Biblical Studies is a Circus Show | Dr. Richard C. Miller

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Biblical Studies is a Circus Show | Dr. Richard C. Miller
Grab his book Resurrection and Reception in Early Christianity
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Get ready for a captivating and thought-provoking RU-vid extravaganza featuring the irreverent intellect of Dr. Richard C. Miller! In this unfiltered and razor-sharp monologue, Dr. Miller fearlessly raises his concerns about the current state of Bible scholarship, shedding light on the unfortunate reality of academics often finding themselves entangled in a never-ending negotiation with fervent faith proponents. Buckle up as he fearlessly dismantles the sacred cows of the field and unabashedly calls out the Society of Biblical Literature, labeling it a veritable circus show that lacks the seriousness required for true scholarly discourse. With his signature blend of wit and erudition, Dr. Miller challenges the status quo, daring his viewers to question long-held assumptions and venture into uncharted intellectual territory. Brace yourself for a no-holds-barred intellectual ride that will leave you both enlightened and entertained, as Dr. Richard C. Miller fearlessly speaks truth to power and injects a much-needed dose of intellectual honesty into the realm of biblical scholarship.
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28 май 2023

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Комментарии : 633

@MythVisionPodcast Год назад

Grab his book Resurrection and Reception in Early Christianity 👉 amzn.to/35FqNYf

@DoreenBellDotan Год назад

I'm so terribly sorry that the Pharisees veered away from the Prophetic Tradition and, in so doing not only led generations of Jews astray but also engendered Christianity, which took Pharisaic errors in interpretation even more far afield. My sincerest suggestion to Westerners is to look deeply into Stoicism.

@DoreenBellDotan Год назад

Please read what I am about to write carefully because it is not something that you've heard before and it is best that it is not colored in your mind by that which you've heard previously. God does not appear anywhere in Torah. I'll say that again. God does not appear anywhere in Torah. God is so beyond anything that we can comprehend or talk about that referencing about God is impossible. God has no name, no designation, no characteristics. God does not exist. Existence is one of God's creations. We cannot talk about that which does not exist. Even now, I am referring to your ideas about God, not God. The Tetragrammaton is not God and not God's name. I'll say that again. The Tetragrammaton is not God. The Tetragrammaton is the highest, holiest version of the Creation. The Rabbis, when they were exiled from the Place that is called HaShem because they rejected the Prophetic tradition and started making Torah into a law book, made HaShem into a god because HaShem was no longer their ambient reality. So, they worship what they cannot experience as a god.

@DoreenBellDotan Год назад

Most people think that the Torah is a finished product. It's not. It's the seeds. To try to read Torah as though it is telling narratives and giving instructions about how to conduct ceremonies is like thinking that DNA is the finished organism. I'll prove what I'm saying in the Hebrew response to this comment. If you don't read Hebrew, put it into a translation function.

@DoreenBellDotan Год назад

ב"ה עברית = 682 = התעברה ספר = 340 = זרע מחיה תורה = 611 = את הרה ספר תורה = 951 = את הרה זרע מחיה

@DoreenBellDotan Год назад

The Christians misunderstood the concept of 'immaculate conception'. The correct immaculate conception is the understanding of those who consciousness knows how to build worlds out of the Torah. Just as a egg cell has to know how to deconstruct and reconstruct the genetic information in a sperm cell, so the consciousness needs to know how to unpack the information in Torah and use it to build worlds. The Prophets know how to do this. The Rabbis haven't a clue.

@alflyle9955 Год назад

For those folks like me, here's a helpful hint: SBL stands for Society of Biblical Literature. SBL describes itself as "SBL, a membership organization with over 7,000 scholars, is the oldest and largest learned society devoted to the critical investigation of the Bible from a variety of academic disciplines. Through its work, SBL supports scholarly research and fosters the public understanding of the Bible and its influence."

@talithaleah6563 Год назад

Oh my goodness, thank you!

@dbarker7794 Год назад

Alf here leading us out of the desert. Thank you! I went through about thirty definitions, all wrong.

@ANCIENTWARRI0R Год назад

This should be pinned at the top. So helpful.

@ChristianSoldier71 Год назад

ATTENTION!!! I am here to proclaim that Jesus Christ is the only true savior for the world. If you deny Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, you will not see the Kingdom of Heaven. Jesus loves you and He died for your sins and on the third day, He arose from the grave. Jesus Christ is alive!! REPENT, believe in your heart and confess with your mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord and you will be saved. MARK 1:15 For the Kingdom of God is at hand, repent and believe in the gospel.

@talithaleah6563 Год назад

@@ChristianSoldier71 it’s okay, there is no such thing as sin, and none of us will be tortured after death because we will be dead. You don’t have to be afraid of end times, you will die at some point, hopefully a long time from now without a lot of pain, but no demons are coming for you.

@dmichael100 Год назад

This is interesting to hear. I did Masters and Ph D studies at a confessional institution where you did have to sign a statement of faith when enrolling in classes each semester. I left with an almost finished PhD because I could not in good conscience sign the statement another time. I was a member and attended both SBL (Society of Biblical Literature) and ETS (Evangelical Theological Society) gatherings. In fact, those two events are normally scheduled at the same time and place each year- SBL occurring after ETS. There was a big discussion when I was in seminary about how SBL lacked the faith commitments of ETS. There was big hullabaloo because some ETS scholars were "witnessing" at SBL and SBL put out a statement that prohibited it. So to hear now, that SBL's scholarship is shackled by faith commitments is interesting to say the least. My own serious study of the Bible and other early Christian writings convinced me to disavow a 4- decades long faith. In my experience. most "Christian scholarship" is very earnest, bright young students desperate to keep answering the question "IT HAS TO BE REAL DOESN'T IT?". If they can do that with, what can only be described as a a "scholarly veneer" over it, it soothes increasingly troubled minds plagued with cognitive dissonance.

