Book reviews, chats, and other videos for stories/books mentioned: *I don't have one for Vinland Saga at the time this has gone up! First Law book 1: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-GQPf9j7NKBM.html First Law book 2: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-sowwX9YKHB8.html First Law book 3 and trilogy review: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-PX1alAXbmwg.html First Law Funny One Star Reviews: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-PX1alAXbmwg.html Why You Should Read FMA: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-FYzg6fSLRV8.html Vicious and Vengeful review: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-O8Yy3DnKR4E.html Strange the Dreamer review: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-QTAW0NuOAlQ.html Strange the Dreamer book 2 (Muse of Nightmares) review: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-R25ZtY1GgB4.html Strange the Dreamer Funny One Star Reviews: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-LbK6KYG-UJ8.html Strange the Dreamer Character Examination: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Ggj4Dy624YY.html Recommendations for if you like Strange the Dreamer: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-5NXwdaFr6Lk.html Six of Crows (This is my Grisha playlist): ru-vid.com/group/PL-WCMA9Lkyewkk4ox_ACjX7x3zLpgUaXh Mistborn (This is my Sanderson playlist): ru-vid.com/group/PL-WCMA9LkyewXJ6w64z19u5sBkocaiTAQ Crown of Feathers review: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-cBxPQTf_GRU.html Crown of Feathers book 2 (Heart of Flames) review: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-oLIJey39RP8.html Stormlight Archive Dalinar musical tribute: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-ZPgTNw-sPtk.html Purchase links to stories/books mentioned: Vinland Saga: amzn.to/3drKyGT First Law: amzn.to/35AxVH5 Fullmetal Alchemist: amzn.to/3bdJwge Vicious: amzn.to/2YGr6C8 Strange the Dreamer: amzn.to/2ziMmDm Six of Crows: amzn.to/2WrvLoM Mistborn: amzn.to/3fviiFw Crown of Feathers: amzn.to/3dmuIgP Stormlight Archive: amzn.to/2YH4xO0
Well, I would say Raistlin Majere gives him a run for his money. Sure, Raistlin was flat out Evil at times (okay, for a long time), but he wasn't _always_ Evil, he went through a couple alignments. And even when Evil, Raistlin still had certain soft spots and would on occasion show beneficent behavior towards certain individuals (usually the weak or downtrodden). And I write this as someone who put Ser Jaime as my favorite **aSoIaF** character (and one of my favorite all time F/SF characters as well).
Totally agree on Vin and Kelsier! I also love Kaz, but i actually find Inej to be more intresting in this aspect. Also, not a book character, but Tommy Shelby from Peaky Blinders is definitely my favourite morally grey character.
The Six of Crows crew, the Vicious and Vengeful characters, Prince Yarvi from the Shattered Sea Trilogy, Mia Covere from The Nevernight Chronicle, and Alex Stern from Ninth House! I love them all... 😍
What a great idea for a video. I love my gray characters! I'd have to say some of my favorites are T'sao T'sao from the Romance of the Three Kingdoms novel and Ahmann Jardir from The Demon Cycle (Such an underrated fantasy series) Oh! And of course my main man Abbadon Haroldson.
I'm up for watching a video on each of the characters we see the povs in Stormlight (Dalinar, Shallan and Kaladin). Also, read Song of Ice and Fire. There is a lot of crazy stuff the show leaves out. Although, I'm not sure Martin can wrap everything up in 2 books.
This is a brilliant video idea! It would make for a very fun conversation for all of us here. I gave your comment a like so that Elliot will see it eventually 😁👍🏼💫 Have a great day
Yeah, ya can't really even _begin_ talking about morally grey characters until you talk about say a dozen or so characters from *A* *Song* *of* *Ice* *and* *Fire,* and _that_ is rushing it I would say.
Watch merphiers video on snape. I actually think he is a better example of an antivillain than morally gray. He is outright a dick as he is abusive towards harry and Neville who are just children. In no way able to justify his behaviour. Even though I enjoy his character.
Kennit from The Liveship Traders, hands down. He is so despicable but his character arc is so good that I ended up crying over him despite how terrible he is.
