The pre built bike rip off 

Your 100% on the ball how many parents are faced with the same dilemma a race bike is the same cost as a top end second hand car you have saved that family hundreds or maybe even more Mapdec is a one off cycle engineering company with few equals loved the video thanks.

Whenever I buy a new bike I always have to swap out the bars, stem, bar tape, saddle, wheels and pedals as well. So paying for the factory installed ones is just a waste.

The price for the Cadex 42 wheels was only for the front wheel, which cost 1099.

It’s pretty much always been that way. I’ve always bought a frame and build over winter gradually waiting for the sales on components. Built an sworks aethos last winter and saved many thousands over the off the peg full bike. Got the frame from Spanish spesh dealer and saved £500 alone.

The Advanced and Advanced pro have the exact same frame, the pro just comes with carbon wheels and di2 options. In previous generations I think the only difference between the frames was that the pro had a full carbon fork whereas the non pro fork had an alloy steerer, but now they are identical. Do you have any data to back up your claim that the Advanced (and Advanced Pro as they are the same frame) is "heavy" and "flexy"? Or are you just reading the marketing and inferring that the lower grade frame must be significantly worse than the top spec SL frame? Do you have any suggestions (based on data, not marketing) for frames/full bikes in a similar price range that have better frames than the TCR?

I built my tcr sl with dura ace for 6k don’t know why anyone would buy a complete bike you just get robbed

Recomended Retail Pricing is insane, over the last 15 years: Dura ace has gone up 600% 500 to 3000 Frames have gone up 300% £1000 to £3000 Handlebars have gone up 1000% from £80 to £800 Hunt around, find the bargains, build it yourself.

The cadex wheels cost 1000dolkar per wheel Not for a Set. And it is clearly a better wheelset compare top the srl1. Please make your Homework before judging.

The Giant SLR Pro 1 does come with a power meter. Explains part of the price difference between Ultegra vs 105 models. Giant branded and GP Lama tested it and thinks it’s a good power meter.

Second hand rim brake frame, cobbled together old lightweight kit- UCI limit achievable on a budget, just like it always was... no need to pay thousands to hinder performance with a 8-9kg build.

In my experience, whether or not custom building provides a better value comes down to what frames are being considered and who's going to do the labor of assembly. If you're very particular about wanting a best in class frame, whether we're talking about the top 10% of carbon, Steel, or titanium frames, then there's no getting around paying a premium for it. Ebay sellers will charge a premium just like the brands do. And if you're going to have your LBS build the bike, tack on an extra $300 (in Seattle). Wheels are a commodity now, and there's very little reason in my view to pay more than $1,500 fully built and shipped. If you truly need a better wheel than that, then you should probably be getting them for free. Put another way, if you're not getting them for free, then you probably don't really need a wheelset better than $1500 will get you. I built my Ti bike because I wanted something unique. I paid wholesale or Craigslist prices for almost every component, and it came out to just over $4k. I can buy a comparable bike from Lynskey for less right now, but only because I'm not demanding the BEST Ti frame. If I wanted only a Moots, Seven, or Davidson, I'd be at $6-7K for my build. So, if you want a top quality and highly sought after frame, there is no cheap path because the brand will crush you on the bundle or the individual frame price, and the secondary market won't be much cheaper for the frame, and you'll have to pay for install. If you can install yourself and find a deal, then sure, there are savings to be had, but that situation doesn't present itself to most riders.

I did the same with my 795 blade RS. The only SRAM option was 13k, With Red and Corima MCC wheels. I got it down to half the price with a SRAM force groupset, using my own Corima WS black wheels. The only pre-built bike that was sensible was an ultegra di2 build but then you get a bland black frame. I'm not going at a funeral when I ride my bike, so I went the custom build route and I think it was the best choice. I would probably go down the same route if I got a new gravel bike

If you wait for January half of these over-priced pre builts go on sale for a far more reasonable price. I got a Trek Emonda SL5 for £2100, "landfill" wheels got upgraded. And then I swapped the saddle, tyres and power meter around with my Allez. I've now got a decent Emonda and a turbo trainer bike. Not a chance I'd be paying full price though.

