Graham Linehan has been talking about this. How this horror isn’t even covered by the woke BBC is beyond comprehension. Why is Mr Rachel (Richard) Levine still not under arrest?
Come on. The Dems have been conducting lawfare against their ideological enemies for years now. They don't arrest people on their own team though -- and even when they're forced to, they try them in front of politically biased juries to ensure they'll get a pass. Look at that one Justice Dept guy charged in the whole Muller investigation. Differences between how Trump and Biden were dealt with over the whole document thing. Modern America runs like a banana republic.
@@frankgradus9474 While I have no opinion on this specifically (just to make clear I'm not opposing) what are you basing this assumption on? I'd be curious to look into this further.
It's about helping another movement as well which is so unbelievable. Who would have thought it would come to castration fetishists including child pornographers, influencing medicine. Right under our noses. It is time for this to END.
@@mkyriacopolous People can hide a whole lot in a tiny plus sign... It doesn't mean that every letter approves of every other letter, just that anybody can stick their letter on the end without consulting the rest of the alphabet. Gate-keeping is violence.
Oh my goodness, I just cried hearing the cases she referenced. Our nation is being overcome by evil. Thank you for what you do, shining a light on what so many people don't see. It's impossible to understand how we got to this point as a culture.
This episode is a critical reminder of how important it is to encourage fearless inquiry into challenging points of view. Stifling those early concerned voices has lead to massive harm to children, their families, and society as a whole. Truth has a way of bobbing up despite all effort to suppress it. Trans “health care” welcome to the sunshine.
@@oliverhug3yes, and women everywhere. This sick ideology has changed laws, ruined LGB rights, made women self exclude or worse still be attacked, fired and cancelled.
Thank you so much for this hugely important episode - and this podcast. Like Lisa, I’m one of those people you’ve been helping to keep sane for the last couple of years…
Answer: Levine. I’m pretty certain he’s not new to manipulation. He’s also not alone in having influence and funding power. Hopkins are reliant on sponsors.
Unfortunately things like this do happen in US healthcare often, although they’re not quite at this level. The DSM is a completely top down document that doesn’t use evidence to update diagnoses and diagnostic criteria.
It is terribly unfortunate that this is an issue where the division is most prominently between liberals and conservatives. As a person who is independent, who used to be a conservative, and who sympathizes with only some liberal activist concerns, I have found that the conservative / liberal division is a serious obstacle in dealing with numerous controversies. The question seems to be scientific and become a matter of group loyalty. We now have “experts” on the left and “experts” on the right, both claiming to be backed by solid science. It’s as if science isn’t science anymore. Whenever any issue falls into a package associated with a “side” it becomes almost impossible to make progress. Any progress in questioning group thought on either side means provoking ire from the very people you are closely associated with and with whom you agree with over a great number of issues. This makes it difficult to change directions based solely on evidence.
He has got a fetish …. he wants to be accepted by medicine! He wants to be validated by medicine. The “I don’t have a fetish, I’m a natural woman” scheme.
Don't let the AAP cosey up to Genspect now. They claimed in a previous interview they didn't know it was not good practice until the Cass report - they just did know. Please don't help them save their image now. You let these people slip passed scrutiny and it won't lead to the greater good. It just won't
Another revealing interview. The age requirements would have been removed because that would have limited business opportunities for transgender surgeons and other associated medicos. Transworld is a disgrace, almost a parrallel universe. As Sascha said: "...there would be some crazy piece of news..." It doesn't stop. I think we are living in a uniquely stupid age.
Thank you - this is a great one to share with ppl who think we're pushing conspiracy theories when we try to point out the uneven coverage in the mainstream media to fellow Democrats.
@@louiseparker1915 There are several such things as trans. But we are not talking about trans fats, transatlantic, trans-dermal, or transubstantiation, are we? Transvestite is a thing. Are there 'such things' as utopia, fairness, heaven, or centrifugal force? Is multiple personality disorder a thing? Autism? Are 'liberal' and 'conservative' things? Narcissism or paranoia? You can't make trans just disappear by saying it doesn't exist any more than you can make communism disappear by saying it has never been successful. But we can argue about whether it is good, bad, or stupid... or more than one thing.
@@sw3783 Yes, LGB was one of the movements that was coopted by queer ideology, just like feminism, to degrade the nuclear family. Feminism was used to devalue (even demonize) motherhood, and gay marriage was used to destroy the meaning of marriage. Each movement is discarded as they fulfill their objective and demonized if they stop promoting the narrative.
