I have spent the last 12 months reading books by Prof Tim Spector, Prof Roy Taylor, Dr Bill Bulsiewicz and Dr Andrew Jenkinson - I have PCOS and have struggled with my weight for 50 years - I've lost 3.5 stones - can't wait for the Zoe app to help me understand how my body reacts to certain foods - thank you
I’ve also read those books. Nothing for it, I guess, than to get a notebook and start recording meals and my own response to them. I’m not helped by lack of sleep. Good luck with your efforts.
@@rainbowliz1 Hi Elizabeth all the books are as follows: Professor Roy Taylor - Life Without Diabetes; - Dr Andrew Jenkinson - Why We Eat Too Much; Professor Tim Spector - Spoon Fed, The Diet Myth and Identically Different.
I have worked as a GP for 25 years and have given this advice for all of them. It doesn’t feel groundbreaking. I get that people have different responses to different foods but we could have predicted that surely.
I'm not a physician but agree with your comment, not sure it was as revolutionary as they made out at least 'to my way of thinking' but it is good that real data is being gathered to support 'common sense' . It was interesting that they say different people react physiologically differently to the same meal. Also although I was disturbed they dismissed the spike I have associated with type 2 diabetes risks (?).
It's so great to see this team of people actually looking for information and facts for health and not repeating the old false beliefs about what can contribute to better health.
I find the keto way of eating is actually the healthiest for me topped up with vits. It drastically reduces my IBSD and urge to eat all the time . So with caution works for me
Eliminating processed foods, primarily carbohydrate rich baked foods and white carbohydrates such as potato and rice worked for me in reduction of 40kg without dieting by eating three generous meals a day. Beating the two hour hunger cycle is liberating. I find natural carbohydrates including fruit are fine for me, however take that orange and juice it and it is now a processed food. In other words eat carbohydrates as natural foods.
I'm a big dipper, sweating, shaking and a head full of cottonwool. It knocked me out for the rest of the day. Breakfast was the worst offender, and set me up for a downward spiral all day long. I struggled with this for all my adult life. I'm now in my 60s and thankfully discovered keto a few years ago, which has totally stabilised my blood sugar. I also do intermittent fasting by eliminating breakfast, and am now free to get on with my day without those horrible dips. I also lost 95lbs.
I never ate breakfadt.. excepthfor a short bit when bery sick Ate youghrt with fruit. Thiis keep me going till lunch Got off all medical even before i partly went keto. As i don't eat meat... only eat breakfast when i might have missed dinner.....
Me too! I explained to a dietician that if I had oatmeal for breakfast, I'd be starving by mid morning, but if I skipped breakfast I'd be fine til lunch and she called me a LIAR
Dr. Will is such an effective communicator, love his summaries. Dr. Anna is obviously very well-informed. And thank you, Jonathan, for keeping the discussion grounded for we non-scientists!
Very informative talk! Thank you for your valuable work and for sharing it. I much appreciated dr. Will’s capacity for synthesis and clarification of the points discussed definitely added a layer of understanding to the whole conversation. Thanks! Can’t wait till you do Italy. 💖
Very interesting. I can eat when I am not hungry though: emotional eating or sometimes I eat for sensory needs, social situations even if I am not hungry. I think I override feelings of satiety. Nevertheless I will use what I have learnt here to keep trying to shift my excess weight.