Thank you for hyping up The Liveship Traders for me! 😁 I'm currently reading the Farseer Trilogy, but The Liveship Traders is the one that I'm most looking forward to and now, hearing that there's a morally grey char with a good arc just makes me more excited about it 😁
Honestly I can only really think of ASOIAF characters lol. 😅 Jaime Lannister's definitely up there, Theon Greyjoy too to a certain extent. Tyrion could fit but he gets really darker in the later books. Even Daenerys could fit as well with some of her more radical measures. Arya's a great example too, because her darkness obviously results from trauma and so is understandable. Not to mention she's still a child so it's hard to judge her too harshly.
Morally grey characters are my fave!! I absolutely adore Lord Asriel (His Dark Materials), Chrollo (Hunter x Hunter), Gilgamesh (Fate/Zero) and Kelsier (Mistborn) to name a few.
Really? I personally never thought of Chrollo as being a grey character. We don’t see a lot of him (at least not in the anime if we’re going off that) but that doesn’t mean his morals are grey if you know what I mean? But it could just be that it’s been a while since I read it 😅 I don’t remember everyone’s character
@@alvedonaren The Phantom Troupe still does occasional acts of charity and its Meteor City they care about, the outside world not so much. The reason why they targeted the mafia to begin with was because they treated Meteor City as a dumping ground.
To me, the best example of a morally grey character in recent memory is Teresa in The Maze Runner series. Her motivation is to find a cure to the Flare...at any cost. This causes her to side with WCKD which is an organization willing to sacrifice immune children to produce a viable cure to save humanity. She hates watching her friends go through these absolutely traumatizing trials to become the cure, but not so much that she's willing to stop putting them through it. Because as she sees it, there will be a lot more lives lost if they don't find the cure. An unbreakable commitment to the "greater good" that causes her to do plenty of "bad" in order to achieve it. I love it.
the best morally grey character I 've read is snape. Because it is a ya novel, people dont use this label on him has much, but yeah, snape is the greiest (?) a character can be
Does The Darkling from the Grisha trilogy count as morally gray? I mean, he is evil. But what he did, started out because he wanted to protect and make a place for all Grisha, he just did a lot of really terrible things on his path to get there.
I don’t see him as particularly grey. I mean, I feel for him, I understand him and I get his motivation, but holy hell that guy is a monster. Love him though.
Yes I'm so happy you mentioned Askeladd, such an amazing character! Edit: Askeladd is actually one of the very few characters in Vinland Saga that isn't really based off a real person. The fact that Askeladd is so amazing and his character is for the most part completely made up made me respect the author more.
Huh, I wouldn't have thought of them, but you have a point! Will definitely watch out for that impression when I re-read those books later in the year. 🙂
Most First Law characters could be on my list. Glokta for sure, but Logen, Black Dow, Caul Shivers, Monza Murcatto and Bayaz are also favourites. Same for a lot of Malazan characters.. Lady Envy, Tehol Beddict, Cotillion, Bauchelain, Tavore Paran. But Karsa Orlong wins it. Johnny Marcone from Dresden Files James Stark from Sandman Slim Locke from the Gentleman Bastards Achmed the Snake from Symphony of Ages Orhan from Sixteen Ways to Defend a Walled City Melisande Shahrizai from Kushiel's Legacy Granny Weatherwax from Discworld
Hoid for sure! He’s got some very sweet interactions with certain characters so he’s obviously able to have empathy for people but we also know he’s working on some big plot and is willing to let lots of people die if it helps with his plan. I love that we really don’t know if he’s trying to save the universe or just aiming at some more selfish goal. Also, I just ordered some Polish Sanderson books and they are beautiful! Arcanum Unbounded has Kelsier on the cover so I had to have it. And then I grabbed a few other ones while I was at it. 😍
One of my faourite grey characters is Skulduggery Pleasant, from the series of the same name by Derek Landy. The tagline of the series is "And _he's_ the good guy." Which at the start you think is a ha ha funny joke because he's a skeleton. But as the series goes on you realise no, Skulduggery is a very dark man. Virtually every character in the series is some shade of morally grey, but Skulduggery most of all. And this is a middle grade series. Other than him, Jaime Lannister, Theon Greyjoy and Sandor Clegane from ASoIaF, Nathaniel from the Bartimaeus Sequence, Yultes Dathirii from City of Spires by Claudie Arseneault and Holland Vosijk from Shades of Magic by V. E. Schwab.