@stevebeary4988 Год назад

@@2fast2block Have you read Genesis? I think someone read it for you.

@rembrandt972ify Год назад

@@2fast2block "The 1LofT states that energy can't be created or destroyed, it can't happen naturally." The First Law states it cannot happen, not that it can't happen unless a God pulls a miracle out of his ass. "It is clear creation had to be done supernaturally at some point yet it is still denied because people are just too proud to accept that, among other things." Have you ever heard of psychological projection?

@mrwolley1741 Год назад

What book recommendations would you make of works that helped you in your journey?

@ChristianSoldier71 Год назад

@dmichael100 Год назад

@@mrwolley1741 Good question. First, I had the luxury of serious bible study at the PhD level and reading other ancient material especially the vast collection of pseudepigrapha, apocrypha, classic Greek and Roman writers (Livy, Cicero, Lucretius, Seneca, Diodorus Siculus, Hesiod, Epicurus and others) made it clear that the biblical writings are not unique and certainly not divinely inspired. First, I should add that the reading of the biblical material itself showed me their historically contingent nature- the readings of other writings around the time of the Old and New Testament material put in into context. I discovered at the highest scholarly levels, the argument that the biblical writings are unique is farcical. But that is material of a more academic nature and few people have the time , luxury and/or skill set to study such material- though Christian apologists use bits and pieces with which to prop up their claims. But I think you mean more accessible books from others who have made the same journey. There are far more of those than I dreamed (when I had the courage to admit biblical Christianity was not true, I thought I was largely alone as a decades-long believer). "Why I Believed" by Kenneth W. Daniels- a former missionary and Wycliffe bible translator. His journey was so genuinely related (he even prints his prayers to God as he fights to retain his faith- I prayed almost identical words - it was striking!) *"Childish Things" -Dave Warnock *Empty the Pews" a collection of former believers' stories *"Four Disturbing Questions" Tim Sledge- another former pastor of many years The above are all former believers like me so I found their writings more relevant than the atheists who have never been believers though I have the highest respect for Sam Harris" work. The never-believed atheists can be quickly dismissed by believers ("They have never felt what I felt- they don't understand") I used the same dismissal when I was an active Christian apologist. *Bart Ehrman is a former believer and top-notch Greek scholar-so you get some of both. His book "God's Problem" was one I found particularly prescient. One of the main questions I have tried to answer since discarding Christian belief was "What keeps so many choosing to believe dogma even though it is demonstrably untrue?" and "How did religious belief emerge and shift through history?" "Two books titled "The Origins of Christianity" are excellent- one by Archibald Robertson and the other by Thomas Whittaker *The Evolution of God" by Robert Wright is wide in scope and contains enlightening observations Here's a good one: "The Ark Before Noah"- showing how closely the flood account in Genesis follows an indisputably earlier Mesopotamian story- one that just came to light in the last 20 years and is older than even Gilgamesh. *The best theological work I've read on contemporary Christian belief is by a former believer/scholar titled "Theology After the Death of God" by L. Ron Schultz. It is a little academic- not an easy read, but excellent. *The Denial of Death" - Pulitzer Prize psychological/sociological work by Ernst Becker. That should get you started at least.

@tonydarcy1606 Год назад

"Biblical studies is a circus show". Couldn't agree more. By and large these characters are not interested in history, they're only interested in what backs up their faith. In the same way as the "vulgar economists" are not interested in how capitalism actually works, but only in justifying its existence.

@tomrudolsen6235 Год назад

BIBLICAL STUDYING IS IMPORTANT TO LEARN WHAT GOD HAS TO SAY, AND NOT BEING A FOLLOWER OF A POPE OR SOME ROSARY OR AVE MARIAS. IF YOU ARE TIRED OF WHAT YOU HAVE LEARNED, THEN TRY AND SEE IT IN A FRESH PRSPECTIVE ❤😊😮👍👌😎😉

@tomrudolsen6235 Год назад

PERSPECTIVE ....SORRY 😎

@letsomethingshine Год назад

Bibliolatry? Which canon and why? Why Jesus/Joshua quote book of Enoch but it not included? Which version of said canon? Which edition of said version? why? Why would a true god/gaut/gott/goth fail in both Islam and Christianity?

@tomrudolsen6235 Год назад

I DO NOT THINK BIBLE STUDYING HAS BECOME A SHOW, ONLY TO THE EXTENT THAT MAINSTREAM MEDIA HAS PUSHED ITSELF INTO EVERYTHING AND EVERYTHING HAS BECOME MORE INDIFFERENT. YET YOU CAN STILL BE SERIOUS ABOUT IT ! 😎

@MichaTheLight Год назад

@@tomrudolsen6235 Seems a lot of fun having imaginary friends. There could be smth on the other side buts not an old fart sending lightening in your as* cause your were disobedient. Most of us are to dumb to understand NDE's or OBE's that's the only phenomena regarding afterlife. But the stupidity of us ants leads to the fact that we see smth may even an entity and smack it must be God. If I would be that entity I would be embarrassed if an ant declares me as the ant God and the ant declares itself the crown of creation on the base of a brief look on me 😂

@Teejaye1100 Год назад

I’m not going to lie, I can sit in front of Dr. Miller all day as he talks about this and soak it all up. Got dam, I love when Professors can be 100% honest about the Bible and it’s history. Intellectually honesty matter for me. Thanks Derek for this gem.

