There is so much fluff in the bike industry. It’s very refreshing to watch someone approach bike repairs and bike “science” (engineering) from a practical standpoint. Not talking about “compliance” or any other made up bike industry buzz words. You, hambini, PT, and GC Performance are a breath of fresh air and some of my favs in the bike world. Thanks for what you do!
I think P5 is the bearing class it's not the fit class, there is a page on my website that explains this "Bearing technical information". But I could be wrong... There are lots of oddballs in the bike industry. Also if it was the bearing outer fit, it should should have a small p. ie p5 and not P5. 41.2mm yikes... Is someone having a laugh?! The bearings in the BB that you have are Toyama, they are not generic, it's marked on the outer race (you would need to remove the bearing to see it). Last year, NTN moved their production of small bore bearings away from Japan and subcontracted it out, and I don't think their quality is as good as it used to be; this coincided with an influx of fakes. Additionally, in non-contact seals, NTN has a virtual monopoly as they are considerably better than others, so they can charge a premium. In 2RS, there is not much to differentiate between bearing suppliers, and there is a lot more supply, so the price is more competitive. I prefer to get my bearings made in Japan (because they respect honour codes) so I choose one of a few eg, NSK, Koyo, Toyama, SKF, INA etc.
I forgot to add, T47 and BB86 will be on the way soon. I was a bit sceptical as to whether the SRI bb's would prove popular, but those fears have been allayed.
It’s 41.1. I misspoke. I did put a little *. The micrometer shows. I was pointed to an SKF page about the P5 but it did cause some confusion here. It is +0.15. A little bigger than the enduro. Well done for noticing.
I think the comments about going back to threaded not necessarily being the answer to all of our prayers is spot on. No matter the interface, if the frame manufacturers can't make something to spec / in tolerance / fit for purpose, we're sadly no better off :( Also XHP222 FTW 😀
I am having success with the Shimano SM-BB94-41A PF BB fitted dry into the carbon frame (Scott Spark) with a bearing press. No creaks and continues to run smoothly with the XTR cranks. I swapped out the original 30mm Next SL cranks and RF BB...and never looked back. I have used Acros in the past with good results and friendly service. Thanks for the exploration to find BB nirvana. I really think that for carbon frames a decent PF is the way to go and threaded for Al alloy frames.
I've had pretty good luck with my Wheels MFG BB86 ABEC-3 BB for my GRX drivetrain on my Salsa Warbird. The Warbird is not known for having the best tolerances but so far this BB has helped keep the cranks/bb quiet.
Even more happy I purchase a LOOK. A bit heavier, partially due to the bottom bracket design, but with more piece of mind that the frame should last well and be worth the substantial cash investment!
@@youling1997 Hi yes absolutely many have a lifetime guarantee. You often do not get an exact like for like replacement though. And of course you have time without a bike and have to pay for the rebuild, unless you do it yourself. If there is little difference in purchase price I personally would always go for the ‘higher quality’ frame even if it has a slight, potential, performance disadvantage. Having read much about the LOOK I think it’s likely right up there with the absolute top tier performance wise. I also bought with my heart as had LOOKs before when younger and this Blade in the colour I bought certainly floats my boat :)
Whilst I don't doubt your experiences of bb threaded inserts coming loose I can happily report that I have a 16 year old pinarello quattro fp4, owned from new and done many thousands of miles including touring. I honestly only replaced the original Shimano Italian bottom bracket last year. The frame was made in Taiwan and proves that it can be done properly.
Good. Thank you. Funnily enough,very recently had a local bike shop contact me-removal of worn out press fit BB on an old giant resulted in the aluminium threaded insert pushing out.. I did successfully bond it back in..no more creaking😅
Just love how you explain the concepts in an easy way. Quite an interesting brand with the o rigns. I havd to say that their website is not very clear haha. I like a 3rd interference place to increase stiffness
I must have fitted every PF41-DUB bottom bracket out there. From ceramic (expensive, don't last 2,500km), OEM (cheapish, sort of last 5,000km), even China-special (cheap, don't last 1,200km). Will now give the Bikone a try, but pretty close to changing to a new bike just to get away from such a sub-optimal BB standard.
