Our Hunter 40.5 is a production boat and serves our purpose just fine. Not everyone needs a blue water boat. Plenty of production boats make large passages and have crossed oceans. Buy a boat that fits your needs. If everyone could afford to buy a Passport, they would, but its out the the price range for many. Production boats allow many more people to sail and enjoy the sport and lifestyle.
Yes of course there are many production boats crossing oceans and it's also true that depending on what you want to do a lighter weight boat with a big cockpit and maybe a shallow draft will give you much more fun than a Passport or a hans Christian. If we were staying in the Med for instance Fair Isle would be the wrong boat, we would be better off most of the time with your Hunter. I don't agree with the price issue though. There are plenty of excellent true blue water boats out there that can be had for less than the price of half decent production boat. You may have to put in some work but the rewards will be high. People just need to be educated about what a boat can and cant do, how much comfort it can do it in and how safely, then people can make an informed decision about what suits them best. That may be a Hunter, it may be a Passport.
Well yes, but keels falling off is a whole different matter! Glenn is defending twin rudders which are MUCH more susceptible to damage than a bolt on keel. I'm sure ir Glenn is happy with twin rudders a bolt on keel is no problem at all,
Its about risking your life and others. You're boats capabilities should meet or exceed the risks you will encounter. Plenty of production boats have successfully crossed oceans, however I would imagine the loss rate is higher than boats designed to cross oceans. Cost is not a problem. If you can afford a new production boat you can afford a used ocean crossing boat.
Admittedly, this is a better and more down to earth (sea?) blue water cruiser review than what the Admiralty Show are able to produce. But ofc, you are only reviewing well known and tested BWC's. Anyways, kudos Judy and Steve
The 615 is of course beautiful and over the top comformtwise, but the 456 is just the perfect boal! Nothing to add in this incredible vessel! I also enjoied the familiar and objective presentation, thanks for that.
Hi to you both,although 2 wheel may be practical on a boat of that size,I find a single steering wheel aesthetically pleasing to the eye.I thoroughly enjoyed your vid.thank you.Roly 🇬🇧.
I really liked your friend’s boat they just bought, it looks so “rational” and sturdy. I think at this point I would rather a used one where all the creaks have worked themselves out, even if I could afford a new one. My favorites are your boat and Aquarius over all of the “new” ones….
I seem to remember another video where someone said : If you had such and such a boat you could cross the Atlantic 4 days faster . My thought was : So what ? Take a plane .
@@deerfootnz yes I’m sure there will always be arguments for but I suppose it will always come down to personal choice and budget at the end of the day .In my own view until the day Mother Nature conforms to computer predictions I know where my choice lies .
Im definatly a fan of the staysail (On a self tacker even better ) But none of them had the cudegrar - The solid dodger , Why they dont , Looks , Expense ?? If they had done the miles im sure they would have it on all cruising boats as not only a great place off/On watch but protection from the elements Sun or rain .
We own Passport 47 hull #2 which is pretty much the same boat as the 456 without the reverse transom. She's a great comfortable boat for covering long distances that makes it easy on the crew. There are older used boats like the 456 and our47 that are much less than a new 615.
The smaller boat is the pick of the two for mine. 45’ has systems that are manageable for one or two people. 60 footers are just so much more powerful and when something stops working and a sail needs to be wrangled to the deck it’s generally beyond a couple. The smaller boat had lovely living spaces and was really just the perfect boat, to my eye.
My wife and I toured the 615 at the boat show on Saturday. Very large indeed. I'm really disappointed with how the racing designs and helm configuration have taken over. Twin rudder and helm means twice as much that will break, not to mention the clorax bottle hulls with some tiny leaded object hanging below. I want some thing that will stand up in a blow, and not have to run to a port. Canceling a sailboat race because of no wind is a good thing, canceling a race because of to much wind equals day sailors.
Yes I agree, but the passports do have a good keel & in line rudder… wait to see what happens when we look around an Oyster that has twin rudders! Out soon!