@Teejaye1100 Год назад

@@2fast2block Are you saying that it’s clear creation had to be done supernaturally at some point, so it is Yahweh/Jesus as this creator of the universe?

@travis1240 Год назад

@@2fast2block sorry but that just doesn't follow. "Some magic happens here, therefore God" isn't a valid line of reasoning. Acting like some ancient book can answer modern questions of science through magic is completely dishonest.

@ChristianSoldier71 Год назад

@lynnbaker2336 Год назад

My problem is the fact that, while I have an intellectual agreement with most, if not all of this, I cannot deny the fact that I have experienced God on a supernatural level.

@Teejaye1100 Год назад

@@lynnbaker2336 Not to take away anything from you, these other groups like Hindu, Shintu, Mormons, Islam, Gnostics, Kemetism etc have experienced God on a supernatural level also.What do you think of that? Could it be everyone is just experiencing a human experience?

@rainbowkrampus Год назад

Great conversation. It was one of the most surprising things when I first started getting into this stuff that so much of what was considered foundational in Biblical studies was based on junk arguments and that much of the field was wholly divorced from empiricism, sound epistemology and basic logic. Hector Avalos was talking about this a more than a decade ago in a real serious way and we've got guys going back to at least the 70's talking about how the field needs to reorient itself towards teaching true, verifiable things and working against dogmatism. It's no wonder the US has such a massive problem with fundamentalism. The people whose job should at a minimum be to moderate between theology and fact have let theology run rough shod over fact for decades.

@rainbowkrampus Год назад

@@mgbilby Couldn't have said it better myself.

@annascott3542 Год назад

@@mgbilby the discipline is so compromised is a scandal, I’m of the opinion that there’s no place for it at secular universities and it their Departments if they have one should be abolished, rolled into classics & other related fields, and relegated to only the seminaries.

@annascott3542 Год назад

100% on board with everything Dr. Miller said here.

@tonycook7679 Год назад

@@2fast2block this is a complete non-sequitur. You can't connect these two ideas like this, it's nonsense.

@tonycook7679 Год назад

me too

@Isaac5123 Год назад

@@annascott3542 good question

@theseustoo Год назад

@@annascott3542 It seems that Tony Cook was responding not to you, but to someone (whom I've had previous encounters with and who is a fundamentalist Christian) with the pseudonym '2fast2block', which the latter either changed his mind about and removed himself, or was so embarrassed by Tony's response that he removed it himself, or just possibly, was so hateful that it was removed by the YT censors. (My money would probably be on either of my first two suggestions.) Evidently it was removed before you saw either comment. Have a nice day! 🙂

@ChristianSoldier71 Год назад

@kariannecrysler640 Год назад

Refreshingly genuine and sincere. I like his style 💯

@dennisquinn7729 Год назад

Good to see Dr. Miller. Haven't seen him since we worked together on Sacred History Magazine 20 years ago.

@Mr.PeabodyTheSkeptic Год назад

One of the best explanations for the poor reasoning from within apologetics and it's defenders. Great. Great video. This is saved on my playlist.

@JamesTaborVideos Год назад

Really great interview Derek and Richard...I have less and less interest in the SBL for the reasons you mention. Do you remember when Jonathan Z. Smith, my teacher, agreed to serve as President--his reasons are most interesting, see his Presidential address. It was classic, in a word: we history of religion folk want to STUDY you guys! As in the famous quip variously attributed to Scholem and others with various phrasing: Magic is nonsense, but the study of magic, ah, that is scholarship.

@DaithiMcG Год назад

THANK YOU. I feel heard... SO refreshing to hear Dr. Miller's take on the state of biblical studies and to call it out for what it is! -DF

@epochalypsemeow5732 Год назад

@@2fast2block Doesn’t matter how many times you comment this on different posts, it’s not gonna make any more sense. It’s not clear it had to be supernatural lol

@epochalypsemeow5732 Год назад

@@2fast2block There’s nothing to tackle. I’ll listen to scientists thank you very much. That’s where progress is made.

@epochalypsemeow5732 Год назад

@@2fast2block And notice who resorted to attacking character first. That’s pretty telling in itself.

@stevesheppardmusic Год назад

@@2fast2block it's ok, I understand, it's difficult being part of a cult.

@ChristianSoldier71 Год назад

@MrArdytube Год назад

For many of us who have left the faith, we can look back upon how we kept pockets of hidden deference that likely took years to leave behind. We continue to have moments of realization that there is yet one more bit of dogma that remains unobtrusively embedded in our perception of reality. I identified as an agnostic for decades before I finally admitted to myself that I was actually an atheist

@26beegee Год назад

Ending this very serious discussion with Dr. Miller’s son is brilliant (and very cute)!

@DL-rl9bd Год назад

Derek, you always have all of the best guests on your podcast. Binge-watching these videos with Dr. Miller on this Memorial Day weekend. Thank you and take care, brother.

@trevanhatch8717 Год назад

I would say that most SBL members aren’t at prestigious nondenominational schools. Probably 2/3 are at theological schools. Literally 70% of the book vendors at SBL are Christian presses. Almost everything about SBL is faith based.

@AlanMordue-hx5wv 2 месяца назад

I am a British member of SBL and I understand your view. I am very skeptical but I know loads of sincere people across the views!! I have been in this mad world since 1987 in bookselling and publishing.

@Ken_Scaletta Год назад

The idea of a faith commitment is diametrically opposed to the whole idea of scholarship. Requiring a scholar to say they'll never change their mind is essentially forbidding them to do scholarship. I have much appreciation for scholars like Dr. Miller who are willing to pursue honesty and truth even to the extinction of their own faith, and for not being willing to bend the knee to cultic (yes cultic) control. No other field of study requires anything like that. It's bizarre and anti-intellectual. It's scary. It's literal brainwashing.

