We deep dive into a behind the scenes look at how BeyondATC approaches the problem of vectoring! More information on our website: www.beyondatc.net Join our Discord to follow progress! / discord
SOLD! I just saw the title of this video and I'm instantly sold. Wanted to wait, even after the updated pricing, until other people started messing with it first. Just sold now. I'll be picking this up immediately on launch.
As far as i know we never saw a delivered product operating as promised. Bit confused on how hyped people can be. They would sell their soul based on a promise.
The reality is most users don't care about this stuff. They just want a good product with expected behavior. And sadly if this stuff is not worked out perfectly the developer will catch hell. But many of us despise the default ATC and this is a rather big deal for immersion. The ones that do understand appreciate your efforts.
I have a theory about that. After about 300 hours of flight time on MSFS I've found that the in-game ATC is actually pretty good... at doing what the in-game flight planner tells it to do. The problem lies with the planner, it sucks absolute ass, but is nescessary in order get atc coverage. But., when you manage to program a flight plan into the plane that matches the one MSFS thinks you're flying exactly, the ATC goves you no trouble what so ever.
@@nicolainielsen7700This is simply not true. Even if you program your flight plan via the in game flight planner, the in-game atc will not be able to comprehend SIDs and STARs. This leads to descend and climb instructions that makes no sense.
@nyamedevries783 Per my own anecdotal evidence, it is absolutely true. I have had only occasional problems (mostly due to high ping and bad internet) for the last ~200 flight hours, mostly in airliners. My step climbs work as they should, and I get told to descent within ±10-15 nautical miles of the path the plane calculates. Approach, final approach, and landing clearance also happen when they should. Unless, of course, there is a discrepancy between what MSFS thinks I am flying and the route that I have input into the plane (for example importing from Simbrief and not double checking/editing per the VFR map). Then nothing works. Also, don't use Simbrief for the route itself, download the simbrief file into the MSFS flight planner, choose the SID, STAR, and final approach manually and input that manually into the FMS/MCDU when in the plane. Simbrief is best used just as a reference for weight and fuel.
And people were complaining about the prices of this product. Look at the size of the problem these guys are facing. Admirable work, it will be the biggest and best addon ever made for FS! I can't wait to buy!
Absolutely, like the price was different for VoxAtc or Pilot2ATC... and the programs were still not great but better than the default stuff. I don't get the complaining either, people are easily shelling 70$ on CoD or some other AAA game but will get horrified to pay something close to this for a program that it's basically 50% of what makes a flight experience...
For me the price of the product itself (even the old I think 60 bucks) were totally fine. My issue is the price per flight while only calculating the AI voice costs. This it what killed it for me and not the one-time price for the tool itself. As better voices are now including in the non-tokenized usage I might give it a try tho as the tool looks awesome
Captain, you have no idea how much we appreciate you. The work you are putting in, to give us a real atc experience, is the most important factor. This will give us a more total immersion than any other product currently available. Please know the adults in the waiting room understand how complicated this project is. We would rather it done right rather than done quickly. And please know, when it's released we will be there to purchase it immediately. Your hard work WILL be rewarded. Thank you for everything you are doing.
Love these deep-dive videos! What's not shown in this video and adds the whole another level of complexity is the pilots not actually following the assigned headings lol. The app must keep track of how far the plane from the designated track is, predict where the plane will end up with this error and make corrections at some point. Let alone you need to separate planes moving with different speeds. And people were complaining the software is more expensive than they expected, jeez, it's such a huge amount of work! Captain, we really appreciate what you and the team are doing!
Thank you for the deep dive, you're doing the right thing; take the time to get it right or really damn close to that. It's cool ...Worth the wait....❤
I already know it's going to be amazing when it comes out just from watching all your previews and demo videos and the commitment you guys put in. I can't wait!!
Amazing complexity of creating such a program. Thank you for sharing a small glimpse into what you all, at Beyond ATC, have to create. It’s difficult to properly imagine all the math that goes into creating a program like Beyond ATC! All of these calculations then have to communicate with MSFS. Amazing!
Having watched this play out in the beta, I can say two things - the vectoring works very well now and is a lot more realistic than anything I've seen in MSFS. Also, the speed at which the dev team implemented these changes was incredible. Captain and team developed this new approach rapidly once it became apparent it was needed, and the results were great. The work the dev team is putting in to make this program the best it can be is incredible. Great vid Captain!
We immensely appreciate the effort put into this software. Please take all the time you need before releasing it. Better polished than a mess of bugs incomplete 😄
I was following it all and thinking - wow that's some calculations and techy stuff you have to work out - which made me in awe of your skills and development but then you said 'of course it's all got to be done in 3D' - then my mind was blown! Brilliant work and so professional. Thanks for keeping us updated. I will be buying it as soon as it comes out.
