRL what they're biological body shows. Nothing can ever change that. No amount of hormones. No amount of surgeries. A person is either XX OR XY. Female or Male. Myself? I'm a female that is bisexual. I prefer men over women but if I was to find the right woman I would be having a lesbian relationship. And when with a man I'm considered a heterosexual. Everyone has preferences.
@@Brwneydgrl69we literally cannot have this conversation productively if you aren’t open to the ideas of internal gender constructs being different from sex and biology
@@Brwneydgrl69because trans people don’t make sense through that worldview and logically shouldn’t exist lol (this way of looking at things is very exclusionary and doesn’t make much sense once you look at the bigger picture)
Have you thought about the social implications? You can play the language game all you want, but the issue is that people’s actions are influenced by past actions not words. If people were talking about a trans women and a straight men, the majority of people will argue that the the straight men is bisexual or at least a man with a fetish. This is part and parcel of dating with the increasingly visibility of trans. No straight women out of liberals and leftist would mess with a men who dated a transwomen. A trans men is different from a cis man. Just as a trans women is different from a cis women. To ignore how early socialization and biology is silly. Not only that would
@@kaymillerfromTX There is no lady in the video. You sound as disgusting as any Republican politician because you want to classify people by what's in their pants. Gross
You're literally exposing your personal prejudice against trans people by calling them a fetish. If you can't separate someone's identity from their sexuality, you probably shouldn't be postulating about sex & identity on the internet.
"You're too late." This is pretty much the crux of it, although the rest of the video is great, too. Sorry you're upset that some guy you don't even know is calling himself gay and sleeping with trans guys, Random Internet Weirdo™, but the only real option you have here is to cope, because strangely, that gay guy probably isn't going to change his whole identity just because a handful of terminally logged-on people don't like it.
“You’re too late”…for what? Gays are still gay. It’s about being part of the gay community. This person makes it very clear they’re desperately trying to redefine gay to be an “umbrella term”. They have this impression being gay isn’t something you’re born with but something you identify with as if it’s social/cuktural.
This is very interesting. And it made me think, since you're mentioning bisexual ppl too and talking about how 'gay' is a social category as well and how two guys whether one is trans or both or none function in the world as gay, it got me thinking about this thing that happens to bi ppl dating a person of their same gender and how they're assumed gay/lesbian... There's definitely a lot of nuance when it comes to gender and sexuality Btw, just found you today, very interesting content. Also, this comment wasn't trying to take over the trans and gay focus, it just got me thinking
Im a gay man myself and like, i like and have dated trans guys. Actually my first boyfriend was a trans guy, and even 5 years ago i was gay, my attraction or label haven’t changed. I’d like for this message to get out more but coming from me it’s kinda weird… i don’t want to objectify trans bodies in the process of just saying “for me it’s the gender that matters, but i can still love all types of bodies and their individual characteristics”. I love trans guys the same i like cis guys the same i like intersex guys the same i like nonbinary guys ETC ETC. It shouldn’t be such a big deal basically, liking everyone included in my attraction range doesn’t make me bisexual or str8…
Yes. And it’s wild how the ones saying sex and gender are different are now trying to redefine gay which means homosexual. All of a sudden it’s not a spectrum, these are “gay men” 🙄
It’s late and my brain’s offline lol - are you saying you’re a trans man/masc, and back when you were presenting as a girl you had weird situationships with gay guys? Cause if so, SAME lol. Back when I was living as a girl, I thought my “gaydar” was totally broken, bc so many of the guys I had crushes on ended up being gay lol. Little did any of us know that I’d be a dude 10 years later 😂 Even still, every so often, I’ll browse social media and find out yet another guy I thought was cute in youth group.. church choir.. etc, has come out as gay 🤣🤣
Idk man this topic is so strange because imo I do see you as a guy and will respect your pronouns and all but your boyfriend on the other hand yeah I don't think he is gay. I mean to be fair there are a bunch of bisexual guys nowadays that just call themselves gay because "men are easier", and when you look at their comments in like twitter etc... the way they talk about trans guy or their trans partner its the same way cis straight men talk about women😬.
Trans Masc pre med transition here. I'm attracted to cis men by and large but also masculine nonbinary people and fellow trans men/mascs. I prefer the term Androsexual instead of Bi or Gay. For one it can carry with me after I medically transition. I think it's a better term because it highlights the charactaristics I'm interested in not the sex organs which for me are secondary. I think a lot of people might actually gravitate towards this term if it were more well known but there is security in the "gay" identity because it is already established.
i honestly get so nervous about downloading grindr or putting that i'm trans on any dating apps because i think itll scare people off. do you or anyone know how i can deal with this fear?
