I've been cycling for 15 years with an old steel MTB...but only recently added a rack and panniers. My back (and backside) just couldn't take the heavy rucksacks of shopping anymore....especially when I hit bumps and potholes. Now I'm backpack free, carrying 3 times more, and able to go further without fatigue.
When I’m on the trail, frame bags. Around town, panniers. Nothing beats being able to unhook a couple of shopping baskets, my pannier backpack, in less than a minute and leave nothing behind but a locked bike. My bikepacking adventures tend to rough single track, so frame bags are really the only option for me. But I’d consider using panniers on a gravel/road touring trip.
Just from a totally different perspective, I use my Ortlieb panniers for both my motorcycle and bicycle. The motorcycle mount is 16mm tube and I use the Ortlieb reducers on the top latch to convert the 16mm for the motorcycle rack to the 10mm tube on the bicycle rack. It's great that I can use the same load setup for the dual sport motorcycle and camping that I use for bikecamping. It is for me the most versatile and efficient means of accommodating both my interests. For me, they're just so much more versatile than a frame back or a seat pack.
People claiming panniers are dead are the ones being misleaded by marketing, the bikepacking move is a new word for something that already existed. And don't forget both styles can be mixed
Having recently gotten back into biking, I picked up my first panniers. They are serving me brilliantly, leaving the car behind more and more. About all I need to carry on my commute, including shopping and other errands, are handled so nicely.
And I like it when, while waiting at a light on Rt. 30 in Central Pennsylvania, a few Harley baggers pull up alongside me. And I'm like, yeah, my bike with bags is a big dog, too.
Love my panniers, and love having the versatility of bikepacking bags to add with them. I'm one of those guys who bring way too much stuff so I can be comfortable when I'm off the bike and camping
Maybe I'm like that too. When I go camping (bicycle touring) I want to have everything I need with me. So I have panniers back and front, things packed on the racks (but on my back rack there's my doggie sitting in her basket) and a handle bar bag 😋
I love my panniers, and not just that but having my tail light attached to the back of the rack. It's always pointed the right way and don't have to worry about it flopping around.
Yer darn tootin' they're still relevant! It's downright weird the lengths people will go to avoid 'em. I depend on my Axiom Seymours for my daily commute; I don't see how you could carry that much stuff in a basket, frame bag, saddle bag, backpack(!), or rando bag. Certainly not for the price, as you said.
Panniers are still relevant. It's just that bikepacking bags can fulfill some non-bikepacking needs that previously would have required panniers / baskets. I'm glad we have more options.
You are so articulate. As well as come across so genuine. I don't comment on your channel too often but I watch your videos from time to time I am currently doing a miniature tour in Fort Myers Florida.
Racks are great in general. Single pannier for commuting, small trunk bag for day rides, all-of-the-above for overnight trips. Nothing dumber than a frame with no mount points.
I feel with the load being low, and balanced well, the panniers is better for extended touring. Around town it is hard to beat a Wald basket with a waterproof bag inside. Or pourter rack and bag. Add a tool roll under your saddle, good to go. For a day ride, I love my Carradice Nelson, and my grab bag. One thing is for sure, the bag sewing industry is always making great bags. It makes me smile!
Yes, I love my panniers that I use daily for commuting (usually only one at a time). It's important to me to be able to lock up my bike and remove the bag easily. They've revolutionised the way I use my bike and really make car-less life possible!
Yes I still use them (panniers) but the with the new bike packing systems it offers me an opportunity to consolidate my “junk” into smaller bags and forces me to take less crap on my tours. With 4 panniers, handle bar bag and rear rack I was often prone to hauling 25-30kg of gear on my 30+ day tours, all of which got utilized. Now I try and make due with 20-25 kg of gear with probably 12-15 litres less storage capacity. I’ve always found if you have the means to haul more stuff (ie; panniers, trailers) you’re bound to take the kitchen sink with you, learn to take less and make do.
I don't own a car. I do all my shopping, and a fair amount of recreation on my bicycle. I have Ortlieb roller back panniers. Nothing I have seen can replace them. I wouldn't want them on my bike all the time. Of course I can take them off in one second with the quick release handles.