@annascott3542 Год назад

Absolutely right.

@annascott3542 Год назад

It’s outlandish & desperate.

@Arven8 Год назад

I had no idea that about 50% of mainstream biblical scholars were intellectually compromised in that way. I don't believe this will change any time soon, because the majority of people who are interested and motivated enough in intensive study of the Bible are bound to be believers.

@solomonessix6909 Год назад

I’ve never heard anyone us the word “Shaman” to refer to Christian pastors, BUT I feel it's appropriate and fits them so well.

@julianmarsh8384 Год назад

I have more respect for shamans. At least with their first appearance in the Old Stone Age, they did serve a useful function...religious leaders today, uh, not so much.

@alstewart6870 Год назад

Didn’t u watch the video???

@SouthGallaecian Год назад

Would love to see a conversation between Richard Miller and Richard Carrier. They share so much that they would have the opportunity of exploring issues that don't typically get discussed.

@Marabarra134 11 месяцев назад

would be great yes

@timelston4260 9 месяцев назад

I met Richard Carrier. Not impressed. He seems to like stirring controversy rather than getting at truth. Richard Miller, by contrast, seems motivated to know, not speculate for dramatic effect.

@tumblebugspace Год назад

Excellent discussion raising important issues within biblical scholarship. Cute little guy there at the end, too! ☮️❤️🐾

@nedsantos1415 Год назад

Religion. If it's not about a sense of "belonging," then it's about "wealth" or "power" or both.

@HarmonicAtheist Год назад

Really loving these videos!

@kariannecrysler640 Год назад

@@2fast2block what is always was and will be. The only creation in biblical mythology is the fables. The winding down you mentioned could easily be part of a cycle like everything else in nature. You do not have to believe in these things, but they are just as valid an explanation.

@suejohnson4144 Год назад

Thank you. Thank you.

@fancymcclean6210 Год назад

Interesting. I find it sad, that in our supposed 'age of rationality' this needs to be mentioned at all. Supernatural constructs have no place in rigorous academic scholarship regardless of the topic. I found the 'heart surgery' analogy very illuminating. Keep up the good work fellas. Just purchased a copy of Dr Miller's book and looking forward to reading about his thesis. May Lord Woden protect you. 😉 Flaxen Saxon.

@Herschel1738 Год назад

My spouse was having a colonoscopy done at a small local hospital in a small rural southern county. The doctor comes in once a month from a large city nearby to perform the procedures. After all the paperwork was done, the doctor asked if my spouse wanted to pray with him. We both were kind of startled and said "No, thanks" to which I added "I prefer to put my faith in you skills as a doctor, not in your ability to pray." But it is kind of scary to put yourself under the knife of a doctor whom you may have offended by rebuffing his "sincere Christian offer of God's protection".

@letsomethingshine Год назад

The theologians do not see what they are doing as "heart surgery" they see it as culturally important "painting" and thus they want to stick to certain saleable/popular/"official" styles like Egyptian wall scribes did.

@MichaelWalker-de8nf Год назад

The young man at the end really wrapped the conversation perfectly!!! Well done 👏 ❤

@TheJacrespo Год назад

Money and power these are the truly goals behind. Apologetics is all about power and money as it has been ever.

@ivtch51 Год назад

Richard's book arrived in the post today so looking forward to a deep, focused read at some stage soon. Yes this competing 'secular/academic against theological interests' divide affects me at times on my B A Theol course too. Our lecturer recently brought up a piece of outdated data surrounding gay sexuality research in class; 20 years out of date. I felt totally misrepresented and misunderstood and so wanted to point this out. Except for this incident of misrepresentation, I have no idea where this lecturer lies along the progressive to conservative theological spectrum but my cautious radar of survival skills was/is up. I will remember this incident and when this course is complete I will politely email to point out this error and say why I was compelled to remain silent.

@debrawehrly6900 Год назад

I appreciate and respect what uou said about valuing people more than being right. Unfortunately, i had made that mistake by stating my opinion on a friend's blog.

@johnobrien6415 9 дней назад

Derek, I've got to hand it to you. Over the years your interviewing skills have improved, and the guests you get on to speak are top notch. I hope this doesn't come off wrong, but the early stuff you seemed a little goofy and some of the guests I had to wonder about. These are all good, high quality professional talks, conversations and interviews you have on your show, You seem more knowledgeable, and at ease. It's like you've been trying to grow into this role, this field. This is some guy to be taken serious. Some day it'll be the young buck trying to break into the field who'll be interviewing you. Then the student will have become the master. You will have taken the pebble from my hand. It will be time for you to leave.

@AngeloNasios Год назад

Good conversation, much needed.

@Lionofjudah333 Год назад

I agree. It's more than remembering the truth, its another to go out and become the truth.

@pizzazombie7373 Год назад

Incredible interview!! Thank you!!

@robdavinroy1761 Год назад

Simply Fantastic. I cannot say enough about Derrick bringing this courageous man to RU-vid for all to hear. I’m excited that a new golf league has started and can’t wait to eventually get to the putting green of historical truth. But we cannot take our approach shots to the pin until the apologists clear off on the green. Or do we just hit the ball toward the green anyway and yell “Four!!!” ??

@scottgoulette8900 Год назад

Hahaha... as an avid golfer myself that is a great analogy, even if you got the idea from Dr. Miller lol

@barryjones9362 Год назад

I can't believe I was ever dense enough to pay $300 per month to Calvary Chapel back in the early 1990's so I could earn a "certificate" in "bible studies" by listening to endless tapes of Chuck Smith's sermons...a certificate that meant precisely nothing outside the specific Calvary chapel I was attending.

