Boost Pedal Before Or After Overdrive? [Gain Staging Basics] 

Equalizer at the end of everything works like a charm for this. You can mess around with tone and whatnot all you like, but for live situations, you can boost your volume easily with it as well!

Currently watching this in the gym whilst on a cross trainer. The guy next me just gave me a weird look as I realised I'd just said, "Bet Dan mentions the after delay thing" out loud.

Always on clean boost last in chain to get that sweet spot for the amp. That’s what I do :) also doubles up as a buffer.

I have an Xotic EP Boost (Echoplex circuit emulator/boost) that I put right in front of my RevivalDrive. I only give it a small boost, but I like what it does for the sound. I don't usually use it for distortion, because I can add that right on the RevivalDrive. The EP just pushes a slightly richer midrange into the RD that I love. (I don't ad top end with the internal dip switch, I'm just using the circuit) It also works nice at the end of the entire chain as an overall boost for everything, giving it a lift and a pleasing tonality.

For me, a TS-9 before all my drive pedals with the gain turned down and volume at 3 o'clock, then an MXR Line Driver at the other end gives me glorious OD options. Nice vid chaps, short and sweet!

I've been running a Rowin Dumbler into the D&M Drive, then the MXR Carbon Copy delay, then ABY into two Boss Katana 50s (Mk1 and Mk2) with reverbs and masters cranked. It's an odd mix, maybe, but holy moly it's glorious. This video was fascinating, great work gents!

Hey Dan and Mick, just wanted to say that I bought the D&M pedal this week and was incredibly impressed. The option to change the boost/drive order is a nice touch.

I have really come to the conclusion I want both. Used to use a Mesa Boogie with a (solo) feature which just bumped up master volume "Sweet". Problem is, I like Fender amps with everything in front. So Ge7 at the end of chain for me. Wah, tuna, comp, boost, od, mod , dly, Ge 7.

For me, the Thorpy Peacekeeper is the best for this. It's a "low gain" overdrive that lets you completely turn down the overdrive, but, also has a TON of volume on tap. As well, there is a VERY powerful EQ on it. In case you were thinking about buying the Heavy Water, look into this one for extra versatility! 💙from🇨🇦

I traded a ts9 for an archer gold klon. I ran it into a fulltone fat boost and it is incredible tone. This combination makes my univibe pop like never before.

Tumnus Deluxe set pretty clean with three band EQ at the end of the drives. Makes everything sound great, and always cut. But the best tone piece in this show has to be that MEMORY MAN. wow. I also love a clean boost after the delay and reverb! sounds so good.

Dudes, adding an effects loop to the Heavy Water would make so much sense. Great idea!

Excellent demonstration of boost. I like my Nobels ODR-1, but found it a touch lackluster in the upper mids and couldn't fix it with the Spectrum control. So, I put a Boss GE-7 in front of it and ever so gently boosted the upper mids while also pulling the lower mids down a hair. Problem solved. :-)

Yup, I run both. An EP and Keeley Katana before my overdrives and an EQ after. Best of both!

It’s hilarious that this video is 20 mins but it really, really does seem like “a short one”. Never change!

I’ve had a fun journey with you guys, that to my luck, corresponded with the height of my career and the liquidity to do what I want (hasn’t always been the case). I’ve come to the realization that I truly just might need a fuzz face…though a tone bender is a great tool. I didn’t understand “All you need is fuzz” until I went through this journey. They can boost, distort, and get the fuzz all with a volume knob. Fun conclusion. Get my reverb and trem from the amps, a Ripply Fall, and some delay. Always wet/dry/wet. Tone wise, couldn’t be happier. Heart broken over 🇺🇦 Ukraine, for which I play the blues to sooth my soul and weep for their circumstance.