As an old(er) engineer, pilot and software developer, it's nice to see this elegant effort.. I see you've also covered the vertical component in your demo, as for sure, you need to predict not only x,y but the altitude z at some time t... . Ayk, most departures and arrivals involve vectors and altitude .. nice to see that on your visual graphing there.. Cheap at thrice the price.. !
Thanks for this. I knew that ATC was complex but hadn't considered just how complex it would be to simulate. Just the simple thing like giving vectors to get an aircraft on track for capturing the final approach fix could be rather challenging. Now throw in the complexity of other traffic needing to be sequenced as well as the various rules that need to be followed, along with their exceptions, and you have a long complex problem that you have to find a solution for. Y'all have been doing a lot of amazing work. Am looking forward to getting my hands on this. Haven't been able to enjoy MSFS in a while as the vanilla ATC has not been all that reliable for me and I don't care for trying any of the "Live ATC" options. When it's ready I will be picking this up and getting back to flying.
What a complex matter, it made me feel warm and at the same time I wondered whether you can still sleep. I wish you a lot of success and wisdom in bringing this wonderful project to a successful conclusion because it would be an enormous enrichment of our entire beautiful hobby and we can wait patiently for the release.🤞
First! Can’t wait for this program! The technology that goes into this program to make it “as real as it gets” is unbelievable. Thanks for all your hard work Captain and crew!
O Boy Thanks for this very interesting insight into the hard work you and your team are putting into this program The Technical engineering and issues to solve is "Beyond" me, we all appreciate the very hard work on this. And very much looking forward to using this software as and when it becomes available keep up the great work 👍👍👍👍👍
Really nice to see something like this, maybe if we had this type of thing back when I was starting out there may have been more programmers out there. Excellent job, can't wait to see this on the market!
I am truly flabbergasted! You guys are true geniuses. I like the tech and behind the scenes stuff. I wonder how you guys take the wind component into the calculation? It just takes time to get the program more advanced then the other tools around. Really appreciated. Good luck and I am waiting patiently.
Had the same question re: 5 degree increments. Seems it would make it a little easier. Though I don’t understand the linear path restrictions beyond needing a track and intercept. It’s beyond me.
This is amazing work I don’t know why all the fuss was about your pricing. The time the effort is not unnoticed . I would not have a problem paying what your first price was at $69.00. I would have supported this. I just wanted a very good ATC that works and I think you got it. I don’t do any online flying and your product has it all. I will no patient and wait for it. Thanks for all the hard you and your team has put into this and I hope it’s successful for all of you. to see you at the flight Expo in Vegas.. again thanks for this
Some controllers will give you 5 degree increment HDG assignments, not often but they will. Its most often used when the aircraft will be on that HDG for a longer time than usual, if you fly 5 degrees off course for 60nm, you will be 5nm off the intended point. That is why they will use it when vectoring distances more than like 15nm where a 5 degree off course HDG will put you 1.25nm off the intended point, or more than 30nm where 5 degrees off will put you 2.5nm off of the intended point. Another common thing they will say is "Turn 5 degrees (Left/Right)" to correct you closer to the point they want you at. This could be helpful if the aircraft being vectored overshoots the desired track line (Point A) and you want them to just turn a little bit back toward the desired point where the desired track line intersects the next desired track line (point B).
Great work Captain and the rest of the team, looks absolutely amazing. And thanks for the insights into the development, for most it might not be as interesting. But for people like myself who are into programming and or just generally interested in the development and learning with this kind of content it’s a real treat! Much success to you and the team. Impressive how fast you’re implementing everything lately. Stoked for the eventual release! Thanks!
Simply amazing. The amount of work and skill involved is mind boggling. At $29.99 this is going to be the bargain of the century. Well explained too. I sort of understood it .....🤔
Very interesting😊 Just my point of view, as i am an ATC Most of the time now, we use RNAV point which is the most eficient way to guide an aircraft We barely vector to follow a track So what is a the point of vectoring an aircraft? Sequencing or separate planes So when we give a vector, we have to visualize a target in space in time in the future Visualizing the closest point between 2 planes in the future is the tricky part of the job😄
And for sequecing on final, imagine an aircraft just passing the FAF at time H, your target for the next aircaft is the FAF at H+1m30 (if sequencing time for the runway is 1m30) Next aircraft at the FAF H+3min and so on So vectors are given to be at the right position, at the right time
I’ve been in the conceptual design business for many years, and here is what I’ve learned: never present a price for a product without what you would consider the final product. Doing so, leaves the client with 1 option (to decide on price). Showing them the product presents the 2 most important questions (value and cost). More importantly, it posits the question and the answer to be rendered by them and only them. Captain, if I may offer some advice, it is not for you to convince them (only they can do that). If you think about it… what you are producing is verging art and no amount of money will ever compensate you for that. How ironic it is that by putting a price tag on something that we so often devalue it. 😢
Ignore the naysayers. You guys are going an amazing job. Day one purchase here. Will probably spend the extra 10 bucks a month on the premium voices as well.
