Auto Makers Attack Right-to-Repair - Ep. 7.138 

A lot of people watch you & you planted a seed in their mind today about Right to Repair. Thank you!

This is so true. My cousin farms & bought a brand new combine last fall. On day 2 of harvesting it quit! They run 24/7 during harvest. He called the help line & was told they'd send someone out NEXT WEEK!!! He told then no, you'll send someone to fix it in the next hour or they can come & pick up their junk & his lawyer will sue for loss. Then he went into town at 4am & bought another combine from a different manufacturer & he made the dealer pick up the broken combine & cancelled the sale. Farmers work against the weather. If the weather changes, in a natter of a few hours a seasons work can be lost. People don't understand this. Sometimes farmers make big money, & sometimes they lose big money. Their lively hood depends on equipment working properly all the time & their ability to repair it immediately on the spot.

*Those "billions invested" by manufacturers was mostly spent on lobbyists trying to defeat Right to Repair bills.* *Nice kick in their gonads, Massachusetts.* 👍

There are auctions for farm equipment where older tractors are selling for more than new because they can be fixed on-the-spot.

Automakers won't let others modify the software, and yet they won't commit to maintaining their software beyond 10 years.

This is just a way to prevent independent repairers from operating. It allows the manufacturers agents to charge exorbitant prices for parts and labour.

Being from Massachusetts and having voted for right to repair, I too will have my eye on this. Thanks Steve.

John Deere tractor company has been a big problem for farmers the last ten years to the point that some of the farmers have had to become hackers just to diagnose and fix their equipment.

I'm probably going off on a tangent but I'm a used car dealer and Manheim Auctions, the world's largest auction chain, will not allow dealers to bring code readers for OBD II into the sale anymore. Granted, there are sophisticated scanners that can be used to alter engine parameters, mixtures, and functions, but 99% of dealers just want to see if there are any pending trouble codes and if the readiness has been reset--for emissions testing purposes. So many dealers and large sellers simply clear codes before the car goes into the sale and hope that they stay cleared long enough for the car to be sold and not arbitrated. Seemingly, Manheim is implementing this policy in order to reduce the number of cars being arbitrated where the auction makes no fee from the seller AND the buyer. In my opinion, Manheim is aiding and abetting fraud. Getting back on point, I have followed the story of 'Right to Repair' and I think that manufacturers not allowing owners to work on their own equipment is decidedly un-American. There is no other way to put it.

I’m sure VW would have wished their diesel emissions software had stayed proprietary.

The American public is nothing more than a powerless lobbying group nowadays. We are not represented by anyone. Senators and House of reps have very little motivation to help us in any regard. We have proven we are disorganized complainers. they laugh at us while using our tax dollars to provide for themselves and the corporations who REALLY make policy.

Any company who opposes right to repair should be closed down immediately.

Steve. Yes cars have come a long way, but so have people. We have super computers on our hip capable of looking up any and all available materials on any possible subject. That's not even my issue. My issue is being able to fix my property how I choose. It's that simple. Corporate profits don't trump the right to personal property. Thanks for the content. This subject is important.

All codes and diagnostics should be displayed on the nice 12" center stack screen so the end user can diagnose, repair, and reset the computer systems on their car

I quit driving a truck for a living because of all the technology that is being installed on new trucks. Some of these systems are required by the government, and have not been thought out all the way and actually make the truck less safe.

I heard a long time ago that the reason they make things so difficult to repair is because an engineer came home to find his wife in bed with a mechanic.

Everything is turning into an Apple product and it pisses me off.

So basically they called Tim Cook up and asked how does Apple get away so easily with screwing their customers with 'no right to repair' my vastly overpriced product?

Cars have a lot of things today I don't want nor need.

You are correct on the farming analogy. Tractors not as bad as Combines because some dealers can get a "loaner" tractor out to you quickly, but there are not many "loaner" combines since the combine is a dedicated harvest machine. Having a good dealer you can trust is key with the newer AG and construction equipment. Rebuilding and repowering older equipment is common now for farm and construction. Often you will see some older equipment on the farm or contractor lot which is not often used but they keep it around to have something dependable to fill in when the modern stuff breaks and they need to get work done. Lots of older tractors still in operating condition because of this problem. Lots of older skid steers, excavators, loaders, and dozers for the same reasons. The older stuff is often not as capable or efficient as the modern equipment, but the owners know they can keep it running when they need it.

Resting software to factory settings is only hard if the manufacturer wants it to be hard.

Steve, That is why I have a 1970 Chevy Pick-up. If it won't run, there are only three things to check. It is not getting gas. It is not getting fire. The timing is off. Nice and simple. No sensors, No computers.