I'm curious to know why Lisa is against banning the prescribing of puberty blockers and cross-sex hormones, and "transitioning" surgery to minors? As I understand it, such legislation that has been passed has been carefully worded to exclude medication or surgery for real medical reasons. Of course, such legislation should never be necessary, but here we are with "medical" centers and doctors pushing this. Why shouldn't there be legislation banning it to children? We are not talking about competent adults who understand what they are taking on (or should), we are talking about children who cannot consent.
When medical/social/psychiatric practitioners are also activists, they appear completely incapable of acting scientifically by setting up and running diligent assessments and follow-up studies.
@@NNM-sc3rj A rather classic AGP man leaving a trans widow in his wake. If you see him it's not exactly difficult to spot. He's the head of Wpath and knows that young boys lose all future sexual stimulation. Also the one who botched Jazz Jennings surgery. Not that it's possible to do it successfully
In this instance though, Johns Hopkins seems to have pushed back against WPATH. Read Jesse Singal's coverage of the story in the Economist. Institutions are rarely ideologically homogenous, so it's not surprising that some people would be unwilling to let their professional reputations be ruined by advocacy groups.
@@twatmunroJohn Hopkins has its dark Dr John Money history behind them. They better push back. They get credit for the mess, the work of their gender leader John Money and the death of the David Reimer and his brother!
All the professional medical associations latch onto WPATH standards and now we know the evidence base is shaped by politics. This undermines the legal deference which the associations are given in courts. Judges now have to judge and no longer defer given the "purity" of the science has been crushed by political influence.
28:00 the point about changing the language to surreptitiously manipulate our presuppositions is spot on. I have been banging on about this. Ever since Kellie Jay Keen started refusing to accept the language a couple of years ago, it's made me realise that even I as a skeptic was having my perception groomed to accept the possibility there really were trans people as objective fact. It's grooming, and it doesn't just happen to kids.
I think it's very easy to underestimate how deluded a culture can be and how ingrained a set of beliefs. It is a rare thing for individuals to fully admit they were deluded and naive, when thousands and thousands of people have been deluded and naive across an entire culture, some of whom are very powerful indeed, it is in no one's interest to point this out. It has the potential to shake the very foundations on which medical authority is based. I think sometimes those that are investigating this are slightly delusional themselves in their rose tinted, optimistic faith that these monolithic organisations will act in a moral, honest way when shown up as corrupt.
"When the truth is stigmatized, it's very hard to speak it." That would have been another great title for this episode! Lots of good info here, especially for us in the USA. Thank you!
I think this episode should have a broader audience . This is important for both sides of this '"debate." This issue has ended my idealized love of the left. It hasn't made me a conservative, but I realize that common sense isn't common, and each issue should be assessed by its own individual merits. Also, autogynephiles have co-opted the trans movement (i.e., Rachael Levine) to the detriment of many "true/real" LBGT members :(
AGP make up the majority of trans identifying males globally, and have always been at the forefront of trans advocacy and the push for medical and surgical transition procedures. Do you believe only hsts are "tru-trans" ?
The U.S. government should establish a fund now for the billions in reparations they’re going to owe these kids. This state-sanctioned child abuse will rank up there with the current contaminated blood scandal in the UK or the thousands of indigenous children stolen in the 60s.
Round 1 was remarkable. To think Levine refused to answer the direct question regarding children and surgery. To then see this person remove age details from the standards.
Speaking of language, I would use the word "leftist" in place of "liberal". These organizations are not liberal; they are leftist. Many liberals will listen to this with horror, and leftists will celebrate it with glee. Everything is intentional, especially the manipulation of language and the use of "OwnVoices", which is a marketing term for "lived experience". Leftists regard empirical data as racist and oppressive and seek to find "other ways of knowledge". I digress. Admiral Levine needs to be prosecuted. This is insane.
I'm a leftist and I don't celebrate any of this madness. Plenty of people who are leftist in their broader politics see this for the criminality it is.
39:00 the oppressor-oppressed dynamic is central to Wokeism. As a form of socialism it relies on scapegoating groups in society against each other. Marxist-Leninism pitted worker against employer. Nazism portrayed Jewish people and marginal groups as sources of societal degradation. Fascism saw the rest of the world against the nation state. Wokeism has made the claim that minority groups are only minorities because majority groups have pushed them down. Trans ideology is deep deep self victimisation to garner maximum sympathy. It's masochism.