You use whatever either suits your lifestyle or circumstances. I do a weekly family shopping using a trailer with up to 60kgs load. But if I get a bouquet of flowers or something else I need to carry seperately, I still always bring my panniers too so I can pop them in there safely. Oh and they're 20L folding pannier bags that hold double when opened up fully I bought in Lidl for I think it was €10(/-?) each about 4 years ago and still going strong. I always stick them on rolled up on the carrier just in case I need them even if I have no plans to actually use them when I set out. Better looking at them than looking for them! I ride a hybrid bike btw. Not a racer/road bike.
My Brompton is now my only bike, got rid of the rest of them due to lack of use. One of the reasons I love the Brompton so much is that I just slot the front mounted pannier on the block and go (even though Brompton don't call them a pannier, it's effectively what they are). For commuting on a full size, I can't imagine farting about with seat and frame bags is a worthwhile exercise - with a pannier (or Brompton bag), just sling stuff in, attach to bike, pedal, detach when you get there. Easy.
I'm a pannier fan for bikepacking. That new gear cost is real. And water. Out in the desert, you really have to give up space for your water. Put all your big, less dense stuff in the panniers and you can more easily carry your water.
Racks from Tubus (or Salsa, Surly, Nitto,...) and some Ortliebs (Ultimate Pro E - ouch, but the electric contacts are great) are also quite expensive. With bikepacking, you can leave away some of the racks. But I already have them, so one reason not to change ;-)
I'm in the pannier camp. I like to travel light, but comfortably. That means clean/dry clothes, shoes for off the bike, cooking gear, etc., even though I still call it bike packing. I just don't understand how one could possibly carry more than enough for a spartan overnight outing with the bikepacking setups I see. With that said, however, I'm drawn to gravel, so I've modified my Ortlieb City Rollers to include a more secure attachment to the rack than stock. It's not fun to bounce one of those suckers half-way off bombing down a hill.
I use the Topeak MTX DXP Trunk Bag. The panniers fold up into the sides of the bag when not needed for bike packing and give a very useful bag for everyday use. 👍🏻
I used to have the same model. But due to years of using it comes the wear & tear especially the zipper part. I had to give it up. And I ended up buying the Topeak Drybag Pannier (yellow one). Works great! 👍
For me the point you made about versatility is it for me. I can use my Ortlieb back roller classics for touring and for my work commutes. It is just so much easier to get a laptop, tablet, change of clothes, my lunch bag in one of those than any bikepacking bag.
When I bought my Kona Rove I bought a rear rack and an Arkel tail rider trunk bag. I feel like such a nerd riding around with it because most of the "cool kids" these days seem to use frame/seat bags. I generally only do day trips now but this spring/summer may try some overnighters. I'm thinking of getting some panniers now since you've convinced me they are more practical and not so nerdy. Cheers
I have been cycling for about 10 years and I just started using Panniers. I have used frame bags and a cargo trailer, the bags are light but have a low capacity, the trailer was very effective but a chore to install/remove trailer.... I just used Pannier bags from Ortlieb first time ever last night and I really appreciated the cargo capacity and ease of use
Cozy times with panniers. Sometimes it is hard to make a decision what to take or what to leave behind. Panniers will always be the no compromise-solution. Here in Germany as in other areas with a high variety you can leave your home at more than +30 degrees C not knowing if your sleepingbag will be encrusted with ice in the night when your sleeping on the mountains.
For longer tours, I run a framebag, stembags, handlebar roll, and yes... panniers. Of all the bags that live on my bike, my favorites are the stem bags, but right behind that, my Bedrock panniers. Love panniers, not dead by a long shot.
Thx for the video. Totaly agree panniers are still very relevant. And, I find them (5 in total, back, front and bar) super easy to pack and organize, spec on weeks + trip.
I commute with panniers because I haul too much stuff. But as a touring (gasp) roadie who doesn't haul a tent or cooking gear I love my "Bag of unusual size" - a Revelate Designs Viscacha seat bag that holds rain pants and a not-very-compressible rain jacket with room left over for my wife's stuff. So, I'm a fan of both. And some days a fan of a trailer. But always a fan of bicycles.