A couple thoughts! The goal isn't to maximize the number of people who want us (despite what dating app culture might lead us to believe). If you want to go on a date next week, all that matters is one connection. If you had two hundred offers maybe that would be flattering, but it wouldn't actually help you towards your goal of a single date. And so whenever I wonder if my transness is turning people away I remind myself that I'm not trying to "win" dating or hookups and that I have more than enough people to chat with anyways (and almost surely that will be your situation - these apps are flooded with people!). I also think of putting my transness up front as just saving me hassle and emotions down the line. That way you know that every person you're talking with is cool with it and you won't have to worry.
Personally, I would rather "scare off" someone who's going to be shitty about my transness when they find out than get in too deep (LOL) with someone from Grindr or whatever and have to worry about how/when to disclose. In a dating context, it might be different, but on a hookup app, I feel like you may as well cut to the chase, as it were. That being said, I'm also intrigued but slightly terrified of Grindr, so....
My wife and I got married when I was still living as a woman. We were a lesbian couple. I have started transitioning, with the intent to take Testosterone and have top surgery. I don't have any bottom dysphoria. I identify as a trans man. She identifies as a lesbian. We are perfectly happy with our labels. I think some people forget that labels are broad and mean different things to different people.
Thank you for sharing your story! I wanted to make a comment on the video to the tune of "if the cis folk can't handle trans men being gay wait until they hear about lesbians & trans men.. make their little heads explode"
This video unlocked a memory of something I said to my mom and my friend when I was around 12yo and still thinking I'm a cis girl: "My future boyfriend will have to be bisexual so he'll like both my masculine and feminine traits" 💀 But right now, it really doesn't matter to me how my partner identifies or what exactly he finds attractive about me as long as he likes guys and sees me as a guy.
Stepping daintily over the transphobic comments to politely ask what was the card game you play on your laptop in the morning? It sounds like the same routine I have with my boyfriend :)
pretty privilege doing wonders here; i think the likeliness of how many cis gay men will approach us is directly correlated with how well we pass and how attractive we are. which is kind of a bummer in a way. its tough to navigate.
Ok well, but this is not a trans issue (besides passing, ofc). Idk if I'd even call this "pretty privilege". Ofc, people who are considered attractive by many people might find more people interested in them when they try to date. But that's the reality for everyone. Also, this doesn't only depend on specifically physical attractivity, but on other factors as well (even though physical attributes might play a big role in particularly dating apps).
As a cis gay man I agree with you gay man who like transmen are not bisexual and it's true it comes to physical appearance I find like guys and if you're a trans guy it wouldn't matter to me , I never been with a trans guy but your conservation on sex was very interesting I always think that if a trans guy is pre op with a vagina how that would work for me but I think I'm open to exploring how sex can be
Arthur: You are the happiest trans man on the Internet!! I am really, really, curious, how has your sexuality, and sex drive in particular, changed as a result of testosorone? Is it now seemingly as insatiable as it is for many younger guys? Does the sexual desire go in cycles OR is it more of a constant? I am really curious how that aspect of your life has changed POST transition.
I wonder if people who say this are (sexually) attracted only to genitals??.... Like....not to gender expression, fashion choices, appearances, traits of a person? Just. Genitals :D It's not really an argument, I am genuinely confused probably bc of being on ace spectrum and bi-curious :D How do they realize they wanna have sex with a person, ask them to show a pic of down parts? :D
As a cis gay guy I'm also very confused about the seemingly genital obsessed transphobic cis men. Like when I see a hot guy in life I think "wow he's so hot id love to fuck him": I don't need live confirmation of his penis, balls, or anus in-situ to be turned on. If I find a guy hot, and we both agree to do something I think we can all agree that's pretty fkn gay regardless of how we have sex, what body parts we use, or what we were like at birth.
@@CajunGators so you 1) can't reply to all the points 2) can't read (I'm cis) 3)can't support the queer community, tryna dehumanize us with generalizations and 4) are a loser bc trans men are men. You being a hurt POS on the internet doesn't devalidate trans folks and your sad, narrow-minded conception of your sexuality isn't most of our experience either. In a society striving for an expansive & welcoming community, you're still clawing at the dirt trying to find meaning in division.
@@ShouPow Never used the word universal once, I said guys do it all the time. Not even EVERY time. Y’all wanna be victims so bad you have to manipulate what people say… even when it’s in text. Lmfao. And yeah people definitely meet up without any pics exchanged… said some ladies.
Arthur, thanks for redirecting me to this video. I am attracted to men like yourself because when I see/hear you, I see/hear a man. So I’m definitely gay. When I saw your videos with photos of yourself before your top surgery/hormones, I was not physically attracted. I guess it really depends on how strongly people feel about the genitalia of their partners. I myself, have a very different mindset from most gay men(at least from what I’ve seen/read). If I’m with someone, I’m either a top, or a bottom, depending on if I feel more masculine or feminine with the person. I hate the idea of a “flip f*ck”. If I’m indulging in p*rn, I will click right off any flip videos. Because I personally am turned off, when the person who I deem to be more masculine, is the one doing the receiving. Obviously I’m not bothered by what others do, it’s just not my thing. I figured I’d mention it, because I feel like I’m alone in that particular thought process a lot of the time. And I feel like when I do decide to date, it will be a bit more challenging.