Why would I want to take to dealer when aftermarket parts cost less and last longer in most cases I have found. My new car brakes wore out in 22000km, aftermarket have 65000km and still not worn out. Yes they also perform better.

I'm not a PRO. mechanic, but have worked on everything from lawnmowers to heavy equipment, and I can tell you the complexity of everything is now over the top!! But I still work on everything I can and work around all the bullshit that cars and other machines are loaded with. We haven't bought a new car in 8 years, but brought the car back to the dealer for minor routine maintenance during the warranty period. Got decent deals on oil changes, brakes etc. But since the warranty expired, all bets are off, so I either do the work required myself or take it to an independent shop that doesn't charge dealer labor rates. So far, no computer problems, but that can be a nightmare if they act up. And if you lose your "smart key" or fob, that can cost hundreds of dollars to replace. Locksmiths charge less, but is still expensive!! If you're good with your hands there is still alot you can repair on your own car. If something trips you up on the electronic side of things, get a decent scan tool and check out a website called "alldata". Big help! And, if you get a "check engine" light but everything seems fine, could be something really minor like a loose gas cap. So check that first. Or just take it to an auto parts store like Autozone and they'll hook up a scan tool to tell you what the problem is. Then you take it from there. Everything today is a scam! Everything from working on your car to our elections are all rigged to screw the average person out of something, and force you to comply with some extreme or ridiculous rule, law or agenda. My philosophy is there is always a "work around", and if you're resourceful enough, you will find it. As for cars, the car maker that goes backward a bit and builds a simple, reliable, car that doesn't cost THOUSANDS of dollars that will last for years if you take care of it, and is repairable by the average guy, would be great!!! I don't need or want power windows, locks, seats, mirrors, back up cameras, navigation systems, self parking features, power trunk realeases, seat warmers, a turbo charged 500 horse power engine, electronic suspension adjustment, all wheel drive and ten on board computers to control all of it!!! Eventually even the cheapest cars will cost as much as a house. Some high end models today already do, and that's insane!!! But people like their luxury so there will always be a market for the rich. And that's fine. I don't live in that world. But a car is a labor saving device, much like a washing machine or a vacuum cleaner, when you get right down to it. It gets you from here to there, hauls people and things and is supposed to make life easier. But when the labor saving device that's supposed to make life better actually makes life more problematic, then the whole thing has to be re-thought. A car and the problems it creates shouldn't be first and foremost on anyone's mind. And farm equipment!! Don't get me started!

I would think that big companies like Napa, AutoZone and advanced auto would be lobbying against this. It would put all of them out of business.

Like JinzoDefiler says, Louis Rossmann has a lot of deep knowledge on this. it's been a creeping reduction of the ability to fix your own equipment or have it fixed by the person you want. Even the ANSI people should be against proprietary tools and equipment that keeps someone out of his or her own products. But it's really becoming a _huge_ problem lately.

I worked a few summers on a small farm. The farmer had one new-ish tractor that could handle the biggest machinery he had to hook up to it and the rest was all hooked up to old 1950s to 1980s tractors that he could keep alive himself. Since they were much cheaper he could have plenty of them which meant we could have a few of them going doing different tasks during harvest seasons and wouldn't have to switch machinery between tractors nearly as often.

Guess I’ll have to purchase my next tractor in Massachusetts.

the tractor warranty repair problem reminds me of the problems lehto has mentioned in the past about RV warranty repairs. - stand in line and take a number, we'll get to you when we get to you.

"Push auto repair fixes over the air" The 1980s me: "Flying cars! In 2020 we get flying cars! Gonna be the best year ever!"

If they can fix it remotely then they can also break it remotely.

Any mechanic here wrenching back in the 1980's can tell you every Chrysler engine with a knock in the overhead cam was due to cheap non factory oil filters with defective anti drain back valves. So there are problems with MM Act... Today, oil grades are required for various engines and putting the wrong oil in it can cause severe damage. The big issue I have besides the battle for repair data is anti theft methods that make key cutting and adding remotes a strictly an OEM thing. Or cost prohibitive aftermarket thing. Sometimes between same makes / models but different trim levels you may or may not require a visit to the dealer... Phone dongles/scanners may give you some insight but a professional level tool is usually required to really fix the car. A lot of these issues are being driven by gov regulation and emissions control requirements.

Hi Steve, great video & content. Just wish to pass on something I learned approx year 1969, just out of high school, Long Island, N.Y. working at a local autobody shop. That was run by a Man, who born and raised in the State of Tennessee, on a farm. His words: Farming is the only business that you purchase *RETAIL & SELL WHOLESALE.* Fast forward, 1978-79 Move to the State of Washington, living for the first time in my life, in a farming community. Boy did those words come to haunt me. Even today 2020, yes the farmer's can join a co-op to purchase say seed and some other small items, but basically still true for the farmer's.