Love the compassionate stance towards the people who shoulda known better, but didn't. That is the only way forward. I keep saying we'll need 360 care, from all angles, and all the people impacted.
I've been bugging my local NPR station to cover this, but it is impossible. I talked to someone from programming and the conversation went nowhere. But I hope more people contact them especially if they are members.
They don't care. NPR is probably willing to go down with the ship with its "new" journalism. Their donations are way down because people are sick and tired of every single story being told through the lens of identity.
Once again, a breath of fresh air, and probably not for a reason you might expect! I love listening to you, because you are voices of reason, and you are so pleasant and friendly. I don’t believe in hormone and surgical treatments for children who experience gender dysphoria, and personally, I think it shouldn’t be allowed. There are other things we don’t allow children to do, with good reason, because they don’t have the maturity to do them, nor do they have the maturity to understand why they shouldn’t. Sometimes “because I said so” is the appropriate answer, when they don’t have the capacity to grasp the ‘why,’ and/or when it happens to be my preference as their parent that they do or don’t do what we’re talking about. So, it sounds like we have let WPATH run the show or drive the train without any good evidence that they know what they are doing. So now a state has stepped up and said, “whoa!” and the “progressives” or should I say “persons with progressive opinions” are calling “foul!” They like their positions and don’t like being told “No!” Your guest’s point about it being good this happened because it has brought out the truth about what passes as “evidence” is important and perfectly reasonable. I happen to have conservative beliefs and opinions, for what I believe are good reasons, and I don’t like being vilified by those who aren’t interested in listening to my reasons! I listen to things I don’t agree with sometimes, but I admit, it’s difficult because they use the opportunity to make sweeping generalizations or statements they don’t back up with evidence, and they vilify everyone in a group they stereotype as “hateful” or “mean.” I hope you can see I am reasonable and interested in evidence, even tho I question opinions often presented as “fact.” So thank you for your podcast, and as I said, sometimes I listen to you just because I like listening to you!
Having worked behind the scenes at the hospital, and I mean all areas in departments installing medical equipment there’s definitely conversations that happen behind doors all the time. I mean all the time
Makes me feel that KELLY JAY KEEN's determination not to negotiate with this stuff makes total SENSE. Why are we even debating this BS? When a ball of wool is this tangled, you just throw it in the bin. NO guidelines would protect vulnerable people from this...it's a mess.
39:19 I don't quite follow or understand this line being drawn from "the way Republicans are acting (w bans)" to "the advocacy groups getting to remain the victim". This stuff is being run from the inside out & top down. Activists have wormed their ways into medicine, psychology, media, journalism, law, medical associations & so on. Gender ideology & queer theory have been working in the background & social justice activists from academia to entertainment have convinced portions of the country that it is possible for someone to feel disconnected from their bodies & gender & to benefit from transition. By the time Republicans got involved & started pushing back it's bc of the HARM these ideas were causing. It's not like Republicans from random red states just decided to go pass bans for no reason. They were pushing back against what they were seeing happen to young ppl & families & wanted to put a stop to it. I mean I started seeing this stuff online several years ago & the more time that went by the more ground these ideas gained & the more young ppl it confused. And it's bc the activists in the AAP, AMA, Endocrine Society, etc kept endorsing this. It's bc Psychologists were threatened w losing their license if they didn't affirm. I mean I *guess* you can acknowledge that the Republican push back is making them out as victims, but it's not like this would've just gone away on its own had Republicans done nothing. Clearly we know that bc the reason we are where we are now is bc too many ppl did nothing, too many said nothing, too many ppl ignored it under the guise of tolerance & love & letting ppl be their authentic selves. It took Republican legislatures, Republican Governors, & Republican AGs deciding to fight back against this to bring a lot of this info to light & it's clearly what was needed to bring it to SCOTUS. We can't rely on our institutions for guardrails anymore. Our institutions have been captured & are steering the ship in the entirely wrong direction. Blaming Republicans for "reacting" & seemingly making it seem worse just really seems to miss a whole lot about how all of this has been able to happen.
The fact that there's a chapter on eunuchs but not on ethics is all anyone needs to know about these guidelines. The ones who will be affected most by all of this are all of the lovely girls and boys who will persuade their parents to sterilize them and mutilate their bodies. Obviously, some percentage will grow and mature from this process, but I would argue that most will probably eventually regret their decisions, especially once they want to have children and realize just how expensive IVF surrogacy is. I believe lawsuits will clear most of this up within the next 10 years, but for the 25 years or so's worth of teens who sadly grew up now, they'll be gay men and lesbians in medically damaged bodies.