Why not get your frame checked first? Make sure the bore is correct. For that size it is a nightmare. BBinfinate do a good one but not very weatherproof if you want low friction. Otherwise. Enduro XD15 probabaly the most durable.
@@Mapdec Brilliant advice. Thanks for that. Will give their stainless one a try before pulling the trigger on the more expensive XD15. But yeah, PF41 and DUB is a nightmare.
Great content keep up the good work. I do have an Emonda SLR 8 with the infamous BB90 BB if you can let me know where to forward my details as I'd would love to try and see if they last in the cornish lanes.
I am slightly confused, these bb's are trying to correct an interference fit that is oversized either due to wear or initial poor tolerance in manufacture. If that's the case, why the hard shell aluminium? Each frame oversize is going to be different and thus forcing in an oversized BB aluminium cup could cause damage? Or are we saying tolerance doesn't really matter? The point I'm getting to is that surely bearing retaining compound (many types including those that fill a gap) should negate the need for a generic fixed sized BB designed to fill a gap which is going to be different on every frame? I understand that those bespoke bb's Hambini does are entirely different and, because they are bespoke, a perfectly reasonable solution.
You are kinda right. That’s why I was calling on BikOne to publish the dimensions. With the oversize BB here it means we can salvage an oversized frame by reaming to a consistent bore on both sides and fitting an oversized BB.
Nice video Paul. Some food for thought. I think if my threads debonded, a sleeve like the FSA BB30 adapter to put new threads into the frame would be ideal. Note to my future self: if that happens get a local machinist to knock one up 😂 Or just use it as an excuse to buy a new Time or Look frame 🎉😃 Looking forward to your future videos on the bikeone BBs
As a punter on the Internet, it's hard to understand how this is a problem in the first place. This isn't F1, it's just a human-powered device, and at the price of a high-end road bike one would expect excellent reliability. I'm guessing that the market values weight and good advertisements above reliability; I can't think of any other reason.
Its pity that we in Sweden cant buy a LOOK frame in this country to get a proper bottombracket shell. Swedish bike shops ar so scared to start selling a new brand so almost all bikeshops sell exactely the same bikes in Sweden
I had a 2015 Emonda with BB90 it went from normal bearings to oversized and then Trek Under warranty re carboned the bottom bracket. The creaking continued and in the end they replaced the frame with a 2018 frame with another BB90 😭 Within 6 months the creaking started and were back on oversized bearings again
I bought a Time ADHX and I put the Rotor ceramic (the standard version was out of stock) using the Loctite 7649 & 641. I went with that based on other video you made. Maybe I should I went with the BBinfinite, time will tell. BB are the most confusing part to buy when you build a bike. So many standard, each standard have different name, each one have different build (1 pieces, 2 pieces) made of different material(metal vs plastic) with different bearing type (ceramic vs metal, different type of seal) etc. And would be nice if it stop there, but then you still need to figure out the spacer you need, I put none on the non drive side and 1 on the drive side. Time provide no instruction manual, so that doesn't help.
@@Mapdec I just took the crank out and checked the bearing for fun. They are crunchy after 3000km. On the drive side it even started polishing the crank shaft. Rotor 👎
@@Mapdec I don’t understand how we can make high speed turbines, nuclear submarines, aircraft, and space telescopes but a set of human powered cranks in a bicycle ends up being such a shitshow. 🤷♀️
@@Mapdec you’re doing a good job with that! No one makes it easy, with all these many & weird BB standards and axles and proprietary fastening systems around (shimano left crank preload tool? wtf? Why not use a hex key?! And that’s one of many!)
You said that you do not think a threaded solutions like Token Ninja are not ideal for carbon frames due to the required torque. And what do you think about those for aluminium frames? The thing is - in my 2019 aluminium Trek Checkpoint I have a PF41 BB shell and I'm looking for a creaking-free solution to pair with the Shimano GRX crankset. As far as I checked the Token Ninja is the only readily avaliable option (at least currently) in the region where I live.