The Dagger and Coin series by Daniel Abraham has some of the best grey characters/ villain progression I’ve seen with Cithrin bel Sarcour, Clara Kalliam and Geder Palliako. Would definitely recommend!
Askeladd was so charismatic at times, it was hard NOT to root for him lol 😄 definitely one of my favorites! And SCAR!! ❤ what a badass, with one of the best character arcs in FMA - and that's saying something! Greed from FMA is up there for me as well. Great list, Elliot!
May I ask where you got your glasses? They are so cute! I haven’t been into reading lately, but I still love watching your videos and they inspire me to read more 😊
Askeladden is also a character from Norwegian folklore and fairytales. Often, if not every time, he was the main protagonist in the different stories. My favourite fairytale is the one where he has a eating contest with a troll. But I heard so much good about the Vinland Saga, so maybe I give it a shot.
One of my favorite characters is Ainz Ooal Gown from Overlord. I personally haven't watched the anime because I didn't like the way the novel was adapted, but the novel is amazing. You may think he's just another main character who got caught up in some generic overpowered isekai trope, but a lot of what he does after his transition makes a lot of sense. He doesn't take his power for granted, and he constantly contemplates and experiments what he can and cannot do, so he can preserve the legacy of his bygone friends. Doing so involves a balance between cooperating with the indigenous people of one country and ruling another with fear and ruthlessness. What I find appealing is inevitable, constant internal conflicts between Suzuki (his former self) and Ainz (the all-powerful overlord). In Volume 14, he claims everything he does is for his and his underlings' happiness, which is a touch of humanity unexpected from a monster like him (Ainz is an undead).
Classics: Frank Churchill from Emma. Edward Rochester from Jane Eyre. Fantasy: King Tremane of Hardorn from the Valedmar series. Father Andrew Hubbard from the All Souls Trilogy. Sci-fi. Sofia Mendez from The Sparrow.
DALINAR!! Oh my gosh, I couldnt stand him in book 3 during the flashbacks. I was like WTF SANDERSON! how can I like him after this. But then THAT MOMENT happens and I was like "ooooh shit this is deep" and by the end I was still rooting for him. But I dont think hes a gray character. I think Dalinar actually changed and chose to be better(and still trying), and gray characters seem to be people stuck in in their back and forth and dont attempt to want to be better because they know right where theyre at is fine.
Im sure hes gonna be on my list, but Glokta. I love him so much and weirdly could really relate to him, mainly the always being in pain part. I love the First Law so much its my favorite series.
Your art, I dont know which one you did first but (oh lord help me on these names bc I havent read either of these) your Glockda? work, if made before your Kaz? work shows alot of improvement. Kaz looks really good. Although I think I can appreciate in your art that your quality fluctuates, because thats just how we do, sometimes I can make something great and the next piece im like...wtf? Do I need to go back to color theory? lol
AH, yes, I thought that I hadn't seen the obligatory Vinland Saga mention in a while! I got a physical, hardbook copy of Six of Crows recently and I so can't wait to read it!
Click. Tap. Pain. Glokta is one of my favorite characters i've read so far. Up there with Dalinar. I'm really looking forward to your deep dive into Dalinar, there is a lot to explore with him. Also what do you think about Andross Guile? Morally grey or villain?
One year late response but I personally reckon Andross falls more on the morally grey side. **Spoilers if you don't want his character arc spoiled** He does some morally reprehensible stuff but he did them cause he genuinely believed he was the Lightbringer (which even after the end could still be argued) and had prophecies to fulfill to save the Chromeria in which he ultimately did play a significant role. Morally compromised piece of shit? I reckon so but not a villain.
