I really love that Tod is showing this side of himself the past year or so. I remember his oldest videos being very informative but rather dry; now he's all bubbly about his inventions and testing them. This opening had me shouting in awe of arrows skipping on water and laughing at the tragedy of rubber ducklings.
I can already hear the gears in jorgs mind turning... be quite and you will here them to "he .. he ..he .. let me show it's features " See they are there alright.. "He .. he .. he "
I love that there are some details that you totally don't understand and you celebrate that fact. The beginning of knowledge is "I don't know", so it's really fun to watch someone enjoy learning something and knowing how much they don't know about it.
Thank you, I appreciate that and there is so much I don't know but as a YT 'celebrity' people assume you do know things, often everything, but of course I don't, I am just lucky enough that I can use this platform to explore and learn first hand.
@@tods_workshop maybe you've done this already (I'm still exploring this channel) but it would be cool to see you experiment with different indigenous hunting weapons to see how effective they are! 💚
I think the centre of gravity of the arrow is changing as the get wet. SO dip the ends, part or whole arrow in wax / duck fat (not Muscovy duck - Cornish) other oil waxes or fats are available.
An oil or wax coating on the head would also help preserve an essential fluid flow character of that edge. Water flows along the face, comes to a corner, and can't follow around the corner.
I can well believe it is primarily (or only) COM changing, but I had two other ponderings - how much of the changes would be the fletchings getting wet and more beat up changing the aerodynamic efficiencies - the ones that failed looked rather shabby and if the tail doesn't want resist the tipping forces applied on hitting the water enough it will dive straight in, - how much is just the change in mass - While the COM will shift a little forward, the whole arrow will also get heavier along its whole length, which means its going to need more bounce to lift it regardless of the the centre of mass. The shallower shot works well I believe because it improves the force vector at impact reducing the amount of downward force and the angle of attack of the leading bulge is at a better angle into the water, which is also why the one that never worked never worked - you need to create a lifting force out of the tip and that one was way to hydrodynamic, so its always going to plough straight in not act like a hydrofoil.
Clearly you are referring to the dream where a giant rubber ducky is threatening to peck you to bits...and Tod is a member of a secret society that is at war with said rubber duckies...
When you shoot a duck, it breaks into several smaller ducks. It's like Asteroids. Just some thoughts... What about using cork for the shaped collar? Also: what about if the collars were sort of bell-shaped? - with a little skirt to deflect water almost perpendicular to the axis of the arrow itself - action/reaction should result in an upward force on the arrow (although the drag might be too great this way)
Thanks for that and some great ideas to test next winter as my flood has nearly gone. But to be honest the way I look at this is many, many generations of many, many hunters shot thousands of shots and tried so many iterations that me messing for a couple of hours is not likely to improve things. A phd student though.....
@@tods_workshop Yeah, it's easy to forget that the only thing 'primitive' about the people who developed all this technology was really just the range of materials to work with. The hands, the brains, the senses of curiosity and innovation were the same as our own (maybe sometimes better in the face of material challenges and necessity)
@@tods_workshop I would like to throw in my few cents and point out that the rubber ducks you used were really small. Members of anseriformes family which include most targeted birds in northern Eurasia are significantly larger. The average height your arrows bounced would have not necessarily affected the shot.
This looks like a great Fairground game. I guess that the smaller your game is, the bigger the arrow:meal ratio is. Shoot a dear, and you've got food for a week. Shoot a duck, and you've got food for a day. The ability to recover arrows should offset that ammunition cost.
Plus when you hit a deer you need to get in deep to actually kill it. Small game many times dies from a heart attack even if you didn't gravely wounded it (and it's much easier to do so anyway). So you can sacrifice the overall pressure of the arrowhead in order to save them.
@@HomoErectusIsAFunnyName all of that, plus ducks generally live closer to home. Deer need big expanses of forest, so there is always going to be an element of travel for most people, while the majority of people historically lived right next to a source of fresh water.
I think another bonus is that once the arrow hits the water it will startle the birds. This means they will be lifting off as the areow iss back in the air, again further increasing the chance of a hit?
Maybe impregnating the bounce bulbs with wax helps to prevent soaking of the heads? Could also make for a better bounce, since the interface between arrow and water is now hydrophobic. Edit: changed philic to phobic
@@andrewgodly5739 people did not have freezers or fridges so they only shot one duck a day and it would be every day for the old day ducks. Modern ducks are mostly only scared during flight in hunting season.
Thats what the original boomerang was for (not the ones that come back, but ones that fly flat and straight). The birds would hear it, and take off, straight into its path.
@@tods_workshop Hi Tod, I am finding YT vids constantly 'freezing' when I watch them, but only on certain channels, i.e. all the 'Community of the Sword' , gun channels and others. I don't know why but I suspect the purge of political channels is overspilling onto all the other areas that YT is known to dislike - History, weapons etc. Maybe it is time to start posting to other platforms such as Rumble, Bitchute etc.? I for one would rather view all you guys on a platform that does not have an overt political agenda. P.S. I suspect that people who do not follow more conservative news channels may not be experiencing this problem but it is very real - this vid took nearly 1/2 an hour to play rather decreasing its effect. I have this problem on your channel, Lindybeige,Scholagladiatoria,English Martial Arts, Skallagrim, Thegn Thrand, Shadiversity, Metatron etc.