Hey Mick and Dan, cheers from Glasshouse Mountains near Brisbane, Australia! I have absolutely loved experimenting with gain stacking. Loving my King of Tone Clone with buffer the latest addition to my pedal board into my Suhr Riot Pedal I find it doesn’t! Compress as much as other overdrives like the Kilt. So feeling both inspired and educated by the show. I am getting a better sound out of my existing pedals from watching the show and trying different things. Loving my AC30 and VC30 in stereo. Going to try wet dry wet with the big Sky and Timeline and putting a boost pedal after my overdrives. Thank you so much for all you do to keep us all on our toes. Love your work! God bless you both!

Forget ye not the venerable TC Spark which has bass and treble controls plus a mid kick switch; awesome at the end of the chain for solos and cheap as chips. I only wish Dan and Mick were around 30 years ago when this awesome resource would have saved me a lot of money in experimentation. Sterling work, chaps!

Did you guys guessed the topic I was gonna request?? Got back to rehearsing with the band, first time trying my drives into a 100 watt amp, I used a boost before my drives but had a hard time leveling the levels of clean and crunch and solo. Thank you so much, this is a very useful show!!

Thanks for providing a channel dedicated to pedals.

That Kaluna is one of the first valve overdrives I've heard that sounds like a real amp gain stage. Other valve pedals still sound like pedals.

Perfect timing - my KoT and Beano Boost arrived this week!

Personally, I prefer boosting into dirt. I run my drives lighter, and that has two important upshots. First, switching from chords to lead lines drops signal enough that you fall below the edge of breakup, so a boost can give that back. Second, even though you *do* get dirtier boosting into gain, I find that you also gain some volume on many gain pedals, especially if set "edgy" into a clean amp with some headroom. You guys had the Kaluna pretty cranked, so I'm not surprised it didn't let you get any louder in that setup, but depending on the circuit and the setting a boost into dirt can give you both louder and dirtier.

One of my favorite tones seems counterintuitive at first. Put a tube screamer with no gain and all the level in front of a driving amp (Mesa Dual Rec) to clean up the low end and add gain, but then put a boost in front of the tube screamer to thicken it back up in a different way than the amp's gain structure. Not a solo boost, but it's Brillant for the music i play

Great tones/info as per usual, after watching one of the vids going back along, I copied you guys idea of have klony type (silver archer) after drives and it’s staying there for ever! Small bit of gain plenty of level and it always works to get solo sounds to poke through! It works especially well with a superreverb with it running about Halfway’s up! It’s almost like adding a expander to the signal due to the head room in it! Love the show and looking forward in the future at some stage to go on one of the experience days as that would be a dream come true to meet you guys and try extract even more tone gold info!

You know you're in for a good episode when Dan's memory Man comes out!

A well done video. I'm sure this will pre-empt anyone ever asking any pedal order questions ever again.

Another fantastic video. I hope someone rants about how “short” it is compared to other videos.

The Ascent can also be an anti-boost, which is sometimes useful with high headroom, loud amps. On another subject, I sure hope Neville's gig on Sunday can be recorded, especially the songs Mick sits in on. And unrelated but extremely cool, Brothers Landreth fans will want to hear the title track on Bonnie Raitt's new album. The song really suits her well. ;-)

Excellent short format show. It's a nice way to get new viewers in the door and craving more. Soon they'll be all over the tangents and wanting the long shows! Nice content today. Have a great weekend!

15:41 was the holiest sound I've ever heard! 💙

I have a Wampler Tumnus in front of my Prince of Tone and a Bad Bob at the end of the chain before splitting into my wet/dry amps. They work so nicely together. At the very front I have my Sun Face and Gunshot OD. Both of those pedals seem to like to be first in the chain.

Sweet! I just ordered my second TC Spark (full size) to put at the end. The other Spark is at the beginning being used as an always on EQ/boost/tone shaper. I love that pedal and it’s cheap! Great video BTW!

Would enjoy hearing you guys add a little here about how the amount of clean headroom available in your amp (which is also part of your gain stage) changes this calculus. Say, a Princeton Reverb vs a Twin Reverb.

Boost into drive with the bass up and down would be a really interesting thing to demonstrate with the bass and drums some time, if you haven't already done so.