3 months ago the neighbor lady ran away with a tractor salesman. The husband today got a john deere letter in the mail.

For years John Deere used proprietary hydraulic fittings and a brand specific hydraulic fluid. Each available only from John Deere. Each substantially more expensive than the going market pricing. This was a contributing factor in our purchase of International Farmall tractors.

"Nothing Breaks Like a Deere!"

Appreciated your recent discussion with Rossman, Steve, you're a machine. Think you scared him a little, you're a consumer advocate, focused on making manufacturers doing right by the consumer. He's a repair guy focused on fixing things the consumers need fixed outside traditional channels ie: apple store (mostly, apple tries to screw everyone eventually, because of the closed distribution channel, consumers have no choice.) There used to be tv vcr hifi repair shops all over the country because the stuff louis wants available for a price, was available, for a price. Please reach out to him again, right to repair means different things to different people, he's a good guy, think you overwhelmed him, you ABSOLUTE legend.

The real issue is the fact software companies can demand anything, the end user has no choice. There needs to be limitations and regulation on software companies to curb the greed and price gouging they are permitting to achieve.

Me and a friend have noticed and are amazed how much used construction equipment, tractors and other farm implements have risen in prices of the older machines without all the computerized crap on them. Apparently we are not the only ones buying them.

Auto makers are NOT winning this one. At least not in Massachusetts.

"You think cars are expensive? Price out farm equipment." Oh dear god, yes!!! I imagine the most basic farm tractor now runs about mid-six figures.

My old school tractors and trucks are much better built than the newer stuff. One tell tale feature is that the older equipment has greasable joints. Good Luck, Rick

All my tractors are over 15 years old and I've gutted all the electronics and switched everything to mechanical gages and switches. Screw that nonsense with a simple diesel engine needing a computer.

Steve, I appreciate you covering right-to-repair work. It's been a while since I'd heard anything about it. I remember when my state of Nebraska was considering this in the unicameral and it was shot down. John Deere and associated groups flat-out said in the hearings that if we passed the law they would do no more business in Nebraska. The farmers came into the equation on their end because they can't have John Deere leave the state. It's like battered woman syndrome. We live about 40 miles from the nearest dealership. During harvest season you'll see the dealership's pickups out on the fields as if they were the farmers' overseers. Every time the slightest thing breaks the farmers have to sit there like they're playing a game of freeze-tag with the combine. They call the dealership and the dealership sends their pickup over from the neighbor's place to plug their computer in and find out what the problem is. If it's big enough, the farmers have to wait until someone else can drive the parts up from town. The same John Deere dealership owns just about every single location in the state. It's the "Plains Equipment Group" from here to Omaha. I live four hours from Omaha if you drive 80 miles an hour. You can't tell me this isn't just a perpetuation of the exact kind of monopoly the Clayton Antitrust Act was targeting. Don't get me wrong, I love big business-- it makes products cheaper for everyone, but when you have to rely on the business more than your own family just to get simple things fixed, it's time to do something about it. And so what if these statutes create cyber-security risks? The equipment doesn't have to be that complicated in the first place. Maybe these initiatives will give manufacturers more incentive to make products that are less complicated and expensive. It's the same problem with the fed's rules on semi trucks: the older ones are worth more money because they have less regulatory baggage tied to them.

You own the car, we own the technology that makes it run.

That's why I like my 59 Chevy truck so much. It's reliable, easy to maintain, and easy to repair when needed, and I can fix it myself without a computer or high dollar tools and equipment. I also don't have to worry about anyone wanting to steal it since very few people would know how to drive it, if they could figure out how to start it.

I am a maintenance manager for a large corporation and what pisses me off more than anything is an OEM that takes a standard, off the shelf item and modifies is slightly to make it a proprietary spare part that you can only get from them at their price. For example, they will take a standard size bearing and alter it slightly. Like grinding the diameter down .005" and making the bearing pocket in the machine the same size so that you cannot fit the standard bearing into the machine. That $10 bearing from Grainger is now a custom OEM part that cost $145.

At work we had a Mercedes Sprinter which had a broken seatbelt (the short female side). We ordered the part, which was available from the dealer. The plan was to install it in our own facility (maintaining over 400 vehicles). The dealer explained that we could buy the part, however if we installed it, the vehicle would be rendered inoperable and would have needed a tow down to the dealership anyways.

The aircraft industry has been this way for what nearly a 100yrs. I’m surprised the auto industry hasn’t regulated maintenance under the guise of safety years ago.