GIANT is a Taiwan brand made in Taiwan, GIANT also makes Specialized. There all Asian made frames, so I don’t see why the high prices are so high for these frames, it’s the name you’re paying for, frankly I think it’s a rip off, so I’m looking at other options in Asia.

Realised this years ago. Always deals on groupsets. And then pick your own wheels. Job done.

There's a flip side to this. Ive been looking at getting an alloy endurance frameset for my wife. Having spent ages scouring different brands it's become apparent that the best option is to buy the cheapest Trek Domane AL full bike, rip off the Claris gruppo and wheels and stick some half decent wheels (which I already have) and a 105 groupset. In the sale I can get the whole bike for around £700. A 105-spec Domane AL then for around £1200. Thats what I would have expected to pay pre-C19.

Definitely, second-hand is the way to go - loads of decent kit out there for less than £1,000. Upgrading what you have with second=hand kit is great fun and teaches you about the workings of bikes, which adds to your enjoyment of the hobby. When i can buy a brand new Royal Enfield 650 Interceptor motorcycle for just over £6,000 it makes you realise how much profit these bike companies are levering out of the punters- disgusting.

We all know the prices these days are a HUGE RIP OFF!!!! What do they think these brands? That money grows on tree and everyone IS SUPER RICH? and lets face it, Giant is'nt exactly an exotic looking bike. Their colours are boring, the bikes all look the same. A bit like BMW AUDI MERC and every other car brand. Platforms they call them. I call em Crap!

Why not jump to Merida Scultura Limited with Ultegra with decent extra wheels will cost you under 3k

absolutely bang on. get a frameset, buy decent wheels and finishing kit and get someone to put it together. save money and get what you want!!!

I thought this was well known among bike builders and lbs. I was baffled about the crap wheels entry level bikes have. I tried to stop my friends wasting money on a full bike, but they say they tried it and felt amazing. It's useless to convince someone that has no knowledge abour bike parts because they think its a whole package and they want it to pay once and be done with it.

Spot on, It’s what I have always done. For me its part of the enjoyment of the hobby finding a frame, planning the build, working out which components you can reuse, what new bits you need, new tools etc. If your happy enough not to have the latest and greatest, there are some good bargains to be had out there.

I think 1100 was for the front wheel only. Plus it comes with shimano powermeter. So it kind of adds up if you where to buy everything at full retail.

New cyclist aren't starting road cycling. They used to go into a bike shop, expecting a reasonable price for a nice looking bike and get too confused and blown away by the prices. They won't buy second hand as they don't know what is value. As such it's stalled the second hand market. The bike industry got greedy and the new generation isn't coming through. Too much cycling BS marketing driving the industry into products that are rubbish with no future. It's going to be a shit few years for the bike industry.

What I did was buy an older bike and piece by piece upgraded a few of the components. The only thing left from the original owner now is the frame, seat post and saddle all of which I like. Saved me a fortune compared to what a new similar specced bike would’ve cost.

If you could maybe elaborate why you you think the tcr advanced is a mediocre frame that would be super appreciated My guess is that you're confusing mediocre looks with mediocre performance .

The only brand I've seen which has a decent off the shelf experience, in terms of value, is polygon, just a shame they come with garbage wheels. They are Indonesian, and as far as i am aware make their own frames. The group-set is identical, so can't possibly make a difference, but I've no idea of build quality inside (I'm not gonna cut open any of the frames I have as I'm using them). Whether or not the value proposition is there for other brands is up in the air, the more I cycle the more I realise that Home Mechanic is the way to go, in deference to buying "known" or "reputable" brands. They are just a ripoff, especially at the higher end. To me the two choices are, cheap not well known value brand, China direct frame and reputable groupset made yourself, and then known brand frame with high quality groupset made yourself. The value proposition at the high end just isn't there.

There’s a lot of misinformation in this video unfortunately- 1. The TCR advanced and the advanced pro actually come with the exact same frame. Only difference is in the fork where the former comes with a normal sized steerer and the latter comes with an oversized OD2 steerer. So in essence, the base advanced version is actually a banger of a deal. 2. The price of cadex wheel that you quoted was just for the front! The entire wheelset will set you back close to £2,500 3. Giant also equip the SL bikes with full carbon components i.e., SLR saddle, bar/stem and a 9200 Shimano power meter.