Maybe thread press-fit system is fine on alu. I've not heard of this brand. thx for showing this. I looked up Bikone: Norwegian dictionary showed up: woman with whom one (marries and) has children in addition to one's actual wife 😀
I saw your other video where you said for press fit with Shimano crankset the best option was the Shimano Ultegra bb. I am buying a Time bike but I don't know which bb I should fit now after this video :)
Thanks for the video Paul, I am hoping to buy the overdue next Scylon and am about to preorder a Hambini bb to match my dream bike. Now I learned that I would need spacers to achieve the correct chainline. If this is the case and the Hambini bb does not come with the necessary spacers, could you possibly point me to a place where I could get decent ones? Also: what kind thickness would be required. Thanks for you informative content! It makes me want to visit the Lake District too. It really seems to be a lovely destination. Greetings from Germany. Kind regards, Daniel
would you mind sharing which facing tool(s) you use? i'd really like to get mine done (i have a tarmac SL7 with the problem you mentioned in this video) and would like to do the work myself as I am not lucky enough to have a shop like yours nearby!!
Sram DUB BB are rubbish. You are lucky to get 6 months life. I now used a Enduro Hitmax on my Genesis CdF Ti 68mm BB shell external cups. For my new Giant Revolt I have fitted a Enduro PF41 X15 D. Both of these have life time warranty. No brainer. Especially for me as I'm a high mileage rider. Paul why not use Enduro X15-D P41 on Time frames?
Great video! Off topic question; I have a 2024 Look 765 optimum and I have bent the derailleur hanger, twice. I think it’s made from cheese. Do you know of anyone making stouter hangers for the bike? I’m in the USA. I love everything else about the bike.
Excellent content as always Paul. Do you have any thoughts on Colnago T45 to replace threaded cup with BB86 press fit? I’m thinking Ceramicspeed T45 but interested in your experience, cheers.
@@Mapdec Colnago use a threadfit cup system on some frames. The cups then accept a BB86 pressfit. Its a system only used by Colnago. If you remove the threaded cups the frame hole is 45mm x 82.5mm and will accept a T45 threadfit.
Hambini claims the following about the SRI BB: "The methods used to manufacture this bottom bracket are unlikely to be found anywhere else within the bike industry" And "The load rating is significantly higher than the competition" Whilst these statements may be true, I couldn't find any data to back them up. Any ideas?
Thinking if the new hambini BB if it is cheaper with international shipping to west coast USA then get it for my 2017 railegh CX/ gravel bike if it will last much longer then fsa mega exo.
@mapdec. I'm struggling to solve my bb90 oversized issue. Currently waiting for trek to give me their analysis. The oversized bearing doesn't seem to solve the issue. Any advice on which one of these could be best ?
No. And sorry for the confusion. The metal parts is still the correct size. The o rings remove the need for a retaining compound. They might prevent some level of corrosion.
Hi. So if I purchased the new cheaper Hambini bb then would I only need to replace the bearings on wearing out and the shell would be reusable? Many thanks if you can help.
I had the LBS install a Wheels Manufacturing BB on my Orbea Orca when they installed my Ultegra Di2. I now see uneven witness marks on the crank spindle, the drive side is 360degrees around, the non-drive side it's about halfway. I didn't have any witness marks with my old 105 press fit BB. LBS said they are normal and that the only reason I never had any with 105 bearings is because of the plastic cover on the bearings. Thoughts?
@@Yamaha_Bolt it’s most likely that the plastic BB dealt with some minor misalignment with its squishy compliance. I would go back to using a Shimano. The metal BB can often cause more problems than they solve.
The marks on the spindle he is talking about come from the fact that there are no delrin top caps in Wheels MFG bottom brackets. Bearings are sized so that they make direct metal to metal contact with crank spindle which causes these marks. I know because I own a BB from Wheels MFG. For me the solution was to purchase top caps from Hambini and change bearings in Wheels MFG BB to a different size accommodating these top caps. Problem was solved, but the total cost of this BB was then not worth it in my opinion. Wouldn't buy a BB without top caps sitting between bearings and crank spindle anymore. Too bad I had to learn the hard way.