Think i do my drive section a little different than most. I do overdrive>clean boost 1>compressor>clean boost 2. This combo seems to give the best of all worlds and great flexibility. Big cleans and tight crunch in any amounts needed on the fly.

I’ve been putting a jhs haunting mids in front of a echo line roadrunner (transparent drive) recently, it sounds brilliant and is really shapable.

I love how you chose to revisit this topic. It was brilliant, interesting- and contained a few surprises. Killer playing, too, mates.

My good friend is building me an overdrive pedal with a boost circut that can be switched before or after the overdrive with a switch! I cant wait to get it.

I have a EP boost at the front of the chain and a RC Boost at the end and works good for me

A real good, clear and very well explained demonstration on boost! Thank you Dan & Mick. Greetings from Hollywood California. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year 2024!!

Great show! Short and sweet. But I can’t help wanting more… I know! if I want to get more TPS signal, I’ll just put my Heavy Water after it. See you Monday (crossing fingers)!

Thanks guys! Great, to-the-point episode. I do miss red, though.

I have tried alil experimenting and I run a thing that has the best of both worlds for me. Guitar > OBNE Haunt Fuzz > wampler ratsbane > flamma fc18 boost > boss BD-2 as my drive chain, i find it covers a lot of ground!

I use a double boost pedal in the middle of my drives to make some have two levels of volume and some to add gain stages. My amp also has one at the end of the signal for another volume boost if needed. In a live show this works great.

I need another dose of That Pedal Show!

I use a low gain, high volume overdrive with the drive all the way down (with the eq very useful) at the very beginning of my drives and then a klon after all of my drives. I love 2 boosts sandwiching all of my "higher" gain drives.

Both, well kind of. I use a Boss GE-7 Graph EQ cutting low ferquencies and boosting the level between some guitars and the front end of the amp. Also I put a Zoom 70 CDR in the FX loop with a graph eq block to increase volume and boosting mids for soloing, and an analog delay block to make it sound more interesting for soloing.

I used to run my boost pedals before and after. RC Booster first and an EP Booster last and it was awesome!

I'd love to hear thoughts on using a timmy as a volume boost at the end of the gain stage. Sort of an organic boost that pushes in the perfect amount of overdrive to taste. Plus it lets you trim off some bass and even push up the highs if needed. I love what it does!

IME, in using lower output amps 20 watts and lower, gain staging with multiple pedals isn't the way to go.What is better is to start with an an amp that is close to what you are looking for, so the Drive is more fine tuning.I've generally found that putting Fuzzes up front where needed, the Drive and non sensitive Fuzzes mid chain, and a good high headroom EQ/Boost like the EQD Tone Job( I've tried many, and they are def are not all the same) at the end to finalize the overall tone and volume level.Pushing boosts into Drives with smaller amps is going to create mud; compressors and Treble Boosters are better for changing EQ and gain and sustain levels.Consider the possibility that all those multiple pedals could be doing more harm than good, or that they are better employed individually.Keep in mind the amps usually used on TPS vs. those you have.

Thanks Fellas, I hope youre all doing well with the weather there.

This show has so much awesome information

The Kaluna! Good choice, gents. It's a ripper. That Heavy Water by Thorpy seems to make everything sound better. It's extraordinary, I've never heard anything like it.

I use one pre and post gain, it allows you to keep the drive knob on the pedals at a lower level and it just creates a sound that is both massive and clear. Even the best pedals can get too "grainy" with the gain knob turned up too high, this allows everything to stay in their respective "sweet spots."

I use a boost before my dirt which is always on it's almost at equal level with my overdrive , I also have a boost before my amp that is always on I use it again to maintain volume it fattens my sound , lastly I use a clean overdrive to drive which is my solo boost

Great video as always ! Rory got it right 50 plus years ago . 😉

To me it all boils down to your conclusion: the one you want to get louder when you step on it must go second. Took me a surprisingly long time playing live to figure this out.

