Breaking Bitcoin with Casey Rodarmor

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Casey Rodarmor is a bitcoin developer and the creator of the ordinals, inscriptions, and runes protocols. In this interview, we discuss ordinal theory & inscriptions, the purpose of runes and why these projects have received so much backlash.
“Especially as Bitcoin gets more popular, people are going to do things with Bitcoin that you don’t like…that is the nature of money.”
- Casey Rodarmor
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TIMESTAMPS:
00:00:00 Introduction
00:10:23 Ordinal theory
00:23:47 Breaking ordinals?
00:35:56 Ord hate; fee future; runes
00:52:53 Gambling tokens vs equity
01:01:26 Ethics & mining centralisation
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#Bitcoin #Finance #Money #Crypto #Economics

Опубликовано:

26 июн 2024

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Комментарии : 132

@FirstTimer23 10 дней назад

I'm 25 minutes in and I don't think I've yet heard why a bitcoiner would want this. Did I miss it?

@BITC0IN 10 дней назад

It's a scam, bitcoiners don't want this. shitcoiners do.

@datgoy5509 10 дней назад

Nope, it is complete shitcoin garbage. Just another bitcoin affinity scammer / enabler. Seems he has deluded himself to the point he can't even tell that is what he is.

@Cronus6 10 дней назад

Because nobody wants it and Casey can't explain why anyone would.

@walkabout8201 10 дней назад

Have fun staying solvent

@_-Wade-_ 10 дней назад

Bitcoin doesn't need him...

@TM-456ii 9 дней назад

To Mechanics point, isn't the problem with Runes and other non-monetary uses that it creates blockchain bloat and thus makes it harder for the average user to run a node? Do we want to force nodes to store a lot of extra data, making it more costly and perhaps pricing out the smaller pleb node runner?

@vinchino 9 дней назад

The great thing about segwit and taproot is that you can Prune all of them without affecting the actual function and decentralised network of bitcoin. Segwit data blob were only used for useless data, such as signatures and pubkey to be able to spend your utxo. That’s it, you can prune, you can decide not to prune. Generally speaking if you don’t want to prune, it’s about 2.5 MB per block, but only the 1MB of the real BTC block is important. It’s like saying, I have an important expensive small gift, and I wrapped it with gift paper, and I wrap alot of gift paper to make it very bulky. Gift paper is like segwit data, not important to keep, the only important thing is the actual item (1MB block). So people stressing over over this ordinal are just dumbwits and just don’t understand bitcoin

@nilskp 9 дней назад

No, we don't

@vakeone 9 дней назад

The block size limit is still in effect. All that changes is what’s in the blocks, not how large they can be.

@Richard-ki4nk 9 дней назад

...and pricing out less wealthy potential bitcoin users because the majority (in personal number and % of bitcoin exchanged) of buyers+users are fiat users. fiat wealth distribution is heavily centralized (bitcoin is currently more but that will change over the looong term if it becomes THE world money) so those with considerable fiat can make all kinds of silly bloat inducing bitcoin transactions tipping the scales towards games+gambling making transactions more costly for "legit" transactions, ie. Buying bread. So you could say until we r on a bitcoin standard there should be various arbitrary transaction filtering. But how is that done? Seems both nodes + miners need to agree on what to filter...and maybe this develops over time.

@cheesyandy1 9 дней назад

@@vinchino Not just storage. Its network bandwidth and CPU usage. Drastically increased IBD times since ordinals came out.

@cheesyandy1 9 дней назад

To pretend these 'transactions' are not spam by any reasonable definition is just dishonest. The email comparison is valid, just because a spammer adheres to the email protocol, doesn't mean they are not spamming. They are exploiting what is essentially a bug, any protocol should have size limits on arbitrary data.

@fatrick9001 10 дней назад

Hey, Casey! Leave them dogs alone! ❌🐕

@dominatorbooze8381 9 дней назад

Lmao

@yuhhhhhhhhh8240 8 дней назад

“Indeed, Bitcoin is a distributed secure timestamp server for transactions. A few lines of code could create a transaction with an extra hash in it of anything that needs to be timestamped. I should add a command to timestamp a file that way.” - Satoshi Nakamoto March 4th 2009

@robertkennedy9188 3 дня назад

Casey is possibly the best-looking dev I’ve ever seen

@Profacy15 10 дней назад

I'm with you, Peter; I'm at the point of not caring too much as well. Definitely respect Casey more after hearing this and looking forward to his ideas of file sharing!

@yuhhhhhhhhh8240 9 дней назад

hfsp

@cryptoni9n 9 дней назад

absolutely important episode - a must listen for all Bitcoiners!