Great stuff. You lost me a bit on the maths, but I get the concept. Clever! What about crosswinds though? Would you not use track rather than heading to determine where the plane will hit the virtual line? P.S. Will we get a preview of aircraft on approach into a big airport? I wanna see how BATC handles Heathrow 27L with 4 birds all lined up 90 seconds apart! haha
So why isn't it released yet? What's taking so long? How hard can it be? :-) Because it's really really difficult! Fascinating insight, thanks for sharing.
Interesting. I have a question. Why does ATC issue vectors that cannot be published? Why should it make a route with other than 040 or 050 if it can't? You can argue that it is the best and most convinient route to avoid terrain or whatever, but in reality, it ends up off course! I reckon the issueing is where the problem might be. Publish the best route with only 040, 050, 060 and so on. I might be completely wrong. Great work non the less, and thanks!
Great work... only thing that concerns me is 10deg off can be quite a lot in distance (1:60 rule)... depending how far you travel 10deg off track... OR will it end up being no more than +/- 5deg based on whole 10deg values? Will it always go to the greater req value? Is there a distance limit on vectors (just for approach)? Or can you get vectors under IFR to cross CAS (transits)? I bet it's a HUGE amount of work and the deeper you go the bigger it gets!
I'm not really knowledgable about the correct radio phraseology you are suppose to use talking to ATC, and that is what has kept me too intimidated to try VATSIM, where I would worry all the handholding I would need would mess up the flow for everyone else. I have seen others say the same. How does Beyond ATC work as a teaching tool for learning how to talk to ATC? Could you make a video that demos what BeyondATC does when someone is using layman's speech, forgetting things, or using the wrong words, so we can see how it does with correcting and teaching?
Vectoring after arrival is the main thing i want this program to get right. The program I use now will get you there all right but after arrival vectors you with commands it doesn't even give you time to complete .
I need more videos where the plane is moved around the screen with a mouse. much realism, many delight :D ha ha ha really helpful video though, really interesting
If there is a named waypoint, will it tell use to go direct to that waypoint instead of giving us a heading? (And BTW, will it always rely on the latest AIRAC data?)
Only question I had was can I buy a refill of premium voices and then turn them on just part of the time while I’m entertaining friends and then off otherwise
Really appreciate your hard work and the recent price drop (which I am not sure is sustainable for free PTT and Basic voice but hope I'm wrong). Isn't the product ready for open beta though? Yes, the purists will moan, but they can wait 😏. ICAO is vital to me though. Most pilots aren't in the US😊
captain, ty for your video now my dudes talking to the ones stayed until the end of the video and some "youtubers" praising a $30/month shit and not this masterpiece . You see how these things are done for 1 plane..now add the traffic as well and do the math
How do you handle "mountains on both sides" scenarios? You can't allow for too much deviation, lest the aircraft hit something while following your adjusted flight path.
Hopefully Microsoft fully unlocks the Xbox one day so devs can max their potential income and allows us more options. Navigraph has figured a way so hopefully everyone can.
Couldn't you give a correction vector directly to the point when the bearing to the point is +-20 off the initial vector. I would think that is more realistic and simpler. I suppose it adds one more vector given.
Don’t forget at 13:50 that ATC are humans and also they have a reaction time and isn’t always the same for all the situations and there’s many type of performance aircraft.
Just sayin you guys should also add a var for human reaction like random time for every command or vector given by ATC. Between stations and controllers within the station. Getting a little more geek. ;) nice work by the way keep it going!
Appreciate the video. Humanity is a fickle beast - I get that - but still cant quite get head around the fact viwers are told to skip if they dont want the techie bit then sit through it and throw a "yawn" comment. Bloody poor show. It is a wee bit beyond me and do get the great circle and rhumb line idea as we are dealing with a curved surface but can one not simply work with a vector between 2 gps points? This constantly updated until you get the figure (heading) you need inclusive of a little lead time? Is it too resource intensive to keep grabbing plane gps pos? Like I say - layman here!
Is there a way in the final application to set Ai and ATC to lets say basic us voice no matter where in the world you are? The basic german voice sounds like someone who is talking in german but with english words. Its sadly pretty far from a real german english accent. The premium german voice is amazing
