Battle at the Washita: Did Joel Elliot's Massacre Save Troopers at the Little Bighorn? (Part 5) 

I think what Benteen did to Custer was worse than what happened at Washita. Elliot took off without orders and without notifying anyone. Benteen was ordered to support. We of course will never know, but I don't think it's a forgone conclusion the Indians would annihilated the entire command had Benteen joined them. Custer had divided his command to keep the way open for Benteen. With them all united, I think it is more likely the Indians would have been happy with their victory and escaped. After all, isn't that what happened? When Reno & Benteen united, the Indians couldn't press the attack. The Reno-Benteen position isn't that great of a defensive position- militarily speaking.

I just found your channel and subscribed. Now I have a lot of videos to catch up on! I've studied this topic for +25 years, and I have to say I completely agree with you. I know many discussions are held regarding Benteen's motives for not going on to assist Custer. I think Capt. Benteen was a paradox, in that while he definitely had a strong hatred for Custer, he was also a very good soldier who wouldn't capriciously ignore his duty to go to the aide of 260+ plus men being slaughtered. He was also desperately needed to take control of the situation on Reno Hill. Those soldiers were in dire straights with no commanding officer in control. I've always wondered exactly as you put it; if Benteen had felt the same way about Custer as he did Elliott, what MIGHT he have done? I agree with you that the outcome would've been disastrous had he joined the doomed men on Last Stand Hill. So many people argue that Benteen was a coward or derelict in his duty. I strongly disagree on both counts. Thanks so much for this interesting video!

It is very interesting learning more info of the Washita battle and how it connects to the plains Indians war.

-Another great presentation. What was always before me - but I didn't put together - was that all troopers were not killed in the Battle of the Little Big Horn. -Most survived. -Well done in bringing this to the fore.

The thing is that Black Kettle was a peaceful chief. The Cheyenne were told to stop depredations on the white settlers. Black Kettle replied that he couldn't control the young braves if they were going out to cause trouble. Paraphrasing, he said you know how young people are, they don't listen and just do what they want to do. Well some of the young men went out and attacked some more settlers. The Army, or the Bureaugh of Indian Affairs that the Army needed to stop the attacks. That is mostly why Custer attacked the village. That is my understanding anyway.

Your points are excellent ones!

Such drama and intrigue in the 7th Cavalry - who knew? Interesting story :)

Great video,but you failed to mention custer did send somone to look for elliot,the came back and said they went 2 miles,and didnt c anything,.so its proberbly safe to assume,custer thought elliot had retreted back to the wagon train,.dont think any commander can be held account if a subboardnate goes off on a whim,looking for battle honors,.

Attitude had no role at little big horn. They just bit off more than they could handle. They had no control over any part of that battle at any time.

Great video. You tell so many stories I've never heard.

No doubt that Benteen was an acerbic personality. Didn't help that Custer tried to convince the command that Elliot just got "separated" and would soon show up. Did he believe that...or was he just trying to get his command moving? In one campaign prior to the Little Big Horn, Benteen was in charge of base of support troops while Custer was in the field. Benteen's wife sent him a message that their daughter dying... Benteen requested emergency leave... Custer could have easily had next officer present with Benteen take command of detail... Instead, he flatly refused and Benteen's wife got to be alone with her daughter when she died. . Custer had a long history of abusing military leave for his own purposes... including one stretch from February to October when he puttered around New York City among other places, hob-knobbing with wealthy "swells" looking into civilian work opportunities. Benteen didn't need a lot to dislike Custer, but this gave him a cosmic gripe... . On the other hand, while Benteen might have been delighted to hear that Custer had been turned into a bear rug or such-like... he was too good an officer to knowingly permit good soldiers.. and officers (some of the latter friends of his) to go down the drain with Custer The opinion among the officers on Reno-Benteen hill was that Custer had encountered a large number of combative Sioux and Cheyenne and were repulsed...and fell back in the direction of Terry's command to the North. As with Elliot, many thought that they had been at least left behind out of a perceived necessity... if not simply abandoned. . It is all too easy for some in the 21st Century to discuss the matter as if Reno did not exist. Reno's performance on June 25th was abysmal to say the least...and at the worst... perhaps drunken cowardice. When Benteen came upon Reno's command, Reno... Benteen's immediate superior... instructed him to remain in place... at least until the ammunition pack train arrived... as he had "lost half his command..." Last info that Benteen had re Custer was from orderly Martini who reported that the Indians were "skedaddling..." Reno's command, on the other hand was more than "dispirited..." rather it was practically shattered... (see S.L.A. Marshall) and if left behind by Benteen might well be overrun and wiped out. After the ammo caught up, the joint command moved forward...only to find countless hostiles in their face. . Ultimately, Benteen "took effective command" of the survivors...without formally doing so. Whatever mistakes he made (he had been far too long without sleep...as were many others) he put steel in the defense and saved a major portion of the command. YP