@yuhhhhhhhhh8240 9 дней назад

it pisses me off so much how much negativity casey gets, these idiots dont really get the big picture if theyre mad about whats going on now they wont be able to handle the effects of world adoption. thank god to casey for being the most innovative person in bitcoin since satoshi - everyone else can be sour faced from the sidelines and whine forever idec theyre incredibly lost in the sauce

@RolfRochen-yb6sq 9 дней назад

Missing the discussion on future changes on Bitcoin, since this is a blueprint of something which nobody had foreseen and therefore being much more conservative to changes of the base protocol, because they might bring in problems nobody can imagine. This Ordinal thing should be a lesson to think even ten times before doing changes.

@HowardARoark 9 дней назад

Good point. But Luke Dash jr had a solution to the Ordinals problem?

@prancer1803 7 дней назад

@@HowardARoarkyes a bugfix

@TheRealDerekS 3 дня назад

Bearer shares is also what Eddie murphys friend was killed for stealing at the beginning of Beverly Hills Cop

@bradymac7206 9 дней назад

Just when I thought I couldn't be more against ordinals, I listened to this guy

@telelvisjr 9 дней назад

Kudos for inviting Mr. Controversial . I think you can create & sell Real Bedford tokens along with long Terms & Conditions, where you'd put on yourself or some entity requirement to manifest token's holder will in real world. This may hold in court

@wesm9750 8 дней назад

I think Bitcoin can improve humanity's prospects. Others want to make neat toys with it. I hope his mucking around ultimately strengthens it.

@astroswell 8 дней назад

What can be done - will be done.

@adrianflower3230 10 дней назад

So, the other side of the story...... 🤔🤔

@shifu9276 9 дней назад

Thank you Pete, finally.

@sailsthe7seas 7 дней назад

heck yeah

@vincentwu6345 9 дней назад

this is definitely one of the funniest conversation I've seen in Peter's podcast. I'm really curious about the file sharing thingy that Casey is working on.

@dominatorbooze8381 9 дней назад

The agora project he mentioned at the start? I thought he said it was done for due to lack of interest?

@shifu9276 9 дней назад

Love Casey

@skylark_yt 9 дней назад

Agree with the points on censorship. Pay the fee, get the block space. Don’t want Bitcoin to act like a private company. If people wanna blow money on shipcoinery, let ‘em. If Bitcoin can’t survive that, it’s not the solution that “Fixes everything.”

@prancer1803 7 дней назад

Unfortunately I agree with you.

@DanielGonzales-di6tq 10 дней назад

Not here to break Bitcoin, but for sure here to allow scamming on Bitcoin.

@IVIagicful 9 дней назад

If you think bitcoin is relying on anybody's ethics of not creating any kind of consensus-compliant transactions you don't like, you have the same fiat mindset as the ones you claim to oppose. Bitcoin is permissionless and you can't stop people from using ordinals, inscriptions or whatever else shitcoiners want to do in the future. Freedom is not free.

@ArnieRodriguez 9 дней назад

Bitcoin allows it, Monero does not. Monero is King, you just dont realize it yet.

@bayc8855 9 дней назад

you sound like the boomers who proclaim that Bitcoin is only for scammers

@dominatorbooze8381 9 дней назад

@@ArnieRodriguez monero has its place but will never be king.

@Usernamebtc 7 дней назад

@@ArnieRodriguezverify the supply for me then

@FirstTimer23 10 дней назад

Bitcoin doesn't act like a private business, but individual private miners certainly can act like a business....and as such, they can curate their own blocks.....if they don't accept your block because you didn't pay enough in fees, is that censorship? I don't know anyone who would say it was.

@ZoTrAcK 9 дней назад

So if I understand correctly ordinals cannot identify all individual sats in an input alone, they need transactions to identify ranges of sats with the different outputs.

@THOMPSON8787 7 дней назад

That's what I got from it. He contradicts himself by saying you can identify a certain Sat, then not articulating EXACTLY how. It's really meaningless anyway. I just don't want someone to get into Bitcoin through this route and end up hating Bitcoin because they lose money on this scheme, all while the actual Bitcoin price is increasing. It's just a money grab in the end. These guys know it's not going anywhere, but they can capitalize off the retail buyer's stupidity and ignorance in the process. He should've put this energy into scaling Bitcoin and improving the lightning network.

@prancer1803 7 дней назад

@@THOMPSON8787100%

@AnonYT618 4 дня назад

@@THOMPSON8787when you say it’s a money grab, who exactly grabs the money?