@@andytopley314 they hinder your favourite channels and your activity to get you to update. It’s a scam and they disrupt your actions increasingly until you update and receive their latest brain washing , time wasting , subliminal messages. They want to control you and they hold back what they think you want and they know from your user history. Don’t let the evil control
I used to shoot a sling shot at swimming ducks when I was a kid and ( hard to believe) but if you aimed at the ducks head you could never hit one. The ducks would sit still and just move their head out of the way of the passing stone. The ducks were so fast at reacting you just could not hit one from over 15yards unless you shot for the ducks ass end and you might hit one. Like you said it would guarantee a hit but really it just greatly increases your chances. Maybe it was just because the ducks I shot at were from the golf course and were battle hardened :)
Brilliant figuring out the purpose of the reverse-curved arrowheads. I'd be interested to see more tests with a variety of knob-shapes to see which ones bounce best. If anyone out there has access to some fluid-dynamics simulation software to explain the details of the mechanics, that would be really interesting as well.
This is what I love about channels like this one - 5 minutes in and I'm already fascinated about things that I didn't know existed just this 5 minutes ago! On completely unrelated note, I saw the new messer on Tod Cutler and I really think that at some point when you (somehow) have everything in stock, you should make a video showcasing these items - just so one can see them somewhat in 3 dimensions - puts them to scale much better than photos :)
3 года назад
This video will be amazing for my fantasy adventure novella. I was curious about those arrows for so long and you mister just shared this perfect video. Thank you so much!
If you want the other bouncing/water-skipping duck hunting arrow videos, here: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-Owy6sAPusoc.html - Siberian/Uralic version ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-3EtQnJvelw0.html - Native American version
3 года назад
Zemplin Castellan I appreciate your help. Thanks ^^
Tod, when i saw the forked (and also crescent) arrowhead I thought it was made that way, because when it struck a narrow target such as a duck's neck a glancing blow would center it delivering all the energy to the target, instead of a making a small gash. It wouldn't matter for larger targets, but when a target is about as narrow as an arrow it could make significant difference. You could test in your back yard by shooting at say a vertical garden hose with a small stick in the center.
If someone would have asked me if i tyhought this was practical feasible.. I would have sad: nah! years ago someone suggested to me that those crescent arrow heads function is to styop an arrow from going too far- getting lost, I thought nah, too complicated and it wont do enough damage. Sigh ^^ Love this!
Cresent arrow heads where used to cut wings and tendons, and blunt arrow heads has been used to hunt birds and small game so there is realy no need for these bouncing arrows. Remember when the english tried that bouncing dam busting bomb??
Lmao the beginning gave me a smile. You can practically see the grin on his face as soon as he begins talking, too. Glad he enjoyed himself so much! Fun watching for us as well. :D
The arrows bounce very similar to skipping stones: The angle of incidence at the front directs the water down and the front of the arrow up. The force is likely related to the angle of incidence towards the water line and the speed of the arrow. Shooting at a steeper angle has two negative effects: The downwards momentum is greater and the angle of incidence is lower. When you shot the soaked arrows the downwards momentum was again greater (because of the greater mass) and the arrow was slower because of the extra mass. The angle of incidence against the water line was likely also lower as the arc of a slower arrow is shorter and therefore steeper. The angle of the front wood peace can likely be lowered with a faster arrow, or could be increased to allow for heavier arrows. It would be interesting to see what happens if you just used a cone and cut of the other half of the wood piece.
weigh them when new/dry, go play for a while, when they start screwing up, weight them again.. keep playing and when it goes all wrong, weght them again ... and maybe you could fasion some metal tips to suit these particular arrows.
Billy Berger @ Primitive Pathways made a video about skipping arrows a couple of years ago. If I'm not mistaken; he mentioned that native Americans used them. Chris Boyton. He worked with Ray Meares in the "Aboriginal Britain" bushcraft episode. Really nice bloke 👍🏻.
I also think that on those few times where the arrow strikes the water right in front of the ducks & then bounced over them, it would hit them if they were real ducks. The arrow striking in front of them might startle them & some will attempt to fly away, so once the arrow bounces it could hit one of the ducks that is trying to get airborne.
Not relevant to the main topic of the video, but the introduction had me nostalgic because I performed in a group doing Barber's Adagio for Strings twenty years ago. I still think it's the saddest piece of music ever written.
Your video, brilliant, too! I think the arrows going over the ducks have a high likelihood of success because many ducks ‘jump’ upwards when spooked and so put themselves in the path of the higher arrow.
