Bad Atmos!! Is a 5.1.2 Dolby Atmos Setup any Good? 

Actually, you're SLIGHTLY wrong on the way this gets folded down with Atmos. Basically, it's a range limitation based on the number of speakers you have. I'll try to explain: First, let's compare 5.1 to 7.1 in an Atmos context, setting aside the heights for now. The Atmos decoder sees the front soundstage as 0.0 on the longitudinal, with your REARMOST speaker pair as 1.0. So with 7.1 (the ideal), your rear surrounds represent the coordinates furthest back in the room. Accordingly, static objects placed at rear surround play back in the rear surrounds, side surround position in the side surrounds, etc. Now, compare that to how it deals with 5.1. In this case, the SIDE surrounds will be the range limitation, meaning they are the "1.0" coordinate. Here's why that's important: Because of the way this works, static objects for rear surround are now played through the side surrounds. BUT... static objects for the side surrounds are now no longer played back just by the side surrounds, but instead imaged between each side surround and its adjacent main. To clarify, a left side surround object in a 5.1.x Atmos layout will be played back by both the left main and left side surround so that it images between them. This is why 5.1.x layouts tend to have the side surrounds a bit further back than where they would be in a 7.1.x layout. Now that you've wrapped your head around that, let's consider the heights. The same range limitation issue applies. So in a bone stock x.x.4 layout, the decoder considers the front heights (whether in front height or top front position) to be the 0.0 coordinate and the rear heights (whether rear height or top rear) to be the 1.0 coordinate longitudinally. Note: This is only for objects AT THE MAX Z coordinate of 1.0. So on the Z axis, ear-level channels are 0.0 and heights are 1.0. Now let's consider what the range is with a x.x.2 layout. Basically, as there are not two pairs of speakers for it to set this range between, any object at max Z will be played back solely by the 2 heights at top mid. It doesn't matter what their longitudinal coordinate is... The entire longitudinal range from 0.0-1.0 is represented by those two speakers AND ONLY THOSE TWO SPEAKERS when at max Z. Static objects at max Z in the top rear position will play back identically to static objects at max Z in the top front position. So in a static 7.1.2 mix (as many are, sadly), a 5.1.2 layout will play the heights at top mid, rear surround at side surround, and side surround a bit forward of side surround by using the mains. You can confirm this using Dolby's 7.1.x test tones on a 5.1.x layout. Where things get interesting for a 5.1.2 layout is for any DYNAMIC objects below max Z. So let's say you have an object placed directly above the expected left side surround position at 0.5 on the Z axis. On a 7.1.2 setup, this would be played back half by the left side surround and half by the left top mid. On a 5.1.2 layout, however, the side surround position is represented between the physical side surround and the front soundstage... so this same object at 0.5 on the Z axis would basically be played 50% in the left top mid, about 30% in the left side surround and about 20% in the left main (because if I recall correctly, "side surround" expected position is at 0.6 longitudinally, in line with the "reference listening position" of the theatrical layout). So the weakness of a 5.1.2 layout really only occurs with objects that are at max Z, as you will have no longitudinal movement for objects at max Z. Dynamic objects otherwise that are between 0.0 and 1.0 on the Z axis get adequate representation by steering using the adjacent channels. The side surrounds don't necessarily "do the duty of three speakers" as you're saying. But they do get used to help steer any rearward sounds that AREN'T at max Z. The mix doesn't have to be optimized between the layouts... but they do CHECK the mix on the lower speaker counts to make sure the general effect is still there and tweak object placements if needed. What does this all mean? If you are doing a 5.1.2 layout in your room, make sure you don't put the side surrounds at the 90 degree position they would be in a 7.1.x layout. Put them at the 110-120 degree range so that the rear max range is actually behind you slightly. Then your "side surrounds" will image between the physical side surrounds and mains so that the image is closer to the 90 degree placement in a 7.1.x layout.

Isn't Atmos an object based system? I understood that the mixing engineers put the objects in 3D space. They don't need too worry about the speaker setup like they did in the old days The processor decides how to interpret that for your particular speaker configuration. This whole concept of the mixing engineer "optimizing" for a particular arrangement of speakers is the old way of doing things in a channel based system. Seems like the people doing the optimizing should be the processor software engineers. Likely a combination of Dolby, DSP company, and sound united engineers.