I am a master dealer technician that has been working for a company that has had remote data for many years and I have one very very important question. Why is not one single person talking about the real truth behind this bill? Despite what this bill claims this is not, I say again, NOT about right to repair. As someone who has had access to remote vehicle data for years I can say with absolute certainty that the data that is transmitted back to the manufacturer is 100% available to anyone, ANYONE with access to the vehicle’s OBD2 port. Allowing everyone to access this data remotely does not it any way increase right to repair. However what it will do is decrease the security of vehicles that rely on secure connections for their data. This is done this way because as modern vehicles become more and more advanced and autonomous their data needs to be secured to prevent bad actors from getting into the vehicle and in a worst case potentially seizing control of the autonomous systems and in a best case scenario using the data to track you. I don’t like the fact that this data is already available to manufacturers but at least it’s only available to manufacturers. Now you want to open it up to every single technician or independent or owner?! You might as well just give away the password to your home WIFI network and let anyone who passes by get on it and do whatever they want. Yes the ads from the manufacturers used scare tactics and that was dumb but the issues of data security are very real. Again this data is already available at the OBD2 port to anyone who buys a cheap data reader but at least that port is behind locked doors. Why everyone wants this data basically made public is beyond me and honestly quite scary.

not surprised. For many many years, dealers have been claiming that non-dealer oil changes would violate warranty, and such nonsense.

The manufactures freaked out that if someone tinkers with the car someone crashes and dies the lawyers sue the deep pockets auto manufacturers.

Last week an Amish carriage pulled by a beautiful horse trotted by my house. Hearing these issues make me think they have the right idea about transportation!

Electronics companies like Apple has been waging this war too. I hear this fight has also been going on in hospitals too.

Scary stuff. Because of the DMCA, manufacturers are putting chips into components that don't require them, just so they can use the DCMA to prevent you from working on it, or purchasing generic parts. I replaced an ABS control unit on my truck. Had to take it to the dealer for them to "program" it. I know one tech personally and was told they charged me just to hook it up to a machine a clear the trouble light. Although I have my own diagnostic equipment, if the component serial number doesn't match, it triggers a trouble light. After learning a bit more about how this particular code was stored, its a straight money maker for the dealership. Taking this to the extreme, how many people would buy shoes if when the laces broke or heels wore out, you had to send them in to be "serviced". Love your videos. Always something new.

If my FIL had one of the newer John Deere tractors (his tractors are 1950-73), he would need to travel about 60 miles for service. While JD used to have three dealerships within 20 miles, they have all shut down or have converted to garden service. It is not practical to run to the dealership when there is a problem.

It's not just warranties at issue. It's accessibility of parts and information. I can go to a dozen places to buy an oil filter for my car from any of a dozen manufacturers. Well, I can for older cars. If an IC chip on my phone burns out, or there is a software glitch in my tractor, or something like, the manufacturers and sellers have been working HARD to make getting those parts, the information on how to repair, and the data to reset things software-based, is impossible to get legally. - I voted yes on that initiative, and I explained it to my friends who were exposed to the "Someone will get your information from your car and rape and murder you!" ads, and THEY voted yes on the initiative. - And why is there even all that supposedly "sensitive" data stored in the car? It doesn't need to be there, except for the auto makers to find ways to profit.

Please do keep an eye on this topic. It is more important than most people realize.

Years ago, here in California, the state government started pushing for OBD II ( Onboarded Diagnostics Two ). As technicians, we didn't want the state being involved in anything. In point of fact, the head of standards, and training was a college classmate of mine. He was not trained as an engineer, but the state of California gave him the official title of engineer. He was in fact trained as a High School wood shop teacher, with zero background in anything related to automotive technology. The first conflict I had with him, was with the proprietary new connecter to be used with the purposed new OBDII system. I wanted a standard 28 pin connector, such as commonly used on computers to be used, as the last thing the world needs is another connector, when there are so many already in use. He absolutely refused, citing the need for more pins, and a connecter that couldn't be hacked !!! His proposed connecter, had fewer than 28 pins, and was immediately hacked. I followed him through our 3o plus years of career, and always challenged his every BS proposal, based upon his lack of technical expertise. I managed to defeat him several times, because he would always push Snap On tools diagnostic equipment, some of which was clearly inferior to other equipment on the market, and always overpriced. He quickly ended all public input meetings, to prevent me from cutting into his kick back scheme with Snap on tool company. I always loved facing off against him in public input meetings, because I always came prepared with diagnostic models, and was able to demonstrate, even to non technical folks that his proposed mandatory equipment requirements were un necessary, and that proper education, and training were what was needed, not more gadgetry !!! The whole of California's automotive emissions control laws are rife with fraud, and misinformation. Not just because of an incompetent wood shop teacher pretending to be an automotive engineer. One former head of the Bureau of Automotive repair, was trained as a Psychologist, and had spent his entire working career as a printer, while another former head repeatedly presented himself as an Attorney at Law, when he held no such credentials. When I brought this up in a public information meeting, he wouldn't answer, and became extremely up set. Apparently he knew in advance that I would challenge him, and he was so frightened that he had several members of the California Highway Patrol ( California State Marshals ) accompany him to the meeting here in Fresno. Shortly after my peaceful, and verbal only, confrontation he resigned to avoid further embarrassment. Northing proprietary is going to be any good for any consumer. Being able to innovate, and compete in a rising technological market place will serve to promote excellence, and reduce consumer costs through open competition. I remember when GM, Ford, and Chrysler thought they had the lock on the Automotive Market Place in the United States. We can clearly see what happened to them. Without government protections of their outdated technology, and sloppy engineering and technology, the Japanese, and others quickly eclipsed the automotive market with quality products at a reasonable price, not to mention better fuel efficiency, and lower maintenance costs. The Japanese, and others are already coming for the agricultural, and heavy equipment market. American Manufactures of all kinds need to wake up and smell the coffee. We are about to be beaten again, by our own ignorance, and arrogance !!! Tim