How interesting, this is certainly a topic of conversation that doesn't always come up especially with mangas. So if i understand this correctly; morally gray means liking a character or something you aren't supposed to like? I would appreciate any insight on that with examples. Based of that, my morally gray character would be Frieza from Dragon Ball. He's super cruel and savage but his voice, humor, and swagger is kinda entertaining. Also Magneto from Xmen. On the surface it seems like he hates people who aren't mutants and wants to punish them for being discriminatory. However you kinda understand why he wants revenge and you wanna like him even tho his methods are evil. Also killmonger from Black Panther. Anyways I'm probably so getting this video misunderstood but thanks for another fun chat Elliot. Have a lovely Happy Reading Day 💜
Atleast in my opinion, morally gray people arent the villain, and can do decent things, but usually choose not to be better and think where theyre at is just fine. They dont have that "Im doing good for the sake of good" but also dont have "im going to do this bad thing because I enjoy being bad" Frieza I would NOT deem morally gray, straight bad guy. Depending on the issue or movie or whatever, Magneto is definitely Gray. He wants his people not to face injustice anymore, so he does it out of a sense of rightness, but goes about it in an objectively bad way. Just look at days of future past, hes helping the xmen, hes not a villain. Or Xmen 3, after charles dies he doesnt just manically lauigh like, "oh look my nemesis is dead!" Long comment, but yeah, Magneto, definitely Gray! Freiza, definitly not lol
@@lucaleone4331 LOL ok now this morally gray term makes more sense 😄 I think using comic book characters helped me understand it more. I appreciate your in depth answer. It'll be fun think of some more characters once i finish eating. Hope you have a great day!
TToTT oof vinland saga was so good! Askellad is by far the best antagonist ive seen in a while. For other morally dubious character I love all 4 main characters from Steel Crow Saga, its chaotic and they have really fun dynamics between each other
Hiii! New subbie here! Have been binge-watching ur videos for a few days now :P Love it! Also I thonk Kvothe from Name of the wind is a little bit morally gray. If you think about it, his whole journey and all he does is for revenge :P To avenge his family. While he could use his powers for good, but his motives are kinda selfish sometimes. :P But I still love him and find him very human. :)
I LOVE the bride from the movie kill bill. One of my favorite movies ever. I also like roland from the dark tower and jorg from broken empire, not necessarily for their personalities but for what I think they represent as human archetypes
I really liked that you mentioned Vin, becausse everybody agrees that Kelsier is morally grey but I don't see people saying the same for her, but she is exactly as you said and in my opinion is what makes her a really good and complex character^^
Vicious was soo good and both of them are amazing morally grey characters. Strange the Dreamer is on my June TBR and I've seen so many good reviews so my expectations are high 😅
Hey Elliot! I was curious what your #1 choice would be for someone's first adult fantasy book. I've heard of all the hits...Wheel of Time, Sanderson, Malice, Nevernight, Game of Thrones, Malazan, etc., YOU NAME IT I KNOW IT.... I have never read anything sold in the adult fantasy section and I want to know what's a really good one if you have any recomendations. Trying to escape the Cassandra Clare/Sarah J Maas era of reading, at least...for now I am. Thank you! Love your vids
The one that comes to mind off of the top of my head is Cole from the young adult Everneath series. He's one of those that is bad at first and then grows to be better. I cared more about him than the actual couple. He has more character growth than the actual couple.
Which edition of Mistborn is that? It's stunning! I love that cover. I'm reading The Hero of Ages right now, it's my first read-trough of the trilogy and I'm loving it. Vin is an amazing character.
@@popuri48 You are totally welcome and i agree that there's so many great covers out there. I like seeing how creative they get with the overseas editions
My top two favorite morally grey characters are Kelsier, of course, and John Cleaver from Dan Wells' John Cleaver series. I'm only halfway through the first book, I Am Not a Serial Killer, but I'm absolutely hooked. It's about this teenager, John Cleaver, who's obsessed with serial killers and is a sociopath, who is investigating a series of murders in his hometown. I think John is might be my favorite character of all time, at least so far. He's such a good person, despite being a such a bad person. It's confusing but I love him.