I have totally fallen into the camp of boost into overdrive and then using a volume pedal (with a minimum volume setting at the heel) after the final gain stage to turn up for solos. So I was enjoying your video but wasn't learning anything new. Then the 335 into the Kaluna was rolling and you stepped on the Heavy Water....boom goes the dynamite. Great little show today. Have a great weekend.

Yeah I run two graphic EQ pedals. One immediately after the drive section for changing the character of the drives. One in the EFX loop for lead boost. I don’t like boosts in front of drive pedal. I want my dirty sounds to be open not over compressed. Dirt pedals are effectively compressors. Clean tones are different. I like early compression but I’m an old Nashville guy. In the loop a little bit of boost goes a long way up the volume scale.

I'm running a Keeley Aria at the start of my signal chain, before overdrives, and I'm using the compressor level control as a boost. This gives both more clipping AND volume. Blend & sustain controls at around 9 o'clock.

Not all boost > overdrives seem to act the same. I have an EP booster going into a morning glory and there is some volume change going on. Similarly, I have the moonshine going into the morning glory and it also gives some extra volume. I guess one could argue that the difference between a "transparent drive" and a "dirty boost" is basically nill. My solution to this is as follows: Boost > tube screamer like OD > transparent OD > 3-band klon like OD > boost ... I'm kind of missing a disortion and fuzz though...

Heavy Water is such a great pedal. The lower end knob makes for a great neck pickup strat sound.

Dan that tele is amazing

This tele into the Kaluna is amazing.

I think of it like working out. The pre helps you get more gains and the post helps you amplify those gains.

If you really want to tune the tone going in to an overdrive most EQ pedals include a boost and using them you can really tune your overdrive to exactly what you want out of it. If you use a midi eq like source audio that can give you multiple different overdrive and clean sounds by controlling the EQ and the stacking. There is no end to the tinkering.

Thanks for another info packed episode gentleman. I've been running a FTT Crunchy Chime booster on my board for the last several weeks. It's a very versatile boost pedal, it can do subtle boost up to, as the name implies, slight crunchy tones. It has excellent EQ (seperate Treble and Bass) control with 2 modes of Bass EQ. I'm running it in front of my Dualist and TomatoTone and it really adds some depth to those presets. But that ThorpyFX Heavy Water is really speaking to me....resistance is futile...resistance is futile... Cheers

I don't think I ever recall seeing a Timmy on the show before. This would have been the perfect opportunity with its EQ controls and I think a lot more people own a Timmy than a Heavy Water, which was already featured 2 or 3 times recently. Also, I knew the DMM was a large box, but holy cow! Seeing it next to a Belle Epoch which I'm familiar with, sheesh its a biggun.

I like both, but use a relative clean overdrive before another overdrive for dirt and an EQ after to boost selected frequency range depending upon other instruments.

Boy, the more I hear that Tone King, the more GAS I get. Thanks guys (in the nicest sarcastic way possible 😉).

Ok, I see I need to experiment with boosters in conjunction with overdrive/ distortion pedals more😄 My favorite booster is the Clean Boost setting on the Elektron Analog Drive which has a great EQ with semiparametric mids.

Love the educational episodes but do indeed miss pedal jams/picknmix

Vertex boost, because it's so transparent and doesn't color as most other boosts. Also has a buffer built in. That always on after my tube factor lets me use the volume pot of my tele to change the amount of overdrive without losing high frequencies. In front I can push the tube facor with a spark booster mini if wanted.

Wearing the same shirt Dan, love it!

Thanks Guys for another grate Vid ,I used a Boss GE7 to Boost my EH Muff ,I think it sounded better before the Muff can't remember , Also it made the MXR Fullbore sound way better than it did stand alone , I did it because I was trying to get that Doom Sludge sound and the GE7 with the MXR did the trick . Im sure some Extreme Metal Genres used the GE7 in a similar way , although I might be wrong im sure I will be corrected at some point , everything starts to get hazy for me when I think back.