Another thing about the time-sensitivity of agriculture: Farmers don't just say, "Today is the day I wish to harvest my crops, and if I have to wait a week it will simply be inconvenient." No, they have to deal with critical time constraints outside of their control, like THE WEATHER. Some crops must be harvested only while the weather is dry, and some crops must SIT OUT AND DRY after being cut before it's collected or else they will quickly rot in storage. Sometimes the harvest needs to get done ahead of an approaching storm or the seasonal freeze which will DESTROY the crops. Plus, most large scale agriculture occurs VERY FAR from dealerships and "authorized repair shops," so that even if the repair shop isn't delayed with multiple repair jobs, it can take hours for a technician to be dispatched and arrive on site, or if the machine has to be hauled into town just getting to the shop can be an entire day wasted.

encrypting diagnostica data, had some fords that required odd sockets to remove some nuts/bolts that were not standard, had to buy 2 of the sockets from ford for nearly $90 each

We had a "Mag-Moss" class in our dealership chain, so that we'd not get into any trouble.

A lot of big tech names came to Nebraska in 2017 to scare us away from passing a similar law.

Honestly I get auto makers want to make sure that people arent going into the PCM after buying a new vehicle and boosting the power to insane levels to make massive power and then blowing up an engine and claiming warranty on it. The problem I have though is that even to get codes, the auto makers have gone as far as adding codes that just dont relate to anything to frustrate people who go and buy a code reader so they can figure out what is going on with their vehicle. Not to mention automakers have gone as far as to make sure the check engine light comes on when an oil change is close to being required and won't go out till the engine oil change has been reset, but it is causing people to believe there is something way more serious going on and they go to a shop or a dealer. Auto makers have long ago gone to great lengths to making cars more and more difficult for the average person to repair, some vehicle these days to even bleed the brakes require a scan toll to command the car to bleed the brakes because it cant be don manually. These days Automakers are going to great lengths to make you go to the dealer from limiting parts to dealer only to codes to proprietary screws and bolts that are tamper proof or next to impossible to find at your local auto parts store. I get there are some things that dealers need to restrict, but there is way way too much they are restricting people from doing these days even when it comes to maintenance and repair

It strikes me that used car buyers never agreed to the terms the manufacturer imposed upon the original new car buyer. They need to be unbridled in this way. Not everyone is wealthy and able to afford the dealer repair prices which are almost universally agreed upon to be price inflated.

Hey Steve, Substitute the word auto with iPhone, or iMac, or MacBook and you have the exact same argument. Also, further to what you stated about the tractors. Think a bit more. How far away is the dealership for these tractors from the farms? How much in pure logistical cost to the farmer to simply get the tractor to and from the dealerships? $6000 ? $8000 just to pickup and deliver round trip some of these tractors are MASSIVE. You are exactly right about many of them are looking at older products pre-locked down computers. You ever watch Goldrush? a year or 2 ago they had a new water pump, it kept tripping codes and shutting off. Think how much $$ it cost them in down time and potential lost gold recovery due to lack of proper water. It could not be fixed even after acquiring the very costly and complex software diagnostic program. Their solution in the end was to remove the computer control section all together thus passing the flaky sensors. After they did, it ran 100% without any further issues. The costs to the operation were if I recall, well over 2 if not close to 3 times the cost of the pump and software, and training course for the mobile mechanic that was on staff. Pioneer pumps I think is the brand. Great video. It's no wonder that Warren Buffet invested in JD around the time years ago that they started down this path of only the dealer can repair.... Follow the $$$ always!

