BART riders say goodbye to legacy trains as they prepare for new system changes 

Another $100 Billion please! Its already way up from the original voter approved $33 Billion to $128 Billion! That's both terrible fiscal shepherding and a pretty hefty bait-and-switch!

At the expected $128 Billion, it would take more than 1.5 billion people paying the expected $86 a ticket for the high-speed rail system to break even. That is the equivalent of 32 times the population of California in 2023 ... so how is this not going to go the way of Bart?

They were cute but extremely outdated, dirty, and unreliable. It was time for an upgrade.

​@@TohaBgood2outdated in what?

@@tomv3361 The Bredas have crappy old electronics that don't jive well with modern train control which leads to needless delays and breakdowns. Their doors are constantly broken in at least two major ways. They are basically more often broken than in service at this point with literally only 20% the reliability of the new Siemens sets. The Bredas were always a disastrous vehicle so they weren't good even when they were new. But now that they're also outdated and old and crappy, it's impossible to justify not setting them all on fire. The Breads almost cost Muni its life. The sooner they can get rid of them the better. They're trash.

Wow - those noisy things? Just goes to show we should not use an aerospace company to build railway rolling stock - even if they do come in with the lowest bid!

Nonsense. When the trains are crowded there are no homeless people. They started hanging out in the trains specifically because the trains were mostly empty during the day. And even then they'd hide out in the last car to sleep. More normal people in the trains forces the homeless out of the system. That's just a fact.

@TohaBgood2 whether they're homeless or normal, more people is more people and its still a shitshow. This is coming from a daily rider.

The trains have definitely been way more crowded lately.

Don't be a pu$$ey!

Real

The new trains will get urinated in or worse soon enough

@@Sean_Connery I'm sure, but remember a lot of these "new" trains really aren't that new, they've been around for many years. They have an overall more sterile feel, like you could just pull out a pressure washer and clean the trains at the end of the night and they'll be good to go the next day.

@@Mike__BThis! The old trains originally had carpets and wool seats! They were not waterproof and not designed to be cleaned and disinfected. They were supposed to launder the wool seat covers and vacuum clean the carpets. It was an idiotic idea but they thought that they could pull it off given enough consistent funding. That's not what happened at all. The new trains are fully waterproof on the inside and designed to be pressure washed like any normal/metro subway car around the world. They hose the whole thing down and then wash the seats and the floors with actual soap and disinfectant now! That's an order of magnitude cleaner than the old non-washable cars! BART even released a video about the whole process to show off.

Opposite for me. :P I just found the old seats so much more comfortable that after a long day I'd actually be relieved when an old train came. Honestly... I expect that pretty much anything used by the public is "dirty", I don't really allocate too much of my mental energy worrying about it.

Nothing is safe anymore, not even at your own home.

That would take over 150 officers . That's more officers than some cities I doubt that would ever happen

BART was fine just 10 years ago. All we need is for them make it the way it was 10 years ago. What's so hard about that?

They don't have money to pay for more train operators because all the money went to support the homeless.

Even New York is no more than 5 minutes

@@timson7970 The actual frequency of BART is about 4 minutes in the core. The system just works differently than a traditional subway. The lines are heavily interlined. You get on whatever train shows up first and transfer at the next transfer station. This guy just doesn't know what he's talking about.

I'm neutral on this change. It makes sense to rebalance the train schedule, but it does nothing to improve safety for normal people. It remains a drug user's free transportation system, but now with more evening trains.

@@alansnyder8448 They have a ton more cops in the system and will be adding even more. They now also have fare inspectors and unarmed security guards that actually call the cops in emergencies. I do believe that the shorter trains will help. All the nasty stuff I ever saw happen on a BART train was always in an empty or semi-empty car. Having everyone together gives you some heard immunity and is less ground for the cops on patrol to cover. This is not perfect, but 100x better than before. Now we just need to push them to improve it all the way! More cops, more fare inspectors, more cameras, new fare gates. Let's go! We're moving in the right direction with this!

Nonsense. There are literal subway lines that were explicitly and proudly copied off BART. BART may have its safety and cleanliness issues, but from a technical standpoint it's a marvel of civil engineering. Even the people with good transit systems recognize that BART is an incredibly impressive system. Why can't you lot?

The new seats and floors are more hygienic & easier to clean. And the seats are pretty comfortable.

You don't want cushion seats when homeless bums do their business right on them with or without people watching.

@@secretadmirer5006 I’m aware of it’s hygiene problem. But let’s be honest, it’s the ppl’s mannerism/hygiene that causes the problem for it 😂. We can’t have nice things xD.

@@bobbymoss6160 I mean I do want them, but definitely not gonna have them xD. Maintenance, ppl’s hygiene. Yah, it’s not meant for America 😂. I’m just noting how I miss the nice things of the past ^^.

yep

This is nonsense. The homeless always stay away from the busy cars. And when all of BART is busy they stay out fo the system. Plus, fewer cars means less area for the cops to patrol. They actually walk the trains now! Your 2019 view of BART is outdated.

The old trains had 54 seats. The new ones have 50 and a ton more standing space. Learn how to count at least, if you're going to be commenting on this. Four extra seats and drastically reduced standing room on the old trains did no one any good.

Well, that’s just too bad, learn to accept changes. Sometimes in life you just have to accept changes without question or giving a reason why you deny them. I don’t hate both the old and new trains

Well, they're seven years old to be exact since the first Fleet of the Future train cars arrived at BART in 2016 and then began being phased into service in 2017. So they're not brand new. But they're certainly newer than the legacy fleet.