That is a good point to ponder!

I've made a lifetime interest out of the Indian Wars and the debacle of the Great Sioux War of 1876-77. I believe that the whole campaign was ill conceived and as such it's outcome was a foregone conclusion that it would not have ended well. The winter campaign against the encampment of the Southern Cheyenne which culminated in the Battle of the Washita was another example of the Post 📫 Civil War US 🇺🇸 Army trying to conduct punitive military operations "on the cheap." They didn't want to deploy enough manpower in order to get the job done properly as a regiment of an understrength winter campaign is a prime example of. Had the striking force been more numerically superior than what rode out of Camp Supply that November of 1868 perhaps they'd have been able to have done a more thorough reconnaissance of the Washita watershed and have made a more efficient and better choice of the time and place of the attack than was made.

Very good video.

I’ve learned so much from your videos sir you are a great American

Cavalry not Calvary. Sorry but this mis-pronunciation is so common and it bothers me so much. I appreciate all your knowledge and sharing with your subscribers as I am one.

Elliot is in my line

Thats custer county on your map. Roger mills next door is where it all happened.

LOL, your map shows Washita county in Oklahoma. The battle took place in Roger Mills county along the Washita River. That county is directly to the northwest of the highlighted one.

Please excuse the misspellings and bad grammar in my last comment I was using voice to text. I should have checked more thoroughly. Anyway my question today is do you think the Gatling guns offered to Custer would have made any difference?

You have some very good points made here, but I don't think Benteen would have gone to Custer's aid even if he could have. Reno's command was in bad shape after the valley fight with Reno having lost nearly half his command. Captain Wier did try to go to Custer and the rest of the command did follow him after a while but were turned back by the increasing number of Indians starting to return after the the last stand. So saying Benteen saved the lives of the rest of the 7th by not going to Custer's aid is a little far out of facts.

I like how you handle this topic of Joel and his death. ‘Here’s for a brevet or a coffin.’.. As you also have articles on the Little Big Horn have you considered investigating the stories of the two adjutants. Lt’s Cooke and *Hodgson?…( *age clouds my memory on his name).. There’s a real mystery with the *latter as an officer terrorised by hostile action, Reno, was still prepared to search for the body before even thinking of proceeding towards Custer’s command. Back into hostile territory!!… He searched the body but did not bring it back to his command. Tell me what he was looking for and what had mysteriously disappeared from the corpse.. From memory most of his personal possessions were still present.. In both adjutants cases their note books had gone..( very strange).. There’s where the secrets lie. That permanently unanswered question did Custer detail his battle plan prior to the command division and would it have shown Reno disobeyed orders. Mebbe Benteens real mission. Why valley hunting. Was he a mobile reserve.?… Just What orders were recorded in these books. Just speculation but what a revelation that would be. Good luck with your projects.👵🇦🇺🇺🇸