I think it's very premature to herald the demise of the GI index on the basis of this research. Take rice versus mashed potatoes: The GI index rates mashed potatoes one of the highest at 85 compared with a low value of 49 for boiled white rice. It doesn't just put all popular carbohydrate foods into a high rated section. Pasta and tortilla wraps are also rated very low on the index compared with bread and potatoes. That's completely in line with what is being said in this video, where Jonathan Wolf found that mashed potato caused a big downward swing in blood sugar (after the initial rise), whereas rice caused very little secondary decline. The rapid rise in blood sugar after the mashed potato would stimulate the rapid release of insulin to remove the excess sugar from the blood into the cells where it is needed. What is odd is that Dr Ana claims that the white rice and mashed potato produce the same increase in blood sugar after consumption. The GI theory does suggest a more rapid rise in blood sugar for the mashed potato compared with rice would cause a more rapid release of insulin and a bigger over-correction of sugar levels. The GI system compares equal total amounts of carb for all portions of foods. So the total sugar eventually absorbed into the blood should be the same, assuming complete digestion. It's the rate of absorption and the peak reached that differ. Is Dr Ana saying that the peak values in the blood are the same for mashed potato and rice? Is she comparing equal amount of potato carbs and rice carbs? The GI theory assumes more rapid digestion and absorption of sugar from a particular carb will produce a higher peak in blood sugar and therefore a higher release of insulin and more chance of subsequent hypoglycaemia. You must compare food servings with equal amount of total carbs. Was this done in the Zoe research?
Very interesting. I'm definitely a big dipper, having being diagnosed with (non diabetic) reactive hypoglycaemia ten years ago. I have faced a constant battle to try to stabilise my blood sugar levels and to avoid my system dumping excess insulin after eating. I feel I would really benefit from the personalised advice Zoe could give me. Please launch your program in the UK soon!
2 years late but have you seen some of the more recent episodes on Zoe ? I've learned that there are many simple hacks you can do to stabilize your blood sugar levels. For example, drinking a small teaspoon of apple cider vinegar in a half glass of water before meals , eating fiber first, then protein and fat, and then carbs, or just having an appetizer that's higher in fiber before eating the main meal in whatever order, or any kind of physical activity, 10 minutes of it, within 1h of eating.
10 years ago, when I was 70, I consulted an integrative doctor who is beyond praise. I was having severe gut problems. We changed the foods I ate and those I avoid. 20 kilos melted away. I have never regained that weight. I very rarely feel hungry. I just stick to the plan. If I don't, I know all about it. My system has become incredibly sensitive. Annoyingly, my tahu (partner) can eat all the foods I can't, with impunity . Love your programmes. Regards Nicola in New Zealand
This is really interesting Did you manage to capture any data on the role of the impact of hormones in the menstrual cycle and this interacts with hunger?
If you are wondering what is the unmanageable hunger during the premenstrual period, it's probably (but not exclusively) due to excessive insuline release due to high sexual homone levels. Excessive insuline release causes a big dip in blood sugar. There are solutions, but you need a personalized assessment. I suggest that you look for medical/nutritional professional services, if are available in your country.
Good question about hormones. Now that I’m 55 I don’t have a menstrual cycle & I wonder how this different balance of hormones affects my hunger & weight gain.
On one hand they seem to be dismissing the GI angle, but on another the 'superglycaemic' foods are mentioned which surely means a high GI score? Stands to reason that highly processed carbs/sugars are going to cause these big dips more than other slower releasing foods, no?
This is so informative. It's very exciting, for the first time someone explains what's happening. I've been under a consulatant and dietician for 5.5 years and got nowhere. Do the books show the foods that can affect us? It makes so much sens. Thank you.
Hi Jo, check out this video: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-TWK8ZKtCNJo.html&lc=UgyrCAKydqhokne0O794AaABAg it's less than 3 minutes :)
Highly informative study which as Dr Will suggests consigns glycemic index to the bin, it would be interesting to link a further such study to the participants microbiome as a possible explanation for the individuality of reactions to the same food sources. My opinion is that the microbiome is fundamental to combatting the obesity epidemic and the key to a healthier life for all.
Definitely! check out our paper published in nature medicine all about the microbiome (this is something we are really passionate about!) www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-01183-8
Will the research start examining the cause of the blood sugar dip, which is release of insulin. I was diagnosed with reactive hypoglycaemia in the early 70's, caused by overeating carbs and sugar and my body became over reactive - or should I say my pancreas was overreactive. A low carb diet was recommended, yes, around 50 years ago and that sorted the problem.
Eat in a very narrow window - 5:30pm to 7:30pm - and I worry what impact this might be having on my blood sugars. It’s been very effective at helping me to maintain weight loss, but am I getting huge spikes in blood sugar, and is this risky?