Interesting you have Giant website up. Last year I bought a tcr sl frame for $2,900 new. Pieced together Dura ace components, Farsport wheels. Basically have a pro caliber bike for half the price.

Cycling has become a lifestyle sport, lots of people with money who equate higher cost with more performance and more desirable. Custom building is something they wouldn’t consider, too much hassle. Building and maintaining my own bikes is integral to my love of cycling.

Best way to buy off the peg is last year's model at a fat discount. That's a bit disrupted at the moment but am expecting some great deals next year. This year's latest and greatest is next year's bargain bin option....

Two months ago i built tcr sl advanced 2019, with 2x12 ultegra, carbon wheels, all new components for under 5k euro. Silly giant prices all the way.

I did the same thing recently, and I think I'm going to keep doing it this way. If you are price conscious it gives you so much flexibility to find deals, and you can upgrade as you go. I ended up replacing an old and heavily dented CAAD 9 with a Fuji Roubaix Elite frame which was basically on a bankruptcy sale, and picked out the crankset, handlebars, and wheels that I wanted, and finally just now am swapping the old mix of Chorus/Record 10 to Chorus 12 (which seems to be super cheap at the moment). I don't think I could have justified spending $2k+ all at once on a new bike. If you like picking out your own parts, and have a local bike shop you like, I think it is a no brainer. The only "downside" I would say is you have a lot of choices that maybe don't make a big difference so you can spend too much time thinking about things.

Lol I got access to a sale from a major bike brand, a $11000 CDN bike on sale for $5500 CDN.. di2 durace, hi mod frame... the di2 groupset is $3000+ CDN retail

I just built a top of the range bianchi oltre xr4 rim brake (already had 2 sets of wheels) for around 6k all in including 1 set of wheels. For me, aside from low-mid range, never EVER buy built bikes.

I only agree partly with you there is some truth to buying a better bike to get better upgrades rather than starting with bottom tier and then upgrading yourself but only on a case by case basis. The trend I currently dislike the most is inflation of the frame cost, your seeing way too many bike at the lowest specc which are only ~ $500 or even less than the frame itself. I know they are not losing money on even the low specc bikes even if the margin is slim so they are deliberately inflating frame price to discourage just buying a frame and performing a dream build forcing you to pay up front more.

I can't see why at that level you would buy off the peg, anything after entry level it only makes sense to custom build, yes its less convenient but you don't get all the garbage you'll want to replace anyway, and if you shop around you can get a better build at a lot better value. I guarantee I could build at least a comparable spec bike, probably better at a much lower price point.

Those cadex wheels are like $4000 can $ lol

The Cadex aren't £1100 thats per wheel not for a set !

Can I add that rim isn't dead? I got a new Canyon ultimate cf sl 8 for $2400 cause my '06 lemond cracked. Already had some mercury S5 wheels and I instantly doubled my inventory on groupset (R8000 Ultegra) since that comes stock on the canyon and I previously had this on my Lemond. The Canyon Ultimate Rim is the absolute lightest road bike for the money.

When building the bike yourself, you should take into account the hours spent in research, sourcing parts, building it up, investment into tools and a workplace. It‘s a hobby for the most of us, but it still comes with the complete bike … buying the raw materials of any assembled product is probably cheaper, you should do this calculation for a pair of jeans 😅

OR get a second hand F8 frameset for 1k, used r8000 for 350 and then get some wheels.

Ridiculous the prices. I have ordered a Rose Pro SL 105 Rimbrake. Costs just 1099 euros in the sale.

Always bought by bikes from the frame up, mainly new stuff, some carried over, its part of the enjoyment. Custom handbuilt wheels are also the way to go, specced to how you want rather than the factory telling you what you want.

Insane prices, I've seen the highest spec TCR SL disc in durace on sale here in the Philippines from online sellers, going for 315,900 php basically 4,500 pounds in direct conversion. Insane to see how much they mark these prices up.

