BIG Power from Small Block Engines! | Engine Masters | MotorTrend 

why bother, we wont see them here for at least 6 years!

methanol.

Using an engine with knock sensors (preferably boosted) Show the octane limitations, or power limits for different fuels, (turbo Coyote with built lower end)??

Are you going to test the Trick flow single plane on the 410 c.i. ? Raise the compression to 10 or 10.5:1 maybe but keep the flat top pistons with relief custom cut to just enough. Use the tapered spacer. Test your primary lengths. Keep the same schneider solid roller 238* cam. Put some nascar tri Y's on there. Enjoy your 550 hp and torque daily street car.

Seeing the before and after of that cheap Chinese intake being ported and smoothed out would be interesting. I bet it would make a decent difference.

Don't buy generic drugs either then

@@jimkrogh2549 if saving $0.25 on your bottle of blood pressure pills is worth the risk of something like arsenic poisoning to you then enjoy

​@@jimkrogh2549drugs are different. It might be a life or death situation 😆

Where’s your phone made?

Your just close minded my guy.

its a dart block

@@mikec9112 I was wondering exactly how the 80s 5.0 compared. Thanks for the info!

@@mikec9112 A stock 351 block can take far more than that. Never have hurt one in 25 years of running Windsor strokers on nitrous or with boost with far more than 650 hp.

@@mikec9112I always thought the Cleveland’s were rated for more?

@@NAPAuniversalJoints the 363 was for the intake setup. the first one for header collectors and carb spacers was an OEM block

speedmaster doesnt design or make the heads or the intake they are both chinese products they rebrand. the speedmaster heads used to be the procomp castings.

Wow y go aluminum, are 496 on pump gas with BBC 2 brodix heads made 780hp with port work, but on 93 octane

Yeah and it averages 5 miles per gallon 😂

😐

​@@mariocooldude9092I'm sure as he was building it he was thinking of mpg. Knucklehead

@@hughmongous5089 right because when I hear the number “521” in reference to displacement I think of economy cars 😂

how did you modify the dizzy to fit the lower deck Windsor?

❤❤❤❤❤

thats like running 225cc on a 355 chevy. A little WAY huge for a street machine making the same power. However it works good on these engines because it is a way huge bore. And is an oversquare engine.

Who says its mismatched? That cam makes for an awesome st engine huge tq at any rpm nice extended power band and can drive anywhere. Wide lsa doesnt mean the engine wont be fast guys. So much more to it than lsa duration numbers etc.

I would love it if the guys on Engine masters would build my 427 FE and then they could dyno for an episode. I have new, ready to build: BBM 427 Block, Forged stroker kit to 482 cubes, Edelbrock Proflow 4 Fuel Injection top end kit, Roller Rocker set, TFS Powerport 175 Cylinder heads, Hyd Roller camshaft. Just need someone to put it together, might as well make an Engine Masters episode of it. Yes David Freiburger, it would be great for the Ford FE enthusiasts see a street build like this. And I can't find anyone to build this for me that doesn't have a 2 year waiting list. Yes I know, shameless plug to get my engine built. LOL

watch richard holdener. He is a master and has done it all.

@@weaverdennisl 175cc head is very small fora 427

Bet it would still get walked. A pro porting job is going to start around e5-600 and ca run to twice that.

totally agree what other info you got to help us beginners

Absolutely on the 410ci Windsor in the beginning of the video. Some AFR 220 heads,.675-.725 lift,108 lobe,250-260 @ .050 cam,bump the compression to 10.5:1-11:1 and a Edelbrock Super Victor... Easy over 600 hp on an engine dyno.

@@NCSTANGGUY exactly the motor I was referring to. It made good power but typically that kind of flat Dyno result between torque and horsepower shows there is a bottleneck somewhere. The factory 289/302 heads are a 165 cc intake port. I don't think the 195 cc AFRs are flowing enough.

also agree, even a skilled porter would help those 195cfm--there's dyno videos around here (richard holdener, etc) where cfm alone doesn't make power, it's the design of the port.

The low decks will crack after 500 bhp, unless you can find one that bores past .040 over. But they were designed for economy cars and 221 cid, with the Y blocks for truck use. you can modify one to take way more power than that, and the tall deck Windsor will go 600hp on average. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-c71ClII1NsQ.html

@@albertgaspar627 Tall deck being the 351 ?

@@barrycuda3769 assuming you mean the 351 Windsor, yes. There was the Cleveland and Modified (the 400M was the Midland, then it was destroked hence the Modified moniker) in that displacement as well, but i'll suspect you were referring to the Windsor :) year of casting is important, Ford like most of Detroit cut down on nickel content in blocks from the late 1970's to the early 1980's. Some people will push the Windsor blocks a lot more (one right off the bat is the Neomustang channel here on youtube) and truck engines use better internals than the passenger cars, but that's a ballpark figure.