@ELL289 11 месяцев назад

You weren’t the only one. We used to quote CHUCK in hushed tones!

@Dr.Anti-Theist Год назад

Some of the current MV content and interviews I've watched is absolute fire. WOW!

@elliotwalton6159 Год назад

If you want a grant in any discipline you have to subscribe to the orthodoxy of that discipline. I am a person of both faith and deep skepticism. I have every sympathy for Dr. Miller's position. But to think that theology is the only voodoo taught at universities is naivete of the highest order.

@jillphilips3788 Год назад

God BLESS YOU

@djfrank68 Год назад

It's nice for me to hear someone as credentialed and articulate as Dr Miller, verbalize many ideas and opinions that I've had bouncing around in my head for years.

@librulcunspirisy Год назад

Thanks 👍

@entwood Год назад

So good to have the insider's view of what Carrier, Price and Fitzgerald have been telling us about for years.

@alexlarsen6413 Год назад

Dr. Miller is such a legend!! 👍👍 Loved seeing his kid there at the end!

@martyalmberg9317 Год назад

good video, great talk!

@willmosse3684 Год назад

It would be useful if you started this by telling us what exactly SBL is. I know many people watching probably know already, but not all of us. I can deduce it is some kind of Biblical studies network, but a full definition would be good. Otherwise, at 8 mins in it’s very interesting. Thanks

@HarmonicAtheist Год назад

Loved seeing your son at the end!!

@annascott3542 Год назад

Love it!! Haha I love that he called them shamans, lol

@VoxUrania 11 месяцев назад

There are walls in Classics that are surprisingly similar to these debates. Without signing declarations of faith, there are still gates of admission around religion in the ancient world. Even garden-variety anachronism plays a role. The Academy as a human institution allows careerism to outweigh evidence.

@_Niddy_ Год назад

End credit. amazing

@jmaniak1 Год назад

People are deserving of respect. Ideas should not have the same privilege.

@jamesswagerty16 Год назад

At least one verse in the Bible is absolutely true. Ecclesiastes 9:5 For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten.

@davidaaronhill5680 Год назад

Love it! No tiptoeing around.

@babisbabinos8075 Год назад

All I see is tiptoeing.

@joshua6244 Год назад

Biblical studies in the UK don't require people to sign confessions of faith. Academics at most universities are not shackled. At Oxford and Cambridge many theology academics are college chaplains and so have to be Anglican clergy and, for example, at Christ Church college, Oxford theology academics are canons of the cathedral (which is part of the college). Many of those clergy are what might be termed "radical" in their views with no sanction. But at the other universities you could be an atheist professor of theology. No university requires students to sign up to any faith statement.

@antonius_006 Месяц назад

Searching for the truth and Psychological Balance requires honor. History of Compared Religions / Psychology of Religions is the way to go. Carl Jung (Answer to Job) and Reza Aslan (Zealot) touched on this subject.

@TheBackyardProfessor Месяц назад

Sounded like he described Mormon studies. They also have the answers before they even begin the research, and then only use info that gives them the answer they want.

@fredmcelroy2839 Год назад

I just finished G.A. Wells book ‘Did Jesus Exist?’ And it has helped me regain some sanity.

@60th60th Год назад

Excellent throughout!

@timothymarkonis3630 Год назад

In the abstract philosophical and/or spiritual realm of rational reason-based intellectual discussion, any system of thinking or believing that requires an a priori expression of faith or conviction other than that which is firmly grounded in the precepts of the rationally objective and rigorously empirically based Scientific Method is tantamount to putting your thumb on the scales from the outset of any further intellectual inquiry. Something that is not only irrational, but ANTI-rational.

@kaidruhlusa Год назад

In the physical sciences, the scientific method is based on the a priori expression of faith or conviction that experimental data can be predicted from mathematical equations. As Einstein noted, there is no explanation for that, in the context of the physical sciences.

@loyisog4795 Год назад

Love love this channel. Thanks Derek, we don’t deserve you

@chuckyfarley9465 Год назад

@@2fast2blockan eternal cosmos is just as likely as an eternal God. Good luck.

@ChristianSoldier71 Год назад

@chuckyfarley9465 Год назад

@@ChristianSoldier71 I am here to proclaim that cheese tastes good, and that the God of the Bible is a capricious thug that likes to hide. But, don't worry only cheese is real.

@MrArdytube Год назад

❤❤❤ love the boy doing the outro

@johnsimca7093 Год назад

As an amateur interested in biblical studies who can i trust?

@jefffloyd9671 Год назад

I'll be heading to patreon in a few. I have to hear everything with this man.

@markmanenator Год назад

I'm like him. I need raw data. Understanding the origin can not also lead to visibility, but can calso bring us together in a modern context. Those were people. They were trying to understand their world, or not. We lost the Library of Alexandria to fanatics, today we would lose our freedoms, the true God given right to exist and thrive.

@chrisdiver6224 Год назад

Friends, this is the third discussion of yours I've watched and I still don't have a clear understanding of what Dr Miller's groundbreaking contribution is because you haven't provided a basic synopsis of it. Can you point me to a video where he discusses that specific content, please?

@dakrontu Год назад

Imagine Chemistry classes in Alchemist seminaries that obstruct real Chemists, seeing them as eccentric for challenging unevidenced dogma. Or Astronomy classes full of Astrologers. Or Math classes full of Numerologists. Or Psychology classes full of Demonologists and Exorcists. Or Paleontology classes full of Creationists. Or Medicine classes full of Faith Healers and Homeopaths. Or Dead Sea Scrolls classes full of Catholic priests anxious to censor anything contradicting their dogma. Or Anaesthesiology classes full of fanatics who think it sinful not to suffer pain. Or Microscopy classes full of fanatics who think it blasphemy to see the minute handiwork of their Creator. We can all understand how such horrific circumstances would have held us back (or indeed did). I appreciate the despair-inducing frustration of being an open-minded researcher into religious texts.