All The Bags!!! :D - We use panniers (or a Bob Trailer and drybag) when we are touring on the tandem. More volume, more flexible packing. Easier to divide things up into his/hers. - I tend to use bikepacking bags for solo trips as I'm taking less and I'm riding in more rugged terrain. - My latest build is going to use a front basket with a fitted drybag and a Fabio's Chest seatbag as it's luggage. I'll use this for my around town and quick/easy biketrail/in town camping and daytripping rig.
As someone who uses her bicycle as only means of transport I can not do without my panniers (I write it here in the original French way, pronounced as ' pah-nee-jay' . Here in the Netherlands we call them 'fietstassen ', meaning bicycle bags). They are large and heavy, but can carry a lot of groceries, or (when touring) my sleeping bag and all needed clothes. 🚲
They better not be dead, I just ordered a set of Ortlieb Back-Roller City Rear Panniers. They great thing about panniers is they are behind you, not constantly reminding you of the weight you are carrying
Fredrika Ek, a swedish girl who cycled around the world, noted in her book that she carried 28 liters of water on her bike when she crossed the Australian outback. Good luck doing that with bikepacking bags. I find bikepacking bags to be great for credit card touring and weekend trips, but for anything more advanced than that I want panniers.
5 лет назад
I lived on my bike for about five years and still go every year on a few 20-day+ treks. I use seven bags (4 rack panniers, handlebar bag, rack pack and saddle bag) when I need them. Everything attaches and detaches in seconds. All completely waterproof and apparently indestructible. I never ever bike with anything on my back but a shirt or a coat. I tried trailers, I tried backpacks (in 1986)… I honestly don't care if people bike one way or another, but I reserve the right to shake my head at the idea of putting all the weight of a traveling two-wheeler higher on the frame. That's just silly. If you want it easy, get an RV! :) At the start of my biggest bike adventure, which included the Alps, the Pyrénées and the Carpathians, several dudes argued violently against my choice of equipment, absolutely convinced that I should cycle with a fixie (they were all the rage back then). A fixie. Fully loaded. Up mountains. Aaaah well. I suppose those guys are still taking their 3000€ oval obedient cut drop down one-speed bikes for 3km evening strolls on flat urban pavement, connecting between trendy apartment and trendy watering hole. And I still carry my tiny world up and down the hills of my own chosen life. Peace to all! É.
My panniers mostly sit in a trunk. A big basket is almost always good enough for my around town missions, and I've gotten really used to going ultra-light for bike camping. Of course, the panniers will probably come out again when I start trying to bike camp with my little kids.
I never even owned a pan-yah but after rubix cubing my stuff into bags I’m a HUGE fan of a big stuffable pannier! The plus of bags is you learn to be a minimalist😜.
While touring I open/close my panniers at least 20 times a day. To store food after shopping, to grab something to eat, to take the stove out for lunch, to get a sweater or rain jacket and later store it again, to get the swimming shorts and towel and so on and on. On a bikepacking setup I am sure it would drive me nuts.
Never used panniers, and until recently my bikes didn't have real mounts for them. Yes, I know you can get racks that mount to the QR skewer and seat clamp, I just don't have one yet. I've ended up with a hybrid ish approach using a klick-fix rando ish bar bag, frame bag, top tube bag, and seat pack. It's served me pretty well for the riding I do, but there is absolutely no room for anything but the barest of necessities.
I ride Moulton bicycles (I have two) and so I never use panniers. With the Moulton you have a large rack on the rear on which you can put a large bag. However on a diamond framed bicycle panniers do make sense. Whatever bike you ride I think if you are going touring with a lot of stuff personally I think a trailer is better than panniers. I like two wheeled trailers as the bicycle feels so free, it is like there is no luggage much of the time.
I use at least one pan-yer every day. Just easier on and off. Camping I use a frame bag and dry bags strapped to my rack to separate gear. All depends on where I'm going and for how long.
I'm a big fan of panniers - and - my BOB Yak trailer. I'll continue to use them for different tours based on travel and need. Racks and panniers were great in Europe and I'll use the Yak on some regional trips soon. Great video!