I have always been very gay (in my mind) but only began transition as a gay trans man. I was always read as the "fag hag" that ever quite belonged in any group of male friends. Now I am feeling better but my partner is straight so he is forced to examine if he is attracted to masculine women or if he can love a man. It is very difficult after 15 years of marriage. Ultimately, we have to break it down to chemistry and parts. Parts aren't always important because prosthetics and toys exist. You are right, straight people seem to not understand some couples are happy with side play or handjobs or whatever.
As a gay guy myself, I've often found found trans men attractive for the reasons you've listed here. Im attracted to the whole aesthetic. Although i do have a genital preference that might become an issue in a long term exclusive relationship with someone who's trans. I'm not completely against the idea, but it's something that'll need to be hashed out.
@@Dellennickolis95 I was in a hurry when I typed that out. What I'm saying is, if we mesh well and are genuinely attracted to each other, if I wanted the relationship to work, we would need to come to some understanding about my genital preference. Whether it be keeping the relationship open, him going through bottom surgery, or the relationship is so good, I'm willing to forgo my preference altogether.
Maybe gay vs bi vs straight should be less of a factor. Maybe it's more about being attracted to Masculinity or femininity, regardless of what your doing in the bedroom.
as a trans woman i think it makes them gay. wait that sounded perjorative...well u know what i mean, non perjoratively. may our non perjorativity reign.
I absolutely agree that liking trans men does not make a man bi. Gay is an exclusive label. My current model is that some using the G label are exclusive only regarding sex, some only regarding gender and some regarding both. All are valid. I quite agree with your most of your assertions. Where we part company is when you say you see no reason to make a category for being put off by the idea of something, as gay itself excludes as much as it includes. When I was socially active gay had two clear implications - no women and no heterosex. I never crossed either boundary and was never tempted to cross either. I think many gays accepted the SGE model as generally true and then found out they were really only GE after all. It probably makes more sense for SGE gays to identify under a subclass term. I cannot in good conscience call myself gay anymore with all the changes in usage - it's not just the T; the L and the B have had me looking for a new term far longer. I want to ally with trans gays and trans-attracted gays as far as I can but I cannot share your main label.
Hi Arthur how are things going for and your partner some people like to put labels on arter people wen i look at guys i see tham as men if i talk to a men i say hi i don't ask are you trains if someone say i am trains all i see is a man wen i was a little boy some people be came trains man no one care you keep it to yourself and did you and your partner have a good Thanksgiving you can ask me for my age my Thanksgiving was just me and my pet i have no family now by robert
It definitely reflects at least partially on what I experience as a medically transitioned trans woman. I went to a speed dating event that was queer-focused, and it was mostly cis women and afab enbies. Almost noone marked trans women on their list of acceptable genders - so in theory they should not be attracted to me, right? But I've had several, when talking to them IRL, tell me that they find me very beautiful. And I've rarely had sex with cis women, so I can't really tell what their broad opinions on actually sleeping with me would be, but like... I don't need to sleep with them because in our transfeminine circles the common trauma of touch starvation and the common understanding that medical transition is necessary due to the fact that the maleness of the self is considered a bad thing - as a result, we are attractive for each other and massively hook up with and date each other all the time. My own girlfriend is trans, and I definitely would not be attracted to her the way I am attracted to her if she was a guy. I cannot for the life of me top guys, but girls - any day.
i really resonate and agree with your mindset and i think you're 1000% right. btw loved the book comparison. and that you mentioned that there're some people who reject others bc of their d size cause it can really be like that sometimes i mean bottom growth=small pp u know😁 i'm really happy that a blogger like you exists bc you can educate people really well and without any negativity. im appalled that some people in the comments still didn't get you, lol. really appreciate your content tho!
Not trans, but I’m an intersex homoflexible man with female-presenting genitals. Personally I wouldn’t be able to date a pre-HRT trans boy because it just doesn’t sit right with what I’m attracted to. At best it feels like dating a woman, at worst it feels like I’m dating a teenage boy. I wish my brain didn’t see it that way and I have no qualms about the trans community and I respect their identities. But unfortunately, that’s the way my brain sees it and not dating them is my prerogative. Post-HRT is a maybe, but I really depends on his general disposition and how settled he is in himself. If his view of himself is essentially just a guy with a cervix then cool. We’re both fellas with cervixes in different ways. But what I’m not prepared to do is get invested in someone’s transgenderism because they scream it from the rooftops. I’m attracted to men, not trans people; If you identify as trans first and foremost and male second, I’m not interested.