@@Mapdec great! my question was a bit about that, but also about what grease do you use inside the bearings themselves? (not racing or anything ultra low friction, but for the weekend warrior) Actually, a video going over what kinds of grease you use for different purposes would be AWESOME. Thinking out loud: rolling bearings such as hubs and BBs, suspension pivot bearings, headset bearings. And also non bearing moving parts like some full suspension frames that use bushings at the pivots. And seals (hubs/BBs/pivots), assembly grease or anti-seize for stems or seatposts. There's probably less uncertainty around suspension forks and shocks, the manufacturers tend to be very specific in their service manuals.
@@MichielvanderMeulen because otherwise the BB still screws onto an uneven painted finish and rocks. Except now it’s worse because the BB is supported up 1-2mm of paint.
LMAO BIKONE's design is supposed to help stiffness?? no way! They put an elastomer right in the middle of the stiffening mechanism with slide fit. That's like saying "by spreading mayonnaise all over my body, I'll be 5% more aero"
@Mapdec I don’t understand why you continue to promote Hambini. His information on BB tolerance maybe correct (as he works in manufacturing, correct tolerancing is day to day stuff) however his behaviour elsewhere is immature, sexist and a shock jock. This is the opposite of what Mapdec seems to be basing your business on and promoting. Professional work and attitudes in the bike industry at the customer level.
It’s literally why I unsubscibed. Mapdec videos mentioned a guy named “Hambini” so much that I checked out his channel thinking I’d find someone wise and an expert on bicycle maintenance. Unfortunately, I found any but that. Instead, I found out this Hambini fellow is involved in feuds with multiple people online, has been accused of very questionable behaviour and his maintenance videos are not very good. It seems like he hates his bicycles the way he treats them. Anyway, it changed my opinion of Mapdec.
This video is still ridiculus. Imagine that, you bought an extremely expensive bike/frame. Turns out it's shit. Now you got the task to buy a fackin expensive bb to solve the problem. As the problem as Hambini shouldn't exist. Cheers.
Don't talk shite.... from that comment, we should get rid of t47.... looks a crock of 💩 if you ask me. That's why Giant went away from that threaded insert design years ago but 🔔🔚 specialized decided to bring it back 🤦🏻♂️. If pressfit is done right, there's no issues
@@Dolmar-Rick A "not just glued in two pieces thread" but a proper threaded bb shell is obviously far better bb design than any press fit. Pressfit simply doesn't make sense, but of course not sensible engineering made that shite, but money saving.
@@EllasPOSEiDON problem with threaded BB shell on a carbon frame is bonding the alloy shell to the frame. You have all the design limitations of a threaded BB with none of the benefits.
@EllasPOSEiDON All BB bearings are press fit. The BB shell of a BSA threaded isn’t the outer bearing race… Your point on cost saving is completely backwards. The only issue with press fit is crap BB shell tolerances due to accurate tolerances being more expensive to manufacture. It’s far easier and cheaper to bond in a threaded shell but then you end up with heavier BB’s, compromised frame design due to narrower BB, and eventual galvanic corrosion between carbon and aluminum shell.
@@Mapdec i don't trust verymuch unbranded components.(on the contrary,Hambini's are unbranded BB's the bearings no they're NTN. But we do have his Engineering channel which proves his theory and justification of that theory, I bought several bb's from him all are 100% Top products). The two sleeves(threaded T47) were over tight(out of tolerance) to slide together. As per the version you showed with PF using not 1 but 2 O'rings does'nt look like a good Idea or necessary really. As all PF bb's should be interferance/friction fit, thus allowing for next to zero non contact of the two faces bb-bb shell. The principal of Hambin's BB is that one Longer side fits into a shorter one is more precise and most probably less prone to deformation under load. This T47 Bikeone being a 50/50 setup, depends entirely on the quality of the threads being perfectly alligned L/R.