Russ, you nailed it. My wife and I have been bikepacking for a few years. We’ve decided that for expedition trips, I can finally carry enough food by adding panniers into my configuration on the bike. We just finished riding the GDMBR across New Mexico. For 4-5 day carries of food, my life is so much better with the micro panniers I have from Bedrock Bags. That’s in addition to a frame bag, handlebar roll bag, 2 feed bags, a gas tank bag, and a seat pack. We travel really light but there’s limited volume for food and water in the bikepacking bags. Panniers ain’t dead for me!
Excellent, I’m glad you asked this question. I was beginning to think I was just an old fossil using pan-yers. I love them, both front and rear. I certainly like the minimalist direction of bike packing gear is driving, but I think pan-yers are easier to pack and unpack while providing the ability to better distribute weight and keep it low on the bike. IMHO the combination of the rack challenges on full suspension mountain bikes, the growth of 1-3 day off road touring vs. cross country sojourns and bike/gear manufactures desire to create a new market has driven the bikepacking bags growth. Its a win-win situation, more people doing bike adventures and better gear options to mix and match. front pan-yers, framebag, cockpit bag, rear pan-yers - what’s not to love?
Just got my full size frame bag yesterday, It fits my bike like It was custom made for It, looks amazing so i removed my tubus rack 😅 Not even 24 hours latter i realized all advantages panniers do have and all dissadvantages bikepacking bags do have.
I've had both types. In wind, panniers catch a lot of wind. But frame bags catch wind during side gusts! There will always be a place for both types I think. My panniers were great for grabbing some quick groceries, or commuting. Now I'm more of a sub24on sort of bike packer, so less gear (less weight) is my goal. Panniers aren't dead.
Bikepacking bags seem better for forest trails, where you probably want the agility of a lightweight and compact setup - but im a laid back guy who mostly travel on roads, and i also like to pack a little more than the "bare minimum", while still having room for enough food that i can take a break for a day or 3, if i want to go hiking in an area. So panniers covers my main needs, but i still use a frame bag and other small bags to keep stuff sorted and easy to reach - and they are of course really nice for daytrips :P
I just learned about panniers that attach more securely with stuff like velcro, and that are maybe a bit smaller. I will probably use them on my offroad touring rig when I get it. You get more volume, plus you can strap something to the top of the rack as well which will be waaay less wobbly than a seat bag.
For me and my 8yr old daughter we use a homecom trailer for camping and adventures we pack everything we need in there even Ower sevylor Rivera inflatable cannoe. Just one word of advice though for anyone using a bike trailer don't pack anything on top of the trailer it makes them very unstable a learnt that mistake my self on bumpy trailes. Take care, Liam. UK
Thank you for this topic, I'm gonna keep my panniers for now--- racks and panniers came with the used bike I bought -- found them perfect for two 12-packs of beer....
Great points. I agree, there are roles for each system. Right now “bikepacking” is all the rage, three years from now it will be something else. Having said this, I have used both systems and since I am primarily a mountain biker, soft, biker packing gear makes sense to me, though it will certainly make a minimalist out of me! Keep up the good work, much appreciated.
Panniers are easier to pack, if you ask me. I like the bikepacking concept-- being able to use whatever bike you like, carrying less stuff-- but those translate to panniers as well. I would also think if you were going on an extended tour (a month or two), having a bit more space for variable conditions gear (rain/cold weather gear, spare parts, whatever) would come in handy. Still, like anything else, ride what you enjoy! I mean, I saw a guy hauling an inflatable kayak once. I would consider that over-packing, but he seemed pretty sure he would need it.
I think bike packing is cool. Especially if you are going to be doing single track or lots of off roading. I will do some off roading, but stick mostly to paved roads, so i do prefer my classic 4 pannier set up. 2 front & back panniers from ortlieb. But I do use a frame bag & handle bar bag as well, so it’s a bit of a Frankenstein set up. It’s all good tho. Whatever works for you. There definitely is no right or wrong. And you learn what works best for you & how you when you get out there and ride. So giddy up!