I started with a 5.2.2 with rear height. A year later I added 2 front height and the difference was astonishingly better & I thought it sounded great before. Soon I'll be upgrading to a 7.4.4 & I can't wait!

When I went 5.1 to 5.1.2, it was significantly better in terms of immersive feels. I haven't tried x.x.4 before but 5.1.2, to me is definitely worth the upgrade from 5.1 if that is all you can manage

My favorite atmos movie is still A Quiet Place. The Atmos and LFE are off the chart 🔊🔊🔊🔊

I've got a 5.1.2 with Polks and a Sony STRDN1080. I love it! Usually the sound just comes across blended everywhere nicely, with moments that are clearly overhead. When watching 5.1 tracks I really notice the difference as it sounds more in front of me than enveloping me. Super happy with upgrading my receiver and adding ceiling speakers.

The referrence home setup for atmos is 7.1.4 when it first came out. It may have changed. While I certainly agree that a 5.1.4 will sound slightly better than a 5.1.2, you cannot leave the side surrounds at ear level with a 5.1.2. You will have to raise the surrounds slightly above your main listening postion and slightly behind to create a better transition of sound.

I just went from a 5.1.2 to 5.1.4. The difference is really amazing. I've also been mainly listening with Auro 3d (on your suggestion) and it just makes everything I watch that much better. Thanks for the tip buddy!

I just have standard 5.1 at the moment, but I feel the optimal placement for 5.1.2 would be center height speakers. Having the 2 heights only in the front or rear seems like they would unbalance the sound field like you describe in the video at 7:30

My goal is to get a 7.1.4 setup. I have just a 5.1 setup and I feel like there are massive holes in my sound. One day. One day. Happy New Year!

As several people have pointed out, the sounds-tied-to-channel mixing doesn't apply to Atmos, as it is object based and the engineers mix using spatial placement rather than sound panning. What I'd add is this is why it is important to design your setup specific to your listening space. I have a similar space to what you described you have. I live in an apartment, which presented multiple obstacles. I have limited space, so my sofa is almost against the wall, with about 9 feet of space between the entertainment center and the sofa. I also have textured ceilings that prevent effective use of up-firing modules, and I couldn't install speakers on the ceiling or run wires in the ceiling or walls. My solution is very much like yours, I have a 5.1.4 system, with height speakers and surrounds mounted to the walls and wires ran using cable concealer tracks. When I installed my speakers, I did a LOT of testing. I tested multiple placement positions and angles before I mounted everything. It took me two weeks to decide on what sounded best. My space is far from ideal, but with my installation it sounds as good as I believe it possibly can, given my resources and space limitations. I've turned off my rear height speakers to see what it sounded like, and while it is different, it isn't a jarring difference. My surround placement is optimized more for general directional sound rather than point source, and that alleviates some of those "panning" issues you described. My advice to anyone setting up an Atmos system is research, test, and be patient. You'll find what is right for your unique space.

I've got a 5.1.2 and even though I don't have rear highs I hear things that should be in the rear high channels and it sounds higher than the speakers themselves so the effect works. I also hear things pan through the rear as it would with 7 channels. I really think it depends on what speakers you have. If you can localize your speakers than it's going to sound disconnected.

The more speakers you have to mix for, obviously you’ll get a more immersive experience but your processor plays a very large part. I have a 5.1.2 with the surrounds (floor) behind at 45 degree to listening position and my Atmos are 15 degrees forward of listening position above on the ceiling. I’m perfectly happy with my set up, it’s great and matches the space/layout.