I rarely feel hungry - or thirsty for that matter. I'm currently on 500 calories two days out of seven and find it easy because of my lack of hunger. I reckon I don't eat a lot of calories a day generally. I'm not overweight but neither am I skinny.
@@dantronics1682 Not really sure calorie wise, porridge for breakfast, cheese omelette for lunch, salmon with veg stir fry for dinner, that kind of thing.
Interesting. As a type 2 diabetc and occasional Abbot Freestyle user, I have often thought that the impact of calories on blood sugar levels has a half-lfe and that it therefor can take several days to level out peaks and troughs. Breakfast always sends me high, whatever I eat, dreadful after foot on the floor as well.
Absolutely, I had a low sugar attack this afternoon, I wasn't hungry, so I skipped breakfast, boy did I pay for it. Sick, shakes, body aches, sweating, brain fog. I had an orange and something sugary to bring up my sugar level. Then ate a small sandwich.. Felt a bit better but still feel off and the hunger is insatiable. I usually control my drops pretty well by eating something small every 6 hours. Except when sleeping of course. This makes so much sense to me now. I don't ever want to feel that way again. Hopefully I'll get it under control.
14.44 into video I've paused. I had breakfast earlier, put thevideo on, then promptly fell asleep within a minute or two. Anyway, I've just remembered something I heard about every critter whether an insect or whatever, keeps eating until they have had enough protein. Makes sense then that nutrient dense food would give satiety with a lot less calories consumed?
20.13 paused video again. Even though diet drinks don't affect dips like sugary drinks, it is known that all chemical sugars and even Stevia destroy the healthy gut microbiome.
20.44 paused again. I think I wrote artificial sugar destroys healthy microbiome but I think I meant to write artificial sweeteners destroy healthy gut bacteria.
Very interesting presentation - lots of familiar themes - but two questions ... 1. some people can eat anything and never put on weight - how do your findings explain that, usually it is just passed off as them having a 'fast metabolism' but whatever it is, the fact is I know several people who can eat and drink anything and never put on any weight - they are alert, fit, lithe and fully functional. 2. As a member of Slimming World in UK, by changing my eating habits and learning about satiety, I have lost over 45lbs in less than a year. and my BMI has dropped from over 30 to 25.2 - I am still classed as overweight but losing the next 6-8 lbs makes me look haggard so I put it back on. Why then can some people never seem to achieve weight loss using such life changing regimes as Slimming World whilst others lose over 150lbs? Finally, call me a sceptic but this whole presentation, (particularly the last couple of minutes) seems to be setting us up for a Zoe sales drive for the PREDICT system here in UK - I understand this research needs funding but how about coming clean from the outset - you sell us the product and then get all that research data and info for free! Don't get me wrong, I fully respect what Zoe is doing - I have been reporting on the Covid app for over a year now - all at no cost to me, but with massive data value to Zoe, so why is the Predict system not offered in the same vein? Finally, great presentation !
I'm new student to nutrition and currently studying child nutrition which is so interesting regarding sugar and behaviours. Would it be possible for me to email for the transcript too please?
I'm struggling to understand the practical takeaways here. So as a sportsman who works in an office and eats a balanced lunch each day I find myself reaching for a snack bar and a coffee by 2pm. Holidays are the only exception. Is there some high fibre alternative I should be eating?
Sounds normal and i think most people want a light lunch whilst working anyway, so a snack bar is fine unless youre gaining weight with it? Imo 'hungry lot' is not a homogenous group. Some are overeaters not specifically hungry.. Hard to know who the study is directed at.
The funny thing is, we avoid putting sugar in our tea or coffee for health reasons, but then eat a snack bar with the equivalent of multiple teaspoons of sugar
i think in general its better (easy and quick) to train your palate to not want sweet food or drinks. Sweet taste will come from much less sweet food quite quickly.
Looking forward to reading more and participating in this research. Great work Zoe but have more confidence in your researcher - we don't need the Mansplaining
So... As an overweight person, how can I ensure my blood sugar does not drop after a meal? I have no idea what the level it is, never mind whether it's dropped or not.