Custer's hometown was New Rumley Ohio..I've been there..onlything left was the base of a handpump for a well. His wife was from Monroe, Michigan.. There is a large monument there as they adopted him. I enjoy your work very much. My GGF James Madison Drake was under Custer in a battle in Virginia. Grandfather Drake was in Co H 13th WV.Vol Inf.He was under General Sheridan and also Rutherford B Hayes. in other battles. He liked Sheridan and named my grandfather Albert Sheridan Drake..Grandfather Albert was the first child born after the war..GGF James M died in 1878 of Typhus fever, he was 43 and had been in 6 major battles in the Shenendoah Valley chasing Jubal Early..Grandpa was first in the CSA's Virginia Wildcats and was under Devil Anse Hatfield.. Paul Drake

that's interesting, I thought you were going with the fact that Major Elliot died as if abandoned and so Benteen abandoned Custer. Starting with his life is a good example of how Benteen could have done many things but was part of the union near his father's place and from what I understand they did attack his father's place from what I remember. If he held a grudge, it was for life. Elliot's coffin or a commendation or something to that effect. The fact that this discussion also happened again at the Far West between pointing out Benteen shot a kid, that was shooting at him, the newspaper incident along with, Let the whipping commence, meanig for Benteen that he wrote the letter of Custer abandoning Elliot. it is clear that Benteen always poked the bears. The idea of killing ponies that the 700 or so were killed in groups with axes and I think this was at the Washita but it may have been another battle, saving on ammunition- this may seem not important but at the LBH it is possible that men were sent after the pony herds to destroy them- Crook at his battle was planning to court marshal someone for not killing the ponies that were later recaptured. However, there is much more on a battle and campaign that has the eyes of the chain of command watching. The cold was a factor, the band could only blow a few notes and the instruments froze up, and the idea that they took their cold weather clothes off and Custer told them it would be hot enough soon, Tom having to choke to death the dog of Custer for communicating with the village dogs, etc. So I like the discussion topic. I will say that Benteen at Reno Hill had his knuckles grazed with a bullet and one that hit his heel and I think a thing in the Camp notes that stands out is his telling a man to stand up and take a look at the size and scope of things as it would be something he would be able to tell his family. Also that Chief Joeseph from the Nez Perce campaign asked to see the man with a pipe and fishing pole that rode while on scout through a valley area and while ten or so of his best shooters could not hit him while he rode his horse as if on parade. The pipe and fishing pole even Benteen claims he carried for catching his own lunch, Camp notes has Benteen slowing the pace and fishing at the morass while others say he came in riding to Reno Hill with a straw hat on and unsaddled. Which I guess he accessed the situation. Here is the rub, he neither seen to his troops to take the advance that day as Godfrey says, Benteen never made defensive places for his troops the night of the battle and they suffered terribly for it. I am not sure how to get a feel for Benteen. Even his testimony at the RCOI is so full of mischief that it is possible he was asked to make a yarn, not liking Reno anymore than Custer he may have just fabricated such big lies as to let history know it was a true Inquiry. If it was Elliot instead of Custer. Thanks for giving me, finally, something to ponder on that is relevant and interesting. Here is the final thought, I have always been o.k. with my command and immediate command for the most part, however, I never loved or cared one way or another for those a few ranks above me as I did not have a vested interest. When it comes to fighting in the end it is not for God or Country but for the man next to you and the desire to go home. Custer and most of the others companies had not been together nor a bonding but more of a dictatorship. Custer Clan against the average joe.

You know II think part of the problem was country dividing his forces. And the other issue is the way Calvary fought battles. I really didn't learn anything from the Civil War. We still got down on the ground, and every fourth man was a horse holder. While the Indians fought from their horses, enabling them to use clubs and whatever weapons they needed.

I've always thought Custer was overrated.

Joel Elliot’s fate was on the minds of Reno, and all Reno’s men that saw Custer on the bluffs, but did not come to their support as per the plan. But beyond any speculation about Benteen’s motives, we do have a letter he wrote to his wife, which included the note from Cooke. In the letter, he told his wife, Kate, that Weir was sent out with some men to find Custer, but Weir was turned back, due to the number of warriors. I have a question about Custer and his lack of support for Reno at the village. According to several Native eyewitness accounts, Custer died or was fatally wounded at Medicine Tail Coulee, and was dragged by his men to Last Stand Hill. What are you thoughts? Thank you.