You make some good points, but the TCR Advanced frame is the same as the Advanced Pro. They both use the Advanced-Grade Composite; the SL uses Advanced SL-Grade Composite, which is stiffer. Some say too-stiff. The only difference between the Advanced and Advanced Pro is oversized steerer on the pro, which actually makes the ‘lower tier’ Advanced frameset a great buy with the adaptable 11/8 carbon steerer. I’ve seen no record of anyone saying the non-SL TCRs are noodly. All reports have been that they perform very well in terms of stiffness.

The residual is the dentist tax. Aint no dentist got time for a custom build.

I've assembled my last two bikes from framesets up. The two main advantages for me are 1. Being able to tweak components to adjust fit characteristics such as bar width and stem length and 2. Specifying componentry such as crank length and chainset size

You're right on this. I started year ago and it had to be 1st (and only one) bike upgrade project. Result was 2nd bike built from pieces May this year. Full Ultegra mechanical, carbon frame and carbon wheels. 7.3 kilos of joy, "combat ready". :D

It's a bit like cars. Cheap cars don't make much money as you have to build down to minimal profit. However, go up the scale and people are willing to pay a premium if they think they're getting a premium product, which is what covers the manufacturer's r&d, marketing etc.

I can absolutely second the conclusion. I spend only 2/3 of the price through building my bike up from a frameset.

Upgraded a new Specialized with S-works frame during covid that had fairly low grade components to higher than best-in-class S-works off-the-shelf standard (except Ultegra Di2 12 speed vs the "old" DuraAce Di2 which I still consider a step up) and saved almost 2.5K USD - before selling the left over components. However, was hell and took months to source the correct parts. Also, would not recommend to anyone who does not know cycle components very well. Lots of pitfalls. I almost stumbled with the wheel set but found an excellent solution.

cadex wheel 900£ is only for front wheel , rear cost 1200£

I noticed a growing disconnect between prices of complete bikes and the bike you’d have by shopping around a bit and buying a frame and components separately, at least here in Canada, ànd particularly at the higher end. Manufacturers seemed to take advantage of the post Covid inflation conditions. Many of the developing trends in the industry seem counter to the idea of growing revenues by getting more bums in saddles versus maximizing profits from an already existing pool of riders.

I’ve built my last two bikes by buying the parts as they go on offer. It takes times, but you get a better quality bike and one which is unique. :)

Yea you do the math and these top level completes just don't add up. Its almost like the brands just decided they wanted a 10k-13k price on their bikes just to do it lol

You confirmed all my suspicions. Unless a prebuilt bike is heavily discounted say at an end of year sale you’re better off building the bike from components. Cheers.

Conclusion: custome building, come to me for business LOL, what a load of bollocks. Your price quotes are wrong, you aint comparing like for like: new vs loads of 2nd hands, no one pays full RRP plus cycle to work scheme.

Custom build also gets you the right finishing kit without extra cost - right stem, bars, saddle, crank length. Andbas daft as it sounds - the right colour of parts! I had an all black frame, fitted white bar tape and a white saddle. Looked excellent. The stock bike had black tape and saddle, just looked a bit dull.

TCR Advanced Pro "A fairly mediocre frame?"

I built my road bike this year with 105 group set, Winspace frame, Superteam wheelset, inexpensive bars and saddle. All in at about $2,500 and as good a racing road bike as I’ve ever ridden. Custom building a bike is more fun as well, at least for me.

Cadex Wheels priced each not as a pair! Different hubs, Carbon spokes, much lighter! Night and day between them and the SLR1

Don’t agree with the advice on the Giant frame levels. The Advanced and the Advanced pro are the same frame, only the fork is a different grade of carbon with larger diameter steerer. The Advanced is very capable to race on, great frame set.

Figured this out for myself this year when I went to get a new road bike, with a budget of around 20,000 Chinese Yuan (around 2100 pounds). Didn't really like the specs on any of the pre-built bikes that were available here in China so I decided to build up a bike for myself. Ended up getting a custom Ti frame from Waltly (including Ti seatpost and stem and a carbon fork), Ultegra R8000 mechanical shifters and derailleurs, hand built 50mm deep carbon wheels with DT Swiss 350 hubs, PRO aluminum aero handlebar, cable actuated hydraulic brakes, and a spider power meter for the same basic budget, and since I'm somewhat mechanically competent I was able to build the bike up myself. Weight is around 9kg and it's a beautiful, quick, and comfortable bike that I really love. It also has the ability to be upgraded to Di2 and hydraulic brakes later in the future which I will probably do in a year or two.