Hi Vince, our research shows that your response to food is totally unique so it's impossible to give tailored advice here. If you're based in the US you can head to joinzoe.com to sign up to our waitlist to join the ZOE program which will give you an insight into your response to foods and the foods which work best for your body. If not I would say anecdotally that experimenting with different foods and seeing how they make you feel can be a fun way of finding out what works for your body
@@andrewparkeruk I used one for two weeks for the program and it was fascinating feedback. I'm trying to find a way to get the CGM for ongoing personal experiments but they're expensive if you don't have a prescription. Also, getting access to the data is crucial because the monitor they give you is tiny and you really want to see you data over a 24 hour period. I found a way to download the data and graph it, which is really helpful. I want to monitor my glucose level for every meal I eat now and optimize my diet.
Excellent info here. However, I don't think one should assume that a person will stop eating when s/he is full. People who are emotional eaters will continue to eat far beyond the point that they are no longer hungry.
This sounds like we may be able to get a good sense of what we should be eating by watching what happens to our energy and hunger after a couple of hours. Do I have that right?
Thank you Zoe/Prof Ana Valdes/Dr Will Bulsiewicz so much for your continuing great work on Diet and Microbiomes (and Covid)- much needed especially in the context of the current pandemic . Looking forward to the launch of your app/tool in the UK for myself ( and my twin) and my patients and hope for many more studies also looking into hormones and microbiomes ! Do you have any data about your users demographics in the US ?
thank you so much for your support Ulrike! Unfortunately we wouldn't be able to share patient demographic data as this is protected but thanks for your interest
We know that not all calories are created equal. Can you share some of the menus you created and distributed to the test group so we can try to determine our own unique hunger triggers and foods that will help us feel more satisfied. I try to journal my food intake every day with a goal of achieving a healthy weight and metabolism.
Hi Jane, as well as standardized muffins we also record blood fat response, blood sugar response and do microbiome testing so it wouldn't be possible to gain these insights by eating what the test group ate alone. If you are based in the US you can sign up to the waitlist for our program on joinzoe.com
I am absolutely astonished that this podcast which was supposed to be about blood sugar response to different kinds of food did not mention insulin once!. They don't seem to of heard of insulin resistance or the Kraft glucose tolerance test. Without understanding these key factors I don't see what use the results will be. Very disappointed.
maybe that's why it's different from other studies - if insulin resistance the way it's conventionally measured is a red herring and the actual factor is the person's unique blood response to food, this research will produce more meaningful results.
So what to do? If, like me who has been totally confused over a long life as to why I behave like an alcoholic after eating sugars so I illiminate carbs completely ! Can we participate in this program?
I've always thought if I can get a blood sugar monitor I could work out how to lose weight, they're expensive and it's a pity they're not available on the NHS unless you've got certain conditions.
they are not that expensive, you can get them for about £20, only that you have to buy the strips since the doc/nhs wont prescribe the refills but its the equivalent of a pint of beer per week
Not sure the strips are what you want. We tried (for my wife) the Abbott continuous glucose monitor for a couple of weeks and you get a graph of 15 minute readings. It's much harder with the strips as you aren't going to test every 15 mins 24/7. Expensive yes but two weeks is enough to try lots of foods and compare with the graph. It was for her diabetes and we'd learnt nothing trying to use the strips.
@@colinkerr1928 I understand where you're coming from Colin, a continuous monior would be great but with strips I could at least see my response to different foods after a few different time intervals.
@@joinZOE yes, I've had to endure years of people saying "potato won't hurt you" and facing cafe meals that were all problems like sandwiches, pasta, pastry, potato!