I'm just waiting for an April 1st video where everyone swaps introductions. "Hi, it's Joerg from the Slingshot Channel and Joerg Sprave here." "Greetings, I am Tod." "Hello and welcome to the Shadiversity channel."
A huge thing I took out of this is that the arrows bounced slightly up perfectly to hit the size of a regular duck and not really any higher, it is an amazing thing to see such a simple design when it really comes down to it put out a purely genius performance.
When i saw the title and thumbnail i was about to comment: "hey, you might want to check out Ugri Archer, he's donne a video or to on that topic and i think, you cold like his stuff."... just goes to show, that i am really at the right channel and comminuty here =D. As for the dipping wet arrows: i could imagine, that the wet, deformed feather-flights don't provide enough stabilisation for the heavier head. Would you think wooden flight might work more reliable here?
a great suggestion, a layman here though so not sure how it would work out.. Though in all due honesty i think it would work well with a crossbow .. you would only get one shot realistically so i wonder how these would work with one
@@Sallafar but would the enlarged and heavier heads work with a crossbow? i would presume so, as a hunting bow/crossbow is lighter than a war bow... And it would be used in hunting fowl or small game as hunting large game would be (probably) illegal during the timeframes as depicted?
I said Barnes Wallace style bouncing arrows on your last "flooded range" video's comments and they actually work! I said ""Think of our hero in a film pulling off a bouncing arrow shot to save the day!". I never thought of what profile of tip thought. Looks like someone has beaten me to it! What a stunning bit of physics!
Certainly up there with the best youtube videos I've seen ... your enthusiasm is so infectious that I've already picked out a couple of nice bits of timber to turn ... oddly I first heard of these arrows from an old poacher who used them on the Norfolk broads just after the war. Shot them from an army surplus canvas kayak so he could retrieve his arrows... he also told me how to launch marbles from a cupped-headed arrow, tied to the bow string, these were used to knock roosting pheasants and pigeons silently from the tops of hedges ... something else to make 🙂
I tried this at the local lake. I am now in prison for poaching. Doesn't really matter, just a different prison from eternal quarantine. Don't have to worry anymore about bills and my boss and my existential pain. My soul is free now. Thank you Tod
Samuel Barber's Adagio for Strings... nice touch. - When I first saw forked arrow heads, I let myself be convinced they were for rope cutting in naval battles. I am so glad to be better educated now.
My theory: when the wood is soaked, the water on the wood surface will merge with the water surface of the pond and the water surface tension is reduced and the bounce is harder. How about coated the arrow with wax or oil?
I remember reading about those arrows on the first volume of "The Bowmaker's Bible" back in 2015, it explains how to make them by wrapping a ball of sinew around the shaft and covering in pitch.
I know why the arrows kept going over their heads. They are called "Ducks" for a reason, the species have had millennia of experience at avoiding being shot!
Thats why the scottish minister invented the primer ignition system for his black powder shotgun... The flash of the flintlock gave the birds time to dodge hence the name...Ducks...obvious, innit?
That is one movie "Adagio for Strings" is not in. Though John Williams is often inspired by other composers. So I wouldnt say there is nothing that sounds like it in that movie. "Adagio for Strings" is in a lot of movies and some tv-shows. Some of them set in WW2.
@@WakarimasenKa yeah good track for war movies - the instant thought upon hearing the tune was platoon. But the black n white and yellow ducks made me think of the red dress girl, which was much more poignant!
@@75keg75 Oh, of course. I see that now. I must me more atuned to the auditory than the visual. Or it has just been much longer since I saw Schindler's List, than it has been since I heard the music :P
My guess about bouncing or not bouncing while wet is that it has something to do with water's surface tension. Dry arrow do not break it that easily as wet, which just slides in. Anyway that looks like a lot of fun. Gonna make myself some of these. 😀
@@tods_workshop Absolutely, I just want some comfy medieval crafting videos in these shitty times. Although I still don't understand what the OP meant.
😆 Your intro!! This, this is what make you a super star!!! You weren’t kidding, really interesting arrow!! Duck and waterfowl meat is very greasy. We might consider that a defect but for subsistence hunters it’s a glorious grand prize. The calories were critical and the scum floating on the stew pot was practically the equivalent of cash.
The Tod Todeschini lends further credit to the multiple Tod theory. Also what a beautiful demonstration of the bouncing bomb, lovely work there. Your flooded field has been wonderful for content.
Reminds me of how old style artillerists in the era of round shot were trained to go for "grazing shots" -- shots fired at a shallow angle that hit the ground in front of the enemy troops, than bounced through the ranks. You'd cause a lot more casualties that way than if your shot came in at a higher angle and just buried itself in the ground.
I was just reading 'Traditional Manchu archery of the Quing Imperial Guard'. Fascinated to discover, among the long list of descriptions of various arrow types--a duck hunting arrow much like this!
Until you see its a duckling it looks like the heads coming off with the impact. Other info we get from this video is apparently somewhere there's a shop selling rubber ducks as essential items during lockdown.