Senator McGovern's diet advice (or was it a law?) was made with little or no 'evidence' about the harm of fats, despite the pushback of scientists, so probably this happens a lot more often than we'd like to think.
So the crazy fake guidelines that everybody uses to CYA got made crazier specifically to protect far-out stuff they were already doing? What planet is this that I'm on now?
Everyone should learn and know what FMLA is and use it :) In small government as well. So much is available on every level on various topics One of the last rights we need to hold on to
Your comment just took me down a rabbit hole. Admiral Levine is not in the U.S. Navy s(he) is in the Public Health Service and did not progress (from what public source information indicates) thru the ranks as any other military serviceman would. DIRECTLY COMMISSIONED INTO THE RANK OF FOUR STAR ADMIRAL. I am astonished and appalled. 😅😅😅
I am so upset. Question: WHY... would any parent need the government to regulate the health of their children? Age limitations and things like that? Noone is coming near my children PERIOD. I dont give a shit if they identify as the moon.
Around 15:00 the question about political pressure from the government onto WPATH and on WPATH to Johns Hopkins arises. Lisa basically acknowledges that Hopkins "pushes back and pushes back and then ultimately concedes" and "we don't know why". Ok. Let me posit an answer. I remember reading academic studies in media criticism during the Iraq war era. The studies focused on the "tail waging the dog" idea and the question of how much big media "events" and their coverage, influenced public policy. The results were quite striking and in my own observations in the last few years this phenomenon has grown exponentially and can be observed in many of the public political hearings where senators refer to a NYT publication in an argument, never questioning whether this authoritative source really has it right. In short, i wonder if the reason the people at Johns Hopkins ultimately caved to pressure is because they "felt" that the culture was shifting underneath their feet, when in fact it wasn't. The media at the time was awash with stories about right wingers targeting poor trans people. Health authorities would not want to be on the wrong side of something like a nazi persecution of minorities. In short, my speculative answer to the question is that the media environment (which was intentionally created) is the reason they caved to the pressure. One cannot underestimate the power of media on culture, and culture on politics.
Lisa's work on this has been great. My guess is that when lower age limits were published in WPATH's Standards of Care, some WPATH members remembered they'd carried out procedures on children below these ages, and realised that they would have legal liability unless the documentation was changed quickly.
By coincidence Facebook showed me that economist story about the WPATH cover up of a systematic review today. All the comments I could see unless I sorted by newest were claiming it was a hit piece etc. It is really hard to get a fair hearing.
Amenable healthcare, for detransitioners. Here in MI they have gone so far as to build daycare centers that are trans friendly. They are called Rainbow daycares and 26 of them popped up over the last 2 years in one county alone.
Have you written an article about this? You said the research isn’t available to the general public? What is being done to obtain it? Where can we see what has been released so far?
FYI: The John Hopkins Systematic Review was in fact published. Titled: "Hormone Therapy, Mental Health, and Quality of Life Among Transgender People: A Systematic Review". Every single peer reviewed medical study in the review found Gender Affirming Care to improve Mental Health and Quality of Life. No one has yet to produce a single peer reviewed medical study that concludes Gender Affirming Care results in a deterioration of Mental Health and Quality of Life. Hence why no major professional medical organization in the world has stopped endorsing GAC as effective treatment for Gender Dysphoria.
Being a lifelong patient with a messed up endocrine system , incontinence, dysfunctional sex organs, heart, liver and kidney damage etc improve mental health and quality of life? Are you sure?
The systematic review you cite is not for "gender affirming care" in young people. In the Results section of that review it explicitly states: "no study reported separate results by gender identity for transgender youth". So this is not a systematic review of these interventions being carried out on minors.
@@widerlenspod It does in fact include all the studies of GAC on minors they found. They included all their available research into a single Systematic Review instead of separating them as they originally intended. There's no suppressed research being hidden in John Hopkins basement as Stella implies when she says "John Hopkins did carry out the research, which I would love to get our hands on" to which Lisa responds "That would be nice". You do have it because it was in fact published over 3 years ago and it does in fact conclude all the studies showed improvement in QOL and Mental Health. You're misinforming your audience by implying that WPATH suppressed a study that concludes the opposite.
Did you maybe miss the European Child & Adolescent Psychiatry statement that recently came out? The ECAP represents 36 Child and Adolescent Psychiatry societies, calling for more, better research because there are strong concerns they don’t already have enough to justify the medical decisions they are making.