I have noticed this as well. It also depends on what you tell your receiver you have as far as where your Atmos speakers are and even what movie you play. I have a Denon AVR 3700H running a 7.2.4. My Atmos speakers are set up to where the layout really is front ceiling speakers and rear height speakers Because of where they are located in my room. So I have two different presets for Audyssey But I have saved three different presets in the Audyssey app. One that has them set as 4 high channels. One that has them set up as 4 top/ceiling channels. And one that has them set up as 2 top/ceiling fronts And 2 rear heights. When playing my 4K disc of No Time To Die I get different sound coming out of those channels depending on which preset I use or upload. In the scene where Bond and Paloma are talking in the Spector club with on the earpieces if I run the front And rear height channels the dialogue clearly comes out of all 4 channels. But in the same scene using the preset as 4 top/ceiling channels The dialogue only comes out of the front ceiling channels and not the rear. Same thing goes for the other preset where I have Front ceiling/top and rear height. It only comes out of the front Atmos channels. This doesn’t make any sense to me that the preset with all 4 height channels actually sounds better. Some Atmos mixed movies sound better in the different presets and some sound exactly the same and it doesn’t make a difference. One would think that having them as all ceiling channels would be optimal but that’s definitely not the case. Sometimes having them is all Heights sound much better and more dynamic. It can be frustrating. I usually just leave them on the height preset as opposed to the top/ceiling preset because it seems to be more consistent. Anyone else experienced this or test this? I don’t think it has anything to do with the Denon receiver. I think it has to do with how the Atmos is mixed. Another example is the last mission impossible movie on 4K DVD. The helicopter scene towards the end. No matter which preset I use it sounds amazing with the helicopter blades going overhead etc. but it sounds the same no matter which preset I use.

Happy new year! Definitely noticed a difference from hen I had my 5.1.2 and switched over to 7.1.4. It whould be awsome if on the 4k disk description it say mixed on certain amount if channels.

Techno Dad, I discovered in a sound test with two receivers and I found that if you set the speakers to "front height" or "top front" the sound is as you said but if you set it to "top middle" the sound of the height front and height rear are heard in the "top middle" do the test.

I have a 5.1.2 setup with the atmos speakers only in the rear. I don't know if that is supposed to be terrible, but I think it still sounds great. Better then my old 5.1.0, it has a lot more seperation.

I don't have the same setup but this really helped with my 5.2.4 setup with front heights and rear heights. I've now changed the rear heights to surround rears (7.2.2) and getting a much better experience! Thank you for your content. First time listening and got some whopper advice!

So glad I have a 5.1.4 set up, don't have the space for 7 ear level speakers. All Kef baby!!

I recently went from 5.2.4 to 7.2.4 just before thanksgiving. I have noticed a significant difference. Movies that I thought sounded great sound significantly better. There sound that we’re going to my back that never were supposed to. I can imagine X.2.2 would have the same advantages of upgrading to X.2.4

7.1.2 I’ve added Dolby atmos speakers and I notice a big difference from the sound bar I had before. I now have 2 bookshelf front speakers 2 Atmos . Center channel and 2 rear surround speakers and subwoofer.

if you do not have a dedicated room set up for HT, the secret is to use omnidirectional speakers for front and rear, then tone match a center or get a center you like, throw in 2 subs for even bass and call it a day. point is not be able to pick out your speaker when you hear a sound. its about being able to hear the sound between 2 speakers.

Have 5.1.4. setup nowhere near perfect bcs my room layout is crazy. But still enjoying it alot :D

This is exactly what I was thinking and experiencing when I had two heights. Keep throwing it down CD! Hope all is well. Happy new year.

I think the proper placement for surround speakers in a 5.1 system according to dolby's recommendation is not at ear level, but 3 feet above ear level. Perhaps when you add two atmos speakers in order to have a 5.1.2 system you should leave the surrounds 3 feet above ear level.

I’ve spent so much money on my current setup, I don’t plan on upgrading for a while. I’m currently using a 5.2.2 set up.