@@albertgaspar627 Yes, I did mean 351 Windsor, I watched the Steve Vizard video that you provided a link to, it's interesting that the cracking issues seem to be due to vibration, and that you can install aftermarket vibration dampening devices (girdles). I wonder if Chev and mopar small blocks have had any cracking issues? I'ts also interesting that the 289 powered GT 40's could complete the 24 hours of Le Mans with no issues, I know they didn't exceed 450 HP , but running hard for that long is impressive, but I imagine they had specially cast blocks? On the subject of Cleveland's I think in my part of the world ( New Zealand) we (Australia and NZ)had far more of them than in America, the most famous example being the GTHO Falcon , which has become insanely valuable. Maybe the Cleveland 351 is a better choice for getting big horsepower out of, despite being heavier , that means stronger???

@@barrycuda3769 Ford originally designed the 221 cid Windsor for economy cars (the Falcon) while saving the Y block for passenger cars and trucks with the FE/FT big blocks for heavy duty useage. However, Ford had wanted to make a corvette competitor in 1955 but the Y block was too heavy (so the Thunderbird got built on the family car chassis, the Fairlane). someone realized the 221 could be a sports car engine in 260 cid and handle midsized passenger cars, so the Y block went away and the 260 showed up in Sunbeam Alpines to make the Tiger. Chevy, on the other hand, made its small block right from the beginning to power trucks and passenger cars, so they made it a bit heavier duty in comparison. Still, the Ford 289 had the impact you mentioned. It was designed to carry midwest americans at 70 mph for hours to their destination (compared to some european sports cars that got one around town, etc), but it was ultimately a good design. the cylinder heads ran smaller ports and valve sizes to build more torque at lower RPMs compared to the chevy, and the exhaust ports were sadly given short shrift as Ford designed cars with shock towers that took up space. Mopar built its LA small block in 1967 off their A engines from the 1950's (LA stands for Light A) that spawned the first generation of Hemis. so their lifter bores have a bad cant for wedge engines, but otherwise you can guess the strength built in naturally. by the late 1970's, however, they were bankrupt so quality suffered. but the rest of the industry was getting hammered by imports, so they all put less nickel into their cast iron, and some engines were in fact lightened up in the main webs to generate more fuel economy. You are spot on about the Clevelands. We got them "late to the party" and so there was less development--we only have two head designs to choose from, and engine builders will try to get australian heads. in drag racing, some teams would actually cut the exposed exhaust port off an american cleveland head and weld on a square pipe to lose the "dogleg" bend. (on a side note, Ford did develop a version of the Cleveland with a taller deck height for use in pickup trucks and full sized cars like the Lincoln to theoretically get rid of big block engines. they were the 400Midland and later a destroked version, the 351Modified. it's a shame no one bothers to modify these engines, there's a fair bit of potential in each one even though the rear of the block only has a bolt pattern for heavy duty transmissions). considering the taxes, shipping and exchange rates, if i lived in your part of the globe I would go with a cleveland. unless you needed a roller cam setup and your windsors offer that right from the factory--that's what we have here, and it's worth buying a windsor engine from a junkyard and getting the entire roller cam setup for free. plus that model got EFI from the factory, which also saves eventual costs if one wants that and isn't getting too crazy with the engine build. plus our ford explorer SUVs came with the best OEM windsor heads on them stock--the GT40P heads once offered over-the-parts-counter. so you grab a set of those on the way out the door, and you have yourself a decent street engine to put together for a hot rod.

熟练的人可以很快把它做得更好🇨🇳

I found that I could tune the collector length by shortening the collectors an inch at a time until I get the maximum power starting with an 18" extension and working My way down . 🇺🇸🇵🇷🦊👍

ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-ihN-15Kn1BM.htmlfeature=shared

probably 14:1 to 15:1. 18:1 is diesel territory. edit: somehow my later response got lost or deleted, so i'll just add it here: in the late 1970's Bruce Crower had a mileage cam idea, you used 14:1 or so compression pistons and one of his cams that closed the intake valve really late, like almost near TDC. it bled off compression into the intake manifold on purpose, but at higher rpms it had less effect and you got higher compression for fuel economy and power. but what you really got was a soggy power curve at cruising RPM and domed pistons that blocked much airflow into the engine at higher engine speeds. so it was a lose-lose situation.

@@albertgaspar627 yeah diesels have to have that high for igniting their fuel but in theory couldn’t you make a normal engine have such a high compression?

In theory, but you need fuel that is knock resistant enough. Even Avgas wouldn't be able to handle 18:1. Maybe if you were running on methanol and using other tricks to prevent knock it could work.

RE. super high compression on gasoline. Need to understand static vs dynamic compression. Running compression is reduced by factors that inhibit volumetric efficiency. A example is a 2bbl limited engine class, can't fill cylinder at higher RPM. Cam timing is adjusted to lower compression at lower speed.