I agree with everything you said except the last bit where you said you need panniers if your going over 3 days adventure .. i can carry 7 days food without pannier or backpack.. everything else you said was correct
It's all about terrain. Panniers are still king if you're on smooth gravel and pavement. When things get rough and you want to have a suspension fork or ride single track you need to start thinking about bike packing equipment.
Now I know you aren't actually talking about me (my surname is Panniers) but it is rather nice to pretend that you are, plus a lot of everything you say is so very true :D
I will say upfront that I am retired, and new to cycle touring. For beginners to touring, you can buy a cheap pannier bag and rack bag set up of 75L for USD 59 on Amazon, less than 1 buck per liter. Not everyone who buys gear is a seasoned bike tourer, and may only do a tour a couple of times. The money saved could be used for other gear that a newbie would need. Like tent, sleeping bag, stove etc. or even just more beer. If things get used a lot and wear out over time, then yes change up. Like any hobby, you can spend money on stuff that does not get used a lot, and after a couple of uses gets stored in a box in the garage, never to see the light of day again. I confess I have some items of bike luggage like that too. I have cheap (30 bucks) panniers, and have done a couple of tours. At the end of a the day they are just a bag. You can argue about waterproof vs non waterproof, and then use plastic bags to keep gear dry. You can pay a lot for extra features or utility that doesn't get used. I have dream panniers in mind, should I ever decide to do a long expedition. Most of us have the dreams, not many of us do the multi-month expedition though. I am a firm believer that unless you are doing extreme camping/cycling, you don't need extreme gear. If you buy budget cheaper gear (where appropriate) you can buy more toys for your money, and the one who has the most toys....wins.
I didn't know this was a question. I get a headache just looking at framebags. Barely looks like enough room for spare tire tubes and tools. Definitely not enough room for that plus my lock, plus my work clothes and lunch. Not to mention once a week when i bring home my towel.
agree with panniers - another advantage being they're relatively easy to swap between bikes - although some of the advantages identified are with being able to fasten outsized items to the rack itself. I personally ride with a small handlebar bag for tools etc and usually a single pannier - but I'm mostly making short journeys on a heavy roadster bicycle
Totally agree! I think people don't like bike racks therefore they want other solutions but nothing beats a high quality rack like Tubus and some waterproof panniers like Ortlieb or Vaude. For me they are also usable for everyday shopping trips, how much food can you stuff in a framebag? The whole idea with framebags counteract the go as you are and with the stuff you already have. But if you're new to biking, it's up to you to choose.
Bikepacking is a great way to adress real problems of panniers in a few given situations: mountain biking, light touring on road/carbon bikes on which racks are impossible to mount, fast longdistance races where aerodynamics really matters and a few others. But in general the combo racks + panniers is way more adequate and versatile for the reasons you mention in your video. Panniers have epitomized "old school touring" which has turned off roadies for many years. Most of them roadies just cannot contemplate the idea of using panniers for the only reason of self esteem so they have turned to bikepacking for getting into multiday biking trips. This stupid segragation will die out when makers of bikepacking gear will sell racks + panniers in a modernized style which will allow those who want to look cool to use them without looking like they've become "oldschool". It's started already. Mixing and matching bikepacking and panniers is a great way to adress any given person's particular needs.
panniers are much easier to take off the bike at the end of the day, or if you leave them on the bike when camping it is easier to access the contents of panniers. This is almost impossible with bike bags.
I carry my heavy locks a nd general stuff to places in panniers. Then I put shopping in my panniers. I used to use a big Crumpler messenger bag, big like a suitcase,. The trouble was that it put the weight on me, which pushed me down onto the saddle. Panniers put the weight on the bike.
I use drybags in combination with cargo cages and a Carradice saddlebag. For me the biggest problem with frame bags is they're too wide. I pedal knees in and find my legs rub against the frame bags which is super annoying when riding.
As a 5'1" rider I totally agree. I have frame bags, but they don't carry much. If I am going grocery shopping or taking clothes with me on a short ride, panniers are the best for me.
I’m on holiday with my German fiancé in Germany, and got an Ortlieb gravel kit, made up of a 9L handlebar roll and a pair of panniers sent to her parents while we were there!