Benteen's insubordination at the LBH cost the 7th Cav any chance of victory or even a orderly retreat.Had no Gibbon and Terry arrived Benteen/Reno would have been wiped out too or taken prisoner with remaining troops. Recall that Boston Custer overtook Benteen coming from the pack train on his way to Custer. So the way was clear for Benteen. As for the Washita,had troops dawdled looking for Elliott,a LBH type decimation may have taken place. Custer was "right" to recall and leave,and Custer avoided the Warriors looking for the 7th in a brilliant move. Benteen suffered from professional envy of Custer.

Great explanation of what took place,i was born in Mississippi,,now i live down the road from Custer battle field,, thank you.

Well, I learned something new in this video: I never knew, or read, that Major Joel Elliott and Captain Fred Benteen were actually good friends. Conversely, I once read somewhere - and I cannot recall the source - but I distinctly remembered a reference in regards to Benteen's relationship with Elliott. The lines by the author, whoever it was, went something like this (insofar as I can remember): "Then again, Benteen didn't care much for Major Elliott either. Captain Benteen, it seems, had problems with any officer who outranked him." If what I read is historically correct, it sort of repudiates what this video says about the friendship that existed between the two officers. Then again, I'm not one to gainsay any information these videos unfold. Near as I can tell, they are among the most historically accurate videos about Custer and the Little Bighorn on RU-vid. For all of that, I do know this: George Armstrong Custer and Major Joel Elliott were definitely good friends. In 1865, Elliott had served as Custer's judge advocate in Texas. Impressed, Custer had added his support to a lobbying effort by Elliott's political friends to secure him his post as major in the 7th Cavalry. Also, in 1867, during Custer's court-martial, Major Joel Elliott was one of a few of the 7th Cavalry officers who stood as a witness in Custer's defense. But, to get back to Benteen....if disharmony in the 7th Cavalry began with anyone, it began with him. Pardon my language, but Captain Frederick Benteen was an absolute and 'no holds barred' prick. He hated Custer from the start; there was no special reason for it, the animosity was just there. After the Washita battle, Benteen asked one of the regiment's scouts, Ben Clark, to swear that Custer had ordered Elliott to his death. Clark refused, knowing that Custer had no idea where he went. Elliott rode off on his own, and sent no word of his intentions ("Here's for a brevet or a coffin!"). Benteen was a malicious, crotchety, querulous asshole. His hatred toward Custer tended to color all of his writings, making him the most untrustworthy of narrators. This was especially evident in his statements given during Major Reno's Court of Inquiry in 1879. It is true that Captain Fred Benteen adeptly took command from Reno of the troops trapped on Reno Hill, where he displayed genuine courage and a sure hand; nevertheless, his display of a cool leader in a desperate siege colored the public's impression of his testimonies. Benteen despised Custer for "abandoning" Major Elliott and 19 men at the Washita, yet did he even consider his own abandonment of ten times as many troops at the Little Bighorn? In his petty, self-absorbed spite against his commanding officer, Benteen utilized any available pretense to avoid helping Custer or the hundreds of men with him.

I would laugh when I hear the Washita referred to as a battle, but my heart is too sad for the massacre that took place there. Custer was a true Civil War hero, but he changed when he went west. The Cheyenne camp of Black Kettle on the Washita was friendly to the US; he even flew an American Flag over the camp to show it. There were many other camps along the river, some not so friendly. Custer surrounded the camp and attacked the sleeping village at dawn. Old men, women and children were killed without mercy. When it was over the wounded Cheyenne braves were shot and killed. Custer took 53 women and children hostage and put them in the center of his column as human shields to keep warriors from other camps from attacking. This was the My Lai of the 1860's. During the Civil War, Custer never had wounded enemy murdered. Benteen was no hero either. He didn't dislike Custer for slaughtering noncombatants. Dead women and children meant nothing to him. He was only angry about his friend Elliot.