Quite an interesting topic Chana.. No one has ever done such a video.. 👍

At 7:30 you said "since you only have TWO height channels, the sound is gonna go from up top here and then immediately" go right behind your head. Well, my setup has Dolby Atmos and DTS:X processing and is 7.3.0 (no height speakers), so I can't test this myself, but whether what you said is true or not probably depends on whether those two height channels are configured as top-middle, top-front, or top-rear. If they're configured as top-front, then you're probably correct. If they're configured as top-middle, then you *might* be correct, but you might be wrong. If they're configured as top-rear, then you're *probably* wrong. I assume that when you did your comparison testing, you left all four ceiling speakers in their positions, and did nothing but turn the back ceiling speakers on and off, and left the front ceiling speakers configured as top-front. Ideally, you'd have done this comparison with top-middle speakers installed in the top-middle location. It probably would not be practical for you (or most people) to move the top-front speakers to the top-middle position to repeat that test, and the next best thing would be for you to repeat the test with the top-front speakers configured as top-middle and the top-rear speakers as off, and compare that experience with 5.1.4. It wouldn't be a perfect test, of course, but in my opinion, it's worth doing.

Cool video man! In my tv room I have a 5.1.2 setup. My Pioneer Elite AVR is 9 channel. I am going to add rear heights and check it out! I have 300 and Midway on 4K disc. Let the games begin!

Yeah my rear surrounds process a lot of sound. Only have two heights up front. Luckily my rear surrounds are higher than they should be so is somewhat okay.

Wow TD, this is a great addition to your videos... all new info that we never really considered or think about when we judge how the sound is distributed in certain movies. But now, I totally understand why my side surrounds are so active in my 5.1.2 set-up (.2 as front heights). Because they are receiving so much information to deliver, meaning sound going towards the back or up above Atmos-wise, and what their supposed to be doing themselves!. I have my surrounds placed off to the side like yourself, because no placement possibility behind me. My side surrounds seem more active than my front L & R in some movies, but now I understand why. Thanks again for sharing this incite, none of your good RU-vid colleagues ever touched this subject so far. Good job!

I have the denon s960h receiver with 5.1.2 set up! And I did notice the same thing but my rear channels are higher than my listening level. Because of the brackets I used to hold my monster rear klipsch speakers I had to put them slightly higher so for me it works! Eventually I will upgrade my receiver to 7.2.4 but gotta wait until I sell my house and move. I enjoy my setup now it works for my livingroom and the first time I heard this new setup it blow My mind.. so I can only imagine adding more speakers to the mix...

You are so cool. You are so helpful and I always learn so much from you. Keep doing what you’re doing bro.

Great video brother, and definitely a great topic to cover.

In my movie room i have a 5.2.2 and my dad has a 5.2.4 and I can clearly hear a difference. So if you can afford it go for the bigger setup. Btw great video👌🏽

Hi Channa. Greetings from Australia.🇦🇺 I'd like to say that I thoroughly enjoy your channel. 👏👏 Thanks for enlightening me on your experience with a 5.1.2 mix. Interesting. It would be nice if we could have spec specific mixes but as you mentioned it's not going to happen. 💲💲 I have 5.1.2 with ear level surrounds and Dolby spec heights, ( front speaker width just in front of MLP, ) set to top front height in my Marantz NR1711. I have been pleased with the result ie much more immersive than 5.1. but as you have mentioned in previous videos missing the movement 5.1.4 provides. Bloody shame about the quality of many home theatre Dolby Atmos mixes. I have found using upmixers eg DTS Neural to provide a better result than poor native Doby Atmos mixes. Thx again for you helpful and informative content. Take care. 👍🍻

I'm rocking 7.2.2. LCR then 4 Klipsch surround speakers. the RP 502s as my side and rear speakers. then i have 2 RP 500SA Elevation speakers. next I'm getting the SPL 150 (15 INCH) SUBS the thing i love about PETER JACKSON is he is involved with every aspect of his movies from cameras to CGI to prosthetics to sound i mean everything.

It's called downmixing. This isn't new it's what receivers have always done when playing multichannel content to stereo or 6.1/7.1 to 5.1. This will continue to be a thing as all systems are different. Let's be realistic, a 5.1.2 would be amazing for 90% of folks as most people tend to go with soundbars. Just do the best you can with the space and budget you have and just have fun. ✌🏼

In my case, my surrounds are in the ceiling. And not at your level so that effect of dropping behind you does not occur.