@@gilliancooke9525 oh yh the addictive triple P aha but man switching from processed foods has liberated me alot. I memba craving sugar so badly like cereals cruncy nut twice often to get my fix. So mch better now
Interesting point! One thing that paper talks about is the external factors that can impact blood sugar dips and appetite including stress but we haven't explored emotional eating in our research YET, it's a question we'd love to explore in the future
@@joinZOE Having struggled with my weight since being 16 (now 69) and having read quite a lot and explored my own psychology of comfort eating, I am convinced that until we bring together the type of nutritional science work you are doing with the psychological angle we will never have the whole answer, for some people. I am personally trying to combine the two approaches for myself at the moment! with some success in terms of weight loss, but keen to be on your study so I can have a complete picture. This individual approach to matching your diet to your ability to process diets, fats and the health microbiome angle is SO important and of course flies in the face of "DIET" companies who say there is one way to do this and that's this (ie their way). How can one type of diet plan ever help you meet those individual metabolic characheteristics, and of course it can't! Thanks for doing all your work, especially as it will bust the myth of one size fits all! Can't wait to get onto your study.
How did you define ‘hunger’ or feeling hungry , in the study - it varies with age/person/ habits ie hunger pain, clock watching, or feeling shaky? Agree if you start day eating you will feel like eating through your day . Can you explain the relation of ‘hunger’ to blood sugar ? As children we were always taught not to spoil our apetite by snacking and eating between meals. This is something the French practice a lot, to not get overweight. Some people are afraid of ever feeling hungry as if their blood sugar cannot regulate itself . But not everyone gets symptomatic hypoglycaemia I don’t believe?
Hi Lou, check out this blog which explains our methods in more detail: joinzoe.com/post/nature-blood-sugar-dips or the publication itself: www.nature.com/articles/s42255-021-00383-x
Interesting research, thankyou. I suppose one question is the big-dipper-snacker profile relevant if its not correlated to the persons BMI etc Could be useful to see if this group of individuals BMI increases over time or not..
Interesting topic , I have reactive hypoglycaemia and wear a CGM, I can testify to eating extra during the day when BG drops during the day. I feel but should’ve been prefaced with the fact that Blood sugar is crucial for survival tightly regulated by body and severely low Bg can lead to death and high or variable may be early or diabetes
3pm sugar dip...when I worked I refused to do training in the afternoon... isn’t this when afternoon tea became popular as ladies needed a meal mid afternoon...during that dip... I could fall asleep that time of day... This is fascinating...I’m trying to shift weight with no luck even on 1250 cals...I thought it was a blood sugar issue...? Even fasting 16 hours overnight. Nothing is shifting.. Still no easy answers.
I had the same issue and I had to fast on water for 14 days to reset completely Now I water and dry fast for various lengths. I do a 24 hr water fast from Sunday evening to Monday evening every week.
Can o ask. When i went keto i noticed i went hypoglycemic. After meals. But not felt hungry .. mnever had to eat food yo bring sugar up just stopped mt insulin.. As i began not to need it... stopped checking b.sugar.... i just eating normal and too much checking is bad. Except in an experiment......... So she not heard that fuet drinks are bad fir your brain..
500 calories from chips are not the same as 500 calories from steak or chicken thighs. Protein needs to be broken down to amino acids to be used and that takes energy. So you don’t actually get those 500 calories from a steak. Even high sugar fruits will cause cravings and severe hunger 2 hours later. I stick to berries only. Every other fruit has too much sugar for my prediabetic body. Wore a CGM for a while. Sticking to protein, above ground vegetables and some healthy fat is what leveled out my blood sugar and caused a 70 pound weight loss. Not lots of fat. Processed food has got to go if we want healthy people on the earth.
As hyperinsulinemia is the culprit, why don’t you mention that. So many now have cellular dysfunction from all these processed foods. But I agree about different foods. Yoghurt is suppose to be good for you but eating it drives massive hunger and I fight to get control of my hunger. I avoid it for this reason.
If you are constrained by money rather than just having limitless snacks and food, does that mean youre going to be heathier if your available foodstuffs arent too unhealthy to start with?
Need for carbs and fibre is 0.grams.Your body is capable of giving you enough sugar through gluconeogenesis.Protein and fats are satiating and you will never be hungry.Keto is not a fad diet it's been around for millions of years.
I figured only from my experience that its the animal protein that keeps you hungry. It keeps your blood glucose way too low so you end up over eating.
Absolutely not the case for me. It's plant starches that make me hungriest. In long term ketosis, I'm fat-adapted so, even if my blood sugar is fairly low, my body happily runs on fat so less hunger.