@johnnehrich9601 Год назад

Too many universities are dependent on donations from wealthy alumni, etc. who are going to push their biblical studies in a direction which might be contrary to what the administration themselves feel is good (assuming they even see this need).

@ChristianSoldier71 Год назад

@johnnehrich9601 Год назад

@@ChristianSoldier71 There are 783,137 words in the bible. Do you really think your couple of paragraphs are going to convert me and any non-believer who reads your comment when all those words that supposedly god wrote didn't? What hubris!

@ChristianSoldier71 Год назад

@@johnnehrich9601 I planted a seed in your heart that will never go away. The great thing is that you came back for another and now I have the opportunity to tell you once more that Jesus loves you and He died for your sins. Once you die, it will be too late to repent. Jesus Christ is the only one who can save you from the fires of Hell. Repent and put your faith in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior today, we are not guaranteed tomorrow. Have a great day!

@nekanoh Год назад

Thanks!

@MythVisionPodcast Год назад

Thank you for that superthanks

@vincents.6639 Год назад

What is SBL?

@roddyboethius1722 Год назад

Good talk 💯

@user-vg4px3uh8h 23 дня назад

This will improve around the same time when it will be okay for a politician or candidate to say he or she is an atheist.

@kjmav10135 Год назад

100% YES to this. I was in the AAR part of the AAR/SBL marriage, and I avoided those SBL people like the plague for the very reasons he is suggesting.😂😂

@kjmav10135 Год назад

Oh my word. You really are confused about the difference between science and religion, aren’t you? Very creative, mixing categories of knowledge like that, but chock full of logical fallacy. Maybe you would benefit from a logic class or two.

@battlerushiromiya651 Год назад

As a still living religion, it is strange if adaoting the message to todays time is something not accepted. That should be plainly obvious thing to happen at divinity schools. It is not like other religions dont get to tailor the understanding of these texts to their religions growth and survivial. If you want to be factually honest, go to a history department or classics department, let divinity schools help in people grow in faith, as they were intended to be.

@wabisabi6875 Год назад

5:42 "Having the answers before they know the questions; that's not a scientific approach." BINGO! Anyone engaged in free inquiry must be prepared to abandon their opinions, no matter how long-held or cherished they may be.

@waderogers 16 дней назад

About the only way we could know the methods used by Mark, Matthew, Luke, and John to write their gospels would to be to have lived during the time the gospels were compiled and to sit with the authors while they were researching these early 'Jesus' stories, incorporating Greco-Roman myths and legends into an obscure new religion, having people find resource material regarding the history and geography of Israel, etc. Then, and only then, could we know their methods and motives for writing these semi-historical religious docudramas. I've heard it said that people like Luke and Mark, and others, would have had access to libraries for source material, staff or helpers to fetch documents for them to read to garner some historical and geographical information, a patron who funded their writing endeavors and who funded the people who made copies of their works, etc. This evokes images of scrolls in libraries, staff scurrying to and fro, candles on tables, discussions with other educated people who knew the classics, etc. What Dr. Miller is saying is that his work is an attempt to peer into the methods used to compile the gospels stories without necessarily agreeing with the theology contained within. This is purely a historical literary secular exercise whose goal is to find out, from a neutral perspective, how these documents were put together and where did the literary elements originate.

@tedreed6046 Год назад

Although I can understand the value in taking an objective look at the Old and New Testament narratives, I have some reservations about the possible negative effects on the people in the churches who need to be ministered to if this is openly expressed. People expect in their church a sense of security or a "warm fuzzy feeling". What Dr. Miller is expressing are ideas which would only lead to confusion for the people in the churches. People want security in their faith, not confusion. I think that the ideas expressed by Dr. Miller should be considered with caution and the conclusions which are reached should be presented with extreme care.

@grahamlindsay1263 Год назад

Negative effects- like being a Russian citizen in 2023, breaking the mold of nationalistic propaganda is a very sensitive subject to deal with in our consciousness.

@donnievance1942 11 дней назад

I don't know why we should worry about people whose lives aren't based on a primary respect for knowing the truth about things. Lack of a fundamental valuation for truth above all is one of the most fundamental moral failings. Tip-toeing around to maintain the comfort of such people is counter-productive for society.

@tw9472 Год назад

Very interesting conversation. Our everyday life is based on compromises - someone who doesn't want to compromise is being perceived by majority as extremist and by default extremists are bad. The majority still accepts to higher or lower extent existence of divine being behind our world. Well, Copernicus was an extremist too. I wonder how many percent of current biblical scholars present currently the position of people like Drs. R. Miller, D. MacDonald or F. Stavrakapoulou? Perhaps all these rational biblical scholars should somehow get together and initiate a new field of study. Derek, thank you for another great interview!

@ChristopherCudworth Год назад

Rigorous and honest. That’s why I wrote my book Honest-To-Goodness, Why Christianity needs a reality check and how to make it happen. Let’s be honest above all.

@henrim9348 Год назад

It takes a lot of courage to take certain positions. One can lose their whole $$$ by telling the truth.

@ReverendDr.Thomas Год назад

In your own words, define “TRUTH”. ☝️🤔☝️

@xiuhcoatl4830 Год назад

@@ReverendDr.Thomas Events, or prepostions that can be demonstrated to be true empirically or rationally.