5.1.2 is not bad. It all depends on the space available. Realistically if you can afford it and have the space you want to have at least 5.1.4 for a fuller hight experience but 5.1.2 set up is where most people start and is good enough for people who don't know much about audio. The reason you are probably noticing such a big difference is because of the surround back speakers. In a 5.1.2 your surround speakers are usually designated as side surrounds and there are no back channels so alot of audio drops off in the back end of a 5.1.2 set up. By adding surround backs and rear heights you are widening the rear sound stage dramatically and will obviously hear much more going on behind and above you because of it.

As usual Techno Dad is on his game. Thanks Technodad!!

Chana, u make me feel like I am wasting money.... Perhaps I should just buy books and e-books and read more. The 'cinematic' feel in my head is always like pure gold... happy new year!

The number of speakers in a room is a function of the size of the room - not budget or quality. You could pack a bunch of speakers in a tiny room, but you’ll do more harm than good. Four height channels are really for rooms that are 18’ or longer/deeper and have multiple rows of seating. Thats what I’ve heard/read from pro av installers. There was an avs thread about it that linked to a great video of installers talking about their experiences installing many setups and what they found successful. My dealer installer convinced me not to run a 7.2.4 setup in my room that’s only 13.5’ deep. Instead went with a 4.1.2 and it images beautifully. Every room is different and everyone has different preferences though!

Hey Techno Dad since your back wall is right at your seating postion try placing your rear L&R speakers flush against the wall and pointed at the ceiling. you might find that you dont need the over head rear speakers. just remember to adjust the settings and add some dbs to the rear to match the dbs of the fronts if not a little louder.

I watched your explanation of Atmos sound in different configuration and your analysis make total sense and spot on. I didn’t consider the possibility of Bad Atmos until your explanation. Thanks for sharing. With that said, you just destroyed the concept of of why the best sound bars with Atmos will not cut it for audiophiles. However, some sound are good for limited space setup.

I’ve been running 5.2.4 for going on 7 years now and it works great

It's the receivers job to decode the information and place the audio. When you're mixing in 3D (or in any format for that matter) the meta data is always the same, no matter the set up. So the amount of monitors being used by the Mix engineer doesn't matter to you. Of course if you have more speakers it will make a difference for you, but how it's translated on your set up is directly controlled by the decoder on your hardware anyway. If your receiver allows you to define where your speakers are placed within the software it can make the difference. Is 5.1.2 worth it? Hell yea, I enjoy my set-up and I still get more dimension to what I'm watching and playing. Could it be handled better? Of course. That being said, in my personal opinion if you're only running 5.1.2 with top fronts for Atmos, it should be a blend of the backs and tops for rear overheads. But I'm just an Audio Engineer... what do I know about sound.. looking at you Onkyo...

Good stuff bro

In my humble experience I noticed major differences in sound when going from using book shelf speakers as rears to specifically designed and dedicated rear speakers , I also noticed a huge difference when using actual in ceiling speakers instead of ceiling mounted book shelf speakers but more than anything adding an extra subwoofer really improved the sound affects as well in the room . My basic advice would be to use a speaker system designed to be used as a system - I use a monitor audio full system in 5.2.2 configuration using full in-ceiling 8” 280 idc units with the height channels set as per the manufacturers guidelines for height and distance and the package is phenomenal for both music and film . I would say I’m often disappointed with some atmos tracks on dvds and do feel it appears atmos isn’t being supported by companies as much as it should . Possibly because atmos isn’t being used as much in homes as predicted.

I finally got rid of my 12 years old 7.1 setup. I recently bought Marantz Cinema 50 and rocking 7.2.4 what a difference. 👍

Gotta ask where you got that shirt? Its amazing

If you only have 2 ch for overhead, they should be center ceiling. If you have 4, they should be front and rear. If you have 6, they should be front, center, back. That’s how it’s constructed. With that said, if the mixer puts the plane in the bed, and not as an object when he makes the flyby, then yes, the plane will drop behind your head. The whole idea with atmos is that it’s scalable, but you still need to give the system a fair chance to scale in the right way, buy putting speakers at their designated locations. If you do, it should give an immersive experience every time. Just better the more speakers you have.

Thank you for sharing this experience. I was curious about this and you answered those questions.