I would like to ask you if you have studied the dips in glucose with people who are prescribed medication to treat schizophrenia, I believe they can have problems with weight gain.
I dont think you are too far off the mark as I am fairly sure that some psychiatric (sorry if my terminology is outdated but its been a while since I read about this) drugs can affect weight and hormones and can cause all kinds of changes to ones body. I am not sure if drugs used in schizophrenia are different now but I can definately state that many antipsychotic drugs have these side effects. I would also state that the 2nd Gen Atypical antipsychotics are known to have much more metabolic side effects causing things like obesity and diabetes. Actually, I have been thinking about you and I really think that your doctor, or whoever is treating you, should have gone over all this with you because I think some of these side effects are so extreme they could harm your future health. Next time you see them ask and say you want it all explained and for them to tell you what effects (if any, because theres likely better medicines now) these may have on your future health and wellbeing. If you were my daughter I would want to know all the ins and outs of your treatment. Look after yourself and I hope you can reach a happy comprimise with whoever is treating you.
Really interesting information. My mother is a long term type 1 insulin dependent diabetic (since the age of 14, now 81). I have struggled all my life with what I have called blood sugar dips. How do I take part in the ZOE study? I need to change snacking habits, and would really appreciate some guidance.
Have you looked at the data sex-disaggregated? And within the women, differences in dipping during different parts of their cycle? There must be differences, but if the premise is that everyone has an individual response, with women there may be another variable to add to the tracking.
Hi Susan, This isn't something the study looked at as we didn't collect data on where any women who menstruate were in their cycle but this is definitely an interesting variable that could be explored in future research. Thank you so much for your suggestion
No diabetes, hypos as low as 2.4, and no hunger possibly due to gastroparesis. Not reactive hypos but hypos tend to happen with activity yet no answers.
Welcome to hour first podcast and I get it today. And the first thing I see is it is 2 year old. University of Nottingham? Isn't that the the bad dudes that incentivised Robin Hood?
You need to look at serum insulin to get the full picture of what's going on we know that blood glucose doesn't tell anything with regards to insulin resistance. Nothing new here
So I'm suffering with this, have been since before Christmas, strange phenomenon as I'm thinking I'm eating enough but so hungry all the time and I feel physically ill till I eat something and I find 2 hours is the length of time I can just about manage to last, not medication induced so had blood tests today to find out what's going on, not dehydration either as I'm drinking quite enough for my size and weight even though my local chemist said its dehydration as I have crinkly fingers. Not overweight either and consume between 1200 and 1500 calories per day Wish me look 😆
The talk struck me as a poorly presented research proposal. Staring at three earnest academics for what felt like an hour only to find out that they have not a single result to display is no fun. Are they after funding or are they selling their "services" in the hopes of generating results from people who sign up for those services? In either case I for one would not support their program. They let the cat out of the bag towards the end of the talks when it emerged that they don't know why glucose level decline rates vary, managing to not even mention insulin and other involved hormones, diabetes, lifestyle, age, sex, etc., preferring to put their bets on the gut microbiome. I believe that looking after my microbiome is a good thing but has rather obvious side effects. So if they put all their money on that possibility I'll bet they come up against a brick wall labelled FLATULENCE. I am male, live alone and have no problem with it but ladies are generally averse to windiness. Maybe THAT is why ladies are generally fatter than men...
Sorry to burst your bubble folks. You have not been measuring insulin as in the Kraft Insulin Test which will explain why people at the different points in their journey to insulin resistance will have different responses to high glycemic foods. The glycemic measure of foods still remains a good indicator. The Low Carb Community have cracked this metabolic science. Sorry the crash the party but true science must always prevail.
I’m hungry most of the day. I have to eat every 3 hours or I start to feel faint! Cutting out sugar has helped a little. Fortunately, I’ve never been overweight. Great study. Would love to take part in a UK trial.
That's so interesting - thanks for sharing your experience. We aren't currently recruiting participants in the UK but if you wanted to join our program once we launch in the UK later this year you can visit our website: joinzoe.com