Excellent and very helpful review, thanks so much both. How do you feel they compare to the Kraken you reviewed earlier this year? That's possibly the only other modern producer that takes true bluewater seriously?
Oh I could write several pages on the Kraken v other blue water boats! The bottom line for me is that I would feel super safe in either, and keep watching because we've got some others coming up too. There are more good Blue water boats still being built than you might think despite some producers like HR and Oyster starting to veer away from that ethos and pandering more to what sells in big numbers i.e. volume inside and large cockpits. For me I think I'd go with the Passport over the Kraken surprisingly, just a personal thing, it suits me better. The Kraken would be more fun to sail though.
I haven't been on an Amel 55, but the thing I would say about Amels is although they are very good boats they are perhaps overrated. Maybe Delos has something to do with this! Henri Amel designed the Amel range to be an affordable capable cruiser, he had some excellent innovative ideas and knocked out a lot of boats, relatively low price, high quality. But he did this by have one set design and one production line at a time. You couldn't ever specify the colour of the upholstery. Thats fine for most things, but for others not so mush. The fact Amels are ketch rigged with in mast furling for instance would exclude them as a boat I was interested in, but if it happens to be what you want then you're fine!
@@svfairisle Those are comments all all very true. I think Amel has changed their product offering. In addition to the traditional 55' Amel ketch, the Amel 50' and 60' center cockpit yachts are sloops. There are both single mast (but with in mast furling). I personally prefer a ketch at that length of a boat, as a ketch offers more sail area and at the same time shorter masts. Ketches just seems to offer more sail options to suit weather and sea conditions. But, you are correct, I think it's an individual decision whether to choose ketch or sloop; center cockpit vs. rear cockpit. It's all personal option. I think you are also correct in that historically Amels all came off the production line identically. I don't think that is true today. I think all boat manufacturers need to offer owners choices on layout, the interior materials, and options on how they are equiped. Especially as these price points! Heck, I think the Amel 60 is in the $2.5M price range, plus options! These yachts are very much luxury goods! I think your series of yacht comparisons is very interesting. I hope you'll be comparing many of these yachts. Certainly, this video was excellent. You do it in way which I find interesting and informative. Thank you!
Driving to work in may thanks seethed in my 8 axis stabilized seat i feel secure…. A I would state that most modern boats are blue water if the sailor is. Sailing a long keel boat may ba all the excitement some one need, but this is not cruising that all would like. We have faster planing boats that due to speed may be just as secure with modern forecasting and the ability to run away from weather. These bots åre a lot more fun to sail. As far as I know most of the boats in route the rhum or other transatlantic races are sea worthy. May not any one of them have the nice interior that you seem to prefer but definitely not dangerous. May want to raise the question should not a cruiser in Caribien or west cost of Europe have the ability to stand on its keel thus twin keelers or lifting keels with stand pods. Can a boat with middle positioned bed ever be a cruiser ( you will fall out of bed at sea), or should all cruisers have plenty of different sleeping arrangements for the owners?
I used to sail a bilge keeler on the East coast of England, great for drying out and for not getting into trouble on the soft mud and big tides, but bilge keelers are not a fun fast boat, which you seem to want? There are now twin ruddered boats that can dry out of course and these can be fast and fun. The question is are they a good option to sail around the world? For me not. Others may want it, but don't kid yourself that the ability to dry out will have you doing it all the time. From the people I know who have these boats virtually none ever do, it's too risky. A rock in the wrong place or a patch of soft mud/sand can get you in all sorts of trouble. As for the bed, no one uses the master bed at sea. Short handed it's always a pilot berth or more likely for a couple the saloon couch. It's not a good idea to be locked away in a cabin if it's just a cruising couple. As for a cruising boat that planes, I don't think such a thing exists.
@@svfairisle it depends om what you think is planing is. To me is vraking and going above hull speed. There have several French boats With two keels thai are able to do this away from the wind and still has decent performance up wind. Wether or not a cruising boat should be a home With all the home comforts then there probably are no cruisets no, but if one do not need a dishwasher and a washing machine there should be several that to me have what qualifies as cruisers.