I just purchased an Onkyo TX Nr 7100 and I'm going to go with a 5.1.4 height setup. I can't wait...

I'm still stuck at 5.1 lol... Why I'm watching videos like this one before I upgrade. Thanks for the vid.

How well speakers sounstage, and room acoustics/ shape, makes as big a diferenc in the emersive experience as the number of speakers does. This is one reason we will see varying opinions on the subject.

I switched my rear surrounds to rear high channels. Just changed the settings. 7.2.2 switched to 5.2.4. Way better

Channa, Another issue is the Dolby Surround Upmixer firmware in each brand and series of AVR or processor. Surely they are all different. My thought of Atmos mixing is that there should be only one spacial dome for "audio objects" and the "audio objects" simply move to where the mixing engineer sent them. If you don't have those speakers - well you are just SOL in hearing those sounds and their placements, leaving "holes" in the playback. Since the AVR firmware AI adjusts the sounds and their placement to "it's liking" it is very unlikely that any AVR or processor will accurately place those sounds where the engineer put them no matter what your X.Y.Z set-up/format is. It would be interesting to find out which AVR/processor actually reproduces the audio only as recorded/placed by the engineer. Just my $0.02. Take care and I hope you have a great 2022!

In terms of the dome feeling of heights panning into surrounds, placing the surrounds a feet or two higher aimed down above your head helps with this as well as multiple seating positions (a head blocking your ear during a movie)

Great discussion and information. I went from 7.1 to 5.1.4 (I added two front height speakers plus surround back) but I have ended up (for now) with a 7.1.2 which in my room seems to sounds best. That's based on my Denon x4700h audyssy setup doing its thing. I guess there is some trial and error involved.

Waited for the extra power. Use my Denon AVR X6500 to power up 11 channels at first, which includes 2 front channel Cerwin Vega VE15 towers, 2 SVS PB2000-500 watts subs, 4 Cerwin Vega SL5M surrounds, 1-Cerwin Vega SL45C center, 4-8 inch two way Polk Audio used for Dolby Atmos ceiling mounted speakers, then two years late bought the QSC RMX1450A 300 watts/2 channels @ 8 ohms amplifier. The QSC really made the system sound four times better.

Having 7.2.2 for past 6 years I thought I’d try 5.2.4. I really miss the solid base layer. Much more important that the odd overhead effect. I’m going back to 7.2.2 until I can upgrade to an 11ch amp

Your channel is bad ass ! Keep cranking them out please

I have 20ft vaulted ceilings so the bouncy thing won't work. I'm still waiting for some good looking wall mounted speakers which look better than the wedges. Seems like 5.1 is still the sweet spot for most content in 2023.

My rear and side speakers are about 18-24 inches above my head when I'm seated, and my ceiling is only about 7 1/2 feet high so they're about 1/2 way between my noggin and the ceiling. I don't think I'd have the issue you were having if I added a couple of Atmos speakers. I don't think it was the number of speakers that was your problem, but the positioning.

I run 5.2.2 with marrantz sr5015 , 5 elac debut reference B6 , 2 Elac debut atmos at front height, 2 Jamo 12” subs and it’s my first atmos system and I love it.. still working and tweaking.. getting some sound isolation gear next to keep improving the sound. And working on front and center pre-out amps next.

I'm initially inclined to agree with the tech portion of this - I have a 5.1.2 soundbar that has a sub without rear speakers. I have the paid Atmos via Windows 10 and have run the Atmos 7.1.4 test supplied via the Dolby Access app. My concern is the rear surrounds sound like they're being fed through the front speakers and side surround speakers with a preference towards the front - if that's the way the bar interprets an Atmos 7.1.4 mix, the rear mix is way in the wrong place. My AV room is a flat room that allows for at least some bounce. The height channels are all mixed into two points with a preference for the rear which matches the angle of the top speakers.

Yeah I have 5.1.2 and was watching - Indy the Dial of Destiny, and that’s exactly what happened. As a plane was flying above, once it got past the middle heights it went down to my side speakers. It even started with the fronts first, which wasn’t as bad, but you could hear it going up then down, when it was just flying straight lol I’ll have to add another pair of heights it seems.