Automakers are screwing you. I'm a repair shop owner. The multiple modules are a web inside your car. We are nearly locked out. 15,000+ for full access. Programming is necessary from time to time. But software owns all their intellectual property. They want to create a series of trouble lights that exhaust car owners. Que "planned obsolescence" built to glitch. And you just go get another lemon car.

My Honda dealer has put on my work order that if I do not have their repairs done by them, they will not honor my warranty. The problem is nothing is wrong with my vehicle, just ways to get more money out of the owners. I feel sorry for citizens who trust their dealers and they are taken for possible not needed repairs. As a mechanic who as built many vehicle, I know when they are trying to blow smoke up my ---.

The big issue right now is Alldata. You have to pay PER car for the in-depth info to fix the cars! It is some outrageous amount!

My father had a tractor in for service took them over 3 months to repair. He had to go buy another tractor or he would have missed the cutting season. A bit of financial hardship for him but when you have to work do then no choice.

Nebraska and Montana are also having "right to repair" laws working their way through their respective Legislatures.

My Dad was a mechanic & taught me how to service & repair my cars & trucks. I've taken vehicles to a dealership & they don't do the work they're told to & still charge for it. I'd rather fix my own car & know its done right than pay big bucks for someone that hasn't got time to do the job right.

Last week, I did 3 repairs to my car. I diagnosed one problem by using a code scanner and a cellphone app. The dealership, one mile down the street is probably sad that I saved about $1000. Springfield, Massachusetts.

I’m waiting on right to repair our own wheelchairs I made an adjustment to a seat on my Pride mobility chair my warranty was denied for faulty electronics.

This is exactly why I bought a 1966 Chevy Belair for a daily driver. I kept having electrical failures on my vehicles that took forever to diagnose and repair myself. Keep in mind I’m trained on modern cars but the equipment to read a computer to the level one occasionally has to is still super cost prohibitive. A $34 scanner will read about all the codes but it won’t read what we call live data. In fact I spent 10 times that just to be able to read data on a 95 trans am I had because I couldn’t even go to a dealership or a regular shop to get codes read simply because it used what I call OBD1.5 obd2 took over in 96 and in 95 on that car they used elements of it and the same port as obd2 but the problem is it’s different enough that a normal scanner couldn’t read it properly. My 2007 Colorado was expensive to repair and my 04 envoy just about broke me. Before that I had a Honda Civic and same thing when something did break it was so expensive that it could take me two or 3 weeks to have enough money to fix it then there was still the time it took to actually do it. With this Belair it’s very different in a matter of hours I can have it back on the road with relative ease other than the wait on parts it doesn’t take any major time to do anything. I can have the engine in an out in a a day if I need to

This makes me think of two things with the local dealer and my moms car. My mom lives on the coast and there is no dealer for her car close by so she has to take it inland to where I live for repair. It is a 2 hour drive. My father passed away in 2017 and my mom knows nothing about cars. She takes her car to the dealership for every service and follows the dealer warranty and service recommendations. Well two events have happened in the last year and both have her and I just mad as heck. 1. Her vehicle has a CVS transmission. She received a notice from the manufacturer that stated the warranty was extended on the transmission to 5 years. Now the original warranty was for 5 years, so she assumed this meant her warranty on the car was extended from date of purchase. The vehicle was purchased used from the dealer in 2017 just months before dad died. Anyway the CVS transmission failed and needed to be replaced. We took it in to be repaired and she thought it was still under warranty, but they said no because the warranty started when the car was manufactured and didn't apply to the date of purchase. She showed them the paper stating the warranty was extended for 5 years and they said that was from manufacturer date and that the 5 year warranty had expired 3 months ago. She was out the entire cost of a new transmission. I called the local transmission specialist to see what it would cost to repair and was told that they didn't work on CVS transmissions, nor could they rebuild them. They would have to buy it from the dealership and then install it. I got the same answer from my favorite mechanic in town. Ended up having the dealer do the work since it was already there and the price elsewhere was pretty much the same. The fact that the CVS transmission is not a piece of the car that anyone, including the dealership, can work on, and that the entire transmission had to be replaced 5 years after purchase, just screamed at me, this is a scam. 2. Same car, same dealer. Mom received a recall notice about a faulty airbag. She contacted the dealer who didn't have the parts. Months later she was told they could now repair the car, but she had to make the appointment right now before they ran out of parts again, so she made an appointment and brought the car in. Remember 2 hour drive. They had us bring it in and we waited in the showroom for a few hours for them to "fix" the airbag. Then went home. Now while driving back home she noticed that the airbag sensor light in the dash was on. She called the dealer about it and they told her to bring the car back in. So now she had to drive 2 hours back to have them check the sensor. They found that the plug under the seat was unplugged and charged her $170 to plug it back in. She asked if it could have been unplugged while they performed the airbag fix recall. They said no since that was in a different part of the car. They said she probably unplugged it herself shoving something under the seat. She never shoves stuff under her seat, but does have a small dog in the car. Anyway, they said, "No we didn't unplug the airbag while working on the airbag, wasn't us. Now pay us $170." Sound fishy to anyone?