@@pereugenkristiansen6324 We all go above hull speed, even Fair Isle at 26 tons can do it! Planing is a very different thing, no cruising boat can do. It's not a question of dishwashers, you would be without any of the stuff you need to live. Also to have a rear end flat and wide enough to plane you need to be able to make sure the boat can't heel much, thats why the boats like the open 60's that are designed to do this in the open ocean have canting keels and pumped water ballast. If you let them heel they will be impossible to steer with a following sea. It's a nice though to have a 'fun fast boat' but there's a real limit when it comes to weighing a boat down with cruising gear and sailing it shorthanded, this is why i think it's dangerous to try and make so called 'blue water boats' look like a racing boat, it won't perform well and in the worse case swill be dangerous.
@@svfairisle ther is Nottingham nes to me here…. All boats can «surf» if the wind and the waves are right. The thing is that braking the hull wave happens a lot earlier in boats with different construction to the traditional displacement and a lot more frequent. All modern boats should be sailed «flat» and if done correctly th actually become comfortable to sail. To sail flat you will need to have the rigth sails for the conditions…. And yes some solutions are best for all like staysails, efficient refing systems…. You do not need a bit displacement to be safe…. I personally like both linds of boats, however, if i need to choose I Would go for a non displacement as they are to slow in light air, and although they can Get up to Max speed at passages they will not when you are fjord cruising and have to tack…. And never as fast as other designs.
Great reviews with honest Blue water sailing experience driving them. Would be fascinated to hear your choice of top ten affordable 2nd hand blue water cruising boats. I’ve always loved the Moody 38CC and similar Moody designs
Production boats as boats from big producers may be called is not that bad. What is a production boat anyway. The quality of boats of course differs depending of price and quality management of the builder. Boats speed under sail is important when I choose a boat not old designs and heavy materials.😅
Ever had to sail to windward in a Production boat for more then a few hours , You have to run off20 deg. or slow them down because of the pounding from there flat forfoot (Floor space in the forard cabin) Mind 'good' cruisers (Gentlemen) Shouldn't be sailing to windward Yes horses for courses .
@@claussvensson8670 well that’s not the case with modern production boats, Bill has it right. Hull designs in modern yachts have made sailing into weather uncomfortable at best and dangerous at worst
@@claussvensson8670 Claus I wasn't being fiseshis by implying youv never sailed to windward in a production boat I was just referring to there very uncomfortable actions in any seaway on the wind , In flat waters they are a very exciting yacht on all points of sail BUT in my experience iv found them to be a pain in the but clawring of a lee shore , trying to make a safe port before a low comes in & have seen Toilet doors Jam , fittings come loose but mostly the consistent slamming witch you dont get (Or very little) With a deep forfoot yacht , Pleasant sailing (Off the wind) .
Resale value should be fine for both. There huge demand for spacious boats to entertain on, manufacturers can’t build them fast enough, and passage making boats will become increasingly scarce so should hold value too
It is a bit boring hearing about the negative comments on twin rudder boats and even Halberg Ramsay “selling out”. Statistically, more twin ruddered boats cross the oceans (given that most racing yachts have them, especially the mini 650 class) and the level of rudder damage they suffer is insignificant. Your view, all be it making you feel fuzzy and warm inside, is outdated.
Crossing oceans in a twin ruddered boat is no problem, you're not going to hit the bottom! (although a big piece of floating debris could ruin you day!) Cruising is another matter there are ample opportunities there to leave you stranded. Just take a look at the film we made with Kraken at about 21 mins in ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-uNXSfwO8NWI.html Dick, who is about as experienced a sailor as you can get got hung up on a chain leaving Bodrum marina. No harm done with the Kraken, but if that had been a twin ruddered boat, one it would have been MUCH easier to snag it and two it would have almost certainly resulted in a bent rudder shaft which would probably have left the boat with no steerage. So yes I think we all felt 'fuzzy and warm' going out for a days sailing as planned instead of arranging to lift the boat to fix a bent shaft!