@user-zh8nb1fg2q 10 дней назад

great episode. tho i dont think the economic game theory of stratum v2 works. hashers just want to get payed the most. they dont want to start picking block templates because that is not as efficient for them. its better to outsource the template production to who ever specializes in getting the most fees. this is why i think stratum v2 never took off, and i dont think at a large scale the economics of it works.

@IVIagicful 9 дней назад

v2 never took off because it's very new. Game theory works perfectly because if miners don't use it, bitcoin becomes a centralized shitcoin so whatever they mine becomes worthless. In order for that not to happen, they are incentivized to use it. There's the game theory...

@HowardARoark 8 дней назад

He admires Adam Back but that won't stop him destroying what Adam Back has created.

@yuhhhhhhhhh8240 9 дней назад

complaining about fees is the dumbest thing in the world, the original vision since 2009 was that fees will end up becoming big enough to be 100% of block reward. once more and more halvings come where do you expect block rewards to come from ?

@yuhhhhhhhhh8240 9 дней назад

correction fees will eventually be the ONLY reward, the successs of bitocin and fees going high are one in the same in the long term

@cryptoni9n 9 дней назад

27:47 there is no 'new range' in these cases. neither coin joins nor consolidations create new sat ranges, per se. they can get split up, but no new ranges are created. the new utxos simply contain all of the ranges that went into them.

@prancer1803 7 дней назад

Ranges don’t exist, of course.

@bazzle_brush 9 дней назад

No mention of nodes, all the stuff mechanic spent 2 and a half hours talking about was barely touched on by Peter in this chat.

@jaltoorey4445 9 дней назад

You were supposed to ask where the magic gets its roots

@qorazx 6 дней назад

Get him an mechanic on the same show

@HowardARoark 8 дней назад

If he got the slightest advantage over you he'd rip you to shreds. But at the moment he's at the endearment stage, trying to worm his way in, Mr. nice reasonable guy, what's not to like ? Why so serious ?

@Usernamebtc 7 дней назад

Casey is not a bitcoiner, he is a grifter who wants your money and has no morals or limits to what he will say and do to get it.

@Gunther_Pott 9 дней назад

"It's bad for crypto, it's bad for Bitcoin, it will bring down the mother chain..." Where have I heard all that before? Oh yeah, I remember the Internet in the 90's. If some guy would have said back then that he is developing stuff so people can download or stream videos and other content, most everybody would have yelled and shouted and called him crazy because that makes no sense, that's not what the internet is for, there is not enough bandwidth and it would clog up the system and bring down the world wide web.... and where are we now? Maybe Casey's stuff sticks, maybe not, but I'm sure new ideas will arise from this one, maybe something else altogether, maybe something really important is coming out of this kind of development on Bitcoin. Very exciting times.

@andreattafabio 10 дней назад

First half was boring. Bad questions from Peter. 2nd part was actually pretty good!

@Cronus6 9 дней назад

I think the first half was Peter getting him to explain the protocol, which is why it wasn't interesting.

@yuhhhhhhhhh8240 9 дней назад

questions werre great and cruhsed by lord casey

@goldenbez8031 9 дней назад

.....when people lose track of the fact that Bitcoin is money, they fly off on a tangent and use language like this.

@user-gc5tk9fd7g 7 дней назад

Keeping Bitcoin

@mikechavez3 9 дней назад

Great conversation. Thanks for hosting, Pete!

@HowardARoark 8 дней назад

Well done Peter to get through with this fiend.

@dominatorbooze8381 9 дней назад

I was a rune sceptic to start with and probably even more so now. When the developer uses words like arbitrary and scheme that raises alarm bells for me. If you stop and think theres little wonder why true bitcoiners dismiss it. Couple of things to ponder, it provides another attack vector for bad actors and government officials. Just brings bitcoin closer to being lumped in the same basket as crypto. Then looking at runes from a tax angle, i know for a fact in Australia that moving runes around is a taxable event EVERY time. The whole thing is very gimmicky.

@abrahamnorthhampton3327 10 дней назад

Peter, thank you for drilling down on this. After listening to the answers to your questions, I still don't understand how this works or why anyone would want one. Given that ordinals tend to inflate user fees and, by extension, makes it harder for plebs like me to use the system, I'm against it. Good for the miners, though, and thus for future hashrate and network security.

@yuhhhhhhhhh8240 9 дней назад

ur so dumb

@DavidArcosRealtor 9 дней назад

the reason's people would want it are for the reasons you just gave. Miners are going to have to make their money off of network subsidies to keep the network secure. 1:13:15 is the clip

@knoworiginality 9 дней назад

Sats are not unique on Bitcoin. You can abstract and add your additional layers all you want. Not interesting though.