They really want to bleed you dry taking every penny they can. And the farmers still wear the hats and t-shirts advertising their support for the companies that hold them hostage. Please, if you support the right to repair, hide the manufacturers advertising. Don't buy the green hats or the key chains, cover the nameplates and model numbers embossed on the side of the hood and tell your representatives that you want to be able to afford the equipment you own.

I'm a software engineer and I know that lots of the software in modern cars is free software (free as in free to modify and change, not free as in no money). So Teslas are based on Linux and loads of other free software projects. So the locking down of that software is, at the very least, rude. If you're bored and want to learn what happens when geeks hack law, look up the GNU General Public License.

My mid-80s Chevrolet had a big 32 pin connector beneath the steering column. I always paid extra money to get the real GM shop manual, so I could short pin 1 and pin 32 together with a jumper, and the check engine light would flash code. With the table in the shop manual, I was able to get the messages, almost all related to the Mass Airflow Sensor. I went to the parts desk at a dealer and asked for one. I was asked how I diagnosed the problem, and I simply said "I'm getting these codes" without mentioning HOW I got those codes. I was sold the part, installed it, and after a short drive, I had no more codes. I drove that car until I got hit from behind for the third time and my auto-body man said that repairing it again wouldn't result in a car strong enough to withstand a fourth collision.

Im all for Right to Repair. People *should* have complete control over the product they purchased. However, with that control, comes responsibility. Some consumers *will* exercise that right and damage and/or destroy their product. The warrantor needs to be able to shield themselves from that.

In 1974 I bought a Texas Instruments SR-51 for $150. That is roughly equivalent to $792 in today's dollars. Today I can buy a scientific calculator with all the functions of the SR-51 for about $19 on Amazon. That is roughly equivalent to $3.60 in 1974 dollars. If car manufacturers and farm equipment manufacturers share information with customers and with parts manufacturers and testing equipment manufacturers, then it won't be long before they will not be able to charge customers $700 for a $3 part. A $150 to $300 per hour shop rate might be cut by competition. I don't blame them for wanting to keep secrets. P.S. Even among farm equipment manufacturers, John Deere really loves it's stuff.

You know the evolution of automobiles has gone too far when cyber security enters the conversation.

This is why I refuse to belong to an HOA!

I see two sides here, yeah, somebody is messing with your car's brakes who doesn't know what he's doing, he 'fixes' it, and then you have an accident due to brake problems and some lawyer sues the car company for the brake problem. My take, you mess with it, you take responsibility. Other side, particularly farm equipment, when something breaks or doesn't work, you need to get it fixed pronto or maybe the whole factory or farm closes down until, furthermore and I've had this happen, "so you're on the highway and have a flat tire, yeah we got an opening next week to fix that, just get a tow truck and have them drop it here". A tow truck for a $250,000 farm combine is a flatbed trailer and if you live in Iowa the dealer might be 100 miles down the road so you're looking a a $500 bill each way just to get the damned thing to the dealer. Dealers are often rather pricey in repair costs and many make far more on repairing equipment than on selling it. The worst issue is serialization, each part has a number that is registered in the car's computer and let's say you have a fender bender and the body guy replaces it with an identical fender in perfect condition from a junked car and then tries to start the car and gets a computer message 'unauthorized fender attached, will not start', some computer makers are doing this now. I hereby nominate Louis Rossmann for the Nobel Prize in consumer protection.

'Future Steve' ha, love it. Man, younger Steve should be impressed that he became a self made man (not in the mafia sense). Darn it, if I had to bring back my previous Ford to the dealer to get it fixed every time it had a hissy fit I would have junked it 6 years ago. Its still running like a train apparently. Much more green to keep old cars running as long as possible. Yes there's a time to let them go, but much better to ring every last mile before they head for the "back roads in the sky". Also people need to be incentivized to want to keep things going for longer- disposable/planned obsolescence products (looking at you HP printers ...) cost a heap in terms of natural resources. Anyhoo ramble over, great show, thanks again.

Also, on the tractor topic - if a farmer must send his/her tractor to the dealership, they need to trailer that tractor to the dealers location - which may cost over a $1,000 per round trip! Only to have that tractor sit at the dealership for a week or two until it is looked at! Versus having the diagnostic SW at the farm to determine the issue and resolve it at the farm’s location!

Simple fix! Make the DEALER and MANUFACTURER financially responsible for losses from failures of equipment they don't allow you to repair. CHOICE is good!