Sylens from Horizon Zero Dawn deserves a mention. He's such a fascinating character, obsessed with knowledge of the old world, and probably the most technologically advanced human who still exists in the world. His obsession leads him to doing horrible things, such as theft, deception, and murder; however, he isn't devoid of empathy towards others, such as when he discovers what Ted Faro did to obstruct the new humans from gaining knowledge of the old world, he's absolutely disgusted. Not to mention, I feel like there's still so much we don't know about him, (SEQUEL PLEASE!?). An underrated character for sure.
I don't think Szeth counts as much as a morally gray character, but rather as a victim of his cultural beliefs. Dalinar would say that it is a 50/50, only the young version is morally gray, the older one is of good morality.
for me its gotta be kiritsugu emiya from fate zero , you should definitely check it out its a hella good series imo and inside it exists a lot of interesting characters that are also a morally gray character
Ooooh, there are so many! These (aka the antiheroes) are my favorite types of characters 😊 But let me count down a "few"😅 : Donquixote Doflamingo and Trafalgar Law from One Piece Jaime Lannister, Jorah Mormont, Tywin Lannister and Davos Seawater from GOT/ASIOAF Accelerator from A Certain Magical Index/ A Certain Scientific Railgun/ A Certain Scientific Accelerator Izaya Orihara from Durarara! Nesta Archeon from ACOTAR series Lelouch Lamperouge from Code Geass Makishima Shougo from Psycho Pass Seto Kaiba from Yu-Gi-Oh! 🤣 On the other hand, I laughed out loud when I heard Elle mention Kelsier as a "charismatic" character. I tend to love charismatic characters, but he made me want to throw the book (and him) out of the window. I found him to be extremely unlikable and insufferable (and arrogant and hypocritical and insulting and... I could rant for a long time, I apologize 😅). He's one of the main reasons I dnf-ed Mistborn. And from what I just heard about Vin, it seems highly likely that I would dislike her as well 😅 So I'm quite glad I stopped reading it when I did. Though I'm also glad there are people who like them, even if I cannot figure out the reason why 😁
Raoh from Fist of the North Star is a personal favorite of mine, as he was kind of a necessary evil for the wastelands of the world of 199X. He was very empathetic, manly, badass, and unbelievably hot and romantic. Just, god I love him, but damn does he do some awful things. Karsa Orlong from Malazan is also amazing, as he does do a lot of irredeemable things, but delivers karmic justice and judgement towards those who are far worse than he. He's the noble barbarian archetype taking to the extreme, and done beautifully This one I'm a bit iffy on, as the character himself admits that he's not a redeemable/good person, but I love Ryo Narushima from Shamo. He's an objectively awful person (I am not exaggerating, he is the worst), who will fight for his friends if anyone dares to hurt or abuse them. Not to mention, the plotline with his sister and the events in China shows that he's fully capable of fighting for someone else without any selfish intentions, he's just too much of a Byronic character. No matter how hard people try, he just won't allow himself to be redeemed, because he's rotten all over. He's also the biggest underdog. Despite how much of a garbage person he is, you kind of can't help but root for him at times because of his backstory and what he went through. Ringo Roadagain from Jojo's Bizarre Adventure: Steel Ball Run is also one of my favs. He's such a great character and person, with an amazing backstory. But he's also fully willing to kill anyone, no matter who they are, albeit in a fair duel. Love him, he's beautiful and manly in every way.
Skilgannon or Parmenion by David Gemmell, hopefully, I wrote them right. These are the first who came to my mind, but I'm not sure if Parmenion is totally right. Definitely I'm looking forward to your video about Dalinar's redemption. :)
I wouldn't have thought of Askelad from vinland saga for this list, but great pick. I also would add roland the gunslinger from Stephen Kings Dark Tower series and Light Yagami from Death Note to the list.
This is before having read the last book of lightbringer so my opinion might change but Andross and Gavin Guile are two amazing examples in my opinion.
Hmm, probably anyone in Malazan. But besides that Glokta and Kaz as you mentioned. I also loved Jorg in the Broken Empire series.. which makes me definitely feel like a terrible person haha.