Happy new year's dad!

This is very informative and well explained, thank you! So my concern is with all of these decoding ATMOS, Auro 3D etc. it sounds like the goal is get more sounds for the height and surround etc. in this case Auro 3D setup. If that is the case, why wouldn't you be able to just replicate the audio signals to wherever you needed and amplifing them? For instance, i have a center chanel, i can duplicate that channel and put another center channel say to ceiling - that way when the dialog is spoken, you get the effects of the ear level center + the top ceiling like the VOG. This same design concept can be replicated for the rears/surrounds as well as it seems like the goal is for folks to hear more sounds and everywhere.

Surely the point of ATMOS was that it's matrix based and it's the responsibility of the receiver amp to decode better if the ceiling surrounds are missing? :)

Good video content. You are right, not all movies sound the same because the sound is not mixed the same way. My set up is 7.2.2. I will be add two more height speakers soon. I think adding those two speakers will give a good compromise to most movies with atmos.

Awesome video, thank you TD!! You’re the man brotha!! BOOM

This sounds crazy but hear me out ... my theatre room is like your living room setup where the couch is against the rear wall so I have 5.2.4. My rear Atmos speakers were originally intended as Rear Heights and thus are mounted in that position, where the wall meets the ceiling. However I recently set them to instead be Top Center (since the MLP is within the recommended mounting angle for Top Center) and there is a noticeable difference in effect. Thats Front Height/Top Center configuration on my Denon X3600H. Prior I had Front Height/Rear Height and Atmos was OK, but this new configuration blows it away in both immersion and activity. Try it out!

I have a 5.1 setup and my Yamaha RX-A870 AVR does virtual surround backs using the surround speakers via DSP, it does a great job.

I went from 5.1.2 with front height, to 5.1.2 with rear heights, and I would say that rear heights is way better. I think that would be more optimal, because its only merging height fronts and fronts, instead of surround, surround rear and rear heights. You should try with rear heights only, also the sound stage, would in a smaler setup be bigger without heights in the front, due to bigger front speakers, i think.

highly interesting soon to have a 5.1.2 atmos we ll see clearly explained great job

So sofa is backed up to the wall i dont have an option for surround back, i placed my side surround, facing to listening point from an angle 5ft from the floor 6ft away , when i sit at my listening position the speakers are angled slightly at the back of my ear maybe like a 10 degree angle, and it clearly makes great sound stage, with two top middle atmos channels , i used onkyo satellites pointed at listening position about 1ft away from listening position 5.5 ft apart running on str an1000, sounds great 👍🏼

Love the shirt Techno 🔥🔥🔥

I agree having 4 height channels is the best vs 2. But the fact the rear height channels get played on the rear speakers is completely expected… like imagine you had no height effects, all the sounds would be played on the base 5.1 or 7.1 layer. It’s not like the sounds are just going to vanish because you don’t have the height channels…

actually , most recent films have a bad Atmos sound Compared to old re-released movies 4k Remux

Atmos is the worst thing that happened to home theater. Even if you don't use Atmos, you're paying 50% more for an AV receiver and you have less power per channel than you did before. The vast majority of people don't use Atmos.

Wow I really loved your explanation, I never thought about it, awesome content subscribed

I have 5.1.2 and i see your point. Because i'm starter on atmos.

Very good video. My comprehension of what you say is, correct me if I'm wrong, : In a 9 channels system, a 7.2.2 will reproduce a better mix than a 5.2.4 ? Because the base layer is 7.1 plus atmos.

Running a 9.4.6 Klipsch system. L R C all Klipsch RC-64ii Surrounds 6-all RS-62,s Celing 4-THX-5002 s, SUBS 4-SW-115 and 2-SW112. Powered by Yamaha and Outlaw . Sounds Awesome 😎 Cheers 🍻 Eh!🇨🇦

I had my system set up to 5.1.2 and I didn't get crap out of it. Turned me off to Atmos altogether. I just didn't get it. I'm back to 5.2 and love it.

I just looked up a receiver that supports 5.1.4. It costs as much as my entire setup. Not to mention that i need to pay extra for the additional speakers.