@courtrye 9 дней назад

I don’t think he is the Vitalik Buterin of Bitcoin because there wasn’t a pre-funding moment and he hasn’t rolled anything back. He’s just a creative person making code that can interface with Bitcoin to enable different use cases. He did interrupt you quite a bit towards the end of the interview, and it would have been nice to hear your points fully communicated. I thought you handled it very well.

@boostandflow4603 9 дней назад

DOG GO TO THE MOON

@FirstTimer23 10 дней назад

As long as your shitcoinery does not expect changes to Bitcoin, then i don't care either.

@FirstTimer23 10 дней назад

"I will never allow MEV on Runes". The fact that he believes he can make that promise tells me he doesn't understand one of the core principles of Bitcoin. No one person can control any aspect of Bitcoin. The fact he wants changes to Bitcoin that would allow anything that changes that core tenet tells you all you need to know about his willingness to harm Bitcoin.

@spinner735 10 дней назад

don't think you watched the full episode. or you didn't understand what Casey was saying. he was saying anything he creates won't allow MEV

@yuhhhhhhhhh8240 9 дней назад

he admits anyone can fork his code what r u talking about

@JoeNakamoto 7 дней назад

I really like Casey but I really don’t care about ordinals or runes…. Until fees get above 21 sats per vbyte. Then I care

@JonathanCr0ss 9 дней назад

He keeps saying "fungible tokens" where he means the opposite...

@realizingerin 10 дней назад

King 👑

@yuhhhhhhhhh8240 9 дней назад

frfr + queen

@DanielGonzales-di6tq 10 дней назад

2nd comment now that I finished the episode. I feel like I wasted my time listening to him. I do appreciate Peter for bringing in other perspectives though.

@insanity54 9 дней назад

Dear Peter, stop optimizing for the haters.

@insanity54 9 дней назад

Dear Peter, stop thinking about tokenizing equity. People want trading cards.

@nori3749 9 дней назад

Thanks for your creation Casey, but if we had wanted shitcoins we have simply used shitcoins...

@Dilandau88 9 дней назад

Grifter. Moving on

@shifu9276 9 дней назад

👋

@AliBooondok 10 дней назад

Always fantastic content Peter.

@utubehelps 9 дней назад

Ppl want to have fun, Casey made Bitcoin fun again. Thank you.

@HowardARoark 8 дней назад

What's the bets this guy is left-handed ?

@gabisseverin3563 10 дней назад

"Everything is a shared allucionation" HAHAHAHHAHA this is the guy writing your code for finances.. mentally enslaved by Harari's ridiculous assertion, a small pet from Frankfurt...

@MadWaloo 10 дней назад

Thanks for interviewing Casey. I have a better understanding of Runes.

@Bitvestor 9 дней назад

“Normie bitcoiners” is a term I’ve never heard before, and I intend to never hear again. What a joke.

@rbrendanhughes 9 дней назад

Hi Peter - you forgot to ask him about the animal porn fetish. @hodlMagoo looking for answers

@dominatorbooze8381 9 дней назад

Holy shit I forgot about that. Even more reason to pass.

@THOMPSON8787 7 дней назад

Ok, so this guy being interviewed is a perfect example of someone unnecessarily complicating Bitcoin and making money off these complications. Hopefully, he isn't recruiting too many new people to this style of monetizing Bitcoin. While Bitcoin goes up in price, his "rare sats" he's selling people, will be forgotten and most likely drop in value, leaving a bad taste in peoples mouths regarding Bitcoin in general. He's basically a shitcoiner. But he's worse because he's using Bitcoin to shill this style of shitcoinery. Notice he can't even fully and reasonably explain how you can distinguish one sat from another. Classic shitcoinery word salad. Dont fall for this nonsense people. People like him give Bitcoin a bad name.

@prancer1803 9 дней назад

Why do any bitcoiners want this???

@dominatorbooze8381 9 дней назад

They don't

@habibaghasafari2237 9 дней назад

I'm a fan of this show. But this is absolutely the worst episode you ever made.

@WhatBitcoinDid 9 дней назад

How come?

@dominatorbooze8381 9 дней назад

@@WhatBitcoinDidyou know about his "manga" efforts right? Plus ordinals are junk lol

@habibaghasafari2237 8 дней назад

@WhatBitcoinDid the topic is boring, uninteresting, inconsequential and irrelevant. Plus when you listen to this guest, you tell yourself, oh my god, there is so much more interesting content that I can listen to rather than listening to this guy.