Sounds like the old saying that 'You get what you pay for' holds true and I still hate politicks. GBWYall, Barry and Thanks!

Eliot was reckless but so was Custer

Benteen defintely WAS on his way to Custer after meeting up with the routed Reno on the bluffs, although Cpt. Weir had led the advance against orders. When they reached Weir Pt. about a mile north of the Reno position, they witnessed perhaps the end of Custer's annihilation some 4 to 5 miles north, and thousands of warriors who sighted them and began advancing on them. For Benteen to move towards that debacle any further would have been suicide.

Old Custer got the hell out of there!

Also Mathews and Waldo.

Why you showing a picture from the Civil War of Sheridan tying it to Washita massacre...?? Benteen was to pragmatic to tolerate Custers shenanigans....!!

How are you doing dr Barry i got surpised because ijust there are grammar National day on 4 th of March . We too have Arabic national day on 18 th of December since 2012 established by (UNESCO) actually our language is beautiful but more difficult than English honestly so many rules in grammar , one single words have several meanings, vocabularies . English needs efforts and reading and writing both are great ways to improve English language for native or none native speakers too . Any away iam gathering main information about topics you mentioned briefly here it’s Joel Elliot ( November 27 1868 October 27- 1840) on November 27 1868 second command at battle of washita river . Elliot broke off from main body to case fleeing indians . Major Elliot sergeant major Walter Kennedy, and sixteen other soldiers were killed . Joel Elliot was a Union major during after civil war . Joining as private in 1861 with company 2 and Indiana cavalry regiment he saw action at battle of Shiloh , Battle of perryvile , battle of stone river , he was wounded twice . Joel was killed during battle of washita river , just west of present day Cheyenne, Oklahoma. Thank you for your wonderful cultural channel you encourage us to read learn new information improve our English language as well. Stay safe blessed good luck to you your family friends. We always began our conversation with greeting and end with bid farewell .

Id say custers intelligence and strategic mind we’re way overrated but his courage and his ability to act took him a long way I doubt if I lwud have liked custer But there’s no doubt he could get things done sometimes action is better than strategy

The population if the U.S. is one percent native Indians, but 20 percent blacks.

Custer's experience at the Washita begs the question, what was he thinking at the Little Bighorn? In the face of approximately 1,000 native warriors at the Washita, Custer escaped through the use of non-combatant hostages -- escaped; he did not act positively. He accomplished nothing. To cover-up the failure at the Washita, Custer lied and wildly exaggerated native casualties. What could he possibly have thought would have transpired differently at the Little Bighorn?

You know even though Custer was on Grants staff, during the civil war, Grant as president blamed Custer for the whole Massacre at the Little Bighorn. There wasn't a whole lot of support for Custer. Even though his men called him general he was really lieutenant-colonel at the time of his death.

One witness reported Custer watching Elliott's demise and did nothing.

I thought that Custer was from Ohio . . . ?

Two editorial notes: .....You referred to Custer as "General". He was a Lt. Col. .....Cavalry refers to a mounted military force. CALVARY is where Jesus Christ was crucified. When it comes to Custer, I am again saddened by what passes for history. The MURDER of Black Kettle & his wife (who flew an American flag outside his teepee) and other peaceful Indians is called a BATTLE. But when American Indians defeat armed aggressors who attacked without provocation, it's a MASSACRE. REALLY? Also, your sources is apparently the US Park Service. Numerous accounts of both the Washita & the Greasy Grass are available from the perspective of the American Indians. The facts... 1-Elliot's DEFEAT had nothing to do with the death of troops at the LBH. 2-Benteen was ordered to separate from Custer's column by Custer.. 3-Reno ordered Benteen to stop his move to assist Custer. 4- The only thing that saved Benteen & Reno's troopers? The Indians stopped attacking & left the battle field.

Stop saying Calvary unless you are talking about the hill Jesus died on

Eliot and his men were essentially murdered by Custer

You need to spell my family member's name correctly. It's Elliott not Elliot!