Channa..great video. If you have less surround/height channels than the original mix, then the pre/pro/avr downmixes all channels into your setup channels. This can easily sound 3 dimensional. Just like a true stereo perspective, where you cant really tell where the sound is coming from. Ie, A singer is infront of you, but there is no speaker infront of you. Of course the sound placement maybe different with less speakers, but if done well on a good system, it can be quite close to what the sound engineer intended. Happy new year.👍

Also if you’re just unplugging the speakers can running the calibration each time you change how many speakers are connected, of course there would be gaps. You were not clear if that’s what you were doing or not

Thank you for posting this video. I have noticed the same thing on my 7.1.2 system. Initially, I thought it was an issue on my system.

Great video mate. The dolby atmos experience has great potential, but it's still a mixed bag. I want to say, I totally agree with your points. I've spent the past two weeks testing/optimizing my Vizio Elevate. Coming from a 5.1.2 system you can definitely feel and hear the difference. Position is the key, if you don't have optimal placement for your speakers relative to your listening Position, you are still missing effects, even on a 5.2.4.

I appreciate the video, but if your highest altitude speakers are young from your upper fronts to your ear level backs (no upper backs), the highest that sound of a jet can appear to travel is in a straight line between those speakers elevation-wise. No reformatting can fix this. I doubt it's scooping down right behind your head, it's just doing a straight line through the highest 3d audio space available by the setup. Let's ignore the center channel for a moment as it just enforces the barrier, a 5.x set up is basically a square, a 2d space, flat, and through combinations of sounds and volumes of those speakers, a sound can be placed anywhere withing that field. Adding more speakers inside of this square (like the center) just adds accuracy and clarity. A 5.x.2 setup turns this into a 3d environment, but it's only a triangular prism. Sound objects can only be created within this prism and not outside of it. Though it's 3d, the sound objects will be hindered, height-wise on the lower slant of the prism. At least if your two elevated channels are in your rear, you are mostly surrounded by your triangular prism of viable sound object space. If you have your elevated speakers in front, the affect you spoke of will happen. The sound opjects will only be able to be made inches above your ears. With a 5.x.4, you've created a cube and all area within that cube can be used to create sound objects. 5.x.4 is deftly the way to go as it can make use of an entire area. Going into a 7.x.4 will add further accuracy to the sound objects, making it easier to tell exactly where they are in your space, but the jump to 2 high rears, and then the jump to 4 heights from two are almost as big as jumps from 1 speaker to stereo or stereo to 5.x

I'm just going to the Sony A9 system. Got an old 5.1 system for 20 years in which the rears died recently. I was looking at all these options to replace the rears. Wife said she wants something that looks neater and simpler. So I'm getting the A9 system whenever it's back in stock in Australia. Told me April.

Where are the best positions for a 5.1.2 system? x.x.2 for atmos would be better in top front?? Or ceiling or rear? Help me please

Hey Channa D nice to see you put out a awesome video again. Happy New Year brotha.

It’s object based now not speaker based so I don’t think what setup the sound engineer had counts anymore 🤔🤷🏻‍♂️ or that’s what I gathered was meant to happen. The processor is the one that decides from the information given and the speaker lay out to where it sends the sound.

Speaker toppers don't work its basically like sitting a bookshelf on top. The inbuilt ones in the standers work really well . Topper my amp will.measure them thrm same distance as thr fronts. On the built ins its twice the distance. So the mics not taking the sound from thr ceiling

Great point! - You can't put sound where there aren't any speakers (the missing rears and overheads). But... you can go slightly out of the traditional soundstage - Remember when Madonna recorded in Q-Sound? Traditional stereo speakers appeared to have sound wider than the stereo speakers (by playing with phase and adding out-of-phase left to the right and out-of-phase right to the left). A nifty trick from the 1990's, and probably what Atmos is based on, just way more complicated, with a ton more channels. :)

Hey TD, hope and you and yours are good. Yo, this video is very insightful and straight up brilliant. I actually don't have atmos yet, but I will be very mindful of this kind of stuff when we get to have an atmos setup. In short, you just made my future setup better.