I big activist on the right to repair is on the RU-vid channel Rich Rebuilds. This guy has taken flood salvaged Tesla’s and rebuilt from the ground up. But he has ran into multiple headaches on getting replacement parts from Tesla and being allowed to have the ability to recharge and even drive the car. Tesla is a huge obstacle. This guy is extremely smart when it comes to these kinds of cars and has even started his own repair shop for EV’s. If you haven’t checked him out yet, it’s definitely worth your time.

In 1973 auto manufactures were banned from using whale oil in it’s paint. The first year of two the hood would start to rust. The factory rep said the owner should have kept the car waxed. The auto manufactures did eventually fix the problem a few years later but would no cover the affected cars under warranty. I was a service manager back then and took care of the painting myself.

Same thing happening with lawn tractors sold by the dealership. To preserve the warranty you MUST use their parts. And if there is a problem, the lawn tractor must be taken back to the dealer to unlock the computer preventing the tractor from starting and read the code that caused the computer to prevent the tractor from starting. Which ends up a simple sensor malfunctioning.

My gut says they are going to be able to block the law. Then will this right to repair turn to antitrust litigation? It seems they are actively trying to shut everyone one for no legitimate reason.

I remember when cars were sold with a roll of tools in the trunk. The fancier ones even had spark plug sockets, a gaping tool and file for the points, a distributor wrench for timing, brake shoe wrenches and small screwdrivers for the floats and jets on the carburetor. I have rebuilt and modified engines, transmissions, differentials, changed brakes, repaired, rebuilt, and restored everything on cars. I know how to align wheels, change and pack bearings, change the tire on a rim, repair wiring, gages and lights, troubleshoot just about anything, and not rely on a mechanic. I currently own and use OBD diagnostics and computer software on my modern truck in conjunction with technical manuals and things like fuel injection, the onboard computer, and sensors hold no mysteries to me. I'll be damned if I'm going to let car manufacturers monopolize service and maintenance when I can still do it myself.

My neighbors run a small farming business. They always buy used John Deere tractors, implements, and work on them their selves. They have about four hundred acres around the county. Just this year they replaced a 24 year old combine with. 15 year old one. They had found their newer one several states over. They paid $35,000 for the newer one. Each member of the family plays important role to keep the farm successful, but it’s still a difficult dealing with weather, break downs. . I’m always amazed at their abilities. Great subject.

What people need to realize with the farmers - their machinery is so large - to get it to a "dealer" - is a massive undertaking. To put a tractor on a 18 wheeler and take it to a dealer could be a few hundred mile journey. These farmers spend a half million dollars on a tractor and John Deere is being ridiculous. Either repair their tractors remotely like Tesla, or send technicians out. I get why farmers want to work on their own machinery or have competent repairmen do the work.

every part for the product should be available at a cost of no more than 4 times the cost to the manufacturer. the manufacture buys it for $10, doubled the costs to $20 to the dealer, the dealer cannot do more than double that cost. that goes for cell phone batteries, screens, transmissions, harvest equipment, etc.

Stop buying stuff that can't be home repaired folks. It's been going on for a long time, my dad and some of my uncles worked at BTH making light bulbs. One uncle had the job of testing bulbs from a batch, if they lasted too long the whole batch was smashed. There is more profit in selling a new one rather than a reliable one. All domestic appliances are the same. A friend of mine is still using a 40 year old refrigerator, they don't make them like that anymore. It's built in obsolescence.

Wireless repairs (as you termed it) to a vehicle could only fix software based (rare) anomalies, and wireless security patches (since alot of vehicles broadcast wireless access). It does not repair a bad running engine. What limited access does do is, prevent 3rd party repair shops from ACCESS to and DIAGNOSES of operational data, which helps track down the source of a problem. Though there are plenty of repair shops that don't have the OEM test equipment but rely on experience and 3rd party help to get the job done. If we prevent vehicle repair shops from repairs or operational data, where does the scope of this idea stop? No longer can consumers or repair shops repair anything that wasn't manufactured or sold by them. Ridiculous.

A big example of this was here in Michigan. Company in Auburn Hills was taking Fisker Cars (when they were out of business several years ago) and putting Corvette Engines in. Problem was, all the controls and emission programs associated with the engines were the property of GM. To gain access, first GM had to decide if they were worthy and then of course there was oversight and a charge.

Even the idea that a bad sensor can cause a vehicle to be inoperable is an affront to humanity. Automotive manufacturers should be fined for every occurrence.

OBD readers are not on the same planet as diagnostic equipment or software. These machines can cost thousands. When a dealer quotes $500 for brake repairs but your local mechanic charges $150 how do they justify the extra cost? They don't make the brake parts. If its o/e approved then offer better prices