@ReverendDr.Thomas Год назад

@@xiuhcoatl4830 TAUTOLOGY. 🙄

@xiuhcoatl4830 Год назад

@@ReverendDr.Thomas you wanted a definition, there is. Thats not tautology

@ChristianSoldier71 Год назад

@debrawehrly6900 Год назад

Can a person be a "free thinking Christian "?

@cipherklosenuf9242 Год назад

Sure. Depends on how one defines the terms. Some would argue no one can really be a free thinker…it depends on definitions.

@ralphyetmore Год назад

A faith-based field of study is biased toward the faith of which it is based. Can't say I'm at all surprised, but I appreciate the fact that you said what has to actually be said for some.

@martinnyberg6553 Год назад

26:26 Best outro ever! 😊🖖

@leiflohne3096 Год назад

Awesome kid at the end! We are MythVision

@herbyking2623 Год назад

Very true words spoken " there is too much at stake here "...

@NoWay1969 8 месяцев назад

Some of Dale Martin's Harvard classes are on RU-vid, and he's Episcopalian but he starts his classes explaining to students that the class isn't a faith-based class. He makes a distinction between his faith-based reading of the gospels and an academic reading. Many people of faith do that kind of compartmentalizing.

@RichardMiller-ym5jc 6 месяцев назад

Well.. they claim to do so..

@NoWay1969 6 месяцев назад

No, they really do. You necessarily have to compartmentalize magical beliefs from a wider understanding of the world. @@RichardMiller-ym5jc

@RichardMiller-ym5jc 6 месяцев назад

@@NoWay1969, I was once one such person. I think those most honest, however, invariably find their way out, particularly those equipped with modern academic resources.

@Crazimir Год назад

The same is true for egyptology and other branches of archaeology - toe the line or accept that you cannot have a career in the field.

@jefffarris9238 Год назад

Congrats on 100k subscribers. Just noticed that!

@sizzle1836 Год назад

I had no idea SBL was like this- I went to a private university affiliated with the Disciples of Christ. My religion professors did not teach or research from a theological perspective. They discouraged her intro students from injecting their theological beliefs into their work. My Greek professor never referred to koine Greek as “biblical” or “ancient” Greek. And she was even an ordained minister! I’m wondering if your critiques really apply to academics from theologically conservative institutions? And I’m also wondering if you think that *truly* intellectually honest research and being a person of (Christian) faith are mutually exclusive? By the way, I’m really really enjoying this channel. I thought I had everything figured out after I deconstructed out of fundamentalism. No one ever told me what to do when THAT faith fell apart. I love the Bible (mostly the Hebrew Bible tho). I think Jesus had some great ideas. But I do not believe in his divinity. And seemed like every biblical content creator was 1.) A Christian and 2.) didn’t know wtf they were talking about. These interviews are exactly what I’ve been looking for!!!

@JohnD808 Год назад

Could be there’s a lot of BS mixed in with what he said. The fact he calls himself and Carrier mainstream scholarship is about all I need to know in that regard. That’s total nonsense. This isn’t a trustworthy person unfortunately.

@travis1240 Год назад

I think that being a "person of faith" does introduce a large amount of bias. It may be possible for someone to check their faith at the door and do serious scholarship in this area, but it's far, far easier to let the bias creep in. Almost no believers are going to admit that Jesus' passion narrative is patterned after Romulus. If you think that, what is left of your faith?

@JohnD808 Год назад

@@travis1240 the passion narrative isn’t patterned after Romulus….Miller thinks the ascension narrative is patterned after Romulus but again, this reinforces my point. The idea that a scholar would care whether Luke patterned the ascension on Romulus or Moses because of their faith doesn’t actually make any sense. Either way it’s a mythical trope. Scholars like Allison look to Jewish stories for influence not because they are Christian but because there is overwhelming evidence the gospel authors patterned their stories about Jesus on Jewish mythology. It’s the obvious place to look, not a faith bias. And the only reason a person of faith would prioritize Jewish influence over Greco-Roman influence is because their faith is informed by Jewish beliefs. And what is informing that faith, are the same texts they’re emphasizing Jewish influence on. In other words the argument only works if you assume what Miller is concluding from the get-go. The simpler conclusion is that scholars emphasize Jewish influence not because of faith but because that was the primary influence on the texts.

@ChristianSoldier71 Год назад

@sizzle1836 Год назад

@@travis1240 tl;dr I think it’s a mistake to assert that having faith in the Truth of the Bible/NT and intellectually honest engagement with the text are mutually exclusive. You make a good point, and I had considered that the only natural conclusion to a purely academic analysis of the NT is to lose faith. BUT. The reason I take issue with that stance (and most analyses of the Bible from atheists) is that it seems to be predicated on the same fundamental belief that evangelicals have- that if the Bible is not factual, it therefore cannot be true™️. Many fundamentalists/conservatives who deconstruct and then become atheists, in my experience, continue to conflate fact and truth. So if they discover that factually, Jesus didn’t literally heal people or literally come back to physical life, there’s nothing meaningful to be found within the text. For example- I myself am not a Christian (and I was raised half Jewish anyway) because I believe Paul and the other early church leaders had it all wrong. I could def go into that more ofc, but it’s beside the point lol. But just because I don’t believe Jesus was God or that he literally healed people or rose from the dead doesn’t mean I don’t think he had valuable teachings to offer. I believe there are a lot of universal truths to be found within the NT, and esp in the Hebrew Bible. The fact that there are so many similar stories in other ancient religions and cultures doesn’t discount the universal truths of love and justice- in fact, it tells me just how enduring and true those tenets of human existence are. I recognize that these interpretations of the biblical text are inherently theological. But I think to assume that 1.) these scholars are Christians because they believe the NT is Fact™️ and 2.) that truth = fact and 3.) to then discredit the work of the SBL as a whole because many (if not most) academics are Christians and therefore can’t engage with the material in an intellectually honest way is fallacious.