So you're wrong on both counts. First of all the new fleet started running in 2018. So yes, some of those cars have been in service for 5 years. That will be visible. The majority of the new cars are actually new, i.e. delivered between 2018 and 2023. And they're pretty darn clean. I've only seen some scribbled graffiti once and it had clear sings of someone trying to rub that crap out like it was the mark of the devil. So they're definitely trying to do a good job with these new trains. Second, the trains in Asia are not "sparkling and shiny". Most trains in Asia are atrocious. I'm assuming that you're referring to subway/metro trains in some of the richer countries like Japan and Korea. Then yes, their metro trains are generally pretty clean. Certainly above average for metro/subway cars around the world. They are definitely not "sparkling and shiny" though. Most are on the older side. They have blemishes, scribbled graffiti and can get dirty too depending on where you are on the line. But they try to keep them in good condition and clean. The people take pride in their metro systems and snitch like crazy if they see, for example, some teenagers damaging the trains. If you want that type of a system then it's up to you! There's the BART Watch App created specifically to report issues on BART. Use it! Overall, I want to say that you people need to travel more. Some of your ideas about what the rest of the world is like are literally lifted directly out of propaganda and anime. Real life doesn't work like that.

@@TohaBgood2 I remember you now. You're the Bay Area Troll. Defending this hell hole. You probably contributed to it too and now you live in denial. Move along.

Japan as a culture and a country is way cleaner than the U.S.. You’re talking about a country where there are no janitors in the schools because the students do all the cleaning. They are raised to appreciate cleanliness. You won’t find many places in the states with that appreciation for it.

@@LostChildOfTime This is complete nonsense. You are confusing the image the Japan wants to project for the rest of the world and what is actually happening in the country. Saving face is the central necessity of that culture, so they go to great pains to hide things that they don't want the world to see. This does not mean that they are not happening. Look up Kamagasaki and the "Net cafe refugees". The fact that you people actually believe nonsense propaganda is staggering to me. Japan is a real place with real people that have real problems, not some anime Disneyland for you to fetishize.

BART should have cops at every station. The new trains were not only necessary, but BART wouldn't survive without them. FYI, the old fleet was about half as reliable as the new trains. For a heavily interlined system like BART, where literally every train has several timed transfers that it has to make, an unreliable fleet is literal death. The whole system has to slow down to accommodate each straggler train. Junking the old fleet was probably their best decision in at least 30 years. The way that BART was designed makes reliable trains an imperative.

yep the garbage is pretty gross. no trash cans either.

Same with SF Muni where you can also be stabbed or shot.

BART hasn't been "pack like sardines" in three years, bud. Chill. They've already extended the trains and will continue to do so as more Alstom cars are delivered every month.

These new trains have been in service since 2018, bud. The announcement is that they are retiring the remaining retro ones. So new the entire fleet will be composed of the new model. But yeah, these new Alstom trains have been in service for five years at this point.

And pee in the seats and spin the pipe and fill the cab with their crystal fumes. Oh the amazing benefits of living here in the Bay Area

Yeah, little problem with your theory there. These trains have been in service since 2018. The announcement is about the retirement of the last of the classic BART trains not about the introduction of the new trains. Listen better next time.

@@brosephbroman7564 Given that the new trains have been in service for 5 years already, it sounds like you were wrong. Better luck lying next time though.

@@TohaBgood2 I can tell you don't ride the BART buddy. Regardless if the train is brand new, few years old, or one from a decade ago. The homeless and the druggies use the trains as a flop house drug den.

​@@brosephbroman7564and that is largely because the cities BART operate in fail to provide resources to decrease homelessness and increase sanitation, like public toilets and government subsidized housing.

I've noticed the wait time on the other lines is much longer now. Guess it's nice for people using the yellow line, sucks for everyone else.

@@Rubycon99 Literally ever point in the BART system except three stations on the Blue line have a train at least every 10 minutes. And the areas where the vast majority of BART riders live or work actually have trains every 4 minutes. BART is a heavily interlined regional metro system. You're supposed to take whatever train comes first and transfer at the correct station to your second train. That's literally how the system is designed to work. That's how all the heavily interlined systems work. I keep seeing my local Bay Area friends being consistently confused by this, yet none of my European friends ever have any trouble figuring it out. Why is that? Does no one know how to read a transit map with clearly marked transfer stations?

@@TohaBgood2 It's fine for going to SF, but Orange from del Norte is every 20 minutes and there's no way around it through transferring.

@@Rubycon99 You mean going south? Why not take the Red to West Oakland and transfer to the Green or Blue there?

Not really, they come from all over the country. Mild climate and the city pays them $600/month.

@@Rubycon99 pay the homeless to do drugs and buy vapes

This might be the result. They need to focus on stopping the fare jumpers and getting more police on the trains.

The old trains had 54 seats, the new ones have 50 and a loooooooot more standing room. BART doubled police patrols and fare inspectors, you can visibly see that the whole system became an order of magnitude cleaner and feels safer compared to last years. You are far from a "positive person." You're a whiner who insists on whining even when things are improving. Nothing will ever make you happy, except more opportunities to whine.

Lol, then why are you watching a local news video about a local subway operator in California. If you didn't care you wouldn't be commenting on here, bud. You care. It eats you inside when something good happens here. You hate us don't you? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 God, you people are so pathetic.

@@TohaBgood2 What's pathetic is you defending this turd of a state lol. California is collapsing and you're over here acting like everything is fine lol. Are you even paid to defend it? Or are you just trolling cause your bitter denial??