Essentially buying everything I want on a bike that's already built and is available for sale. Otherwise, prices start to jump... jump... Jump. Then again, you may want another brand that offers second hand warranty on manufacturing defects.

Here in south Korea Giant don’t even offer the option of a frame-set only. You get what you’re given by them and that’s it. Giant aren’t as good value as they once were! I bought a Revolt recently and I sometimes stare at it and think, what did I pay 4k for. A carbon frame and Sram Rival explr. Everything else is worthless on it.

I am starting to see inventory stacking up in bike shops here in the Washington DC area. Expect to see promotional pricing shortly. Also, a bike build up process gives you the decision power to pick where you want to spend the big money, versus value engineering. Example, someone may choose to go 105 on the groupset and pour the money into good wheels. This is more likely to help win races than to buy a Dura Ace group and cheap wheels...

well...When im gonna buy a new bike im gonna get Ican Triaero 105 for the price of Giants frame..

If you're patient and willing to look at other brands then pre-built bikes can be much more competitive (also true of desktop PCs incidentally). Lynskey's been selling a Ti bike with Rival 2x12 for $2950, and over the winter sweetened the deal further by tossing in their Ti stem and seatpost. Now, in fairness, that build comes with an unimpressive wheelset, and the frameset was going for ~1000 a few months ago; at which point a self built mechanical version might save you a few hundred. Your points about both aluminum and going used are spot on. I picked up a 2014 trek madone AL with (mostly) ultegra for $500, and it's been great to me.

How big is the youth/junior race bike market?

I always buy a frame and then build it up myself. Albeit my bikes are more steel and all road/gravel and retro (1960’s). If your looking for value and have the time and experience to build from scratch then you get what you want and not what the manufacturers want you to buy. It seems that particularly at the top end the price vs value doesn’t seem to stack up in the face of it.

Whilst I agree it’s best to build at the current time. However a tcr and a tcr pro being mediocre frames? They CONSTANTLY get best bike of the year and best value race bike of the year. And as for the difference in them both- the fork. That’s it the fork. One uses bigger bearings than the other so the frame is the same and I can guarantee it’s not flexy in any way

Would you realy rate the TCR frame low average? I mean it rides very well compared to other medium priced frames in my eyes.

My strategy was to search Trek dealers nationwide (USA) for the top spec Fuel MTB that was on the showroom floor but two years old and offer 30% under retail. Just did the same thing two weeks ago for a showroom 2022 Giant Revolt Advanced Pro 1 gravel bike. I think its about timing and finding a dealer that wants to move a bike that's been sitting there a couple years. Lots of phone calls.

Custom building always been the way to go in my view,. Much better bang for your buck

All my CX bikes are custom built. Best way to save money if your willing to work on getting desired parts for the bike right way. Plus you know how it is built up which makes easier how to do basic maintenance later. Plus a sense of pride that you built your bike up and more willing to take care of it.

For god sakes you just gave away the secret sauce, now the manufactures are going to jack the frame prices up😂 good one. I just bout a 2015 time izon, what a great bike that is and so much fun building it.

I’m 82 yo and have built up 2 doz bikes over the years. I have a non average body and have found that I need a custom built frame - steel or ti. Though my preference is steel. I mix and match Ultegra w Dura Ace. I close my eyes and don’t look at the $$$. I just want the bike to “work”. Which means 24x40 w 11x36. Sounds nuts. Right? I love climbing and go to the East Sierras in Calif to have some fun. But I challenge you to tell me the 40 - 11 is too low. But that’s my cruising combo that you could never get off the shelf. White Industries to the rescue - crank, rings, hubs.