Great show! Very informative. I really appreciate that you guys play different style guitars. I don’t play single coil guitars, so it is really helpful for me to hear the humbucker examples.

Another great video guys, hugly helpfull in building my first rig, doubt I could ever work all this out on my own. Keep up the good work.

Great episode guys👍

Everytime i hear the tps pre-intro my body goes into full love mode!

I've been tackling this in real time all week..great timing w this guys! I have clean boost in alot of my pedals but my standalone boosts are the spark mini and the original....lpb-1... different boosts for sure..the lpb1 is much cleaner..the spark has some coloring to it so I feel it matters more where I put it than the he power booster...?

Boost into overdrive seems a bit counterintuitive since it will change the tone of the drive. I mean, normally you buy the drive for it’s unique tone and this might be something you would want to boost. But to each their own I guess

Really nice riffing there chaps

As I tend to use dual pedals (Budda Zenman, T-Rex Moller 2 or Hobo Drive) the point is moot for me. These pedals are always last in my overdrive/distortion chain. My amps are usually set clean or mildly crunchy depending on the band style so the clean boost is purely that - extra volume. I occasionally use a treble-booster, or its EQuivalent, in front of my drive if I want slightly more cut to my tone but not the extra volume.

Tried a Fulldrive 2 recently. At first I didn't get it, I expected the boost to give me more level. Once I realised it kicked the drive up a gear and I could set two levels of the same drive I was sold. I have always put boost after drive, even when stacking drives. I realise the newer ones do both but I kind of loved sculpting "my tone" with two levels and the volume on the guitar. Besides, I have several boosts and the top boost on my Vox to kick up the volume.

I definitely need a boost with a bass knob. I get that everyone loves mids (me as well) but man, bass adds so much yum to everything.

Orders Fuzz is All You Need shirt… looks down at pedalboard… xotic wah, quartermaster 6, analogman sunlion (fuzz/boost), micro vibe, hw tube screamer, protein (nobel and bluesbreaker), dd8 (delay + reverb + looper)… this show keeps me constantly buying pedals

The question itself wrecks the real answer. The answer is, which resolves everything, is that a rangemaster treble booster should be placed before overdrive, and that a clean volume booster should be placed after the overdrive. If using amp distortion, the clean boost after the preamp should be in the effects loop, not in front of the preamp. If using a clean amp with no effect loop, then the range master should be omitted and only a dyna comp should be used as a boost.

Another great video guys so thank you :-) Always wanted a Dallas Rage Master booster clone and in the past the only pedals I've owned and used was a Dunlop Wah and a Boss BD-2 blues driver from my Strat and SG straight into a Vox ac-4 which sounds quite tame but cranked was brutal (especially for my then neighbours and family) but certainly did a good job as a treble boost with some adjusting even though not a strict treble boost.

Have you ever tried having a boost up high before your overdrives with the gain turned down and then a volume cut after the overdrives to make them more dynamic and touch sensitive? I haven’t really fully tested it yet but I think it will as I’ve sort of experienced it before when treating. This requires turning down the gain on the drive pedals and the volume cut after it so it doesn’t push the pedals after it or the amp more than you want

Rangemaster in the front klon in the back does all the things.

I have put it after which, for me, gives me more control with headroom and clarity

Y'all make the best vids..... thanks so much!!!

Hence the necessity for two boosts - one before and one after the gain stage. "Honey! Mick and Dan said I need a new pedal."

Fender Engager Boost has great EQ as well...😎😎

They called you "soccer dads" in The Pedal Movie. Ha! Dads that can play like crazy!!

The J Rockett Holdsworth boost pedal has overdrive too. I can get a stacked /boost combination in front of the Strymon Riverside.

Boosts... God.... everywhere? Lol Looking forward to this.

EP Boost (always on) after my overdrives and before delay and modulation pedals - everything sounds flat and flimsy without it

I have a King of Tone clone, so my overdrive is also my boost. That being said, the Distortion side is running into the boost, and before all that is the Big Muff