@matthewsmiley7159 Год назад

If I could get my money back for your book, that would be great….

@scottgoulette8900 Год назад

Could we hear your specific complaint/issue, if you have one?

@A.--. Год назад

Ma'Sha'Allah Alhumdullilah. This accademic evidence based approach is the right one. Quran 17:36 tells us the same. Unfortunately lots of Madrassa sects also hate accademic evidence based approach.

@nuttysquirrel8816 Год назад

I stopped the video after 3:07 - 3:23 to comment: *Derek is an awesome person* 😀

@stevenlancestoll629 Год назад

Seems like the Sociology of Religion is a field he would be comfortable in. We study religion as a human phenomenon, but not as truth in any way!

@ChitwoodMitwood Год назад

Never admit that you don't really know , it is bad for your image as a human.

@eternalism8274 Год назад

15:30 "in classics, I could write freely" - no, you cannot write about myth as depiction of psychedelc experiencing.

@matthewkopp2391 10 месяцев назад

I think it should be part of classics. But I also think that Greek Philosophy is taught wrong and if it were taught correctly it would provide a window into the Bible. Greek Philosophy was really religious philosophy and people think it wasn’t. Socrates was a religious martyr and was regarded as such. Parmenides and Heraclitus were prophets. Empedocles was considered a God-man who said a goddess taught him his philosophy. And he sung his philosophy. And had religious practices which were popular and in fact they appear in Irenaeus‘s heresies. The fact that we teach Greek philosophy without understanding it was religion and art as well. And the fact that we teach religion as if it were not philosophy is precisely the problem. And the fact that we don’t take atheist refutations as part of the the corpus is also an issue, as the Christian writers refuted all the time.

@americaeaustraliaepius4338 Год назад

Those of us who still worship the ancient Gods don't care for censoring secular research in subjects like mythology or ancient religion, because even back then in ancient times, these things were discussed by the philosophers. Just read Cicero and other ancient authors, you'll see it, and they weren't atheists, they were theist pious of the Gods, they simply were critical of the religion and traditions. We're not like christians or muslims trying to impose limits to academic research.

@battlerushiromiya651 Год назад

Because you cant, Hindu nationalists have regularly called out Indic studies and criticized scholarship for the same reasons COnservative christians do. They are trying to use their power to ensure that views contrary to their own dont get traction in academia. Also, other reliongs like christianity are not attacked so divinitiy schools can speak about these subjects theologically without being expected to be objective like christian schools are.

@dionysianapollomarx Год назад

Islamic studies has a similar problem. But it’s even wider. You have big name scholars claiming that the Quran is incontrovertible unlike the Bible, ignoring the relevance of pre-Islamic tribes and Judeo-Christian literary traditions to the development of Islam as a faith. The only likely difference perhaps due to tribal influence is that Islam has its own lexicon and though the Quran had many changes along its development, ergo no one final idea or vocabulary, it is plurivocal. It is immensely funny that the same problem, though perhaps different in gravity and much less impenetrable (the overall academic social structure not being governed by purely theological interests), is seen any other monotheistic religious studies tradition outside of traditional religious studies departments.

@dionysianapollomarx Год назад

@@T_K_R_G yeah, I see it. Much of it is thanks to a style that starts from al-Ghazali onwards. But it is weird that many big names from van Ess to scholars today diminish the idea that there are lines of descent from Gnosticism and Manichaeism. All without giving counterevidence. That said, the academics of an ummah is a lot closer to the SBL than you might think. Which is my main point. They just don’t have the same institutional structure backing them in Western universities, except maybe Cambridge Muslim College.

@dionysianapollomarx Год назад

And Cambridge Muslim College is a lot less sectarian in attitude than a divinity college, but they still reject lines of descent from previous cultural traditions. Which as a former student of anthropology, I found disappointing. And mind you, the same is true for a bit of Jewish studies, a lot of whom reject the idea that Moses is myth, at least publicly. Hence you have hoax archeological finds made by legitimate antiquities scholars in Israel every now and then.

@Wrathful2000 Год назад

This is my favorite person I never knew existed until now

@therongjr Год назад

This! Is! MILLERvision!

@ardalla535 Год назад

You don't have to be a scholar to come to the conclusion that Biblical Studies is a circus. You just have to know how to read, and actually do it. That also goes for Biblical Archaeology (and pretty much everything that has Biblical in the title).

@alstewart6870 Год назад

Pat, how familiar are you with biblical archaeology? Your statement leads me to believe you know little, otherwise you would never say such a thing!

@marktwain5232 Год назад

@@alstewart6870 I fully agree. Biblical archaeology does NOT require any "statement of doctrinal faith" at all. It is "cultural archaeology" in the context of the precious ancient texts we have that have been preserved. I studied as an undergraduate student under Dr. James B. Pritchard at the University of Pennsylvania regarding the Epic of Gilgamesh back in the 1960's. He could both work the spade in the grid lined dirt of the Middle East on his digs, and then try to interpret what he found. Besides all that, I believe the study of the Bible itself is also very important on the Jungian level for the modern reader. I recommend the books of Edward F. Edinger to everyone. The great contribution of the Jewish people, if nothing else, is the preservation of the history of ideas.

@alstewart6870 Год назад

@@dialecticobserver Rather then give your thoughts, why not show facts that prove Christ or Christianity a fraud, unless of course u can’t?

@ChristianSoldier71 Год назад

@alstewart6870 Год назад

@@dialecticobserver oh ok, because u say so then???