@jeffhill3681 yeah you can look at the inlet valve closing event timing to get a sense of this. Later IVC moves the power band higher in the rev range and reduces the effective compression ratio at low revs, while raising it at high revs. A particularly extreme case is found on the Toyota Prius engine, which always closes its inlet valve way too late. Net effect is to reduce the geometric 14:1 or so compression ratio to something normal 91 RON fuel can handle. But the expansion ratio on the power stroke remains 14:1, so the engine extracts more of the energy from the hot gases than a regular Otto cycle. Of course this means the volumetric efficiency and thus power is rather low, but it's a hybrid so the electric motor compensates for that. The other side of the coin is diesels, where making the IVC happen too late makes the engine impossible to start because the dynamic compression is too low at cranking speed.

Put same work in all intakes hr wise then run

I can't get mad either way none of these intakes fit under the hood of my 79 LTD Landau with it's 351 Windsor 😢

either time limit or....most of the parts you see in these videos and on PowerNation TV come free from the manufacturer in return for free ad time.

You said it on a "Street" engine the dual plane is great. On this engine going to 7,600Rpm, the dual plane would get smashed in high end hp, as this setup is geared for racing. Sure the dual plane would have the most tq. down low, but anyone that knows anything about racing, would use a 5,500 to 6,000Rpm high speed TQ. converter on this setup, shift @ 7,500 to 8,000Rpm, and never look back!

It is. 2 different motors too. They just abandoned the 410 project I guess. Weird.

if, and when, (as always in america) you got an auto trans there. With a 7500 winding smallblock, you kindof need a 3000 stall turbine. If you mash the throttle, the turbine lets the engine always go to 3000rpm, and start pulling power from there. Manual guys, like I, are a different story

chances are they aren't even buying it--manufacturers often dump their stuff on guys like this for the free advertising.

@@albertgaspar627 was more for the viewers in the comments section, support local companies, keep the jobs at home, too much of our industries have been outsourced to the Red Dragon. Say NO to Communism

Yeah when they stop asking ridiculous prices

sorry, but in the 60's and 70's we were getting 500 bhp/500 ft lbs out of...big blocks :) a good stroker small block will beat those 70's big block numbers in terms of power-to-weight ratio when installed in the car. I don't even do a big block until 700+hp...since a roller cammed small block stroked with forged reciprocating parts and a sniff of nitrous is going to hit 600bhp and remain streetable. and then there's the LS/hairdryer guys. LS6's and L88's weren't making that much low end torque, they were cammed for 6,000 rpm and above. you wanted off-idle torque, it was GM's 455 triplets and the Cad 472/500--neither wanted to go over 5,500 rpm.

and replace it with what?

@@albertgaspar627 Electronic Fuel Injection (EFI)

Carbs make more power, if you are too dumb to tune one, thats on you

That's what I normally start with, get it timed right then make some carb adjustments to dial it in 100%

How much timing the engine can accept is largely a product of camshaft and combustion chamber design (to include piston top design). Assuming they had already tuned the timing on the engine before, since they didnt change the cam or heads then there probably wasnt much to be gained in adjusting timing.

My thoughts exactly, we would love to see the difference.

Junk

Needs a single plane. There wont be much casting flash on an AFR casting, but the head would flow more with a pocket port and agressive valve job over port matching

​@@PackMane1419the test is to evaluate the intake manifold not the heads flow so cleaning up the casting flash and gasket matching of the ports on the manifold should help with the power production on a budget . I'm interested in the results of such a test ! 🇺🇸🇵🇷🦊👍

@@ferdinandcuevas8457 agree with you. people forget that hot rodding isn't just bolting on parts like a mechanic. Intake manifolds are cast for a variety of engine requirements and should be tailored like a jacket to fit. if you know how to do that...then the cheap chinesum stuff shines so long as it's not porous.

Was debunked, it don't work

yeah that's an old bike racers trick, still works, too.

@@davidleggett137 wonder I'm going to have to cut all my primaries off cause paint disappeared on all 8 all the way down

I learned this trick as well and yes it absolutely works. White Chalk was used not paint.

it does work, and yes, it was paint not chalk. Flowmaster designed some amazing "collectors" that replaced the collector on a basic set of 4-into-1 generic headers and made them a Tri Y setup while adding length before the crossover pipe. but this video shows that just disconnecting the headers at the strip isn't getting the most power out of the engine.

Yeah 60ftlbs vs 30 hp- I would take the torque too

this is true, but if you match that slight hp difference with another one someplace else and the 10 hp with a pulley swap and a windage tray and so on...then it adds up.

That’s exactly what I was thinking. It’d be a good test for how much polishing and porting actually could improve it

Why would you bother doing all of that when you could just buy the better product

@@728GT it’s the cheapest one and working a die grinder is just time. Poor people gotta speed too.

well, that's the joke. Most people pay more for an aftermarket part to bolt on in place of the OEM part and call themselves a hot rodder (more like a mechanic, who just scans your car and keeps replacing parts until you stop showing up to complain about the problem). Old fashioned hot rodders would buy a crusty OEM part off a junkyard musclecar and then machine it, massage it, weld it into the design they need. buy cheap, work it over in your garage, and keep up with the big spenders :)

@@H3110NU but its an intake plenum. You could grind all you want. If the design is bad, it will still under perform.

No, it’s not you. He clearly presented the other engine prior to performing the intake comparison.