Hmmm, I wish one could actually get decent framesets or more noticably groupsets, here in South Africa. It becomes even more problematic when you start wanting specific crank lengths and gearing combos - basiclly impossible to find the 170mm 52/36 105 cranks I'd like without ordering especially from Shimano through a dealer - ie: any hope of a bargain out the window. Most people on a budget here end up building with second hand gear (mostly quite dated). Maybe I'm just not connected enough??

I've built up a few bikes, I always find it cheaper. I built a Van Rysel rim brake bike with force 1x11 sub 7kg for less than £1500, all new but sale parts. My most recent build is a Mondraker Chrono xc bike with Rockshox raceday ultimate and xt groupset for about £3.5k. a lot less than what it would have cost to buy as a pre built. I've just picked up a force axs disc geoupset for £700(not including cassette or chainset) ready to upgrade another bike I have.

Reminiscent of the computer market many years ago when it was cheaper to buy quality branded parts and assemble them yourself as it was so much cheaper, the PC manufacturers did eventually wise up and substantually drop their prices, but no sign of that as yet for pre-built bike prices?

There's some bigger anomalies than that out there. This is why folk are buying made up bike and wheel brands with spurious marketing about being UK brands etc... they seem good value.

just recently built a tcr sl rim brake version with bargain sram force groupset and winspace wheels, giant pre built wheels are obvious rip-offs, and the frame for the new color has increased price, unbelievable, but lucky me i got another bargain on a second hand sl frame for much less money, i am really happy about this build

I think most items in the bike industry are a rip off now. A bicycle should never cost anywhere near a decent car. Unfortunately, you see it with everything; clothing, cleaning products, accessories.

I was in a Giant shop at the weekend...Propel with Sram electronic groupset and SL1 wheels for 4600.....what is going on with their website.....?! 😂

The cadex wheel price is only for the front wheel.. no rear, and the dura ace crank that comes with it is shimano is fc-9200p power meter crank 😅

The cadex wheel for 1100 is front only 🤦‍♂️

The groupset prices are starting to fall while full bikes discounts lag, making builds viable. Be I threshing to see if the full bike prices continue to drop while components level, rebalancing this market, and the choice build / buy.

Awesome breakdown. Surely the manufacturers are taking the piss? I believe that Specialised is even worse (Although it must be said that their framesets are just a touch more expensive.) :)

Literally all true. I'm waiting on the next release of specialized allez sprint framesets to do just that! 👌

If we're me I buy a new aluminum rim brake frameset and some killer aluminum wheels. I'd also try to build it myself first. This combination would be just as light as the carbon fiber disc brake bikes. Unless the type of racing he does doesn't allow rim brakes? I would still go aluminum frame and wheels The frame as would need to have a treaded BB 😊

Be interesting to know how many fully built high end bikes Giant sell......... I thought most of us hunt for bargains 🤔

What about the Cannondale supersix Evo off sigma sports for £2199…?

Buying a full bike just saves time. ISP frames should be avoided if you plan to sell later on. Just my 2¢ worth.

Yes, Sir!! Custom, ( find your own parts ) is the way to go. I currently desire a top end Colnago. But I sure as hell WILL not spend $17,000. Simple math makes it a no Brainer. Gather your parts at "real world" prices. Catalog and Manufacturer prices have huge profit margins written in. There are plenty of " middle men ", that will sacrifice some profit to make a sale. I hope many people see this video. Helping the average Joe and his family is Golden.

The downside to building up your own bike is that insurance companies often refuse to insure those bikes. Even if you buy a fully assembled bike and change some parts there are often hard restrictions before it becomes "custom built". Of course it doesn't really matter if you always keep your bike in a safe place and don't use it for commuting. Thanks for the vid!

The advanced frame on the 105 bike is the same frame as the TCR pro frame set. The fork is the difference. Rethink your value!

If you buy off the peg you deserve to get ripped off .

I would never buy a pre-built bike. Get a nice frame pick your group, get some nice wheels and you save a lot of dough and get what you want,

I spent thousands on a giant when I started cycling, great bike and I’ll never out perform it unless I smash it up in a crash I won’t need to replace it but if I knew then what I know now I wouldn’t of bought it. I would bought a second hand older madone or 5000 series save a couple thousand and a few kg.